Log for #openttd on 22nd May 2006:
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01:02:48  <rain````>
01:02:51  <rain````> ... ?
01:05:10  <Sacro> ?
01:05:31  <glx> looks like a multistop bug
01:06:20  <rain````> any suggestion to fix?
01:08:08  <Sacro> dont have all the roundabouts
01:08:17  <Sacro> 1 road to all the stations i belive is best
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06:34:11  <Celestar> Intel CEO Otellini 'incredibly disappointed' by Dell's AMD decision <= perhaps one should have produced a SINGLE usuablly server-CPU in the past 5 years instead of whining??
06:34:39  <Celestar> Xeon, Itanium, Itanium 2 ... all utter crap
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06:56:04  <peter1138> what the fuck
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06:58:32  <peter1138> windows networking still adheres to networking classes?
06:58:57  <peter1138> = broadcast of
06:59:07  <peter1138> = broadcast of
06:59:55  <Vornicus> evidently
07:00:34  * Fujitsu loves Windows.
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07:00:54  <Celestar> peter1138: that second seems wrong....
07:01:05  <Fujitsu> Exactly.
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07:03:32  <peter1138> = broadcast of
07:03:34  <peter1138> *sigh*
07:03:36  <peter1138> wankers
07:03:55  <Fujitsu> Yep.
07:03:59  * Fujitsu huggles Linux.
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07:07:52  <Celestar> Mircoshit obviously has tremendous problems computing simple netmasks
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07:08:04  * Celestar hugs his BSD-firewall
07:08:22  <Celestar> inet netmask 0xfffffff8 broadcast <= can M$ do something like that?
07:08:31  <Celestar> inet netmask 0xfffffffc broadcast <= or this?
07:09:00  <peter1138> nope
07:09:28  <peter1138> still uses for a /29
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07:13:03  <Celestar> :S
07:13:51  * roboboy wonders what happened to his company on brianettas nightly server
07:14:08  * Fujitsu wonders how people can use software with such crippled networking.
07:14:13  * valhallazzzw thinks Finland ate it.
07:14:15  * Fujitsu mourns peter1138.
07:14:19  <Fujitsu> valhallazzzw, true.
07:14:24  <Fujitsu> Finland for ever!
07:14:33  <valhallazzzw> :)
07:15:01  * roboboy thinks F#### you destroyed it somehow
07:15:04  <Prof_Frink> ...finland, finland, finland
07:15:11  <Prof_Frink> The country where I want to be...
07:16:07  <roboboy> F### you is a client on brianettas server and he stole an oil refinery from my old company
07:16:30  <valhallazzzw> 'atole'?
07:16:31  <Prof_Frink> 'stole'?
07:16:37  <valhallazzzw> that called
07:16:44  <valhallazzzw> healthy competition
07:16:44  <Prof_Frink> I didn't realise you could buy industries
07:17:04  <Celestar> peter1138: get a proper OS then :)
07:17:15  <Fujitsu> Celestar, yep.
07:17:32  <roboboy> he blocked my dock off with land and then bought it
07:17:55  * Celestar notes that terraforming prices should be 20-fold for 0.6.0
07:17:55  <Prof_Frink> So do the same to him
07:18:10  <Fujitsu> 20-fold!?
07:18:21  <Celestar> Fujitsu: about, yes
07:18:23  * Prof_Frink notes to to terraform till at least.. 1955
07:18:28  <Fujitsu> Why!?
07:18:41  <roboboy> then i removed it so my ratings didnt get affected and then he stoped anyone from accesing it with a train station
07:18:51  <Celestar> Fujitsu: why not is the question
07:18:58  <Celestar> terraforming is WAAY too cheap
07:18:59  <Fujitsu> True.
07:19:08  <Prof_Frink> Celestar: As long as buildonslopes prices don;t go up 20x as well, that's good
07:19:21  <Fujitsu> But not by /that/ much, surely?
07:19:54  <roboboy> i think the cost for raising land from water at the begining is ok
07:19:56  <Celestar> Prof_Frink: that's something different
07:20:10  <Prof_Frink> Celestar: Oh good.
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07:20:34  <Celestar> usually, train tracks are adapted to the surrounding environment, not the other way round...
07:21:17  <Prof_Frink> Next we'll be requesting sheer cuttings ;)
07:21:25  <Celestar> hm?
07:21:42  <Prof_Frink> straight down, rather than sloping
07:21:42  <Celestar> IRL railway rely a LOT on bridges and tunnels and stuff
07:21:49  <Celestar> yeah
07:21:53  <Vornicus> depends on where you are.  The tracks that run through my town are lifted ten feet off the surrounding landscape by an embankment.
07:24:36  <Celestar> an Embankment is rather common, but also not cheap to build
07:24:46  <Fujitsu> Not very cheap, no.
07:26:42  * Prof_Frink goes for Tea2
07:27:18  <Celestar> Vornicus: but you normally don't see Embankments running miles through the open sea?
07:27:35  * Celestar thinks oil fields should ONLY be accessible by ships and choppers, nothing else
07:27:50  <Vornicus> well, no, you don't.
07:29:31  <Fujitsu> Underground rail! /me hints
07:31:27  <Prof_Frink> Underground to an oil rig? That's crazy talk!
07:31:59  <Fujitsu> No, you just need a nice elevator at the end.
07:32:23  <Prof_Frink> But yes, /bridge and /tunnel would want to be merged before you kick the prices up
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07:39:17  <Vornicus> ...dangit, I can't find it!
07:40:03  <Fujitsu> What?
07:40:33  <peter1138> i daren't ask
07:42:51  <Vornicus> Alligator Alley!
07:43:01  * Vornicus found it.
07:44:34  <Fujitsu> ...?
07:45:17  <Vornicus> Alligator Alley is a stretch of Interstate 75 that crosses the Everglades.
07:45:37  <Vornicus> It is mostly on artificial land.
07:47:57  <Vornicus> it's like 70 miles long.
07:50:41  <Vornicus>,-81.042023&spn=0.853549,1.392517&t=h&om=1
07:55:23  <Vornicus> ...granted, there's land around most of it, but it's swamp.
07:55:54  <Celestar> . . .
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07:56:37  <Vornicus> so they piled crap onto it to make it less swamp, and then built a highway on it.
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07:59:17  <peter1138> how ecological
08:00:24  <Vornicus> yeah
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08:53:53  <Celestar> Vornicus: that's something different than deep sea where you normally find Oilrigs
08:58:56  <Celestar> Darkvater: you anywhere near?
09:02:12  <Rubidium> Celestar: 'openttd -t <year> -g' does not work anymore due to the configuration subsystem rewrite of Darkvater. I've got two patches that solve the problem, but I want to know which one is the best solution:
09:02:16  <Rubidium>
09:02:21  <Rubidium> or
09:02:28  <Celestar> Rubidium: reading.
09:03:24  <Celestar> hm...
09:03:38  <Celestar> the VARDEF is out of the question imho ^^
09:04:52  <Rubidium> another option might be adding extern Patches _patches_newgame to settings.h and including settings.h in intro_gui.c and openttd.c
09:06:22  <peter1138> VARDEF bad
09:06:24  <peter1138> extern bad
09:06:32  <peter1138> (except in .h, heh)
09:08:05  <Rubidium> what about
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09:10:36  <Rubidium> or +/** The patch values that are used for new games and/or modified in config file */
09:10:40  <Rubidium> doh
09:11:04  <Rubidium> <- essentially the same as extern1, but in settings.h instead of variables.h
09:12:05  <peter1138> yeah
09:12:07  <peter1138> don't use variables.h
09:17:57  <Rubidium> ok, so only extern2 is good enough
09:25:07  <Rubidium> anyone against committing ?
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09:49:51  <Celestar> back
09:50:46  <Celestar> hm ..
09:50:51  <Celestar> it removes two externs from C files
09:50:54  <Celestar> thats not bad
09:51:18  <Rubidium> but it adds extra dependencies
09:51:42  <Celestar> as long as you don't include h files in h files, that's not problem imho
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09:54:39  <Celestar> dependecies are a problem if you have headers that include headers that include yet other heads which then include the first header ...
09:54:47  <Celestar> and it all ends up in muddle :S
09:54:51  <peter1138> yeah
09:55:02  <Celestar> peter1138: Tron: RFC on the bridge-draw-correction stuff?
09:59:14  <CIA-3> rubidium * r4944 /trunk/ (intro_gui.c settings.h settings_gui.c): Codechange: make _patches_newgame available via settings.h and remove instances of extern Patches _patches_newgame in .c files
10:00:44  <Rubidium> should the 'make openttd -t <year> -g work again patch' be Change of Fix?
10:02:57  <Celestar> fix
10:03:04  <Celestar> because it is non-working but documented
10:03:33  <peter1138> but never mind; it's not broken in the last release
10:03:48  <Celestar> but it is broken as of now, right?
10:04:37  <Rubidium> it is broken by r3726 (DV's configuration rewrite); it's not in any release
10:05:11  <peter1138> oh, the fix isn't committed yet?
10:05:21  <Rubidium> no, not yet
10:05:30  <Rubidium> I first committed the related cleanup part
10:05:36  <peter1138> in that case something like, "- Fix (r3726):"
10:05:53  <peter1138> iirc
10:06:31  <Rubidium> it's just that I remember reading something about 'Fix' is only for bugs that are in releases too
10:06:59  <peter1138> dunno
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10:07:28  <Celestar> Fix is for everything :)
10:07:33  <Rubidium> ok
10:08:28  <CIA-3> rubidium * r4945 /trunk/openttd.c: Fix (r3726): make -t command line option (set starting date/year) work again
10:08:32  <peter1138> peter1138 * r4945 /trunk/ (sound.c sound.h vehicle.c): - Fix: Added newsound support
10:09:05  <Celestar> peter1138: THAT isn't a fix :)
10:09:31  <peter1138> :)
10:09:51  <Celestar> it's not a real commit message either :P
10:10:21  <Celestar> because you have a wrong revision number ^^
10:10:39  <peter1138> i typed it before Rubidium committed :)
10:11:01  <Celestar> vici@galadriel:[/home/vici/openttd/trunk]> grep extern *c */*c */*/*c | wc -l
10:11:02  <Celestar> 126
10:12:31  <Celestar> that'S a bit much, isn't it?
10:13:16  <peter1138> yeah
10:13:17  <peter1138> hmm
10:13:43  <Fujitsu> I would assume so.
10:23:39  * peter1138 cuts it down to 113 by adding rev.h
10:25:21  <Celestar> er what?
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10:26:11  <Celestar> oh some files are not actaully part of the rep
10:26:39  <Celestar> bool CheckStoppedInHangar(const Vehicle* v); /* XXX extern function declaration in .c */
10:26:50  <Darkvater> morning
10:27:21  <Celestar> hi Darkvater
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10:27:34  <Celestar> Darkvater: why not move declaration of CheckStoppedInHangar into depot.h ?
10:27:36  <Celestar> or airport.h?
10:28:08  <peter1138> Celestar:
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10:29:21  <Celestar> peter1138: ah
10:29:26  <Darkvater> Celestar: what? When did I do that?
10:29:42  <Celestar> Darkvater: you didn't so it, it was a suggestion ...
10:29:45  <Celestar> s/So/do
10:29:52  <Celestar> s/So/do/i
10:31:02  <Celestar> Darkvater: somehow we need to fix the 2 last outstanding bugs for 0.4.8
10:31:03  <Darkvater> ah hehe ok. Where is it now?
10:31:16  <Darkvater> of which there is only one real the economy thing
10:31:16  <Celestar> aircraft_gui.c:bool CheckStoppedInHangar(const Vehicle* v); /* XXX extern function declaration in .c */
10:31:24  <Darkvater> the other is nonsense
10:31:41  <Celestar> it'S not really a release-breaker
10:31:55  <Darkvater> which one?
10:32:04  <Celestar> the vehicle selection thingy
10:32:12  <Darkvater> I wouldn't even classify that as a bug
10:32:15  <Celestar> <= and can we please close this?
10:32:20  <Fujitsu> No matches, Celestar.
10:32:24  <Celestar> Darkvater: technically, it's a bug.
10:32:31  <Celestar> Fujitsu: ?
10:32:37  <Darkvater> yes, more than one week, no reply > close
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10:34:35  <Celestar> so be it
10:35:34  <Fujitsu> Better.
10:37:46  <Celestar> <= hm?
10:38:07  <Celestar> peter1138: could you have a look at that?
10:38:36  <Darkvater>
10:38:38  <Darkvater> hehe
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10:40:32  <Celestar> <= comments on this diff?
10:40:43  <Celestar> gl
10:41:02  <Celestar> forums are disfunctional for me
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10:43:32  <peter1138> hehe
10:43:36  <peter1138> lots of people dislike elrail
10:43:38  <peter1138> "har har"
10:43:41  <hylje> :E
10:43:58  <Celestar> there will be a cheat that allows e-engine usage on convrail
10:44:04  <Celestar> but methinks that should be it :S
10:44:21  <peter1138> yay, cheat :)
10:44:34  <hylje> hax
10:44:44  <Celestar> where is the cheat gui? :S
10:44:46  <peter1138> then they know what they're doing is bad and wrong
10:45:03  <peter1138> misc_gui
10:45:26  <Celestar> because settings_gui would be more logical?
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10:45:55  <Celestar> peter1138: Darkvater: Tron: Request after 0.5.0, rip apart misc_gui.c and main_gui.c and put functions in sane locations
10:46:14  <Darkvater> if only 0.5.0 were anywhere close, eh? :)
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10:48:22  <Fujitsu> Celestar, your sentence now makes sense.
10:49:14  <Fujitsu> Yes.
10:49:17  <Celestar> Darkvater: depends :)
10:49:24  <Celestar> we could rename 0.4.8 to 0.5.0?
10:49:28  <Celestar> *runs*
10:49:39  <Darkvater> that makes absolutely no sense
10:50:11  <Celestar> I know.
10:50:19  <Celestar> so when to start merging stuff for 0.5.0?
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10:52:15  <Darkvater> hmm, after 0.4.8 RC1?
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10:52:50  <Darkvater> bbs, gonna upgraded the firmware on my router
10:52:54  * Darkvater crosses fingers
10:53:15  <peter1138> do we need the 0?
10:53:19  <peter1138> is 0.5 not enough?
10:53:48  <peter1138> (yay, version number arguments again ;p)
10:54:23  <TheMask96> :)
10:54:43  <TheMask96> after 0.5 will you get 0.5.1 or 0.6 ? ;)
10:55:04  <Celestar> 0.5.1
10:55:15  <TheMask96> then 0.5.0 will make more sense ;)
11:01:30  <peter1138> not really
11:02:21  <Celestar> ok who really cares?
11:03:38  <hylje> no
11:05:08  <Celestar> train_cmd.c:2639 does that appear faulty to any of you?
11:05:13  <roboboy> people got confused with the 0's in 0.4.1 so i think we should keep the version numbering system to 3 digits as it is.
11:06:17  <Celestar> wtf?
11:06:24  <Celestar> latest kernel version is
11:07:12  <blathijs> damn, you people should stop committing so much
11:07:31  <roboboy> i mean the version number such as 0.4.1 and 0.4.8
11:07:34  <blathijs> it takes so much time reading all the commit logs ;-)
11:07:36  <hylje> ive kernel 2.6.17-rc4
11:07:40  <roboboy> and 0.5.0
11:07:44  <hylje> but it doesnt work
11:10:33  <peter1138> Celestar: should be the same as 2649?
11:15:31  <blathijs> Celestar: it looks okay? I just think 2649 should use the same check as 2639?
11:16:12  <peter1138> no
11:16:27  <peter1138> other way, i'm sure :)
11:17:45  <peter1138> u.rail.compatible_railtypes is for the whole train, u.rail.railtype is for the engine
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11:20:59  <White_Rabbit> hi everybody!
11:22:05  <White_Rabbit> (hi, Dr. Nick!)
11:23:01  <blathijs> peter1138: ah, yes :-)
11:23:27  <blathijs> peter1138: but, I think they should both use the wrapper function?
11:23:37  <Celestar> peter1138: IsCompatibleRail takes an engine type
11:23:43  <Celestar> er wrong
11:23:44  <Celestar> damnit
11:23:48  <Celestar> I was in the wrong file :S
11:23:57  * Celestar ought to return to bed
11:24:15  <peter1138> blathijs: what wrapper?
11:24:23  <Celestar> <= RFC
11:25:24  <peter1138> +·_railtypes[1].powered_railtypes = 1 << 1 | p1 << 0;
11:25:26  <peter1138> looks wrong
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11:25:42  <Bjarni> "I think elrails feature is awful. Both in its present graphic implementation, and in the concept. The fact that it wasn't meant to be optional, makes it twice as awful" <-- some guy named .CHaSE. on the forum wrote that. Like he ever made anything to the game that should validate that he should take decisions like that
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11:25:52  <blathijs> peter1138: IsCompatibleRail
11:25:52  <Celestar> peter1138: why's that?
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11:26:00  <peter1138> Celestar: you've told it to allow normal engines to be powered on elrails? which is normal...
11:26:05  <Celestar> nope
11:26:09  <Celestar> it's the otherway round
11:26:18  <peter1138> blathijs: that's for railtype vs railtype. compatible_railtypes is a bitmask
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11:26:47  <peter1138> Celestar: i'd've thought you needed to change normal rail, not elrail though?
11:28:01  <Celestar> negative
11:28:55  <Celestar> new diff, peter1138
11:29:50  <Celestar> _railtypes[RAILTYPE_ELECTRIC].powered_railtypes show one which railtypes an engine of RAILTYPE_ELECTRIC generate power
11:30:14  <Celestar> ~.../** bitmask to the OTHER railtypes on which an engine of THIS railtype generates power */
11:30:18  <Celestar> ~...RailTypeMask powered_railtypes;
11:30:48  *** Pixelz` is now known as Pixelz
11:32:14  <peter1138> hmm
11:32:18  <Celestar> sonne:~ # ps aux | grep Xvnc | wc -l
11:32:18  <Celestar> 30
11:32:19  <Celestar> :S
11:32:20  <peter1138> seems odd, but there you :)
11:33:11  <peter1138> but if you say so :)
11:33:25  <peter1138> speaking of railtypes
11:33:42  <peter1138> railtype checking for pathfinding over bridges needs to be fixed
11:33:52  <peter1138> and backported
11:35:56  <Celestar> peter1138: is there any official bugreport?
11:40:25  <peter1138> no, there is me saying it's broken from playtesting
11:40:54  <Celestar> but I will for sure not be able to remember it
11:41:24  <peter1138>
11:41:25  <peter1138> or
11:41:32  <peter1138>
11:41:41  <peter1138> both of those work, but tron wasn't happy with either
11:42:24  <peter1138> first one skirts over the bridge, as for tunnels
11:42:38  <peter1138> second one just checks the right bits
11:42:53  <Celestar> I'll check later
11:42:59  <Celestar> mail deparement called me
11:43:01  <Celestar> I have 80kg of mail
11:43:14  <Celestar> some workstations ...
11:43:57  <ledow> You must have a very strong postman
11:45:28  <roboboy> gnight
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11:46:52  * peter1138 ponders lunch break
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11:47:41  <White_Rabbit> whoa, what a name
11:48:08  <HentaiXP> Hello White_Rabbit
11:48:43  <peter1138> wow
11:48:49  <peter1138> violent Bjarni :-)
11:48:59  <HentaiXP> yeah openTTD isn't LUA friendly
11:49:17  <White_Rabbit> what's LUA?
11:49:44  <Fujitsu> What about Bjarni and LUA?
11:49:48  <HentaiXP> Limited User Account on win XP
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11:50:34  <Fujitsu> Oh, not Lua as in Lua?
11:50:54  <peter1138> it's not Lua friendly either :)
11:51:12  <Fujitsu> OpenTTD.GPMI is, however.
11:51:38  <peter1138> is it currently playable?
11:52:00  <HentaiXP> now I'll need to add write premissions to the dir
11:52:10  <HentaiXP> Fujitsu, openttd,gpmi is?
11:52:13  <HentaiXP> ,=.
11:52:26  <Fujitsu> Lua, not LUA compatible.
11:53:49  <HentaiXP> Lua as in?
11:54:12  <Prof_Frink> Scripting language
11:54:16  <Fujitsu> Lua as in the programming language.
11:54:19  <Fujitsu> Yes, what Prof_Frink said.
11:54:57  <HentaiXP> ahh ok
11:55:20  <hylje> the windows version isnt, mainly because it saves the games to its directory by default
11:55:46  <hylje> shouldnt it use %HOME% ?
11:55:59  <Fujitsu> Ideally.
11:56:03  <Fujitsu> File a bug!
11:56:35  <HentaiXP> yeah autosave failed is getting anoying, so a runas
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12:12:23  <Celestar> hey guys
12:12:31  <Celestar> I need a terminal application, for RS-232 conns
12:18:29  <tokai|noir> hyperterminal maybe?
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12:18:43  <[Shaman]> I got a stuck train O_O
12:18:50  <[Shaman]> it's literally.. not moving xD
12:19:00  <tokai|noir> Celestar:
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12:20:05  <Eddi|zuHause> [Shaman]: how did you manage to do that? :p
12:21:04  <[Shaman]> Eddi|zuHause: no clue
12:21:21  <[Shaman]> but after crashing it, shortening the station by 1 and replacing removed tile with a depot it's fixed :p
12:21:58  <[Shaman]> 9m/profit a year.. 13 years after start :o
12:22:11  <[Shaman]> not bad for only 2 hubs :P
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12:27:02  <RichK67> hi
12:28:17  <Scia> hello RichK67
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12:31:04  <Celestar> tokai|noir: that seems windows only?
12:31:36  <Celestar> bah Tron ping
12:31:57  <Fujitsu> Celestar, minicom?
12:32:02  *** ShadowJK_ is now known as ShadowJK
12:32:12  <Celestar> Fujitsu: trying but somehow I'm not very lucky @ connecting
12:32:24  <Fujitsu> WHat are you trying to connect to?
12:32:24  <RichK67> Celestar: ive been having a though about TGP - it doesnt handle 64x64 at all well  - often crashes as it cannot place any town. how about use the old generator for maps with a dimension < 128??
12:32:54  <Celestar> Fujitsu: a Sun Fire server
12:32:58  <RichK67> (or my preference; lose 64 altogether)
12:33:04  <Fujitsu> Via RS-232!? Silly...
12:33:08  <Celestar> RichK67: people likeit
12:33:12  <Celestar> Fujitsu: by what else? :)
12:33:20  <Fujitsu> Er... Ethernet?
12:33:29  <RichK67> 64?
12:33:40  <Celestar> Fujitsu: that assmues there are configured Ethernet ports in the first place?
12:33:41  <Fujitsu> Yeah, 64x64 is fun!
12:34:10  <RichK67> ok - so we need something non-TGP to generate them tho
12:36:59  <Celestar> hmm I get no response :S
12:37:20  <RichK67> me too ;)
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12:41:21  <Celestar> great
12:41:25  <Celestar> conn established
12:41:28  <Celestar> faulty cable
12:41:37  <Fujitsu> Good, minicom wasn't at fault :D
12:46:22  <Bjarni> <Fujitsu>	What about Bjarni and LUA? <--- well, I don't know how to code it. End of story
12:46:38  <Noldo> how to code in lua?
12:46:53  <Bjarni> isn't LUA some sort of coding language/scripting language?
12:47:07  <Bjarni> maybe it means something else as well
12:47:10  <Noldo> yes
12:50:28  <Celestar> great
12:50:33  <Celestar> I got a test server with a root password set
12:53:17  <Celestar> damnit
12:53:41  <Celestar> minicom needs a "connect" button
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13:11:56  <Bjarni> why can the forums get so odd ideas compared to what happens in this channel???
13:12:36  <peter1138> heh
13:12:45  <peter1138> what've we done now?
13:13:07  <Bjarni> "remove all catenary in the game", "you can drive with diesel/steam under catenary", "oh, then you don't have to remove it anyway"
13:13:47  <Celestar>
13:13:57  <Bjarni> but the removing requests (notice the "s") move towards being downright flaming
13:14:55  <peter1138> Celestar: yeah, problem with that is network games o_O
13:15:28  <Celestar> peter1138: why is that a problem?
13:15:35  <Celestar> it'S a cheat, so there'S no problem?
13:15:59  <glx> yeah cheat are not allowed in multiplayer :)
13:16:13  <Celestar> yes
13:16:17  <Celestar> that's the idea
13:19:08  <peter1138> ah, screw them, they should live with elrails ;)
13:19:21  <Bjarni> yeah
13:19:24  <glx> Celestar: hmm only train power is changed not all consist
13:19:25  <peter1138> if they really dislike it, they can make a grf to change all elrail engines to normal rail
13:19:57  <peter1138> (actually doing that in code might be an easier way to support no elrails)
13:20:03  <Celestar> glx: ?
13:20:03  <peter1138> blimey, sudden downpour
13:20:12  <Bjarni> I'm not sure they dislike it that much after they realised that they can use diesel on elrails
13:20:28  <peter1138> what!?
13:20:31  <Bjarni> so they can replace the tracks without instantly replacing all engines
13:20:44  <glx> Celestar: TrainPowerChanged(v) should be sufficient
13:21:19  <peter1138> glx: rather than modifying the tables that should be const?
13:21:33  <Bjarni> I thought  that it was a no brainer to figure out that diesel can run on tracks with catenary, but it appears that the forum failed to figure that out
13:21:40  <peter1138> Bjarni: yeah...
13:21:50  <glx> peter1138: I mean for trains updating after the change
13:22:01  <peter1138> i mean, all the engines are listed in an elrail depot...
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13:28:42  * peter1138 ponders increasing handles from 32 to... something else
13:28:55  <peter1138> with newstations, a lot more grfs are available...
13:34:41  <Sionide> is newstations in the nightly?
13:36:21  <peter1138> yes
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13:43:53  <Celestar> so what now0
13:44:29  <Celestar> commit or no commit for the cheat?
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13:48:41  <Celestar> great
13:48:45  <Celestar> mom's freaked up her PC
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13:56:27  <ln->
13:56:46  <Sacro> afternoon all
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13:58:32  <peter1138> isn't that what mums are for?
13:59:32  <Sacro> dare i ask?
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14:00:19  <Celestar> running IIS I presume
14:00:27  <Celestar> \o/ I'm in
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14:03:00  <Darkvater> success :D
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14:13:06  <Celestar> Darkvater: opinions on the patch?
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14:17:37  <Darkvater> which one?
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14:19:51  <Celestar>
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14:22:07  <peter1138> go the whole hog and let anything run on anything ;p
14:23:40  <Bjarni> steam on maglev?
14:23:54  <Celestar> peter1138: I will do no such thiong ..
14:24:01  <Bjarni> I would hate to be the fireman, specially if the shovel is magnetic :p
14:24:12  <Celestar> or the coal :P
14:24:36  <Bjarni> yeah, that would make it rather hard to throw it to the far end of the firebox
14:24:46  <Bjarni> ohh, new idea
14:25:14  <Bjarni> magnetic fuel. You can make it levitate in midair and that way ensure that you got a good fresh air flow to it
14:25:40  <Bjarni> even better than the grate the steam locomotives use to get air from underneath the fuel
14:25:57  <peter1138> hehe
14:26:03  <Prof_Frink> Oh yeah, how does openTTD's implementation of elrails cope with battery-powered trains?
14:26:14  <peter1138> Prof_Frink: same as ttdpatch's
14:26:15  <Bjarni> err
14:26:20  <peter1138> they're not electric
14:26:25  <Bjarni> battery powered???
14:26:31  <Prof_Frink> yup
14:26:36  <peter1138> Bjarni: yes, dbsetxl has one, for example
14:26:38  <Bjarni> what sane person would make battery powered trains???
14:26:45  <Prof_Frink> Germans.
14:26:47  <Celestar> Bjarni: there are some modules
14:26:49  <peter1138> :D
14:26:57  <Celestar> models
14:27:09  <Celestar> ok how do I restart sshd ...
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14:27:26  <Bjarni> oh, for taking care of tasks like the fireless steam engine switchers?
14:27:30  <Prof_Frink> /etc/init.d/ssh restart ?
14:27:40  <Bjarni> killall -9 -1 ?
14:27:42  <Celestar> Prof_Frink: no such file ;)
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14:28:14  <Darkvater> looking
14:28:16  <Celestar> root@T20-1:[/etc]# top
14:28:17  <Celestar> top: Command not found.
14:28:22  <Bjarni> not good
14:28:27  <Celestar> this really is a rather complete installation ;)
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14:28:51  <Bjarni> where DO those Germans use battery powered trains? At refineries and other places where you don't want sparks?
14:29:58  <Prof_Frink> I dunno, look on MB's site
14:30:33  <Sacro> Celestar: /etc/rc.d/init.d/sshd restart
14:30:34  <Darkvater> Celestar: /etc/init.d/sshd restart
14:30:40  <Bjarni> haha, google more or less only returned Thomas the tank engine as a battery powered toy
14:31:03  <Darkvater> Celestar: assuming you use suse 10.1
14:31:34  <peter1138> Bjarni: "EP1/E62"
14:31:53  <peter1138> hmm
14:31:56  <peter1138> not that one
14:32:01  <peter1138> why did i pick that one ;p
14:32:19  <peter1138> oh, saw "bav" and read it as bat ;p
14:32:32  <peter1138> BR515
14:32:39  <Darkvater> Celestar: echeat.diff < what's with the whole replacement -+ of the CheatEntry table?
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14:32:43  <peter1138> 49 tons or battery powered engine, heh
14:32:46  <peter1138> *of
14:33:14  <Darkvater> where the heck did this guy run off to now?
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14:33:20  <Darkvater> he asks for feedback and then just quites
14:33:24  <Darkvater> quits even
14:33:26  <peter1138> again!
14:33:44  <peter1138> Bjarni:
14:33:47  <Darkvater> peter1138: any progress on UTF-8 input?
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14:34:00  <Darkvater> or at least something I can plug windows functionality into?
14:34:02  <peter1138> no, i had a lazy weekend
14:34:03  <Celestar> GNAAH
14:34:12  <Celestar> please post a backlog
14:34:40  <Darkvater> Celestar: I don't like the english string for the cheat. It is confusing and not clear. Eg something like 'Allow electric rains to run on normal rail'
14:34:49  <Darkvater> 16:32 < Darkvater> Celestar: echeat.diff < what's with the whole replacement -+ of the CheatEntry table?
14:35:02  <Celestar> Darkvater: whitespace
14:35:07  <Celestar> so that it remains aligned
14:35:07  <Darkvater> whatfor?
14:35:11  <Darkvater> it was aligned
14:35:20  <Bjarni> so those battery powered vehicles are electric engines without catenary, but with a limited range and a lot of time out of service to recharge... not ideal
14:35:30  <Celestar> or right
14:35:35  <Celestar> I changed some variables
14:35:45  <Bjarni> 49 tons.... 5-10 tons of batteries?
14:36:28  <Bjarni> I mean, it takes half a ton of batteries to start a diesel locomotive and it will not last many minutes at that load
14:36:34  <Celestar> <= bettery?
14:36:38  <Celestar> :)
14:36:48  <Darkvater> wtf I can't change my background? It just ignores it
14:37:09  <Darkvater> much, much better
14:37:18  <Celestar> root@T20-1:[/usr/X/bin]# xclock
14:37:19  <Celestar> xclock: Command not found.
14:37:24  <Darkvater> although the assert is kinda useless
14:37:32  <Celestar> Darkvater: is it?
14:37:35  <Darkvater> the type is bool so it can only be 0 or 1
14:37:49  <Celestar> anything else?
14:38:00  <Bjarni> Darkvater: I once set it to automatically change the background each 5th sec, and then each 5th minute and it kept doing it each 5th sec. Kind of annoying. After I deleted the pref file, it started to be controlable and working correctly again
14:38:03  <Darkvater> yes, I'd like some chocolate :)
14:38:09  <Bjarni> so in short: pref file corruption
14:38:16  <Celestar> Darkvater: I can't commit chocolate
14:38:23  <Celestar> but shall I commit this cheat?
14:38:23  <Darkvater> Bjarni: I think it got confused cause I set the wallpeper when I had tv-out active
14:38:32  <Bjarni> ahh
14:38:46  <Bjarni> then you set the wallpaper on the virtual monitor you can't see
14:38:50  <Bjarni> or something
14:38:53  <Darkvater> I can't
14:38:56  <Darkvater> cause I can't see it
14:39:12  <Darkvater> Celestar: looks ok
14:39:30  <Bjarni> corrupted pref file. You set it to monitor 2, while you only got 0 (monitor) and 1 (TV)
14:39:35  <Bjarni> now that would suck
14:39:42  <Celestar> root@T20-1:[/usr/X/bin]# smc
14:39:43  <Celestar> Exception in thread "main" java.lang.UnsupportedClassVersionError: com/sun/management/viperimpl/console/BaseConsoleOptionsManager (Unsupported major.minor version 49.0)
14:39:46  <Celestar> wee
14:39:50  <Celestar> Darkvater: go or no go?
14:40:17  <Darkvater> Bjarni: what's this pref file called?
14:40:21  <Darkvater> I say go if it works
14:40:27  <Bjarni> in your system... I have no idea
14:41:07  <Bjarni> it's ~/Library/prefs/ or something like that in OSX
14:41:13  <Darkvater> brb, apple-pie is almost ready L:D
14:41:24  <CIA-3> celestar * r4946 /trunk/ (lang/english.txt misc_gui.c rail.h railtypes.h variables.h): "Feature": Add a cheat that allows running electric engines on normal rail
14:41:55  <Bjarni> like warm apple pie
14:42:06  <Bjarni> no wonder he hurries to catch it while it's warm :p
14:43:01  <Bjarni> Celestar: I would hate to use such a cheat, but then again I only use cheats to test my patches
14:43:38  <glx> money cheat is usefull to test things :) but only for that
14:43:51  <peter1138> money cheat and date cheat
14:44:09  <glx> yes date too to have more vehicles :)
14:46:08  <Bjarni> or player one. We once had a bug report from a MP game where it was player 2 or 3, who had the problem
14:46:32  <Celestar> the player cheat is great
14:46:43  <Celestar> especially when debugging AI shit :P
14:47:04  <Bjarni> yeah, make the AI build clever stuff and then it will be so confused that it can't figure out to continue
14:47:25  <Darkvater> Celestar: don't forget the savegame
14:47:28  <Darkvater> shit too late
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14:47:34  <Celestar> Darkvater: ?
14:47:46  <Darkvater> savegame bump, cheats are saved
14:47:59  <Celestar> you need to bump the revision for that as well? :o
14:48:25  <glx> to re-modify railtype on load I think
14:48:48  <Celestar> Darkvater: so bump now?
14:48:56  <Darkvater> wait lemme look
14:51:23  <glx> Celestar: if you activate the elrail cheat and start a new game, is _railtypes reset ?
14:51:35  <Darkvater> hmm seems it's not necessary
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14:52:38  <Celestar> glx: find out please
14:52:43  * Celestar gotta go
14:52:50  <glx> ok
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15:24:44  <Darkvater> hmm can I commit to 2 branches at the same time in the same commit?
15:26:32  <Darkvater> hmm apparently I can
15:26:37  <peter1138> technically, yes
15:26:49  <peter1138> it's just directories...
15:26:51  <peter1138> but should you? :p
15:27:11  <Darkvater> isn't it easier than doing 2 consecutive commits one to trunk/ and another branch/0.4?
15:27:30  <Darkvater> good you're here though
15:27:42  <peter1138> am i ever not here?
15:27:44  <Darkvater> peter1138: < which one of the three if any and if all should still go into 0.4.8
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15:29:45  <peter1138> hmm, iirc they're all pretty simple
15:30:04  <peter1138> otoh, the third is a feature not a bug fix
15:30:21  <Darkvater> I know but still thought it might be handy, that's why it's there
15:30:29  <peter1138> btw, that railtype fix for level crossings... there's a similar problem for bridges too
15:32:42  <Sacro> Darkvater: s/exclamation/question :)_
15:34:07  <Darkvater> peter1138: bridges don't have level crossings ;p
15:35:15  <peter1138> Darkvater: no, but they do have different track type on and below the bridge
15:35:29  <peter1138> and currently it doesn't check
15:35:34  <peter1138> ...
15:35:38  <peter1138> and currently it doesn't check the right one
15:35:51  <peter1138> of course, it could just ignore the railtype *on* a bridge
15:38:20  <Darkvater> well it does check the ramp, doesn't it?
15:38:40  <Darkvater> checking anything else is kinda moot
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15:40:19  <[Shaman]> [Darkvater]: checking anything else is kinda moot << If the track-converting thing converts an entire bridge at once then, you don't need railtypes on a bridge.
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15:46:22  <peter1138> nice
15:46:32  <peter1138> Darkvater: yes, exactly
15:47:01  <peter1138> Darkvater: but we do. currently it always checks the railtype under the bridge
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15:52:07  <Brianetta> Industrial stations ar eback in my nightly
15:53:18  <Sacro> w00t :D
15:53:29  <Brianetta> so the password changed again
15:53:37  <Brianetta> and there's a tenth rule
15:53:46  <Brianetta> which sucks
15:53:46  <TheMask96> what's a Industrail station?
15:53:50  <Brianetta> I didn't want loads of rules
15:54:34  <Brianetta> TheMask96: A bunch of stations in a pack which are graphically designed to look like commercial industrial loading nad unloading facilities
15:55:21  <TheMask96> ok... so just some other images?
15:55:31  <Brianetta> Well, not quite
15:55:41  <Brianetta> but they are eye candy, yes
15:55:48  <TheMask96> tried to google for it, but it didn't show anything ;)
15:55:55  <Brianetta> I posted several shots in the pictures thread
15:59:15  <TheMask96> kewl :)
16:07:40  <Sacro> Brianetta: 10th rule?
16:08:17  <Brianetta> Sacro: There were nine
16:08:24  <Brianetta> Now there is a tenth
16:08:26  * Sacro didnt know there was rules...
16:08:34  <Brianetta> What does the welcome message say?
16:08:46  <Brianetta> What does the page where you get the password from say?
16:08:50  * Brianetta sighs
16:10:31  <Brianetta> I wouldn't need rule 10
16:10:34  <Brianetta> but
16:11:01  <Brianetta> until the server has some means of saving the passwords, there's scope for idiocy
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16:11:45  <Brianetta> devs, isn't there any way that passwords for companies could be written into a file that accompanies the saved game?  It's only for dedicated servers, after all
16:12:04  <White_Rabbit> I'd also like people to have more control over their own companies, even without a password
16:12:20  <Brianetta> Kicking off other players, etc?
16:12:34  <Brianetta> The server supports making people into spectators
16:12:42  <Brianetta> because it does that at bankruptcy
16:12:54  <Brianetta> so having a command that could do that would be neat
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16:15:21  <Darkvater> peter1138: the PF checks the railtype when on a bridge?
16:16:59  <Brianetta> So, what's next for OpenTTD?
16:17:07  <valhallazzzw> Brianetta: rule 10 is pretty logical I would think?
16:17:10  <Brianetta> Trains that go backwards?
16:17:26  <valhallazzzw> that would be cool
16:17:28  <peter1138> Darkvater: yes
16:17:36  <Brianetta> valhallazzzw: It is, but if passwords were saved by the server when I updated, the vandals wouldn't have access to companies or their funds
16:18:04  <valhallazzzw> true
16:18:07  <valhallazzzw> btw Brianetta
16:18:09  <valhallazzzw> north (top left) to south (bottom right) <--?
16:18:32  <glx> Celestar: as I though, _railtypes is not reset when you start a new game after the cheat was activated
16:19:02  <Brianetta> valhallazzzw: Yes?
16:19:20  <Brianetta> The top left of the map is north
16:19:37  <Brianetta> although some people think it's north west
16:19:51  <Brianetta> I'm trying to hammer in some consistency
16:20:07  <Brianetta> so that if and when they drift over to #openttdcoop the compass is second nature
16:20:12  <valhallazzzw> yeah
16:20:28  <valhallazzzw> but I don't think top left and bottom right are the best ways to describe it ;)
16:20:33  <Brianetta> I do
16:20:43  <valhallazzzw> mkay
16:21:38  <Darkvater> peter1138: so why does it still work in all cases?
16:23:03  <White_Rabbit> I thought north was top-right?
16:23:15  <White_Rabbit> that's how OTTD names stations
16:23:15  <Sacro> White_Rabbit: me too
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16:24:00  <Brianetta> White_Rabbit: I am followin #openttdcoop convention.
16:26:35  <Darkvater> hmm
16:26:45  * Darkvater has troubles committing to multiple branches at the same time
16:27:59  <argonel> was there an issue in 0.4.7 where the quantity of sea/lakes was ignored?
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16:37:15  <peter1138> Darkvater: it doesn't
16:37:35  <peter1138> Darkvater: of course, it works if the rail type below is compatible
16:37:44  <Brianetta> Back later...
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16:37:46  <Darkvater> hmm
16:38:02  <peter1138> the train controller still works, of course
16:38:08  <Darkvater> so you are telling me a train doesn't go over a conventional rail bridge if there is maglev rail below it?
16:38:12  <peter1138> it just won't find a path
16:38:26  <peter1138> yes
16:39:04  <Darkvater> hmm why did I never experience this?
16:39:15  <peter1138> perhaps you have better networks than me? :)
16:39:31  <Darkvater> :)
16:40:23  <White_Rabbit> uh oh...animated engines are no longer animated in OTTD :|
16:40:41  <hylje> :<
16:40:46  <Darkvater> no it works
16:40:49  * Darkvater checks trunk/
16:41:20  <White_Rabbit> yes, it should work and I've seen it
16:41:37  <White_Rabbit> but I'm using r4943 and they're no longer animated
16:41:55  <hylje> so they just slide along the rail
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16:44:19  <CIA-3> Darkvater * r4947 / (branch/0.4/openttd.c trunk/openttd.c): - Fix [FS#145]: Starting scenarios did not adhere to local difficulty settings
16:44:20  <Darkvater> tdaa
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16:57:28  <peter1138> White_Rabbit: which set?
16:57:56  <peter1138> White_Rabbit: we support x/y pos animation (old hacky style), but not motion_counter animation (new preferred style)
16:58:00  <White_Rabbit> US set
16:58:09  <White_Rabbit> the Berkshire there should be animated, but its pistons are no longer moving
16:59:44  <peter1138> which is the berkshire?
16:59:57  <peter1138> can't see it here
17:00:44  <White_Rabbit> the 'Class F Berkshire' is available in temperate only, after 1927
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17:06:12  <peter1138> "allow electric engines to run on normal rail" should perhaps mark the whole screen dirty
17:06:21  <peter1138> or just vehicle purchase lists
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17:37:11  <Sacro> hmm, guet the feeling youve missed something
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17:56:28  <Darkvater> peter1138: I have no idea what you are talking about
17:56:45  <Darkvater> peter1138: trains with conventional bridges but for example monorail below still go voer the bridge
17:56:54  <Darkvater> both in 0.4.7, trunk and branch/0.4
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17:58:03  <peter1138> Darkvater: the *trains* go over, yes
17:58:08  <peter1138> but the *pathfinder* doesn't
17:59:29  <Darkvater>
17:59:30  *** Mucht|zZz [] has quit ["I'll be back!"]
17:59:31  <Darkvater> you mean this bug?
17:59:49  *** |Jurgen| [] has quit ["Leaving"]
18:00:22  <peter1138> dunno, never looked at it
18:01:19  <Darkvater> ah see the problem. seems to affect old PF only though
18:02:13  <peter1138> yes
18:02:13  *** |Jurgen| [] has joined #openttd
18:02:53  <Darkvater> I wonder why this was never reported
18:03:02  *** Belugas_Gone is now known as Belugas
18:03:20  <Belugas> hey there
18:04:14  <Belugas> Darkvater, installing msvs 2005 ahs exactly the same steps as for v6, right?
18:04:27  <Belugas> I mean same libs, same config and all..
18:04:53  <Darkvater> Belugas: you don't need the directx SDK I think but otherwise it's the same
18:04:54  <peter1138> Darkvater: i guess most people upgrade in one go
18:05:02  <peter1138> i only found it because i had lost trains, heh
18:05:03  <Darkvater> just copy headers/libs and you're set
18:06:25  <Darkvater>
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18:08:44  <peter1138> Darkvater: for my next trick...
18:08:59  <Darkvater> hmm I wonder how this can be solved
18:09:10  <peter1138>
18:09:12  <Darkvater> how does the function know in what direction you want to check for compatibility?
18:10:01  <peter1138> take your pick, or improve
18:12:24  <Brianetta> From the next time I restart the game on my nightly, I think I'll begin logging the IP addresses and names of everybody who joins the game.
18:12:34  <Brianetta> This information I will use to become a ban-happy admin-ogre.
18:13:07  <Brianetta> I'm tired of visiting my nightly server to see vast oceans with embanked railway lines crossing it.
18:13:22  <Darkvater> :)
18:13:46  <Darkvater> peter1138: so what are these tricks?
18:13:46  <Brianetta> Darkvater: Perhaps if Terragenesis was made core, people would think it was too pretty to flatten?
18:13:48  <Brianetta> Nah
18:13:54  <Brianetta> Of course they wouldn't
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18:17:23  <peter1138> Darkvater: well, they each get around the issue
18:17:35  <Darkvater> ah the above issue?
18:17:39  <peter1138> yea
18:18:13  <RichK67> lol
18:18:15  <Darkvater> hmm I needa check this in trunk/ 0.4 has too much magic
18:18:29  <RichK67> TGP has some ... errr.... issues with 64x64 ;)
18:18:42  <peter1138> it's the same in 0.4, heh
18:18:53  <Darkvater> yes but it's all *magic* there
18:18:58  <Darkvater> GB( magic :)
18:19:40  <Sacro> i spy a wiki problem - Compiling on MinGW
18:20:33  <RichK67> wiki - Where Ignorance Kills Intellect ;)
18:20:33  <Sacro> can anyone tell me where to get "wget" from... cos without that I cant download zlib or pnglib
18:21:20  <LIIT>
18:21:48  <Darkvater> it's probably in your cygwin install program
18:21:50  <Darkvater> selectable
18:21:51  <Sacro> LIIT: never mind - theres links to the actual tar.bz2's needed
18:22:03  <Sacro> Darkvater: im using MinGW/Msys rather than cygwin
18:22:18  <Darkvater> it's probably in your mingw install program
18:22:32  <LIIT> ahh, I was thinking you were in Linux :-)
18:22:47  <Sacro> LIIT: laptop is, desktop can be
18:22:54  <RichK67> Brianetta: ping
18:23:00  <Darkvater> I think people usin cygwin are sad
18:23:37  <|Jeroen|> yeah
18:23:40  <Brianetta> RichK67:
18:23:44  <Brianetta> ew
18:23:51  <Brianetta> new theme, and I can't see the input box on xchat
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18:24:14  <Darkvater> hi Tron_
18:25:43  <Sacro> Darkvater: i ran from cygwin when i saw KDE, GNOME and XFCE as options
18:26:17  <Darkvater> he
18:27:22  <Prof_Frink> It's only a matter of time until cygwin has WINE as an option
18:27:58  <Sacro> Prof_Frink: or vice versa
18:28:38  <Sacro> though cygwin/MinGW under wine would be useful for cross compilation
18:29:15  <Darkvater> peter1138: I think I prefer uglypathfix[2].diff
18:29:31  <Darkvater> the other doesn't fit into the current NTP code-philosophy
18:31:31  *** Zerot_ is now known as Zerot
18:31:54  <Sacro> that sounds like an oxymoron...
18:32:05  <peter1138> *nod*
18:32:25  <Darkvater> can't decide about 1 or 2 though
18:33:08  <Darkvater> perhaps 2
18:33:46  <Darkvater> hehe "My first patch ever :) - More than 32(30) GRF files." < funny
18:34:20  <peter1138> :)
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18:37:28  <Darkvater> peter1138: shall I flip a coin or you'll pick one?
18:38:21  *** Tron [] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
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18:42:00  <Darkvater> fine, quit then
18:42:02  <Darkvater> jezus
18:42:08  <Darkvater> no need to take it personally
18:42:20  <Darkvater> glx: the startupeconomy() fix worked like a charm :)
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18:43:32  <Brianetta> peter1138: Tonight's nightly is a TGP map if you fancy a go (:
18:43:34  <Darkvater> well lookwho's back...
18:43:40  <peter1138> power cut
18:43:45  <peter1138> what did i miss?
18:43:46  <Darkvater> yeah they all say that
18:43:54  <peter1138> i saw a highlight, but couldn't switch
18:43:58  <Darkvater> when'd you leave?
18:44:17  <Darkvater> 20:37 < Darkvater> peter1138: shall I flip a coin or you'll pick one?
18:44:17  <Darkvater> 20:38 -!- Tron [] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
18:44:20  <Darkvater> 20:41 -!- peter1138 [] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
18:44:23  <Darkvater> 20:42 < Darkvater> fine, quit then
18:44:26  <Darkvater> 20:42 < Darkvater> jezus
18:44:29  <Darkvater> 20:42 < Darkvater> no need to take it personally
18:44:57  <peter1138> heh
18:46:41  <[Shaman]> lol
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18:48:58  <[Shaman]> ooOOooo my mini_IN crashed
18:48:59  <[Shaman]> openttd: tile.h:39: TileHeight: Assertion `tile < MapSize()' failed.
18:50:10  <Bjarni> Darkvater: it is personal, but they don't dare to say it to your face :p
18:50:30  * Bjarni wonders what the coinflip was all about
18:51:36  <Bjarni> [Shaman]: it's a modified source, so talk to the patch makers/guy, who compiled this for you about this
18:51:43  <Darkvater> Bjarni: whaat?
18:52:13  <[Shaman]> Bjarni: I compiled it myself.. dunno if you have logs of last night, but i remember 0 from it :P
18:52:23  <[Shaman]> maybe it explains the amount of emty beer bottles as well
18:54:59  <Sacro> [Shaman]: yeah, you where a bit drunk
18:55:06  <[Shaman]> Sacro: Heh.
18:55:31  <[Shaman]> Clueless about what caused this assert.. then again, I never was anything but clueless :P
18:55:55  <Sacro> and drunk :P
18:56:59  <Bjarni> 	<Darkvater>	Bjarni: whaat? <-- mini_IN is a modified source, right ;)
18:57:27  <Bjarni> Sacro: is [Shaman] a friend of yours?
18:57:35  <Bjarni> or relative?
18:57:40  <[Shaman]> Bjarni: Don't even know the guy :P
18:58:03  <[Shaman]> He seemed to be helpfull last night though, seeing the amount of times I asked him things.
18:58:08  <Bjarni> clueless + drunk... somehow I would not be surprised if you were related
18:58:16  * [Shaman] chuckles
18:58:28  <peter1138> Darkvater: this FS168 is a bit strange
18:58:45  <peter1138> if i tell it to ignore drawing the bad sprite, it works (obviously)
18:58:53  <peter1138> but there is no gap where a sprite would have been :s
18:59:16  <peter1138> hmm, maybe it's random
18:59:48  <Darkvater> is it a bad sprite?
19:00:29  <Darkvater> this assertion and the likes have been there for quite some time
19:00:44  <anboni> is YAPF supposed to function the same way as NPF, or are there supposed to be differences between the two (for instance with trackselection on a station)?
19:00:48  <peter1138> in this particular case it's an empty entry in the GRF
19:01:01  <Sacro> hmm, dont u hate it when you double click on a .zip file and the PC bsods and reboots
19:01:25  <peter1138> Darkvater: it used to happen with the arctic set, but that was fixed long ago
19:01:32  <KUDr> anboni: there can be many differences
19:01:45  <Sacro> Bjarni: OI :P
19:01:47  <tank_> Sacro: how the hell do you do that?
19:01:56  <Sacro> tank_: what?
19:02:13  <Bjarni> Sacro: don't know that one, but I got another issue kind of like that. My computer wants to open certain files in a hex editor
19:02:14  <tank_> well, thos thing with zip-files and reboot:)
19:02:24  <[Shaman]> Sacro: If you manage to do that, yer doing something -really- good :P
19:02:27  <Bjarni> no, I don't want to open .gz files in a hex editor :p
19:02:34  <anboni> KUDr: want to know about specifics in a situation that was designed to do some loadbalancing? (the result of the current design is that NPF balances a lot better than YAPF)
19:02:57  <Bjarni> <Sacro>	Bjarni: OI :P <-- what?
19:03:03  <Sacro> i think it was just coincidence, it was an IRQL_LESS_THAN_OR_EQUAL
19:03:19  <KUDr> anboni: then enter new bug report
19:03:25  <[Shaman]> I think he didn't like the comparisson, Bjarni.
19:03:26  <anboni> willdo
19:03:49  <Bjarni> Sacro: so did I scare you off IRC for days? (again)
19:03:51  <anboni> (just not sure if it's a bug in yapf code or in my track design :) )
19:04:02  <Bjarni> I didn't really intend to do that
19:04:05  <Bjarni> not now
19:04:09  <Sacro> n[19:58:36] <Bjarni> clueless + drunk... somehow I would not be surprised if you were related
19:04:10  <Bjarni> and not last time either
19:04:14  <Sacro> that ^^^
19:04:34  <KUDr> anboni: no problem, just set email notification so we can discuss it there
19:04:39  <Bjarni> you mean you aren't drunk?
19:04:48  <anboni> KUDr: ok:)
19:05:17  <Bjarni> I guess it's due to the fact that the shops are closed when you are awake... and you risk getting sunlight on you if you go shopping for beer
19:05:19  <Bjarni> :p
19:05:22  * Bjarni hides
19:05:30  <Belugas> Darkvater : msvs 2005 works like msv6 in a matter of installation.  It needs DirectX SDK too. Only difference : the directX include/lib should be set at the end of the paths, not at the beginning
19:05:36  <Sacro> Bjarni: i'm teetotal
19:05:50  <Bjarni> wtf is teetotal?
19:05:59  <peter1138> Darkvater: this is a buggy grf
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19:06:26  <peter1138> (hmm, but why should it break in arctic but not temperate
19:06:27  <peter1138> )
19:06:45  <Bjarni> peter1138: then write that in the bug report and report it to the creator of the grf file
19:06:54  <Sacro> Bjarni: i dont drink
19:07:07  <Belugas> +`1345--
19:07:10  <Bjarni> Sacro: ok, there goes that theory
19:07:18  <Bjarni> only the vampire theory remains
19:07:24  * Bjarni goes to get some garlic
19:07:25  <Sacro> Bjarni: i do go out...sometimes
19:07:40  <Bjarni> o_O
19:07:43  <Sacro> oooh, i like garlic
19:08:11  * Bjarni gets his long sword +5
19:08:31  <Bjarni> that should ensure that you will not harm me
19:08:54  * Sacro gets his +6 electromagnet
19:09:02  <Bjarni> lol
19:09:08  <peter1138> Bjarni: it's also a bug in ottd
19:09:19  <peter1138> Bjarni: it *should* break in both cases
19:09:30  <peter1138> it's a steamer
19:09:35  <peter1138> it has the multihead flag set
19:09:54  *** Bringuh [] has joined #openttd
19:09:55  <Bjarni> how is that possible?
19:10:06  <Bjarni> should it have a steam engine in both ends of the train?
19:10:25  <Sacro> ive never seen that before
19:10:28  * Bjarni have seen trains like that in real life
19:10:40  <Bjarni> they use them in Germany once in a while
19:11:17  <Bjarni> but those are normal steam locomotives and because the tracks don't allow them to move an engine from one end of the train to the other one at the end of the line, they got one in both ends
19:11:55  <Bjarni> then only the front one operates and the rear one is dead weight. No commercial railroad would do that through
19:12:20  <Bjarni> they would figure out a way to make the trains run with only one engine
19:12:34  <Bjarni> like placing more switches and stuff like that
19:13:05  <Bjarni> peter1138: so the multihead flag is a mistake from the grf creator, right?
19:13:35  <peter1138> looks like it
19:13:36  <peter1138> it's engine 24
19:13:44  <peter1138> the original is the SH '40'
19:13:47  <peter1138> which isn't multihead
19:14:08  <peter1138> hmm
19:14:11  <peter1138> unless
19:14:28  <Bjarni> you got an i386. Decode the grf and read the flags for engine 24
19:15:22  *** Belugas is now known as Belugas_Gone
19:16:18  <Bjarni> 	<peter1138>	unless <-- usually such a line is followed by a statement, so I'm still waiting ;)
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19:22:40  <peter1138> yup, it definitely sets the dual head flag
19:23:31  <Bjarni> so the rear engine gets sprite+1 and that one is borked?
19:24:10  <Bjarni> try to remove that flag and reincode and see what happens
19:24:16  <Bjarni> it should work... in theory
19:25:12  <peter1138> yeah
19:25:16  <peter1138> cos it's a gui sprite
19:25:19  <peter1138> so it's not been drawn
19:25:37  <peter1138> there are many other bugs with offsets in this grf
19:26:08  <Bjarni> OTTD should validate that sprites from a grf that should be drawn really is drawable sprites
19:26:44  <Bjarni> and reject the whole GRF as buggy with a red error box instead of a crash
19:28:26  <peter1138> this sprite is never meant to be drawn
19:28:33  <peter1138> anyway
19:28:36  <Bjarni> yeah, that's what I meant
19:28:52  <peter1138> no, you meant it should be rejected
19:29:31  <peter1138> looks like this is using multihead to draw a tender
19:29:40  <peter1138> without using the articulated engine callback
19:29:42  <peter1138> however
19:29:47  <peter1138> the gui sprite is fucked up
19:29:49  <Bjarni> when loading a grf, it should make a list of sprites it will draw and verify that they are drawable before continuing. If it detects that a vehicle or whatever intend to draw a sprite that is not meant to be drawn, then it should reject the grf
19:29:54  <peter1138> (because it's empty)
19:30:30  <Bjarni> rejecting instead of crashing the game when it tries to draw the sprite anyway
19:30:37  <peter1138> also, it's fuck up because dual head engines are, obviously, at each end of the train
19:30:40  <peter1138> +ed
19:30:48  <Bjarni> yeah
19:30:49  <peter1138> Bjarni: we can ignore the bad sprite
19:30:50  <peter1138> but...
19:31:06  <peter1138> by the time it's being drawn, the grf is already loaded
19:31:25  <Bjarni> I meant when it detects that it should load the sprite, long before it tries to draw it
19:31:40  <Bjarni> err
19:31:41  <peter1138> Bjarni: er, you don't know how the sprite cache works, do you?
19:31:46  <Bjarni> 2nd try to say that
19:31:49  <peter1138> it loads the sprite just before drawing it...
19:32:36  <Bjarni> hmm
19:32:56  <Bjarni> you know more about this than I do
19:33:01  <peter1138> i know :)
19:33:36  <peter1138> we *could* check the sprites when loading the grf file, but 1) there is nothing to mark a palette map sprite from a normal sprite
19:33:37  <Sacro> hmm
19:33:37  <Bjarni> still, I would like if we got a grf validation check when it opens the file for loading
19:33:53  <peter1138> 2) just because there is a sprite doesn't mean it will ever ever be drawn
19:34:09  <peter1138> e.g.
19:34:22  <peter1138> some times sets use different graphics for the purchase list
19:34:26  <peter1138> to show, e.g. tenders
19:34:42  <peter1138> now, the purchase list is only ever drawn going west
19:34:46  <[Shaman]> meh
19:34:50  <peter1138> so there's no point drawing sprites for the other directions
19:34:52  <[Shaman]> how come the server isn't being advertised :/
19:35:05  <peter1138> so that's a valid use of empty sprites
19:35:40  <Bjarni> [Shaman]: advertising turned off or firewall?
19:36:09  <Bjarni> peter1138: you are making this complicated compared to my original idea :/
19:36:09  <[Shaman]> no and no :/
19:36:24  <peter1138> which was what?
19:36:27  <[Shaman]> normal server works, mini_IN with same network settings fails
19:36:36  <[Shaman]> at least.. normal server worked yesterdya
19:36:37  * [Shaman] checks
19:36:54  <Bjarni> peter1138: an easy way to detect if sprites should be drawn when they are missing
19:37:34  <Bjarni> peter1138: how about just making a test to see if multiheaded engines got sprites for the engines in both ends?
19:37:48  <Bjarni> and if not, then force it to use the same sprite in both ends
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19:43:17  <peter1138> problem is we'd have to look into each sprite to see if it is valid
19:43:26  <peter1138> anyway
19:43:28  <peter1138> gon
19:43:29  <peter1138> +e
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19:58:38  <Brianetta> TOnight's nightly is desyncing all the time
19:59:01  <Sacro> i was thinking of joining it
19:59:02  <RichK67> im the only stable one - no desync yet
19:59:23  <hylje> :o
19:59:27  <hylje> u r unstable
19:59:41  <Sacro> lol, be back in  abit, food hunting
20:00:01  *** Zr40 [] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
20:01:17  * Bjarni wonders who gave Sacro a hunting licence
20:01:28  <Bjarni> I'm not sure he is stable enough to carry firearms
20:01:52  <RichK67> ah - but he has a right to bare arms
20:02:02  <RichK67> and get sunburnt ;)
20:02:47  <Bjarni> sunburn and Sacro... those words don't fit in the same sentence
20:02:54  *** Scia [] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
20:04:39  <Sacro> Bjarni: too right
20:08:25  <Bjarni> <--- hey Tobin is on
20:08:42  <Bjarni> I'm not sure if this is the real Tobin. It could be a faked one
20:08:47  *** tokai|noir [] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
20:09:33  <Xeryus|sleep> rofl @ quote _O_
20:09:42  *** Xeryus|sleep is now known as XeryusTC
20:09:53  <XeryusTC> i wasn't suppose to be still sleeping...
20:11:24  <Sacro> lol
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20:15:08  <Dred_furst> Hey
20:15:26  <Dred_furst> Gonna ask a really silly thing where is the revision identifier stored in the OTTD source code?
20:15:37  <RichK67> rev.c
20:15:50  <Bjarni> rev.c is autogenerated at compiletime
20:16:02  <Bjarni> the makefile takes care of that
20:16:09  <Bjarni> why?
20:16:17  <Dred_furst> cause mine says norev000
20:16:24  <Bjarni> OS?
20:16:35  <Dred_furst> Windows, MSVC7 compiler
20:16:47  <Bjarni> then I have no idea on how to fix it :(
20:16:59  <Sacro> bodge it :P
20:17:16  <Bjarni> I can fix such a problem for all other OSes than windows
20:17:22  <Dred_furst> I dont even have a res.rc :/
20:17:30  <Dred_furst> oh
20:17:33  <Dred_furst> Whoops
20:17:38  <RichK67> Brianetta ping
20:21:08  <Bjarni> <-- now that's a salesman
20:22:29  <Bjarni> <--- oh crap, I prefer C to C++ :s
20:24:01  <RichK67> nah - gotta be Ada ;)
20:26:26  <Bjarni> why?
20:26:31  <Bjarni> oh
20:26:48  <Bjarni> a necrophile
20:26:55  <Bjarni> >_<
20:26:58  <XeryusTC> ouch
20:27:29  <Bjarni> you know, Ada is named after a woman, who invented something computer related in 185x
20:27:41  <Bjarni> you prefer somebody like her???
20:27:49  <XeryusTC> that reminds me, some scientist discovered a homosexual necrophilic duck once :X
20:27:51  <Bjarni> dead for more than a hundred years
20:28:30  <Bjarni> XeryusTC: wtf. I guess it had problems reproducing and it died out
20:28:34  <Bjarni> darwin at work
20:28:53  <RichK67> lol
20:29:06  *** Aankhen`` [n=pockled@] has quit ["Look ma, no script!"]
20:29:17  <XeryusTC> the scientist just happened to notice that a male duck was f**king a dead male duck on a hicking trip or something
20:29:24  <XeryusTC> he took like 70 pictures
20:29:40  <hylje> --
20:29:40  * XeryusTC goes out if he can find them
20:29:42  <hylje> rly
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20:30:30  <Bjarni> what have happened to this channel???
20:30:51  <Bjarni> half an hour ago, it was about the trunk, now it's about pics of a homosexual necrophilic duck
20:31:15  <XeryusTC> here are some
20:32:06  <Bjarni> "An other drake mallard raped the corpse almost continuously for 75 minutes"
20:32:08  <Bjarni> ....
20:32:16  <Bjarni> I thought they did it really quickly
20:33:20  <hylje> maybe it was obsessed
20:33:56  <Bjarni> something was completely wrong with that duck
20:34:01  <Bjarni> it should have been shot
20:34:24  <Bjarni> it wanted to have gay sex for 75 minutes with a dead duck o_O
20:36:10  <Bjarni> <--- this guy must have a real problem with the length of this .... since he cares about this
20:37:00  <Sacro> damn beetles
20:37:22  <XeryusTC> Bjarni: people do that too
20:37:41  <Bjarni> XeryusTC: personal experience?
20:37:43  <XeryusTC> but they are mostly locked away in some psychiatrist thingy
20:37:52  <XeryusTC> unfortunately not
20:38:10  <Bjarni> you mean you want to, but you have yet to find a dead male mallard?
20:38:24  <XeryusTC> no, i was kiddin' :P
20:38:40  <Bjarni> <-- maybe you are into that instead
20:39:11  <XeryusTC> yes, im into that :)
20:39:18  <XeryusTC> although im nog aged 40
20:40:07  <XeryusTC> <- he must be a stoner :)
20:40:18  <Bjarni> you are even older??? o_O
20:41:02  <Bjarni> <--- old, but still good. AFAIK they wrote an article in some computer magazine about it because they spent ages looking though all scripts and such first
20:41:06  <XeryusTC> no, im 2.5 times as young :P
20:41:42  *** |Jeroen| [] has quit ["Whoopsy"]
20:41:53  <XeryusTC> rofl
20:42:42  *** |Jurgen| [] has quit ["Leaving"]
20:45:12  <Bjarni> <--- kids can be so cruel
20:46:48  <XeryusTC> <- so obvious ;)
20:48:25  <Brianetta>
20:48:26  <Brianetta> ):
20:48:33  <Brianetta> wah )-':
20:48:33  <XeryusTC> :D
20:48:45  <XeryusTC> Brianetta: what was in it?
20:49:10  <Brianetta> Something from here
20:49:15  <Brianetta> but I can't remember what
20:49:19  <Brianetta> *I* thought it was funny
20:49:32  <Brianetta> Everything I have ever submitted to bash has been rejected
20:49:34  <Brianetta> All three of them
20:49:59  <XeryusTC> lol
20:50:25  <Bringuh> some of my stuff is on The Better Bash [tm]
20:50:25  <XeryusTC> only 1 thing i submitted to ( like) has been rejected out of 5 or something :)
20:50:26  <Bringuh> aka
20:50:40  <Bringuh> bash is run by an asshole who hasn't updated any of the software behind the site in oh about two years
20:50:47  <Bringuh> (at least nothing that was requested)
20:50:50  <XeryusTC> im actually the target of most quotes i come in @ nego :(
20:51:14  <Bringuh> if you go to the new mod questionnaire you'll find an image that points to because no one at bash bothered to check and remove it ;P
20:51:49  <Bringuh> This is my best qdb quote:
20:51:49  <Bringuh> :D
20:51:56  <CIA-3> KUDr * r4948 /branch/yapf/ (29 files in 3 dirs):
20:51:56  <CIA-3> [YAPF] Added YAPF settings into Patches with non-standard Save/Load - uses SL
20:51:56  <CIA-3> structure CYapfSettings with its own serialization. This should allow to
20:51:56  <CIA-3> add/remove YAPF settings without changing savegame revision. Please review.
20:53:49  <XeryusTC> <- quite a classic :)
20:54:13  *** mode/#openttd [+o peter1138] by ChanServ
20:56:17  <Bjarni> yesterday when looking at, I had an issue with a fly, that kept landing on my monitor. I don't think that was the intention when using flyspray
20:57:37  <XeryusTC> <- roflmfao
20:59:53  *** Tron_ [] has quit ["Client exiting"]
20:59:59  <Bjarni> that goodmorning one reminded me of something that happened long ago (way back into the 90s). I entered the computer room at school at around 16:00 and was sleepy after a long day, saw one I knew and wanted to greet him, so I said "goodmorning.... NOO, I didn't just say that"
21:00:20  <Bjarni> then he started talking about my weird internal clock :(
21:00:29  <HentaiXP> Bjarni, where can I submit bugs are suggestion, openTTD on win wants to save within program files, well since I run under a User account and not a account with admin, it can't save there and so the auto save fails
21:01:06  * XeryusTC thinks that HentaiXP is a sick pervert
21:01:25  <Bjarni> XeryusTC: that is what we say out loud AFTER they leave
21:01:31  <Sacro> Bjarni: conversley, on linux, it looks for scenarios under ~/.openttd/scenarios, when they are under /usr/share/openttd/scenarios
21:01:53  <XeryusTC> Bjarni: i know, but i couldn't resist :X
21:02:04  <Bjarni> HentaiXP: you DO know that hentai mean pervert in Japanese, right?
21:02:13  <Bjarni> so you named yourself pervert XP :p
21:02:23  <XeryusTC> pervert experience
21:02:28  <HentaiXP> yep
21:02:29  <Bjarni> yeah
21:02:31  <XeryusTC> sounds sick
21:02:49  <HentaiXP> XP denotes OS I'm on
21:02:52  <Bjarni> are you one of those nice looking cartoon girls?
21:03:04  <Bjarni> <HentaiXP>	XP denotes OS I'm on <-- that makes it even worse
21:03:05  * peter1138 > sleep
21:03:50  <XeryusTC> <@Bjarni> <HentaiXP> XP denotes OS I'm on <-- that makes it even worse <- /me would commit suicide if w2k showed up in his nick, or just change it ;)
21:04:11  <Prof_Frink> Bjarni:
21:04:11  <Bjarni> or ME
21:04:21  <HentaiXP> think autosaves, should go under appdata\openttd\autosave\
21:04:33  <Bjarni> win CE, win ME, win NT = windows^3 CEMENT <-- stoneage OS
21:04:41  <Prof_Frink> nah, ~/.openttd/save/auto/
21:04:56  <Prof_Frink> "As hard as a rock and as dumb as a brick"
21:05:20  <HentaiXP> there is a port of openTTD to PSP?
21:05:32  <RichK67> nah - a brick is an improvement on stone ;)
21:05:46  <Bjarni> HentaiXP: actually about your write problem. it will not write in the exe file, but it tries to write to the same dir. I'm not sure if there is an easy solution. I don't know XP that well
21:06:01  <Bjarni> <HentaiXP>	there is a port of openTTD to PSP? <-- officially no, unofficially yes
21:06:57  <HentaiXP> Bjarni, its the autosave so far I noticed, by efault users don't have write perms to stuff in program files
21:07:12  <XeryusTC> HentaiXP: you should contact your system admin to change the rights of the program files dir
21:07:18  <HentaiXP> I gave write perms to the dir the autosave goes into
21:07:25  <HentaiXP> I am the sys adm
21:08:14  <Bjarni> HentaiXP: actually I don't really know about windows....
21:08:20  <Bjarni> Darkvater: windows issue
21:08:41  <Bjarni> Darkvater: take care of the experienced pervert in here
21:09:23  <Bjarni> <HentaiXP>	I am the sys adm <-- either that or you used one of the millions of backdoors to do stuff like that without the admin pw
21:09:38  <HentaiXP> nah
21:09:58  <HentaiXP> if I need to change a permission than I gain admin access in CMD with runas
21:10:02  <Sacro> HentaiXP: dont bother with non-admin accounts, are silly
21:10:17  <HentaiXP> Sacro, sorry I disagree
21:10:53  <Sacro> HentaiXP: hmm, well thats up to you :)
21:11:35  <HentaiXP> Bjarni, where can this unoffical port to PSP be found at?
21:12:09  <XeryusTC> google? [/useless]
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21:14:00  <Bjarni> <Prof_Frink>	Bjarni: <-- if HentaiXP is the XP in that pic, I would hump her
21:14:13  <Bjarni> but somehow I got a feeling that he is not
21:14:27  <HentaiXP> lol
21:16:11  <HentaiXP> PSP ver looks good, finially I can get some use out of my psp
21:18:42  *** sw4y [] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
21:19:14  <Bjarni> <HentaiXP>	Bjarni, where can this unoffical port to PSP be found at? <-- I have no idea
21:19:37  *** Angst [] has quit ["gn"]
21:19:43  <HentaiXP>
21:19:56  <HentaiXP> for anyone else who might care
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21:30:25  <Sacro> mmmmmmmm, XGL
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21:58:00  <Eddi|zuHause> [22.05. 23:03] <HentaiXP> Bjarni, where can I submit bugs are suggestion, openTTD on win wants to save within program files, well since I run under a User account and not a account with admin, it can't save there and so the auto save fails <- i think the solution could be a openttd.cfg setting like "savegame_dir" and "autosave_dir"
21:59:07  <Eddi|zuHause> i really hate it when i have multiple versions of openttd in different folders and have to click through half a dozen of folders just to get all savegames in the same dir
22:00:22  *** jong [] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
22:00:25  <CIA-3> KUDr * r4949 /branch/yapf/yapf/yapf_costrail.hpp:
22:00:25  <CIA-3> [YAPF] Fix: FS#183 - Load balancing behaves oddly with YAPF turned on.
22:00:25  <CIA-3> Last signal state was ignored due to logical mistake in the cost calculation. (thanks to anboni)
22:00:57  *** wonea [] has joined #openttd
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22:07:12  <glx> KUDr: ping
22:07:15  *** ^Cartman^ [] has quit ["Bunchie!"]
22:07:15  * Vornicus fiddles with the half&half 4-way by Sebastian.
22:08:43  <Vornicus> only thing wrong with it, really, is that paths through the cloverleaf part have two hills to climb.
22:08:55  <Biff> Vornicus: url?
22:08:56  *** wonea [] has left #openttd ["Leaving"]
22:09:00  <KUDr> glx: pong
22:09:09  <Vornicus>
22:09:11  *** Hallo [n=me@] has quit []
22:09:19  <glx> KUDr: I saw you add debug_level for yapf
22:09:31  *** shintah [] has quit []
22:09:47  <Vornicus> It's a graceful little thing.  I'm trying to find a way to make it so you only have to climb one hill no matter where you're going.
22:09:55  <KUDr> heh, yes, but it is yet used in setting only
22:10:05  <glx>
22:10:13  <glx> for other debug places :)
22:10:50  <KUDr> thanks, i will do it during cleanup
22:11:01  <KUDr> or you can if you like
22:11:15  <Vornicus> I haven't yet succeeded - I'm trying, possibly, to make the cloverleaf sections on the lower level.
22:11:18  <KUDr> would be good to work in team
22:11:35  <glx> ok I commit it then
22:11:42  <KUDr> k, thanx
22:12:39  <XeryusTC> Vornicus: why do people complain about the slopes?
22:13:08  *** Forexs [] has quit ["Go on, get out. Last words are for fools who haven't said enough. - Karl Marx"]
22:13:11  <Vornicus> Slopes tend to slow you down, especially with maglev.
22:13:17  <Eddi|zuHause> i believe junctions work best when you have 2 height levels between the 2 crossing mainlines
22:13:43  <CIA-3> glx * r4950 /branch/yapf/ (6 files in 2 dirs): [YAPF] Replaced debug printfs with DEBUG()
22:14:07  * XeryusTC mumbles something about realistic acceleration
22:15:37  <Eddi|zuHause> RichK67: i have kind of a problem with the TGP... i have mountaneous terrain and very rough... and for my taste, i get too many "high plains", i.e. flat areas on the top of mountains
22:16:25  <Eddi|zuHause> damn... placing/expanding towns are WAY too destructive to the terrain :(
22:16:41  <Eddi|zuHause> they basically make everything flat
22:16:52  <Eddi|zuHause> only rarely they build roads up/downhill
22:17:00  <XeryusTC> thats not RichK67's fault
22:17:09  <Eddi|zuHause> no, that is independent ;)
22:17:10  <Vornicus> it's even worse with realistic acceleration - a train taking a curve doesn't slow down, but a train taking a slope crawls.
22:17:31  <XeryusTC> Vornicus: that is with ra OFF
22:18:20  <Eddi|zuHause> realistic acceleration is odd... electric trains go much faster around curves than conventional trains...
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22:30:45  <Vornicus> dangit, I can't get the latest mini_in to run on my computer
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22:33:30  <RichK67> eddi - i have tried all sorts of rescaling stragegies to try to alleviate the flat top mountains - basically with only 15 levels, its inevitable. if we had 32 levels, then those flat tops would rise to nice peaks
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22:34:27  <Vornicus> how do the various options for tgp relate to each other?
22:37:10  <Eddi|zuHause> hmm...  that is pretty sad... beat the devs to introduce more heightlevels then ;)
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22:40:51  * Vornicus figures it's something like: smoothness affects the "fractal scale" of the generator, mountainousness affects the height multiplier, and wateriness affects the height offset.  or... something like that.
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22:43:06  * Vornicus actually goes hunting for the tgp code, so he can see for himself
22:43:41  <RichK67> yup - pretty much
22:44:07  <Vornicus> where can I find the tgp stuff?  I want to see what I can come up with
22:44:35  <RichK67> terrain (mountainousness ;) ) actually adds / subtracts a second terrain ontop of the main one
22:44:47  <RichK67> try the TGP thread ;)
22:45:10  <Vornicus> %&*#$
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22:45:40  <Vornicus> which is in what forum?
22:46:02  <Vornicus> ah, nemmind, it is linked from your sig
22:46:16  <RichK67>
22:46:37  <Vornicus> not a small patch, either
22:47:07  <RichK67> very old version too  - 4600
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22:47:30  <RichK67> its only 36k... Mini IN is 540k !
22:47:32  <Vornicus> I'm mainly just looking for the scaling data
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22:58:16  * Vornicus fiddles
22:58:43  <Vornicus> what I'm looking for is NewGenerateTerrain, I take it?
23:01:28  <Vornicus> okay.  terrain is... amplitude, roughness is... frequency.  And then the water level is just a clamp on that.
23:01:37  <Vornicus> Correct?
23:02:44  <RichK67> with a few tweaks, but yes, generally - if you look, there is a section that adds terrains in a case statement
23:02:44  <Vornicus> what if... you changed the amplitude according to the water level?
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23:03:24  <RichK67> ive fiddled a lot - the variation is quite complex, and its just gone midnight and my brain cells have expired ;)
23:03:35  <Vornicus> ok
23:04:36  <Vornicus> but there's, like, a range limit on the noise?
23:06:17  <RichK67> find the table of decimal values... the max is sum(2^n * the decimal value)
23:06:29  <RichK67> where n is the position in table
23:07:02  <RichK67> so its 1*0.95 + 1/2*0.85 + 1/4 * 0.65 +...
23:07:24  <Vornicus> hm
23:07:29  <RichK67> so its not exactly a simple number
23:07:29  <Vornicus> okay, I think I see how that works...
23:07:37  <RichK67> and its positive and negative
23:08:10  <RichK67> that then gets scaled, clamped, modified, etc etc... its a bit hackish
23:08:24  <gradator> w 17
23:08:35  <gradator> oops :)
23:08:57  <Vornicus> scaled, clamped for the sea, then smoothed to make a legal terrani, it looks like
23:09:58  <RichK67> as i say, complicated - i have  a new version of the patch on my local machine with a full text explanation in tgp.c
23:10:20  * Vornicus is fiddling with the scenario creator.  thinks he sees how it works
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23:12:05  * Vornicus tries to think
23:13:18  <RichK67> specifically for the mountains, i test if the value is > 200, and if so, scale the remaining bit into the 4 levels between 200-255
23:13:46  <Vornicus> okay, so my idea - and, granted, it might not do any good - would be to change the scaling so that first the water is clamped to, and then the highest point in the remainder hits 255.
23:13:47  <RichK67> it makes the tops flat, but at least they arent *totally* flat
23:14:37  <RichK67> vorn - problem is identifying what that max number is - i had values of up to 590 on some terrains...
23:14:50  <RichK67> and on others only 350
23:14:54  * Vornicus is fiddling
23:15:33  <RichK67> it needs more work - if you find a good solution, i will be happy to add it into the final build (with credit)
23:15:44  <Vornicus> well, is there a calculable maximum value?
23:16:02  <Vornicus> I mean, a number that you can guarantee the max isn't above?
23:16:25  <RichK67> yes; 1*0.95 + 1/2*0.85 + ......
23:16:55  <Vornicus> but you'd using integers.  where are those coming from?
23:17:21  <RichK67> the table of decimals at the start of the tgp section
23:17:50  <RichK67> static const double _perlin_p_values[4][6] = {  // perlin frequency per power
23:17:50  <RichK67>      { 0.35, 0.35, 0.35, 0.35, 0.35, 0.35 }, // Very smooth
23:17:50  <RichK67>      { 0.45, 0.55, 0.45, 0.55, 0.45, 0.35 }, // Smooth
23:17:50  <RichK67>      { 0.75, 0.86, 0.65, 0.65, 0.55, 0.45 }, // Rough
23:17:50  <RichK67>      { 0.95, 0.85, 0.75, 0.65, 0.65, 0.55 }, // Very Rough
23:17:51  <RichK67> };
23:17:55  <Vornicus> right, I see that.
23:18:01  <Vornicus> But those don't add up to 590.
23:18:18  <RichK67> then
23:18:18  <RichK67>           const double amplitude = pow(_perlin_p_values[_patches.tgen_smoothness][i], (double)i);
23:18:19  <RichK67>
23:18:19  <RichK67>           total += interpolated_noise((x * frequency) / 64.0, (y * frequency) / 64.0, prime) * amplitude;
23:18:51  * Vornicus fiddles with that
23:19:20  <RichK67> i may look at it this weekend coming (uk bank holiday)
23:19:26  <Vornicus> ok
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23:51:12  <RichK67> gn
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