Log for #openttd on 14th September 2006:
Times are UTC Toggle Colours
00:00:36  <grimrc> just like English
00:00:45  <Sacro> wa?
00:00:58  <grimrc> resistance/resistor
00:01:00  <Sacro> Widerstand isnt english
00:01:07  <grimrc> really???
00:01:07  <Sacro> resistance != resistor
00:01:31  <grimrc> a redundant resistor is 'futile resistance'
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00:02:16  <Sacro> true
00:02:21  <Sacro> as a redundant users
00:02:23  <grimrc> 'widerstand ist spannung durch stromstarke' = resistance is [something/spanning?] through [something]?
00:02:25  <Sacro> *are
00:03:56  <Eddi|zuHause> hm... R=U/I
00:04:03  <Eddi|zuHause> i don't know the english names
00:04:18  <Sacro> i can never remember ohms law :(
00:04:23  <Sacro> R=V/I
00:04:29  <Sacro> V = voltage
00:04:40  <Gonozal_VIII> current?
00:04:50  <grimrc> Ohm's Law
00:05:01  <Sacro> grimrc: stop correcting me :p
00:05:10  <grimrc> well, you know it's a bloke then
00:05:19  <Sacro> :o sexist
00:05:31  <grimrc> yes, the sexiest
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00:05:57  <grimrc> sexiest physicist 1801
00:06:08  <grimrc> (I don't know the actual date)
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00:06:24  <Sacro> :s
00:06:42  <grimrc> heh
00:06:55  <grimrc> well *I'm* entertained and that's all that matters
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02:05:44  <Eddi|zuHause> yay. looks like i found the file...
02:06:12  <Eddi|zuHause> i copied /usr/X11R6/lib/modules/drivers/ to /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers/
02:06:59  <Eddi|zuHause> now i got till (EE) fglrx: Failed to load module "fglrxdrm" (module does not exist, 0)
02:07:33  <Eddi|zuHause> is there a search function somewhere?
02:09:22  <glx> find
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02:25:10  <Eddi|zuHause> something is odd... i now managed to "test" the configuration with sax2, but it is stuck on initializing the test screen (shows a background, and a waiting clock mouse cursor)
02:28:26  <glx> night
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07:24:55  <DaleStan> Darkvater: Any chance of getting the version of grfcodec hosted on upgraded to something less ancient?
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08:39:21  <AsterixMG> hi @all
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11:13:39  <YogSothoth> Hi!
11:13:44  <Sacro> hey
11:13:49  <YogSothoth> I'm new at the deluxe version and wonder, in the ice world, what should I do with gold mines?
11:14:19  <Sacro> errm...
11:14:24  <Sacro> errrrrr...
11:14:30  <Sacro> gold, goes to banks i think
11:15:04  <YogSothoth> directly? no factory?
11:16:49  <Sacro> dont think so
11:31:24  <mikk36> yes
11:32:01  <mikk36> just look at the bank req list
11:32:05  <mikk36> accept list*
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11:45:10  <PluueeR> lo
11:46:05  <PluueeR> I've seen loads of screenshots on, mostly the railway networks are not verry realistics
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11:46:21  <PluueeR> RoRo station for examples,
11:47:05  <PluueeR> I always try to make my network realistic, but it isn't very easy at some point
11:47:12  <PluueeR> What do you think?
11:47:47  <Noldo> it's a game, not a simulation
11:48:45  <PluueeR> hummz...
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11:49:41  <Pogopuschel> hi everyone!
11:49:43  <PluueeR> short but clear
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11:50:10  <Noldo> when ever you put a piece of track on the map it's already unrealistic
11:51:36  <PluueeR> humm. maybe I apply for a job at the Dutch Railways then ;)
11:52:16  <Noldo> :)
11:52:45  <Sacro> busy in here today
11:52:57  <PluueeR> yeah... you like it?
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11:53:14  <Sacro> PluueeR: yea
11:53:16  <Sacro> *yeah
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11:53:35  <Pogopuschel> erm.. i found out about openttd just yesterday and have been playing it since... might it be possible that the ai is still pretty bad? :|
11:54:37  <peter1139> as it hasn't changed, yes...
11:55:12  <Pogopuschel> the site says "an AI that is actually worthy of its name" :o
11:55:28  <peter1139> lies
11:55:37  <Pogopuschel> hehe
11:55:55  <peter1139> the only competitor worth playing against is other people on a network game
11:56:00  <PluueeR> oh, like it more to play against people or on my own, AI is no fun
11:56:47  <peter1139> yeah
11:56:55  <peter1139> i hate the way it destroys the landscape
11:56:55  <Pogopuschel> i wouldnt mind a good AI
11:57:06  <peter1139> possibly, but there isn't one
11:57:10  <Pogopuschel> hehe yeah i noticed
11:57:24  <peter1139> the improved ai being just rvs, and that's still not that good
11:57:37  <Pogopuschel> rvs?
11:58:11  <peter1139> road vehicles
11:58:14  <Pogopuschel> ah
11:58:16  <Pogopuschel> yes
11:58:27  <Pogopuschel> their routes are ok though
11:58:43  <mikk36> but not economy
11:59:00  <Pogopuschel> yep :/
11:59:01  <mikk36> i managed to see 30 road vehicles waiting in line on 40 tiles long route :D
11:59:34  <PluueeR> I hope some day will have diagonal bridges and tunnes in the game, or bridges and tunnels with a bend in it, should be nice
11:59:45  <mikk36> there will be :)
12:00:09  <mikk36> although, u can do just fine without them
12:00:27  <Born_Acorn> peter1139, tell peter1138 to commit newsounds!
12:00:40  <Prof_Frink> newshounds?
12:00:44  <mikk36> atm the thing that bothers me most is that u can't build signals under bridges and diagonal stuff under bridges
12:00:48  <PluueeR> you can, but you kan make better, more realistic, faster crossings
12:01:36  <peter1139> ah, t' news 'ounds
12:01:37  <PluueeR> and you cant build signals on crossings (with road) and in tunnels, on bridges
12:03:50  <Eddi|zuHause2> the largest problem with "realistic" networks is the signalling
12:04:24  <Eddi|zuHause2> it neither supports flat, compact junctions nor 2 way stations
12:04:45  <mikk36> even funnier is the realistic acceleration where starting the momentum takes 1 full day :D
12:06:07  <PluueeR> with PBS you kan come a long way
12:06:11  <PluueeR> it's very nice
12:06:34  <PluueeR> I'm still thing of combining PBS with presignals for a nice terminus station
12:06:48  <Eddi|zuHause2> yes, but the PBS (in the miniin) are not good either, and they are even worse with 2 way stations
12:07:08  <Eddi|zuHause2> PBS are automatically presignalled
12:07:47  <Eddi|zuHause2> which is very useful for single track lines
12:08:19  <PluueeR> ah youkay, zo instead of presignals with exit signals for my terminus station. I can use PBS instead?
12:08:28  <Eddi|zuHause2> yes
12:08:47  <PluueeR> I use 2 lines, 1 each way,
12:08:55  <Eddi|zuHause2> but PBS have problems with trains turning around, so that can cause trouble
12:10:03  <Eddi|zuHause2> (trouble meaning trains crash)
12:10:18  <mikk36> a little whoops :D
12:10:58  <PluueeR> But when you switch of 90 degrees for trains and ships, they can't turn around
12:11:38  <mikk36> u can also set that trains can turn around only on track ends
12:11:48  <mikk36> and i don't like creating non-roro stations
12:12:20  <Eddi|zuHause2> terminus stations are nice for not so busy tracks
12:12:22  <PluueeR> I will experiment tonight :)
12:12:37  <Eddi|zuHause2> and they take a lot less space
12:12:45  <PluueeR> okay but in reallife, and later on in the game with passenger services you have to
12:12:57  <PluueeR> the cities are really populated at this point
12:13:38  <Eddi|zuHause2> take a look at Leipzig main station ;)
12:14:31  <Eddi|zuHause2> (that's the largest terminus station in europe (or the world?))
12:15:34  <Eddi|zuHause2> the story about it is quite funny, because they were originally 2 identical stations next to each other
12:15:52  <Eddi|zuHause2> one belonging to the prussian railway, and one to the bavarian railway
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12:20:01  <mikk36> to create a good terminus station u have to combine presignals and pbs
12:21:02  <Sacro> nah, just pbs
12:22:02  <Sacro> woo, dell launch AMD systems
12:22:06  <mikk36> old news
12:22:14  <Eddi|zuHause2> like i said, PBS are automatically presignals
12:22:14  <mikk36> heard about it a month ago already
12:22:54  <Eddi|zuHause2> and even better, they are "intelligent" presignals, only stoppin the train if the exact signal they try to go through is red
12:23:03  <Sacro> mikk36: no, they got launched TODAY
12:23:07  <Sacro> it was announced ages ago
12:23:23  <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause2: #newsignals has major plans
12:23:45  <Eddi|zuHause2> i know the plans
12:23:52  <Eddi|zuHause2> tell me if you have an alpha version :)
12:23:53  <Sacro> do you?
12:24:04  <Sacro> errm... KUDr has got LUA working in MiniIN
12:24:10  <mikk36> also.. it was pretty nice to see how dell xps 1710 is taken apart :)
12:24:18  <mikk36> how quickly
12:25:55  <PluueeR> what kinda plans?
12:26:09  <Sacro> PluueeR: new signalling system
12:26:26  <Sacro> id like to also have proper depots, goods yards, detachable consists
12:26:36  <Sacro> turntables to
12:26:37  <PluueeR> with presignals, the train won't stop in the signal section, how is that when you use PBS?
12:26:39  <Sacro> *too
12:26:50  <Sacro> PluueeR: new signals will default to red
12:26:51  <hylje> yarr.
12:26:56  <Sacro> yeek, a pirate
12:27:11  <PluueeR> I've seen a turntable irl, there not used in the netherlands i gues
12:27:11  <Sacro> so i train wont enter a block until its cleared
12:27:46  <Eddi|zuHause2> i've seen lots of turntables
12:27:47  <hylje> python and lua newsignals ftw
12:28:00  <Sacro> hylje: yes, i dunno if KUDr is planning on leaving LUA in though
12:28:01  <Eddi|zuHause2> they were commonly used with steam engines
12:28:15  <Sacro> im hoping if we keep saying KUDr  and KUDr_wrk he might notice us :p
12:28:21  <Eddi|zuHause2> but all modern engines are designed to go in both directions
12:28:25  <hylje> Sacro: i dunno but python should be supported
12:28:33  <Sacro> hylje: ive never used python
12:28:43  <hylje> its easily embeddable and extendable by C
12:28:49  <hylje> so i dont see why not
12:28:50  <Sacro> but id like to implement the whooooole set of UK signalling systems
12:29:05  <Sacro> and then others can implement those from other countries
12:29:16  <Sacro> german and swedish both look quite interesting
12:29:21  <hylje> thats the coolness of scripting
12:29:31  <hylje> as long as theres a script directory feature
12:29:40  <hylje> you can just have predefined scripts do the hard work
12:30:00  <Sacro> is it a lot slower though?
12:30:17  <Sacro> wouldnt it cause desyncs?
12:30:21  <hylje> not a lot
12:30:34  <Sacro> ah fsck
12:30:40  <Sacro> dell site doesnt suppored t'internet
12:30:40  <hylje> and its supposed to be modifiable on the fly
12:30:46  <Eddi|zuHause2> i guess it is easy to put the scripts in a pool and send them over the net
12:31:12  <hylje> Eddi|zuHause2: it might not be as easy to sync the things
12:31:23  <Eddi|zuHause2> especially if that newgrf saveload would be finished ;)
12:31:26  <Sacro> thats the main problem
12:31:31  <Sacro> is using them online
12:31:40  <hylje> shouldnt be too hard either
12:31:55  <hylje> block the script running if someone is lagging behind
12:31:58  <Eddi|zuHause2> hylje: why? once the scripts are sent, on all clients the same things are executed
12:32:19  <hylje> yes its what is supposed to happen
12:32:28  <hylje> but sloow machines which cant keep up.. well..
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12:32:54  <Eddi|zuHause2> if you are really brave, you could make a command to change a script on the fly
12:32:55  <hylje> (.. we can stop supporting them)
12:33:07  <hylje> Eddi|zuHause2: its essential to make the scripts usable
12:33:17  <hylje> Eddi|zuHause2: if your script has a bug, have fun fixing it
12:33:24  <Sacro> arrgh, i got a Win 95 pc to "fix"
12:33:43  <Eddi|zuHause2> slow machines are easily thrown off the network game anyway
12:33:58  <Eddi|zuHause2> install SuSE ;)
12:34:00  <hylje> so yea.
12:34:01  <Sacro> could code it in java
12:34:22  <hylje> java. hah.
12:35:09  <Eddi|zuHause2> wtf? i got 45 new mails over night...
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12:36:49  <Eddi|zuHause2> hm... no... they're old mails that got downloaded again...
12:37:51  <PluueeR> what are goods yards, detachable consists
12:38:30  <Pogopuschel> can anyone tell me why the "first train arrives.." news are always so.. late?
12:38:44  <hylje> PluueeR: station tiles which store en-route and waiting stuff
12:38:55  <hylje> PluueeR: consists.. i dont know
12:39:17  <Sacro> PluueeR: means you can seperate the engine from the wagons
12:39:26  <Sacro> and if needed, seperate wagons from other wagons
12:39:28  <PluueeR> Ah okay
12:39:52  <hylje> sounds cool
12:40:04  <PluueeR> so the locomotive doens't have to wait before wagons are loaded
12:40:05  <hylje> would make some wicked designs :>
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12:40:37  <Sacro> PluueeR: yes, it'd mean shunters would have uses
12:40:57  <Eddi|zuHause2> PluueeR: the main use would be feeder services, where you just redistribute the wagons, not unload them
12:40:59  <Sacro> and they'd wait for a mainline trian to collect the full load, and come back with an empty load
12:41:22  <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause2: yes, in reality, they dont unload one train and reload another, they'd just swap the wagons
12:41:38  <hylje> but at gameplay perspective
12:41:46  <hylje> it would be a pain to do wagon swapping in a roro
12:41:56  <Sacro> would it?
12:42:28  <Brianetta> The loco could ro-ro while the wagons go out the way they came in
12:42:29  <Eddi|zuHause2> you'd need to adapt the station construction, of course :p
12:43:00  <Sacro> Brianetta: yes
12:43:07  <hylje> yes
12:43:10  <hylje> realism
12:43:40  <peter1139> you want a train simulator, not a transport game ;p
12:43:49  <Brianetta> Of course we do
12:43:57  <Brianetta> peter1139: Have you incremented?
12:43:57  <Sacro> peter1139: yes! spot on!
12:43:58  <hylje> you mean this isnt a train simu already?
12:44:26  <Sacro> hylje: how many trains do you know that can stop in 10m for a red signal
12:44:44  <hylje> gameplay>realism
12:45:14  <Eddi|zuHause2> realism can make up very good gameplay
12:45:18  <Sacro> i disagree, i think gameplay < realism
12:45:33  <Brianetta> gameplay < realism
12:45:36  <PluueeR> or how many TGV like trains do you know that slowdown when climbing.
12:45:53  <Eddi|zuHause2> sometimes you have to cut realism short because your game engine just cannot handle it
12:45:56  <Brianetta> PluueeR: How mant TGVs do you know that ever have to climb a significant gradient?
12:46:09  <Sacro> PluueeR: use realistic acceleration
12:46:23  <PluueeR> maybe IU should :)
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12:47:57  <hylje> i think that we can archieve playable realism with a real physics and 3d engine
12:48:06  <hylje> stuff up to scale, etc.
12:48:39  <Prof_Frink> hylje: a real physics engine, but with fudge factors for gameplay
12:48:46  <PluueeR> there is work on that right?
12:49:03  <Sacro> hmm, lets find a GPL physics engine
12:49:07  <PluueeR> hummz. lets rephrase that.... People are working on that right?
12:49:23  <Sacro> PluueeR: no, we just sit and moan
12:49:37  <Torm> evening all... whats up
12:49:49  <Sacro> Torm: ceiling
12:49:51  <peter1139> well
12:49:53  <peter1139> i'm hungry
12:49:56  <PluueeR> seen some graphics on forum, but is there a site with progress things and all?
12:49:59  <Torm> Sacro: /slap
12:50:14  <PluueeR> Sacro : happy moaning for you
12:50:17  <PluueeR> ;)
12:50:22  <Sacro> :D allo allo
12:50:27  <Sacro> good moaning
12:52:07  <Brianetta> I was pissing by your door...
12:52:46  <Sacro> hehe
12:52:50  <Sacro> i got Season 1 here,
12:57:43  <Eddi|zuHause2> hm... is the election in sweden this weekend?
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13:07:32  <Belugas> good day
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13:09:31  <PluueeR> back again
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13:47:02  <WolfAngel> (CPU) 2-AMD Athlon™ 64 X2 Dual Core Processor 3800+, 9006MHz (7% Load) .:. (RAM) usage: 0/2048MB (0.00%) .:. (GFX) RADEON X1600 Series Secondary, (Display) 1024x768/32bit/75Hz
13:47:03  <WolfAngel> (OS) Windows XP Professional, Service Pack 2 (5.1 - 2600), (installed for) 9w 6d 20m, (uptime) 1d 9h 19m 27s .:. (HDDs) 62.1GB/359GB(17.3%) free
13:47:07  <WolfAngel> wooopps
13:47:10  <WolfAngel> sry ^^
13:48:10  <peter1139> YOU WILL BE
13:48:24  <WolfAngel> I'm really sorry ^^...
13:48:30  <WolfAngel> not on purpose...
13:49:40  <Brianetta> peter1139: Why did you increment?
13:51:14  <peter1139> ping timeout/autoconnect, i guess
13:51:15  <Prof_Frink> WolfAngel: Something's wrong there
13:51:25  * Prof_Frink hands peter1139
13:51:30  <WolfAngel> ... like? ^^...
13:51:47  <WolfAngel> the 9Ghz cpu? ^^
13:51:52  <Prof_Frink> XP needs to use more than 0MB ram
13:52:00  <WolfAngel> ... no way? ^^^
13:52:03  <WolfAngel> ^^*
13:52:16  * Prof_Frink steals WolfAngel's hats
13:52:27  <WolfAngel> ... darn
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13:58:39  <Born_Acorn> peter1139! Tell peter1138 about the news hounds!
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14:03:45  <Sacro> 9GHz CPU and 0 RAM usage?
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14:19:41  <WolfAngel> yeah of course Sacro ^^
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15:00:08  <Neonox> Tron: ping
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15:08:32  <Sacro> Neonox: there is no Tron
15:08:57  <Neonox> Sacro: I know. I tried to call him
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15:28:40  <mikk36> niceee
15:28:41  <mikk36>
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15:36:53  <Brianetta> !seen meush
15:36:55  <_42_> Brianetta, MeusH ( was last seen quitting #openttdcoop 3 days 6 hours 31 minutes ago (11.09. 09:05) stating "Quit: bye - quit" after spending 2 hours 16 minutes there.
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15:41:32  <jonty-comp> Hmm, maybe not
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15:43:06  <Sacro> ?
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16:00:32  <grimrc> those fans weigh 670g!
16:01:53  <Sacro> lol
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16:03:58  <hylje> :E
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16:20:09  <grimrc> (GNU) patch doesn't seem to have an interactive option, so I can just patch certain file/hunks ;oS
16:20:26  <grimrc> is there a better program/way
16:20:58  * grimrc thinks patch needs patching
16:24:10  <hylje> patch *.road *.tar
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17:01:14  <Wolf01> hi
17:01:21  <spock_> hi
17:01:29  <Sacro> hi
17:02:01  <spock_> Is there any control panel to easily control the decitated server trough your browser? (Preferably in Php)
17:02:10  <Sacro> spock_: not yet
17:02:29  <spock_> But there's being worked on?
17:02:40  <spock_> Any code yet available?
17:03:18  <Sacro> errm, Brianetta says you could tie one in with his autopilot
17:03:25  <Brianetta> If you had the patience
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17:03:49  <Brianetta> Communication would probably best be semaphored through the MySQL module
17:04:06  <Brianetta> with autopilot pollin it periodically, and PHP used to command it
17:04:17  <Sacro> hmmm, sounds challenging
17:04:21  <Brianetta> Indeed, yes
17:04:35  <Brianetta> PHP scripts need to be (re)written anyway
17:04:39  <Sacro> there are some?
17:04:46  <Brianetta> The ones for the web chat log are not yet functional
17:05:20  <Sacro> well if the autopilot can dump to either xml or sql, then php can pick that up nicely
17:05:53  <hylje> php
17:05:55  <hylje> :E
17:05:58  <Wolf01> i installed DSLinux on the DS :O
17:06:06  <Sacro> DSTTD ::d
17:06:08  <hylje> damn small?
17:06:15  <Wolf01> 12MB
17:06:19  <grimrc> cool
17:06:27  <Wolf01>
17:06:27  <grimrc> does it have good hardware drivers?
17:06:46  <Sacro> ooh, i just equalised air pressure in my right ear
17:06:49  <Brianetta> Sacro: It talks to MySQL already
17:07:01  <Sacro> Brianetta: does it? ill have to take a look
17:07:03  <Brianetta> It's all in the release
17:07:19  <Brianetta> The only thing missing is any application that reads the tables to act on it
17:07:30  <Brianetta> Basically, MySQL is the semi-official API
17:07:44  <Sacro> not sure if thats a good thing or not...
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17:07:59  <Wolf01> now i'll try to surf internet with the retawq browser :O
17:08:20  <spock_> Brianetta, what is autopilot exactly? Is there documentation about it?
17:09:28  <Sacro>
17:09:34  <Sacro> spock_: ^^
17:10:37  <Brianetta> spock_: Yes, there is extensive documentation.
17:10:39  <peterNaN> mysql--
17:10:53  <Brianetta> peterNaN: Feel free to add another module.
17:11:02  <Brianetta> You can control autopilot with IRC
17:11:05  <spock_> So basically, autopilot has direct access to the game console from the server itself?
17:11:07  <Brianetta> sandbox is an autopilot
17:11:09  <Brianetta> on this very net
17:11:11  *** peterNaN is now known as peter1138
17:13:38  <Eddi|zuHause> <grimrc> (GNU) patch doesn't seem to have an interactive option, so I can just patch certain file/hunks ;oS <- on windows there is tortoise merge, maybe there is an equivalent for linux
17:14:00  <grimrc> thanks Eddi|zuHause; I'll look that up
17:14:24  <Eddi|zuHause> although that had not all needed features either
17:14:39  <Eddi|zuHause> it is part of tortoisesvn
17:14:49  <grimrc> ohhh
17:17:41  <Eddi|zuHause> just click on the directory and choose "apply patch"
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17:32:57  <Wolf01> yeah, i'm on google with the DS :D
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17:37:22  <eper> when you leave a server rejoin then leave again shortly after, the passwords removed. That a bug or a "feature"?
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17:42:11  <glx> eper: company passwords are not saved
17:43:29  <eper> but surly the server should store the password? ie, i join dedi1 set pass, leave the game (servers not shutdown) rejoin the password will remove itself after i join 'sometimes'
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17:44:58  <Sacro> password autoclean
17:45:08  <IronDuke> Hey... Can I use the new graphics from in openttd?
17:45:20  <Sacro> IronDuke: some yes
17:45:37  <IronDuke> Sacro: ok! are there other graphics that are better ?
17:45:41  <IronDuke> for openttd
17:46:06  <Sacro> no, openttd is aiming to support ttdpatch graphics, rather than creating its own standard
17:46:11  <IronDuke> ok
17:46:24  <IronDuke> I looked in the manual trying to install them, but it didn't work
17:47:16  <IronDuke> When I download them.. i get lots of grf-files.. and I unzip them to the folder data right?
17:47:28  <Sacro> yeah
17:48:03  <IronDuke> do I overwrite newgrfw.grf ?
17:48:14  <IronDuke> i meant cfg
17:48:18  <Sacro> errr...what grfs are you installing?
17:48:23  <glx> you don't need it
17:48:25  <Sacro> doesnt matter, you may as well delete
17:48:26  <Sacro> it
17:48:33  <IronDuke> really?
17:48:40  <IronDuke> ok
17:48:46  <glx> you need to configure grf in openttd.cfg
17:48:50  <IronDuke> ok
17:49:04  <IronDuke> so i just insert all the grf-files like this in openttd.cfg:
17:49:09  <IronDuke> [newgrf]
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17:49:15  <IronDuke> dbsetw.grf
17:49:18  <glx> yes
17:49:22  <IronDuke> ok!
17:49:24  <Sacro> that should do it
17:49:34  <Sacro> oh, and ignore the red dot, it means nothing
17:49:44  <glx> you can pass params: dbsetw.grf=params
17:49:54  * Sacro has never used dbset
17:50:05  <IronDuke> so whats the point with newgrfw.cfg ?
17:50:16  <glx> it's for ttdpatch
17:51:15  <IronDuke> hmm. i cant find openttd.cfg
17:51:41  <IronDuke> oh.. now its there:) had to run the game first appearently
17:51:47  <glx> yes
17:52:40  <IronDuke> And i have to type all the grf-files in openttd.cfg?
17:52:44  <IronDuke> under [newgrf]
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17:52:59  <glx> all the newgrf you want to use
17:53:03  <IronDuke> ok
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17:56:54  <IronDuke> how come the train stations look the same?
17:56:59  <IronDuke> it should work now :/
17:57:23  <glx> which openttd version?
17:57:29  <Sacro> what grfs and which opnettd version?
17:58:20  <IronDuke> i want stations like u see in the latest screenshot on :)
17:58:39  <glx> you didn't reply :)
17:58:44  <IronDuke> sorry
17:58:56  <IronDuke> openttd 048
17:59:10  <IronDuke> and the grfs in the zipfile on
17:59:16  <IronDuke> no
17:59:17  <glx> ok newstations only work in nightlies
17:59:18  <IronDuke> ttdpatch
17:59:42  <IronDuke> Do i have to install the ttdpatch?
17:59:42  <glx>
17:59:56  <glx> you don't need ttdpatch
18:00:10  <IronDuke> ok
18:02:38  <IronDuke> but i have to put these files in the ttd95 folder ?
18:02:41  <IronDuke> not in openttd?
18:02:45  <IronDuke> i mean the grf-files
18:03:17  <glx> grf-files go in openttd/data
18:03:24  <IronDuke> ok
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18:06:49  <IronDuke> the game crashes at startup when i have the newstatsw.grf file in openttd.cfg.. Works fine without it
18:08:43  <IronDuke> well now it works.. but the stations look just the same :/
18:10:06  <Sacro> you have to build them in the new style
18:10:44  <IronDuke> I dont get any option to change style
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18:14:00  <Maedhros> IronDuke: newstations doesn't work in 0.4.8 - you need to download a nightly (
18:14:56  <IronDuke> ok!
18:15:03  <IronDuke> does it have lots of bugs?
18:15:48  <Maedhros> not at all, i very rarely find any
18:17:17  <IronDuke> Yes now it works fine :) Thanks :)
18:17:27  <Maedhros> np :)
18:17:51  <IronDuke> So what do you think of "Locomotion" ?
18:18:59  <Maedhros> never played it ;)
18:19:04  <Maedhros> see you later
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18:19:54  <IronDuke> ok bye
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18:37:06  <tigri> hey there
18:37:46  <Sacro> hey
18:38:02  <tigri> how can i get some servers ips?
18:38:28  <tigri> (playable ones)
18:38:42  <Sacro>
18:38:43  <Sacro> i think
18:39:05  <tigri> yeah but none works
18:39:07  <tigri> :(
18:39:20  <Sacro> strange, any errors?
18:39:26  <tigri> nope
18:39:35  <tigri> no games and no players
18:40:08  <Sacro> hmm
18:40:18  <Sacro> you got it set to "Internet" rather than "LAN"?
18:40:27  <tigri> yes :)
18:40:42  <AsterixMG> do you have a firewall?
18:41:11  <tigri> i do but i played 1-to-1 with someone
18:41:15  <tigri> it's permissive:D
18:41:41  <AsterixMG> sure that its permissive for TCP AND UDP?
18:42:04  <tigri> what's udp?
18:42:17  <AsterixMG> i think the server-info required upd, while playing only needed tpc
18:42:17  <Sacro> heh, guess not
18:42:25  <Sacro> AsterixMG: yup
18:42:55  <tigri> shall i turn it off?
18:44:37  <Sacro> could try
18:44:59  <tigri> ohh.. wait a little..
18:45:17  <tigri> :)
18:45:21  <tigri> where is the game info it says version mismatch
18:45:33  <tigri> what version shall i have?
18:45:38  * Sacro slaps tigri :p
18:45:47  <Sacro> it'll say on the main menu
18:46:23  <tigri> no i mean what version i need for servers? i have
18:46:41  <Sacro> server then
18:47:05  <AsterixMG> are there any such old servers left? :)
18:47:17  <tigri> think not:D:)
18:47:28  <AsterixMG> maybe you should try to download 0.4.8
18:47:45  <tigri> now i try it
18:48:00  <Sacro> nope
18:48:04  <Sacro> oldest is 0.4.5
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18:58:24  <tigri> hehe think it works thanks anyway for the help:D
18:58:32  <tigri> getting in a game:)
18:58:33  <tigri> bbye
18:58:35  <AsterixMG> np
18:58:38  <AsterixMG> cu
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19:29:49  <grimrc> isn't there a security vulnerability in
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19:31:01  <glx> grimrc: in 0.4.5 too IIRC
19:31:19  <grimrc> blimey; shouldn't they be absolutely discouraged
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19:32:43  <glx> grimrc:
19:33:27  <grimrc> oh I mistakenly thought it was a buffer-overflow; DOS isn't that important I suppose
19:33:56  <grimrc> "Release Date  	September 06, 2006"
19:34:42  <glx> check the references (old bug ;) )
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19:34:45  <grimrc> another one
19:35:20  <grimrc> is before or after (my guess is after)
19:36:00  <grimrc> oh yeah - ancient DOS bug
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20:41:06  <CIA-2> Darkvater * r6449 /trunk/video/dedicated_v.c:
20:41:06  <CIA-2> -Fix (Win32): The dedicated server could overwrite the keyboard input buffer
20:41:06  <CIA-2>  before it was handled by OpenTTD. Thanks to glx for noticing.
20:41:06  <CIA-2> -While here, also do really minor coding style, and proper variable names.
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20:45:14  <Darkvater> DaleStan: probably.. yes. Wouldn't it be better to remove it and forward people to the ttdpatch svn?
20:45:44  <Darkvater> DaleStan: (about grfcodec)
20:46:02  <glx> Darkvater: your fix is cleaner than mine :)
20:46:11  <DaleStan> Darkvater: That would be fine too.
20:46:32  *** Ammler [] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20:46:43  <Darkvater> glx: well as long as we were using events, I thought it's better to stick with those than to do some weird mix
20:47:00  <Darkvater> DaleStan: now to convince sourceforge to make it work ;)
20:51:11  *** TinoDidri is now known as Jezral
20:51:23  <Born_Acorn> Hey there Ben_Robbins_
20:51:50  *** _WolfAngel [] has joined #openttd
20:51:51  <Born_Acorn> (only ten minutes late with a hello!)
20:51:59  *** WolfAngel [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20:52:07  <Ben_123> hi
20:52:35  <Ben_123> how you no that it was me?
20:52:42  *** Neonox [] has joined #openttd
20:52:54  *** Neonox [] has quit []
20:52:59  <glx> Ben_123: [22:41:50] Ben_123 [~Ben_Robbi@] has joined #openttd
20:53:06  <glx> then deduction :)
20:53:38  <Ben_123> ooo...
20:56:15  <Born_Acorn> I'm a wizard with magic identification powers.
20:56:21  <Born_Acorn> Ghostly woooooooooooo.
20:56:39  *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-83-100-209-245.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd
20:58:23  <lws1984> Sacro!
20:58:32  <Sacro> lws1984!
20:58:37  *** Belugas is now known as Belugas_Gone
21:00:01  <Ben_123> i ventured this way, cause I'm curious as to the state of the 32bpp stuff...?
21:00:32  <Ben_123> 'stuff' demonstrating my understanding of it all
21:03:00  *** Progman [] has joined #openttd
21:03:04  *** smeding [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
21:06:48  <Born_Acorn> egladil was working on it, I believe.
21:07:03  <Eddi|zuHause> i believe the developer developed a serious case of real life
21:07:34  <Ben_123> so its 'was' not 'is'?
21:08:25  <Born_Acorn> If graphics get finished before the code.
21:08:36  <Eddi|zuHause> well, he is theoretically still working on it, but progress is... stagnating
21:08:38  <Born_Acorn> Then there'll be real incentive for it to become finished.
21:09:31  <Ben_123> yeah, but then that works the same both ways.  If the code was finished first then there'll be some real incentive for artists
21:12:20  <Ben_123> the reason crazy removed his stuff was becasue of that, and Sellu
21:14:42  *** mikk36[EST] is now known as mik36
21:14:44  <Eddi|zuHause> i think there should be less branches, and more alpha features in the trunk
21:15:02  *** mik36 is now known as mikk36
21:15:21  <mikk36> x-fighters seems pretty nice :)
21:15:31  *** Guest56 [] has joined #openttd
21:15:39  <Eddi|zuHause> that way things like the 32bpp code would get way more attention
21:16:24  <Eddi|zuHause> all it needs is 8bpp backwards compatibility, and it is a perfect for an alpha version
21:17:25  <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause: well said, then Brianetta might re-open his nightly
21:17:28  *** lws1984 [] has quit [Quit: Dinner!]
21:17:45  <Brianetta> Damned right there should be less branches
21:18:37  <Bjarni> well, egladil manage to break his computer so he had to stop for a while. Now that he got a new one, it's like he forgot to resume work :s
21:18:39  <Bjarni> maybe we should debug him for memory leaks
21:19:08  <Brianetta> How does one get a changelog from an svn server?
21:19:28  <Eddi|zuHause> svn log?
21:19:37  <Prof_Frink> "Excuse me, Mr. svn server, may I have the changelog please?"
21:19:47  <Sacro> Prof_Frink: the polite way :P
21:20:00  <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause: just HOW many revisions back does that go
21:20:04  <Eddi|zuHause> better than the police way :)
21:20:07  <Sacro> 3600 and counting...
21:20:20  <Sacro> r1 | truelight | 2004-08-09 18:04:08 +0100 (Mon, 09 Aug 2004) | 1 line
21:20:20  <Sacro> Import of revision 975 of old (crashed) SVN
21:20:43  <Brianetta> ah nm, svn log wasn't showing my commit because I hadn't svn update'd
21:21:17  *** blackis [] has quit [Quit: blackis]
21:21:19  *** Gonozal_VIII [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:21:33  <Brianetta> glx: Check out r2 whenever you want
21:22:20  <ln-> hmmmmmmmmm, i've been told that there are quite politically incorrect wagons available for MS Train Simulator.
21:22:49  <Sacro> ln-: you mean like black tar wagons?
21:22:58  <Sacro> or LUL
21:23:21  <ln-> what's LUL?
21:23:25  <Brianetta> Tube
21:23:42  <Ben_123> branches?...don't really understand that.  Does that mean that the 32bpp is to/was being developed completely independent of the trunk until complete?
21:23:48  <Sacro> London Underground Limited, but it means something amusing in ducth
21:23:50  <Sacro> *dutch
21:23:51  *** Guest56 is now known as Gonozal_VIII
21:23:56  <Brianetta> Ben_123: That's normal for OpenTTD features
21:24:00  <Sacro> Ben_123: yes
21:24:09  <Brianetta> London Underground Limited?  It's all TFL now
21:24:17  *** DaleStan [~Dale@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:24:23  <ln-> and why is that politically incorrect?
21:24:37  <Sacro> ln-: it means "dick" in dutch
21:24:44  <Brianetta> a dick ina tube
21:24:47  <Brianetta> heh
21:24:52  <Ben_123> so is egladil in here?
21:24:57  <Sacro> yes, hence the LULset got changed into LUGset
21:25:04  <Sacro> Ben_123: he seems to be
21:25:04  <Eddi|zuHause> !seen egladil
21:25:05  <_42_> Eddi|zuHause, if you can't see egladil here right now, you probably need new glasses. ^_^
21:25:11  <glx> Brianetta: done
21:25:15  <Sacro> he's there ------------------------------------>
21:25:18  <ln-> i was more like referring to livestock wagongs loaded with jews :/
21:25:19  <Brianetta> glx: Only a two-line change
21:25:21  <Ben_123> i can see him, but i can't see him...
21:25:32  <Brianetta> egladil's right there
21:25:34  <Ben_123> seems little more than his name
21:25:35  * Brianetta points at egladil
21:25:38  <Eddi|zuHause> and if my nick list was that way?
21:25:42  <Eddi|zuHause> <-------
21:26:04  <Prof_Frink> Eddi|zuHause: nick list?
21:26:15  <Sacro> ln-: hmm
21:26:37  <Ben_123> yeah...i can see his name.  There isnt as many people here as that list seems to inply though
21:26:41  <Eddi|zuHause> that is a list of things i need and want to nick off someone, Prof_Frink
21:26:49  <Prof_Frink> aah, gotcha
21:26:59  <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause: then your using a strange client
21:27:07  <Sacro> or i am
21:27:24  <Ben_123> i probably am
21:27:25  <Eddi|zuHause> "you're"
21:27:33  *** arctic [] has joined #openttd
21:27:33  <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause: i dont care
21:27:40  <Prof_Frink> Although the nicklist is less than helpful for whether I am here or not, as my irssi lives on David's server, and I just connect to it
21:27:55  <Prof_Frink> You're both using strange clients
21:27:59  <arctic> Hello
21:28:03  <Sacro> <- xchat
21:28:14  <Sacro> hello Archwyrm
21:28:18  <Sacro> errm, hello arctic
21:28:32  <Prof_Frink> Sacro: exactly.
21:28:36  <Eddi|zuHause> Sacro: everyone who cares can do a /ctcp version
21:28:39  <arctic> I'm rather new to openttd, and I've just managed to get two trains to crash in to eachother, and I can't seem to find any documentation on how to get them of the track :(
21:28:44  <arctic> Any pointers anyone ?
21:28:46  <Brianetta> Try that on me, Eddi
21:28:54  <Prof_Frink> it's called a CLI-ent for a reason
21:29:03  <Prof_Frink> arctic: wait a bit
21:29:04  <Archwyrm> =o
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21:29:07  <Ben_123> sooo...if egladil isnt really proceeding, would it not be posible for someone else to progress on from where he left off?
21:29:09  <Prof_Frink> they'll disappear
21:29:35  <arctic> prof: By themself ?
21:29:37  <Prof_Frink> aye
21:29:50  <Prof_Frink> Unless someone's messed with that
21:30:01  <Archwyrm> That is to simulate scraping the gore off the rails.
21:30:04  <arctic> Oh, I see,, Thanks :)
21:30:38  * Sacro used to spend aaaaaages waiting for wreckages to go
21:30:48  <Sacro> Brianetta used to screengrab ><
21:30:58  <Born_Acorn> *I
21:31:32  <Sacro> Born_Acorn: ?
21:32:36  <Born_Acorn> There's no I in team, boy! But there's a mster in teamster!
21:33:05  <Prof_Frink> Born_Acorn: but there is a 'me'
21:34:25  *** Mucht is now known as Mucht|zZz
21:34:27  *** Spoco [] has quit []
21:34:43  <Wolf01> 'night all
21:34:50  *** Wolf01 [] has quit []
21:38:26  <Ben_123> i don't really understand this converstaion at all!...any anwsers to my question?
21:39:26  *** Trenskow [~outlet@] has quit [Quit: Read error: Connection reset by sortepeer]
21:39:31  <Prof_Frink> Ben_123: what question?
21:39:50  *** arctic [] has left #openttd []
21:40:01  <Ben_123> if egladil isnt proceeding at all, then how come someone else cant just take over from where he left off
21:40:32  <peter1138> who says they can't?
21:40:33  <glx> Brianetta: autopilot works better with the latest openttd commit :)
21:40:59  <glx> I get output I haven't before
21:41:32  <Ben_123> 'would it not be posible for someone to...'
21:41:32  <Eddi|zuHause> !openttd commit
21:41:33  <_42_> Commit by Darkvater :: r6449 /trunk/video/dedicated_v.c (2006-09-14 20:40:59 UTC)
21:41:35  <_42_> -Fix (Win32): The dedicated server could overwrite the keyboard input buffer
21:41:37  <_42_>  before it was handled by OpenTTD. Thanks to glx for noticing.
21:41:39  <_42_> -While here, also do really minor coding style, and proper variable names.
21:41:42  <peter1138> Ben_123: yes, it would be
21:41:45  <peter1138> Ben_123: are you offering?
21:42:07  *** TinoM| [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:42:18  <Ben_123> Hell no, i can't do it
21:43:26  <Ben_123> I was just wondering if someone else could continue it...and evendently someone could
21:44:09  <Sacro> "OpenOffice 2 is a little bloaty but it can do stuff that Office can't and is just a lot more user friendly. It doesn't include a lot of hardcore functionality but for web surfing and email it's very easy to use," he said.
21:44:26  <Sacro> i think someone has screwed up quotes there
21:44:32  <Bjarni> well, I tried to get somebody else to take a look, but that person got hit by real life as well
21:44:45  <Sacro> Bjarni: want me to take a look, me and real life dont get along
21:44:48  <Ben_123> can't people and real life just get along?
21:44:50  <Born_Acorn> Somebody will eventually come along and continue it.
21:45:15  <Bjarni> Sacro: I know, but how much do you know about C and graphic engines? :)
21:45:37  <Sacro> Bjarni: errrm...i got free time
21:45:47  <Bjarni> no kidding
21:46:03  <Bjarni> but...
21:46:10  <Bjarni> you need skills as well
21:46:22  <Ben_123> I just think if something gets done, then the amount of graphics appearing will double
21:46:35  <Prof_Frink> Bjarni: skills or m4d skillz?
21:47:14  <ln-> what are we talking about?
21:47:26  <Bjarni> to recode OpenTTD into using 32 bit graphics without making it slower (at least not much) will take skills
21:47:50  <Ben_123> wich skills?
21:48:00  <Bjarni> well
21:48:14  <Bjarni> the code will not care for your skills in bed
21:48:51  <Eddi|zuHause> but... if you code in bed? :op
21:49:10  <Bjarni> then you are a technophile
21:49:35  <Bjarni> not that the code will care at all
21:49:56  <Prof_Frink> Eddi|zuHause: you say that, but I could actually code in bed
21:50:05  <Bjarni> odds are that all linux users got some code on their computers, that's coded in bed xD
21:50:33  <Bjarni> by nudists
21:50:37  *** DaleStan_ [~Dale@] has joined #openttd
21:50:55  <Ben_123> hmm...if someone went hardcore at 'this code' how long would it takeish (weeks/months etc)?
21:51:13  <Bjarni> I have no idea
21:51:34  <Bjarni> you see, I'm not a graphic engine coder, so I don't actually know what needs to be done :/
21:51:59  <Ben_123> oh right, I didn't realise there where different types
21:52:09  <Sacro> hmm, im wondernig about changing the output to cairo
21:52:21  *** e1ko [] has quit [Quit: Chatzilla 0.9.67+ [SeaMonkey 1.0.4/2006072904]]
21:52:30  <Ben_123> so...are there any graphic coders that could take over?
21:52:43  <Eddi|zuHause> depending on skill, time, complexity, legacy code, other stuff... anything between 1 day and 10 years...
21:52:47  * Sacro has done a slight bit
21:53:05  <Bjarni> Ben_123: it's like school. Some people are good at drawing, some people are good at cutting paper to draw on and some people are good at math
21:53:41  <Ben_123> ooo..i like similize
21:53:45  <Sacro> i loved maths
21:53:46  <Bjarni> being good at math is not the same as being good at drawing even though one doesn't rule out the other one
21:53:56  <Sacro> mmmmm fractals
21:54:00  <Ben_123> arcitectural plans?
21:54:30  <Bjarni> <Sacro>	i loved maths <-- and you dropped out of school???
21:54:51  <Sacro> Bjarni: no, i got a B
21:54:56  <Eddi|zuHause> well... if he fails even at his mother language...
21:55:27  <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause: you leave my mother tongue alone
21:55:34  <Bjarni> I fear that he speaks his mother's language... it's just not English, but that ... thing, they speak in Hull
21:55:55  <Eddi|zuHause> like i would ever touch your mother's tongue
21:55:56  <Bjarni> Sacro: I'm pretty sure Eddi|zuHause don't plan on kissing your mom :P
21:56:04  <Ben_123> single vowle english
21:56:20  <Sacro> Bjarni: you leave my 'ull accent alone
21:56:30  *** lws1984 [] has joined #openttd
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21:56:46  <Eddi|zuHause> if you only knew my Halle-accent ;)
21:57:00  <Bjarni> hmm
21:57:08  <Eddi|zuHause> (actually, i have extremely little accent)
21:57:17  <Bjarni> Halle-accent... is that like speaking like Halle Berry? :)
21:57:19  <Sacro> we should get some more foreigners to the TT meet next year
21:57:21  * Bjarni hides
21:57:40  <Sacro> i could bring some girls...
21:57:47  <Bjarni> yeah right?
21:58:02  <Sacro> tell you what, birmingham girls are fuglier
21:58:06  <Eddi|zuHause> well, honestly, i have no idea how Halle Berry speaks
21:58:30  <Bjarni> 	<Eddi|zuHause>	well, honestly, i have no idea how Halle Berry speaks <-- same here. I just know the name
21:58:47  <Eddi|zuHause> well, i have seen her in films
21:58:53  <Eddi|zuHause> but they were always translated
21:59:03  <Bjarni> hehe
21:59:19  <Bjarni> it's called synchronised
21:59:28  <Bjarni> translated is subtitles
21:59:40  <peter1138> there's a tt meet? heh
21:59:54  <Bjarni> well
22:00:00  <Eddi|zuHause> well... technically, it is a synchronized translation
22:00:01  <Bjarni> it appears that Sacro wants to make one
22:00:14  <peter1138> dubbed, heh
22:00:26  <Ben_123> soooo are these graphics coders a rare bread?
22:00:27  <peter1138> but that's usually with dodgy anime
22:01:22  <Bjarni> Eddi|zuHause: I only watched one German dubbed movie. It was Star Trek TNG and I turned it off when I was done laughing at how bad it sounds compared to the real character voices :D
22:01:24  <Eddi|zuHause> well, probably the english synchronisation of animes are bad, because you do not have such a large synchronisation industry
22:01:26  <Sacro> peter1138: dont you read the off topic forum
22:04:36  *** Netsplit <-> quits: @Darkvater, eQualizer, Triffid_Hunter, Frostregen, BJH2, Jezral, Prof_Frink, peter1138, TheMask96, Born_Acorn,  (+55 more, use /NETSPLIT to show all of them)
22:05:18  *** Netsplit over, joins: lws1984, DaleStan_, Gonozal_VIII, Progman, Sacro, Ben_123, Jezral, @Bjarni, Brianetta, GoneWacko (+31 more)
22:05:19  *** Netsplit over, joins: eQualizer, Empero, Prof_Frink, KUDr_wrk, guru3, Born_Acorn, A1win, anboni, egladil, Naksu (+14 more)
22:05:19  <Bjarni> and Diablo-D3 is in it xD
22:05:38  <Sacro> SpComb: was too, hence we lost logs
22:05:39  <SpComb> Logs:
22:05:39  <Sacro> !logs
22:05:58  <Prof_Frink> Bjarni: Diablo-D3 is in an xD card?
22:06:12  <Bjarni> sure
22:06:20  <Bjarni> hmm
22:06:23  <Bjarni> then again
22:06:42  <Bjarni> he speaks a lot, but knows less
22:06:50  <SpComb> Bjarni: working on it
22:07:03  <Bjarni> working on what?
22:07:04  <SpComb> although it's on hold, exams start next monday
22:07:07  <SpComb> netsplit stuff
22:07:23  * SpComb has been pondering a way to oversmart netsplits
22:07:45  <Bjarni> ahh, but I was taking about #offtopic, not the netsplit
22:08:02  <SpComb> *outsmart
22:08:03  <Bjarni> hence the message was a bit cryptic :)
22:08:25  <Sacro> SpComb: more bots
22:08:36  <Bjarni> yeah
22:08:36  <glx> once on each server :)
22:08:37  <SpComb> Sacro: well, redundant bots
22:08:39  <Bjarni> a bot on each server
22:08:48  <Sacro> SpComb: yes, redundancy is the only way
22:08:48  <SpComb> not quite, but a couple three of four wouldn't hurt
22:09:03  *** _WolfAngel [] has quit [Quit: '$quit.msg' (without quotes).]
22:09:07  <Bjarni> btw what is causing the netsplits?
22:09:12  <Bjarni> server restarts?
22:09:18  <SpComb> I just need to figure out exactly how to make them synchronize the logs with eachother in real-time
22:09:18  <Bjarni> crashes?
22:09:20  <Sacro> Bjarni: some guy with a scewdriver
22:09:33  <XeryusTC> Bjarni: a server being disconnected from the network
22:10:11  <Bjarni> IRC needs soft handover of clients, so a closing server would transfer all clients to other servers
22:10:23  <SpComb> hmm
22:10:54  *** SpComb^ [] has joined #openttd
22:10:59  <XeryusTC> * Mucht|zZz ( Quit ( <- from kinetic to hydrogen IIRC
22:11:01  <SpComb^> my server died...
22:11:13  <Bjarni> no, it's not a soft handover. It's a hard handover, because the connection is dropped and then opened to a new server
22:11:14  <XeryusTC> we can't, a client can only be connected to one server
22:11:21  *** DaleStan [~Dale@] has joined #openttd
22:11:45  <XeryusTC> being connected to 2 different servers at the same time means that you would have to use 2 nicknames
22:12:34  <Bjarni> <Bjarni>	IRC needs soft handover of clients <-- I think this implies that it's something that's not present right now ;)
22:12:57  <XeryusTC> it is not possible with the current situation ;)
22:12:58  *** SpComb [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
22:14:04  <Bjarni> but the question is: what causes the netsplits? If it's server crashes and so on, then soft handover is impossible. If it is planned, then it's possible to add this feature
22:14:17  *** DaleStan_ [~Dale@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:14:45  *** lws1984 [] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal]
22:14:46  <SpComb^> or you can pay lilo to global everyone about it
22:14:52  *** You're now known as SpComb
22:14:55  <XeryusTC> lol
22:15:26  <Bjarni> somebody should have paid lilo to broadcasted startkeylogger
22:15:42  <Bjarni> I got the feeling that he is a man, who will do everything for money
22:15:45  <Sacro> Bjarni: when freenode got haxxored someone did
22:15:51  <Bjarni> lol
22:16:02  <Sacro> a LOT of people left
22:17:23  *** DaleStan_ [~Dale@] has joined #openttd
22:17:57  <XeryusTC> lets make a hidden feature in ottd that wil hax lilonet :+
22:18:04  <mikk36> lol
22:18:33  <Eddi|zuHause> hm... the main problem of netsplits is that the server connections are not redundant
22:19:33  <Eddi|zuHause> if a server disappears, there is not much to do about, but the problem is that, in a tree, a server is a link between more servers, who then have no connection to each other anymore
22:19:49  *** DaleStan [~Dale@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:19:51  <Eddi|zuHause> that is, what a netsplit is
22:20:52  <Eddi|zuHause> if you made this redundant (like a ring of servers, or more complicated) you'd need to introduce routing protocols
22:21:06  <Sacro> heh, token ring irc
22:21:26  <Eddi|zuHause> and discard messages if you get them twice, through different routes
22:21:56  <Eddi|zuHause> a ring does not necessarily need a token ;)
22:22:20  <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause: it does if its token ring
22:22:31  <Eddi|zuHause> the token only denotes the server that is allowed to send data
22:22:32  <XeryusTC> Eddi|zuHause: you are trying to say that servers have a server<->server<->server connection and a client is connected to all servers at the same time?
22:22:33  <Sacro> however if you loose the connection the ring falls out ><
22:23:02  <Eddi|zuHause> XeryusTC: no
22:23:12  * Brianetta legs it with the token
22:23:25  <Eddi|zuHause> a client should only be connected to one server
22:23:45  <Eddi|zuHause> but the underlying system of connecting servers should be made more redundant
22:23:55  <Eddi|zuHause> that would be completely transparent to the client
22:24:08  <Eddi|zuHause> but the risk of netsplits is greatly reduced
22:24:26  <Sacro> Brianetta: thats not nice
22:26:08  <XeryusTC> lets just avoid netsplits by using 1 server :D
22:26:18  *** Nigel [~Nigel@] has joined #openttd
22:26:18  <Sacro> and then if that server goes down?
22:27:01  <Brianetta> At least it didn't split.
22:27:31  <Sacro> well... true
22:27:56  <Eddi|zuHause> let's avoid netsplits by shutting down the internet :p
22:28:03  <XeryusTC> yeah, it's the ultimate solution :)
22:28:22  <Eddi|zuHause> the computer is the solution to a problem that would never have existed without it
22:28:26  <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause: nooooooo, where would i go
22:28:52  <XeryusTC> yeah, lets just shut down all power stations to avoid netsplits :D
22:29:02  <XeryusTC> no power = no computer = no internets
22:29:51  <Eddi|zuHause> let's see what the world looks like in 20 years
22:30:00  <Eddi|zuHause> it might come that way ;)
22:30:46  <Eddi|zuHause> anyone remembers 'Dark Angel'?
22:31:03  <Brianetta> autopilot will be ported to slide rule
22:31:17  <Sacro> ooh, can we have it on slide whistle too
22:36:02  <Prof_Frink> Sacro: no, but it will run on Swanny Kazoo!
22:36:12  <Prof_Frink> And with that, I leave you.
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22:50:18  * Sacro spys a job as a "Nordic technical advisor"
22:50:24  <Sacro> selling pc's to vikings ill bet
22:50:51  <Nigel> hah
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22:52:04  <Eddi|zuHause> plural is not written with '
22:53:37  <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause: LEAVE MY ENGLISH ALONE ><
22:54:04  <Eddi|zuHause> Sacro: i see absolutely no reason to do so :p
22:54:14  <Sacro> because its upsetting me
22:54:56  <Eddi|zuHause> exactly what i said ;)
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23:00:11  <Gonozal_VIII> you shouldn't make fun of his english...
23:00:22  *** DaleStan [~Dale@] has joined #openttd
23:00:25  <Gonozal_VIII> sein deutsch ist viel lustiger :-)
23:01:01  <Eddi|zuHause> ja, aber das kriege ich zu selten zu sehen ;)
23:01:25  <Eddi|zuHause> (wobei dein dialekt bestimmt auch abartig wäre :))
23:01:40  <Sacro> ich can spreche deutsch
23:01:48  <Sacro> errm, not can... thats not german
23:01:50  <Gonozal_VIII> norddeutscher?
23:02:07  <Eddi|zuHause> naja, ostdeutscher...
23:02:19  <Eddi|zuHause> also an sich heißt das mitteldeutschland
23:02:43  <Gonozal_VIII> jedenfalls definitiv andere sprache als hier...
23:02:53  <Eddi|zuHause> eben ;)
23:03:06  <Bjarni> <Sacro>	selling pc's to vikings ill bet <-- start by selling power first, so they can use it :P
23:03:22  <Sacro> Bjarni: ooh yes, dont want angry vikings
23:03:36  <Bjarni> don't worry
23:03:45  <Bjarni> Hull is too bad a place even for vikings
23:04:01  <Bjarni> you see, I will not go there
23:04:23  <Sacro> we got invaded ><
23:04:28  <Sacro> damn vikings
23:04:30  <Gonozal_VIII> but you're not angry
23:04:30  *** GoneWacko [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
23:04:42  <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, but that was 1000 years ago
23:04:51  <Bjarni> yeah
23:04:56  <Eddi|zuHause> the place definitely changed since then ;)
23:05:04  <Bjarni> that's means I better do it as an anniversary thing
23:06:28  <Bjarni> <-- Sacro: do you have a secret identity as julia?
23:06:39  <Sacro> Bjarni: only if you ask nicely ;)
23:06:49  <Gonozal_VIII> ^^
23:06:51  <Eddi|zuHause> that's funny, in the 1960s, our city celebrated 1000 year anniversary, and this year, we are celebrating 1200 years ;)
23:07:28  <Gonozal_VIII> what next? 1500 years in 2010?
23:08:14  <Eddi|zuHause> they said they try to find an even older document by next year ;)
23:08:26  <Gonozal_VIII> hehe
23:08:36  <Sacro> Hull maritime history is thought to have been a key factor in the transmission of syphilis: the earliest evidence of syphilis in medieval Europe is at at the site of an Augustinian Friary (destroyed 1539) in Hull.
23:09:01  <Bjarni> in 2009, they will celebrate the 2000th anniversary for slaying the Roman consular army, right?
23:09:24  <Eddi|zuHause> yeah. but that was nowhere near my city :)
23:09:34  <Bjarni> who cares?
23:09:43  <Bjarni> they can celebrate, so they will do it
23:09:51  <Eddi|zuHause> the inhabitants of Bielefeld probably ;)
23:10:09  <Bjarni> invite them
23:10:19  <Bjarni> or screw them
23:10:25  <Bjarni> ...., or both
23:10:58  <Eddi|zuHause> the football team "Arminia Bielefeld" got his name from Arminius (latin form of Hermann), who was the leader of the german "army" in teutoburg forest
23:11:48  <Gonozal_VIII> arminius = hermann? O_o
23:12:02  <Eddi|zuHause> actually, they are not sure of the exact location of teutoburg forest, so at least 3 cities claim to be the location of the battle :)
23:12:09  <Sacro> hmm, theres a road from hull to denmark
23:13:08  <Sacro> Bjarni: im driving to yours! :P
23:13:10  <Eddi|zuHause> Gonozal_VIII: well, a lot of people throughout history made their names sound latin
23:13:26  <Gonozal_VIII> i think they would have some aquaplaning problems on that road
23:13:41  <Sacro>
23:14:14  <Gonozal_VIII> wtf?
23:14:35  <Sacro> ?
23:14:39  <Archwyrm> Eddi|zuHause: The Romans who wrote it down did not speak very good Germanic. ;)
23:14:52  <Sacro> ooh, can drive to Estonia too
23:15:29  <Gonozal_VIII> be sure to close the windows first
23:15:32  <Eddi|zuHause> Archwyrm: no, it was just "cool" to make things sound latin, like nowadays it is "cool" to make things sound english
23:15:43  <Sacro> Gonozal_VIII: i run linux
23:15:51  <Gonozal_VIII> ^^
23:16:02  <Eddi|zuHause> that's how german words like "Handy" get created
23:16:04  <Archwyrm> heh
23:16:10  <Bjarni> <Sacro>	hmm, theres a road from hull to denmark <-- I don't know that one...
23:16:30  <Sacro> Bjarni: E20, link posted above
23:16:34  <Archwyrm> Well, plus they had to use their own endings for the case system.
23:16:35  <Bjarni> ahh
23:16:40  <Bjarni> well, I DO know that one
23:16:41  <Eddi|zuHause> ("Handy" denoting what an english person would call "cell phone")
23:16:53  <Bjarni> just not that it's corrupted by Hull o_O
23:17:06  <Sacro> Bjarni: well you get the ferry into Hull, and then it continues across the UK as the M62
23:17:32  <Gonozal_VIII> same with the strg key
23:17:44  <Bjarni> looks like if I use that road and forget to turn away from it, I will end up in Dublin
23:18:05  <Sacro> Bjarni: you will go through 2 seas to get there though
23:18:07  <Bjarni> or St. Petersburg
23:18:13  <Bjarni> depending on direction
23:18:21  <Sacro> and im pretty sure thats 1 sea to the east
23:18:25  <Eddi|zuHause> the "Strg" key denotes "Steuerung" (Control)... that other "interpretation" is created by idiots
23:18:40  <Bjarni> <Sacro>	Bjarni: you will go through 2 seas to get there though <-- I'm used to ferries
23:18:41  <Sacro> ooh, a pretty pic of our town centre
23:18:58  <Gonozal_VIII> steuerung? ok.. dann passts^^ dachte immer das wär string oder so
23:19:00  <Sacro> Bjarni: but im pretty sure when boarding it you'd notice something strange
23:19:25  <Eddi|zuHause> Gonozal_VIII: genau, das ist das "andere" wort ;)
23:19:32  <Bjarni> I might notice something strange when everybody else starts to drive in the "wrong" side of the road
23:19:38  <Gonozal_VIII> hab das schon oft jemand sagen hörn
23:19:47  <Eddi|zuHause> ist aber totaler blödsinn
23:20:00  <Sacro> oi, keine deautsche bitte
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23:20:07  * Bjarni slaps Sacro
23:20:19  * Sacro enjoys it
23:20:20  * Gonozal_VIII switches back to english
23:20:39  <Bjarni> just because you don't understand it, you want us to stop communicating... dream on
23:20:40  <Sacro> thats a pretty station i reckon
23:21:16  <Bjarni> yeah, nice one
23:21:31  <Gonozal_VIII> is that 25 speed sign for the trains?
23:21:33  <Bjarni> also the barrier. It looks reinforced, like people tend to drive into it
23:22:21  <Bjarni> Gonozal_VIII: maybe I should take a picture of the max 15 km/h sign for trains and post it on the net
23:22:34  <Gonozal_VIII> it faces that direction but looks like a road sign
23:22:52  <Eddi|zuHause> eek... trains driving on left
23:22:53  *** DaleStan [~Dale@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:22:59  * Eddi|zuHause gets scared
23:23:11  <Bjarni> Gonozal_VIII: it's a sign, that tells the driver the number of sane people living in the town
23:23:18  <Sacro> Gonozal_VIII: yeah, 25 limit
23:23:22  <glx> Eddi|zuHause: all trains drive on left
23:23:35  <Eddi|zuHause> not in germany
23:23:36  <Sacro> Bjarni: they are pretty hefty barriers, you can lean on them and get picked up
23:23:37  <Bjarni> glx: no
23:23:55  <Bjarni> Sacro: you tried that?
23:24:01  <Sacro> Bjarni: of course
23:24:13  <Bjarni> that's illegal
23:24:21  <Gonozal_VIII> what else would he do there all day?
23:24:30  *** grimrc[away] is now known as GrimRC
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23:24:39  <Bjarni> good point
23:24:39  <Sacro> Bjarni: is it?
23:24:49  <Sacro> Gonozal_VIII: i occasionally catch trains into Hull
23:25:00  <Eddi|zuHause> "hefty" sounds like a word that jar jar binks would use
23:25:17  <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause: whats wrong with hefty
23:25:25  <Eddi|zuHause> nothing
23:25:25  <Bjarni> every single barrier in Denmark got a sign saying "it's illegal to try to stop barrier movements". I presume it's the same for you
23:25:43  <Sacro> Bjarni: nope, never seen one
23:25:57  <Bjarni> you see, you are messing with railroad security, which can result in several years of jailtime
23:25:59  <Eddi|zuHause> i don't even know the exact meaning of it
23:26:01  <Sacro> i think its part of the highway code though, but that doesnt legally apply to peds
23:26:12  <Eddi|zuHause> or if it is close to the german "heftig"
23:26:13  <Sacro> now thats a junction
23:26:33  <Gonozal_VIII> it's a smurf
23:27:02  <CIA-2> Darkvater * r6450 /trunk/ (console_cmds.c settings.c settings.h):
23:27:02  <CIA-2> -Feature: Make the 'patch' console command available for offline use and for
23:27:02  <CIA-2>  online use for player-based settings.
23:27:03  <Bjarni> Sacro: you are lucky
23:27:29  <Sacro> Bjarni: am i?
23:27:37  <Bjarni> you don't have a driver's license. If you did and should be driving there, you would make a wrong turn each time :P
23:27:42  <Eddi|zuHause> hm... that site has a broken script, says konqueror
23:27:55  <Sacro> i do have a drivers licence
23:28:00  <Sacro> and i think i can go on that junction
23:28:18  <Bjarni> <Sacro>	i do have a drivers licence <-- what's the name of the guy you stole it from? :)
23:28:40  <Sacro> Bjarni: its got my name on it
23:28:41  <Sacro> and photo
23:28:46  <Bjarni> ahh
23:28:48  <Sacro> not my address... but that needs fixing
23:28:50  <Bjarni> photoshop
23:29:23  <Sacro> :O tis not
23:29:25  <Sacro> i paid for it
23:29:38  <Bjarni> for borrowed money?
23:29:55  <Gonozal_VIII> so someone else with photoshop made it for you?
23:29:56  <Bjarni> and it's not valid because you bought it off someone's back of a truck
23:30:04  <Sacro> Bjarni:  i got it from the DVLA
23:30:14  <Eddi|zuHause> hm... honestly... i have seen worse junctions than that
23:30:18  <Bjarni> good to know
23:30:25  <Bjarni> now I will not go to England
23:30:28  <Sacro> hehe
23:30:36  <Bjarni> too dangerous with the Sacros on the roads
23:30:44  <Sacro> what about the Born_Acorn's too
23:30:48  <Sacro> and the orudges
23:30:51  <Bjarni> yeah, those too
23:30:53  <Gonozal_VIII> us highway junctions are worse
23:31:01  <Sacro> Gonozal_VIII: you dont have roundabouts
23:31:13  <Bjarni> you?
23:31:26  <Bjarni> Gonozal_VIII is European :P
23:31:38  <Sacro> you as in the US
23:31:50  <Bjarni> hehe
23:31:59  <Eddi|zuHause> Gonozal_VIII is austrian
23:31:59  <Sacro> Bjarni: bet that'd confuse you
23:32:27  <mikk36> omg
23:32:33  <mikk36> actually
23:32:37  <mikk36> it isn't that confusing :)
23:33:00  <mikk36> there are 5 roundabouts next to each other ?
23:33:02  <Sacro> mikk36: i can drive to estonia from here :P via denmark
23:33:08  <Bjarni> the most confusing part is that they drive the wrong way around in them
23:33:09  <Sacro> in a circle
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23:33:20  <mikk36> clockwise ?
23:33:39  <Sacro> you can go anticlockwise around the middle actually
23:33:39  <Bjarni> yeah, they drive clockwise in the roundabouts
23:33:49  <Sacro> as explains
23:33:50  <mikk36> left-side traffic :P
23:34:12  <mikk36> sucks :P
23:34:18  <Eddi|zuHause> it is a 2-way roundabout
23:34:28  <Sacro> actually, that scares me, cos your going anticlockwise around a roundabout and thats just not allowed ><#
23:34:57  <Sacro> i can see myself joining that and never leaving
23:35:08  <mikk36> Eddi|zuHause, no it aint
23:35:16  <Sacro> mikk36: it is and it isnt
23:35:20  <mikk36> :P
23:35:25  <Bjarni> <Sacro>	i can see myself joining that and never leaving <-- then do it
23:35:25  <Gonozal_VIII> the sign is not hard to understand but why is there a symbol at each exit and not just one in the middle?
23:35:30  <Bjarni> and we will celebrate
23:35:36  <mikk36> smaller roundabouts are 1way
23:35:50  <Sacro> Bjarni: ill set up home in the middle and never dare leave
23:35:50  <mikk36> but by combining them all it in a whole is 2-way
23:36:04  <Bjarni> Sacro: camping?
23:36:06  <mikk36> lol
23:36:10  <Eddi|zuHause> and what part of that contradicts my statement?
23:36:19  <Sacro> Bjarni: if you fancy it
23:36:35  <mikk36> Gonozal_VIII, each symbol represents one smaller roundabout
23:36:48  <mikk36> look at the second pic
23:36:49  <Gonozal_VIII> i don't think so^^
23:36:52  <mikk36>
23:37:10  <Gonozal_VIII> oh...
23:37:27  <Gonozal_VIII> that's just crazy
23:37:29  <mikk36> actually
23:37:31  <mikk36> Eddi|zuHause,
23:37:37  <mikk36> i'd still say it's 1way
23:37:38  <mikk36> :)
23:37:40  <mikk36> in the whole
23:37:43  <Sacro> Gonozal_VIII: yes... if you look at it for more than about 10 seconds you go mad
23:37:58  <mikk36> it's just 5 roundabouts connected by 5 very short roads
23:38:02  <Sacro> i'd end up in the middle going anti-clockwise
23:38:06  <Sacro> and get very confused
23:38:40  <Bjarni> and fined
23:38:44  <Eddi|zuHause> then you should avoid continental roundabouts ;)
23:39:09  <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause: i could probably manage that
23:39:12  <Sacro> because its only 1 way
23:39:22  <Bjarni> since you will be so confused that you will start to go clockwise in the middle
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23:39:37  <Eddi|zuHause> reminds me of one JAG episode
23:39:48  <Sacro> Bjarni: possibly
23:39:53  <Sacro> i might take my bike to Europe
23:40:11  <Eddi|zuHause> where Harm goes to australia, and talks Brumby into letting him drive the car
23:40:34  <Eddi|zuHause> he drives like crazy, going the wrong direction in a roundabout and stuff
23:41:07  <Sacro> lol
23:41:08  <Eddi|zuHause> and in the end, he says "i got taught driving by my uncle on the bermudas"... and brumby goes "but don't they drive on the left there, too?"
23:41:32  *** Netsplit <-> quits: +tokai, mikk36, coronel, Mucht|zZz, JonA, +glx
23:41:37  <Sacro> i have spent a whole afternoon playing GTA, gone out and forgotten which side to drive on
23:41:58  <Eddi|zuHause> hehe ;)
23:42:13  <Triffid_Hunter> Sacro: driver's side is always closest to the center of the road ;)
23:42:31  <Eddi|zuHause> better than saying "10 points" each time you hit a car ;)
23:42:40  <Sacro> heh
23:42:49  *** Netsplit over, joins: mikk36, +tokai, +glx, coronel, JonA, Mucht|zZz
23:42:49  <Sacro> double points for a OAP
23:43:00  <Sacro> triple if they have a stick
23:43:09  <Eddi|zuHause> (like that guy in Resident Evil 2)
23:43:19  <Bjarni> <Sacro>	i might take my bike to Europe <-- why?
23:43:28  <Sacro> Bjarni: cos i can
23:43:33  <Sacro> head east on the E20
23:43:58  <Gonozal_VIII> i like the e20
23:44:08  <Sacro> it goes near here
23:44:22  <Gonozal_VIII> never heavy traffic there
23:44:52  <Sacro> there is in Hull at rush hour, ive been stuck in it loads
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23:45:06  <Sacro> just outside the red light district
23:45:15  <Eddi|zuHause> it has been a long time since i got stuck in a rush hour
23:45:26  <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause: me too
23:45:54  <Eddi|zuHause> i will not ask what you were doing in the red light district ;)
23:45:54  <Gonozal_VIII> it's not that crowded between hull and denmark
23:46:48  <Sacro> Gonozal_VIII: no, the north sea kinda stops it
23:47:02  <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause: errr... i was going to get my bike
23:47:25  <Eddi|zuHause> ah, that's what this is called nowadays ;)
23:48:07  <Gonozal_VIII> actually that magic roundabout could make an interesting openttd crossing
23:48:22  <Sacro> Gonozal_VIII: i was thinking of using it with trains
23:48:26  <Sacro> but it might kill PBS
23:48:28  <mikk36> hehe
23:48:33  <Bjarni> <-- found it
23:48:34  <mikk36> i'm stuck in a traffic every morning
23:48:43  <mikk36> kmz ?
23:48:45  <Sacro> Bjarni: kmz?
23:48:48  <Gonozal_VIII> you play with pbs?
23:49:06  <mikk36> ahh, google earth
23:49:19  <mikk36> give us google maps link
23:49:27  <mikk36> on the web
23:49:31  <Bjarni> no
23:49:34  <Sacro> mikk36: i did
23:49:43  <Bjarni> because then I have to find it again
23:49:48  <Sacro> i think :S
23:49:55  <Bjarni> Sacro: no you didn't
23:50:19  *** Rens2Sea [~Rens2Sea@] has quit []
23:50:29  <mikk36> ?
23:50:46  <mikk36> did what ?
23:50:49  *** DaleStan [~Dale@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:51:02  <Gonozal_VIII> "it"
23:51:03  <Bjarni> Sacro: good news. You can't afford to go to Swindon, so you don't have to worry about driving in this multiple roundabout thing
23:51:10  <Sacro> Bjarni: phew
23:51:17  <Sacro> i'd hate to go near it and get sucked in
23:51:21  <Bjarni> <mikk36>	give us google maps link
23:51:26  <Bjarni> <Sacro>	mikk36: i did
23:51:27  <Bjarni> <Sacro>	i think :S
23:51:33  <Bjarni> <mikk36>	did what ?
23:51:35  <Sacro> kinda like "ooh swindon, lets go see that roundabout"
23:51:45  <Bjarni> yeah
23:51:46  <Bjarni> totally
23:51:52  <Sacro> sweet
23:52:03  <mikk36> Bjarni, please ?
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23:52:09  <Bjarni> and I would never have build it
23:52:20  <Bjarni> *built
23:52:29  <Sacro> im gonna attempt one in openttd
23:52:29  <mikk36> but it's fun :D
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23:52:32  <Bjarni> I can imagine rush hour
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23:52:41  <Sacro> i dont quite know how or why
23:52:54  <Bjarni> nothing new there :P
23:52:57  <mikk36> a traffic there would propably look almost as bad as in italy :)
23:53:10  <Gonozal_VIII> should be more efficient than a normal roundabout... but only if everybody understands how it works
23:53:21  <Sacro> Gonozal_VIII: so its fine till an american arrives...
23:53:28  <Gonozal_VIII> hehe
23:53:41  <Sacro> or a german - "this is cannot be efficient"
23:53:49  <Bjarni> it's fine until one of the non-locals arrives
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23:54:37  <Gonozal_VIII> there are lots of huge arrows painted all over the ground... should be fine
23:54:44  <mikk36> i don't think i'd cause a jam there
23:55:08  <mikk36> but when an american arrives in his huuge SUV
23:55:39  <Bjarni> ahh, you mean your car is so small that everybody else can just pass it when you have to stop to take a look?
23:55:52  <mikk36> saw one some days ago driving around... without any warning tried to push bmw to the opposite side of the road
23:56:10  <Sacro> ouch
23:56:18  <mikk36> and when he realised that he just pulled sloooowly back and looked with a dumb face
23:56:27  <Gonozal_VIII> i saw one of those dodge pickups recently... the hood was about the height of my mercedes' roof
23:56:40  <mikk36> i imagine him thinking "what ? did i do smth wrong ?"
23:56:56  <Sacro> get that around here, SUV drivers are idiots
23:57:00  <Sacro> as are BMW drivers
23:57:10  <Bjarni> and Mercedes drivers
23:57:27  <Gonozal_VIII> :P
23:57:28  <Sacro> and women drivers
23:57:33  <Bjarni> and men drivers
23:57:44  <Sacro> and chavs
23:57:50  <Bjarni> now I think we covered most of the bad drivers
23:57:56  <Sacro> im pretty good
23:58:00  <Sacro> only got stopped for speeding once
23:58:31  <Bjarni> <Sacro>	im pretty good <-- everybody in this channel would be good compared to "normal" in Hull :P
23:58:37  <Bjarni> I never got a single ticket
23:58:44  <Sacro> oh hull driving...thats fun
23:58:51  <Sacro> i got told off for overtaking 3 busses ina  row on my test
23:58:58  <Gonozal_VIII> you forgot people with both/no gender
23:59:08  <Bjarni> no
23:59:15  <Sacro> Gonozal_VIII: is that still sexist?
23:59:17  <Bjarni> those are excellent drivers

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