Log for #openttd on 23rd April 2007:
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05:47:48  <boekabart_> where can i find a log of this channel?
05:48:26  <boekabart_> or : peter1138: can you give me a link again to your version of my patch? (@ another pc now)
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06:03:09  <boekabart_> answer to my own question:
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06:10:47  <SpComb> boekabart_: !logs
06:10:57  <SpComb> Logs:
06:10:57  <boekabart_> !logs
06:11:17  <boekabart_> apparently more than 1 site is logging :)
06:11:24  <SpComb> I was the first one, though :P
06:11:29  <boekabart_> hm, the thegrebs one is prettier :)
06:11:34  <SpComb> 423 days logged since Feb 25 2006
06:11:51  <SpComb> I have a prettier version that works, but I haven't had the time to make it production-ready
06:12:15  <boekabart_> totally unimportant anyway. Thanks, found the info i needed
06:12:38  <SpComb> but I have had this big nagging feeling recently that I need to pick it up again and finish it off
06:14:02  * peter1138 nags SpComb
06:14:24  <boekabart_> look who's alive :)
06:14:53  <boekabart_> peter1138: the link you sent me yesterday still points to your latest version?
06:15:43  <peter1138>
06:15:49  <peter1138> removes that bit you mentioned
06:15:55  <peter1138> and adds transparency option
06:16:07  <boekabart_> what's that option?
06:16:23  <boekabart_> and what is the 'UI' for changing sea level?
06:17:08  <peter1138> UI? you want a UI?
06:17:19  <peter1138> i was just adjusting it with a debugger ;p
06:17:39  <peter1138> but... easy to add it to the patches window
06:20:32  <boekabart_> ok, just checking
06:20:38  <boekabart_> wondered if i missed it :)
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06:20:52  <boekabart_> i fixed bridge drawing
06:21:04  <peter1138> was it broken?
06:21:17  <boekabart_> well yes, it drew the pillars under water
06:24:13  <boekabart_> well they were sorted out after
06:25:09  <boekabart_> still, pixels for nothing
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06:48:06  <boekabart_> 				if (GetMaxTileHeight(tile) <= _patches.sealevel + 1) break;
06:48:15  <boekabart_> is not OK according to vs80
06:48:27  <boekabart_> types are uint / uint8
06:48:41  <boekabart_> but this IS ok:
06:48:43  <boekabart_> if (GetMaxTileHeight(tile) <= _patches.sealevel) break;
06:49:02  <boekabart_> apparently, unsigned char + 1 = int ?
06:49:14  <peter1138> o_O
06:49:18  <peter1138> + 1U ?
06:49:45  <boekabart_> yea, that helps
06:49:56  <boekabart_> same thing with * TILE_HEIGHT
06:50:15  <boekabart_> (uint)TILE_HEIGHT fixes that
06:50:33  <peter1138> le sigh
06:54:12  <boekabart_> what to do with building depots... only on 0-deep water?
06:54:27  <boekabart_> sounds reasonable, doesn't it
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07:10:27  <peter1138> yes
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07:10:50  * peter1138 bahs at plane speed patch
07:11:17  <peter1138> our taxi speed is reduced, so if i just /4 then taxiing takes days
07:11:34  <boekabart_> peter1138: do you think it's a good idea to modify the GetSlopeZ_Water and GetSlopetileh_Water functions to return water level/slope instead of sea-floor slope?
07:11:58  <boekabart_> it does fix the ship movements, but i'm not sure what it might break
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07:12:31  <peter1138> i don't know
07:17:03  <boekabart_> i like the transparent option :) but to call water a building....
07:19:10  <peter1138> hmm?
07:19:13  <peter1138> oh, the menu option, heh
07:19:20  <peter1138> use the transparency toolbar
07:19:25  <peter1138> press ^X
07:19:44  <roboboy> or call it underwater view?
07:19:48  <roboboy> like RCT
07:20:10  <peter1138> 08:07 < Tama00> lol
07:20:15  <roboboy> so add it as an extra option?
07:20:17  <peter1138> errr
07:20:30  <roboboy> lol
07:20:31  <peter1138> it is an extra option
07:20:34  <roboboy> ok
07:20:49  <peter1138> ^8 toggles it, heh
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07:47:43  <peter1138> time to put the coffee on
07:53:22  <SpComb> time to reboot quakenet
07:58:06  <boekabart_> what happens when a train depot with trains in it, is flooded?
07:58:11  <boekabart_> everything gone?
08:07:47  <boekabart_> peter1138: changing GetSlopeZ_Water influences too much.. better let ship controller call a specific GetSlopeZ_WaterSurface function
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08:13:42  <peter1138> :/
08:13:58  <peter1138> does it need it?
08:14:22  <peter1138> can be fixed easily, i should think
08:15:30  <peter1138> ?
08:15:35  <peter1138> hmmmmm
08:15:52  <peter1138> no that won't do for low canals
08:16:10  <peter1138> so just test if it's a canal first :D
08:16:11  <boekabart_> i've fixed it already
08:16:20  <peter1138> oh
08:17:07  <boekabart_> actually i've thought of a sealevel patch that is a LOT better, but it requires an extra uint8 in map array
08:17:12  <boekabart_> that's not acceptable, right?
08:17:38  <peter1138> another one? why?
08:17:45  <boekabart_> it's more realistic
08:18:04  <peter1138> so *all* tiles need to store sea level?
08:18:21  <boekabart_> yes
08:18:30  <peter1138> o_O
08:18:38  <boekabart_> makes lakes and stuff possible
08:18:54  <peter1138> not possible to store it just for water tiles?
08:19:04  <boekabart_> well yes
08:19:11  <boekabart_> do water tiles have 8 bits left?
08:19:14  <peter1138> no
08:19:26  <peter1138> they have 50 bits free
08:19:38  <boekabart_> wOOt!
08:19:42  <boekabart_> where?
08:20:10  <peter1138> all of m2, m3, m4 and m7, bits 2-7 of m5 and bits 2-5 of m6
08:20:31  <boekabart_> you know that by heart? :)
08:20:35  <peter1138> yes
08:20:38  <peter1138>
08:20:41  <peter1138> i lied ;p
08:21:07  <boekabart_> first we'll finish this, i need to focus...
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08:58:50  <boekabart_> peter1138: only m7 would be usable, other are in use by dock, oilrig
08:59:09  <peter1138> hmm
09:01:15  <Eddi|zuHause3> doesn't that suffice?
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09:02:52  <Rubidium> I guess m7 will be used for oilrigs in newindustries
09:04:38  <peter1138> and i'll be using it for stations, though probably not for docks, yet
09:12:09  <hylje> with several water levels, rivers and other aquatic constructs might be a breeze
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09:15:04  <peter1138> hylje: they'll be a breeze if you code it for us :D
09:15:17  <hylje> yes, sure
09:15:25  <peter1138> Rubidium: planespeed/taxiing
09:15:43  <peter1138> Rubidium: if i apply a 'planespeed 1' patch, taxiing is really slow. acceptable? ;p
09:16:14  <peter1138> (i gather that celestar doesn't care)
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10:00:44  <boekabart_> hylje: I'm thinking the same thing and have the code in my head already.
10:00:56  <hylje> thats great!
10:01:19  <hylje> but i dont think any draining mechanisms can be had
10:01:28  <boekabart_> I think they can
10:01:59  <hylje> if so, that'd be totally sweet
10:02:04  <boekabart_> But first i'll finish the basic high-sealevel-patch. I'm fighting with the drying-up after lowering sea level again... I don't want lakes to dry up....
10:03:18  <hylje> lakes in this context?
10:03:21  <Eddi|zuHause3> just start "anti-flooding" from 0x0
10:03:38  <Eddi|zuHause3> anything not connected to the sea will then not dry out
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10:16:11  <boekabart_> Eddi|zuHause3: how do you suggest that drying up propagates then? instantaneously?
10:16:18  <boekabart_> currently it's like flooding
10:16:43  <Eddi|zuHause3> yes, i thought like flooding
10:17:58  <Eddi|zuHause3> but i do not know how flooding is exactly implemented
10:18:20  <Eddi|zuHause3> you could implement it like a BFS
10:18:54  <boekabart_> flooding is in tileLoop: if a tile is water and the neighbour is not, it will become wet too.
10:19:41  <boekabart_> basically, drying up works the same now for water tiles that are above sea level: if any neighbour at same height is dry, dry up too
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10:24:17  <boekabart_> i got it to work so that lakes stay wet
10:24:32  <boekabart_> but they won't get larger if modified: they will dry up
10:25:33  <boekabart_> since drying up is stronger than flooding, above sea level
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11:05:36  <Rubidium> peter1138: does that slow taxiing mean that it is possible to get them stuck?
11:05:41  <peter1138> no
11:06:20  <Rubidium> then it's ok by me; planespeed should (ofcourse) be on all speeds of a plane ;)
11:07:06  <peter1138> can always be adjust later, of course
11:07:14  <peter1138> default to 1 or 4?
11:09:25  <Rubidium> I'd say default to TTDs speed
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11:12:36  <peter1138> so taxiing is slow? :p
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11:22:36  <boekabart_> ever been in a plane? taxiing IS ALWAYS ANNOYINGLY SLOW!
11:23:02  <peter1138> heh
11:23:26  <peter1138>
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12:36:56  <Tino|r152> f
12:37:05  <peter1138> f?
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12:41:07  <Eddi|zuHause3> it's the letter next to g
12:42:27  <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause3: what a strange keyboard you have
12:43:04  <Sacro> no...
12:43:06  <peter1138> it's a letter next to f...
12:43:09  <Sacro> its like that on mine too
12:43:10  <peter1138> but not *the* letter...
12:43:15  <peter1138> Sacro fails
12:43:27  <Sacro> indeed he does
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13:20:09  <Belugas> hello
13:20:43  <peter1138> Belugas :D
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13:26:34  <Belugas> #water water everywhere!
13:27:09  <Belugas> how's life, Master?
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13:31:53  <Belugas> it looks like i should start reserving bits and bytes for newindustries, if i don't want to see any left ones used up by the new water scheme :)
13:32:06  <Belugas> kick in the butt boy!
13:39:49  <boekabart_> Belugas: You can relax, I've now got High Seas, Rivers and Lakes working with no extra bit used
13:40:21  <Belugas> congratulations :)
13:40:33  <boekabart_> i hope
13:40:47  <Belugas> either way, i have stuff to clean on industries.  requirements of a *certain* project of mine ;)
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13:41:43  <Belugas> map-oriented-stuff, might i add...
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13:44:48  <maddy> how can i use newindustries from the nightlies?
13:46:22  <Belugas> you can't
13:46:30  <Belugas> it's not in the nighlties
13:46:40  <Belugas> it's not even on my own machines
13:46:50  <Belugas> welll not finished,that is...
13:46:54  <Belugas> far form it
13:46:59  <Belugas> far FROM it
13:48:33  <maddy> ah, because in the logs i see every time new changes for newindustries
13:48:46  <maddy> i thought maybe it is already available
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13:48:50  <Sacro> newindustries?
13:49:02  <maddy> or was it newcargo...
13:49:10  <maddy> yeah!
13:49:13  <maddy> newcargo
13:49:18  <maddy> i meant newcargo
13:49:22  <Eddi|zuHause3> those are two different things
13:49:30  <Sacro> its newcagoes
13:49:36  <Sacro> *newcargoes
13:49:51  <maddy> yes, i meant newcargos, not newindustries
13:49:57  <maddy> how can i use them?
13:50:01  <Eddi|zuHause3> new car goes? you better hope it drives :p
13:50:13  <maddy> Eddi|zuHause3: :p
13:50:18  <Eddi|zuHause3> you can't use newcargos without industries
13:50:24  <Eddi|zuHause3> newindustries
13:50:29  <maddy> lol
13:50:33  <maddy> ok
13:50:48  <maddy> then i forget about newcargos and newiindustries
13:51:33  <Thomas[NL]> some people are talking about the new map-array format, what will be different at what will be the advantages?
13:52:20  <Eddi|zuHause3> there were lots of different plans for that... not all lead anywhere
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13:52:27  <Belugas> they do not know whata they are talking about
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13:53:06  <Belugas> they are confused by the evilish wiki!
13:54:05  <Eddi|zuHause3> the last plan i heard was stacked tiles, in preparation of flexible bridges
13:54:48  <Eddi|zuHause3> but apart from the C++ port, i have not seen anything happening towards that direction
13:56:39  <Belugas> can addition of m7 counts?
13:57:00  <Eddi|zuHause3> m7 has nothing to do with stacked tiles :)
13:57:28  <Belugas> no, but for new map array, it could, since it's a new array in the map!
13:57:29  <Belugas> lol
13:57:52  <Eddi|zuHause3> err... yes :)
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14:04:05  <ln-> boris yeltsin is dead
14:05:36  <boekabart_> i just heard
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14:14:24  <peter1138> heh
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14:14:49  <peter1138> was he doing anything?
14:21:39  <boekabart_> no, except for drinking a lot, apparently.
14:22:09  <peter1138> now that i aspire to
14:22:40  <Belugas> slurp
14:22:42  <Belugas> burp
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14:37:48  <boekabart_> Updated!
14:38:06  <hylje> great"
14:38:07  <hylje> !
14:38:48  <hylje> omg
14:39:11  <hylje> all we need is stream sprites?
14:41:11  <boekabart_> yea, we do need those.
14:42:05  <boekabart_> going home.. later!
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15:05:10  <Eddi|zuHause3> i'd like to see: lake water, stream water (with direction), waterfalls, shallow sea, deep sea and ocean ground (when transparent) sprites
15:05:57  <maddy> me too
15:06:14  <Eddi|zuHause3> and also streams affecting ship speeds :)
15:07:04  <maddy> hehehe
15:07:14  <Belugas> steam ships
15:08:07  <ln-> what about frozen lakes with temporary ice roads over them?
15:08:51  <Eddi|zuHause3> i don't think anyone outside finland thinks this is a great idea :p
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15:09:26  <ln-> or frozen lakes with temporary railroads over them?
15:10:02  <Eddi|zuHause3> somehow i knew that one was coming :p
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15:11:19  <hylje> i didnt expect that
15:11:35  <Belugas> roads on lakes are known in here too.
15:11:41  <Belugas> trains on lake were used
15:11:44  <Belugas> not aymore
15:11:48  <Belugas> since eons
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15:12:06  <Belugas> frozen lakes...
15:12:47  <Eddi|zuHause3> hylje: a while ago he showed a picture of rails over ice, because the bridge was destroyed (by germans retreating in WWII)
15:12:58  <hylje> :>
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15:13:21  <yeti_> hi :)
15:13:56  <Belugas> hello
15:14:43  <yeti_> when you upgrade your railways to monorail, what's the easiest method to upgrade your trains? build new depots, the trains, then copy orders?
15:14:50  <yeti_> or is there something easier :) ?
15:15:10  <Eddi|zuHause3> i don't think so
15:16:02  <yeti_> okay :) still a lot better than original ttd though. is it known when PBS will be back?
15:16:50  <Eddi|zuHause3> no
15:17:02  <Eddi|zuHause3> well, yes, the PBS you know will never come back
15:17:26  <Eddi|zuHause3> the new signal system will be much more than just PBS
15:19:00  <blathijs> oeh, are there designs for a new signal system?
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15:23:34  <Belugas> ho... xyz is from Montreal
15:23:44  <Belugas> welcome then :)
15:24:01  <Belugas> don't know blathijs.
15:24:12  <Belugas> You might ask KUDr
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15:25:51  <xyz> hi
15:26:07  <maddy> hiho
15:26:17  <xyz> what's with Montreal?
15:26:25  <peter1138> pom te pom
15:26:41  <xyz> what is that?
15:28:07  <Belugas> xyz, i am too :)  i saw that on your address ;)
15:28:23  <xyz> oh
15:28:25  <xyz> ok
15:28:29  <xyz> nice
15:28:31  <xyz> :P
15:28:43  <xyz> finaly spring coming
15:28:45  <xyz> ;)
15:29:11  <Belugas> you bet!
15:36:12  <Belugas> and gardening too.  Nothing is for free :(
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15:36:46  <maddy> i love gardening
15:40:09  <maddy> is a change from the programming the whole day
15:40:39  <Ailure> Yes
15:40:41  <Ailure> It's like
15:40:42  <Ailure> RL terraforming
15:40:59  <maddy> lol
15:41:04  <maddy> something like it
15:44:49  <peter1138> heh
15:45:00  <peter1138> press a few buttons to plant stuff...
15:47:58  <Belugas> or maybe obey the Grand Manager
15:48:03  <Belugas> your wife!!!
15:48:37  <peter1138> hehe
15:48:50  <peter1138> i need that bulldozer tool...
15:50:54  <HMage> and if you don't have much time, use copy-paste patch
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15:52:26  <Belugas> that would be so cool
15:53:25  <HMage> but it would mess your terrain if you make a mistake
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16:34:43  <Wolf01> hello
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16:39:38  <xyz> hi
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16:42:41  <adumitru007> how do I use xmlNodeGetContent(NodePtr cur) to extract the info in an xml-sequence like this one? <tag1><tag2><text>CONTENT</text></tag2></tag1> ?
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16:45:18  <xyz> adumitru007 ro>
16:45:19  <xyz> ?
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16:46:48  <Belugas> wrong channel :D
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16:47:31  <Digitalfox[Home]> Belugas this a little offtopic, but do you know anything about cars tyres?
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16:47:40  <yeti_> why do planes always fly a circle around the airport before landing?
16:47:56  <Belugas> Digitalfox[Home] : cars tires?
16:48:10  <Digitalfox[Home]> I need to change my car tyres.. And i'm having a hard time to pick the right ones
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16:48:19  <Belugas> i know about winter tires and 4 seasons ones...
16:48:21  <Digitalfox[Home]> so many companys and models
16:48:21  <Belugas> that';s about it
16:48:40  <Digitalfox[Home]> It's an Audi A3 205/60/15
16:48:46  <Digitalfox[Home]> yeah
16:48:53  <glx> expensive size :)
16:48:54  <Digitalfox[Home]> i'm seraching for sites with reviews
16:49:01  <Rubidium> Digitalfox[Home], tip: go to a company that sells lots of tyres
16:49:01  <Belugas> my father-in-law owns a garage. he's the one selling me what i need
16:49:14  <Belugas> i never know the details...
16:49:30  <Belugas> i don't even know the pressure required :S
16:49:42  <xyz> :)
16:49:46  <Digitalfox[Home]> Rubidium: I did, to 3, but all have diferent tyres and models and prices.. It's so confusing
16:49:50  <glx> Belugas: look at the sticker when you open the door :)
16:50:22  <Belugas> i may do that :)
16:50:28  <Digitalfox[Home]> And the you have tyres that cost 55EUR, 65, 75 120, etc...
16:50:48  <Digitalfox[Home]> Anyway it's offtopic, so thanks :)
16:51:12  <Digitalfox[Home]> Anyone knows a good review site for tyres?
16:52:06  <glx> Digitalfox[Home]:
16:52:20  <Digitalfox[Home]> glx:  Thanks a lot :) :)
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16:54:52  <Chrissicom> good afternoon =)
16:55:08  <Digitalfox[Home]> hello
16:55:28  <xyz> i think there is a bug in the intercontinental aeroport plane handeling code
16:55:49  <Digitalfox[Home]> xyz: What's the bug?
16:56:01  <Chrissicom> do you also have the problem that planes seem to use only one runway?
16:56:23  <xyz> the plane that is taking of from the second runway (the cosest to the camera) makes a 450 degree turn
16:56:33  <xyz> in stead of 90
16:57:17  <xyz> 450 anti-clockwise in stead of 9 clockwise
16:57:19  <Rubidium> what version are we talking about?
16:57:37  <xyz> all til latest AI build
16:57:40  <xyz> let me check
16:57:42  <Rubidium> (450 anti-clockwise != 90 clockwise)
16:57:51  <xyz> :)
16:57:59  <xyz> 360 + 90
16:58:05  <xyz> ups
16:58:09  <xyz> is 36-90
16:58:14  <xyz> 360-90
16:58:16  <xyz> sorry :P
16:58:28  <xyz> so 270
16:58:55  <xyz> is r9634 -noAI
16:59:06  <xyz> i have a savegame if you want
16:59:11  <xyz> or a screenshot
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16:59:45  <Rubidium> can you reproduce it in trunk?
16:59:55  <xyz> let me try
17:01:56  <Chrissicom> I just got a strange missing include when compiling the 0.5.1 source
17:01:57  <Chrissicom> .\music\dmusic.cpp(15) : fatal error C1083: Cannot open include file: 'dmksctrl.h': No such file or directory
17:02:01  <Chrissicom> what file is that?
17:02:17  <Rubidium> you miss directX stuff
17:02:39  <Rubidium> so you need to install some DirectX SDK
17:03:35  <Chrissicom> can I use the April 2007 SDK or is the 8.1 required mentioned in the readme?
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17:04:27  <xyz> iep it is happening in the trunk also
17:04:41  *** nfc [] has joined #openttd
17:04:42  <Rubidium> and in 0.5.1?
17:04:58  <xyz> :)
17:05:02  <xyz> le me see
17:05:37  <Rubidium> Chrissicom: have you added the correct paths to the configuration of MSVC?
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17:06:28  <Chrissicom> I am using a standard install of VC++ 2005 Express and didn't change any dirs
17:06:50  <Chrissicom> and I copied the PSDK files to .../VC/PlatformSDK/include ./bin etc....
17:07:00  <Chrissicom> that solved the problem of a missing winsock2.h and windows.h
17:07:10  <Chrissicom> I am trying to install the DX SDK right now :)
17:08:06  <Rubidium> < Chrissicom> can I use the April 2007 SDK or is the 8.1 required mentioned in the readme? <- under the assumption that it's backward compatible, it should work
17:08:39  <xyz> 0.5.1 also
17:09:23  <Chrissicom> I'll see if I can reproduce the problem xyz describes, I have a game open with icont airports right now
17:09:33  <Rubidium> can you make a bugreport @ for 0.5.1 and attach the 0.5.1 savegame?
17:11:03  <xyz> can i use the forum username for that?
17:11:22  <xyz> or i have to register
17:11:43  <Rubidium> it should allow unregistered reporting, but I'm not really sure about it
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17:13:23  <Chrissicom> do you have YAPF enabled in the patch settings xyz?
17:13:28  <Chrissicom> I can't reproduce the problem in my game
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17:14:29  <xyz> Chrissicom: yes
17:14:32  <Wolf01> Belugas: oh dear :P
17:14:57  <Rubidium> the pathfinder settings shouldn't bother the airplanes
17:15:31  <xyz> it is just for trains roads and ships
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17:16:23  <Chrissicom> oh my the DX SDK has 441 MB :D that'll take me 6 or 7 mins till I can try if it solves my problem
17:17:14  <Chrissicom> oh you're right hmm
17:17:32  <Chrissicom> send me the link to your bugreport when you made it and I'll check your savegame here :)
17:18:32  <xyz> ok
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17:21:54  <xyz> Notice: Undefined variable: register_text in /www/ on line 602
17:21:54  <xyz> Notice: Undefined index: project_title in /www/ on line 605
17:21:54  <xyz> Notice: Undefined index: flyspray_userid in /www/ on line 264
17:21:56  <xyz> ups
17:21:58  <xyz> :P
17:23:11  <boekabart> Chrissicom: on my site you can find a torrent to a super lite version of DX-SDK (jan2007), install-less, perfect for building ottd
17:23:41  <boekabart>
17:24:32  <Rubidium> MiHaMiX: why is flyspray still throwing warnings at new users?
17:24:38  <hylje> the other solution is of course to use linux
17:24:58  <boekabart> that's even more work than installing the full dx-sdk
17:25:00  <boekabart> ;)
17:25:46  <hylje> depends
17:27:10  <Chrissicom> oh cool link boekabart I'll give that a try :D although installing the DX SDK just fixed my problem already
17:27:22  <Chrissicom> but I'd prefer a few files to a big installation :D
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17:28:41  <Belugas> Wolf01 : thanks, saw it, tried to cool down the expectations
17:28:48  <Belugas> hopefully...
17:28:56  <Sacro> ooh tis a boekabart
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17:30:50  <dihedral> hello
17:31:00  <xyz> here is the link
17:32:28  <dihedral>
17:32:32  <dihedral>
17:32:42  <dihedral> can someone tell me what that is about?
17:33:00  <dihedral> i was spectating one of my games
17:33:01  <glx> what were you doing?
17:33:11  <dihedral> hehe - was faster
17:33:54  <dihedral> just toggling that button gave me that window
17:33:58  <dihedral> every single time
17:34:06  <dihedral> i have seen an empty error message box more often
17:34:21  <dihedral> like when simply joining a game
17:34:27  <dihedral> not that it influenced anything
17:34:44  <dihedral> but it only started coming in 0.5.1 (RC3)
17:34:59  <peter1138> hellay
17:35:31  <peter1138> dihedral: "that" button?
17:35:38  <glx> autorenew
17:35:41  <dihedral> yup
17:35:44  <dihedral> as you can see
17:35:50  <dihedral> when looking at the 2 screenies
17:36:05  <peter1138> ah
17:36:10  <peter1138> not obvious from one :p
17:36:23  <dihedral> but like i said - it happens on more occations - though this being the reproducable one
17:36:29  <dihedral> no - it's not
17:36:35  <dihedral> thats why there are 2 :-D
17:37:48  <dihedral> also once happened when i was spectating and ran a connect command...
17:38:15  <yeti_> if i set my airplanes to autoupgrade to a larger model, will it rebuild the planes to carry the goods that the old ones carried?
17:38:30  <peter1138> yes, in theory
17:38:34  <glx> if it can yes
17:39:43  <dihedral> any ideas what could be causing these empty error message boxes?
17:40:56  <Chrissicom> @xyz I downloaded your savegame and tried it, now I got what you exactly meant before :)
17:41:06  <Chrissicom> it's 100% reproducable in any game with 0.5.1
17:41:20  <xyz> :)
17:41:47  <xyz> i think it is in the game till the introduction of the intercontinental airport
17:43:32  <Chrissicom> I've just checked the behaviour on other airports
17:43:57  <Chrissicom> and e.g. when landing on a metropolition or international airport they do this same full circle turn when leaving the runway
17:44:36  <Chrissicom> it's not really a bug but not choosing the best path I think
17:45:33  <xyz> well i gave it a low severity
17:47:48  <glx> dihedral: did that happen in RC2?
17:48:36  <dihedral> not when i ran the connect command but i did not try it with the autorenew...
17:49:08  <dihedral> i should still have a binary on my server i could test it quickly
17:52:40  <dihedral> yes it does happen with autorenew
17:52:51  <Sacro>
17:52:55  <dihedral> i'll try one of the versions before (0.5.0 and RC1)
17:53:25  <dihedral> i feel 0.5.2RC1 coming soon :-P
17:55:39  <Chrissicom> hmmm I still have an error when compiling 0.5.1 source
17:55:53  <Chrissicom> I have a file C:\Program Files (x86)\Microsoft Visual Studio 8\VC\PlatformSDK\Include\mfc\afxres.h
17:55:58  <Chrissicom> but when compiling I get this error:
17:56:06  <Chrissicom> 2>.\ottdres.rc(15) : fatal error RC1015: cannot open include file 'afxres.h'.
17:57:10  <dihedral> well - it happens in 0.5.0 too
17:57:15  <MiHaMiX> Rubidium: err... i don't really know, i'll test it
17:58:42  <dihedral> i have also got more than one report of private messages not working
17:59:04  <dihedral> but only if the server has been up for more than 5 games or so
17:59:17  <dihedral> could it possibly be because of the higher client numbers?
18:02:32  <Rubidium> higher client numbers?
18:02:54  <dihedral> i dont know
18:03:04  <dihedral> connected clients get numbers
18:03:24  <dihedral> at some part the number reach 2000+
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18:04:36  <Rubidium> I see no reason why it would stop working at around the number 2000
18:04:47  <dihedral> i have no idea
18:04:56  <dihedral> but it seems to be a reocuring issue
18:05:13  <Rubidium> but is it at 2000, or maybe ~256?
18:05:36  <dihedral> i do not play there that much myself - i only go around and check up on the games
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18:06:09  <dihedral> sometimes the pm's worked
18:06:35  <dihedral> but very often (when the server has been running for some time) i get a report from players that it aint working
18:07:19  <dihedral> SirkoZ just mentioned "after serving the 5th game or so"
18:08:10  <dihedral> for my games that means running for about a week
18:08:28  <dihedral> but to be honest
18:08:39  <dihedral> i just updated to 0.5.1
18:08:47  <dihedral> and i have a client count at 423
18:09:23  <dihedral> so the 256 could be closer to the issue than the 2000 :-P 2000 really does not make that much sence
18:14:14  <Chrissicom> I can't get rid of this error 3>.\ottdres.rc(15) : fatal error RC1015: cannot open include file 'afxres.h'. :-(
18:14:19  <Chrissicom> the file is there though
18:14:30  <Chrissicom> < done this, didn't help
18:16:17  <Chrissicom> it also can't be my NTFS permissions, I also get the error when allowing everyone full access
18:17:02  <Wolf01> i just saw the tv: in italy the theft of copper is very common, thieves cut the copper wires on the railroads too :P
18:17:10  <dihedral> some players also report that the key below esc does not open the console for them
18:17:31  <Zuu> dihedral: Depends on the keyboard-layout.
18:17:49  <Zuu> It is the ~ that does it.
18:18:01  <dihedral> Wolf01: you could add that do the list of disasteres... have a little italian run around the map and take some wires form the rails so the e-trains cannot run there anymore :-)
18:18:09  <Chrissicom> Shift+Key below Esc opens the console for me
18:18:16  <Chrissicom> (on German kayboard layout)
18:18:23  <Wolf01> that's what i was thinking :)
18:18:27  <dihedral> it does that form me to on german layout
18:18:40  <dihedral> on uk layout it's the backtick (`)
18:18:58  <dihedral> on the slovanian layout it does not seem to work with either
18:19:23  <Zuu> For me it works to use the ~ atleast which is on the button bellow "x".
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18:19:39  <Maedhros> hi
18:19:44  <Wolf01> hello Maedhros
18:20:53  <Chrissicom> ok I fixed the RC1015 error by copying the afxres.h file from the PSDK dir to the ./VC/include dir
18:20:59  <Chrissicom> but now I got 64 new errors when linking lol
18:21:15  <Chrissicom> like this: 3>fontcache.obj : error LNK2001: unresolved external symbol __imp__RegCloseKey@4
18:21:27  <Chrissicom> I have no idea what causes this tho
18:21:44  <SpComb> Logs:
18:21:44  <Sacro> !logs
18:22:04  <Wolf01> comment the lines that give you errors.. worked for me
18:22:08  * Wolf01 hides
18:22:11  <Rubidium> Chrissicom: have you followed the guideline on the wiki?
18:22:27  <Rubidium> <- that one to be precise
18:22:28  <Chrissicom> I did everything like it told me in the readme
18:22:43  <Chrissicom> I haven't read that wiki page tho *sorry* doing that now :)
18:24:42  <dihedral> Wolf01: now i know where all the new features are...
18:24:45  <dihedral> in the comments
18:24:56  <Wolf01> :)
18:26:19  <dihedral> so you backport a lot of comments Wolf01 ?
18:26:52  <Chrissicom> Rubidium: Just read the wiki and I have actually done all these steps. Downloaded the Source, Installed VC++ 2005 Express, Installed PSDK, Installed DX SDK, Setup Directories
18:27:03  <Chrissicom> it compiles fine until the linking errors occur
18:30:50  <Chrissicom> fontcache.obj : error LNK2001: unresolved external symbol __imp__RegCloseKey@4 < hmmm the file fontcache.obj doesn't seem to exist here
18:30:57  <Chrissicom> isn't it supposed to be in one of the packages?
18:31:10  <Rubidium> Chrissicom: do you probably don't have the latest
18:31:31  <Rubidium> s/do //
18:31:35  <Chrissicom> I downloaded the useful file 1.2 from sourceforge just a few hours ago, but I re-check if I clicked the wrong file
18:38:37  <Chrissicom> hmmm that doesn't fix it, there are 3 files missing
18:38:52  <Chrissicom> win32.obj, win32_v.obj and fontcache.obj
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18:40:06  <Chrissicom> oh lol I just see these files aren't from the dev tool installation but reside in the ottd source code dir
18:40:20  <Chrissicom> then I don't know anymore what these linkage errors mean
18:43:53  <Rubidium> sounds like it doesn't compile those files when it should
18:45:24  <Chrissicom> < damn it I hate it when people write "Yeah I solved it." but don't say how
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18:45:36  <Chrissicom> because this guy is having pretty much the same problem as me
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18:52:24  <Chrissicom> hmmm I found some MSDN entry which tells me that __imp__ in front of the linker error means it's a problem with a dynamic link library
18:52:46  <Chrissicom> the OTTD Source compiles with the /MT switch tho shouldn't it be /MD when using dynamic instead of static libraries?
18:53:06  <Chrissicom> sorry if I am a headache with questions right now :p
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19:07:56  <Ailure> [20:51] <Chrissicom> hmmm I found some MSDN entry which tells me that __imp__ in front of the linker error means it's a problem with a dynamic link library
19:08:06  <Ailure> Or that you need to grab your shotgun and kill taht imp
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19:20:54  <mikegrb> how does one get airplanes? to have trains you have to build a depot, is there something ssimilarfor planes?
19:21:49  <Wolf01> build an airport, there is the hangar
19:22:53  <mikegrb> ahh
19:23:05  <mikegrb> I was clicking on the airport in general, not the hangar
19:24:42  <Digitalfox[Home]> Since celestar changed the planes speed, i was wondering if an option could be introduced to chose between the old speed and the new one...
19:25:50  <peter1138> sure
19:25:52  <peter1138> go ahead
19:29:01  <Digitalfox[Home]> I would go ahead, but my knowledge of c and c++, is a big 0, so i have to wait for a spare time from a developer, and we all have a real life, so time is always little :)
19:29:33  <peter1138> if you don't try, you won't learn...
19:29:36  <Ammler> the new console command list_patches is cool, but is there something like list_patches | more?
19:30:51  <Wolf01> [21:29:36] <peter1138> if you don't try, you won't learn...
19:30:52  <Wolf01> i learnt :D
19:31:39  <dihedral> use shift+page up
19:32:10  <peter1138> gah, slow pc :/
19:32:21  <peter1138> doing nothing and my loadavg is 0.50+
19:32:53  <Ammler> dihedral: thx
19:33:15  <dihedral> :-)
19:33:24  <dihedral> but you cannot see the whole lsit
19:33:47  <dihedral> i find the wiki page on openttd.cfg very helpful here
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19:34:48  <Ammler> yeah, but if you use a patched game, its more worse
19:35:20  <Belugas> Digitalfox[Home], it's true that Real Life his a big burden, but a good book of programming is a good start
19:35:30  <Belugas> there is much rewards when you start to understand stuff
19:36:07  <Belugas> not to the point of understanding Bjarni's stuff, but that's another story :P
19:36:59  <Digitalfox[Home]> Belugas: I am thinking on that, there are some patchs i would like to see in openttd.. But my real life is working in networks, so it's not easy to change my first priority that is learning more about networks :)
19:37:17  <Belugas> got a point...
19:37:51  <Belugas> but in the other end, lack of knowledge is worse than useless knowledge
19:38:01  <Belugas> you never know when you'll need it ;)
19:38:09  <peter1138> Digitalfox[Home]: beware the speed of taxiing ;/
19:38:16  <yeti_> <- help :) trains from SE did not arrive at sadston, even with weighpoints, they would loop around sadston heights an flonnley market heights forever
19:38:30  <yeti_> the extra track south of sadston heights solved it. why?
19:38:32  <Digitalfox[Home]> Well i do some web design so there is a little of understand from my part about how to code some stuff, but there are so many programming languages..
19:38:57  <Belugas> my wife offered me a book on c++ along time ago (5 years i think) by mistake, she did not knew the difference between Delphi and c++.
19:38:59  <Chrissicom> There is no such thing as useless knowledge =) knowledge is power!
19:39:01  <Belugas> now, it servers
19:39:08  <yeti_> i dont think it's a signalling problem because trains went (and still go) ta sadston without problems, just the two new ones :(
19:39:55  <Digitalfox[Home]> peter1138: taxiing? What do you mean?
19:40:10  <peter1138> yeti_: hard to see anyuthing at that zoom level
19:40:26  <yeti_> peter, okay, i'll make a more detailed shot
19:41:09  <peter1138> Digitalfox[Home]: taxiing... when the plane moves from the runway to the terminal
19:41:14  <Digitalfox[Home]> Belugas: But you also got a point.. So what books should i start reading to able to understand openttd code?
19:41:26  <yeti_> <- more detailed shot
19:41:39  <Digitalfox[Home]> peter1138: Oh, ok i see now..
19:41:43  <Belugas> Digitalfox[Home] : start by an easy book on C programming
19:41:57  <Chrissicom> maybe try a nonstop order for the way back
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19:42:11  <Digitalfox[Home]> Belugas: But if openttd is now in c++ shouldn't i start there?
19:42:13  <Chrissicom> as they are forced to go through the train station which trains sometimes don't like
19:42:22  <Belugas> Digitalfox[Home]: openttd code is a bit complicated if you want to learn C/C++ out of it :P
19:42:37  <Belugas> Opentt id not fully C++, far form it
19:42:51  <Digitalfox[Home]> It's a mix of c and c++?
19:42:52  <Belugas> in fact, if is mostly C code compiled ion C++
19:42:52  <glx> it's C with some C++ features
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19:43:03  <Digitalfox[Home]> ok
19:43:04  <Belugas> hey glx :)
19:43:14  <dihedral> is anybody working on
19:43:34  <Digitalfox[Home]> Going to a book store tomorrow, i hope i don't get a wrong book.. :|
19:43:34  <Belugas> and if you want to, you can start learning openttd code, but do it in small chunk
19:43:46  <peter1138> dihedral: not afaik
19:43:50  <dihedral> ok
19:43:50  <Belugas> i don't know what is available in portugal :)
19:43:53  <Belugas> cannot helop you there
19:43:58  <Maedhros> Digitalfox[Home]: you might be better off looking through libraries first
19:44:00  <dihedral> just curious because i asked someone to have a look at it
19:44:14  * peter1138 nods at Maedhros
19:44:17  <Digitalfox[Home]> Well i portugal most of technical books are in english, so ...
19:44:18  <Belugas> good point Maedhros.  New books a re pretty expensive!
19:44:21  <Digitalfox[Home]> *in
19:44:54  <dihedral> New books are created a lot faster than new stations :-D
19:45:26  <Digitalfox[Home]> hum... Well i must say that technical books here in portugal at least for networks, are not much expensive, so for programming they should be equal in price
19:45:43  <Belugas> can't say :(
19:45:47  <Belugas> never touched networking
19:45:50  <Digitalfox[Home]> i'll take a look :)
19:45:54  <elFarto> hi everyone
19:46:02  <Belugas> hello
19:46:18  <Thomas[NL]> If you find a good book you can recommend I'd like to now which :)
19:46:30  <elFarto> can anyone give me some comments on my shiney new patch?
19:46:43  <elFarto> it's located here:
19:47:16  * Belugas will in a few momentts
19:47:28  <elFarto> it (unsurprisingly) allows the the autoreplace dialog to replace say an electric with a monorail/maglev
19:47:36  <elFarto> engine
19:47:50  <elFarto> then lets you convert the depot with the trains still inside
19:47:50  <hylje> elFarto: how does that work? arent depots one (or two in case of elrail) railtype only?
19:48:13  <elFarto> hylje, it works coz the patch removes those checks :D
19:48:28  <peter1138> :o
19:48:31  <hylje> what happens when you start an incompatible train in the depot?
19:48:36  <elFarto> becuase i couldn't bare the pain of upgrading my network from elrail to maglev
19:48:50  <elFarto> it doesn't start, it complains about "No Power"
19:48:54  <peter1138> solution: don't upgrade it :D
19:48:59  <Belugas> elFarto : src/players.cpp : please use tabs instead of spaces
19:49:02  <hylje> so it might actually work
19:49:06  <elFarto> peter1138, but but...:P
19:49:07  <hylje> i'd have this in trunk
19:49:25  <elFarto> damn it, i made sure to turn that off in vim too :(
19:50:36  <elFarto> there are a couple of problems with the patch
19:50:59  <elFarto> afaik, it doesn't upgrade the wagons, but they still work on the new railtype
19:51:13  <hylje> wagon upgdare
19:51:20  <hylje> gah
19:52:28  <Belugas> hehehe... i jusst imagine the comments : a lot of "Cool!", of "Bravo!"  and the inevitable "It's not like taht in Real Life!"
19:53:32  <hylje> undocumented feature
19:53:41  <hylje> people arent going to try that by themselves
19:54:37  <elFarto> i'd rather have an easy way to upgrade a network rather than total realism
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19:55:59  <Belugas> code style wise, apart from what i told you, it looks clean.
19:56:10  <elFarto> ok, i've fixed that
19:56:30  <Belugas> code wise, dunno, i don't have my stuff around nor do i know enough about rail conversion, to be honest
19:56:56  <Maedhros> imho, the possibility of running wagons on tracks that should be incompatible is a showstopper
19:57:05  <Belugas> feature wise, although the idea is good, a lot of people claim the game is too easy.
19:57:08  <elFarto> it doesn't work Maedhros
19:57:23  <elFarto> the train can't be started
19:57:27  <Maedhros> ah, ok
19:57:54  <Sacro> but what about attaching maglev wagons to a monorail train?
19:58:01  <Belugas> but do you really upgrade the rails?
19:58:12  <Belugas> no, you just let the trains run on them, right?
19:58:31  <elFarto> wagons are another thing
19:59:11  <elFarto> all my patch does is allow the auto-replace to convert to engines that are not of the same railtype
19:59:23  <elFarto> it also lets you convert a depot when there are trains inside
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19:59:43  <dihedral> have another player reporting ~ to not open the console on US keyboard
19:59:52  <dihedral> and only since 0.5.1RC1
20:00:40  <Belugas> elFarto : how?  all i see is just some conditions been overriden by your setting
20:00:55  <Belugas> told you i don't knwo the rail code well enough ;)
20:01:11  <elFarto> well, overriding those conditions lets you :)
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20:01:56  <io]nowhere> hi
20:01:58  <elFarto> pfft, i hadn't even looked at openttd code till yesterday night :)
20:02:06  *** io]nowhere is now known as nowhere
20:02:25  <elFarto> so i went "right, what needs to be commented out for my life to be easy" :)
20:02:31  <dihedral> lol
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20:04:08  <nowhere> is there a known bug causing console to be no longer opened via keyboard?
20:04:32  <elFarto> hmm, maybe the wagons are going to be a problem...
20:04:52  <nowhere> started after installing 0.5.1-RC2
20:05:07  <DaleStan> nowhere: I'm not familiar with such, but that means approximately nothing. Check
20:05:28  <nowhere> I heard others were having the same
20:06:17  <nowhere> I noticed there have been some console improvements, maybe it's related.
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20:10:00  <elFarto> actually, wagons won't be a problem, if the user has a issue with running elrail wagons on maglev, they can just replace them at the same time as the engines
20:10:38  * elFarto < lazy developer
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20:20:14  <Belugas> Digitalfox[Home] : try to get your hand on "The C++ Programming Language" by Bjarne Stroustrup.  a good one
20:20:29  <Digitalfox[Home]> Belugas: Ok, will try :)
20:20:52  <Digitalfox[Home]> I don't know exactly what's in the market here in portugal
20:20:53  <Belugas> that's the guy who wrote c++, so it might be good :D
20:20:57  <Digitalfox[Home]> oh
20:20:59  <Digitalfox[Home]> nice
20:21:17  <Digitalfox[Home]> thak you :)
20:21:23  <Digitalfox[Home]> ops.. Thank you
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20:21:40  <peter1138> not to be confused with bjarni
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20:21:56  <hylje> speaking of confusion,
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20:22:27  <elFarto> my favourite comment about C++: "C++: an octopus made by nailing extra legs onto a dog"
20:23:10  <elFarto> hylje, wtf?
20:24:00  <hylje> i dont know
20:24:30  <Belugas> mine : "Discusting... all those members"
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20:25:04  <elFarto> give me Java any day of the week :)
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20:26:53  <Belugas> give me Delphi any day of the week
20:26:59  <Belugas> oups... i already have that :P
20:27:06  <hylje> i has python
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20:27:24  <Chrissicom> what about Haskell ;)
20:27:41  <elFarto> Chrissicom, sane languages only
20:27:50  <Chrissicom> *g*
20:27:50  <Belugas> Basic Objects?
20:27:52  <Chrissicom> While ?
20:28:04  <elFarto> brainfuck :)
20:29:45  <Wolf01> whitespace is teh best
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20:29:56  <Wolf01> specially when you print the sources
20:30:07  <elFarto> :D
20:30:49  <Wolf01> night boys
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20:34:31  <Ailure> [22:20] <hylje> speaking of confusion,
20:34:36  <Ailure> all I can say is
20:34:37  <Ailure> wut
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20:40:27  <peter1138> Ailure: wut!?
20:40:37  <hylje> lol wut?
20:42:22  <Belugas> good night, going home
20:42:49  <peter1138> nini
20:43:44  <Maedhros> night Belugas
20:43:57  <elFarto> night
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20:48:25  <Chrissicom> gnight :)
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20:55:38  <Chrissicom> good night from me too
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20:58:24  <Maedhros> and me, good night
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21:05:38  <elFarto> and good night from me, too! :)
21:05:41  *** elFarto [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
21:06:32  <Sacro> it should be "and a good night from him"
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21:11:22  <HMage> anyone knows how can I add a case via webtranslator ui?
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21:17:24  <glx> HMage:
21:18:18  <HMage> thanks, glx
21:20:11  <HMage> what if I want to change the list of available cases or rename them?
21:20:49  <glx> dunno, ask MiHaMiX
21:21:14  <glx> my language doesn't need cases :)
21:21:29  <HMage> we have 6 cases in russian
21:21:37  <glx> I know that :)
21:21:45  <HMage> :)
21:21:56  <glx> and 32 letters ;)
21:22:15  <HMage> 2^5 :)
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21:42:55  <Bjarni> hi channel
21:43:19  <Sacro> Hello Bjarni
21:43:50  <Bjarni> did I miss anything?
21:43:54  <Bjarni> !seen anything
21:43:54  <_42_> Bjarni, anything? hmm... I'm trying to remember... maybe... I'm not sure... no. I don't remember anything.
21:44:03  <Bjarni> I guess not
21:44:31  <Bjarni> actually that's quite an answer from _42_... I didn't plan that one :D
21:46:39  <Bjarni> looks like nothing goes on right now :s
21:46:58  *** _42_ [] has quit [Server closed connection]
21:47:20  <Bjarni> ...
21:47:24  <Bjarni> bye _42_
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21:48:41  <peter1138> hello bjarni
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21:48:54  <peter1138> fancy looking into the clone/refit bug?
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21:51:13  <yeti_> another beginner's question: the faster you deliver your cargo, the more money you get. is the delivery time counted from when the train leaves the station or from when it begins loading?
21:51:40  <yeti_> i.e. is there any sense in setting trains to "full load" or not?
21:53:13  <Eddi|zuHause3> well, yes, the loading time count, and yes, "full load" makes sense for most cargos
21:53:50  <Eddi|zuHause3> because while the train waits you get better station rating, so the industry produces more cargo overall
21:54:52  <HMage> does the time start to count since cargo gets loaded or when train exits the station?
21:55:00  <yeti_> so in general use full load for coal, iron ore, etc, but not for passengers, right?
21:55:25  <Eddi|zuHause3> yeah, that is usually a good rule
21:55:46  <Eddi|zuHause3> passengers lose a lot of value fast
21:55:57  <Eddi|zuHause3> while coal loses value only slowly
21:56:37  <yeti_> now i see why there are stations with that many tracks on some screenshots :)
21:56:53  <yeti_> can i use any map size or do i have to use powers of 2?
21:57:05  <glx> powers of 2
21:57:33  <Eddi|zuHause3> maps are always powers of 2, the values in the cfg denote the powers, not the actual size
21:58:10  <Eddi|zuHause3> so if map_x = 8, you get a 2^8 wide
21:59:38  <yeti_> okay, thank you :)
22:00:12  <Bjarni> <peter1138>	fancy looking into the clone/refit bug? <-- yes, but not right now. It's kind of late :s
22:00:17  <Bjarni> remind me tomorrow
22:03:19  <HMage> Trying to fill this into webtranslator: "{WHITE}{COMPANY} - {COMMA} ?????{P 2 ?? ?? ??}", this works in OpenTTD, and doesn't if I don't put 2 after P, but webtranslator tells me that there's an error. :(
22:05:26  <peter1138> wt2 is buggy then
22:05:46  <peter1138> but openttd is buggy too, it should work without the 2
22:07:48  <HMage> yeah
22:08:27  <HMage> shame the proper plural won't work there, it will be a strain for the eye
22:09:01  <Bjarni> remember the name of this string
22:09:11  <Bjarni> eventually the problem will be solved
22:09:15  <Bjarni> also post a bug report
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22:13:38  <HMage> Bjarni: for wt2 or for ottd?
22:14:20  *** Progman [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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22:19:46  <peter1138> Bjarni: there's already a report
22:19:58  <Bjarni> then don't post another one ;)
22:22:11  <Naksu> running out of spacebucks sucks
22:23:11  <Bjarni> running out of any kind of bucks sucks
22:23:39  <Bjarni> money will not make you happy by itself, but it sure helps ;)
22:25:52  <Naksu> whoops, wrong channel
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22:27:30  <jordi> oi people
22:27:47  <Bjarni> people?
22:27:52  <Bjarni> there are people here?
22:28:01  <Bjarni> I thought it was a geek only channel :(
22:28:56  <HMage> Bjarni: oops, I just did
22:29:26  <Bjarni> heh
22:29:30  <jordi> blathijs: done!
22:29:41  <Bjarni> I will not kill people for reporting bugs
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22:30:08  <Bjarni> specially not when I tell them to do so (even though it turns out to be duplicates)
22:30:36  <jordi> okay, 0.5.1 just uploaded to Debian
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22:31:15  <ln-> Bjarni, do you know about Carbon?
22:31:30  <Bjarni> not much
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22:31:52  <Sionide> we are made from it...?
22:31:56  <ln-> I'd like to enable "click-through" for some buttons, but I'm having difficulties finding information on how to do that.
22:32:09  <ln-> (completely off-topic, I know)
22:32:25  <Bjarni> are you making some sort of GUI with Xcode?
22:33:21  <ln-> i'm using wxWidgets which then uses Carbon.
22:33:36  <Bjarni> well, I tried to do that once... and the result told me that I'm not the right person to ask :p
22:33:48  <Bjarni> I never figured out how to make the code aware of click events
22:34:03  <glx> wxwidgets should handle that for you
22:34:20  <Bjarni> didn't try extremely hard though. When I had problems setting it up, I went for the CLI solution instead
22:35:43  <Bjarni> glx: most likely, but Xcode aren't that tricky to use either. I just didn't try very hard on it
22:36:19  <Bjarni> my need was virtually not there since I know how to use CLI apps and make them
22:36:46  <glx> wxwidgets is a cross-platform GUI framework :)
22:37:01  <Bjarni> I know
22:37:40  <Bjarni> cross platform is nice if you plan on porting your app. If you plan on using it locally only on one system only, then cross platform isn't an issue
22:39:46  <Bjarni> but it could indicate that if you should learn only one system, the cross platform one could be the way to go
22:42:37  <glx> even without porting app, it's easier to code for win32 using wxwidgets than using win32 api directly
23:02:44  <yeti_> good night everybody
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