Log for #openttd on 15th January 2008:
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00:04:11  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: glx * r11855 /trunk/src/ (newgrf_house.cpp newgrf_house.h openttd.cpp town_cmd.cpp): -Fix [FS#1335]: recompute town population when removing a 'newhouses' grf, or when loading a game with missing 'newhouses' grfs
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00:11:40  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: glx * r11856 /trunk/src/ (date.cpp stdafx.h): -Revert (r11772): since FS#1335 is solved, we do not need the extra checking and such anymore.
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00:22:09  <Wolf01> 'night
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00:48:25  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11857 /trunk/src/widgets/dropdown_type.h: -Fix: some compile time warnings.
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02:38:11  <ln-> i know a workaround for the nightlies Leopard issue.
02:38:29  <lws1984> WOAH
02:38:29  <lws1984> what?
02:38:30  <lws1984> do tell!
02:38:53  <ln-> what? you have a mac and you have an issue?
02:39:02  <lws1984> Yes, as in, nightlies don't work on Leopard
02:39:38  <ln-> according to very minimal testing, i propose the following workaround: use the PPC binary.
02:39:50  <lws1984> i'll try that once i feel like it...
02:41:28  <Sacro> damnit i need to sleep
02:41:34  <Sacro> instead i'm watching threshold
02:41:39  <Sacro> despite the fact i know it got cancelled
02:41:43  <Sacro> thus i'll never know the ending
02:54:17  <Jortuny> yeah, the ppc binary works fine
02:54:25  <Jortuny> (on leopard)
02:57:14  <Belugas> ln, yopu might want to share your findings and maybe your patches with bjarni an egladil
02:58:18  <ln-> there's no 24/7 bjarni here, unfortunately.
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07:16:42  <peter1138> morning
07:17:09  <rygrass> afteernoon
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07:23:20  <LA[lord]> morning
07:24:13  <LA[lord]> I managed to breath in a big quantity of CO thius morning..
07:24:39  <LA[lord]> so I  won't be going to school
07:24:47  <LA[lord]> atleast now...
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07:32:02  <peter1138> er, whoops?
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07:42:11  <SpComb> Logs: (old: )
07:42:11  <LA[lord]_> !logs
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08:14:34  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: peter1138 * r11858 /trunk/src/widgets/dropdown.cpp: -Fix (r1679): Mask and rule colour in drop down lists using wrong source value. (r1679 partially reverted r1368)
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09:06:49  * Rubidium ponders what 'a big quantity' is
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09:25:10  <SmatZ> morning
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10:28:13  <egladil> [15 03:57 CET] Belugas ln, yopu might want to share your findings and maybe your patches with bjarni an egladil <== share :)
10:37:18  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: peter1138 * r11859 /trunk/src/ (newgrf_station.cpp newgrf_station.h rail_gui.cpp): -Codechange: Update newgrf station class dropdown to use new method of generating list.
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11:01:28  <ln-> egladil: the nightlies cannot be executed on Leopard,
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11:01:58  <rave> hi
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11:03:31  <egladil> okies
11:03:45  <peter1138> ...
11:04:11  <egladil> that means the compile farm has to be updated (again)...
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11:34:57  <dihedral> good (?:(?:mor|eve)ning|afternoon)
11:35:48  <peter1138> good day
11:36:07  <Forked> g'day :)
11:36:29  <Rubidium> oh noes
11:37:16  <peter1138> oh?
11:37:42  <Rubidium> isn't 'oh noes' #openttd slang for hello?
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11:38:23  <peter1138> i don't know
11:39:19  <pv2b> dihedral: add good day and good night to that regex :-)
11:43:31  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: peter1138 * r11860 /trunk/src/station_cmd.cpp: -Fix: Test station class validity against number of classes, not abosolute limit.
11:45:10  <dihedral> anybody got a good idea how i can split an integer into all separate bits?
11:45:18  <LA[no_school_today]> nope:P
11:45:25  <dihedral> go to school LA
11:45:34  <LA[no_school_today]> can't
11:45:42  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: smatz * r11861 /trunk/src/tunnelbridge_cmd.cpp: -Fix: do not call rail specific functions when removing road tunnel/bridge
11:45:48  <dihedral> you can - you just dont _have_ to
11:45:54  <LA[no_school_today]> I breathed in alot CO this morning, and I'm kinda out of rails today
11:46:13  <LA[no_school_today]> so I have to, but can't
11:46:15  <dihedral> co?
11:46:22  <LA[no_school_today]> like CO2
11:46:26  <SmatZ> LA[no_school_today]: do you breath CO for fun?
11:46:27  <dihedral> carbon monoxide?
11:46:34  <LA[no_school_today]> yup
11:46:47  <dihedral> have another snuff - obviously was not enough
11:46:54  <SmatZ> :D
11:47:07  <dihedral> :-P
11:47:18  <dihedral> c'mon you code junkies...
11:47:21  <LA[no_school_today]> actually my brother tried cooking and it didn't work out so well.. And he didn't open the windows
11:47:26  <SmatZ> :-x
11:47:34  <LA[no_school_today]> so I woke up in a blue smoke
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11:47:56  <dihedral> interger split up into it's bits
11:48:01  <pv2b> dihedral: an integer into seperate bits?
11:48:02  <dihedral> fast and efficient
11:48:10  <dihedral> 5 = 4 and 1
11:48:13  <pv2b> the naive way would be something like
11:48:48  <dihedral> and processing a string is the last thing i want to do
11:49:01  <pv2b> def tobinary(x) { if (x & 1) s = "1"; else s = "0"; return tobinary(x>>2).s; }
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11:50:01  <dihedral> yes - and i want to process that for i dont know how high it goes
11:50:16  <pv2b> dihedral: what do you mean?
11:50:43  <dihedral> i dont want to process it like that
11:51:02  <pv2b> you can just keep it around in an integer and process it bit by bit. accessing individual bits in an integer isn't that hard
11:51:20  <dihedral> yes - but isn't that nice either
11:51:23  <dihedral> ^^
11:51:37  <pv2b> !!(x & (1 << n)) where n is the integer will give you the binary digit at the position n in the integer x
11:52:00  <pv2b> you can wrap that in some syntactic sugar if you want
11:52:05  <pv2b> depends which language you're writing in
11:52:27  <dihedral> a language that actually does not have all that much 'syntactic sugar'
11:52:30  <dihedral> php ^^
11:52:40  <pv2b> oh. :-)
11:52:56  <pv2b> even php has functions though
11:53:08  <dihedral> it close to _only_ has functions
11:54:04  <pv2b> get_bit(x,n) { return (x & (1<<n)) ? 1 : 0; }
11:54:14  <pv2b> my php is syntax is a bit rusty but you know what i mean
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11:56:23  <pv2b> or just write it in pic assembler instead. then you can use BSF, BCF, BTFSS and BTFSC ;-)
11:56:38  <dihedral> lol
11:57:45  <pv2b> btw, counting the number of digits in a binary number is pretty easy to do with a binary (pun not intended) search
11:57:54  <pv2b> or if you're lazy you could just use a logarithm
12:03:00  <dihedral> and the highest set bit?
12:03:15  <dihedral> so in your example n = 0 to highest set bit
12:03:47  <pv2b> highest set bit in php
12:03:50  <dihedral> the ugliest i could think of would be strlen( bindec( x ) )
12:03:56  <pv2b> floor(log(x, 2))
12:03:57  <pv2b> ;-)
12:04:31  <pv2b> that might not work very well though, floating point rounding and stuff
12:04:32  <dihedral> for the example of 5 that retunes 2
12:04:42  <dihedral> and that clearly is not correct ^^
12:04:54  <pv2b> 5 = 101
12:04:57  <pv2b> bit number 2 is the msb
12:05:05  <dihedral> right
12:05:06  <dihedral> hehe
12:05:07  <dihedral> true
12:05:12  * dihedral slaps himself
12:05:21  <pv2b> but don't actually use that method, you'll run into trouble with large numbers
12:05:50  <pv2b> can you describe what you're trying to do rather than asking how to do what you think is the right solution? :-)
12:06:02  <dihedral> ^^
12:06:41  <dihedral> i have a table in an sql db where a history is stored of actions done via the admin frontend
12:07:09  <dihedral> actions are stored bit wise
12:07:19  <pv2b> what's the structure of the bitfield?
12:07:26  <dihedral> so - reading a certain customer ticket could be action 4
12:07:29  <dihedral> writing = 1
12:07:43  <dihedral> so changing the ticket = 5
12:07:55  <pv2b> so, why don't you just do something like
12:08:00  <reto_> hmm.. why do you store bitfileds in a sql table?
12:08:18  <reto_> why don't you use boolean fields?
12:08:20  <pv2b> ticket_read = bf & 4
12:08:25  <pv2b> ticket_written = bf & 1
12:08:31  <dihedral> action & 5 in the sql statement to get the last write access of customer tickets
12:08:32  <reto_> I have just read the last sentence, I dont no the context
12:08:38  <dihedral> will also return 4
12:08:39  <dihedral> because 5 & 4 = 4
12:08:51  <peter1138> bit :D
12:08:55  <peter1138> stores a 1 or a 0
12:09:02  <peter1138> let the sql server handle the storage
12:09:12  <peter1138> on the other hand
12:09:22  <pv2b> peter1138: i don't think he's in the position to change the schema :-/
12:09:39  <peter1138> i've know people store boolean values as varchars with the values "True" and "False" ...
12:09:41  <peter1138> +n
12:09:50  <dihedral> ouch
12:09:51  <dihedral> no
12:09:55  <reto_> :)
12:09:56  <dihedral> it's an integer field
12:09:57  <pv2b> peter1138: :-D..
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12:10:19  <dihedral> makes it easier to read when you need to run selects on the command line ^^
12:10:32  <reto_> a great
12:10:36  <pv2b> dihedral: ok, so you have the integer field. now what do you want to know about it? whether somebody wrote to the customer record or what?
12:10:45  <dihedral> it's easier to catch it in the method that builds the query
12:10:56  <reto_> lets wag the dog
12:11:06  <dihedral> i want to get the last write access for a certain action
12:11:22  <dihedral> as there are custom action 'ids'
12:11:27  <dihedral> i.e. > 1024
12:11:46  <dihedral> which will be defined by 1024 | 4 = custom action of customer ticket
12:11:53  <pv2b> hm
12:12:02  <dihedral> 1024 | 4 | 1 = custom action of customer ticket was a write ^^
12:12:34  <dihedral> assume 1024 was a note one could attach to the ticket
12:12:42  <dihedral> then 1024 | 4 was read
12:12:48  <dihedral> 1024 | 4 | 1 was write
12:13:00  <dihedral> and 1024 | 8 could be something completetly different ^^
12:13:05  <pv2b> that sounds like a rather convoluted design
12:13:18  <peter1138> let's store openttd's data in sql!
12:13:18  <pv2b> or you're not explaining it so i understand it :-)
12:13:30  <dihedral> that could well be true ^^
12:13:37  <dihedral> both in fact could be true ^^
12:14:02  <pv2b> i'm not an epert with SQL but couldn't you use a SQL where clause to test for that?
12:14:11  <pv2b> or doesnt the WHERE clause support bitwise operators?
12:14:17  <dihedral> yes
12:14:24  <dihedral> that is what i tried to explain earlier
12:14:29  <dihedral> say field = 4
12:14:36  <dihedral> and i do where field & 5
12:14:48  <dihedral> i still get the records returned where field = 4
12:14:52  <dihedral> as 4 & 5 = 4
12:15:00  <pv2b> yes.
12:15:04  <pv2b> so what's the problem? :-)
12:15:09  <dihedral> but i also want to know about the fields where &1024
12:15:13  <dihedral> or greater
12:15:33  <dihedral> so rather than changing a bunch of code or the db and a bunch of code
12:15:37  <pv2b> can't you just do <pseudo code) WHERE (field&1023) & 5
12:15:49  <dihedral> i thought i'd split up the int when it hits the method where the statement is built
12:15:58  <pv2b> or WHERE (field & 5) OR field > 1024
12:16:18  <dihedral> the method only is passed one int
12:16:25  <dihedral> hence i want to split it up
12:16:33  <pv2b> so.... split it up
12:16:54  <dihedral> so then i can build a where field = bit for every bit set in int
12:17:00  <dihedral> sorry
12:17:03  <dihedral> where field & bit
12:17:19  <pv2b> or just or the bits together frst
12:17:25  <dihedral> i.e. select * from table where field & 1 and field & 4
12:17:35  <pv2b> whre field & 5 == 5
12:17:40  <dihedral> field & (1|4)
12:18:02  <pv2b> field & 5 isn't the same as field & 5 = 5
12:18:03  <dihedral> with == 5 i deont get those fields that are 1024 | 4 | 1
12:18:14  <dihedral> and it does not end with 1024
12:18:26  <pv2b> so then use an or.
12:18:52  <dihedral> it does not give the the result's that i am looking for in the sql select
12:20:13  <pv2b> ok, just a minute. you want to find lines in the table where bitfield matches which conditions (in plain english)
12:20:29  <dihedral> yep
12:20:41  <dihedral> but 4 & 5 is a match
12:20:50  <pv2b> that was not plain english
12:20:54  <pv2b> what do you want to look for
12:21:13  <dihedral> where every bit in 5 is set
12:21:23  <pv2b> field & 5 == 5
12:21:28  <dihedral> no
12:21:31  <pv2b> yes
12:21:41  <dihedral> because then 1024 | 4 | 1 will not match
12:21:44  <pv2b> yes it will
12:21:53  <pv2b> 1024|4|1 & 5 == 5
12:23:24  <pv2b> per-von-zweigbergks-powerbook-g4-15:~ pvz$ php -r 'print (1024|4|1)&5;print "\n";'
12:23:28  <pv2b> 5
12:23:42  * dihedral slaps himself again
12:23:54  <dihedral> heh - i have a g4 powerbook 12"
12:23:55  <dihedral> ^^
12:25:04  <dihedral> thanks pv2b...
12:25:07  <pv2b> np :-)
12:25:17  <dihedral> dont ask me why i was thinking it would not work...
12:25:24  <pv2b> php rots your brain
12:25:30  <pv2b> that's why
12:25:33  <dihedral> LOL
12:25:44  <pv2b> perfecly intelligent people become iditos when coding in php :-)
12:26:26  <dihedral> thanks a bunch
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12:39:23  <dihedral> !players
12:39:31  <dihedral> !playercount
12:39:36  <dihedral> oh
12:39:38  <dihedral> heh
12:39:40  * dihedral smiles
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12:58:21  <roboboy> gnight soon
12:58:32  <dihedral> who is 'soon'?
12:59:22  <Rubidium> maybe it's his imported Thai wife
12:59:39  <dihedral> lol
13:01:35  <dihedral> the sentance i link to the word 'soon' and this channel is 'not in the near future' ^^
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13:03:56  <frosch123> Hello everyone
13:04:14  <dihedral> quak
13:04:36  <Rubidium> do I hear a duck tour there?
13:05:40  *** Frostregen [] has quit [Quit: und weg]
13:07:10  <LA[no_school_today]> no, rubidium, it was dih
13:07:16  *** TinoDidriksen [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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13:07:39  * LA[no_school_today] can't say 'just dih' :S
13:07:52  *** LA[no_school_today] is now known as LA[lord]
13:09:46  <dihedral> Rubidium: you want to tell me where you get the link between FROSH123 and a DUCK?
13:10:12  <Rubidium> dihedral: no, I can tell you the link between 'quak' and duck tour though
13:12:24  <dihedral> i used the german
13:12:43  <dihedral> so you confuse german frogs with ducks?
13:13:17  <Rubidium> no, I assumed English (with a typo)
13:13:54  <Rubidium> quak -> quack -> a sound closely related to the duck tours
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13:15:35  <dihedral> i can understand that
13:15:46  <dihedral> i mix up japanese and chinese too ^^
13:16:33  <Rubidium> that's not hard because they share a fair share of Kanji
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13:18:13  <roboboy> when did the saving still in progress please wait message get added? Does it matter if one closes i, and what does it actually mean by please wait?
13:19:22  <frosch123> roboboy: The debug feature you mention was removed last night, just wait for the next nightly.
13:19:59  <roboboy> ok
13:20:02  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11862 /trunk/src/ (8 files in 2 dirs):
13:20:02  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Fix [FS#1559]: when two NewGRFs 'fight' to define the same cargo it could
13:20:02  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: happen that the strings are defined by one cargo and the 'action2' by another
13:20:02  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: and when one assumes that both come from the same NewGRF... So store the GRF ID
13:20:02  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: with the strings. To be extra sure add the same protection mechanism to
13:20:03  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: industries and towns too.
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13:21:10  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: peter1138 * r11863 /trunk/src/widgets/dropdown.cpp: -Fix (r11848): One day I'll learn C++... Delete all items in a drop down list before deleting the list.
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13:33:11  <roboboy> I wonder if I cn get a real media plugin for firefox without installing realplayer
13:34:06  <roboboy> gnight
13:34:25  * Hendikins plays a 64x2048 map
13:34:39  <peter1138> :o
13:35:10  <Hendikins> I've got one loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong island
13:35:38  <Hendikins> Which is actually going to be quite fun to play with once I clear off my debt and get a line running end to end
13:36:10  <keyweed> an no need for large complicated hubs
13:36:12  <keyweed> *and
13:36:45  <roboboy> I once tried it with a loop and each station was a cross member
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13:37:07  <Hendikins> keyweed: Just one long main line, balloon loop at each end, and some branches
13:37:17  <keyweed> Hendikins: yup. that will work
13:37:33  <keyweed> Hendikins: untill you reach the maximum capacity of your long main line
13:37:52  <Hendikins> So you quad track it and have stuff going from one branch to another
13:37:59  <Hendikins> It can be made to work :)
13:38:22  <keyweed> yeah. i think it will.
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13:39:11  <Hendikins> Might require being a bit creative
13:43:04  <LA[lord]> Hendikins: how many industries/towns?
13:43:17  <Hendikins> LA[lord]: High/Normal
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13:46:19  <Forked> hmm me and a buddy have a co-op 8192x128 going :)
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13:48:20  * Hendikins makes use of DebtMax technology to speed things up
13:50:47  <Eddi|zuHause3> for my next game i need industries with little output and villages that have near to no growth
13:50:59  <Eddi|zuHause3> then play with high/high
13:51:23  <Eddi|zuHause3> so i can actually have small branch lines and truck transport to hub stations
13:53:03  *** TinoDidriksen [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:56:03  <Hendikins> mmmm, 5 coal mines close together and quite a distance from where I'm dumping the coal. mmmmmmmmmmm.
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14:04:26  <rave> is it distance between the resources or distance between the stations that affects profit?
14:04:47  <Eddi|zuHause3> stations
14:05:06  <Eddi|zuHause3> Hendikins: yeah, that is the plan ;)
14:05:36  <rave> are you sure? wow
14:05:38  <LA[lord]> anyone familiar with a program graphics gale?
14:05:46  <Eddi|zuHause3> rave: yes i'm sure
14:06:10  <rave> thanks
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14:22:16  <LA[lord]> hey Gonozal_VIII :)
14:23:12  <Gonozal_VIII> hi
14:24:48  * Hendikins watches his train profits jump 7x within 2 years
14:24:55  *** Sacro [~Sacro@adsl-87-102-119-5.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd
14:25:34  <Gonozal_VIII> jump?
14:26:29  <Gonozal_VIII> sacro, jumpQ
14:26:31  <Gonozal_VIII> !
14:26:54  *** Sacro [~Sacro@adsl-87-102-119-5.karoo.KCOM.COM] has left #openttd []
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14:27:00  <Gonozal_VIII> hehehehehe
14:27:24  <Gonozal_VIII> yay, if i say jump he jumps
14:27:37  <Eddi|zuHause3> at least you have to give him a dog-cookie now
14:27:37  <Sacro> :(
14:27:48  <Eddi|zuHause3> see his face?
14:28:07  * Gonozal_VIII gives sacro a cookie
14:28:20  <Sacro> ^^
14:28:25  <Sacro> omnomnom
14:29:10  <Gonozal_VIII> can you recycle empty cyanide bottles?
14:29:33  <Gonozal_VIII> got some here from my last cookie baking..
14:30:10  <Hendikins> Gonozal_VIII: 0k to ~.2mil within 2 years. Not huge sums, but for a new/small company, not bad either.
14:30:24  <Gonozal_VIII> ah i see
14:30:44  * Hendikins pieces his trunk line together
14:30:52  <Gonozal_VIII> mine often jump infinity times in 1920
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14:49:18  <frosch123> DaleStan: Is there an easy way to find out whether variables in /inc/ are signed or unsigned? Except looking at the code where they are used.
14:55:32  <DaleStan> frosch123: Not really, but TTDPatch, for most purposes, only does signed integers in the same places that TTD does them.
14:55:56  <frosch123> thanks
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15:00:14  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: smatz * r11864 /trunk/src/ (9 files): -Codechange: pass owner whose signals we will update instead of complex detection later
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15:09:55  <ln->
15:10:20  <Gonozal_VIII> hehehe
15:10:27  <rave> does the cargo delivery timer start when a train leaves a station or arrives?
15:10:49  <Gonozal_VIII> when it finishes loading
15:11:35  <rave> even if there isn't cargo waiting at the station?
15:12:04  <Gonozal_VIII> why would it matter then?
15:12:16  *** HerzogDeXtEr [] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
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15:12:33  <dihedral> LOL ln-
15:12:59  <Gonozal_VIII> oh, you got the rest of your nick back dih
15:13:53  *** Farden [] has joined #openttd
15:14:56  *** dihedral is now known as dih
15:15:05  <dih> ^^
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15:19:19  <Hendikins> Hrm, 412 days in each direction
15:20:48  <Hendikins> At 144km/h
15:21:43  <Gonozal_VIII> @calc 412*24*144
15:21:43  <DorpsGek> Gonozal_VIII: 1423872
15:22:28  <Hendikins> 1.4 million km. Impressive.
15:22:57  <Hendikins> Probably better suited to maglev though
15:23:06  <Gonozal_VIII> @calc 1423872/40075
15:23:07  <DorpsGek> Gonozal_VIII: 35.5301809108
15:23:21  <Gonozal_VIII> 35,5times around the world :-)
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15:29:27  <fjb> Moin
15:29:47  <dih> moin
15:30:05  <Gonozal_VIII> ii
15:30:08  <Gonozal_VIII> hi
15:31:19  <Gonozal_VIII> dbset is very chaotic
15:31:31  <Gonozal_VIII> xl
15:31:31  <fjb> :-)
15:31:42  <fjb> In what way?
15:31:57  <Gonozal_VIII> i tried to extract only the transrapid
15:32:28  <Gonozal_VIII> parts of that are all over the place...
15:32:33  <fjb> Oh, you mean the source.
15:33:43  <fjb> I guess Michael never intended that somebody looks into the grf.
15:33:45  <dih> @seen Bjarni
15:33:45  <DorpsGek> dih: Bjarni was last seen in #openttd 15 hours, 41 minutes, and 11 seconds ago: <Bjarni> goodnight
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15:36:22  <Gonozal_VIII> i guess he had comments...
15:37:14  <Rubidium> and a preprocessor
15:37:20  <fjb> Maybe he stripped them before releasing the grf.
15:37:26  <fjb> :-)
15:37:42  <Rubidium> there are two types of comments and only one gets into the grf
15:37:44  <Gonozal_VIII> the normal // comments are removed by the codec
15:38:04  <Ammler> Action 0c
15:38:43  <dih> hello Ammler
15:38:49  <Ammler> :)
15:38:56  <dih> how was it?
15:39:04  <Ammler> how was what?
15:39:07  <Gonozal_VIII> what's a preprocessor?
15:39:10  <dih> that swiss army stuff
15:39:16  <fjb> I saw and nfo assembler and a kind of compiler released the last weeks. Is anybody using them?
15:39:17  <Ammler> suxx
15:39:22  <dih> still on?
15:39:32  <Ammler> hmm, not atm
15:39:49  <Ammler> but I need still about 30 days to spent there
15:39:50  <Eddi|zuHause3> fjb: the "compiler" is hardly finished...
15:40:02  <dih> you get to go home in the evenings?
15:40:20  <Gonozal_VIII> grf2html helps a lot with reading grfs
15:40:20  <Ammler> not usually, but you can get a permission
15:40:34  <fjb> Gonozal_VIII: Something like that:
15:41:02  <fjb> Eddi|zuHause3: Ah, you are the author of the compiler. I didn't look at it yet.
15:41:08  <Ammler> those 30 days will be spent there later (sommer or next year), for now, I am done :-)
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15:41:50  <Eddi|zuHause3> swiss army... that always reminds me of that movie...
15:41:54  <Gonozal_VIII> you have to spend 30 days in the swiss army?
15:42:05  <Eddi|zuHause3> "Achtung! Fertig! Charlie!" or so
15:42:44  <rave> @help
15:42:44  <DorpsGek> rave: help [<plugin>] [<command>]
15:42:54  <rave> help
15:42:55  <Gonozal_VIII> do you have your own rifle to take home and shoot rats and guys that scratch your car with?
15:43:13  <Ammler> Eddi|zuHause3: that was extreme, but quite real...
15:44:18  <Gonozal_VIII> sig 500 or something like that
15:46:13  * fjb can't await the next release of the new pbs patch.
15:46:37  <Gonozal_VIII> yes, that sounds promising
15:46:48  <fjb> It is fun to toy with.
15:48:11  <Gonozal_VIII> i think presignals have to be removed for that, that just can't work with default red
15:48:50  <fjb> I didn't have the urge to use presignals with pbs.
15:48:50  <Eddi|zuHause3> why? presignals are mostly ignored, and show the state of the next real signal
15:49:33  <Gonozal_VIII> hmmm
15:49:47  <fjb> The common use of signals in TTD is not related to the real working of signals.
15:49:48  <Eddi|zuHause3> presignals should stay mostly for backwards compatibility
15:50:59  <Gonozal_VIII> i would just ditch signalling backwards compatibility with pbs
15:51:01  <fjb> I could live without that bakward compatibility. But I fear many will complin that the signals are not like they used to be.
15:51:41  <Gonozal_VIII> when loading an old game with that patch it should just convert all signals to pbs
15:51:57  <fjb> Mixing both signal systems would lead to chaos, I guess.
15:52:32  <Gonozal_VIII> all presignals.. not the defaults of course^^
15:52:32  <Eddi|zuHause3> i would not allow mixing, but i would allow a setting for using/simulating the old system
15:53:32  <Gonozal_VIII> i guess a switch: default signal colour (red | green) should be enough
15:53:34  *** rave is now known as rave|wk
15:54:52  <Gonozal_VIII> could even work with presignals then
15:55:33  <Gonozal_VIII> well... not as intended... but without the locks that are there now
15:55:50  <Eddi|zuHause3> default red with the current signalling... you would never need green signals then
15:56:30  <Gonozal_VIII> no only for the pbs signals
15:56:30  <Eddi|zuHause3> because green means "signal is reserved by a train that has not passed yet"
15:57:19  <Gonozal_VIII> with green they would always be green yes...
15:57:57  <Eddi|zuHause3> i have no idea what you are talking about
15:58:02  <Gonozal_VIII> hehe
15:58:16  <Eddi|zuHause3> "should be enough" <- for what?
15:58:16  <Gonozal_VIII> pbs signals with default green are always green..
15:58:44  <Gonozal_VIII> to avoid those ever red presignals
15:59:07  <Gonozal_VIII> and trains that won't come out of the depot
15:59:30  <Eddi|zuHause3> i told how to solve that
15:59:39  <fjb> "should be enough" always means for everybody. :-)
15:59:50  <Eddi|zuHause3> train ignores presignal
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16:00:25  <Eddi|zuHause3> presignal shows state of next real signal
16:00:56  <Gonozal_VIII> hmm it could try to reserve a path further if there is a presignal and if it can't the presignal turns red and the train stops there
16:01:14  <Eddi|zuHause3> if real signal turns out to show definite red (instead of idle red), train stops at presignal
16:01:34  <Gonozal_VIII> yes^^
16:03:46  <fjb> Don't mix the real meaning of the term "presignal" and the the TTD meaning. That leads to confusion in discussions.
16:03:51  <Gonozal_VIII> but the presignal should turn green then... i guess users would complain if the train sometimes passes the red signal and sometimes not... and it turns green after the train passed because the next signal is green and things like that^^
16:04:10  <Gonozal_VIII> there are no real presignals yet
16:05:46  <Gonozal_VIII> hmm how do you make priorities with pbs?
16:05:55  <Eddi|zuHause3> i'm talking about TTD (legacy) presignals
16:06:34  <orudge> TTD didn't have presignals
16:06:43  <Eddi|zuHause3> i know
16:07:31  <Eddi|zuHause3> but all TTD successors had them, and shared a similarly wrong nomenclature
16:10:32  <Eddi|zuHause3> what is called "presignal" should probably be renamed to something like "entrance signal"
16:11:10  <Eddi|zuHause3> "presignal" should come before the "entrance signal", and should signal "go slower, because next signal is red"
16:11:22  <Sacro> like a repeater?
16:11:56  <Eddi|zuHause3> i don't know what a repeater is
16:12:34  <Sacro> :(
16:13:05  <Gonozal_VIII> i think he means that yellow and double yellow signals he was talking about yesterday
16:13:22  <Sacro> kind of
16:13:29  <Sacro> except a repeater is tied to a main signal
16:14:00  <Gonozal_VIII> that could be a way to get rid of those unrealistic instant stops
16:14:19  <Sacro> yes, possibly
16:14:42  <Sacro> well a train could maybe slow to 66% on a double and 33% ona  yellow
16:14:47  <Eddi|zuHause3> " Ist das Hauptsignal fÃŒr den TriebfahrzeugfÃŒhrer, z. B. in einem Gleisbogen, nicht innerhalb von 300 m zu sehen, stehen zwischen dem Vor- und dem Hauptsignal ein oder mehrere Vorsignalwiederholer (Lichtsignal)"
16:14:52  <Gonozal_VIII> it's kind of boring that no matter how bad you place your signals, your trains will never crash...
16:15:12  <Eddi|zuHause3>
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16:16:00  <Eddi|zuHause3> if i understand this correctly, the meanings are like follows:
16:16:12  <Eddi|zuHause3> double yellow: expect red
16:16:14  <Gonozal_VIII> there should be light crashes where both trains have a breakdown but without total destruction
16:16:19  <Eddi|zuHause3> double green: expect green
16:16:27  <Gonozal_VIII> or only the last wagon destroyed..
16:16:32  <Eddi|zuHause3> yellow+green: expect slow green
16:17:04  <Eddi|zuHause3> repeating signals have a white light next to them
16:17:55  <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause3: depending on country
16:18:06  <Eddi|zuHause3> of course ;)
16:18:18  <Sacro> german signalling confuses me
16:18:25  <Eddi|zuHause3> where would we get to if each country would not have at least one different system ;)
16:18:29  <Gonozal_VIII> sprites could always be changed, that's not the problem
16:18:41  <Eddi|zuHause3> germany has like 4 different signalling systems
16:19:32  <hylje> Eddi|zuHause3: counting the signaling-without-the-signals system for fast trains and crowded track?
16:19:45  <Sacro> britain has 2
16:19:52  <Eddi|zuHause3> hylje: i'm not really sure
16:20:30  <Sacro> hylje: moving block
16:22:19  <Sacro> bloody hell
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16:22:26  <Eddi|zuHause3> "Signalsysteme: In Deutschland existieren derzeit bei der großen Bahn fÃŒnf verschiedene Signalsysteme"
16:22:30  <Sacro> US has red, yellow, green, white, blue, purple
16:24:03  <Gonozal_VIII> yellow and white... blue and purple... that's easy to misread with sunlight around
16:26:35  <hylje> F40PH
16:29:55  <Eddi|zuHause3> "Tip: Wer alle Signalsysteme auf einmal sehen will, fÀhrt nach Hamburg oder (noch besser) Berlin. Dort sieht (sah) man auf der S1 von Wannsee nach Oranienburg Ks-Signale im Bahnhof Wannsee, Sv-Signale auf der NordsÌdbahn, H/V-Licht- und Formsignale auf dem nördlichen Abschnitt und ab der Stadtgrenze bis Oranienburg Hl-Signale. 5 Signalsysteme entlang einer S-Bahn-Linie, die Formsignale sind jedoch 1992 abgebaut worden!"
16:30:28  <Gonozal_VIII> hehe
16:30:31  <hylje> aaaaa, the german!!
16:31:14  <Gonozal_VIII> tipp is written with 2p :-)
16:31:32  <ln-> ti2p?
16:31:40  <Eddi|zuHause3> it says there was a line in berlin where you could see 5 different signalling systems (not counting the "LZB" system without signals)
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16:33:46  * dih hides
16:34:06  * dih peeks to have a look if he can attack skidd13
16:34:13  <Gonozal_VIII> hi skidd15
16:34:28  <toet> pff cpu multi tasks ingame! >.>
16:34:36  <toet> ai*
16:34:37  <Gonozal_VIII> ski2d15
16:34:57  * skidd13 takes his machine gun out and spots possible enemys ;)
16:35:26  <skidd13> Gonozal_VIII: buy a new keyboard
16:35:34  <dih> ^^
16:35:40  <Eddi|zuHause3> <- the most simple "Main-/Presignal" system, 3 signal states: "stop", "go" and "slow"
16:35:54  <Eddi|zuHause3> where "slow" means 40km/h unless otherwise stated
16:35:57  <dih> slow would be fun
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16:37:10  <flaa> O hai!
16:37:29  <Eddi|zuHause3> yeah, upon reserving the track you could check wether you go along the branching side of a switch, and set signal state to "slow" then
16:38:16  <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause3: i like that idea
16:38:24  <Sacro> we would need more signal graphics though
16:38:44  <dih> that should not be the hardest part
16:38:46  <Gonozal_VIII> they don't slow down to 40km/h on every switch..
16:38:49  <Eddi|zuHause3> you have the pictures in the link, just draw them ;)
16:39:01  <dih> you have enough grf authors
16:39:16  <dih> LA would be happy to do something like that
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16:41:01  <flaa> sorry about the bad image quality. but it's the intention that matters ;3
16:41:06  <Eddi|zuHause3> <- a "combo" signal, which is actually two signals at the same place
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16:42:46  <dih> here comes an ice - lets crash it ^^
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16:46:04  <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause3: i actually kinda understand that now
16:46:05  <Sacro> though...
16:46:11  <Sacro> red + green is wrong
16:46:44  <Eddi|zuHause3> it is yellow+green
16:46:56  <Sacro> :o
16:46:59  <Sacro> that's scary
16:47:18  <Eddi|zuHause3> or orange+green on the presignal
16:47:24  <Gonozal_VIII> that's the special yellow that they use to grow oranges
16:48:15  <Sacro> implementing german signalling in openttd looks quite easy
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16:48:31  <Eddi|zuHause3> <- examples
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16:53:52  <Eddi|zuHause3> it looks easy until you get to the more complicated systems :)
16:54:06  <Eddi|zuHause3> like this one of the east german railway:
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16:54:24  <Eddi|zuHause3> it only consists of "combo" signals, where redundant lights may be left out
16:54:38  <Eddi|zuHause3> also has a java applet to show signal states
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16:55:37  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: peter1138 * r11865 /trunk/src/widgets/dropdown.cpp: -Feature(tte): Support scrolling of drop down lists when in drag mode by moving the pointer above or below the list.
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17:00:34  <Gonozal_VIII> that system is nice
17:01:13  <Eddi|zuHause3> <- another type of "combo" signals, used in berlin and hamburg, basically the left half is the main signal, and the right half the presignal
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17:02:47  <Sacro> shall i start a signal drawing project in the graphics forum?
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17:03:51  <tneo> hello
17:04:00  <Gonozal_VIII> hi
17:04:18  <tneo> Can someone tell me about hard-coded features, that will make a city grow?
17:05:11  <tneo> For the openttdcoop servers I'm intending to write a guide on how to make a city grow
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17:07:09  <Eddi|zuHause3> <- the west german system for "combo" signals, each signal will only ever show one light, and have yellow or red plates to show wether it is a presignal, main signal or combo signal
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17:10:10  <Eddi|zuHause3> <- and then there is the "combo-combo" signal system, that tries to combine all 4 previous systems
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17:13:13  <Sacro> hmm, white spot means diverging
17:13:25  <Sacro> flashing green means slow down
17:13:49  <hylje> HALT
17:13:53  <hylje> HAMMERZEIT
17:14:46  <Gonozal_VIII> that would be stopp
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17:22:20  <Gonozal_VIII> <-- repair thingy pulling three wagons? :S
17:22:41  <hylje> heh
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17:37:57  <rave> what port does openttd .6 on LAN use?
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17:43:53  <glx> same as 0.5.x
17:43:57  <Zr40> he left
17:46:31  <fjb> Are there plans to implement the push/pull feature for trains?
17:46:52  <Gonozal_VIII> push/pull feature?
17:48:58  <fjb> A trains arrives at a station with the locomotion ahaead pulling it and then leaves it with the locomotion at the end of the train pushing it.
17:49:19  <hylje> no magically reversing trains
17:49:29  <Sacro> decouple and run around!
17:49:50  <fjb> Nobody does that today anymore...
17:50:06  <Gonozal_VIII> they push the trains all the time here
17:50:22  <Gonozal_VIII> push in one direction pull in the other
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17:50:29  <Gonozal_VIII> can't turn around anywhere
17:50:57  <Gonozal_VIII> that's the reason i had more than an hour delay today...
17:51:17  <fjb> Why? Did they try zo turn around?
17:51:33  <Sacro> they do run arounds here
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17:51:46  <Gonozal_VIII> the button/pedal/something that the driver has to push all the time to keep the train going in the back cabin thingy was broken
17:51:54  <hylje> i think most delays here (in long-distance) happen due to pendolinos failing to couple
17:52:56  <Gonozal_VIII> so the safety thing let the air out of the brake and the train stopped in the middle of nowhere and they couldn't get it to move again
17:53:14  <hylje> yay
17:53:34  <hylje> local traffic suffers from the occassional dead EMU
17:53:53  <Gonozal_VIII> it was a brand new 1116
17:54:12  <Gonozal_VIII> well... the wagons were older
17:55:57  <Gonozal_VIII> they had do get another engine and pull us back into the next station because there's only a single line and we were blocking everything
17:56:28  <hylje> hehe
17:56:29  <Gonozal_VIII> even a road, the train stopped at a crossing^^
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18:17:03  <dih> in some trainsets there are 'break waggons' or 'caboose waggons'
18:17:40  <dih> will they have an affect on the 'loading' time
18:17:58  <dih> if they are the waggons that make the train too long?
18:18:04  <dih> i.e. end waggons
18:18:14  <glx> if they are outside platform yes
18:19:11  <Gonozal_VIII> the caboose wagons in serbian set are the ones i was trying to replace with transrapid
18:19:58  <peter1138> yes they do
18:20:09  <peter1138> but i have thought about that
18:20:21  <peter1138> if a wagon has no capacity, don't count it
18:20:33  <LA[lord]> same for engine then?
18:20:34  <peter1138> or something similar
18:20:44  <peter1138> possible
18:20:55  <peter1138> front engines don't matter nayway, heh
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18:23:52  <Wolf01> hello
18:23:58  <Gonozal_VIII> hi
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18:28:15  <LA[lord]> hello skidd
18:28:39  <Gonozal_VIII> 15
18:29:29  <LA[lord]> I avoided it..
18:30:04  <Gonozal_VIII> skidd is abstract
18:31:51  <Forked> hmhm
18:34:14  <dih> would it not make more sense if only waggons to be filled had an influence?
18:35:13  <dih> and only influence loading time if the waggon going to be filled is not in the platform
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18:36:03  <dih> glx, peter1138: last 2 lines are for you ^^
18:36:04  <fjb> Or build platforms long enough. :-)
18:36:19  <dih> fjb: there is a reason why
18:36:39  <Gonozal_VIII> disabe long trains ;-)
18:36:50  <dih> if you have one waggon sticking out in the end of the station you can have
18:37:03  <dih> normal signal - exit signal
18:37:25  <dih> the waggon sticking out of the station will turn the normal signal red and the exit signal too
18:37:33  <Forked> hm. any newgrfs with atomic waste as a product? and maybe even gives you minus to town rating if you use it on a track too close?
18:37:43  <Gonozal_VIII> ah i see, faster green
18:37:57  <dih> once the train starts moving, the normal signal remains red but the exit signal turns green, telling trains waiting at a pre signal to move in
18:38:24  <fjb> Forked: Not that I know about any such grf, but it was discussed to make such a grf.
18:38:29  <peter1138> now that's a nasty hack :o
18:38:39  <Forked> fjb: ok :) thanks
18:38:44  <dih> peter1138: it's useful though
18:38:57  <dih> and it's not so nasty
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18:39:04  <dih> you are only working with what is available
18:39:16  <dih> and making the best out of that
18:39:28  <dih> i think the english expression is "make do" ^^
18:40:36  <peter1138> demand pbs :D
18:40:51  <dih> peter1138: how hard would it be to add checks that the loading time is only influenced it the waggon we are currently loading is not in the station?
18:41:07  <dih> *if
18:41:25  <dih> and pbs would not solve it
18:41:46  <dih> as a train would still be in the pbs block until it's left the station and passed the next signal
18:41:59  <peter1138> simple
18:42:26  <dih> would it be something you guys would 'approve' of?
18:43:58  * dih fills the silence with thoughts
18:44:05  <pavel1269> :)
18:44:58  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11866 /trunk/src/ (16 files in 3 dirs): -Codechange: swap OFB_* and OF_* so it conceptually in sync with other cases of *B_* vs *_* like VETSB_* and VETS_*.
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18:47:06  * dih hopes peter1138 read my last question ^^
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18:51:58  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11867 /trunk/src/ (genworld.cpp openttd.cpp):
18:51:58  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Fix: do not reset changes to persistent storages during world generation.
18:51:58  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Fix: store changes to persistent storages after performing all the game logic instead of resetting them.
18:53:10  <peter1138>
18:53:12  <peter1138> that's how easy
18:53:13  <dih> by the way - generation_seed should not be saved to cfg
18:53:21  <dih> wow
18:53:27  <dih> that was amazing peter1138
18:54:04  <dih> is it something that could be considerd 'worthy of trunk'
18:54:41  <Rubidium> hmm... should rething multiheads then ;)
18:54:57  <dih> why is that?
18:54:59  <peter1138> Rubidium, in what way?
18:55:21  <Rubidium> add your engines to the end of the train as you can then have shorter platforms -> more profit!
18:55:32  <dih> hehe
18:55:33  <peter1138> ahh, yes
18:55:34  <dih> true
18:55:42  <peter1138> maybe only count wagons...
18:56:37  <dih> and that what counts as the second engine if waggons have to be placed in between the 2
18:57:03  <Gonozal_VIII> Each platform tile is worth 2 rail vehicles. <-- ?
18:57:20  <dih> what's wrong with that?
18:57:30  <Gonozal_VIII> short wagons?
18:57:36  <peter1138> it was true, originally :)
18:57:45  <dih> those are additional grf's
18:57:50  <hylje> up-to-date comment is very up-to-date
18:57:57  <peter1138> the code is still valid
18:57:57  <Rubidium> it's still true ;)
18:58:08  <Rubidium> a 'short' wagon is just 75% of a rail vehicle
18:58:10  <dih> they are _worth_
18:58:18  <Rubidium> or 62.5% or 87.5%
18:58:20  <dih> w rail vehicles
18:58:37  <dih> 2
18:58:46  <Rubidium> yet, platforms have to be paid in rail vehicles
18:58:49  <Rubidium> *yes
18:59:05  <Belugas> stupid question, but i have to ask: while browsing source code, searching for whatever, do you tend to recognize (or look for) the "shape" of the functions? of enums, or structures... I do.  I just hope i'm not the only one, or i'd be ready for the fun farm...
18:59:12  <peter1138> bah, why are there no interesting complaints on the forums...
18:59:24  <hylje> Belugas: congitive patterns are a bad thing since when?
18:59:40  <peter1138> Belugas, yes, of course :)
18:59:59  <Wezz6400> hmm adding engines to the back looks stupid though, I'd rather have the train stop a few tiles forward so the engine doesn't stop at the platform, just the cars
19:00:00  <Belugas> ok
19:00:07  * Belugas feels better :)
19:00:14  <Gonozal_VIII> faster than skimming the text and easier to remember...
19:01:19  <hylje> "oh, that. the func that looks like a llama."
19:02:11  <dih> lol
19:02:22  <dih> Rubidium: regarding the reload config patch
19:02:26  <peter1138> that's usually bjarni's code
19:02:47  <dih> if the generation seed used for the map generator is stored in the config
19:02:49  <flaa> don't u liked my lolcats? T_T
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19:03:09  <dih> one can end up with always the same map
19:03:54  <dih> also dedicated servers, when started, will always have the same map, unless they load a scn or sav
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19:06:14  <Belugas> flaa : needless to say, i have nothing to say regarding your stuff.  I might be stupod, but i see nothing nor amusing nor interesting.  maybe expand about it?
19:06:23  <Gonozal_VIII> btw that's a thing i noticed, if you open the new game window it always generates a new seed but the same window in the scenarion editor doesn't
19:07:02  <Gonozal_VIII> i spammed that link around to everybody in icq the last time you posted it
19:09:37  <dih> flaa: what are you expecting us to say?
19:09:49  <Gonozal_VIII> that's a reaction i got:
19:09:49  <Gonozal_VIII> [20:06:54] Bartleby: jo und weita? hattma schon
19:09:49  <Gonozal_VIII> [20:07:31] Robert: kazze!
19:09:49  <Gonozal_VIII> [20:07:35] Robert: und openttd!
19:09:49  <Gonozal_VIII> [20:07:39] Robert: openttd kazze!
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19:10:03  <dih> Bartleby?
19:10:05  <dih> LOL
19:10:08  * dih thinks of bone
19:10:14  <Gonozal_VIII> bone :S
19:10:36  <Gonozal_VIII> dogma
19:10:58  <dih>
19:11:19  <dih> i like this one a lot:
19:11:27  <peter1138> what?
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19:12:19  <Belugas> "kazze!" ?
19:12:23  <dih> cat
19:12:27  <Gonozal_VIII> hehe
19:12:35  <Belugas> ho.. makes sens... NOT
19:12:38  <dih> i thought that one was amusing
19:12:47  <dih> perhaps more for germans
19:13:11  <dih> i mean all 3 lines by Robert
19:13:19  <dih> ^^
19:13:34  <Gonozal_VIII> <-- robert... you would never have guessed that^^
19:14:53  <dih> getting back on topic
19:15:26  <Gonozal_VIII> what could be more on topic than a cat playing openttd?
19:15:49  * dih will not say anything against cats, as it might offend Belugas
19:15:56  * dih actually likes cats
19:16:08  <Gonozal_VIII> cats rock
19:16:13  * dih is unfortunately really allergic
19:16:28  <Gonozal_VIII> that's bad... really bad
19:17:08  <Belugas> i love my cat.  The others?  baah... i cant love them as i can't touch them...
19:17:35  <dih> i hate my allergies
19:17:38  <Gonozal_VIII> ha! get aids, your immune system will break, your allergies will stop too and you can have cats :D
19:17:46  <dih> but i like animals - so usually i am the one who sufferes ^^
19:18:29  <dih> that was a cheap, Gonozal_VIII
19:18:37  <dih> can you not come up with better lines
19:18:56  <Gonozal_VIII> not always
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19:20:52  <dih> anyhow - i am curious to hear/read other people's oppinion on the train longer than station thing, and the generation_seed (not) stored in config
19:21:19  <Gonozal_VIII> well, the trick with the signal is nice
19:21:56  <dih> where did peter1138 head to? he disappeared
19:22:50  <Belugas> shhhhutt.... he is working hard
19:23:45  <dih> in his diff is the following comment: /* Reduce time penalty if the last wagons do not carry cargo */
19:24:09  <dih> would you not want to reduce the time penalty if the last waggons are not going to be loaded at that station?
19:24:33  <peter1138> no
19:24:34  <dih> i.e. multicargo trains
19:24:47  <peter1138> cos that would be more complex and i can't be bothered
19:24:54  <dih> ^^
19:25:00  <Gonozal_VIII> hehe
19:25:07  <dih> i like that answer
19:25:11  <dih> :-P
19:25:23  <Gonozal_VIII> i usually don't use multi cargo trains
19:25:29  <dih> me neither
19:25:40  <dih> i was just thinking of that case
19:26:28  <LA[lord]> dih, you think too much.. do something useful.. like play OpenTTD..
19:26:42  <dih> or slapping LA
19:26:45  <Gonozal_VIII> hmmm spriteless 0 px engine
19:26:49  <Gonozal_VIII> 1 px
19:26:50  * dih slaps LA[lord]
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19:27:31  * LA[lord] is sad
19:27:50  <Gonozal_VIII> could be attached there to trigger the signal and also to get eyecandy wagons without engines on some platforms
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19:31:16  <Gonozal_VIII> hmmmm
19:31:45  <Gonozal_VIII> could an engine read the custom name you give it and use that as hp?
19:31:55  <Gonozal_VIII> ^^
19:31:57  <Belugas> hack
19:31:59  <Belugas> blablablab
19:32:09  <dih> ^^
19:32:16  <Gonozal_VIII> maybe even negative...
19:32:27  <Belugas> kcha
19:32:36  <Belugas> balbalbla
19:32:41  <Gonozal_VIII> hehe
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19:33:52  <Gonozal_VIII> if you think one of your trains accelerates too fast to be realistic... buy one of those 1px engines, rename it to -1000, attach it and voila... train has 1000hp less^^
19:34:33  <Belugas> feels like ttdp's cheat sign :)
19:34:48  <Gonozal_VIII> cheat sign?
19:34:55  <hylje> cheat wagon
19:34:57  <Gonozal_VIII> never played ttdp
19:37:16  <LA[lord]> I played..twice.. maybe thrice :D
19:38:04  <hylje> never!
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19:39:53  * AntB is currently playing patch more then open
19:40:30  * LA[lord] slaps AntB with a fresh copy of OpenTTD nightly
19:40:36  <Belugas> it is your choice AntB :)
19:40:58  <Belugas> it SHOULD no bother anyone, even LA[lord]
19:41:04  <AntB> I've only just downloaded it actually, just to see what it was like
19:41:13  <AntB> and PBS :)
19:41:36  <LA[lord]> Belugas: *should* is dangerous word...
19:42:00  <AntB> lol
19:43:01  <dih> should is not dangerous the way it was used there
19:43:26  <LA[lord]> that doesn't matter
19:43:38  <tneo> point of view
19:43:53  <dih> pointy view
19:44:09  <LA[lord]> pointy ears
19:44:24  <AntB> rabbit :p
19:44:33  <LA[lord]> lol
19:45:00  <dih> and AntB just rabbits on
19:45:17  <dih> no pun not intended
19:45:21  <AntB> oi! its not very often I actaully chat in this room :P
19:45:33  <dih> ^^
19:45:43  <dih> that 'oi' is _very_ british ^^
19:46:13  <Gonozal_VIII> isn't that kind of frenchish?
19:46:15  <AntB> well considering i /am/ brittish dih :D
19:46:20  <dih> i did not meet another person (appart of my (?:grand)?mother) using that
19:47:01  <dih> Gonozal_VIII: go to london and say "oi! is french"
19:47:04  <dih> or even better
19:47:10  <dih> say "the french rock"
19:47:25  <AntB> come to where I am and mention the french ;)
19:47:25  <dih> not entirely sure you'd make a bunch of friends
19:47:43  <dih> he should still be able to report back to this channel AntB
19:47:55  <Gonozal_VIII> :P
19:47:59  <Belugas> [14:52] <dih> say "the french rock" <---  no, say "French rocks"
19:48:05  <AntB> a french woman come in the pub and I lost count of the amount of people sayin to chuck her out
19:48:19  <dih> heh
19:48:25  <dih> unfriendly snobs
19:48:33  <dih> ^^
19:48:37  <AntB> you call them snobs and they'll have ya :P
19:48:43  <dih> i know
19:48:53  <dih> i lived in the uk for 2.5 years
19:48:59  <Gonozal_VIII> usually if a woman walks into a pub the guys check her out not chuck..
19:49:07  <dih> LOL
19:49:21  <dih> totally depends on the woman and the guys in the pub
19:49:36  <hylje> a woman walks into a bar ..
19:49:42  <hylje> .. ouch.
19:49:46  <dih> ROFL
19:49:52  <AntB> well theres a barmaid in my local who has a "double" cleavage
19:49:59  <AntB> lol @ hylje
19:50:10  <Gonozal_VIII> double :S
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19:50:22  <AntB> her jeans don't fit very well
19:50:30  <dih> that is normal in the uk
19:50:40  <AntB> not like hers it aint :D
19:51:07  <dih> one thing i did learn after living 2 years in oxford
19:51:08  <tneo> aint aint a word ;)
19:51:21  <dih> it was _not_ my fault that i _never_ saw an attractive woman
19:51:45  <Gonozal_VIII> hehe
19:51:46  <AntB> not commenting on oxford, too far south for my liking
19:51:46  <flaa> 21:43 <@Athan> flaa: 16:39:36 < LuomuXP>
19:52:15  <Belugas> flaa, warning
19:52:16  <haclet> re
19:52:20  <dih> if i had the ability to
19:52:27  <Belugas> express something else but screenshots
19:52:33  <dih> go Belugas go
19:52:34  <Belugas> or face the consequences
19:52:42  <AntB> OTTD Touched... its moved on a bit since that screenie :)
19:52:58  <hylje> :o
19:53:07  <haclet> I have o question - I just updated my openttd and comiled it. All like before (long time I didn't have time to do that) - but when I am running game - it seems be running like in network mode ?
19:53:08  * dih gets some popcorn to watch the 'kick off'
19:53:11  <dih> *out
19:53:14  <Gonozal_VIII> i helped with improving :D
19:53:14  <flaa> Belugas: huh? are screenshots prohibited on this channel?
19:53:29  <Belugas> with a reason, yes
19:53:37  <Belugas> without one, it is spamming
19:53:41  <Belugas> so...
19:53:47  <Belugas> reason or ban
19:53:49  <Belugas> your chopise
19:53:53  <Belugas> choice
19:53:54  <flaa> erm... wait a sec, that wasn't even a screenshot, it was a regular image
19:54:00  <Belugas> samo
19:54:04  <flaa> of some device running openttd
19:54:17  <flaa> or whatever it was running
19:54:19  <dih> kick kick kick
19:54:19  <Belugas> the last one, we all know aobut it. thanks
19:54:26  <AntB> Flaa: Nintendo DS, not "some device" :P
19:54:36  <flaa> well that would have been my second guess
19:54:49  <Belugas> the first one you sent twice, still not getting the beauty of it
19:54:53  <dih> Belugas dont you have some steam to let out
19:55:01  <Belugas> hehehe
19:55:08  <dih> THEN LET IT OUT
19:55:10  * hylje hugs Belugas
19:55:11  <Gonozal_VIII> snow makes people angry
19:55:16  <flaa> that was not the same image i sent twice
19:55:17  * dih snows
19:55:22  <Gonozal_VIII> bad dih
19:55:26  <Gonozal_VIII> not again
19:55:35  <dih> i just need to get a bucket to overflow
19:55:39  <Belugas> freakingly resembling then...
19:55:53  <flaa> how does a DS and a kitten resemble each other
19:56:09  <tneo> they don't
19:56:19  <Gonozal_VIII> you just have to take more snow out of the bucket than it has inside and you end up with maximum
19:57:37  <Belugas> [11:42] <flaa> O hai!
19:57:37  <Belugas> [14:07] <flaa> don't u liked my lolcats? T_T
19:57:39  <Belugas> i see two
19:58:10  <tneo> same url can't miss ;)
19:58:17  <SmatZ> :))
19:58:23  <Belugas> nor logs :)
19:58:42  <tneo> You're just in this channel 24/7 :P
19:58:50  <Belugas> my client is :)
19:58:57  <dih> belugas, give yourself a kick
19:58:58  <Belugas> i'm at work 9-5
19:59:09  <flaa> Belugas: yes i see two also. i think we already came to that conclusion, no?
19:59:11  *** Belugas was kicked from #openttd by Belugas [muhaha]
19:59:16  <hylje>
19:59:20  *** Belugas [~belugas@] has joined #openttd
19:59:21  *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ
19:59:21  <AntB> wtf? lol
19:59:44  <Gonozal_VIII> wooden rail?
19:59:45  <dih> now do the same for flaa
20:00:45  <LA[lord]> Belugas, you don't have to do ALL that dih orders...
20:00:58  <LA[lord]> or dou you?
20:01:01  <LA[lord]> do*
20:01:10  <dih> the thing is, deep inside he wants to
20:01:39  * AntB wonders why dih isn't an op yet then :P
20:01:55  <dih> i am - just not here
20:01:55  <flaa> what i meant to say the image was not the same as the two i sent earlier
20:02:05  <dih> shush
20:02:18  <Gonozal_VIII> as the one you sent earlier :P
20:02:26  <flaa> which actually should have been clear from the context of the dialogue
20:02:32  <dih> shush
20:02:53  <Belugas> flaa, if it was, i would not have interveen
20:02:55  <Belugas> it was not
20:03:03  <Belugas> so, now you now
20:03:04  <Belugas> konw
20:03:08  <Belugas> know
20:03:12  <Belugas> pfffffff.
20:03:17  <dih> ^^
20:03:44  <flaa> tell me if these two are the same image: and
20:04:19  <hylje> pff
20:04:31  * dih slaps flaa
20:04:55  * Rubidium ignores flaa
20:04:58  <LA[lord]> Ah yea. I remember now.. I need to make a grf that has some parameters in it.. So like possible two options for different sprites... It has something to do with action07(sikp sprites) and 0D(assign parameters) but I don't know how..
20:05:00  <Rubidium> /ignore flaa
20:05:23  <flaa> well?
20:05:23  *** haclet_ [] has joined #openttd
20:05:25  <LA[lord]> Rubidium: You are mean..
20:05:38  <LA[lord]> :P
20:05:40  <Rubidium> mean in what way?
20:05:47  *** haclet [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:05:54  *** haclet_ is now known as haclet
20:06:08  <LA[lord]> every time I'm here you suggest  /ignore arandomornotsorandomname
20:06:09  *** helb_ [~helb@] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20:06:32  *** helb_ [~helb@] has joined #openttd
20:06:33  <Rubidium> well... it's better than a ban
20:06:50  <Gonozal_VIII> la, look at the combined airport grf, that has lots of parameter based sprite skipping and nothing else...
20:06:53  <Rubidium> as I do not have to care about reversing it
20:07:07  <LA[lord]> Gonozal_VIII: I know.. Skidd15 told me that..
20:07:44  <Rubidium> why do so many Skidd15 when it's skidd13?
20:07:52  *** peter1138 [~petern@] has joined #openttd
20:07:52  *** mode/#openttd [+o peter1138] by ChanServ
20:08:12  *** tubul [] has quit [Quit: I cna ytpe 300 wrods pre mniuet!!!]
20:08:35  <flaa> pfft
20:08:55  <LA[lord]> no it's not skidd13 (Gonozal, may I? )
20:09:19  <LA[lord]> :D
20:09:27  <Gonozal_VIII> you may ;-)
20:10:43  *** lobster [~michielbi@] has quit [Quit: HELP ME I AM A PENGUIN YET I HAVE NO BEAK ONLY MARSHMELLOWS]
20:11:31  <LA[lord]> welll.. the thing is that I desperatly needed skidd13 and but gonozal could offer me only skidd15 (for a good price) so he disguised him as skidd13 and tried to sell him
20:11:51  <LA[lord]> but I saw it through, took skidd13, but didn't pay
20:11:59  <LA[lord]> skidd15*
20:13:03  <Gonozal_VIII> yes... that was very evil
20:15:21  *** HerzogDeXtE1 [] has joined #openttd
20:22:14  <flaa> you guys gotta loosen up a bit
20:22:20  *** flaa [] has quit [Quit: leaving]
20:22:27  <dih> :-(
20:22:34  *** HerzogDeXtEr [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:22:47  <dih> a kick would have been more fun
20:23:52  <AntB> lol
20:24:36  <Belugas> gnignigni
20:24:52  <SpComb> Logs: (old: )
20:24:52  <peter1138> !logs
20:25:42  <Gonozal_VIII> you're not seriously going to sleep now belugas?
20:26:43  *** peter1138 [~petern@] has quit [Quit: bwaaahahaha, te eeeh eeehee boingk!]
20:26:51  <Belugas> sleep?
20:26:52  <Belugas> no
20:26:54  <Belugas> why?
20:27:08  <Gonozal_VIII> [21:24:36] Belugas: gnignigni
20:27:45  <Belugas> that's the sound of sadistic pleasure seeing flaa gettiing away
20:27:48  <Belugas> :P
20:28:11  <Gonozal_VIII> so that's what sadistic pleasure sounds like...
20:29:00  <Belugas> you should had a grim in the face,
20:29:44  <Belugas> and two hands with long nailed fingers doing . that motion.. hem...
20:29:56  <Belugas> forgot the word...
20:31:12  *** rave [~user@] has joined #openttd
20:33:42  <LA[lord]> goood niiigght
20:33:49  <pavel1269> gn ;)
20:34:00  *** LA[lord] [] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.80 [Firefox]]
20:34:29  *** haclet [] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20:35:49  <Belugas> rubing or maybe rubbing
20:35:56  <Belugas> depends
20:35:58  <Belugas> not sure
20:36:41  <Gonozal_VIII> i don't want to know about your fantasies involving rubbing motions..
20:36:59  <Belugas> twisted mind...
20:37:10  <Belugas> like a witch, you know...
20:37:18  <Belugas> one over the other
20:37:24  *** Mucht [] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20:37:26  <Belugas> in a griddy way
20:38:04  <Gonozal_VIII> i don't know any griddy rubbing witches, sorry...
20:39:05  <hylje> witches, both of you
20:39:22  *** DJ_Mirage [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:40:37  *** DJ_Mirage [] has joined #openttd
20:40:52  <Prof_Frink> What do we do with witches?
20:41:19  <hylje> we burn them!
20:41:51  <Gonozal_VIII> yes, burn belugas, burn him! *steps aside*
20:42:42  <Prof_Frink> What else burns?
20:42:53  <Gonozal_VIII> monty
20:44:22  <Belugas> ...
20:44:27  <Belugas> insanity
20:44:42  <Gonozal_VIII> insanity is the new sanity
20:44:42  <Belugas> i should have shut my big mouth
20:44:51  <Gonozal_VIII> you should adapt
20:45:00  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11868 /trunk/ (5 files in 3 dirs): -Fix: some files were still mentioning that beta1 is the latest release when that's not the case.
20:45:41  <Gonozal_VIII> why does the code mention that? :S
20:46:01  *** thgergo [] has joined #openttd
20:46:06  <pavel1269> what about making some topic in ottd->problems like ... "WHERE" orsth similar with instructions to find screenshots and saved games? :o)
20:46:48  <Rubidium> Gonozal_VIII: the readme is not code
20:47:02  <Gonozal_VIII> you mean like an alphabethically sorted list of words and each of them has a link?
20:47:18  <Gonozal_VIII> 5 files readme?
20:47:55  <rave> does the share order dropdown option on the vehicle list/group window work?
20:49:50  *** Nite [] has joined #openttd
20:49:56  <Nite> Hi
20:50:02  <Gonozal_VIII> hi
20:50:12  <Nite> anyone about bugtracking here?
20:50:22  *** fjb_ [] has joined #openttd
20:51:00  <Nite> hey i mean the channle is full
20:51:19  <Digitalfox_> A fix Rubidium lol
20:51:25  <Nite> ?
20:51:33  <Gonozal_VIII> [21:50:11] Nite: anyone about bugtracking here? <-- that's one of those questions you don't ask
20:51:45  <Nite> why the hell?
20:51:50  <Digitalfox_> Nite: Just ask the question..
20:52:00  <Belugas> you simply state your problem...
20:52:01  <Gonozal_VIII> that's like asking if you can ask something
20:52:09  <Nite> simple problem
20:52:37  <Rubidium> asking to ask something is worse, because you already asked something
20:52:38  <Nite> i was playing with depot orders heavily in 5.3
20:53:00  <Nite> and i guess in 0.6.0 they dont work correct anymore
20:53:27  <Gonozal_VIII> because a train entered a depot twice in a row?
20:53:38  <glx> use service order
20:53:43  <Gonozal_VIII> yes^^
20:54:03  <Rubidium> wow ;) OpenTTD is so much faster when using a release build *and* 1000 MHz more than normally ;)
20:54:16  <Belugas> lol
20:54:21  <Digitalfox_> lol
20:54:29  <Nite> when a train enters the depot and is not able to get out right away (ie: is blocked by another passing or entering train) it dous not switch to the next order
20:54:35  <hylje> Rubidium: thats totally not expected
20:54:57  *** fjb [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:55:00  <Belugas> Nite : [15:58] <+glx> use service order
20:55:10  <pavel1269> gn
20:55:18  <Gonozal_VIII> hmmm that blocked thing is new but i guess it's the same problem
20:55:22  <Nite> (it has nothing to do with service order or not NOR with any patches enabled or disabled NOR with pathfinding NOR with nonstop handling)
20:55:28  <Digitalfox_> bye pavel1269
20:55:38  *** pavel1269 [] has quit []
20:55:48  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11869 /tags/0.6.0-beta3/ (11 files in 3 dirs):
20:55:48  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Release: 0.6.0-beta3
20:55:48  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: Took way too long, but that happens when real life interferes and the bugcount is rising instead of declining.
20:56:06  <Gonozal_VIII> what are the orders?
20:56:16  <Nite> also with heavy traffic some really wired things happened like skipping the next 2 orders after performing the depot order
20:57:47  <Nite> orders where ... goto station A unload - go to depot (nonstop/service) - goto station A ...
20:58:07  <Digitalfox_> Another beta oh why why why o_O
20:58:12  <Nite> the "..." where many orders to different stations
20:58:31  <Rubidium> Digitalfox_: and you still have not installed it?
20:58:56  <Digitalfox_> Nope i'm one of those crazy nightly testers...
20:58:57  <Nite> i also tried to switch off the timetables - but same things happened
20:59:20  <Digitalfox_> It's always crashing but oh well..
20:59:29  <Nite> i also tried different station/depot designs
20:59:47  <Digitalfox_> Someone must do the dirty job ;)
21:00:26  <Gonozal_VIII> that problems sound new to me...
21:00:33  <Nite> mine?
21:00:36  <Gonozal_VIII> yes
21:00:40  <Belugas> indeed
21:00:45  <Nite> they where new to me also
21:01:09  <Belugas> maybe you should repoprt them on forums problem sections and see if it rings a bell to anyone
21:01:11  <Digitalfox_> If it wasn't for those rare and crazy nightly testers, how would you have so many bug reports and a way of spending your free time Rubidium ?
21:01:34  <Nite> 5.3 depot orders worked ...
21:01:35  <Belugas> like... adding savegames, diagrams, screenies of different behavioours
21:02:11  <Gonozal_VIII> depot orders always worked for me, even with the nightlies... maybe it has something to do with the number of orders
21:02:14  *** Bjarni [~Bjarni@] has joined #openttd
21:02:15  *** mode/#openttd [+o Bjarni] by ChanServ
21:02:18  <Gonozal_VIII> bjarni!
21:02:37  <Bjarni> Gonozal_VIII!
21:03:10  <Digitalfox_> And people say " Donate some money to the dev's for so much work " Well i say Dev's donate money to us nightly testers for all the work we do and make you don't work finding bugs!!
21:03:31  <Gonozal_VIII> i usually don't have many orders for a vehicle, so i wouldn't notice if that causes problems
21:03:35  <Nite> there where 7 stations in a pingpong "1unload-depot-1-2-3-4-5-6-7unload-depot-7-6-5-4-3-2-"
21:03:55  <Digitalfox_> I'm joking.. Before someone thinks it's for real :\
21:04:04  <Bjarni> Digitalfox_: it can be more fun to betatest than to code and fix bugs
21:04:20  <Bjarni>  <Digitalfox_> I'm joking.. Before someone thinks it's for real :\ <-- too late :P
21:04:22  <Nite> i also like testing more
21:04:29  <Digitalfox_> And my net just catch some fish
21:04:37  <Digitalfox_> oh a bjarni fish
21:04:43  <Digitalfox_> what a strange fish
21:05:00  <Digitalfox_> better sending it to water again, don't want to eat it
21:05:08  <ln-> it's Bjarni!
21:05:36  <Nite> if forums wherendt so tedious/boring
21:06:52  <ln-> Bjarni: a workaround is: use the PPC binary.
21:07:09  <Nite> ppc bin ?
21:08:02  *** lekro [] has joined #openttd
21:08:13  <Bjarni> ln-: what???
21:08:34  <Bjarni> you are saying that people should use rosetta?
21:08:53  <Bjarni> I tell people NOT to use rosetta because it creates odd issues
21:08:58  <ln-> that way the game at least starts.
21:09:12  <Bjarni> heh
21:09:25  <ln-> but let me paste this link for the third time:
21:09:45  *** helb_ [~helb@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:10:22  <Nite> openttd website states "You should direct these questions to the forums or in our IRC channel." but whatr is "theyr" irc channel ???
21:12:07  <Belugas> theyr?
21:12:36  <Nite> yes they call it "our"
21:12:49  <Digitalfox_> Wasn't there a page that showed the statistics for this channel? I remember seeing it but don't remember who posted the link :\
21:12:59  <Gonozal_VIII> you're talking to "them"^^
21:13:01  <Nite> (their sry)
21:13:17  <Belugas> "our" channel is this one
21:13:19  <Belugas> #openttd
21:13:34  <Nite> ok i wasnt sure
21:13:39  <Belugas> :)
21:13:55  <Gonozal_VIII> it's on the page, i just checked
21:14:13  <Belugas> you did? ho... good boy Gonozal_VIII ;)
21:14:50  <ln-> Nite: "their" is spelled with i.
21:15:15  <Nite> i alreadi applogyzed ;-)
21:15:24  <dih> lol
21:15:30  <ln-> Bjarni: what say thou about that link?
21:16:49  <Bjarni> I say it looks like something needs updating ;)
21:19:24  <Nite> maybee there should be a "bug" gameserver, where the task is to reproduce bugs ... (non crashing bugs)
21:19:57  <dih> they are all over
21:20:23  <tneo> I got a question :)
21:20:23  <Nite> oki then
21:20:24  <dih> and the bug is called 'desync'
21:20:24  <Gonozal_VIII> <-- you can find lots of bugs there
21:20:36  <tneo> What helps to make a city grow in game play?
21:20:40  <Gonozal_VIII> desyncs still happen?
21:20:57  <Gonozal_VIII> you already asked that today
21:21:00  <Belugas> and these are the servers in question :
21:21:43  <dih> visit
21:21:47  <Belugas> tneo : passengers/mail/goods
21:21:51  <Belugas> food
21:21:53  <Belugas> flowers
21:22:01  <Belugas> candies
21:22:06  <dih> and search for desync
21:22:08  <Belugas> coffee
21:22:11  <Belugas> no... that's for me
21:22:44  <Nite> i never noticed "many" desyncs at all in ottd
21:23:00  <tneo> Belugas, and are there certain conditions that will speed up the process e.g. placing stations "inside" gray paved area, amount of stops at station, etc. ?
21:23:14  <tneo> Does the chosen road layout matter for instance?
21:23:34  <Gonozal_VIII> i noticed a lot of them some time ago at revision 5000-8000 or something around those numbers
21:23:54  <Eddi|zuHause3> hmm... my autoreplace is failing...
21:23:55  <Belugas> nope to all the questions
21:24:02  <Belugas> not that i know, anyway :S
21:24:05  <Gonozal_VIII> they grow much better if you build roads for them
21:24:42  <Belugas> and dont forget to dance under the moonlit night
21:24:53  <Belugas> or is it on a volcano?
21:24:56  <Nite> ok it seems to be the "goto destination(depot) twice" bug
21:24:56  <Gonozal_VIII> ^^
21:24:57  <Eddi|zuHause3> ..with no clothes on :p
21:25:10  <Eddi|zuHause3> (but don't tell us)
21:25:22  <Nite> but happening constantly
21:25:24  <Belugas> and a broom in your...
21:25:25  <Gonozal_VIII> that's not a bug nite, that's just a misunderstood feature
21:25:25  <Belugas> hand
21:25:26  <tneo> Gonozal, is building roads the only thing (that you know) that will help?
21:26:00  <Eddi|zuHause3> tneo: you can finance office buildings
21:26:02  <Gonozal_VIII> no.. some bus stops and transport people around
21:26:31  <Gonozal_VIII> that extends the area where big buildings will appear for some time
21:26:44  <Nite> no its not
21:26:59  <Eddi|zuHause3> it also speeds up town growth for that time
21:27:00  <ln-> attention! i need name suggestions for a fork of FTE. <>
21:27:18  <Nite> when i order a train to go to depot and it has gone to depot it definately should go on with the next order, shouldnt it?
21:27:48  <Gonozal_VIII> it didn't go to depot because of that order but because it needed service
21:28:11  <Gonozal_VIII> then it continues with next order... no matter what that is
21:28:11  <Nite> you do not understand
21:28:31  <tneo> Gonozal_VIII So funding buildings, frequent bus stops and building roads will help to grow a city. And the more ppl you move around the faster it will grow?
21:28:36  <Belugas> nite, did you read my PM?
21:28:51  <Nite> no i didnt got a PM
21:29:01  <Belugas> look in tyou IRC client
21:29:06  <Eddi|zuHause3> tneo: no, the amount of stations you visit matters (up to 5), transported amount is irrelevant
21:29:09  <Gonozal_VIII> i don't know tneo
21:29:15  <Nite> (i use dana dont thinks it has PM)
21:29:26  <Belugas> ok...
21:29:27  <Belugas> wait
21:29:36  <Nite> ok found it
21:29:36  <Belugas> [16:15] <Belugas> I really meant what I said about putting your report to the forums
21:29:36  <Belugas> [16:16] <Belugas> unless you want to put it on Flyspray, but you should really really document it.
21:29:36  <Belugas> [16:16] <Belugas> like what was happening,
21:29:36  <Belugas> [16:16] <Belugas> what is now happeinig
21:29:36  <Belugas> [16:16] <Belugas> ways to reproduce it
21:29:37  <Belugas> [16:16] <Belugas> etc etc...
21:29:37  <Belugas> [16:16] <Belugas> otherwise, just on IRC, yo're pretty much screwed to oblivion
21:29:38  <dih> then get a decent irc client
21:30:05  <Belugas> dih... shhhuush
21:30:10  <Gonozal_VIII> and the roads don't really speed up the growth, they avoid places without road access inside the city where no houses can appear
21:30:11  <dih> ^^
21:30:39  <Nite> ok so irc might not be the right place for bugtracking
21:31:27  <Nite> whats the command for PM?
21:31:46  <tneo> Eddi|zuHause3 and those 5 stations need they have a certain frequency?
21:31:47  <Gonozal_VIII> it can be for easy to fix bugs or to find out if a bug is already known
21:32:22  <Eddi|zuHause3> tneo: yes, but i don't know the right number... like each month or each 3 months or so
21:32:30  <Nite> well i just wantet more ppl to know about it
21:32:33  <tneo> Ok thx guys :)
21:32:49  <Belugas> Nite, i dont know about command for PM on your client.
21:33:00  <Nite> idn honestly i dont like messages like "no thats not a bug yu just didnt understand taht feature"
21:33:37  <Nite> ok i thought there where a standrd irc one ... thx sry
21:33:46  <Belugas> IRC might be a good place to inquiry if the given bug is known or not.  But to actually fix it (if it is one), it's better to leave informations (as i mentioned) so it can be scrutinized later
21:34:05  <Belugas> 'cause we MAY not be in the right position to fix it...
21:34:08  <Belugas> like right now...
21:34:10  <Belugas> still at work
21:34:11  <Gonozal_VIII> well sorry... but there are a lot of people that report that their trains enter the depot for servicing and then enter it for the depot order, and that's not a bug
21:34:29  <Belugas> althoug I talk a lot on IRC for a working man...
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21:35:38  <Nite> yeah ok - for me, i know the difference betwenn service in depots and just goto depot refit and non stop ...
21:36:07  <Nite> but neither one works constantly in 0.6.0
21:36:34  <Belugas> you know, it may be a bug, but it may be that the previous behaviour has been changed to something else for this or that reason...
21:36:52  <Belugas> so that is why a decent bug report is required
21:37:44  <Nite> guess you cant call that a behaviour it messes up the whole order sequence
21:37:53  <Gonozal_VIII> with savegame, config, maybe screenshots, instructions to reproduce it, everything that could be useful to understand it
21:38:26  <Nite> because strangely trains dont skip to the next order but also dont go to the depot a second time right away
21:38:44  <Gonozal_VIII> then what else?
21:39:13  <Gonozal_VIII> do they have the possibility to turn around?
21:39:18  <Nite> first they drive out in thee blue, which is often behind some one way signal
21:39:39  <Nite> htey dont turn araound in stations so they could head to the depot again
21:40:15  <Gonozal_VIII> i'm not sure about that but i think they can only turn around at stations when they stop there
21:40:17  <Nite> nad oh yes its hard to bel9eive without havin seen it in action
21:40:54  <Belugas> therefor...
21:41:17  <Nite> true but they stop if they are not set to non stop anyways but dont turn raound to go to that already visitet but not "switched" depot
21:41:17  <Belugas> report the bug for examination
21:41:35  <Gonozal_VIII> and there's something about pathfinder doesn't like dead end bouncing
21:41:40  <Nite> all this its why i duiscus it here because its really hard to describe at once ...
21:42:09  <Belugas> well... if yuo grab your logs, you should have a lot already write ^)^
21:42:10  <Gonozal_VIII> i think i understand it now
21:42:23  <Gonozal_VIII> you need a loop somewhere for the trains to turn around
21:43:05  <Gonozal_VIII> or just activate service at for the depot order :-)
21:43:17  <Nite> could be an option - i found taht when im forcing them to turn around with the icon they alwas visited the depot a second time then swichting it also
21:44:15  <Nite> when i activate service at its teh same problem & tehy only use the order when theyr service intervall is "active"
21:44:50  <Nite> ("their" i kno i know )
21:44:52  <Gonozal_VIII> set the service interval to 10 and they will use it always..
21:45:02  <Gonozal_VIII> and they shouldn't go there twice then
21:45:13  *** fjb_ is now known as fjb
21:45:33  <Nite> if i set it to low they will always try to go there even when in the middle of theyr rout
21:45:40  <Nite> routE
21:45:46  <Gonozal_VIII> not with a service at order
21:45:51  <Nite> and this is something we also dont wonat
21:46:35  <Nite> you mean if they have a service at order they dont go to depot "by them self"?
21:46:42  <Gonozal_VIII> yep
21:46:47  <Nite> sure?
21:46:51  <Gonozal_VIII> quite
21:46:59  <Nite> kewl didnt know that
21:48:04  <Nite> still it would be nice they always skip the order if they visited the right depot ...
21:48:12  <Nite> i will try the service at
21:48:25  <Nite> .. again ...
21:48:48  <dih> a force option would be more interesting
21:48:57  <dih> i.e. goto regardless
21:49:10  * dih seecretly names his station 'regardless'
21:49:14  <Nite> i thought the simple goto would be force enough
21:49:23  <dih> apparently not
21:50:18  <Nite> well they go there but they dont notice/skip
21:50:18  <Gonozal_VIII> a normal depot order does force them to go there
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21:50:56  <Nite> guess its jsut a littel quirk with entering and exiting depots
21:51:36  * dih goes to try nite's setup
21:51:40  <Gonozal_VIII> no it's just them wanting service by themselves and then following the depot order
21:51:43  <Nite> they only switch to next order if they go in and are able to go aou right away
21:53:27  <Nite> the server where u could see the depot restartet aperently
21:54:07  <Nite> ah no still there
21:54:23  <Gonozal_VIII> hmmmm it skips duplicate orders
21:54:47  <Nite> there are no doubel/duplicate orders
21:54:48  <Gonozal_VIII> i have 10times go via waypoint bla and then service at depot
21:55:04  * Belugas goes home . good night all
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21:55:35  <Gonozal_VIII> when it reaches service interval while it's at the 5th pass (or something) at te waypoint it skips the rest to the depot order
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21:56:22  <Nite> even when i skip the orders manually it doues not work
21:58:31  <Nite> all that AI af the trains yust is wired thy yust should follow the orders one by one without asking
21:59:24  <Gonozal_VIII> that's what they do
21:59:31  <Nite> apperently not
21:59:38  <Gonozal_VIII> service interval servicing is not an order
22:00:10  <Nite> i have a look if i can turn intervalls off 100%
22:00:20  <Gonozal_VIII> yes, set it to 0
22:00:34  <Gonozal_VIII> but unfortunately you can do that only through default interval
22:00:52  <Nite> set to very high?
22:00:55  <Nite> i guess
22:01:00  <Gonozal_VIII> that should be made possible in the train details...
22:01:19  <Gonozal_VIII> 0.. that means disabled
22:01:19  <Nite> better in the patch settings
22:01:28  <Gonozal_VIII> it is in the patch settings
22:01:52  <Nite> true that would be an option to maybee prevent mayn pf quirks
22:01:52  <Gonozal_VIII> but you can set the service interval from 30-800 in the vehicle details... why not 0-800?
22:02:16  <Nite> dont ask me :D ?
22:02:25  <dih> Nite: the setup you described earlier works alright for me
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22:02:42  <Gonozal_VIII> it was an open question^^
22:03:33  <Nite> i see
22:04:11  <dih> so i have no idea what you did _exactly_
22:04:19  <dih> but what you described works
22:05:12  <Nite> you mean it works for you or the bug works
22:05:19  <Nite> ?
22:05:25  <dih> there is no bug
22:05:34  <Nite> aaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrgggggggggggghhhhhhhhh
22:05:41  <dih> same way as there is not spoon
22:05:52  <Nite> spoon?
22:06:37  <Prof_Frink> Name two films that contain the line "There is no spoon".
22:07:19  <murr4y> pulp fiction
22:07:21  <murr4y> citizen kane
22:07:22  * Rubidium ponders whether The Matrix is allowed as answer
22:07:37  <murr4y> oh and saw iv
22:07:43  <dih> Nite: and i just looked at my game server where you have a company
22:07:47  <dih> and it workes there too
22:07:57  <Nite> no it doesent
22:07:58  <dih> so i have no idea what you are going on about
22:08:05  <Nite> plz go there
22:08:08  <dih> watch train 9
22:08:11  <Rubidium> because it's "Imaging there is no spoon" and "There is no spoon" implies that there is the first word of the sentence
22:08:46  <Prof_Frink> Rubidium: Neo mumbles it later later.
22:08:59  <Nite> i do wathc and as u see its still trying to go to a depot is has already passed
22:09:07  <Prof_Frink> But you've not got the other one I was thinking of
22:10:20  <Nite> oki
22:11:18  <Nite> ill skip train 9 to Igualda forest
22:13:02  <Nite> i also skiped train 12 to taht
22:13:14  <Nite> now look
22:14:06  <fjb> Why do trains go round half the world instead of waiting a short time in front of a red signal? :-(
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22:14:26  <dih> it looks like 2 depots are being confused for eachother
22:14:26  <Gonozal_VIII> you can set that in the cfg
22:14:43  <fjb> Oh, where? What di I have to change?
22:14:57  <Gonozal_VIII> signal wait time
22:15:49  <Gonozal_VIII> wait_oneway_signal = 15
22:15:50  <Gonozal_VIII> wait_twoway_signal = 41
22:16:02  <Nite> so you saw that it doesent work now ??
22:16:31  <fjb> Gonozal_VIII: Thank you. What di the numbers mean?
22:16:42  <Gonozal_VIII> i think ticks
22:16:49  <Gonozal_VIII> or days
22:16:52  <Gonozal_VIII> or something
22:16:54  <Gonozal_VIII> ^^
22:17:38  <dih> Nite: you should hae
22:17:46  <fjb> Is that the time it should wait?
22:17:46  <dih> *have said that in the first place
22:17:53  <Nite> i should what?
22:18:01  <Gonozal_VIII> i had a strange bug looooooong ago where two depots seemed to be connected... a train could enter one of them and when you turned the train around then it teleported to the other depot
22:18:15  <dih> Rubidium: in the game it looks like 2 depots are being confused for eachother
22:18:16  <Nite> omg
22:18:18  <Gonozal_VIII> that's the default
22:18:29  <Nite> you mean fault
22:18:32  <Nite> ?
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22:18:55  <Nite> well so if i delet one depot it should work?
22:18:57  <Gonozal_VIII> i'm having different conversations at the same time nite
22:19:06  <Nite> i swear it worked in 5.3
22:19:19  <fjb> Gonozal_VIII: Do I have to set the numbers higher or lower?
22:19:40  <Gonozal_VIII> the name suggests higher
22:19:42  <Nite> i see but that depot connection thing fitet to my situation also
22:19:48  <dih> Nite: kill one of the depots and create a new one
22:20:01  <Gonozal_VIII> ask eddi, he changes that all the time
22:20:02  <dih> and then i hope you are using shared orders ^^
22:20:10  <Nite> i did create new ones -. and new orders - didnt help
22:20:21  <Nite> but itry it with just one now
22:21:35  <Nite> done that i get "lost tains"
22:21:49  <fjb> Eddi|zuHause3: What Do I have to set?
22:21:58  <Gonozal_VIII> lost or invalid order?
22:22:03  <Eddi|zuHause3> i change "first_twoway_eol" or something
22:22:23  <Gonozal_VIII> invalid order is normal, lost isn't
22:23:11  <Eddi|zuHause3> HAH, i found why my autoreplace failed...
22:23:20  <dih> it was disabled?
22:23:44  <Eddi|zuHause3> i made a group for my diesel passenger trains, and assigned a steam train there
22:23:49  <Nite> the lost train seems normal for me too it happens sometimes
22:23:59  <Eddi|zuHause3> then in that group i set a rule to replace the BR 18 with a V 200
22:24:20  <Eddi|zuHause3> but for "all trains" there was already a rule to replace BR 18 with BR 110
22:24:23  <fjb> Eddi|zuHause3: What value do you set for "first_twoway_eol" ?
22:24:29  <Eddi|zuHause3> fjb: false
22:25:30  <Eddi|zuHause3> fjb: it means "if the first signal is two-way and it is red, treat it like an end of line (do not search paths beyond this point)
22:25:59  <Eddi|zuHause3> so... apparently autoreplace barfed at these conflicting replacement rules
22:27:02  <Nite> ok train 3 went to depot but didnt advance to the next order - ie: sent to depot dont works
22:27:27  <Nite> same thing for 7
22:28:12  <Eddi|zuHause3> Nite: make a savegame, describe what to do with that savegame, and post it to
22:28:16  <Nite> again they dont go to depot again but try to go "somewhere else going once around the whole track"
22:28:53  <Nite> i saved but have to go now
22:29:03  <Gonozal_VIII> [23:25:30] Eddi|zuHause3: fjb: it means "if the first signal is two-way and it is red, treat it like an end of line (do not search paths beyond this point) <-- that's a good thing, i use that to route trains into waiting depots
22:29:17  <Nite> thanx for reading my not so good expieriences ...
22:29:20  <Nite> cya
22:29:21  <Gonozal_VIII> two way combo presignal
22:29:24  <Eddi|zuHause3> it's a bad thing, i don't have waiting depots
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22:30:59  <dih> savegames can be found at
22:30:59  <Gonozal_VIII> it's a bad thing that you don't have waiting depots
22:31:11  <dih> watching his trains is sufficient
22:32:41  *** Bjarni changed the topic of #openttd to: 0.5.3, 0.6.0-beta3 | Website: * (DevBlog: blog, Translator: translator2, Gameservers: servers, Nightly-builds: nightly, NightlyArchive: archive, WIKI: wiki, SVN mailinglist: maillist, Dev-docs: docs, Patches & Bug-reports: bugs) | #openttd.notice for FS + SVN notices | UTF-8 is mandatory | use English | no off topic YouTube links
22:34:30  <dih> night ladies
22:34:33  * dih is off to bed
22:34:39  <Gonozal_VIII> good idea
22:34:43  <Gonozal_VIII> i'll do that too
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22:36:24  <Gonozal_VIII> night
22:36:39  <Bjarni> ...
22:36:55  <Bjarni> why do you two leave for bed at the same time?
22:37:10  <Rubidium> same bed?
22:37:13  <Bjarni> that's the strangest reaction that I have ever seen to a release
22:38:03  <dih> diff is, i say good night but never manage to leave at the same time
22:38:25  <Bjarni> that is what you want us to believe
22:38:33  <dih> :-P
22:39:12  <dih> quick question
22:39:32  <dih> is there an easy way a config option does not by default get saved to the config file?
22:39:39  <dih> though if it's there gets loaded?
22:40:32  <glx> check how it's done for "blitter"
22:41:01  <dih> k - thanks for the keyword ^^
22:41:39  <dih> now then - good night ^^
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23:34:29  <Wolf01> 'night all
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