Log for #openttd on 15th March 2008:
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00:03:10  <Eddi|zuHause3> it is expensive when you call it multiple times per tick, but if you do it only on user input, it should be fine
00:03:34  <Eddi|zuHause3> there are similar functions that mark rectangles dirty
00:05:04  <TheJosh> I think this will be fine. Its only called when the number of owners of a company goes from 2 <-> 3 or 3 <-> 4
00:05:13  <TheJosh> very rare I would think
00:06:10  <Eddi|zuHause3> one suggestion was to have more smaller steps than 25%
00:06:16  <TheJosh> yes
00:06:19  <Eddi|zuHause3> like 10% or so
00:06:32  <TheJosh> I wrote a patch for that as well, but i canned it
00:07:20  <TheJosh> The problem was the GUI was bad, so it would only list 3 companies, but at 5% increments, all 8 companies can own some of the company
00:07:42  <TheJosh> Now it lists them all properly and resizes the window. thats the patch I just made
00:08:00  <TheJosh> are you a dev?
00:09:12  <Eddi|zuHause3> no
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00:20:15  <TheJosh> Ok i have made Improved Shares patch 1
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00:24:38  <Eddi|zuHause3> oh, and one probably important aspect of shares is that the company has to decide that it actually gives out shares
00:25:06  <TheJosh> all coming later
00:25:19  <TheJosh> but you make a good point. if to give out and how much to give out
00:25:44  <Eddi|zuHause3> and also important that shares don't cost nothing just because the company has loan
00:26:29  <TheJosh> Its going to use an actual share price at some point
00:26:38  <TheJosh> probably based on assets
00:27:04  <TheJosh> im/were gonna think up something funky to prevent share cheating
00:31:34  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: smatz * r12367 /trunk/src/network/network_data.cpp: -Fix [FS#1650](r707): commands were sent to clients waiting for map download causing 'executing command from the past' error
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00:35:55  <TheJosh> Patch now in FlySpray
00:39:04  <TheJosh> anyway im going now
00:39:07  <TheJosh> cya round all;
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00:55:29  <Guest1376> is it possible to rotate the map?
00:55:35  <SmatZ> no
00:56:04  <Guest1376> ok, thanks
00:56:08  <Sacro> Guest1376: yes
00:56:14  <Sacro> just times it by i
00:56:20  <Sacro> and it'll rotate by 90 degrees
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00:57:14  <Guest1376> Sacro: what does "times" mean? what to I press?
00:58:29  <Sacro> Guest1376: there's nothing in game you can press
00:58:33  <Sacro> it would need coding
00:58:37  <Sacro> and special physics
00:58:45  <Sacro> and possible an imaginaryInt
00:58:46  <SmatZ> and new sprites
00:59:01  <Guest1376> ah, square root of minus 1
00:59:12  <Guest1376> ok, thanks for the explanation
00:59:40  <Sacro> :)
00:59:50  <Sacro> wow, someone who understood my humour
01:00:23  <Gekz> llol
01:00:30  <SmatZ> :-D
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01:06:21  <Sacro> ZOMG
01:07:28  <SmatZ> rilly?
01:07:33  <Sacro> YEAH
01:07:34  <Sacro> :D
01:07:43  <Sacro>
01:08:26  <SmatZ> zomg :)
01:10:05  <SmatZ> "This content is .... unavailable"
01:10:12  <SmatZ> I don't understand that one word :-x
01:11:49  <SmatZ> ah
01:11:53  <SmatZ> currently!
01:11:54  <SmatZ> but why
01:14:28  <Sacro> uploading i guess
01:16:51  <roadfish> load me up Scottie
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01:23:22  <TheJosh> me back
01:23:47  <TheJosh> me gone again
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01:24:47  <Patrick`> good to know
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01:31:51  <isoenroi> hi
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01:55:09  <Eddi|zuHause2> <Sacro> and possible an imaginaryInt <- it's called a "Gaussian Plane"
01:56:30  <Eddi|zuHause2> Sacro: were you actually able to play this?
01:56:38  <Sacro> ?
01:56:43  <Eddi|zuHause2> the video
01:57:19  <Eddi|zuHause2> i was under the impression the american tv stations would block all non-american IPs from downloading their stuff
01:57:56  <Sacro> no
01:57:58  <Sacro> it didn't wor
01:58:01  <Sacro> *work
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02:02:45  <Eddi|zuHause2> hm... my capital is already level 4 culture while my other cities are just level 2...
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03:24:16  <TheJosh> hello all peoples
03:30:56  <Belugas> hey TheJosh
03:31:06  <Belugas> i saw your patch
03:31:11  <Belugas> looks very goog
03:31:21  <Belugas> only tiny problem i saw
03:31:39  <Belugas> do you have atext editor who can show you tabs and spaces?
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03:36:24  <Belugas> if you do, look at it using that feature
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03:36:51  <Belugas> you'll see that the patch as some rogue tabs, as well as some spaces where there should not be any
03:38:11  <TheJosh> oh i am sorry about the tabs and spaces
03:38:22  <TheJosh> do you want me to use sed to rip them out and then resubmit?
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03:41:10  <TheJosh> ah yes i found it the fourth to last line of the diff. im very dissapointed with myself :(
03:41:16  <Belugas> heheh  just a minor point, really...
03:41:44  <Belugas> as the rest is very top notch
03:42:01  <TheJosh> ill hack gedit to show me spaces and tabs :)
03:42:11  <Belugas> thing is, most patchers tend to not look at their patches before submitting them
03:42:55  <Belugas> for devs, it is a must, since we have this pre-commit hook that rejects work if eveer there is a trailing space
03:43:12  <Belugas> so, let say been picky on it is normal :D
03:43:25  <TheJosh> sorry that I missed that when i did my pre-submit checks
03:43:41  <Belugas> even commit mesages have tobe written in accordance to the rules ;)
03:43:56  <Belugas> no problem, TheJosh.  it's normal
03:44:08  <TheJosh> so will that patch get in sometime soon?
03:44:19  <TheJosh> not being pushy of course :P
03:46:50  <Belugas> of course not, you're not pushy at all ;)
03:47:04  <Belugas> i think it has some pretty good chances indeed
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03:48:11  <TheJosh> cool thanks
03:48:34  <Belugas> np
03:48:47  * Belugas searches for examples of contructors overrides
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03:55:56  * Belugas goes to bed
03:56:21  <Belugas> night/day/whatever-suits-you  all
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04:03:40  <Eddi|zuHause2> i take the night
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07:09:20  <Pinchiukas> what do you think about simutrans? why are there multiple games anyway?
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07:45:54  <Sionide> lol
07:46:00  <Sionide> market forces...
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08:55:45  <peter1138> TheJosh: there's already a plugin for gedit to show tabs & spaces.
08:56:46  <TheJosh> i was looking for ages for one because I heard about it and i couldnt find it
08:57:10  <peter1138> Makes it a bit slow on my PC though.
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08:57:44  <peter1138> This one is called "Draw Spaces"
08:57:52  <peter1138> I don't know where it came from though.
08:58:01  <peter1138> Sacro, Sacro, Sacro!
08:59:08  <hylje> Sacro! NewDrawSpaces!
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09:02:51  <peter1138> Vim's draw spaces at end of line is more useful, though.
09:03:58  <TheJosh> Devs, i have a page for you
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09:07:58  <TheJosh> someone said I should write what changes I plan of actually making, so that page has planned features and a simple roadmap
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09:10:38  <peter1138> Cool
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09:13:02  <TheJosh> anyway im off
09:13:05  <Draakon> greedings
09:13:05  <TheJosh> good night all
09:13:08  <TheJosh> hey
09:13:11  <TheJosh> good night
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09:48:41  <snappy> Hi, is there a way to play openttd in fullscreen?
09:48:59  <snappy> er nevermind -- alt+enter, i cant believe i didnt bother trying that until i joined this channel and asked heh.
09:50:41  <Draakon> happens
09:55:05  <peter1138> If you can't figure something out, ask a question. You're bound to figure it out 3 seconds later :D
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10:09:33  <Wolf01> hello
10:11:01  <peter1138> Hi.
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11:51:54  <jez9999> I have a question
11:52:19  <jez9999> has anyone written a patch that gives you the ability to set trains' service interval to 20 days, then say 'at any junction, if any turn leads to a service depot within 5 squares and it's been 20 days since your last service, take that junction and go to the service depot'
11:52:20  <jez9999> ?
11:52:51  <jez9999> basically i want to have a load of non-mandatory service depots scattered around, then have not all trains going in there, but doing so when they pass one 20 days after their last service
11:53:22  <Frostregen> the only thing which needs to be changed should be the "do i need to service?" check
11:53:46  <Frostregen> beeing called when entering a junction, instead of every day
11:54:10  <Alberth> couldn't you achieve the same effect by building enough depots along the line?
11:54:11  <Gonozal_VIII> hmm
11:54:23  <Gonozal_VIII> i don't think that's good
11:54:45  <Gonozal_VIII> lots of unneeded checks then
11:54:50  <Frostregen> less checks...
11:54:51  <Prof_Frink> jez9999: The potential problem with that is: it may be only five squares *to* the depot, but how many sqaures is it to get back to the mainline in the right direction?
11:54:55  <Gonozal_VIII> once a day is enough
11:55:23  <Frostregen> ok, depends on train speed
11:55:39  <Gonozal_VIII> you have to place your depots right or just use depot orders
11:55:41  <Alberth> Prof_Frink: Isn't that happening now as well?
11:56:40  <jez9999> prof: well i have service stations off the main track, like this:
11:56:48  <jez9999> so getting back on the main track wouldnt be a problem
11:56:53  <jez9999> maybe within 3 squares, i could say
11:56:55  <jez9999> it could be configurable
11:57:36  <Alberth> jez9999: What would happen with trains that never get at that junction?
11:57:52  <jez9999> i'd build enough juntions around the place (i already do) that all trains will pass at least 1
11:57:59  <jez9999> at the moment, they're mandatory
11:58:05  <jez9999> that's slowing things down with a lot of trains on the track
11:58:12  <Gonozal_VIII> that should work with the current system, no need to change
11:58:14  <jez9999> if each train had to go once every 20 days it would improve a lot
11:58:20  <jez9999> how would it work?
11:58:43  <Gonozal_VIII> you can't set service interval to 20... but 30 should be enough
11:59:37  <Gonozal_VIII> with the way you build that there they should automatically choose the next depot
12:00:10  <Frostregen> i would just leave it mandatory, but build it in a way which allows more throughput
12:00:32  <Alberth> could you elaborate on "slowing things down"? Maybe that can be fixed by a different layout
12:00:41  <Gonozal_VIII> yes, the sidetracks should at least be as long as the trains
12:01:08  <jez9999> Gonozal_VIII: the trouble with that is, if the next destination available to them is their next station, i want them to go to that even if they're due their next service
12:01:13  <Frostregen>
12:01:29  <jez9999> Gonozal_VIII: currently if they are past 30 days they won't go to the station, they'll turn around somewhere and waste time going to a depot
12:01:42  <jez9999> i want them to simply stop at the next station they get to when they're due their service
12:01:55  <Gonozal_VIII> you could give them service at orders for every depot along the line
12:02:41  <jez9999> Frostregen: well yeah but even with that, EVERY train has to slow down and service
12:02:50  <jez9999> the fact that they're having to service maybe too often slows them down
12:02:52  <Gonozal_VIII> not with service at orders
12:02:58  <Frostregen> you want them to service!?
12:03:05  <jez9999> every 20 days or so
12:03:22  <jez9999> but if i have lots of mandatory service depots, some will no doubt service too often
12:03:26  <jez9999> slowing them down
12:03:41  <Gonozal_VIII> use service at orders, change the signal direction on the straight track
12:03:52  <Gonozal_VIII> then everything should work fine
12:04:18  <jez9999> Gonozal_VIII: eh?  not really, the train will still service every time round
12:04:25  <jez9999> you don't want to have to specify 'service at' at all
12:04:26  <Gonozal_VIII> they will skip the service at order if they don't need it
12:04:28  <jez9999> just 'every 20 days'
12:04:35  <jez9999> oh
12:04:38  <jez9999> hmm didnt know that
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12:05:00  <jez9999> ok
12:05:11  <jez9999> so what we need is a patch that kind of automatically puts 'service at' orders in
12:05:20  <jez9999> difficult to write i suppose
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12:05:38  <Gonozal_VIII> don't be so lazy :P
12:05:49  <Frostregen> hmm, first thing would be some better breakdown code ;)
12:06:02  <Frostregen> (which resets on service. not on breakdown)
12:06:11  <jez9999> Frostregen: btw how tough do you think that bridge thing would be with the copy/paste patch?
12:06:32  <Gonozal_VIII> that bridge thing?
12:06:33  <Frostregen> not very hard
12:06:40  <Frostregen> just a fallback routine
12:06:56  <Frostregen> just some work fiddeling out the constraints
12:07:18  <jez9999> yeah
12:07:20  <jez9999> should be good
12:07:39  <jez9999> the bridges on my junctions are all so small anyway that any bridge type could be built for them
12:07:40  <Frostregen> but first comes this signal stuff
12:07:47  <Frostregen> nope
12:07:53  <Frostregen> there is a minimum length too
12:07:58  <jez9999> ah
12:07:58  <Gonozal_VIII> anyways, leave your tracks as they are, change signal direction on the straight track to allow them to pass through and add service at order for every depot they pass by and it should work just fine
12:08:29  <jez9999> Gonozal_VIII: i know but that's annyoyingly hard work ;-)  and requires me to update all trains orders if i add a service depot, very annoying
12:08:44  <jez9999> i have to figure out which trains are going past it, and add it to their orders
12:08:52  <Gonozal_VIII> don't you use shared orders?
12:09:03  <Gonozal_VIII> and/or groups
12:09:06  <jez9999> only for trains on the same route
12:09:52  <Frostregen> so just use mandatory, and live with some trains servicing too often ;)
12:10:02  <Gonozal_VIII> yep
12:10:03  <jez9999> which i do now
12:10:16  <jez9999> just be nice to have the functionality i specified above, it would be perfect
12:10:25  <jez9999> trains servicing at exactly the right time, but most passing straight thru
12:10:44  <Gonozal_VIII> i told you how to get that :P
12:10:51  <jez9999> without having to spacify manually ;-)
12:11:31  <Frostregen> high-throughput mandatory conserves train order, and train distance to each other. You never have a train slowing down another train due to servicing
12:11:37  <Gonozal_VIII> they do it on their own too, only problem there is that they don't check if they can reach their next destination if they service there
12:12:17  <jez9999> Frostregen: yeah but you have a train slowing down itself due to servicing ;-)  thanks for the diagram tho, i'll probably save a copy/paste of that
12:12:51  <Gonozal_VIII> anyways, servicing every 20 days seems to be way too much
12:13:06  <jez9999> yeah maybe 30
12:13:13  <jez9999> but the default of 150 is no good, breakdowns too often
12:13:19  <Frostregen> if my thought are correct this does not limit line throughput, just time needed to arrive
12:13:33  <Eddi|zuHause2> <Frostregen> but first comes this signal stuff <- wasn't your MiniIN version already capable of copying PBS signals?
12:13:33  <jez9999> time is everything :-)
12:13:34  <Gonozal_VIII> watch the reliability percentage
12:14:04  <Frostregen> throughput!
12:14:06  <Frostregen> :)
12:14:27  <Eddi|zuHause2> aesthetics!
12:14:29  <jez9999> Frostregen: it doesnt support PBS copying?
12:14:36  <jez9999> i have a copy/paste with PBS signals in it
12:14:38  <jez9999> is pastes ok
12:14:40  <jez9999> *it
12:15:39  <Frostregen> it is a basic problem...
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12:16:15  <Frostregen> signaltype are rebuilt by clicking ctrl+buildsignal
12:16:25  <Frostregen> a fixed number of times
12:16:43  <Frostregen> if you use the new pbs patch, you can change the cycle order
12:16:54  <Frostregen> thus corrupting my approach
12:17:26  <Frostregen> back then there was no functionality to build a given type directly
12:17:34  <Eddi|zuHause2> hm... you could change that cycle temporarily
12:17:36  <Frostregen> this has been introduced by signal-gui
12:17:53  <Frostregen> so it is no problem now
12:17:55  <Gonozal_VIII> directly is better than cycling
12:17:59  <Frostregen> yep
12:18:10  <Gonozal_VIII> only one command :-)
12:18:12  <Frostregen> i just need to do it ;)
12:18:12  <Eddi|zuHause2> yeah, it is probably the better approach ;)
12:18:21  <Eddi|zuHause2> but i understand that your patch is older ;)
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12:32:19  <jez9999> omg, i just paid 1.1million to 'prospect' for a coal mine and... nothing happpened
12:32:38  <jez9999> does it just take 1.1 million if you cant build one?  surtely prospecting should be a lot cheaper
12:32:40  <Eddi|zuHause2> that is the point of prospecting
12:32:46  <mrfrenzy> not all prospects work out in the end ;)
12:33:03  <jez9999> that's incredibly expensive for prospecting though, building i can understand but prospecting should be like 1/10th of the price
12:33:08  <jez9999> otherwise it's never going to be worth it
12:33:25  <Eddi|zuHause2> are you kidding? building is the cheapest of all
12:33:29  <pax``> Is there a way to make openttd run in a particular resolution? It's not comfortable to run 800x600 and 1024*768 is too much in height for my widescreen monitor to play in a window
12:33:35  <Eddi|zuHause2> finding the ressources is the expensive part
12:34:30  <Eddi|zuHause2> pax``: "resolution = 1680,988" in the .cfg
12:34:31  <Frostregen> pax: just resize the window?
12:34:46  <Eddi|zuHause2> but i just maximise the window
12:35:23  <pax``> doh >.<
12:35:38  <pax``> Should've tried the most obvious before asking >.<
12:35:49  <Eddi|zuHause2> that is common these days ;)
12:36:53  <pax``> Weird though, I remember trying resizing and that it wouldn't work... Now it has quirks but works... Maximising works great though
12:37:05  <peter1138> Quirks?
12:37:25  <pax``> The screen starts flickering while resizing
12:37:49  <pax``> Nevermind it's not an issue now that I've been introduced to the mighty maximise button >.<
12:39:53  <Frostregen> hm, yapp changes meaning of CmdBuildSingleSignal p1 bit 7
12:40:46  <Frostregen> so there can't be one version of my code for both :(
12:42:19  <pax``> Is there something besides the visual difference of having either 2 railstations one beside the other and one large with 2 railroads in it?
12:42:44  <Frostregen> catchment
12:43:31  <Frostregen> and trains cannot choose the other station
12:45:47  <pax``> Hmm... Choose as in when they try to pathfind? Catchment as in how far the station can transfer goods to/from?
12:46:00  <Frostregen> both yes
12:46:48  <Frostregen> if you order a train to load at a station, it will use any free platform of exactly this station
12:47:05  <Frostregen> it will never use a platform of an adjacent but different station
12:48:01  <Frostregen> this is useful for separating loading bays at farms for example. (one for grain, one for cattle)
12:48:28  <Gonozal_VIII> waypoints :-)
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12:49:15  <Frostregen> yes, i use waypoints too
12:49:22  <Gonozal_VIII> but waypoints on a diagonal line suck, there should be diagonal waypoints
12:49:30  <Frostregen> but nonetheless it is a possibility ;)
12:49:50  <Frostregen> definitely
12:49:51  <SmatZ> and diagonal stations
12:50:00  <SmatZ> and diagonal roads
12:50:05  <SmatZ> and diagonal tunnels and bridges
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12:50:29  <Gonozal_VIII> ye
12:50:29  <Gonozal_VIII> s
12:50:39  <pax``> Just make 3d non-tile based ttd and get it over with =p
12:50:43  <SmatZ> :-P
12:50:45  <Gonozal_VIII> hehe, hexagonal tiles
12:50:56  <Eddi|zuHause2> <Gonozal_VIII> but waypoints on a diagonal line suck, there should be diagonal waypoints <-- problem is, you need two waypoints on the same tile
12:51:25  <Gonozal_VIII> you could disallow that...
12:51:29  <Prof_Frink> Or, do away with phyical waypoints altogether
12:51:47  <Prof_Frink> "Go via 125,482"
12:51:52  <Gonozal_VIII> hmmm
12:51:53  <SmatZ> like locomotion
12:52:15  <Gonozal_VIII> rather make them like routemarkers
12:52:59  <Gonozal_VIII> that would be best imho, then you could place them on every tile, even on one with signals
12:53:37  <Eddi|zuHause2> what _i_ need with waypoints is conditional destionations... "go via 'Platform 1' OR 'Platform 3'"
12:53:56  <Eddi|zuHause2> [whichever is free]
12:54:25  <Gonozal_VIII> that could be done with connected waypoints...
12:54:41  <Eddi|zuHause2> only if i want to have fixed sets
12:54:51  <Gonozal_VIII> hmm yes
12:55:28  <Eddi|zuHause2> i could want to send another train to "'Platform 3' OR 'Platform 4'"
12:55:44  <Eddi|zuHause2> the number of combinations is exponential
12:55:45  <Prof_Frink> Or, on the coord-system, be able to drag a rectangle as a waypoint - "Go via 125,482:126,473"
12:56:19  <Eddi|zuHause2> rectangle wouldn't be enough to say "every odd platform"
12:56:48  <Prof_Frink> Yeah, you'd need to be able to use arbitrary shapes
12:57:28  <Gonozal_VIII> 125,482:126,473;130,482
12:57:39  <Gonozal_VIII> with the ; as or :-)
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12:58:32  <Eddi|zuHause2> i'd still prefer a textual representation of the waypoint
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12:59:45  <Gonozal_VIII> trackbits would be needed too...
13:00:06  <Eddi|zuHause2> don't go there ;)
13:00:12  <Frostregen> [13:53:43] <Prof_Frink> "Go via 125,482" -> or make it an area
13:00:21  <Gonozal_VIII> it's quite different to use the right or the left track
13:00:29  <Prof_Frink> Frostregen: [12:55:44] < Prof_Frink> Or, on the coord-system, be able to drag a rectangle as a waypoint - "Go via 125,482:126,473"
13:01:26  <Frostregen> ah, just read it
13:01:27  <Frostregen> sry
13:04:56  <Sacro> >< why is x-chat widescreening my text
13:05:02  <Sacro> ITS A 16:9 SCREEN DAMNIT
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13:07:55  <pax``> valuables are only transportable between banks?
13:08:11  <Prof_Frink> correct
13:08:31  <pax``> =( There's only one bank on the map right now...
13:08:32  <Gonozal_VIII> and ecs tourist centers
13:09:08  <Eddi|zuHause2> there is also a minimum distance to discourage transporting back to the same bank
13:11:47  <jez9999> hmm
13:12:01  <jez9999> is there a patch that allows mass-upgrading of railroad trains to monorail trains?
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13:12:23  <Frostregen> i don't think so
13:12:24  <jez9999> maybe something like, when you convert track type on a depot, it upgrades all train engines inside to the best possible monorail vehicle?
13:12:35  <jez9999> otherwise it's virtually impossible to convert a large network's track type
13:12:35  <jez9999> :-\
13:12:58  <Frostregen> it just takes one or two years
13:13:02  <Frostregen> ;)
13:13:17  <mrfrenzy> problem for me is finding a good grf set that has trains for all cargo on all traintypes
13:13:46  <Gonozal_VIII> are there even grf sets with monorail?
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13:14:08  <Eddi|zuHause2> jez9999: problem is, the wagons also have to be converted
13:14:57  <Frostregen> since speed changes you have to accomodate for less needed trains anyway
13:15:04  <pax``> Will it make a city grow larger if I only transfer passangers to it, one way?
13:15:10  <jez9999> one or 2 years?
13:15:14  <jez9999> not likely, i have 90 trains
13:15:19  <jez9999> unless you mean 1 or 2 years of real time :-D
13:15:29  <Frostregen> nope, you just need a good system
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13:15:51  <jez9999> what good system?
13:16:02  <Frostregen> send all trains to depot. then go to all loading stations, one after another.
13:16:08  <Frostregen> click on trainlist
13:16:30  <Gonozal_VIII> keep one train of every shared orders group, send it to a depot, sell it, upgrade depot, buy a new train
13:16:43  <Frostregen> build a maglev/mono train which will replace those, then clone enough and start them
13:17:00  <jez9999> erm...
13:17:05  <jez9999> and how do you get them to run on railtrack
13:17:18  <Gonozal_VIII> you don't
13:17:21  <Frostregen> convert the track first
13:17:26  <Eddi|zuHause2> the system is very easy... build new depot next to old depot, open both windows
13:17:28  <Gekz> someone
13:17:29  <Frostregen> (after sending to depot)
13:17:30  <Gekz> wake me up
13:17:45  <Eddi|zuHause2> (build new train, share/copy orders with old train, sell old train)*
13:18:12  <Frostregen> eddi: this approach takes more time, since you need to check all depots
13:18:23  <Frostregen> and replace every single train
13:18:41  <Prof_Frink> Eddi|zuHause2: compare ttdpatch: upgrade depot, sell train, buy train, buy wagons, go
13:18:45  <Eddi|zuHause2> well, you have a list of all trains
13:18:54  <jez9999> frost: on many loading stations, i have several different train types
13:18:58  <jez9999> this complicates things greatly
13:19:07  <Frostregen> hmm, ok
13:19:07  <Eddi|zuHause2> Prof_Frink: i think there was a patch that allowed this
13:19:14  <jez9999> nah, i need to write some patch that autoconverts trains in depots when upgrading track type
13:19:14  <jez9999> sigh
13:19:23  <Gonozal_VIII> prof frink, it's almost the same in open
13:19:41  <Gonozal_VIII> sell train, upgrade depot, buy train, train has old orders
13:19:59  <jez9999> you should always have an equivalent engine and wagon for each type of old engine and wagon, shouldn't you?
13:20:06  <Frostregen> hehe
13:20:07  <Eddi|zuHause2> Gonozal_VIII: only works with only one train inside the depot
13:20:14  <Eddi|zuHause2> jez9999: no
13:20:20  <jez9999> when wouldnt you?
13:20:24  <Eddi|zuHause2> some sets disallow freight transportation with maglev
13:20:32  <Gonozal_VIII> that's why i said keep one of each shared orders group
13:20:41  <Eddi|zuHause2> only allow passengers/mail/goods/valuables
13:21:07  <jez9999> Eddi|zuHause2: well presumably you could detect that there is no equivalent?
13:21:17  <jez9999> in that case just popup an error saying 'couldnt convert all trains'
13:21:45  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: smatz * r12368 /trunk/ (7 files in 2 dirs): -Codechange: use explicit body for loops and conditions and remove -Wno-empty-body from the configure script
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13:22:54  <Eddi|zuHause2> jez9999: the problem is more fundamental, see
13:23:12  <Eddi|zuHause2> it would be the same with replacing rail->maglev
13:23:26  <Frostregen> or maybe you would have to specify a replacement for each existing engine/wagon combo, before conversion
13:24:03  <Frostregen> (just those which are currently used ingame)
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13:24:36  <Eddi|zuHause2> Frostregen: link also applies to you
13:24:52  <jez9999> Frostregen: damn newGRF :-)
13:25:01  <jez9999> well i dont use newgrf, so i'd probably just write s patch for the default stuff
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13:25:28  <Yorick> hello
13:25:28  <Eddi|zuHause2> jez9999: just don't expect this to get into any official build ;)
13:25:44  <jez9999> the buggy current autoreplace is in the official build
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13:26:05  <Yorick> true
13:26:06  *** X3ryusTC is now known as XeryusTC
13:26:17  <Frostregen> eddi: no, i said "specify a replacement for any used train/wagon combo beforehand"
13:26:43  <Eddi|zuHause2> it's a bjarnism, that is no comparison ;)
13:27:04  <Eddi|zuHause2> Frostregen: still, replacing happens one by one
13:27:10  <jez9999> what is a DMU?
13:27:20  <Prof_Frink> diseasel multiple unit
13:27:28  <Frostregen> and?
13:27:38  <jez9999> what does multiple unit mean?
13:27:40  <Eddi|zuHause2> 1. replace engine
13:27:47  <Eddi|zuHause2> 2. try to apply wagons to engine
13:27:50  <Eddi|zuHause2> 3. fail!!
13:28:02  <Eddi|zuHause2> [4. replace first wagon ...]
13:28:36  <Frostregen> this is the current autoreplace system
13:28:57  <Eddi|zuHause2> yes,
13:28:59  <Frostregen> not the one which would be needed for semi-auto tracktype conversion
13:29:18  <Eddi|zuHause2> problem is that you cannot test multiple replacements in a row
13:29:22  <Frostregen> which would have an exact target consist, for every given consist
13:29:27  <Eddi|zuHause2> and rollback in case it fails
13:29:37  <Eddi|zuHause2> no, that is not needed
13:29:41  <glx> autoreplace needs yet another full rewrite
13:29:47  <jez9999> hmm, is there, like, 1 function that's currently used for autoreplace?
13:29:56  <jez9999> i'm just thinking that this functionality could just hook into that
13:30:01  <jez9999> then when autoreplace is fixed this will be too
13:30:02  <Eddi|zuHause2> it would also be overcomplicated to specify complete consists
13:30:02  <Yorick> grep -r "autoreplace" * ;)
13:30:23  <Eddi|zuHause2> and still there is no way to replace more than one single vehicle at a time [command wise]
13:30:37  <Maedhros> Yorick: you'd probably want a -i in there, too ;)
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13:31:13  <Yorick> noone writes "AutoReplace"...
13:31:27  <glx> autorenew uses autoreplace too
13:31:59  <jez9999> when you convert a depot's railtype, it can check to see if any stopped rail vehicles are there
13:32:06  <jez9999> if they are, it can hook into the autoreplace for each of them
13:32:18  <jez9999> somehow figuring out an equivalent replacement engine and wagon for the new track type :-)
13:32:22  <Maedhros> glx: out of interest, how many rewrites has autoreplace already had?
13:32:31  <glx> 3 IIRC
13:32:35  <Maedhros> heh
13:33:00  <Eddi|zuHause2> Frostregen: what is needed is a vehicle sandbox, where you can assemble the new train without money-constraints, then test if the consist can be started, then test if the money suffices
13:33:01  <glx> Bjarni's style ;)
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13:34:11  <Eddi|zuHause2> jez9999: not needed, you can just upgrade the depot, and then use the "replace" button in the depot to upgrade the trains
13:34:41  <Eddi|zuHause2> only disallow all trains that are not of the correct railtype to be started
13:35:00  <Eddi|zuHause2> [which should already be implemented]
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13:35:48  <jez9999> Eddi|zuHause2: you cant upgrade the depot with trains of a different track type inside?
13:35:57  <jez9999> you get 'train in the way'
13:36:09  <Eddi|zuHause2> jez9999: that is a one-liner ;)
13:36:19  <jez9999> "disallow all trains that are not of the correct railtype to be started"
13:36:22  <jez9999> hmm, interesting idea
13:36:29  <Frostregen> hmm
13:36:30  <glx> like you can't upgrade a track with a running train
13:36:49  <jez9999> but depots are fundamentally different
13:36:59  <jez9999> trains 'disappear' inside a depot
13:37:02  <glx> they are tracks internaly
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13:37:09  <jez9999> yeah, thought they might be :-\
13:37:19  <Eddi|zuHause2> glx: afaik rail->electric is allowed with train
13:37:32  <glx> only for depots
13:37:38  <jez9999> no
13:37:45  <jez9999> i've upgraded rail-electric with tracks
13:38:43  <glx> jez9999: and you may have missing catenries
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13:39:25  <SmatZ> no
13:39:30  <SmatZ> it just works
13:39:31  <Eddi|zuHause2> it was disallowed in the beginning, but there were too many complaints
13:39:35  <Eddi|zuHause2> so it got allowed
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13:57:34  <jez9999> another thing i wanted to ask
13:58:01  <jez9999> has anyone written a patch to filter out companies on the 'view company-coloured stuff' map?
13:58:56  <jez9999> ie. when you go onto the map and view the 'land owners' option, you can select which company's land gets coloured
14:04:22  <Eddi|zuHause2> you mean similar to filtering industries?
14:04:31  <Eddi|zuHause2> that should be easy
14:05:09  <jez9999> yep
14:05:24  <jez9999> seemed quite obvious given the industry filtering so i wondered if anyone had written a patch for it
14:05:33  *** planetmaker [~chatzilla@] has joined #openttd
14:05:39  <Eddi|zuHause2> i have not seen it
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14:09:32  <Gonozal_VIII>
14:09:52  <Gonozal_VIII> they forgot the fireball
14:10:08  <SmatZ> :-D
14:10:13  *** helb [~helb@] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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14:11:07  <Gekz> would you rather be a large man with a small penis, or a small man with a large penis?
14:11:23  <Eddi|zuHause2> wrong question
14:11:26  <Gonozal_VIII> wtf?^^
14:11:41  <Gekz> answer it
14:11:46  <SmatZ> I don't get why he has 2 helmets on his head
14:11:57  <Gekz> >__>
14:12:01  <Gonozal_VIII> because it's xtra dangerous there
14:12:04  <SmatZ> at 01:39
14:12:07  <SmatZ> :-D
14:12:24  *** divo [] has joined #openttd
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14:12:57  *** Link [] has joined #openttd
14:13:04  <Link> Hey
14:13:18  <Eddi|zuHause2> i found the missing Link
14:13:22  <Link> :O
14:13:42  <SmatZ> between "apes" and human?
14:13:51  <Gonozal_VIII> isn't that the zelda guy?
14:13:51  *** Yorick [] has joined #openttd
14:14:09  <Link> yes im from zelda
14:14:12  <Link> nvm
14:14:34  * SmatZ doesn't mind
14:14:38  <Link> i actually heard this name before i found it that there was a game called zelda...
14:14:44  <Link> well
14:14:47  <Gonozal_VIII> i never mindeded at all
14:15:05  <Yorick> I think the whole chatting stuff should be redone...e.g. [all] chat and other chat types seperated, colors
14:15:24  <Link> Is there anywhere i can find a manual for rail lights ? :P
14:15:36  <Yorick>
14:15:40  <Gonozal_VIII> when they are green, trains move
14:15:42  <Eddi|zuHause2> in the wiki?
14:15:43  <Link> it always gets fucked up when i use them..
14:15:49  <SmatZ> :-D
14:16:10  <Eddi|zuHause2> use the yapp signals, they are much more natural ;)
14:16:37  <Yorick> how about redrawing the LA window when the rating changes :o
14:16:57  <Maedhros> this is one of the best guides i've seen - (though it is a bit ttdp-specific at times)
14:17:01  <Eddi|zuHause2> Yorick: provide a patch ;)
14:17:06  <Link> oh its called signal not rail lights ^^
14:17:57  * Yorick wants that programmable signals
14:18:47  <Link>
14:18:51  <Link> woot ? O.o
14:19:17  <SmatZ> :-P
14:19:50  <Yorick> ")
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14:25:17  <Eddi|zuHause2> you have strange eyes
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14:26:31  <DEFACKTwalker> hi all
14:26:47  <DEFACKTwalker> is anyome here?
14:27:12  <Yorick> no
14:27:23  <DEFACKTwalker> ...
14:27:24  <Yorick> and the 103 others aren't here either
14:27:25  <murr4y> no i haven't seen anyome in a while
14:27:41  *** nzvip [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
14:27:54  <Yorick> 102*
14:28:41  <DEFACKTwalker> okay, cYa
14:28:51  *** DEFACKTwalker [] has quit []
14:28:53  <BrDead> ...
14:29:06  <Yorick> :D
14:32:55  <Eddi|zuHause2> this is ever so funny ;)
14:33:07  <Eddi|zuHause2> "hi, is this the maths channel, where you can ask about maths?"
14:33:19  <Eddi|zuHause2> "no, this is a CS-Clan channel called 'maths'"
14:33:23  <Eddi|zuHause2> "ok, bye"
14:35:44  <BrDead> I just can't understand why there are so many ircnets for open source communities, isn't just one enough?
14:36:20  <BrDead> I knew freenode already, I heard about OFTC first time when I joined here :)
14:36:33  <BrDead> and probably there are many others too
14:37:38  <SmatZ> BrDead: maybe #oftc is a good place where to ask
14:37:54  <Eddi|zuHause2> this "isn't just one enough" comes up ever so often all over the place
14:38:15  <Eddi|zuHause2> openttd vs. ttdpatch
14:38:19  <Eddi|zuHause2> gnome vs. kde
14:38:29  <Eddi|zuHause2> oftc vs. freenode
14:38:39  <Yorick> freenode vs. devnode
14:38:44  <hylje> vim is superior
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14:38:57  <Eddi|zuHause2> yes, i was getting to that ;)
14:39:00  <SmatZ> yay notepad!
14:39:23  <BrDead> SmatZ: maybe, I was just wondering... :)
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14:39:58  <BrDead> I'm not a linux geek but maybe that's the reason why I can't find that so reasonable :)
14:40:46  <SmatZ> BrDead: it has a good side - IRC servers limit the number of channels you can join...
14:40:57  <SmatZ> when you are at more networks, you can join more channels :)
14:41:08  <Yorick> they do?!
14:41:30  <SmatZ> Yorick: yes, at least quakenet had limit ~25 channels
14:41:41  <SmatZ> I don't remember, but I know I reached it...
14:41:53  <SmatZ> though you can connect under multiple nicks :)
14:42:41  <Yorick> they block that for my IP
14:42:45  <BrDead> SmatZ: yeah, but I think that if you have a need to join more than 25 channels you might have some other problems too than that :D
14:43:32  <BrDead> meaning that in that point getting a life would be a better solution :)
14:43:44  <SmatZ> BrDead: well... probably it is this way for historical reasons (that I don't know :-)
14:44:11  <BrDead> SmatZ: in most cases that's the way
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14:44:34  <Yorick> what happenes if I do p->Recv_uint8(); while there isn't anything to Recv anymore?
14:44:35  <Eddi|zuHause2> <SmatZ> though you can connect under multiple nicks :) <- except if you use t-online ;)
14:44:42  <Yorick> or wanadoo
14:45:36  <SmatZ> Yorick: probably it will wait
14:46:12  <Yorick> hmm
14:46:25  <Yorick> is there any way to check if there is anything to recv then?
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14:47:44  <SmatZ> most likely there is
14:52:04  <SmatZ> NetworkReceive() uses select()
14:52:08  <SmatZ> with zero timeout
14:52:39  <SmatZ> to check if there is any packet waiting
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15:04:31  <Yorick> I just broke something
15:04:53  <Gonozal_VIII> use a cast
15:05:13  <Yorick> I broke everything that has to do with PACKET_CLIENT_SET_NAME
15:05:31  <Yorick> and I'm not sure about the cause yet
15:05:43  <Yorick> the client list just fails with a spritecache error
15:05:48  <Gonozal_VIII> cast
15:05:51  <Gonozal_VIII> :-)
15:06:36  <Gonozal_VIII> that's what you use if something is broken
15:06:41  *** a1270 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:06:58  <Yorick> it fails to transmit the first char
15:07:14  <Eddi|zuHause2> yeah, just cast everything to void* and you never have type errors anymore ;)
15:07:44  <Yorick> it swapped the name and the language somehow, I think
15:07:54  <Yorick> how much can a packet actually contain?
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15:08:20  <Yorick> a char[80] and uint8?
15:08:31  <Eddi|zuHause2> truebrain is the network expert, i believe
15:08:37  <Yorick> and not here
15:08:50  <Eddi|zuHause2> @seen truebrain
15:08:50  <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause2: truebrain was last seen in #openttd 4 weeks, 5 days, 16 hours, 14 minutes, and 39 seconds ago: <TrueBrain> night :)
15:09:13  <Yorick> now try /whois TrueBrain on the other hand
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15:13:31  <Alberth> Yorick: I think it can; it depends on the MTU, which is for my eth0 1500
15:14:18  <Alberth> Yorick: although I don't know whether that number includes or excludes checksums etc
15:14:28  <Yorick> so it could be not-possible?
15:15:58  <Eddi|zuHause2> MTU should have nothing to do with it... larger high-level packets are just split into several low-level packets
15:16:38  <Alberth> Wikipedia says it is without, ie you have MTU bytes available for use
15:16:55  <Alberth> Eddi: Not if you are using UDP
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15:17:51  <Yorick> using TCP
15:17:56  <Eddi|zuHause2> you deserve a giant slap for this unqualified statement
15:18:09  * Yorick slaps Alberth's bottom and grins cheekily
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15:18:44  <Alberth> Auts!
15:20:05  <Alberth> Well, you started over packet sizes... :P
15:20:48  <Yorick> because it fails
15:20:56  <Alberth> s/over/talking about/
15:22:29  <Eddi|zuHause2> # Der Wolf, das Lamm ... HURZ
15:22:57  <Yorick> :o wait-wrong order of recv-ing
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15:23:56  <Alberth> So the network is byte order-preserving :)
15:24:51  <Yorick> true
15:26:12  <glx> and it is endian safe too
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15:27:28  <Eddi|zuHause2> a friend of mine had huge endian issues when trying to construct a CRC for his packet (on an FPGA)
15:27:37  <Eddi|zuHause2> he somehow had to reverse the bytes
15:27:53  <Eddi|zuHause2> and then he had to reverse the bits in each nibble
15:28:03  <Prof_Frink> Eddi|zuHause2: Huge Endian? Is that like Big Endian, but biggerer?
15:28:20  <Eddi|zuHause2> yes, bigerererer
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15:29:49  *** anhedral is now known as dih
15:31:09  <Yorick> hello dih
15:31:49  <dih> hell... oh
15:31:54  <dih> ^^
15:32:12  <Yorick> :(
15:33:08  * dih pats yorick on the head
15:33:10  <dih> there there
15:33:16  <dih> it'll all be over soon
15:33:58  <Yorick> I don't know what to think of that :o
15:34:36  <dih> LOL
15:35:10  <Eddi|zuHause2> # Wenn frÌh am Morgen die Werkssirene dröhnt
15:35:10  <Eddi|zuHause2> # und die Stechuhr beim Stechen lustvoll stöhnt.
15:35:10  <Eddi|zuHause2> # In der Montagehaale die Neonsonne strahlt,
15:35:10  <Eddi|zuHause2> # und der Gabelstaplerfahrer mit der Stapelgabel prahlt.
15:35:24  <Yorick> | And English only
15:35:33  <Eddi|zuHause2> # Ja dann wird wieder in die HÀnde gespuckt,
15:35:33  <Eddi|zuHause2> # wir steigern das Bruttosozialprodukt
15:36:13  <dih> ^^
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15:38:21  <Yorick> if (ci->client_name != client_name) { <-- this check at DEF_SERVER_RECEIVE_COMMAND(PACKET_CLIENT_SET_NAME) somehow fails
15:38:21  <Eddi|zuHause2> s/aa/al/
15:38:44  <Eddi|zuHause2> comparing strings by addresses?
15:38:57  <SmatZ> :)
15:38:57  <LordAzamath> hellllo
15:39:08  <SmatZ> hi LordAzamath
15:39:18  <Yorick> hello
15:39:23  <Gonozal_VIII> hehe funny translation
15:41:12  <Yorick> would strcmp work therE?
15:41:27  <Eddi|zuHause2> str<something>cmp
15:41:54  <Yorick> <something>?
15:42:03  <Tefad> r?
15:42:22  <Eddi|zuHause2> there are a million different versions...
15:43:25  <Yorick> doesn't strcmp just work?
15:43:41  <Eddi|zuHause2> Gonozal_VIII: sounds like a google translation or something ;)
15:43:48  <Gonozal_VIII> yep
15:43:56  <Gonozal_VIII> there are even words left untranslated^^
15:45:44  <Eddi|zuHause2> but it's surely one of the greatest songs ever ;)
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16:00:27  <UnderBuilder> I tried to enter maarten's server and I get connection lost in joining
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16:05:06  <Rubidium> sounds like a sucky connection somewhere
16:05:21  <UnderBuilder> mine is 256k down
16:05:44  *** Zavior [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:07:01  <Rubidium> sucky being lots of dropped packets and such
16:07:42  * Gonozal_VIII drops a packet at rubidiums head
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16:08:41  *** Gonozal_VIII is now known as Guest1455
16:08:41  *** Gonozal is now known as Gonozal_VIII
16:09:07  <Gonozal_VIII> dropping packets is bad for the connection...
16:09:21  <glx> lol
16:10:28  <Gonozal_VIII> woa, sp season 12
16:10:56  <Gonozal_VIII>
16:12:11  <Eddi|zuHause2> oooold
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16:21:34  <Devedse> HEY
16:21:35  <Devedse> all
16:21:43  <Devedse> can someone help me with setting up a server
16:21:58  *** Zaviori [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
16:22:21  <Devedse> some1 here?
16:22:23  <Devedse> :)
16:23:46  * SpComb yawns
16:23:50  <Devedse> hey
16:24:01  <Devedse> can u help me with setting up a server
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16:24:29  <Devedse> can someone help me a litle setting up a server
16:24:51  <SmatZ> Devedse: don't ask to ask, ask
16:24:52  <SmatZ> :)
16:25:01  <Devedse> huh wot O_O
16:25:03  <SmatZ> somebody could know
16:25:08  <SmatZ> just ask your question
16:25:11  <Devedse> k :)
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16:25:58  <Devedse> i want to run a server with the cfg file: c:/ded.cfg and that automatically loads the saved file: c:/ttdsave/online.sav. de server should nevah reset or something and only be private for me and my friend
16:26:26  <yorick> oh
16:26:31  <Devedse> so it has to be protected with the password (lets say): hello
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16:29:03  <Devedse> ah man i post it on the form
16:29:07  <Devedse> forum
16:29:09  <Devedse> no one is here ;(
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16:29:58  <yorick> no, you don't ask anything
16:29:59  <SpComb> patience is undervalued
16:30:46  <Purno> yo yorick
16:30:55  <yorick> hello Purno
16:31:27  <Purno> are you able / willing to host a 24/7 openttd server in future?
16:31:40  <yorick> willing: yes, able: no
16:31:43  <Purno> ok
16:32:21  <yorick> why do you ask?
16:32:32  <Purno>
16:32:54  <Rubidium> yorick: reading with (packet)->Recv_* when there is nothing left in the packet will terminate the connection
16:33:30  <yorick> :o
16:35:00  <yorick> how to check?
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16:35:39  <Rubidium> well, if you don't know the data that is in the packet there's something wrong with the protocol (imo)
16:36:11  <yorick> I want to check if clients are patched or not
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16:36:31  <Eddi|zuHause2> bad idea
16:36:38  <Eddi|zuHause2> patch all clients or none
16:36:57  <yorick> thats not always possible
16:37:41  <Eddi|zuHause2> yes it is, just include the patch in the official build ;)
16:37:56  <yorick> thats not always possible
16:38:29  <Eddi|zuHause2> it is for patches that make sense ;)
16:38:39  <yorick> now some don't
16:39:26  <yorick> like distributing grf's, makes sense, but not included
16:39:33  <Eddi|zuHause2> gnah... i just tried to write [ESC]:wq in kate :p
16:39:56  *** Slowpoke [] has joined #openttd
16:40:06  <Eddi|zuHause2> no, there are reasons for not doing it
16:40:14  <Eddi|zuHause2> they have been brought up multiple times
16:40:31  <Eddi|zuHause2> just look up the discussions
16:41:22  <yorick> I know the reasons
16:41:32  <Eddi|zuHause2> main opposing reasons are typically varying license issues, and outdated grf versions
16:41:54  *** kaan [~Klaus@] has joined #openttd
16:42:13  <kaan> hello all
16:42:20  <yorick> hello
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16:43:27  <yorick> Purno: will the NS-set be finished anytime soon?
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16:50:02  <Gonozal_VIII> national socialistic set?
17:00:55  <yorick> no, "Nederlandse Spoorwegen
17:00:56  <yorick> "
17:02:16  <pax``> Is it best to connect the longest possible routes? That is, rather than delivering resources from close mines go across the map to find one far away?
17:02:37  <Gonozal_VIII> yes
17:02:38  <yorick> depends on cargo payment factors
17:02:51  <Gonozal_VIII> you get more money per tonne that way
17:03:06  <mrfrenzy> the one way trip shouldn't take more than approx 140 days
17:03:16  <mrfrenzy> depending on what cargo
17:03:22  <mrfrenzy> for some cargoes its as low as 90 days
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17:05:01  <pax``> I usually get the rating of the station drop very low and the AI players block resources tapping to my station if I don't have trains coming in frequently... Any way to prevent that?
17:05:23  <yorick> add more trains
17:05:47  <yorick> if crash, learn how to make signals
17:06:31  <Gonozal_VIII> there should be enough trains that there's always one loading
17:08:08  <pax``> I'll try that, thanks
17:08:40  *** Journy [] has joined #openttd
17:08:43  <Journy> hello
17:09:07  <Slowpoke> hello
17:10:41  <Journy> does anyone have any reccomendations for train sets?
17:10:55  * Journy is bored with the stock sets...
17:11:00  <yorick> try US
17:11:11  <yorick> UK? Dutch? Canadian?
17:11:24  <peter1138> CanSet! :D
17:11:54  <Gonozal_VIII> serbian is cool
17:12:02  <Journy> i have tried the north american renewal set, and the mag lev trains at the end arent capable of running anything but goods?
17:12:17  <Gonozal_VIII> most sets have that
17:12:23  <Journy> oh..
17:12:26  <Journy> why is that?
17:12:58  <yorick> because wagon ID's are used for nice wagons
17:13:09  <Gonozal_VIII> transporting coal at 500 km/h is not very (sorry for the bad word) realistic
17:13:28  <De_Ghosty> it is the future!!
17:13:33  <Journy> indeed, the future...
17:13:46  <Gonozal_VIII> nah... i don't think that will happen in the future
17:13:50  <glx> and imagine how the coal "react" in corners
17:14:15  <Journy> so umm all sets are like that?
17:14:15  <De_Ghosty> why are we transporting coal in the future?
17:14:24  <Gonozal_VIII> it just doesn't make sense to transport cheap mass goods very fast
17:14:32  <Journy> because coal will still be a very cheap energy source in the future
17:14:43  <Journy> 2050 isnt that far in the future anyways...
17:14:45  <De_Ghosty> coal is not really that cheap anymore
17:14:54  <Journy> blame china.
17:15:03  <yorick> [18:13] <Gonozal_VIII> transporting coal at 500 km/h is not very (sorry for the bad word) realistic, transporting pax at 500km/h, however, is!
17:15:18  <Slowpoke> coal is cheaper that some years back
17:15:43  <Gonozal_VIII> pax care about speed, coal doesn't
17:15:51  <Journy> of course coal cares.
17:16:07  <mrfrenzy> yorick: there already are working trains that go 500 km/h
17:16:22  <Journy> isnt the speed record 580?
17:16:23  <mrfrenzy> It's not unrealistic at all that they will be common in 2020
17:16:30  <mrfrenzy> 574 or smth
17:16:49  <Journy> oddly enough China has a few maglevs...
17:17:36  <Journy> ok so, how hard is it for me to add in a coal car for maglevs?
17:17:43  <Gonozal_VIII> there could also be vacuum maglev networks with 5000 km/h or simmilar stuff but i don't think something like that will be used for freight
17:18:01  <Journy> nah only intercontinental transport im sure.
17:18:34  <Gonozal_VIII> global network :-)
17:18:43  <Gonozal_VIII> could replace planes
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17:18:50  <Journy> indeed
17:18:53  <yorick> well...we have a kinda european network
17:19:02  <mrfrenzy> I would like to see in the future different multiplayer games interconnected like continents
17:19:13  <Journy> europe is small.
17:19:14  <yorick> with transfer and take goods
17:19:27  <Gonozal_VIII> that won't happen
17:20:03  <Journy> erm... so whats the best train sets?
17:20:17  <Journy> is the US renewal set pretty decent?
17:20:19  <Gonozal_VIII> you already got a lot of answers
17:20:31  <Journy> true
17:20:33  <Sacro> how do i compile openttd for windows on linux
17:20:47  <Purno> <<yorick>> Purno: will the NS-set be finished anytime soon? <-- it will be finished anytime, yes
17:20:50  <Sacro> ./configure --build=i486-mingw32 works
17:20:55  <Sacro> but make fails when using strgen
17:21:17  <Journy> ok how about another question, how different are the nightly builds from the most recent release?
17:21:30  <glx> Sacro: use --host maybe
17:21:30  <De_Ghosty> 2007 - France - TGV - 574.8 km/h
17:21:35  <De_Ghosty> u don't even need the future
17:21:41  <Journy> heh
17:21:54  <Sacro> glx: i tried that and it failed too
17:21:58  <Sacro> but i did a make clean
17:22:04  <Sacro> then tried again, and it seems happier :D
17:22:54  <Sacro> eugh, need fontconfig
17:23:11  *** a1270 [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:23:23  <Sacro> installing mingw32-freetype now
17:23:50  <glx> disable fontconfig (not needed for win32)
17:23:55  <Sacro> glx: pfft
17:23:59  <Sacro> i've built it now
17:24:14  * yorick goes on with his ficl patch
17:24:15  <glx> freetype != fontconfig anyway
17:24:20  <Sacro> glx: :(
17:24:27  <Sacro> well it disposed of the wrnings
17:24:35  <Sacro> now SDL fails
17:24:47  *** Wezz6400 [] has quit [Quit: Caught sigterm, terminating...]
17:24:54  <yorick> yes, I've named it "FICL", "Flags In Client List"
17:24:56  <glx> not needed for windows
17:24:56  <Journy> hmmm
17:25:13  <Sacro> i don't think it installed mingw32-libpng
17:26:53  *** Alberth [] has left #openttd []
17:27:19  <yorick> but I need some help with
17:27:22  <Journy> guys also, with the US renewal set some of my trains travel by rail slower than the states maximum speed they have, one of my trains says maximum speed 110 mph, but max's out at 60 mph, is there a reason for this?
17:27:43  <Gonozal_VIII> wagons
17:28:01  <yorick> wagon speed limits
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17:28:26  <Journy> argh
17:28:43  <yorick> disable them using the patches if you don't like it
17:29:15  <Journy> im really new to this game, is there a place to find all these patches?
17:29:19  <yorick> yes
17:29:56  <yorick> 3rd button from the right on main-toolbar, keep-pressed and select Configure Patches
17:31:30  <Journy> is this a standard patch though?
17:31:35  <yorick> yes
17:31:53  <yorick> Vehicles->Enable wagon speed limits
17:32:15  <Journy> ahh thank you.
17:34:03  *** planetmaker [~chatzilla@] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:34:26  <yorick> but is there anyone that can help mé?
17:37:27  <Sacro> how do i disable sdl?
17:37:36  <yorick> -v anyother
17:37:43  <yorick> -h to list them
17:37:50  <Sacro> no, when compiling
17:38:22  <yorick> --disable-sdl?
17:39:31  <peter1138> Not much use without it...
17:39:36  <yorick> Gonozal_VIII:
17:40:38  <Sacro> right
17:41:06  <Sacro> Unknown Option --disable-sdl
17:41:14  <Sacro> hmm
17:41:19  <Sacro> tis using /usr/include/SDL
17:41:22  <Sacro> which isn't right
17:41:54  <Sacro> should be using /usr/i486-ming32/include
17:42:14  <yorick> modify configure?
17:42:36  <Gonozal_VIII> what about that yorick?
17:43:04  <yorick> they suggest that chrissicom should go working with you on maintaining a patchpack
17:44:33  <yorick> hmm...can uint8's be negative?
17:44:41  <Gonozal_VIII> u
17:44:54  <yorick> ok, they can't
17:45:09  <yorick> uint6 doesn't exist, does it?
17:45:27  <Gonozal_VIII> wouldn't make sense
17:45:43  <Gonozal_VIII> ok, it could..
17:45:47  <Sacro> oh god now what
17:45:50  <yorick> 0-36?
17:46:04  <Sacro> i think it's lacking g++ :(
17:46:11  <yorick> :o
17:46:27  <Gonozal_VIII> you could combine 6 booleans^^
17:46:36  <Sacro> or maybe ln
17:46:41  <Sacro> its)]+0x183d): undefined reference to `operator delete[](void*)'
17:46:41  <Sacro> yapf/yapf_ship.o:yapf_ship.cpp:(.text$_ZN16CYapfFollowShipTI16CYapfShip_TypesTI10CYapfShip313CFollowTrackTIL13TransportType2ELb0EE20CNodeList_HashTableTI14CYapfShipNodeTI20CYapfNodeKeyTrackDirELi16ELi20EEEE15ChooseShipTrackEP7Vehiclej13DiagDirection9TrackBits[CYapfFollowShipT<CYapfShip_TypesT<CYapfShip3, CFollowTrackT<(TransportType)2, false>, CNodeList_HashTableT<CYapfShipNodeT<CYapfNodeKeyTrackDir>, 16, 20> > >::ChooseShipTrack(Vehicle*, u
17:46:48  <Sacro> collect2: ld returned 1 exit status
17:46:48  <yorick> or I could combine uint4 with 2 bools?
17:46:50  <Sacro> *ls
17:47:13  <yorick> but that way, I would look crazy
17:47:34  <Gonozal_VIII> you mean even crazier?
17:47:52  <peter1138> uint4? heh
17:48:57  <Sacro> argh god
17:49:16  <Gonozal_VIII> int4 :-) -8 to 7 :-)
17:49:53  <yorick> :O
17:49:54  <peter1138> Quite.
17:50:03  <peter1138> Used in some of the NFO spec...
17:50:10  <Journy> hmmm
17:51:21  * yorick help!
17:51:55  <yorick> if (strcmp (ci->client_name, client_name) == 0) { is always true :(
17:52:03  <yorick>
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17:56:53  <Gonozal_VIII> why not ! instead of that == 0 stuff?
17:58:05  <ln> Gonozal_VIII: bad style
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17:58:25  <Gonozal_VIII> really? hmm
17:58:45  <ln> in someone's opinion at least
17:58:46  <Sacro> grrr, can't build
17:59:11  <Gonozal_VIII> what about if(somebool == true)
17:59:18  <ln> ben the builder -- can we fix it!
18:00:38  <Sacro> how do i stop it finding SDL >M
18:00:39  <Sacro> ><
18:00:59  <Purno> how can I resetvehicles in openttd?
18:01:12  <Gonozal_VIII> engines
18:01:22  <Purno> resetengines, ok, how can I do it?
18:01:46  <yorick> console
18:02:01  <Purno> how can I open the console?
18:02:04  <Gonozal_VIII> thingy above tab
18:02:08  <Purno> nvm, got it
18:02:12  <Purno> key wasn't really responding
18:02:27  <Sacro> right
18:02:47  <Gonozal_VIII> bad key
18:02:50  *** k4 [] has joined #openttd
18:02:54  <Sacro> i can get the ./configure --build=i486-mingw32 --enable-sdl=/usr/i486-mingw32-bin/sdl-config
18:02:57  <Sacro> but make fails
18:02:58  *** mikl [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
18:03:03  <Gonozal_VIII> oh noes, another ee
18:03:18  *** k4 is now known as LordAzamath
18:03:23  <Gonozal_VIII> hehe
18:03:32  <yorick> oh noes
18:03:34  <Sacro> yapf/yapf_ship.o:yapf_ship.cpp:(.text$_ZN16CYapfFollowShipTI16CYapfShip_TypesTI10CYapfShip313CFollowTrackTIL13TransportType2ELb0EE20CNodeList_HashTableTI14CYapfShipNodeTI20CYapfNodeKeyTrackDirELi16ELi20EEEE15ChooseShipTrackEP7Vehiclej13DiagDirection9TrackBits[CYapfFollowShipT<CYapfShip_TypesT<CYapfShip3, CFollowTrackT<(TransportType)2, false>, CNodeList_HashTableT<CYapfShipNodeT<CYapfNodeKeyTrackDir>, 16, 20> > >::ChooseShipTrack(Vehicle*, u
18:03:36  <Gonozal_VIII> i was worried there
18:03:46  <Gonozal_VIII> invasion and stuff
18:03:58  <Sacro> it doesn't like `operator delete[](void*)
18:04:18  *** mikl [] has joined #openttd
18:04:24  <Purno> hmm...
18:04:39  <Purno> I did reset engines, but I still can't build e-rails, while I should
18:04:44  <Purno> (openttd 0.5.3)
18:04:50  <yorick> try to restart
18:04:54  <yorick> 0.5.3 :o
18:05:04  <LordAzamath> Purno: 0,5,3????
18:05:09  <Gonozal_VIII> sure that there are electric engines available?
18:05:11  <yorick> aaah
18:05:12  <LordAzamath> , -> .
18:05:13  <Gonozal_VIII> year and climate?
18:05:19  <Purno> it's the only one which got pixel doubling, AFAIK
18:05:26  <LordAzamath> Gonozal_VIII: You dislike .ee?
18:05:32  <Purno> yes, the NS set got an EMU in 1924, current year is 1930
18:05:55  <Purno> it's a scenario, but apparantly GRF info is stored in the scenario
18:05:56  <Gonozal_VIII> i dislike invasions :P
18:06:11  <Purno> meaning I gotta enable the GRFs after the game has started, right?
18:06:52  <Gonozal_VIII> sometimes that doesn't work right
18:07:06  <Gonozal_VIII> but for vehicles it usually did for me
18:07:07  <Purno> so how do I enable these GRFs in this scneario?
18:07:12  <Sacro> WHY WON'T IT BUILD >M
18:07:13  <Sacro> ><
18:08:36  * LordAzamath invades.. not
18:08:39  *** LordAzamath [] has left #openttd [Konversation terminated!]
18:09:26  <Journy> hmmm
18:09:50  <Journy> ok im trying to complile Gonozal_patch_r12180
18:09:54  <Journy> compile
18:11:07  *** Singaporekid [] has quit []
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18:13:02  <Journy> BuildOTTD is so simple its confusing? why isnt it compiling the build and putting it in My OTTD builds? Does this work with vista... hmmm
18:13:25  <Gonozal_VIII> nah, not vista
18:15:00  <Prof_Frink> What's so hard about ./configure && make anyways?
18:15:21  <Journy> as in not vista's fault? or it doesnt work with vista?
18:17:00  <Gonozal_VIII> everything is vistas fault
18:17:33  <Journy> lol almost sounds like bush's fault.
18:21:33  *** LordAzamath [~LAlord]] has joined #openttd
18:22:54  <Journy> ugh
18:23:10  <LordAzamath> .ee attacks
18:31:39  *** LordAzamath [~LAlord]] has quit [Quit:  I love my HydraIRC -> <-]
18:45:07  <peter1138> Well!
18:45:29  *** |Jeroen| [] has quit [Quit: oO]
18:45:35  <peter1138> That was quite nice.
18:47:04  *** Journy [] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
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18:57:12  *** Frostregen_ is now known as Frostregen
18:59:36  <Eddi|zuHause2> <De_Ghosty> why are we transporting coal in the future? <- because oil runs out in 20-50 years, but coal runs out in 100-200 years
19:00:31  *** josch [] has joined #openttd
19:00:49  <Eddi|zuHause2> <Journy> of course coal cares. <- you can convert coal into oil, they did that a lot in the 1940s
19:01:44  <Slowpoke> they will do it again when oil ran out...
19:02:01  <Slowpoke> no plane will fly with a coal engine
19:02:39  <Slowpoke> unless....
19:02:49  <Slowpoke> brb inventing
19:03:21  <Gonozal_VIII>
19:07:41  <Slowpoke> "It was, in practice, incapable of flight since it had insufficient power from its heavy steam engine to fly."
19:07:51  <Eddi|zuHause2> hm... funny... civ4 doesn't repaint the window if it does not have focus (although it is only partially covered)
19:08:01  <yorick> where does * in front of a C variable stand for?
19:08:02  <Gonozal_VIII> read further down
19:08:13  <Eddi|zuHause2> now the music OSDs stack up ;)
19:08:16  <Gonozal_VIII> the 1848 thingy flew
19:08:26  <Slowpoke> a few meters in a hangar
19:08:37  <Gonozal_VIII> until it hit the wall
19:08:48  <Eddi|zuHause2> Slowpoke: the first airplanes had similar problems
19:09:12  <Slowpoke> yeah sure I know
19:09:58  <Gonozal_VIII> it gradually rose until it reached the farther end of the room, striking a hole in the canvas placed to stop it.
19:10:10  <Slowpoke> I just wanted to pount out that coal is not the best fuel to power a plane
19:10:37  <Gonozal_VIII> nobody said it was
19:11:13  <Slowpoke> and I didn't say somebody did ;)
19:15:47  <stillunknown> yorick: It's a pointer.
19:16:01  <stillunknown> (away now)
19:19:20  <Eddi|zuHause2> technically, the * after the type ;)
19:22:19  <Sacro>
19:24:26  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: smatz * r12369 /trunk/src/ (settings.cpp train.h train_cmd.cpp): -Fix (r1681): reset train speed limits when _patches.realistic_acceleration changes
19:25:46  *** Bjarni [] has joined #openttd
19:25:49  *** mode/#openttd [+o Bjarni] by ChanServ
19:26:21  <Gonozal_VIII> bjarni!
19:26:50  <ln> Bjar-ni!
19:27:14  <Sacro> Bjarni: Welsh mountain rescue team make art discovery in snowdonia.
19:27:17  <Sacro> They think it's a constable.
19:27:18  <Sacro> err
19:27:21  <Sacro> wrong paste ><
19:27:35  <Sacro> Bjarni:
19:27:49  <peter1138> :o
19:28:57  <yorick> Bjarni!
19:28:59  <yorick> away again
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19:32:25  <Patrick`> peter1138: wider
19:35:07  <peter1138> :O
19:35:22  <peter1138> :( )
19:37:40  <Bjarni> Sacro: why tell me?
19:38:01  <Bjarni> you want to trick me to give you my sperm or something?
19:38:29  <Tefad> O_o
19:38:38  <Gonozal_VIII> yes, tell him that he doesn't have to use tricks just for that
19:38:58  <Bjarni> actually nomatter what he offers he can never get it
19:40:12  <Bjarni> now imagine what would happen if it's used to create children with my brain and Sacro's ethics
19:40:32  <Bjarni> sounds like a horror movie
19:41:40  <Bjarni> besides
19:41:50  <Bjarni> why would I go to a festival anyway?
19:42:09  <Slowpoke> Ill start!
19:42:37  <SmatZ> Slowpoke: sounds sick
19:43:03  <Bjarni> ANNOUNCEMENT: somebody named Slowpoke wants to host a page called
19:43:17  <Bjarni> homemade?
19:43:27  <Slowpoke> children or sperm?
19:43:33  <Bjarni> latter
19:43:42  <Bjarni> or both
19:44:12  <Digitalfox_> Why does strgen.exe come with the binary's of OpenTTD 0.6 betas? Needed for what?
19:44:31  <Bjarni> good question
19:44:36  <Slowpoke> I will think about that later
19:44:47  <UnderBuilder> drunk?
19:44:57  <Bjarni> I don't think I added it to the OSX betas
19:45:02  <Gonozal_VIII> just get some candy and park in front of a school
19:45:20  <Digitalfox_> Well with Windows 32bit builds it comes
19:45:59  <Bjarni> Gonozal_VIII: sounds dangerous for whoever is doing that
19:46:00  <Digitalfox_> The other builds i didn't test =0
19:46:13  <Bjarni> bbl
19:48:02  <peter1138> I need less GRFs.
19:48:08  <peter1138> Start up takes way too long, heh...
19:50:06  <glx> too many paths where to search for grfs (including tar files)
19:50:14  <peter1138> No, just too many GRFs.
19:50:18  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: peter1138 * r12370 /trunk/src/network/network_gui.cpp: -Fix [FS#1853]: Close language drop down when parent window is clicked/closed.
19:52:07  <peter1138> Hmm, 332 currently.
19:52:39  <Digitalfox_> peter1138: You load 332 grf's at start? =0
19:52:55  <Digitalfox_> That's a record ;)
19:53:08  <peter1138> No...
19:53:18  <glx> but openttd opens 332 grfs
19:53:19  <peter1138> I just have 332 available.
19:53:28  <peter1138> It opens each to see what's there.
19:53:51  <glx> check for duplicates, ...
19:54:28  <Digitalfox_> peter1138: And don't you find it a mess when some names aren't enough descriptive?
19:55:02  <peter1138> I hardly ever look
19:55:44  <Digitalfox_> I don't have even half of that, but i find it sometimes hard because of names not really showing what it is :|
19:56:02  <glx> they have a description field
19:56:24  <peter1138> And a path/filename.
19:56:29  <Digitalfox_> Yes but some don't have any extra info ( Old ones or unfinished versions )
19:56:44  <glx> don't use them then ;)
19:56:52  <Digitalfox_> No newer versions :(
19:57:16  <Digitalfox_> Offcourse i could use grfcodec and add the missing description.. but...
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20:00:49  <Digitalfox_> One of the reasons I fully support OpenGFX, is that there is any real replacement for a lot of graphics.. Sure there are lot's of vehicles set's, some Houses and industries, bridges, roads, etc... But a lot of sprites just don't have any replacement.. But maybe I'm just bored of original graphics and want new ones..
20:01:36  *** roobi [] has joined #openttd
20:01:46  <Digitalfox_> *there isn't
20:01:52  <roobi> hi all
20:01:57  <Digitalfox_> Hello
20:02:03  <roobi> ive got a terraforming question
20:02:14  <SmatZ> hi
20:02:21  <SmatZ> so, ask youe question
20:02:44  <roobi> has someone a glue how I can lower all land by 1 in the scenario editor?
20:02:54  <ln> a glue?
20:03:00  <SmatZ> :-D
20:03:01  <SmatZ> no
20:03:20  <roobi> sooory clue I mean
20:03:22  <roobi> :-))
20:03:36  <planetmaker> roobi: Lower one corner and then use the level tool.
20:04:12  <planetmaker> oh... or you just want to subtract one from every height - may it as it is?
20:04:23  <roobi> yes, thats it!
20:04:35  <Eddi|zuHause2> roobi: not easily
20:04:41  <roobi> I don't want make plain land :)
20:05:09  <Eddi|zuHause2> but why do you want to do that anyway?
20:05:35  <roobi> yes. the reason is I have a good card for the scenario, but the import-funktion makes the "ground-level" too high
20:05:52  <Eddi|zuHause2> roobi: the easiest way i imagine is to modify the source to change a command that it does that
20:06:52  <roobi> huu ... I'm sorry, is there somewhere a guide how to do that?
20:07:55  <roobi> Eddi .. ich sehe an Deinem Nick, daß Du deutsch sprichst, richtig?
20:08:28  <Gonozal_VIII> english chan :P
20:08:46  *** roobi [] has quit [Quit:]
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20:09:01  <roobi> I know.. should I translate?
20:09:04  <roobi> :-)
20:09:53  <Eddi|zuHause2> by "card", do you mean a heightmap picture?
20:10:01  <roobi> yes, I mean
20:10:09  <Gonozal_VIII> you could change the colours in gimp
20:10:24  <Gonozal_VIII> or other image editor...
20:10:57  <Eddi|zuHause2> yeah, edit the palette (or the greyscale, depending on type of picture)
20:11:05  <roobi> good idea... I'm going to try that
20:11:53  <planetmaker> roobi: I'd open the image and subtract some gray values in a reasonable image manipulation prg
20:12:34  <Tefad> convert to grascale
20:12:41  * planetmaker is slower than Gonozal_VIII :)
20:12:47  <Tefad> adjust contrast brightness gamma
20:12:55  <Gonozal_VIII> not gamma
20:12:56  <Tefad> palettetize.
20:13:08  <Gonozal_VIII> gamma isn't linear
20:13:13  <Tefad> sometimes i use gamma for emphasis.
20:13:37  <Gonozal_VIII> you could end up with different terrain with that
20:13:40  <Tefad> yup
20:13:44  <Tefad> slightly different
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20:13:55  <Tefad> it changes the bands depending on how you palettize
20:14:16  <Tefad> i tend to save a palette to use for ttd maps
20:14:20  <planetmaker> subtract the lowest grayscale value and then rescale to 1 byte.
20:14:20  <Tefad> evenly spaced grayscale
20:15:01  <Tefad> sometimes the elevation contours just don't feel right to me
20:15:21  *** divo [] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
20:15:53  <Wolf01> 'night
20:15:57  *** Wolf01 [] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.]
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20:20:02  <roobi> ... I'm still trying...
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20:33:05  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: smatz * r12371 /trunk/src/window.cpp: -Fix [FS#1823]: do not let window hide behind the main toolbar after resizing the screen
20:35:38  <yorick> <-- it finally works as it should now :)
20:36:53  <roobi> I've got it!!
20:37:01  *** Brianetta [] has joined #openttd
20:37:42  <roobi> I made greyscale and putted the brightscale down, so the land becomes flat!
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21:11:48  *** UnderBuilder [~chatzilla@] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.81 [Firefox]]
21:12:20  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: glx * r12372 /trunk/src/music/win32_m.cpp: -Fix: win32 music driver fails if path contains non-latin chars
21:12:57  <Eddi|zuHause2> who invented these damn non-latin characters anyway :p
21:13:13  <Prof_Frink> glx: So I couldn't install it in C:\jgames\openttd\ then?
21:13:52  <Eddi|zuHause2> Prof_Frink: no, your comment is not funny...
21:13:54  <roobi> bye
21:13:57  *** roobi [] has quit [Quit:]
21:20:52  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: glx * r12373 /trunk/src/music/win32_m.cpp: -Fix [FS#1849]: win32 music driver fails if path is too long (128 chars is too much for mci it seems), so retry using the short path name (8.3 style) if available
21:27:53  *** Zaviori [] has joined #openttd
21:30:04  <HMage> ЌяЌя. всеЌ прОвет
21:31:00  <Gonozal_VIII> what's with the russian stuff?
21:31:21  <HMage> it's semi-accidental
21:31:38  <glx> I still don't understand the first word :)
21:32:13  <Gonozal_VIII> those rs face the wrong direction...
21:32:42  <glx> it's miamia but I don't have it in my dictionnary
21:33:39  <HMage> it's not in the dictionary :)
21:34:03  <Gonozal_VIII> Mia Mia Jewels is a small company specialising in creating beautiful handcrafted glass jewellery
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21:36:11  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: peter1138 * r12374 /trunk/src/group_gui.cpp: -Fix (r11892): Don't close a dropmenu when clicking on a dropdown widget
21:36:57  <Purno> waht does one need to run a dedicated server on a webserver?
21:38:08  <peter1138> Shell access.
21:38:21  <peter1138> Oh, and permission.
21:39:26  <peter1138> And another copy of TTD for the data files... probably...
21:44:48  <Purno> that's all?
21:44:52  <Ammlller> Purno: OpenTTD, Autopilot, Webconfigurator, OpenTTDlib and most important some guys to watch it.
21:45:16  <Purno> ok thx
21:45:52  <Ammlller> Purno: there are many NL-guys admin at #openttdcoop, they would like to help you too, I assume ;-)
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21:46:20  <Slowpoke> is there some "sandbox"like server around? I mean some where nobody laughts at me when I fail hard and stuff ;)
21:46:30  <Purno> haven't seen them replying in the topic yet. I asked Xeryus but he didn't know anyone who could host a server
21:46:45  <Ammlller> oh, you also need a server?
21:47:20  <Purno> ehm...
21:47:21  <Purno> dunno
21:47:26  <Purno> I need a game hosted 24/7 :P
21:47:32  <Purno> I'm a noob with this kinda stuff
21:47:55  <Ammlller> [22:36] <Purno> waht does one need to run a dedicated server on a webserver? <-- indicates you have already a webserver :-)
21:48:17  <Purno> Eh... yeah, for hosting a site... dunno if that's enough
21:48:34  <Purno> basicly, it doesn't matter where it's hosted, as long as it's hosted :P
21:48:36  <Ammlller> well, if you don't find one, you could have one at my server
21:49:03  <Purno> a 24/7 hosted openttd game?
21:49:51  <Ammlller> I guess, they aren't around yet
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21:51:05  <Purno> I have no clue whatsoever what exactly is required and how it works :P
21:51:42  <Ammlller> well, it require much CPU usage if you really fill the map
21:51:59  <Ammlller> and for sure, when, PBS is there too
21:52:16  <Purno> so it's gonna be a small map?
21:52:32  <Ammlller> max should be 1024²
21:53:07  <Ammlller> on coop, its 512² and about 1000 vehicels
21:53:11  <Eddi|zuHause2> people should still be able to download the map with their home dsl
21:53:19  <peter1138> 256x512 is a nice size
21:54:15  <Ammlller> if you use something like webconfigurator, its easy to change the size from time to time without ssh
21:54:55  <Purno> ssh?
21:55:15  <Ammlller> and the IRC bridge is also nice to watch the game, without running it self all the time
21:55:59  <Purno> hmm... if we'd get your offer to have one at your server, would that include your help setting the stuff up?
21:57:25  <Ammlller> yeah, but there are also other dutch guys who would like to help, I am sure.
21:57:37  <Ammlller> its really easy...
21:58:01  <Ammlller> Admins from coop have already access to my server
21:58:07  <Purno> dunno what dutch guys to ask
21:58:30  <Ammlller> do you need it now?
21:59:08  <Purno> nah, once the Dutch Trainset is gonna be released
21:59:14  <Purno> will take *at least* a few weeks
22:00:02  <Ammlller> Well, then you have time, setting up a server needs about half an hour.
22:00:44  <Purno> any idea what dutch guys to aks to help?
22:00:51  <Ammlller> XeryusTC:
22:01:00  <Purno> done
22:01:10  <Purno> didn't know anyone who could help
22:01:11  <Purno> he said
22:02:01  <Ammlller> I thought about himself ;-)
22:02:47  <Purno> well, I guess why he didn't say that himself when I asked...
22:02:57  <Ammlller> :-)
22:04:00  <Ammlller> Mike would be another one
22:04:08  <Ammlller> Mark
22:04:10  <glx> I need a MSVC+TortoiseSVN user
22:04:27  <Ammlller> thats XeryusTC too :-)
22:04:42  <Purno> Mike or Mark? (or both, wasn't it a typo?)
22:04:53  <Ammlller> type, yes Mark
22:04:58  <Purno> I'll ask
22:05:35  <Ammlller> he is framiliar with configuration of server
22:05:46  <Ammlller> but new to linux
22:05:57  <Ammlller> do you like to run nightlies?
22:05:58  <Purno> I'll ask him
22:06:11  <Purno> ehm... I don't update my openttd often
22:06:16  <Purno> so it's usually stables and betas
22:07:07  <Ammlller> and an other option is, when it will be run more stable. :-)
22:08:06  <Sionide> woah
22:08:12  <Sionide> that's a cooool idea!
22:08:16  <Purno> is it free?
22:08:24  <Sionide> if it works how i think it works
22:08:31  <Ammlller> yes, but very buggy, as it states
22:09:13  <Ammlller> and of course, really cool
22:10:08  <Sionide> so that server has a script which runs a dedicated server requested by a user giving it what version to run etc?
22:10:42  <Ammlller> yeah, you could also upload a save and play it there
22:10:57  <Sionide> neat
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22:19:30  <Ammlller> Purno: just ask some days before you need the server, if you still don't have other server or help...
22:19:44  <Purno> will do, checking out now
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22:21:02  <Ammlller> Purno: you should specially check NewGRF support...
22:21:21  <Ammlller> sometimes, it works...
22:21:52  <Purno> I got the server running now... but about newgrfs, it wants me to upload them...
22:22:08  <Purno> that's not something I'd like to do to test an yet unrealeased grf :P
22:22:55  <peter1138> How else is it going to get the GRF?
22:23:38  <Prof_Frink> mount an sshfs share back to your computer?
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22:26:31  <Ammlller> Purno: use GRFs which are realeased already
22:26:46  <Ammlller> just to try, if it works
22:27:25  <Purno> finding out how to remove a server now...
22:27:36  <Purno> can't find a link/button to that
22:27:37  <Ammlller> impossible I guess
22:27:41  <Purno> hmm...
22:27:44  <Purno> shame, I just started 3 :o
22:27:49  <Ammlller> but you can stop them
22:27:50  <Purno> since I got some errors and stuff
22:27:53  <Purno> I stopped them
22:28:02  <Ammlller> its very alpha... :P
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22:32:10  <Purno> got it working
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22:43:51  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: glx * r12375 /trunk/projects/determineversion.vbs: -Fix [FS#1847]: revision detection failed to detect 64bit TortoiseSVN when ran from a 32bit MSVC on win64 system (Jafinto)
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23:15:08  <SpComb> I actually used to play a game of OpenTTD with a friend of mine a couple weeks back
23:15:27  <SpComb> some insane fiddling with the configuration was needed (defaults were wrong), but it did work
23:17:06  <Ammller> SpComb: I had many issues with login and sessions at all
23:17:18  <Ammller> almost every request ended with an error
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23:17:42  <Ammller> but somehow saved too
23:17:42  <SpComb> I fixed the one with every redirect giving you an error page
23:17:58  <SpComb> I also changed the error page so it gives the full details including stack trace
23:18:26  <SpComb> login still causes an AssertionError, I don't know how to fix that, but it doesn't actually stop you from logging in
23:20:14  <SpComb> I also tried to move it over to my new server last week, but Pylons is silly and complains about some missing depedancy that doesn't, to the best of my knoewledge, exitst
23:20:23  <SpComb> there's a package that goes under that name but as far as I can tell it works fine
23:20:42  <Ammller> something with NewGRF didn't work
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23:20:50  <Ammller> tried to setup a ECS game
23:22:50  <SpComb> hmm... you'd need to get back to me with the full error page
23:23:29  <Ammller> well, is the current version running now?
23:23:32  *** dR3x4cK [] has quit [Quit: dR3x4cK]
23:23:48  <SpComb> there are no seperate dev/test/prod versions, so yes
23:24:11  <Ammller> also the dev preview of mapvewer was nice :-)
23:25:43  <SpComb> that's still online
23:26:40  <SpComb> although heh, it's been running the same savegame for ages, and I guess the network got stuck and the company went bankrupt
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23:46:43  <Sacro> michi_cc: i keep getting trains stuck in a terminus station, they won't turn round D:
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23:56:49  <HMage> яЌяЌ. всеЌ спПкПйМПй МПчО
23:57:07  <Sionide> ...yup
23:57:18  <Gonozal_VIII> strange russian stuff again...
23:57:30  * HMage <--- strange
23:58:00  <HMage> strange stranger strangled
23:58:03  <HMage> etc
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23:59:22  <Ammller> good night HMage :-)

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