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00:00:50 <ccfreak2k> The actual contents don't get any bigger/smaller with the window size. 00:01:42 *** Dred_furst` [~Dred_furs@user-54418bdb.lns1-c7.dsl.pol.co.uk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:02:04 <TiberiusTeng> did you called ClientSizeChanged() and UpdateWindows() ? 00:02:38 <ccfreak2k> I called 00:02:53 <ccfreak2k> blitter->ClientSizeChanged() 00:02:59 <ccfreak2k> Then MarkWholeScreenDirty() 00:04:11 <ccfreak2k> UpdateWindows() isn't in opengl.hpp... 00:04:13 <ccfreak2k> Is that elsewhere? 00:04:58 <TiberiusTeng> windows.cpp :P 00:05:06 <TiberiusTeng> ahh, window.cpp 00:06:32 <ccfreak2k> I called UpdateWindows(), and there was no change. 00:07:38 <ccfreak2k> I'm gonna give up for now. 00:10:58 *** thgergo [~Administr@dsl5402B32D.pool.t-online.hu] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:15:07 <ccfreak2k> Well, it works, so long as you don't make the window's vertical size any larger than where it's initially set at. :) 00:18:02 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-136-225-75.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:34:04 *** Eddi|zuHause2 [~johekr@p54B75BF8.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 00:39:09 *** Zahl [~Zahl@p549F40BF.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: (~_~]"] 00:40:55 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B744BC.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:47:17 *** ben_goodger [~ben@host86-146-18-220.range86-146.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:47:41 *** ben_goodger [~ben@host86-146-18-220.range86-146.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 01:03:36 *** KritiK [~Maxim@93-80-41-173.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:07:25 *** Wezz6400 [~Wezz6400@145-118-111-36.fttx.bbned.nl] has quit [Quit: Caught sigterm, terminating...] 01:17:41 *** Lakie [~Lakie@91.84.251.149] has quit [Quit: Night All.] 01:19:44 *** Scrotolazer [~Scrotolaz@251.Red-88-27-13.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #openttd 01:20:03 <Scrotolazer> hi guys 01:20:32 <Scrotolazer> just trying to play a multyplayer game of open ttd... every game i enter is paused, any ideas? 01:25:06 *** Scrotolazer [~Scrotolaz@251.Red-88-27-13.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [] 01:28:27 <fjb> Maybe they are paused over night. Or they are on autopause while there are no active players. 01:28:37 *** ben_goodger [~ben@host86-146-18-220.range86-146.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:28:59 *** ben_goodger [~ben@host86-146-18-220.range86-146.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 01:30:11 <ccfreak2k> Scrotolzer doesn't count as an active player? :) 01:35:38 <fjb> Depends if he is joining a company or just watching. 01:59:01 *** fjb [~frank@p5485C1D7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:03:21 *** Gekz [~brendan@123-243-206-102.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Quit: leaving] 02:09:03 *** Gekz [~brendan@123-243-206-102.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #openttd 02:24:09 <ccfreak2k> There. 02:24:13 <ccfreak2k> I fixed the sdlgl driver. 02:24:44 <ccfreak2k> The only known bug so far is pre-baked resolutions not being selectable. 03:03:02 *** elmex_ [~elmex@e180064144.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd 03:07:57 *** elmex [~elmex@e180065096.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:07:57 *** elmex_ is now known as elmex 03:31:47 <ccfreak2k> Any devs around familiar with blitters and what-not? 04:05:13 *** Denyerec [~Never@cpc1-shep4-0-0-cust61.lei3.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd 04:05:17 *** PRiiT^`Kool [Priit@pc145.host3.starman.ee] has joined #openttd 04:05:43 *** M4rk [~M4rk@5351EE62.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd 04:07:07 *** teh_eekster [~eekee@cpc1-lanc4-0-0-cust82.brig.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd 04:10:22 *** blathijs_ [~matthijs@drsnuggles.stderr.nl] has joined #openttd 04:10:43 *** Netsplit charon.oftc.net <-> kinetic.oftc.net quits: Priit, Kommer, Denyerek, ob0t, Prof_Frink, Mark, Sionide, blathijs, Marduuhin, eekee 04:10:58 *** welshdragon [~proffrink@5ad1ee3a.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 04:11:06 *** welshdragon is now known as Prof_Frink 04:11:18 *** Netsplit over, joins: ob0t 04:11:41 *** Prof_Frink is now known as Guest2604 04:11:46 *** Netsplit over, joins: Marduuhin 04:18:06 *** Ridayah [~ridayah@12-208-15-67.client.mchsi.com] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 04:18:32 <ccfreak2k> sdlgl makes openttd a lot more smooth than the standard sdl driver. 04:18:40 <ccfreak2k> TiberiusTeng will be pleased. 04:19:44 *** Ridayah [~ridayah@12-208-15-67.client.mchsi.com] has joined #openttd 04:21:32 *** Kommer [~Kommer@members.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 05:11:54 *** Guest2604 is now known as Prof_Frink 05:12:31 *** Prof_Frink is now known as Guest2613 05:29:32 *** raimar2 [~hawk@p5489CF0B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 05:32:32 *** ben_goodger [~ben@host86-146-18-220.range86-146.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:32:54 *** ben_goodger [~ben@host86-146-18-220.range86-146.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 05:36:15 *** raimar3 [~hawk@p5489C1D7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:56:13 <ccfreak2k> If I'm interpreting callgrind's data correctly, then the opengl blitter has a hell of a lot less CPU overhead than the 32bpp-anim blitter. 06:12:45 *** Guest2613 is now known as Prof_Frink 06:13:21 *** Prof_Frink is now known as Guest2620 06:28:58 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d009169.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 06:33:08 *** hylje [hylje@c214.myrootshell.com] has joined #openttd 06:39:59 *** mikl [~mikl@0304ds2-ba.0.fullrate.dk] has joined #openttd 06:49:09 <TiberiusTeng> :) 06:49:19 <TiberiusTeng> ccfreak2k, can I have your diff please ? :D 06:49:37 <ccfreak2k> I'm not sure how to make one. 06:50:20 <hylje> what version control system do you use 06:50:38 <ccfreak2k> SVN. 06:51:02 <hylje> do you keep your changes on your working copy 06:51:06 <TiberiusTeng> mercurial 06:51:22 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:51:28 <TiberiusTeng> it's much better if you can diff against a tree patched with my opengl patch 06:51:33 <ccfreak2k> I just checked out whatever revision opengl was based on and started hacking at that. 06:51:41 <TiberiusTeng> with mercurial it's really easy to do ... 06:51:49 <hylje> ye, mercurial or git are better for distributed development 06:52:13 *** TiberiusTeng [~Tiberius@sbt.idv.tw] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:52:34 *** TiberiusTeng [~Tiberius@sbt.idv.tw] has joined #openttd 06:52:41 *** ecke [~ecke@213.195.231.53] has joined #openttd 06:53:07 <ccfreak2k> TiberiusTeng, check out the callgrind png I linked to in my post. 06:53:21 <TiberiusTeng> oh I just saw that 06:53:25 <TiberiusTeng> it's amazing ... 06:53:46 <ccfreak2k> Turns out it really IS useful after all. 06:54:16 <TiberiusTeng> actually I didn't profiled it along with 32bpp-anim under win32 yet, just FELT the difference :p 06:54:39 <ccfreak2k> Well, I could definitely feel the difference in my Slackware box. 06:54:49 <ccfreak2k> Anything above 800x600 was all jerky. 06:54:56 <TiberiusTeng> that's why I said that the bottleneck's not at blitter anymore 06:55:07 <TiberiusTeng> try load some openttdcoop savegames and it's still laggy when zoomed out 06:55:18 <TiberiusTeng> but I can't isolate the bottleneck anymore 06:55:45 <TiberiusTeng> (nah, don't tell me it's that MD5 causing delay ... for a long enough game it shouldn't be an issue) 06:56:04 <ccfreak2k> The callgrind profiling was done at the main menu. 06:56:33 <ccfreak2k> Ok. 06:56:42 <ccfreak2k> Now, how do I diff two directories recursively? 06:56:56 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 06:56:57 <TiberiusTeng> something like diff -U5 -r 06:57:15 <TiberiusTeng> ahh, try learn mercurial, you'll definitively love it. :D 06:57:39 <planetmaker> with svn you just call "diff > blubber.diff" in your root dir of that checkout 06:57:47 <hylje> svn diff 06:57:58 <planetmaker> ye 06:58:07 <TiberiusTeng> but I wish him diff against a tree patched with my opengl diff ... 06:58:08 <hylje> `diff` is a different tool 06:58:20 <TiberiusTeng> is svn capable of doing that ? :p 06:58:27 <planetmaker> :) 06:58:36 <planetmaker> my kdesvn is 06:58:41 <hylje> that kind of diffing produces whatever changes were done to the working copy 06:58:48 <planetmaker> I know, hylje 06:58:49 <ccfreak2k> How do I "apply" a diff again? 06:58:50 <ccfreak2k> :| 06:58:59 <planetmaker> patch <p0 blubber.diff 06:59:01 <hylje> patch -p0 -i foo.diff 06:59:19 <planetmaker> shit. I should go, have breakfast. 06:59:25 <TiberiusTeng> ccfreak2k, can I copy that callgrind screenshot to my server and publish it on my blog ? 06:59:28 <planetmaker> patch -p0 < foo.diff 06:59:29 <TiberiusTeng> :D 06:59:40 <ccfreak2k> TiberiusTeng, ok. 07:00:12 <ccfreak2k> Ugh. 07:00:19 <ccfreak2k> This diff I made has a bunch of crap in it. 07:01:05 *** ecke [~ecke@213.195.231.53] has quit [Quit: ecke] 07:01:23 <planetmaker> TiberiusTeng: any special hardware requirements for your opengl blitter patch? 07:02:42 <TiberiusTeng> hmm like my first post about it said, GeForce 6100+ or RadeOn 9550+ 07:02:54 <TiberiusTeng> since it uses fragment programs (pixel shaders) 07:04:48 <ccfreak2k> TiberiusTeng, why don't I just tar the three files I changed? 07:05:07 <TiberiusTeng> uh, yes, it's a solution too :p 07:05:12 <planetmaker> hm... :( I guess, I have too old hardware :( 07:05:19 <ccfreak2k> Well, you already HAVE your changes with opengl. 07:05:22 <ccfreak2k> I just tacked on sdlgl. 07:05:45 <TiberiusTeng> planetmaker, do glxinfo and see if you got GL_ARB_fragment_program in it 07:06:18 <TiberiusTeng> that's the minimum requirement ... 07:06:48 <TiberiusTeng> (actually you still can RUN it without this extension, but you won't have company colors, re-colored strings, etc ... a little meaningless to play :p) 07:06:58 <planetmaker> :) 07:07:26 *** Krol [~Miranda@c71-194.icpnet.pl] has joined #openttd 07:07:31 <Krol> !password 07:07:38 <ccfreak2k> http://ccfreak2k.loliserv.org/sdlgl.tar.bz2 07:07:48 <ccfreak2k> I see no reason why it shouldn't work in win32, but I haven't tried it. 07:07:51 <ccfreak2k> Have fun. :) 07:08:03 <TiberiusTeng> I think display cards in ~2 years have these support 07:08:06 <TiberiusTeng> ccfreak2k, thanks 07:08:17 <Krol> sorry, wrong channel :) 07:08:47 <TiberiusTeng> and the 'entry level' ones supporting GL_ARB_fragment_program and GL_ATI_draw_buffers cost under USD here in Taiwan now 07:10:11 <ccfreak2k> Also TiberiusTeng, I didn't add sdlgl shit to VC projects, so it'll only build using make unless someone adds them to *.proj. 07:10:41 <TiberiusTeng> ccfreak2k, it will be 'auto-generated' once you put it in sources.list 07:10:58 <planetmaker> Chipsatz-Modell: GMA 950 <-- is probably therefor not possible on my laptop :( 07:10:58 <planetmaker> (intel integrated graphics) 07:11:35 <ccfreak2k> planetmaker, the Intel i900 series supports pixel shaders, so it should support OpenGL's fragment programs as well. 07:11:53 <TiberiusTeng> ... would you like to test for us ? I think it can do correct colors, albeit without palette animation. 07:12:15 <TiberiusTeng> seems it supports GL_ARB_fragment_shader but not GL_ATI_draw_buffers ... 07:12:17 <planetmaker> hm... then I should give it a try :) 07:12:38 <TiberiusTeng> but I don't know whether it'll really faster :P 07:12:42 <ccfreak2k> Also TiberiusTeng, I did some testing with sdlgl. SDL_VIDEORESIZE isn't triggered when a pre-baked resolution is chosen, but it IS triggered when the window is resized. 07:12:55 <TiberiusTeng> my 855GME in notebook is not actually faster 07:13:00 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:13:12 <planetmaker> hehe :) 07:13:16 <TiberiusTeng> ccfreak2k, yes, I'm just thinking to block that dropdown menu in win32gl blitter 07:13:35 <ccfreak2k> I actually had some combination of code that did that, but I dunno why. 07:13:46 <ccfreak2k> You chose a resolution, and it just...didn't do anything. 07:13:48 *** Guest2620 is now known as Prof_Frink 07:14:13 <ccfreak2k> Changing between fullscreen and windowed works, though. 07:14:21 *** Prof_Frink is now known as Guest2626 07:15:46 <TiberiusTeng> then it's ok for now I think ... 07:16:46 <TiberiusTeng> if you do want to support resolution changing, you'll need to re-create the context, and release all textures to get them reloaded into the new context. 07:17:26 <TiberiusTeng> I think the way newgrf_gui.cpp reloads all grf's could help :p 07:18:54 <ccfreak2k> I was trying to track down what exactly was different between using pre-baked resolutions and resizing the window. 07:18:55 *** thingwath [~thingwath@morana.sks3.muni.cz] has quit [Quit: It's all over.] 07:19:01 <ccfreak2k> Different calls were being made, but I dunno where. 07:19:17 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 07:19:44 *** dR3x4cK [~Miranda@p5499E443.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 07:23:04 <ccfreak2k> This is why I like VisualStudio. 07:23:11 <ccfreak2k> I can figure out where a function is. :/ 07:30:39 <TiberiusTeng> I think you have Kdevelop or Anjuta at hand ? :p 07:32:05 <ccfreak2k> I have Kdevelop yes, but there's no project files for it. 07:32:43 *** Dred_furst [~Dred_furs@user-54418bdb.lns1-c7.dsl.pol.co.uk] has joined #openttd 07:34:00 <TiberiusTeng> perhaps you can write a script to generate a project file from source.list ... 07:34:08 <TiberiusTeng> that's how OpenTTD deal with VS project files now 07:34:22 <TiberiusTeng> using script/generate or script/generate.vbs 07:35:52 <ccfreak2k> I don't see it. 07:35:56 *** Alberth [~hat@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 07:36:32 <TiberiusTeng> ccfreak2k, if you have time, could you callgrind it again, with some openttdcoop savegame loaded, and zoom out 8x at a city for ~10 minutes ? 07:36:44 <ccfreak2k> Oh, it's in projects/ 07:36:49 *** yorick [~yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 07:36:59 <ccfreak2k> Do you have one such openttdcoop saved game? 07:37:22 <TiberiusTeng> http://www.openttdcoop.org/wiki/PublicServer:Archive_-_Games_91_-_100 07:37:57 <TiberiusTeng> I often test with #96 07:38:02 <TiberiusTeng> but your taste may differ :p 07:38:10 <ccfreak2k> I have no preference. 07:38:23 <ccfreak2k> I guess the more "going on" on the screen, the better. 07:38:35 <ccfreak2k> Hmm, I can't reach openttdcoop.org. 07:39:25 <yorick> time-out 07:39:44 <yorick> it says 07:39:46 <ccfreak2k> --- openttdcoop.org ping statistics --- 07:39:46 <ccfreak2k> 48 packets transmitted, 0 received, 100% packet loss, time 47029ms 07:39:47 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:39:59 <TiberiusTeng> hmm 07:40:13 <TiberiusTeng> wait, I'll pack these GRFs and the savegame for you 07:40:18 <ccfreak2k> Also, is 8x the furthest zoom? 07:40:39 <yorick> yes 07:41:28 <TiberiusTeng> 32bpp blitters would easily come down to 2 spf on my computer 07:41:39 <TiberiusTeng> if zoomed out 8x at such a savegame ... 07:42:09 *** Netsplit resistance.oftc.net <-> scorpio.oftc.net quits: Gekz 07:42:17 *** Netsplit over, joins: Gekz 07:42:50 <TiberiusTeng> http://sbt.idv.tw/temp/openttdcoop-grfpack.tar.bz2 07:42:56 <TiberiusTeng> extract this one in openttd/data folder 07:43:16 <TiberiusTeng> (you should actually fetch this from openttdcoop website ... but it's emergency now :P) 07:43:26 <TiberiusTeng> http://sbt.idv.tw/temp/Metropolis,%2012th%20Aug%202201.sav 07:45:04 <ccfreak2k> Any port in a storm. 07:49:30 <ccfreak2k> Which blitters should I test other than opengl and 32bpp-anim? 07:49:50 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host126-174-dynamic.60-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 07:53:08 <TiberiusTeng> I'm mainly interest in the profiling result of opengl blitter 07:53:22 <Wolf01> hello 07:53:25 <TiberiusTeng> because it can direct us for further optimization ... 07:53:44 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 07:54:34 <TiberiusTeng> I guess 32bpp-anim would be VERY SLOW on that one ... remember F1 is the pause key :p 07:57:57 <ccfreak2k> You have no idea how excrutiatingly slow valgrind makes openttd run. 07:59:01 <ccfreak2k> It's taking at LEAST ten seconds per frame on 32bpp-anim right now. 07:59:09 <ccfreak2k> Closer to about 30. 08:00:44 <ccfreak2k> I don't think it's moved at all since I turned instrumenting on. 08:00:52 <ccfreak2k> Wait, it just did. 08:00:55 <ccfreak2k> After about two minutes.. 08:01:32 <yorick> it helps to turn off animation for that one 08:03:08 <TiberiusTeng> :PP 08:03:13 *** divo [~asd@0x3e42e6e6.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #openttd 08:05:31 <ccfreak2k> Bear in mind that it's running at about 1500x1100. 08:06:13 <hylje> You now visualize a bear running at you 08:14:51 *** Guest2626 is now known as Prof_Frink 08:15:31 *** Prof_Frink is now known as Guest2637 08:24:20 *** M4rk is now known as Mark 08:25:01 *** Brianetta [~brian@77-103-231-158.cable.ubr05.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #openttd 08:39:35 *** PRiiT^`Kool [Priit@pc145.host3.starman.ee] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:46:32 *** thgergo [~Administr@dsl5402B32D.pool.t-online.hu] has joined #openttd 08:48:54 <TiberiusTeng> ok, it builds on my mingw environment ... 08:48:57 <TiberiusTeng> time for diff file! 08:49:36 *** Guest2637 is now known as Prof_Frink 08:51:31 <ccfreak2k> Does it run in Windows? 08:51:58 <TiberiusTeng> I dunno, too lazy to get/build SDL myself ... 08:51:59 <yorick> yes 08:56:23 *** Wezz6400 [~Wezz6400@145-118-111-36.fttx.bbned.nl] has joined #openttd 09:04:07 <ccfreak2k> TiberiusTeng, the profiling is finished. 09:04:25 <ccfreak2k> Instrumentation encompassed only idling at furthest zoom using the saved game you provided. 09:05:40 <ccfreak2k> 32bpp-anim and 32bpp-optimized had 48.52 and 50.70 respectively in self in the function DeleteEntryFromSpriteCache. 09:06:44 <ccfreak2k> Both were followed by 15.81 and 16.59 in SpriteLoaderGrf::LoadSprite. 09:07:16 <TiberiusTeng> ahh ... the spritecache is thrashing ... 09:07:52 <ccfreak2k> 8bpp-optimized had its highest self in ViewportDoDraw at 19.18. 09:08:19 <ccfreak2k> This was followed by Blitter_8bppOptimized::Draw with 11.23. 09:09:01 <TiberiusTeng> perhaps changing sprite_cache_size in openttd.conf will relieve them a bit (I thik maximum allowed is 16 or so) 09:09:03 <ccfreak2k> sdlgl's highest was ViewportDoDraw, with 21.96, followed by GfxMainBlitter at 10.69. 09:09:16 <TiberiusTeng> 8bpp-optimized is still the best performer 09:09:32 <ccfreak2k> If you have Kcachegrind, you can take a look at the data yourself. 09:09:33 <TiberiusTeng> but it won't do 32bpp rendering ... that's its main drawback 09:09:45 <TiberiusTeng> I don't have linux machines around :Q 09:09:54 <TiberiusTeng> but I'll try to gprof myself 09:13:07 *** Zahl [~Zahl@p549F291D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 09:14:36 <TiberiusTeng> ccfreak2k, I've updated the post with your sdlgl driver :D 09:14:45 <ccfreak2k> Heh, 1.86 self was spent in one function of fglrx. 09:17:11 <ccfreak2k> Oh btw, I dunno if I told you, but when I added --with-sdlgl to config.whatever, I didn't add any SDL checking code, so it'll happily try to compile it without SDL. 09:17:16 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-136-225-75.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd 09:20:45 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1EDBA.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 09:21:38 <TiberiusTeng> hmm ... 09:22:03 <TiberiusTeng> I don't think it's a big problem now ... perhaps just make it depend on the check done by with_sdl. 09:22:54 <TiberiusTeng> since your profiling was capped by DeleteEntryFromSpriteCache and LoadSprite, I think it would be better to change sprite_cache_size and do it again, if you're interested in it ... 09:23:07 <ccfreak2k> I couldn't make sense of code, so I just added it in as a standard option. 09:23:10 <TiberiusTeng> actually 32bpp-optimized/32bpp-anim is very usable if sprite_cache_size is large enough :P 09:23:33 <yorick> it then goes slurping RAM instead of harddisk load 09:23:44 <TiberiusTeng> yep, kind of 09:24:01 <TiberiusTeng> I think I'll move my focus to some signaling work from now ... :p 09:24:17 <yorick> good 09:24:38 <TiberiusTeng> and to code for Taiwan Railways Set my friend painted 09:24:48 <yorick> less good :-P 09:25:47 <TiberiusTeng> :P 09:26:05 <TiberiusTeng> oh, by the way, what does 'Stolen Trees' and 'Stolen Water' mean? are they NewGRFs ? 09:26:14 <ccfreak2k> Yes. 09:26:18 <TiberiusTeng> just found it mentioned in the forum ... 09:26:24 <ccfreak2k> Stolen Trees adds more realistic-looking trees. 09:26:38 <TiberiusTeng> then there's no 'built-in' work to do :P 09:27:23 <TiberiusTeng> http://siplab.ntype.tw/E1000.png 09:28:13 <TiberiusTeng> http://picasaweb.google.com/tiberius.teng/TaiwanRailwayVehicles/photo#5157538337516395746 09:28:34 <Ammler> realistic isn't the right word for stolen trees, they are a little bit too big. 09:28:44 <Ammler> but they are indeed nice. 09:29:10 <ccfreak2k> Ok, "more realistic-looking". :) 09:29:18 <Ammler> never heard of stolen water... 09:29:27 <TiberiusTeng> I wonder why they're named 'Stolen' ... stolen from what ? 09:29:31 <ccfreak2k> Neither have I. 09:29:44 <Ammler> stolen from a beta test. 09:30:26 <TiberiusTeng> of a big set ? :Q 09:30:28 <Ammler> SAC gave them out to test and they got around without permission until she released them as stolen trees. 09:30:37 <TiberiusTeng> that doesn't sound good to me ... 09:30:44 <TiberiusTeng> ha! 09:31:14 <TiberiusTeng> so this is how it goes on ... interesting 09:32:36 <TiberiusTeng> how to change the sprite displayed in the vehicle purchasing view ? with Action 2 ? 09:32:36 <Ammler> but where can I see stolen water? 09:32:47 <TiberiusTeng> I dunno ... 09:32:59 <yorick> Ammler: steal Leppka's water, voila! 09:33:16 <Ammler> OpenGFX didn't afaik 09:33:32 <Ammler> so who did? 09:39:21 *** Dred_furst [~Dred_furs@user-54418bdb.lns1-c7.dsl.pol.co.uk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:43:10 <ccfreak2k> TiberiusTeng, update the post. 09:43:20 <ccfreak2k> The opengl blitter is no longer win32-specific. 09:43:31 <ccfreak2k> Well, not that there's sdlgl. 09:44:30 <TiberiusTeng> ahh yes :) 09:46:15 <TiberiusTeng> done. 09:49:47 <ccfreak2k> Also, fullscreen mode DOES work with sdlgl, at least in my testing. 09:50:43 *** Volley [~worf@84.119.42.30] has joined #openttd 10:13:44 <ccfreak2k> There. 10:14:03 <ccfreak2k> I redid the instrumentation with a bigger sprite cache and a smaller viewport 10:17:02 *** HaloMaster [~osiris@122-49-157-233.ip.adam.com.au] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:24:34 <TiberiusTeng> how does it show ? 10:24:59 <TiberiusTeng> what did it show ? (my bad English) 10:27:26 <ccfreak2k> Blitter_32bppAnim::Draw is top now on 32bpp-anim. 10:27:29 <ccfreak2k> With 14.44. 10:40:00 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.226] has quit [Ping timeout: 482 seconds] 10:40:52 *** Belugas_Gone [~belugas@216.191.111.226] has joined #openttd 10:40:55 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas_Gone] by ChanServ 10:43:39 *** Osai`off is now known as Osai 10:45:08 *** einKarl [~einKarl@91-65-234-54-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #openttd 11:03:11 *** jni [~geetee@cs181040004.pp.htv.fi] has joined #openttd 11:06:14 *** Doorslammer|BRSet [Doorslamme@PIPP-p-203-54-229-134.prem.tmns.net.au] has joined #openttd 11:10:57 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:19:35 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 11:27:14 *** Doorslammer|online [Doorslamme@PIPP-p-203-54-115-219.prem.tmns.net.au] has joined #openttd 11:31:54 *** Doorslammer|BRSet [Doorslamme@PIPP-p-203-54-229-134.prem.tmns.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:35:40 *** Doorslammer|online is now known as Doorslammer|BRSet 11:37:32 *** Doorslammer|online [Doorslamme@PIPP-p-203-54-115-222.prem.tmns.net.au] has joined #openttd 11:38:58 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:42:00 *** yorick [~yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Quit: Poef!] 11:43:44 *** Doorslammer|BRSet [Doorslamme@PIPP-p-203-54-115-219.prem.tmns.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:44:18 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 11:44:22 *** Doorslammer|online is now known as Doorslammer|BRSet 11:51:07 *** tokai [~tokai@p54B84289.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:52:41 *** tokai [~tokai@p54B82C08.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 11:52:44 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 11:53:37 *** Boyinblue0 [~admin@5ac85a73.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 12:17:57 <Eddi|zuHause2> hm... should i dare rebooting? 12:18:27 <Eddi|zuHause2> someone pray for me ;) 12:18:54 *** Eddi|zuHause2 [~johekr@p54B75BF8.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 12:20:34 *** fjb [~frank@p5485F264.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 12:20:39 <fjb> Hwllo 12:22:52 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B75D95.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 12:23:18 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:23:21 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... it forgot to update the grub entry for the new kernel... 12:23:41 <Eddi|zuHause> so glad grub has filename completition ;) 12:30:17 *** sunkan [sunkan@sunkan.bsnet.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:39:47 *** svip [~svip@cpe.atm2-0-78233.0x535a2072.boanxx18.customer.tele.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:43:32 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 12:53:59 *** sunkan [sunkan@sunkan.bsnet.se] has joined #openttd 13:03:03 <fjb> Is there a way to find all trains with an invalid order? 13:04:02 <frosch123> You mean except waiting for the news? 13:04:12 <fjb> Yes. :-) 13:04:26 <frosch123> no - not that I know of. 13:04:44 <fjb> I want to fix it before I get news that something went wrong. 13:05:26 <fjb> I'm rearanging some depots. 13:07:06 <frosch123> You can access the vehicle which have the depot in their order as long as you haven't yet removed it 13:07:17 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-136-225-75.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:07:53 <fjb> I know. But I had to remove that depot before I could rebuild the station entry... 13:08:41 <frosch123> You could assign them to a intermediate depot... 13:08:55 <fjb> I will have to look at the orders of every train that goes to that station. 13:09:47 <fjb> Hm, some placeholder order... That could be the solution next time. 13:10:20 *** sunkan [sunkan@sunkan.bsnet.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:11:08 <fjb> Could be also helpful if a vehicle could be part of more than one group at a time. 13:15:33 *** sunkan [sunkan@sunkan.bsnet.se] has joined #openttd 13:18:58 <Eddi|zuHause> that'll cause serious headaches ;) 13:19:14 <Eddi|zuHause> like for example with autoreplace 13:19:37 *** Gekz [~brendan@123-243-206-102.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Quit: leaving] 13:19:48 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... kde4 doesn't like their applications maximized 13:20:24 <Eddi|zuHause> when i maximize an app, then minimize [to tray] or close it and open it again, it's not maximized anymore 13:21:13 <fjb> Hm, that headaches already exists. Think about the all vehicles group... 13:21:38 * fjb is still using kde3. 13:22:10 <fjb> My depots have a tendency to collect trains. 13:22:13 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm using kde3 as well, but i tested some kde4 apps 13:22:34 <Prof_Frink> Eddi|zuHause: Works fine here 13:22:38 <Eddi|zuHause> hunters and collectors, it's the very foundation of humanity ;) 13:23:29 <Eddi|zuHause> Prof_Frink: which application/environment/action? 13:23:50 *** sunkan [sunkan@sunkan.bsnet.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:24:01 <Eddi|zuHause> hm, ktorrent 3 does not have RSSFeed yet... 13:25:22 <fjb> So depots are human... 13:25:42 <Prof_Frink> Everything/KDE4.1beta2/maximising/minimising/closing/opening/restoring on sessionn start... 13:25:44 <fjb> But they are not using ktorrent... :) 13:26:33 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe it's because of kwin4 that yours work 13:27:26 <fjb> Hm, 10 trains sitting in a depot, fearing the world outside... 13:27:35 <Eddi|zuHause> i run kde3, when i maximise ksudoku, close it, open it again, it is not maximised and very small size 13:27:59 <Eddi|zuHause> when i maximize ktorrent, minimize to tray, open it again -> not maximized either 13:28:20 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:30:45 *** sunkan [sunkan@sunkan.bsnet.se] has joined #openttd 13:31:34 *** Gekz [~brendan@123-243-206-102.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #openttd 13:35:29 <Eddi|zuHause> i've never seen so many people mentioned in a doctor who intro ;) 13:36:23 <Prof_Frink> Yeah, it was quite impressive 13:36:51 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 13:38:24 <Alberth> fjb: trains in a depot can only leave when no other train wants the block where the depot is in. 13:39:52 <fjb> Alberth: I know. The problem with that depot was that the trains got faster into that depot than they had a chance to get out of it. 13:41:28 <Alberth> Lucky you have a finite number of trains! Maybe we should have a RORO depot? :P 13:43:16 <fjb> Roro depots would be fine. Even better if only the locomotive would to to the depot without the long train... But that is another story. 13:44:46 *** divo [~asd@0x3e42e6e6.adsl.cybercity.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:45:49 <Alberth> wagons need servicing too 13:46:55 *** sunkan [sunkan@sunkan.bsnet.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:47:09 <fjb> But not that often. 13:55:34 *** TinoM [~Tino@i59F556EC.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 14:03:24 <Alberth> What a fun that would be! Bring wagons to platform, decouple locomotive, service it while loading the wagons, attach it at other end, bring wagons to a hill, decouple! Who needa a locomotive to pull wagons to other station? :P 14:08:50 <fjb> Yes, that is what I was thinking of. Or use a second locomotive at the and of the train only to push it up a steep hill. 14:09:50 *** teh_eekster is now known as eekee 14:10:25 *** dlunch [~dlunch@61.108.29.49] has joined #openttd 14:11:15 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:11:31 *** svip [~svip@cpe.atm2-0-78233.0x535a2072.boanxx18.customer.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 14:15:46 *** sunkan [sunkan@sunkan.bsnet.se] has joined #openttd 14:23:46 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 14:25:09 *** Volley [~worf@84.119.42.30] has quit [] 14:25:57 <Eddi|zuHause> or switch between electric and diesel/steam traction 14:27:46 *** Purno [~Purno@5357D37C.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd 14:27:53 *** Gekz [~brendan@123-243-206-102.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:28:41 *** Gekz [~brendan@123-243-206-102.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #openttd 14:30:05 *** sunkan [sunkan@sunkan.bsnet.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:30:27 <fjb> A diesel shunter for the mineral loading station or gantry cranes... 14:31:35 <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, a Köf III would be lovely ;) 14:33:19 <fjb> Yes. Would be fun to watch. 14:33:50 <fjb> But that would also require station tiles with working switches. 14:34:04 *** Gekz [~brendan@123-243-206-102.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Quit: leaving] 14:34:18 *** Gekz [~brendan@123-243-206-102.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #openttd 14:34:55 *** Mark [~M4rk@5351EE62.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:35:06 <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, you would somehow limit the shunting area by special signals 14:35:24 *** sunkan [sunkan@sunkan.bsnet.se] has joined #openttd 14:35:55 <Eddi|zuHause> so everything inside that ring would be a "station", the current definition of "station tile" would then become "platform tile" 14:36:05 <fjb> What would that require? A complete rewrite of the the oders system and pathfinder? 14:36:46 *** M4rk [~M4rk@5351EE62.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd 14:36:49 *** M4rk is now known as Mark 14:36:50 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:37:31 <Eddi|zuHause> not really, the shunting process would need new kind of orders, and the pathfinder would need to be able to turn around on certain places 14:37:56 <Eddi|zuHause> trains can only turn around while in shunting mode 14:39:10 <Eddi|zuHause> and an extension to YAPP path reservations 14:39:11 <Alberth> is a number of wagons without a locomotive not going to be a problem? 14:39:21 <Eddi|zuHause> shunting reservation (two directions) 14:40:19 <Eddi|zuHause> no, wagon groups have orders like "wait for engine [from group] X" 14:40:47 <Eddi|zuHause> and engines have orders like "pick up wagon set Y" 14:42:19 <Eddi|zuHause> the easiest shunting order would be "go backwards (push/pull)" 14:42:41 <Eddi|zuHause> the next would be "go backwards (reposition engine)" 14:43:04 *** KingJ [~kj@host81-149-184-29.in-addr.btopenworld.com] has quit [Quit: Game Servers @ http://game.kingj.net] 14:44:08 <Eddi|zuHause> a third use would be "detach wagons, go to engine yard, service/wait for different train, attach wagons" 14:44:20 *** sunkan [sunkan@sunkan.bsnet.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:44:20 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 14:46:04 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't really have an idea how complicated rearranging freight trains would be with such orders, though 14:51:52 *** dR3x4cK [~Miranda@p5499E443.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:52:28 *** sunkan [sunkan@sunkan.bsnet.se] has joined #openttd 14:53:18 <peter1138> write it 14:53:46 *** TiberiusTeng [~Tiberius@sbt.idv.tw] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:01:48 <fjb> Really, sounds good. Write it. I will definitely use it. 15:02:59 <Eddi|zuHause> it's an insanely complex subject :p 15:03:19 *** TiberiusTeng [~Tiberius@sbt.idv.tw] has joined #openttd 15:03:26 <Doorslammer|BRSet> :D Did I hear unhitching? 15:09:51 *** dR3x4cK [~Miranda@p5499F9B8.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 15:12:19 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:13:22 *** Linxor[BE] [~den_chris@169.111-66-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #openttd 15:14:44 <Linxor[BE]> hello all , ive being busy quit a while now with open ttd , now i started to mod some with the grf files , and i noticed there are not really packs out of it , does any of u guys can give me links to certain sites that provide full working packs? 15:17:40 *** Osai is now known as Osai`off 15:18:08 <Alberth> Not sure what a "full working pack" is, you know about GRFcrawler? http://grfcrawler.tt-forums.net/ 15:18:59 <Linxor[BE]> well saw that site ^^ thing is there are some things missing in certain packs 15:21:41 <Alberth> There is the openttdcoop.org GRFpack, but also that is a large collection of GRF files. Everybody picks his own favorite combination 15:22:19 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 15:22:30 <Ammler> Linxor[BE]: you can use multiple GRFs 15:23:33 <Linxor[BE]> ye tried to look up on the openttdcoop website but it apears down , any one having a FTP server where i can download multiple files? 15:23:35 <Doorslammer|BRSet> He is missing ECS cargoes it seems guys 15:24:11 <Linxor[BE]> ye i got the picture now , ty for support anyway ^^ 15:24:27 <Alberth> well "some things" in "certain packs" covers that :) 15:25:40 <Doorslammer|BRSet> Just thought you would like a specific ;) 15:25:44 *** Zahl_ [~Zahl@p549F2823.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 15:27:52 *** eekee [~eekee@cpc1-lanc4-0-0-cust82.brig.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:27:52 <Alberth> yeh, thought that after pressing enter and seeing the message 15:27:54 *** eekee [~eekee@cpc1-lanc4-0-0-cust82.brig.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd 15:29:36 <Doorslammer|BRSet> Directed him to the 15:29:39 <Doorslammer|BRSet> US Set 15:29:55 <Doorslammer|BRSet> But thats the only one I can think of off the top of my head 15:29:56 *** Zahl [~Zahl@p549F291D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:29:56 *** Zahl_ is now known as Zahl 15:30:08 <Linxor[BE]> well its just im looking for some new nice improvements that actually work 15:30:09 <Linxor[BE]> :D 15:30:43 *** KingJ [~kj@host81-149-184-29.in-addr.btopenworld.com] has joined #openttd 15:35:56 *** Purno [~Purno@5357D37C.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:37:38 *** lugo [~lugo@mgdb-4d0cf0da.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 15:40:07 *** planetmaker is now known as pm|away 15:40:13 <fjb> Most GRFs work well. 15:40:43 <Linxor[BE]> meaning if they work well also complying they are complete :p 15:42:36 <fjb> Define complete. 15:43:14 *** Osai`off is now known as Osai 15:46:06 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:47:27 <Alberth> what? and denying you the pleasure of finding exciting new combinations of GRFs and hours of exhaustive play-testing? :P 15:47:51 *** jni [~geetee@cs181040004.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:49:40 <Doorslammer|BRSet> He is missing certain cargo types that are needed for ECS and wants to know compatible sets 15:53:23 <Linxor[BE]> :D 15:53:29 <Linxor[BE]> making me sweat hours he? :D 15:54:02 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 15:58:48 *** pm|away is now known as planetmaker 15:59:55 *** dR3x4cK [~Miranda@p5499F9B8.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:00:39 <Alberth> I haven't played with ECS yet, so you are miles ahead of me 16:01:15 <Doorslammer|BRSet> Well, I never have either so... 16:01:24 <Doorslammer|BRSet> Welcome to the ECS-less Club :P 16:05:49 <TiberiusTeng> is there any GRF gurus here? how do I replace the sprite in vehicle purchase window? 16:06:14 <frosch123> cargotype 0xFF 16:06:21 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:06:29 <TiberiusTeng> thanks, I'll try it now 16:07:16 <TiberiusTeng> action 2 with cargotype 0xFF ? 16:07:26 <frosch123> action3 16:07:29 <TiberiusTeng> oh 16:08:10 *** Dred_furst [~Dred_furs@user-54418bdb.lns1-c7.dsl.pol.co.uk] has joined #openttd 16:12:19 <Linxor[BE]> ty for support all :) gtg 16:12:23 *** Linxor[BE] [~den_chris@169.111-66-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has left #openttd [] 16:13:02 <fjb> GRVTS, LV4, av8, Canset 0.3, UKRTS, DBsetxl + ECS extension and Serbian train set are supporting ECS. 16:13:20 <fjb> There may be even more sets. 16:14:42 <fjb> Oh, too late... 16:15:07 <Doorslammer|BRSet> :P 16:15:51 <fjb> How did you know he missed the newcargos feature in some vehicle sets? 16:16:42 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 16:17:24 <Doorslammer|BRSet> I asked him what was missing when he originally appeared in #tycoon 16:17:38 *** divo [~asd@0x3e42e6e6.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #openttd 16:17:39 <Doorslammer|BRSet> And it was cargoes normally found in an ECS game 16:17:53 <fjb> Ah, ok. Not complete couls mean anything and nothing. 16:18:04 <fjb> could 16:18:14 <Doorslammer|BRSet> Hmmm, he was not very specific I see, but obviously new 16:18:16 <Alberth> fjb: Tnx, I copied them to a file for future examination 16:18:28 <Doorslammer|BRSet> :) 16:18:57 <fjb> There is also an ECS extension for NewShips. 16:20:24 <TiberiusTeng> frosch123, made it work, thanks :) 16:20:50 <TiberiusTeng> where did it documented ? I don't think I saw it in newgrf specs @ wiki.ttdpatch.net before ... 16:21:40 <fjb> And remember that the ECS vectors have to be loaded in order of the grf id. And all ECS vectors have to be loaded before any vehicle set gets loaded. 16:22:26 <Doorslammer|BRSet> I imagine our firend will be back, when we can advise on such things :D 16:22:57 <Ammler> fjb: you might want to extend the wiki page: http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=ECSSupport 16:23:20 <frosch123> TiberiusTeng: http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=Action3 16:23:41 <TiberiusTeng> frosch123, ok ... 16:23:45 <frosch123> :p 16:24:09 <TiberiusTeng> how about 'push-pull' trains ? I wish to show one sprite in the purchase window instead of two opposite-faced sprites ... 16:24:17 <fjb> Somebody who writes better English then I do should extend that page. 16:24:29 <TiberiusTeng> or two same-side sprites after I overrided it with cargotype 0xFF :Q 16:24:46 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:25:48 <frosch123> sorry, I have no clue what you are asking :x 16:25:48 <Ammler> fjb: I did already, I don't think you need that much english knowledge :P 16:26:43 * frosch123 though order of ECS vectors does not matter, except TownVector must be the first 16:27:10 <fjb> No, you may get strange effects if you load them out of order. 16:27:15 <TiberiusTeng> frosch123, it now looks like this: http://sbt.idv.tw/temp/080630-ottd.png 16:27:49 <frosch123> How many sprites did you define in your action1? 16:27:57 <fjb> Cute. What kind og engine is that? 16:28:47 <TiberiusTeng> for the set to display in purchasing window, two. one facing left and one facing right 16:29:42 <TiberiusTeng> fjb, this is the train we're doing: http://picasaweb.google.com/tiberius.teng/TaiwanRailwayVehicles/photo#5157538337516395746 16:29:43 <frosch123> well yes, but did you only defined those, or did you added some empty sprites for the other directions 16:30:10 <TiberiusTeng> no, I only defined two 16:30:21 <TiberiusTeng> or I should fill up other directions with empty sprites? 16:30:28 <frosch123> Every vehicle has 8 orientations. The sprite is selected by using (direction % num_sprites_in_action1) 16:30:43 <frosch123> You do not need to add real sprites. 16:30:57 <frosch123> A (invalid) pseudo sprite, i.e. a single "00" will suffice. 16:31:20 <frosch123> nforenum will complain, but it is common practice to do so 16:31:58 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 16:32:32 <TiberiusTeng> hmm OK 16:33:28 <TiberiusTeng> I saw that japanset only defines 1 sprite for purchasing window ... perhaps it's a single locomotive with vehicle override that creates a trail locomotive. 16:34:07 <Doorslammer|BRSet> Maybe the mail wagon converts to a DVT 16:34:27 <Doorslammer|BRSet> Or similar idea to Class 91 in UKRS 16:36:07 *** Pikka [~PikkaBird@CPE-124-187-6-142.qld.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 16:36:35 *** Pikka [~PikkaBird@CPE-124-187-6-142.qld.bigpond.net.au] has quit [] 16:37:37 <Doorslammer|BRSet> Flying visit :S 16:37:53 *** llugo [~lugo@mgdb-4d0cf823.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 16:38:54 <frosch123> TiberiusTeng: The japanes engine I checked does not use "double headed". You only have to buy one engine, but if you attach passenger wagons, the last wagon will look like an engine 16:39:29 <TiberiusTeng> yep, so I misunderstood the way they did it in grf file ... 16:39:43 <frosch123> It is also a difference in game 16:41:27 <TiberiusTeng> I still got two same-direction locomotives after I defined all 8 directions @_@ 16:44:36 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:44:41 *** lugo [~lugo@mgdb-4d0cf0da.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:45:49 <frosch123> the forward sprite is number 7, the backward sprite is number 3 16:45:55 <frosch123> (starting from 1) 16:46:34 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1EDBA.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:47:19 <frosch123> if you need an example, take a look at dbsetxl, sprite 2063 to 2070 16:47:33 *** Alberth [~hat@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has left #openttd [] 16:47:45 <TiberiusTeng> ahh, just made it work. 16:48:30 <TiberiusTeng> is it required that later sprites should have larger X/Y coordinates in PCX file? 16:50:01 <ccfreak2k> TiberiusTeng, the American trainset does that for passenger coaches, if I'm reading you right. 16:50:16 <ccfreak2k> The coach looks different depending on what locomotive set you attach it to. 16:51:59 <frosch123> TiberiusTeng: It does not matter where your sprites are in the pcx. That info is not saved, as grfs do not know that they were pcxs somewhen 16:52:49 <frosch123> if you encode/decode your grf grfcodec will rearange them as it likes 16:53:21 <TiberiusTeng> ok. 16:53:58 <frosch123> You can also include sprites from different pcx files into one grf 16:59:44 *** raimar3 [~hawk@p5489C0F2.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 17:04:47 <Ammler> why do you delete FS posts? 17:06:12 *** grumbel [~grumbel@i577BB940.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 17:07:06 *** raimar2 [~hawk@p5489CF0B.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:09:07 <frosch123> who deleted FS posts? 17:09:36 <Ammler> dunno, a link to FS does only output error now. 17:10:14 <frosch123> Like you have rights to view the page :p 17:10:19 <frosch123> +no 17:10:29 <Ammler> http://bugs.openttd.org/task/1363 linked from here: http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/CIV_Build_1 17:10:47 <frosch123> IIRC you have to ask dih about that 17:11:20 *** Krol [~Miranda@c71-194.icpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:13:17 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 17:13:18 * fjb is addicted to YAPP. 17:13:47 <Ammler> thank you frosch123 :-) 17:13:56 *** mikl [~mikl@0304ds2-ba.0.fullrate.dk] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 17:16:54 <Ammler> frosch123: you should tell those who closed the post also to delete it from Google cache :-) 17:18:09 <Ammler> fjb: you can go to strike with Eddi|zuHause :-) 17:18:52 <fjb> :-P 17:20:54 *** toresbe [~toresbe@89.10.27.56] has left #openttd [] 17:31:20 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:35:07 *** Doorslammer|BRSet [Doorslamme@PIPP-p-203-54-115-222.prem.tmns.net.au] has quit [] 17:35:13 * Ammler is wondering how many other nice patches are just deleted at FS ;-) 17:37:08 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 17:38:12 <TiberiusTeng> grfcodec seems do care about positions of sprites in PCX when encoding ... 17:38:49 <TiberiusTeng> or that's because I used wrong compression settings ? I think it's always 01 ... 17:39:38 <Eddi|zuHause> compression setting does not really matter 17:39:41 <frosch123> well grfcodec... IIRC pcx files' width must be a multiple of 8, else very bad things may happen. But maybe it was already fixed. 17:42:16 <frosch123> TiberiusTeng: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=38122&p=666637#p666637 17:42:38 <TiberiusTeng> frosch123, thank you very much! 17:48:26 <TiberiusTeng> looks like if I don't place sprites in PCX in order, some of them won't make its way into GRF ... hmm 17:54:23 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:00:16 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 18:04:45 <fjb> Bye 18:04:51 *** fjb [~frank@p5485F264.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:07:28 *** einKarl [~einKarl@91-65-234-54-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:10:06 *** Netsplit resistance.oftc.net <-> scorpio.oftc.net quits: Gekz 18:14:13 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1EDBA.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 18:16:16 *** Dred_furst [~Dred_furs@user-54418bdb.lns1-c7.dsl.pol.co.uk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:18:56 *** Pixelz [~pix-qnet@217-210-177-128-no37.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #openttd 18:20:17 *** Netsplit over, joins: Gekz 18:30:58 *** Boyinblue0 [~admin@5ac85a73.bb.sky.com] has quit [] 18:37:16 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:42:32 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 18:46:02 *** KritiK [~Maxim@89-178-122-79.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 18:58:18 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:59:15 *** mikl [~mikl@x1-6-00-14-bf-cc-78-b6.k706.webspeed.dk] has joined #openttd 19:04:00 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 19:22:38 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:27:52 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 19:35:56 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:39:13 <Wolf01> 'night 19:39:17 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host126-174-dynamic.60-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 19:43:53 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 19:44:56 *** llugo [~lugo@mgdb-4d0cf823.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:45:17 *** lugo [~lugo@mgdb-4d0cf823.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 19:49:05 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-136-225-75.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd 19:49:32 *** Dred_furst [~Dred_furs@user-54418bdb.lns1-c7.dsl.pol.co.uk] has joined #openttd 20:00:33 *** lugo [~lugo@mgdb-4d0cf823.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:04:16 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:04:27 <ln> end of discussion 20:08:25 <Eddi|zuHause> no it's not 20:10:15 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 20:14:01 *** Osai [~Osai@members.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Server closed connection] 20:14:33 *** Osai [~Osai@members.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 20:14:52 *** dih 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connection] 21:40:06 *** Born_Acorn [~bornacorn@81.171.98.107] has joined #openttd 21:41:40 *** Mark__ is now known as Mark 21:42:09 *** Andel [~andel@owenrudge.net] has left #openttd [] 21:43:11 *** sunkan [sunkan@sunkan.bsnet.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:45:35 *** sunkan [sunkan@sunkan.bsnet.se] has joined #openttd 21:47:08 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:47:50 *** TinoM [~Tino@i59F556EC.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 21:55:36 *** sunkan [sunkan@sunkan.bsnet.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:56:19 *** sunkan [sunkan@sunkan.bsnet.se] has joined #openttd 21:59:36 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 22:07:01 *** GoneWacko [GoneWacko@86-60-157-76-dyn-dsl.ssp.fi] has joined #openttd 22:12:40 *** mikl [~mikl@x1-6-00-14-bf-cc-78-b6.k706.webspeed.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:13:31 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1EDBA.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:19:18 *** thgergo [~Administr@dsl5402B32D.pool.t-online.hu] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:19:27 *** KritiK [~Maxim@89-178-122-79.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:19:57 *** KritiK_ [~Maxim@89-178-122-79.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 22:19:59 *** KritiK_ is now known as KritiK 22:32:06 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-136-225-75.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:32:28 *** joachim [~joachim@26.84-234-176.customer.lyse.net] has joined #openttd 22:33:16 <joachim> hi. does anyone know how compability between loco/wagon for multiple units is checked in grfs, ie ukrs? 22:35:08 *** Pixelz [~pix-qnet@217-210-177-128-no37.tbcn.telia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:38:33 *** Pixelz [~pix-qnet@217-210-177-128-no37.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #openttd 22:42:33 *** fjb [~frank@p5485F264.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 22:42:37 <fjb> Hello 22:46:23 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:03:14 *** jni [~geetee@cs181040004.pp.htv.fi] has joined #openttd 23:04:18 *** Brianetta [~brian@77-103-231-158.cable.ubr05.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #openttd 23:04:34 *** Brianetta [~brian@77-103-231-158.cable.ubr05.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has quit [] 23:07:43 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@85.19.218.28] has joined #openttd 23:16:12 *** Osai is now known as Osai`off 23:23:13 *** TiberiusTeng [~Tiberius@sbt.idv.tw] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:25:33 *** divo [~asd@0x3e42e6e6.adsl.cybercity.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:28:01 *** Dred_furst [~Dred_furs@user-54418bdb.lns1-c7.dsl.pol.co.uk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:33:35 *** Born_Acorn [~bornacorn@81.171.98.107] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:33:52 <Belugas_Gone> joachim, i'm not able to answer you like right away, but i'd suspect you will find what yuo are looking for in the callback section of TTDPacth's wiki 23:39:14 *** Belugas_Gone is now known as Belugas 23:40:05 *** Born_Acorn [~bornacorn@81.171.98.107] has joined #openttd 23:41:18 <joachim> thanks, i'll look that up 23:42:17 *** GoneWacko [GoneWacko@86-60-157-76-dyn-dsl.ssp.fi] has quit [] 23:45:56 *** Wezz6400 [~Wezz6400@145-118-111-36.fttx.bbned.nl] has quit [Quit: Zzz]