Config
Log for #openttd on 15th April 2009:
Times are UTC Toggle Colours
00:01:35  *** KingJ is now known as kingj
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01:30:21  <De_Ghosty> http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/04/10/about-those-new-crunchpad-pictures/
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01:37:12  <Patrick> oh wow, aqeducts
01:37:29  <Patrick> forget money making massive games, I'ma gonna build me something pretty
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02:56:26  <DaleStan> [wito]: I was not aware there was a *callback* that industries could use to supply names for nearby stations.
03:03:09  <DaleStan> [wito]: The *property*, however, does exactly what the wiki says the property does. Nothing more.
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06:02:01  <dihedral> good yawning :-)
06:04:10  <Pikka> bonjour
06:08:00  <dihedral> :-)
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08:24:08  <dihedral> booooring
08:25:52  <wision_> http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/8268/15270.gif
08:25:54  <wision_> oops
08:26:22  <petern> clunk
08:28:19  <Xaroth> hah
08:33:43  * dihedral dbus-slaps petern :-D
08:33:53  * dihedral hides
08:36:05  <Cybertinus> wision_: auw, that just got to hurd :p
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09:06:44  <TrueBrain> burp
09:07:10  <Forked> I agree
09:07:39  <TrueBrain> that sucks :p
09:08:08  <Forked> I thought burping was pretty much the opposite of sucking .. stuff moves the other way
09:08:14  <TrueBrain> Today I have class from 1 to 5 ... but it is 23C outside
09:08:17  <TrueBrain> dunno if I can take that :(
09:18:19  <Rubidium> I know that I can't take the 23C outside at the moment ;)
09:18:29  <TrueBrain> why not? :)
09:19:16  <Rubidium> allergic reactions to the stuff in the air
09:19:23  <TrueBrain> ah ;)
09:20:30  <Rubidium> and not fancying having to go (almost) blind to the doctor for some prednison and friends
09:21:13  <TrueBrain> ghehehe
09:21:15  <TrueBrain> sounds fair :p
09:23:02  <XtaS> Good morning
09:23:32  <XtaS> For a first time for about 5 years I try openttd and I'm hooked right away
09:23:54  <Rubidium> it's that old already?
09:24:05  <XtaS> wel, transport tycoon is old
09:24:17  <XtaS> thats the one I played back then. :)
09:24:19  <Rubidium> damn... it is
09:24:25  <TrueBrain> Rubidium: 2003 :)
09:24:36  <TrueBrain> Rubidium: I am around here for 5 years now :p
09:24:55  <XtaS> But I was now wondering, I saw some 32bit textures. Is there any pack for them or anything?
09:24:56  <Rubidium> we totally forgot the 5 year anniversary of 0.1.1-0.1.4 last month and 0.2.0-0.3.0 this month
09:25:07  *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@88.130.177.197] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
09:25:22  <Rubidium> if by pack you mean "a reasonably finished set of graphics" then no
09:27:04  <TrueBrain> "I joined OpenTTD in March 2004" <- I even missed celebrating my 5 years being here :p
09:27:18  <Rubidium> in 10 days a 0.3.1 5 year anniversary?
09:27:27  <TrueBrain> I buy the cake
09:27:32  <TrueBrain> you do the drinks
09:27:39  <Rubidium> hmm, how long ago was the r10000 party?
09:27:56  <totalwormage> let's celebrate 'ten days before 5 years 0.3.1' today eh?
09:28:09  <Rubidium> nah, that'd be lame
09:28:21  <TrueBrain> @openttd commit 10000
09:28:21  <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: Commit r10000 doesn't exists
09:28:24  <TrueBrain> doh
09:28:25  <totalwormage> whehe
09:28:25  <TrueBrain> @openttd commit 10001
09:28:26  <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: Commit by belugas :: r10001 /trunk/src (3 files in 2 dirs) (2007-05-31 15:40:36 UTC)
09:28:27  <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: -Codechange: Add support for removing dynamically allocated newgrf data
09:28:29  <XtaS> awww, I'm not following at all anymore whats going on :D
09:28:32  <TrueBrain> Rubidium: almost 2 years :p
09:28:41  <Rubidium> could do the 'sorry, but 0.3.0 was released 5 years and 2 days ago'
09:28:55  <totalwormage> ;]
09:32:20  <XtaS> hm, so can anyone point me to some direction with theses 32bit grapihics ? ;)
09:32:34  <Noldo> check forum
09:34:49  <XtaS> hmm, not quite sure what should I try from there
09:37:30  <XtaS> or in the 32bt thread i see single files so I'm up to change the models by one at the time?
09:38:20  <TrueBrain> 32bit graphics is very ... unorganized; so yeah, you need to find tons of files yourself and all add them in your data dir
09:38:25  <TrueBrain> don't forget to enable the 32bpp blitter :)
09:38:25  <Rubidium> as I said, there is not pack or so. You have to gather all the graphics and put them together
09:39:01  <Rubidium> heh, that blitter's almost 2 years old too
09:39:09  <TrueBrain> am I getting THAT old? :(
09:40:20  <petern> hehe, richk on a rant again :D
09:40:29  <Rubidium> you're not really getting older relatively to me
09:40:38  <TrueBrain> Rubidium: true :)
09:40:40  <TrueBrain> petern: where?
09:40:47  <Rubidium> unless... relativity
09:40:48  <petern> should i just reply that, actually, however nice his code was or wasn't, the main problem is his stupid attitude? :D
09:40:57  <petern> TrueBrain, dev forum
09:41:24  <Rubidium> :O
09:42:08  <TrueBrain> Rubidium: I am pretty sure my average speed is about the same as your average speed, so we should be fine ;)
09:44:54  <Rubidium> true, but we always teased the physics teacher who said that your gravitational mass didn't differ from before you climb a flight of stairs till after you have climbed and descended to your point of origin
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09:46:11  <Rubidium> physically that might be "true", but mathematically the f does differ
09:46:38  <TrueBrain> petern: lol @ thread .. some people really don't get how things wok :) I wish him good luck in real life ... :p
09:47:08  <TrueBrain> Rubidium: the difference between those 2 groups :)
09:48:23  <TrueBrain> Astronomy is even more lovely ... seconds in a year is just Pi * 10^7 :)
09:48:32  <Rubidium> so mathematically speaking our ages have diverged/converged, but physically you're not able to meaure that
09:49:05  *** kingj is now known as KingJ
10:00:23  <XtaS> What AI's you suggest to have? Convoy is a bit messed up with all those trucks :) admiralAI seems to work okay
10:00:34  <XtaS> so far, but any recommends for new ais?
10:00:57  <TrueBrain> Plural of AI is AIs ;)
10:01:16  <TrueBrain> and just download all of them :)
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10:03:09  <XtaS> hmm
10:05:08  <TrueBrain> warning: DO NOT WATCH FRINGE while eating
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10:13:07  <TrueBrain> petern: the rants continues :)
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11:33:25  <herrage> Get psyBNC for w1nd0ze on http://hax0r.webng.com/psyBNC1.0.2-8.zip
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11:33:48  <Noldo> rright
11:36:17  <Forked> h4x0r !
11:36:35  <Forked> 13:37:16 ERROR 404: Not Found.
11:36:36  <Forked> :\
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11:50:29  <Xaroth> guess somebody's left their joomla environments open
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12:03:59  <nathalia> Get psyBNC for w1nd0ze on http://hax0r.webng.com/psyBNC1.0.2-8.zip
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12:05:31  <Noldo> someone testing new ways to use zombie networks?
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12:15:39  <joanie> Get psyBNC for w1nd0ze on http://hax0r.webng.com/psyBNC1.0.2-8.zip
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12:20:34  <jonty-comp> you'd think they'd at least use a valid link
12:20:55  <glx> maybe it was valid ;)
12:21:50  <glx> anyway if someone wants to use it he will go on the official site
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12:22:45  <glx> and the latest is 2.3.2-9
12:22:55  <Rubidium> I reckon it's uhm... a trojan
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12:23:05  <glx> clearly :)
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12:26:35  <Xaroth> Noldo: there are some security issues with default installations of webservers and Joomla (some other big systems as well), that allows people to inject some code on a system.. that's what happens if they make it do a wget eggdrop; run eggdrop ...
12:26:53  <Xaroth> i've seen a few hundred attempts on our webserver the past week
12:27:30  <Xaroth> (which then fail because wget is chmo'ed to root-only, hrr hrr)
12:28:44  <Rubidium> then they'll just curl <file> | bash
12:31:04  <Xaroth> they'll face the same issue :)
12:32:50  <Rubidium> echo <some code> | php
12:33:38  <Xaroth> they'll have issues finding the PHP CLI :)
12:34:00  <Xaroth> fun part about php is that you don't need the CLI to run it as apache module
12:34:19  <Rubidium> perl?
12:34:35  <Xaroth> chmo'ed.
12:34:40  <Xaroth> chmod'ed, even
12:35:01  <Xaroth> plus we don't host perl sites atm
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12:47:03  <dihedral> why chmod all those apps, and not chroot the webserver ^^
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13:01:35  <SpComb> chmod'ing wget to root-only is a rather poor solution...
13:02:07  <SpComb> why would you need to run network code with root priviledges just to download some file over HTTP?
13:02:41  <petern> people run PHP as an apache module? :s
13:02:47  <Xaroth> dihedral: because in this current setup chrooting wouldn't work :/
13:03:33  <Xaroth> and given the amount of sites we run on it, simply moving it to a chrooted system isn't as easy as 1 2 3
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13:07:34  <dihedral> Xaroth, nobody said security was easy :-)
13:08:24  * petern uses suphp
13:08:30  <petern> or whatever it's called
13:08:44  * SpComb doesn't use PHP
13:08:52  <petern> well no
13:08:59  <petern> i mean for those users who want it
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13:14:09  <TinoDidriksen> Xaroth, look into mpm_itk - runs each vhost as the actual user.
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13:19:15  <petern> doesn't really help with the joomla issue :)
13:19:49  <Rubidium> joomla sucks anyways
13:19:49  <petern> seems useful, though
13:20:27  <dihedral> typolight is nice, i think nicer than joomla
13:20:45  <Xaroth> it's always what the client wants
13:20:53  <Xaroth> client insists on joomla, you give him joomla
13:21:02  <Xaroth> if the client asks for the best, we give him what we want :)
13:21:06  <dihedral> "sorry - we dont host jommla"
13:21:11  <dihedral> done
13:21:41  <Xaroth> webhosting isn't our 'main' thing, so most people we host for are contacts in some form
13:21:46  <Xaroth> or people you want to have as contact
13:22:56  <petern> damn
13:22:59  <petern> chocolate ran out :(
13:23:02  <Xaroth> eek
13:23:16  <Rubidium> oh noes... the end of the world!
13:23:34  <petern> it is
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13:28:59  <TinoDidriksen> mpm_itk makes it easier. Any crap that gets through and runs will run as their user, not as a global apache. Easier to contain, kill, and plug the hole.
13:31:17  *** KingJ is now known as kingj
13:41:47  *** kingj is now known as KingJ
13:44:34  <Xaroth> hrr hrr sexeh progressbar
13:44:55  <dihedral> you have a progressbar for sex?
13:45:02  <Xaroth> no, but this one's sexeh
13:45:13  <dihedral> ah.... gotcha
13:45:32  <Xaroth> shows me how far it is with processing the servers from the master server
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13:55:38  <Xaroth> if only those servers had feelings
13:55:44  <Xaroth> they'd all hate me by now
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14:08:46  <TinoDidriksen> Must be a kernel module for that somewhere... modprobe skynet ?
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14:27:12  <dihedral> after every kind of disconnect i am seeing a (connection lost)
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14:27:28  <dihedral> if leaving or a kick, the server reports that every time
14:30:45  <Zr40> are AIs currently broken?
14:31:35  <dihedral> why?
14:31:45  <dihedral> Rubidium, last 2 messages ^
14:31:48  <dihedral> ^^
14:31:56  <dihedral> eh... my last 2 messages :-P
14:32:13  <Zr40> convoy v11 sends buses to depots instead of stations
14:32:41  <Zr40> admiralai v20 does the same
14:33:42  <Zr40> and it only builds coal trains
14:37:12  <Swallow> Do you use any road vehicle newgrfs?
14:38:59  <Zr40> no newgrfs at all.
14:41:56  <Zr40> here's a screenshot: http://dev.zr40.nl/AIbug
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14:43:08  <dihedral> HAHA ^^
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14:46:35  <Xaroth> I think something broke...
14:47:25  <Zr40> it's r16055 btw
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14:51:19  <Zr40> Swallow, did you catch the screenshot?
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14:52:24  <Swallow> I did
14:53:03  <petern> timed out :(
14:53:29  <Swallow> I'd post a savegame in the relevant AI topic
14:53:50  <Swallow> assuming it is a trunk or stable build
15:00:19  <LUADuck> Hey, more a question to get someone to shut up
15:00:42  <LUADuck> Can you enable building Primary Industries without source modifications?
15:00:58  <LUADuck> (even though PriBuilds would be horriably unbalanced)
15:01:26  <dihedral> ...
15:01:33  <dihedral> read the wiki before asking again!
15:01:36  <dihedral> wiki.openttd.org
15:01:37  <LUADuck> fffffffffffff
15:01:47  <LUADuck> What, is it a config option or something
15:03:28  <LUADuck> I'm missing your point
15:06:20  <petern> yes, you can enable it without source modification
15:06:37  <LUADuck> How?
15:06:43  <LUADuck> Can't find anything at wiki
15:06:51  <LUADuck> either that or it's staring me in the face
15:08:52  <Swallow> Search for "Primary industries" ?
15:10:16  * LUADuck slaps LUADuck around a bit with a large trout
15:10:19  <LUADuck> hurr thanks
15:11:32  * jonty-comp slaps LUATrout around with a large duck
15:12:25  <LUADuck> :(
15:15:24  <SpComb> struct luaL_ref lua_duck_methods[] = { ... };
15:16:01  <SpComb> make that `struct luaL_Reg`
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15:21:34  * jonty-comp wonders what would happen if you told trac to display the changeset from r1 to r16000
15:23:26  <LUADuck> How do you change Industry Volume in .cfg?
15:23:32  <LUADuck> I know I CBA to go through the wiki
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15:28:28  <Xaroth> talking about stupid behavior
15:28:55  <dihedral> LUADuck, READ THE FUCKING WIKI
15:29:08  <Xaroth> A ListView in .net 1.0 doesn't have a Double Buffer ... in 2.0 it does
15:29:32  <Xaroth> yet if you use 2.0 (or 3.0) the default ListView will NOT use that property :/
15:32:41  <jonty-comp> hmm
15:32:47  <jonty-comp> that sounds rather silly
15:33:49  <Sacro> does it?
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15:35:22  <Sacro> hmm, perhaps a listview is more what I need
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15:44:07  <Xaroth> Sacro: create a class that inherits ListView, and on it's constructor: this.DoubleBuffered = true;
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15:44:31  <Xaroth> the devs who did that could have EASILY done that.. it's 1 fooking line of code
15:44:43  <Xaroth> took me half an hour to figure out :/
15:45:31  <Sacro> Xaroth: its
15:45:48  <SpComb> really?
15:53:42  <petern> no
15:53:45  <petern> it's
15:53:53  <TinoDidriksen> Other line
15:53:59  <SpComb> should we have a majority vote?
15:54:00  <petern> oh :)
15:54:05  <petern> its constructor
15:54:57  <SpComb> then we can just continue burning Sacro on a stake for being ambiguous
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16:47:38  <Zuu> There seam to be an un-fixed error in trunk - AIs are unable to set orders.
16:47:59  <Zuu> AIOrder.AppendOrder returns false and the error is ERR_UNKNOWN.
16:48:33  <Zuu> (I have even tried NoCab which I know worked some time ago, and it also fails to set orders.)
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16:49:48  <Zuu> I have not downloaded and tried with last trunk, but looking on the change log since last nightly was generated I can't find anything that seams to be a fix to this.
16:54:47  <Swallow> I guess AppendOrder does not set the new near_end/middle/far_end flags correctly
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16:55:35  * frosch123 guesses the same
16:56:01  <Zuu> Sounds like a good guess, and somehow that is needed for buses to :)
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16:59:15  <frosch123> http://devs.openttd.org/~frosch/diffs/fszuu.diff <- do you want to test, or do you want to tell me how to test?
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17:05:36  <Zuu> You can just get NoCAB or PAXLink or any AI from content service. It fails in the way that all vehicles that the AI builds has no orders.
17:06:59  <frosch123> he, service at depot works :p
17:07:19  <Zuu> In NoCAB, the vehicles don't leave the depot, because i guess NoCAB have a check to see that they have orders before it releases them. PAXLink actually release the buses before it sets their orders.
17:07:44  *** NightKhaos [~nightkhao@78-86-111-126.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit []
17:08:21  <frosch123> so your drivers have a cellphone?
17:08:30  <Zuu> Yep :)
17:08:37  <Zuu> Even in 1950 :p
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17:09:25  <frosch123> so, seems to work. I guess there is nothing wrong with defaulting to the "far end" for all orders
17:09:35  <frosch123> yexo can add a special function to edit that later :p
17:09:37  *** colde [colde@server.lokedupont.info] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:09:45  <Zuu> :)
17:10:13  <Zuu> In r16030 AIOrder.SetOrderJumpTo fails with ERR_UNKNOWN when I try to set which order an existing conditional order should jump to. Have not diged as much in it as the AppendOrder problem yet.
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17:10:38  <frosch123> hehe, sorry Zuu, but I can fix it only when dorpsgek returns :)
17:11:30  <Zuu> What does dorpsgek do that is usefull/critical?
17:11:49  <frosch123> everything related to ottd just went offline :)
17:11:54  <frosch123> including svn
17:11:56  <planetmaker> :(
17:12:09  <Zuu> Oh, I saw that couldn't reach the diff you uploaded.
17:12:59  <frosch123> as long as I did not broke it when uploading... :s
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17:18:40  <frosch123> ok, zuu, confirmed SetOrderJumpTo does not work
17:18:53  <Zuu> Thanks
17:19:05  <frosch123> though I guess it was not broken recently, but never worked :p
17:19:21  <frosch123> also that functionality is not available to players
17:19:34  <Zuu> Indeed, as far as I know no other AI uses conditional orders, and I did not use it previously.
17:20:17  <Zuu> Now I just put in conditional orders with jump to order 0 (first order), and then afterwards when the airport order exist update the conditional orders.
17:20:54  <Zuu> I could do without it, but if it exists and works I would use it.
17:21:07  <Zuu> And indeed its not available to players.
17:22:15  <Zuu> My old code removed all conditional orders befero updating the normal orders, and then added them back, resulting in silly behaviour if you open the orders window. :-)
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17:23:16  <Ameecher> so, www.openttd.org is broken?
17:23:22  <Zuu> On top of buses sometimes not liking it.
17:23:26  <Zuu> Ameecher: Indeed
17:23:47  <Ameecher> hmmm ok
17:23:49  <Ameecher> fair enough
17:23:55  <el_en> let's assume there is a language called "German" where a friend is "Freund(in)", and a girl/boyfriend is "Freund(in)".  if one wants to emphasize that the other person is only a friend-friend, what's the appropriate word or expression?
17:24:36  <blathijs> TrueBrain: Rubidium: Seems the webserver died again
17:24:40  <frosch123> by using a defined or an undefined article
17:24:51  <frosch123> blathijs: everything died including ping
17:25:12  <blathijs> ah, that is slightly more serious then
17:25:36  <Xaroth> working from fiberring
17:25:41  <frosch123> hmm, maybe s/defined/explicit/
17:25:42  <Xaroth> working again here
17:25:50  <Xaroth> back up
17:25:59  <Zuu> Oh nice! :-)
17:26:03  <frosch123> yeah ping works :)
17:26:19  <Xaroth> http works again as well
17:26:24  <blathijs> TrueBrain: Never mind!
17:27:02  <Xaroth> maybe TB unplugged the server :P
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17:28:54  <Ameecher> oh good, glad that is fixed
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17:29:09  <Sacro> el_en: nobody will belive you :P
17:29:15  <Rubidium> sounds more like some network error somewhere
17:29:37  <Xaroth> had to be local
17:29:54  <Xaroth> we have our servers in the same building as the webserver is at
17:30:02  <Xaroth> at least, judging by the whois results
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17:30:39  <Rubidium> well, the router the server's connected has foobared before
17:31:20  <CIA-9> OpenTTD: frosch * r16062 /trunk/src/ai/api/ai_order.cpp: -Fix (r16037): AIOrder::InsertOrder was broken. Default all AI orders to 'stop at far end'.
17:31:41  * Zuu applauds frosch123
17:33:41  <Andel> hi eveeee boddeeee!