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Log for #openttd on 28th May 2009:
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00:00:11  <SmatZ> SineDeviance: see the archive ;) http://www.openttdcoop.org/wiki/PublicServer:Archive_-_Games_121_-_130
00:00:21  <SmatZ> SineDeviance: :-)
00:00:21  <SineDeviance> that game was running on a 3.2ghz p4 prescott and 1gig of ram and was getting slow
00:00:49  <Yexo> well, a 2048x2048 map is 4 times as big as a 1024x1024 map
00:03:20  <SineDeviance> SmatZ, yeah those openttdcoop guys are insane
00:03:40  <SineDeviance> honestly i find their designs are more pretty than practical
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00:04:51  <Eddi|zuHause> did you look at other coop games than i did?
00:05:08  <SineDeviance> Eddi|zuHause, such as?
00:05:23  <Yexo> more pretty than practical? That's the first time I've heard that said about openttdcoop designs
00:05:39  <Eddi|zuHause> "pretty" is not the association that i would get
00:05:59  <SineDeviance> Yexo, well... i've played on openttdcoop a few times and it seems like it's mostly about tying up the network
00:06:14  <SineDeviance> that's all well and good but i prefer to make the most profit in the shortest amount of time. the network can come later
00:06:56  <KenjiE20> you can run anything smooth pretty much
00:07:09  <KenjiE20> whether or not your clients can connect is something else :P
00:07:21  <SineDeviance> yeah bandwidth
00:08:43  <SineDeviance> KenjiE20, you have any of those savegames/autosaves from the BuF nightly server?
00:09:09  <KenjiE20> there still in that thread thing in the groups on BuF
00:09:16  <Yexo> SineDeviance: profit is way too easy, running a network with as many trains as possible is much more fun
00:09:37  <SineDeviance> Yexo, i agree, but it's good to have enough money to build that network too :D
00:09:44  <KenjiE20> Moneymakers
00:09:50  <SineDeviance> my favorite thing is goods lines
00:09:58  <Yexo> sure, but with a few well-chosen train lines money is no problem anymore
00:10:11  <SineDeviance> i like to get as much raw resource as possible going to a factory then offload all of it to large cities
00:10:14  <KenjiE20> or a nice long distance air pax
00:10:40  <SineDeviance> i love having trains that make 10 mil a year profit
00:10:44  <SineDeviance> longt trains too :D
00:10:47  <SineDeviance> long* even
00:12:44  <SineDeviance> KenjiE20, you are the man :D
00:13:09  <KenjiE20> i've been trying to tell people that for years, but noooo..
00:13:10  <KenjiE20> :P
00:13:14  <SineDeviance> haha
00:13:43  <SmatZ> :)
00:14:00  * SmatZ likes air routes for MM too... if town growth is disabled :-P
00:14:09  <KenjiE20> hehe
00:17:45  <SineDeviance> KenjiE20, these are all the saves right?
00:17:53  <KenjiE20> pretty much
00:18:04  <SineDeviance> darn :( well thanks anyways :D
00:18:06  <KenjiE20> i think one or two went missing
00:18:29  <KenjiE20> well iirc one that no one played and one before we started autosaving
00:18:39  <SineDeviance> yeah
00:18:39  <SmatZ> hmm someone said he has PSG#135 save...
00:18:50  <KenjiE20> smatz; really?
00:18:52  <KenjiE20> cool
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00:18:54  <SineDeviance> the one before the autosaves is probably the one im looking for
00:18:59  <SmatZ> KenjiE20: yeah, but long time ago :(
00:19:07  <SineDeviance> yea
00:19:14  <KenjiE20> wasn't boothy nubkins was it?
00:19:19  <SmatZ> hehehe
00:25:02  <SineDeviance> well i started a new map 1024x1024. we'll see how it runs after a while :D
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00:25:36  <glx> the main problem with big maps is people taking too much time to log in
00:25:53  <KenjiE20> ^
00:25:58  <glx> so you may see a bunch of join/kick
00:26:23  <SineDeviance> i see
00:26:25  <KenjiE20> tends to be reasonable up to about 600+ trains
00:26:52  <glx> because when someone joins, it must perform all commands issued during the download in a short time
00:28:04  <glx> commands include vehicle movement, and all other state changes
00:28:39  <SmatZ> the game is paused... during download? (if enabled)
00:28:59  <glx> it's paused only when the sync phase IIRC
00:29:04  <KenjiE20> ^ yea
00:29:16  <KenjiE20> at least that's how I've noticed it
00:29:43  <glx> imagine if someone needs 5 minutes to download the save
00:31:39  * glx checks the source to be sure
00:33:00  <glx> yes it's paused once the client got the map
00:33:22  <SmatZ> ok :)
00:33:39  <Aali> can you make it pause during the entire download?
00:34:50  <KenjiE20> what if someone decides to cancel during, the game would just pause randomly all the time?
00:35:15  <glx> and I heard the download stall for some crappy wifi routers
00:36:04  <Aali> it's a simple question but sure, go ahead and spew criticism instead :P
00:36:16  <glx> Aali: it's very easy to write a client to block server :)
00:36:39  <Aali> I think it would it be nice to have as an option
00:36:57  <SmatZ> timeout is certainly needed
00:37:10  <SmatZ> there has to be timeout in current trunk anyway
00:38:43  <KenjiE20> that's the train
00:38:46  <KenjiE20> whoops
00:38:56  <Aali> you can do all sorts of nasty stuff already
00:38:58  <SmatZ> maybe the timeout to drop a client could be made longer for newly connected clients
00:39:02  <SmatZ> KenjiE20: indeed
00:39:12  <Aali> but for trusted networks where you want to make sure noone drops it would be okay
00:40:01  <glx> ,...,...,...,...\/* Set the status to DONE_MAP, no we will wait for the client
00:40:01  <glx> ,...,...,...,... *  to send it is ready (maybe that happens like never ;)) */
00:40:21  <glx> the comment tells there's no timeout
00:40:39  <SmatZ> hmm
00:41:07  <Aali> there's obivously a timeout since people drop if they're not fast enough ;)
00:41:16  <Aali> *obviously
00:41:30  <glx> not for the download I think
00:42:03  <SmatZ> Aali: not that obviously, maybe they fail to execute packets they received during "catching up" in time
00:42:31  <Aali> say what?
00:42:53  <Aali> glx: oh, thats what you were talking about, I see
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00:43:49  <KenjiE20> aali, so you mean like a whitelist for clients it's okay to wait a bit longer to 'turbo' up to the current point from the save?
00:44:31  <Aali> KenjiE20: no I mean it would be okay to pause during download on some servers
00:44:58  <Aali> so you don't have to deal with the catch-up phase at all
00:45:01  <glx> never trust clients
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04:18:56  <Nite_Owl> Hello all
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07:26:51  <Pizen> hello
07:27:54  <Pizen> is there some special thing I need to do to english.txt? Building from trunk works fine, but just opening and saving that file makes the language generation fail
07:28:08  <Pizen> it should be noted I am using windows
07:29:31  <Rubidium> use an editor that doesn't add a BOM to the language file maybe?
07:29:38  <Pizen> yeah, I just did and it worked
07:29:49  <Pizen> yet another reason to loathe notepad
07:29:54  <Pizen> thanks, though
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07:30:17  <Pizen> annoying how I seem to find the answers just after I've asked the questions
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07:35:45  <planetmaker> moin :)
07:35:53  <planetmaker> hehe @ Pizen :)
07:36:01  <planetmaker> at least it wasn't in vain then :)
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07:38:56  <Pizen> shush!
07:39:07  <Pizen> also good morning!
07:39:27  <Pizen> hmm, a friend has asked me to try battlefield 2142. So far I am not impressed
07:46:28  <planetmaker> yes. OpenTTD is more adicting ;)
07:59:13  <Pizen> indeed
07:59:25  <Pizen> except its effect on my dreaming is a bit disturbing
07:59:26  <Pizen> >>
08:00:14  <Noldo> I remember I stopped playing Popylous 3 when the little men came to my dreams
08:00:26  <Pizen> that's "The Beginning" one, right?
08:00:57  <Pizen> I used to play that one - not so much as to start dreaming about it though
08:05:20  <Pizen> hmm, if hosting a multiplayer game with, say, a "no random opening of industries" patch ... do both the client and server need that, or just the server?
08:09:22  <petern> if it's a patch, both need it
08:09:43  <petern> if it's a grf, er, both need it too, but that's simpler to arrange
08:14:09  <z-MaTRiX> brb
08:14:22  <Pizen> well, I was just led to some client-only patches yesterday
08:14:51  <Pizen> and thought that maybe only the person doing the maths needed it
08:17:23  <Noldo> openttd simulation is run on the server and all the clients parallel
08:17:33  <Noldo> random events are part of that simulation
08:18:02  <petern> simulation?
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08:19:18  <planetmaker> Pizen, : client-only patches are patches which do not affect the game.
08:19:55  <planetmaker> E.g. some patches which only add features to the graphical interface (like improved sorting, re-arranging buttons and window contents)
08:21:07  <planetmaker> But no features in terms of what is available, what can be done in general, how any object (vehicles, industries, towns,...) in the game behave.
08:21:42  <planetmaker> those patches are - if they're clean and propper - safe for use on an unpatched server.
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08:26:53  <z-MaTRiX> reloaded
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08:59:04  <Pizen> planetmaker, thanks for that
08:59:12  <Pizen> fonsinchen, I assume you're fonsy on the forums?
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09:06:22  <fonsinchen> Yes
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09:31:33  <hzss> hi people
09:32:44  <planetmaker> hi
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09:42:07  <Pizen> fonsinchen, then I think there's something wrong with the cargodist r16451 patch. Not that it matters much ...
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09:49:15  <fonsinchen> what is wrong?
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09:53:24  <Pizen> well, maybe the problem is windows' patch.exe, but it says the patch file is malformatted (and subsequently crashes)
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09:57:25  <fonsinchen> patch 2.5.9 on Linux does accept it.
09:57:42  <fonsinchen> what is the exact output?
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10:02:21  <Pizen> just a min
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10:04:27  <Pizen> http://pastebay.com/18516
10:04:30  <petern> windows' patch.exe is not patch
10:04:39  <Pizen> no
10:04:42  <Pizen> I know
10:04:52  <petern> ah, you've installed the right one
10:04:53  <petern> however
10:04:55  <petern> it is crap
10:05:02  <petern> because it blows up due to linefeed type
10:05:02  <Pizen> yet still it might hint at some irregularity in the patch file
10:05:05  <petern> crlf vs lf
10:05:19  <Pizen> well, I already unix2dos'd it
10:05:49  <Pizen> ... apparently, I redownloaded it since then
10:05:51  <Pizen> as that did it
10:05:55  <Pizen> well, nevermind that
10:06:02  * Pizen comes off as such a newbie
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10:34:51  <Pizen> planetmaker, you there?
10:35:19  <planetmaker> hm, yes
10:35:50  <Pizen> alright. Are you the go-to-person regarding 2CC?
10:35:56  <Pizen> trainset thing?
10:36:02  <planetmaker> one of them, yes.
10:36:53  <planetmaker> probably doesn't matter here, but the lead developer is DJNekkid, though :)
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10:38:28  <Pizen> alright. Apparently, I can't connect any MU Express wagons to the Sm2 engine
10:38:42  <Pizen> is that something you know about?
10:38:55  <Pizen> (MU PAX works just fine=
10:39:05  <Pizen> *fine
10:39:58  <planetmaker> I didn't know until right now
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10:40:10  <dragonhorseboy> hey
10:40:20  <Pizen> hello
10:40:30  <dragonhorseboy> how're you pizen?
10:40:36  <planetmaker> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/2cctrainset/issues <-- and doesn't seem to be mentioned in our list of bug reports :)
10:40:39  <Pizen> quite alright, thanks
10:40:45  <planetmaker> Pizen, care to add it, there, Pizen?
10:40:52  <Pizen> you're part of openttdcoop
10:41:24  <Pizen> sure, but
10:41:50  <dragonhorseboy> doing ok here..just got up :P heh
10:41:59  <dragonhorseboy> which country you from pizen? canada here
10:41:59  <Pizen> how?
10:42:07  <Pizen> oh, Denmark. 12:41 here
10:42:13  <Pizen> I got up about 5 hours ago though
10:42:14  <dragonhorseboy> denmark...heh nice
10:42:22  <dragonhorseboy> 6:42am here
10:42:24  <Pizen> quite
10:42:38  <planetmaker> Pizen, you just click on "new issue" and add fill in your bug report :)
10:42:54  <dragonhorseboy> pizen you ever gone to watch your real trains? just asking
10:43:11  <Pizen> planetmaker, I need to register first
10:43:22  <Pizen> dragonhorseboy, every time I am at the station
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10:43:33  <Pizen> which, incidentally, is the second largest in the country
10:43:53  <dragonhorseboy> pizen I've seen a variety of them in magazines and websites .. I still think these old GM-built NoHab's are some interesting vintage locomotives
10:43:58  <Pizen> I ran around drawing maps of the tracks of the entire place last year
10:44:30  <Pizen> oh, older trains... Not really, it's not something I am especially interested in - well, not more than most others, anyway
10:44:47  <dragonhorseboy> there's just something about a carbody diesel with cabs at both ends (compared to north america where 99% of them are either single cab or booster units .. 1% being one particular fallen flag actually had a few E units with cabs at both ends)
10:44:47  <Pizen> we had an old locomotive just outside my flat the last place I lived, though ... let me see if I can find it
10:44:59  * Pizen is clueless
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10:45:52  <dragonhorseboy> pizen but either way most of the magazine sources I have is 'today's railway: europe' issues .. they often take 2-4 weeks to finally show up at the local magazine stores here but I don't really care as its better than nothing
10:46:16  <dragonhorseboy> its the only magazine I can find for anything trains *outside* north america .. so go figure with that :p
10:46:35  <planetmaker> hm... No anonymous bug reports? hm... I'll discuss that. You could, of course, register and become a regular tester of e.g. that train set and maybe also OpenGFX :)
10:46:51  <Pizen> are you handling opengfx as well?
10:46:52  <planetmaker> For the latter we just think of implementing something like a nightly build
10:47:15  <Pizen> well, I am contemplating getting seriously into OpenTTD as more than just a player
10:47:16  <planetmaker> That repository is on that server, too, yes.
10:47:18  <dragonhorseboy> pizen just asking what you're clueless on?
10:47:30  <Pizen> most of what you said about those locomotives ^^;
10:48:50  <Pizen> planetmaker, sounds awesome. OpenGFX was the very first project I really cared for
10:49:01  <dragonhorseboy> pizen..heh well 'carbody' was often the name for these earlier streamlined diesels (as the body was built in similar frame manner like your road car so) .. and 'booster' is just basically a whole locomotive but sometimes with no cabs (or existing one boarded up) so basically its mu-ed to another unit
10:49:05  <dragonhorseboy> hope that helped you
10:49:08  <Pizen> anyway, adding the issue now
10:49:26  <Pizen> hmm, a bit
10:49:34  <planetmaker> we as openttdcoop try to provide an easy-to-use environment for community projects... so in a certain way I might have hands in all the projects listed there... as I'm one of the server admins.
10:49:49  <Pizen> I see
10:49:50  <dragonhorseboy> pizen even some north america railroading terms escape me at times too tho so you're not alone in being clueless :->
10:49:55  <planetmaker> Pizen, then it's a good time to start with OpenGFX now :)
10:50:02  <Pizen> =)
10:50:14  <Pizen> well, I have been lurking around the openttdcoop wiki for quite some time
10:50:21  <planetmaker> We just made the sources available there - and additional developers / contributors on that project are highly welcome
10:50:21  <Pizen> even had a look at some of the save games
10:50:33  <dragonhorseboy> pizen here's one I do know tho... "soak her!' steam era quote re to plug up the brakes and dump sand as hard as it can go
10:50:52  <dragonhorseboy> not sure why they used these two particular words but what do I know
10:51:05  <planetmaker> And regardless what OS you have you should in principle now be able to build the current status of OpenGFX :)
10:51:43  <dragonhorseboy> planetmaker just so i get it right.. opengfx was the base graphic replacement to the point it'll finally not need ttdx files anymore right?
10:51:54  <planetmaker> dragonhorseboy, yes, exactly
10:52:14  <dragonhorseboy> planetmaker I looked at some of that threads before for some sprites but hadn't looked for several months now
10:52:23  <dragonhorseboy> hey reldred you around? :)
10:52:45  <Pizen> planetmaker, great - I intend to be on linux again shortly. As soon as I get my laptop back, in fact.
10:52:56  <Pizen> Right now I've just barely set up this computer for building openttd
10:53:09  <planetmaker> dragonhorseboy, we just made yesterday an up2date list on what is missing and added it to our bug tracker so we really have everything missing or buggy at a glance now
10:53:29  <planetmaker> Pizen, if you can build openttd you basically have everything you need
10:53:36  <planetmaker> for grf development, too
10:53:56  <planetmaker> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/2cctrainset/files <-- grab renum and grfcodec and you're set.
10:54:00  <Pizen> "where do i put patch file to make work with openttd resources!!"
10:54:05  <planetmaker> (add them to your search path, though)
10:54:05  <Pizen> sorry about that
10:54:13  <planetmaker> hehe :)
10:54:18  <dragonhorseboy> pizen roughly how large is the station like..re the one you go to?  the one nearest here is basically a 2-floor-tall boxy building with a decent hall+seating space .. facing six 8cars-long (I guess?) tracks although usually only one or two are actually ever used
10:54:21  <Pizen> woah woah, relax now
10:54:35  <Pizen> I'm not just going to jump in and start developing. As said, not before I get my proper computer back
10:55:01  <Pizen> not that big. It's about ... 12 tracks, I think, no idea how long
10:55:02  <dragonhorseboy> planetmaker where's the up2date list out of curiousity?
10:55:07  <Pizen> let me find a top-down
10:55:23  <dragonhorseboy> pizen not a large city over there neither?
10:55:41  <Pizen> it's the third largest city in Denmark
10:55:46  <Pizen> not that that makes it large =P
10:55:50  <planetmaker> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/opengfx/issues <-- @ dragonhorseboy
10:55:50  <dragonhorseboy> ah...heh
10:56:03  <planetmaker> you can filter by bug, feature (missing graphics etc) and other stuff
10:56:21  <dragonhorseboy> ah ok
10:56:45  <Pizen> http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Odense,+Denmark&sll=36.385913,-91.582031&sspn=51.721671,77.695313&ie=UTF8&ll=55.400963,10.383861&spn=0.009065,0.018969&t=h&z=16
10:56:49  <Pizen> horrible quality though
10:56:53  <dragonhorseboy> how often are you cracking openttd yourself planetmaker? (well..not literally..you know :p )
10:57:03  <planetmaker> you mean, compiling the source?
10:57:18  <dragonhorseboy> compile...making sprites..whatever ;)
10:57:32  <planetmaker> depends. Now that I started with 2cctrainset and OpenGFX it, of course, cuts on medding with the code of OpenTTD itself
10:57:34  <dragonhorseboy> pizen heh turntable next to station .. thats quite rare over the ocean here
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10:58:56  <Pizen> I wouldn't know about that
10:59:09  <planetmaker> but OpenGFX is IMO important. It'd be really cool, if OpenTTD could ship with a full set of base graphics :) - no need for all those "where are those files?" questions :)
10:59:19  <dragonhorseboy> pizen I would had rather liked that station a lot more than any that i can find within 200km from here :|
10:59:24  <Pizen> yes, exactly the reason I cared for it
10:59:32  <dragonhorseboy> even if the turntable is dead..who the hell care...its nice for photoing at times :D
10:59:35  <Pizen> insisting that we use it =D
10:59:47  <Pizen> dragonhorseboy, =/
11:00:12  <Pizen> anyway, I'm in the middle of a game
11:00:13  <dragonhorseboy> pizen..I've got a few photos of turntables with humans on them (humans instead of trains...thats the little joke there) :)
11:00:24  <Pizen> wroom
11:01:00  <dragonhorseboy> planetmaker stupid question but would opengfx also resolve the replacement of sample.cat? (I never had any clue whatever that one file was for)
11:01:06  <Pizen> no, that's sound
11:01:18  <planetmaker> ^^
11:01:20  <dragonhorseboy> oh... I thought sound was the other files in gm folder
11:01:46  <Pizen> well, I hope I can help making OpenTTD available for the masses for free
11:01:50  <dragonhorseboy> because it was erroring if I didn't have sample.cat so I assumed it was to do with graphics
11:02:06  <Pizen> well the game needs sounds as well =)
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11:02:26  <dragonhorseboy> even with the sound settings disabled?
11:02:28  <dragonhorseboy> :P
11:03:32  <planetmaker> dragonhorseboy, it needs a sample.cat file. But the size of the file may be 0 bytes :)
11:03:55  <planetmaker> it contains the default sounds for trains, horns, choppers etc pp
11:03:58  <dragonhorseboy> either way how often both of you play openttd (and if you have them.. ttdx(p) too)
11:04:07  <dragonhorseboy> :)
11:04:51  <planetmaker> hm... meddle around with and play are completely different things :). I don't have TTDP running though (though I probably have it somewhere)
11:04:55  <Pizen> well, lately it's been quite a few hours every day. I created a nearly empty 512x512 scenario, and am having fun with cargodist
11:05:05  <planetmaker> I guess I look at it in some way daily :)
11:05:10  <dragonhorseboy> heh
11:06:46  <dragonhorseboy> well some good time ago I used to play openttd multiplayer a bit every few days aside to random ttdx-arctic and all three climates in the patch (temperate was usually german-russia based tho, dbsetxl etc) ....
11:07:10  <Pizen> actually, that turntable is part of the museum
11:07:34  <Pizen> well, I play multiplayer when I find people who want to play
11:07:59  <Pizen> I am a bit of a perfectionist though, so it can be quite difficult playing with me
11:08:10  <dragonhorseboy> now I've pretty much only got a single modified ttdx folder alone to play once in a while at times pretty much (openttd? was having enough trouble even getting anything above 053 to behave at all so deciding multiplayer wasn't really worth it I just kinda forgot about it for most part)
11:08:12  <planetmaker> dragonhorseboy, if I actually *play* openttd, it's on one of the coop servers, though. There are only very few exceptions to that rule :)
11:08:25  <dragonhorseboy> no offense meant on what I said of course ;)
11:09:13  <planetmaker> I join once a week or so our servers for longer than just having a short look what's going on.
11:10:44  <dragonhorseboy> I still sorta remember hosting two openttd-miniin servers once (one was with peter+sacro included, heh that was a bit of fun for as long as it lasted)
11:10:58  <dragonhorseboy> diagonal crossing, shared trackage rights, etc .. meh too much fun with these aspects
11:11:34  <dragonhorseboy> was a bit amusing to watch two different colours of trains running on one single 2-line mainline
11:12:25  <dragonhorseboy> have no idea where to find the mini-in's to download anymore for some time tho :|
11:12:32  <Pizen> yeah, stuff like that is why I don't find myself on some of the multiplayer servers
11:12:39  <Pizen> dragonhorseboy, they're discontinued
11:13:04  <dragonhorseboy> pizen 'discontinued' as in "we wiped all existence of it out"?
11:13:35  <dragonhorseboy> and pizen actually its not that bad..you just have to be willing to use the ingame chat feature to talk with other players about what to share and what not to
11:14:16  <dragonhorseboy> although one annoying bug was you couldn't delete a track stub of yours own if it was on a straight piece of another player's
11:14:41  <dragonhorseboy> so eg if you added a switch then later deleted the line .. the switch stub itself was still there unless the owner player removed it him/herself
11:15:08  <Pizen> dragonhorseboy, I meant
11:15:20  <dragonhorseboy> if I had known the mini-in build was going to be wiped off the web I would had not deleted my folder but aw well
11:15:21  <Pizen> I _want_ stuff like that, stuff like cargodist
11:15:30  <Pizen> oh I think they're still there somewhere
11:15:37  <dragonhorseboy> oh heh
11:15:40  <Pizen> stuff like infrastructure sharing
11:15:43  <dragonhorseboy> btw whats cargodist so I don't get confused?
11:15:49  <Pizen> it's the new cargodest =P
11:15:55  <dragonhorseboy> cargodest?
11:15:58  <Pizen> http://wiki.openttd.org/Passenger_and_cargo_distribution
11:16:02  <Pizen> that's cargodist
11:16:25  <Pizen> cargo and passengers have specific destinations instead of just wanting you to take them anywhere
11:16:51  <KingJ> Makes the game much more fun
11:17:08  <dragonhorseboy> hmm pizen I wouldn't like to ever play one bit with that but then to our own
11:17:29  <dragonhorseboy> I usually lay my express line more for aethestic reasons and re watching certain consists
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11:18:46  <dragonhorseboy> so eg if its a tiny town then its just a 2-tiles platform with an old dmu serving it verus a large city having well-signalled stub station with all these fancy long trains heading in and out of the junction
11:19:05  <dragonhorseboy> and the city stations often have 'wait for full load' on :)
11:19:47  <KingJ> Cargodist encourages me to build large networks linking every town, and having appropriate capacity on linking lines, hub stations etc
11:20:32  <Pizen> same, same
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11:20:49  <dragonhorseboy> kingj I don't find any point in hubs (all the track and signalling mess they cause mainly) .. I often deal with more or less linear networks (so sometimes the city station could actually be made up of two seperate networks where the only thing shared is the station name
11:20:57  <Pizen> I build for aesthetic reasons as well. But actually having passengers travel from place to place without me forcing them to transfer
11:21:12  <dragonhorseboy> I always create a ton of 2-stations-only lines both for freight and passengers
11:21:18  <dragonhorseboy> figured
11:21:48  <Pizen> it also gives me a reason to build metro networks =)
11:21:58  <KingJ> http://files.uploadffs.com/8/90f38b7f/UK_Ultraspeed_29th_Sep_2073.png - That's one of the hubs from my current game, linking 4 lines together
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