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Log for #openttd on 18th August 2009:
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00:00:08  <OwenS> I guess I'm just of the opinion that stuff people have paid money to the government for should be freely available - not available if you pay extra money
00:02:44  <R0b0t1> What do you mean gov't work?
00:03:01  <R0b0t1> I'm pretty sure it's free for the people, they just convince the gov't to fund something.
00:03:04  <OwenS> CSIRO is a government funded and owned research body
00:03:30  <OwenS> Which also is in the business of patent licensing (*cough* trollling *cough*)
00:03:39  <R0b0t1> hmm...
00:10:41  <Pygma> It's the citizens tax money that makes those things, I'd be of the opinion that all government produced stuff should be public domain
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00:32:13  <Jerimiah40> Standard cloverleaf junction sucks: Discuss
00:32:14  <Jerimiah40> :P
00:32:43  <Eddi|zuHause> your command is my ignorance...
00:34:46  <R0b0t1> It's decent
00:35:04  <R0b0t1> But i'd go for a star instead
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00:35:13  <R0b0t1> Not as "sharp"
00:42:29  <Eddi|zuHause> a cloverleaf causes frequent gridlocks when traffic increases
00:43:04  <Eddi|zuHause> especially when trains are longer than the "leaf"
00:43:22  <Eddi|zuHause> possibly path signals can help there
00:45:54  <OwenS> Cloverleafs must be made unacceptably huge with realistic acceleration. And even bigger if you have more than 1 line per direction :p
00:48:33  <OwenS> Cheeeky cat is trying to steal the milk from my cereal :p
00:49:44  <Eddi|zuHause> a ?esky cat?
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00:50:59  <OwenS> flaah
00:51:01  <OwenS> No
00:51:04  <OwenS> A little black cat :p
00:51:53  <Eddi|zuHause> and black cats can't come from czechia?
00:52:06  <OwenS> Well she's a British Shorthair, so no :p
00:53:21  <Jerimiah40> Yeah, I ended up doing the star with tunnels
00:53:31  <Jerimiah40> so hopefully it'll jam a little less often :P
00:54:02  <Jerimiah40> I spent about 2 years guiding trains through it, so I decided I'd have to do some construction :P
01:02:12  <Zuu> What about doing point to point, guarantied free from blocking ;)
01:02:32  <Jerimiah40> yeah, well :P
01:02:48  <Zuu> Or hitting the pause button, should be quite safe too ;)
01:02:55  <Jerimiah40> I'm playing multiplayer though
01:03:05  <Jerimiah40> the other guy tends to frown on that :P
01:03:14  <Zuu> hehe :-)
01:03:55  <Zuu> Doing custom-junctionts often save you a bit space. At least they usually don't require a lot of uniform space.
01:04:09  <Zuu> junctions*
01:04:38  <Jerimiah40> yeah... I haven't played the game in a LONG time though, so I'm kinda re-learning... I was never very good  with junctions to being with :P
01:05:22  <Zuu> Just start out small, trying to do split before merge whenever it is cheap and then expand as traffic grows.
01:06:15  <Jerimiah40> yeah... I think the problem now is that my two biggest stations are too close to the mainline
01:06:48  <Zuu> Sounds like an interesting problem to solve :-)
01:06:53  <Jerimiah40> lol, yeah
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06:49:20  <pavel1269> good morning
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07:23:46  <Terkhen> hello
07:24:21  <LordAzamath> hello
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07:56:51  <Yexo> good morning
07:57:00  <TrueBrain> morning Yexo
07:57:03  <TrueBrain> you are here early :p
07:57:12  <Yexo> hehe :)
07:57:24  <Yexo> I told you my summer job was ove :p
07:57:27  <LordAzamath> pfft early
07:57:31  <LordAzamath> it's 11 AM
07:57:41  <TrueBrain> clearly :)
07:57:45  <TrueBrain> so enjoying the good life now? :)
07:58:31  <Yexo> of course, two weeks holiday left :)
08:00:41  <TrueBrain> WHOHO!
08:01:06  <blathijs> hm?
08:01:21  <TrueBrain> Ammler: I did something I wasn't allowed to, either way, openttd.org MX is migrated to new mail filter .. you should now be able to deliver mail, even when you are flooding. If not: install SPF record :p (and give your DNS 3600 seconds to update :p)
08:01:32  <TrueBrain> oh no, a blathijs!
08:01:41  <TrueBrain> reminds me of what I was going to do today :p
08:08:38  <Yexo> TrueBrain: how much work would it be to generate 0.7 noai api docs next to trunk api docs?
08:12:38  <TrueBrain> I guess in the most optimal way you would have them stored per release
08:12:57  <TrueBrain> so that would mean it is one more thing on the todo list when releasing
08:13:35  <TrueBrain> maybe we should produce a .tar.gz out of it :p
08:15:25  <Yexo> I was thinking more of a webpage like noai.openttd.org/docs, but a bundle for releases is nice too :)
08:15:54  <TrueBrain> I will look it over .. please make a ticket in the ticket system for it ;)
08:15:57  <TrueBrain> (else I forget)
08:17:35  <Yexo> TrueBrain: "The subdomain you tried to access is not used." on secure.openttd.org/bugs
08:17:50  <Yexo> hmm, no I can access is again
08:18:48  <TrueBrain> after creating, it gives you that problem, yes
08:18:58  <TrueBrain> flyspray doesn't like non-absolute urls
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10:06:14  <Stefan__> Hello
10:07:52  <Yexo> hello Stefan__
10:08:16  <Stefan__> :o there are 2 other stefans already here.. let me change my name.
10:09:01  *** Stefan__ is now known as Kaas
10:09:18  <PeterT> Hi kaas
10:09:23  <Yexo> no other stefan in this channel
10:09:29  <Yexo> @seen Stefan
10:09:29  <DorpsGek> Yexo: I have not seen Stefan.
10:09:34  <Kaas> The 0.7.2 version really has a lot of new features
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10:10:17  <Kaas> oh, well my name was stefan__, but in my settings i have Stefan as my preferred name, then stefan_, then stefan__. so i just assumed that :)
10:10:37  <Biolunar> there are 2 more stefans
10:10:50  <Biolunar> not in this chan but on this server
10:10:51  <Yexo> there are some stefans, but not in this channel
10:11:16  <Kaas> Ohw right.. :) i last used IRC about 4 years ago
10:11:45  <Kaas> so i need to re-learn, hehe
10:12:55  <PeterT> yes kaas 0.7.2 is amazing
10:13:14  *** Eddi|zuHause2 is now known as Eddi|zuHause
10:13:26  <Kaas> i played the stable 0.6.3 a lot with a friend of mine, but stopped about 6 months ago
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10:14:15  <TrueBrain> Kaas .. I like the name ... /me goes to lunch .. cheese .. hmm ..
10:14:47  <Kaas> it didnt have the PBS signals, which are currently a bit inclear for me
10:15:00  <Kaas> Lol TrueBrain, have a nice lunch.
10:16:29  <Yexo> main thing to remember about pbs signals is to only build them at places where a train can stop in front of them
10:17:37  <Kaas> Yeah, i assumed that already. To prevent jamming up the system, right?
10:17:48  <PeterT> its more efficient
10:18:00  * PeterT wonders what this world has come to.
10:18:16  <PeterT> They are selling teddy bears on TV for 
10:18:54  <Kaas> In 0.6.3 i did not have a good way to make an efficient dual-one-way track. but with this it should be a piece of cake
10:19:24  <PeterT> that mentality gives you a nice load of jams
10:19:45  <Kaas> Hmm? explain :)
10:19:54  <Yexo> "efficient" and "dual-one-way track" don't fit together imo
10:20:15  <PeterT> lol
10:20:24  <PeterT> well, yexo doesnt play
10:20:34  <Yexo> PeterT: I do occasionally
10:20:43  <PeterT> good for you, openttdcoop?
10:21:00  <Yexo> sometimes
10:21:06  <PeterT> ok
10:21:14  <PeterT> you know all the rules of presignals
10:21:18  * PeterT imagines you would
10:21:21  <Yexo> of course
10:21:24  <PeterT> since you invented them
10:22:02  <Yexo> PeterT: if it says you anything: the openttdcoop guys thought I was good enough to join #openttdcoop.pro
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10:22:35  <PeterT> yeah, i joined that without an invite
10:22:36  <Yexo> not playing much doesn't say you can't play good
10:22:46  <PeterT> and i was kbanned :)
10:22:55  <PeterT> until i receive an invite
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10:24:30  <Kaas> So how long have you two played this game already?
10:24:38  <PeterT> me, 1 year
10:24:44  <PeterT> yexo joined @ 0.6.3
10:25:01  <Kaas> Ah, right
10:25:11  <Yexo> been playing since december 2007, developing since januari 2008 :p
10:25:13  <PeterT> for the NoAI system
10:25:22  <PeterT> Yexo 	 AI / General 	 active 	 0.6.3
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10:25:45  <Yexo> PeterT: yes, but I've written some patches before I started to work mostly on noai
10:25:51  <PeterT> boy, if i could meet ludde, i would ask him to marry me
10:26:13  <TrueBrain> really, this PeterT guy is starting to freak me out
10:26:15  <PeterT> he made uTorrent, and OpenTTD
10:26:15  <Kaas> Never palyed with an AI yet. only the original one, but they suck :P
10:26:36  <Yexo> in 0.7 you either play with a new ai or without any
10:26:40  <petern> scummvm too
10:26:41  <Yexo> the original one is gone :)
10:26:45  <Kaas> Good :D
10:26:53  <PeterT> oh yes petern, scummvm
10:26:58  <Yexo> Kaas: not everyone agrees at that point
10:27:10  <Kaas> ive seen a lot of AIs at the downloadable content
10:27:17  <PeterT> choo choo is a good one
10:27:24  <PeterT> my favorite is admeral al
10:27:25  <Noldo> I really don't understand the love for the old ai?
10:27:37  <PeterT> i dont understand the difference
10:27:37  <Yexo> Noldo: me neither
10:27:39  <Kaas> yeah, i thought tha admiral AI was a good one
10:28:10  <PeterT> its a good mix of fun
10:28:14  <Kaas> Question: what NewGRF do you use?
10:28:27  <Kaas> i only use the generic tram set from 0.6.3
10:28:29  <Noldo> old ai + 64*64 map = living ground
10:28:30  <PeterT> TrueBrain: what exactly is "TGP" (new landscapes)
10:29:29  <Noldo> maybe it's just that the ais are too good
10:29:42  <Yexo> PeterT: TerraGenesis, the landscape generator you can chose in the world generation window
10:29:53  <PeterT> oh
10:30:03  <PeterT> terragenisis is amazing
10:30:13  <PeterT> i only realized when i choose "original"
10:30:55  <planetmaker> Kaas, we use those newgrf which take our fancy.
10:31:01  <planetmaker> Browse bananas and use those you like
10:32:01  <PeterT> kaas, and check out openttdcoop's grf pack
10:32:29  <PeterT> http://openttdcoop.ammmler.ch/wiki/GRF
10:32:30  <Kaas> can the newGRF change the gameplay in any way(new transport units with it own properties for instance)?
10:32:42  <PeterT> yes, but it might crash
10:33:01  <PeterT> http://openttdcoop.ammler.ch/wiki/GRF
10:33:06  <PeterT> thats the correct link
10:33:10  <Kaas> :)
10:33:31  <planetmaker> Kaas, yes, they can. And they don't crash
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10:33:44  <planetmaker> that's actually what newgrf are about.
10:33:48  <planetmaker> they're not only graphics
10:34:04  <planetmaker> The only thing problematic is: don't change your choice of newgrf mid-game
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10:34:17  <planetmaker> once you started with some, stick with those for that game
10:34:26  <PeterT> its free to start a new game
10:34:59  <Kaas> Wow, does openttdcoop use all of these :|?
10:35:15  <PeterT> not all at once
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10:36:47  <planetmaker> Kaas, that's a repository.
10:36:55  <planetmaker> It's a collection we can choose from
10:37:14  <planetmaker> using all at once is bound to fail. And it's completely insane to do.
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10:38:29  <Kaas> Okay, so, anyone up for a game?
10:38:50  <PeterT> go to #openttdcoop
10:38:53  <PeterT> join the game
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10:39:29  <planetmaker> Kaas, if you want to check out reasonably sane combinations, you might want to look at our savegame archive: http://www.openttdcoop.ammler.ch/wiki/PublicServer:Archive
10:39:45  <planetmaker> you can save that collection of newgrf as a preset then and use it in your own game
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10:42:32  <Kaas> I think ill just stick with the old graphics. As im only interested in the gameplay, not the eye candy
10:43:02  <Terkhen> NewGRF are much more than eye candy :P
10:43:04  <LordAzamath> you see, the grfs don't only change graphics
10:43:09  <LordAzamath> but they change gameplay as well
10:43:30  <Kaas> donĊ½t they make the game unbalanced then?
10:43:56  <LordAzamath> do you insist on clean savegame being balanced?
10:46:00  <Kaas> Well, i suppose i could try some. see if i like it
10:48:14  <LordAzamath> wth, windows mail just randomly started up
10:49:08  <LordAzamath> oh
10:49:15  <LordAzamath> I think I clicked on a mailto link ;D
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11:13:10  <Eddi|zuHause> Yexo: MB had some question regarding AI station building and CB18 (http://www.tt-ms.de/forum/showthread.php?tid=4194 [german])
11:13:29  <Yexo> thanks Eddi|zuHause, I'll try to read it
11:13:46  <TrueBrain> with the accent on 'try' ;)
11:14:07  <Yexo> hehe :p
11:14:56  <Yexo> Eddi|zuHause: the answers you gave are correct
11:15:07  <Yexo> cb18 will not be implemented for trains
11:15:22  <Yexo> as for newgrf stations: AdmiralAI already builds them, I have no idea about others AIs
11:16:03  <Yexo> for the AI to implement it they should call AIRail::BuildNewGRFRailStation instead of AIRail::BuildRailStation (just 5 extra parameters)
11:17:58  <Yexo> Eddi|zuHause: http://rbijker.net/openttd/misc/newgrf_ai_train_purchase.txt <- that links works, the link in the log you post no longer works
11:18:15  <Yexo> but it has several flaws, so it's not really important anymore
11:18:16  <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, it's in the third quote
11:18:31  <Yexo> ah, ok :p
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11:27:38  <Belugas> hello
11:28:00  <TrueBrain> Belugas!!!!!!!11111111
11:28:10  * Belugas is waking up at niagara falls today
11:28:32  * Belugas 's wife is in shower, kiddo is in front of the tv
11:28:54  <Belugas> we're heading to marineland in an hour or so
11:29:00  <Belugas> YEAH FOR VACATIONS!!!!!
11:29:04  <TrueBrain> ;)
11:30:10  <PeterT> cool!
11:30:18  <Belugas> hey TrueBrain :) hope it's as sweet as in here
11:30:26  <PeterT> wait, is it niagara falls in canada or in america?
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11:30:41  <Belugas> canada, what yo think...
11:30:50  <Belugas> we've got the biggedt falss!!!!
11:30:53  <TrueBrain> Belugas: it is PeterT you talk to .. what do you think :p
11:30:53  <Belugas> oup...
11:30:58  <Belugas> biggest falls
11:31:12  <PeterT> :)
11:31:27  <PeterT> TrueBrain >:(
11:31:40  <Belugas> and it's not america (that is a continent), it's the USA!
11:31:43  <Belugas> prrrrrt
11:32:00  <Belugas> time for my shower
11:32:06  <Belugas> havea nice day all
11:32:11  <TrueBrain> you too!!!!
11:33:24  <PeterT> bye belugas
11:35:11  <Eddi|zuHause> you shower under the niagara falls? :p
11:41:47  <OwenS> Eddi|zuHause: They'd cetrainly classify as a power shower
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12:41:39  <petern> 9/win 28
12:41:51  <petern> :s
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14:05:13  <OwenS> <3 Patent law
14:05:19  <OwenS> OOXML is patent encumbered, ODF is not
14:06:07  <petern> every patent's been checked?
14:06:47  <OwenS> Well MS have been in court since Mar 2007 (Which means they failed to disclose this as required by the ISO process) over a patent on OOXML's "CustomXML" feature
14:07:07  <OwenS> I don't doubt some patent somewhere is infringed by ODF. The legality of that patent, however...
14:07:09  <petern> no patents in OOXML could apply to ODF?
14:07:20  <petern> ODF sucks anyway
14:07:59  <OwenS> The patent the litigation is over doesn't cover ODF. Even the litigators have said that.
14:08:35  <petern> could be plenty of other patents
14:08:55  <OwenS> Yes, but probably of dubious legal standing
14:09:04  <petern> possible patent infringements is what prevented ogg theora being accepted
14:09:11  <petern> why of dubious legal standing?
14:10:12  <OwenS> Because ODF is based on the many year old StarOffice formats; and because office formats and SGML/XML grammars are both old, established niches, meaning it is very hard to patent something non obious and without prior art
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14:11:02  <OwenS> And "possible patent infringements" is mostly apple going "we can't be bothered to implement this"
14:11:21  <OwenS> And MS, since both have competing formats anyway
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14:16:21  <OwenS> Not that it matters much since Theora is a crap video codec
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14:34:38  <speed> choo choo :p
14:35:02  <TrueBrain> you already missed that train
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14:39:30  <Eddi|zuHause> soo... who is stealing my connection?
14:39:41  <Eddi|zuHause> i must tell him, it's not really worth stealing...
14:39:53  * TrueBrain gives Eddi|zuHause his connection back
14:39:58  <TrueBrain> the joke is over, I know
14:40:29  <Eddi|zuHause> i forgive you ;)
14:41:07  <TrueBrain> yippie :)
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14:54:35  <Kaas> !dl
14:55:00  <Aali> try !password instead
14:57:01  <Yexo> glx: ^^ another command to add to your script
14:57:14  *** mode/#openttd [+o Yexo] by DorpsGek
14:58:00  *** mode/#openttd [-o Yexo] by DorpsGek
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14:58:24  <TrueBrain> "tis ook nooit goed :p"
14:58:28  <glx> Yexo: same target?
14:58:34  <Yexo> glx: yes
14:59:19  <Yexo> TrueBrain: too much work to go and kick manually every time
14:59:57  <glx> Yexo: ask the bot in private :)
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15:00:47  <Yexo> glx: hmm? I do know how to kick via dorpsgek
15:01:16  <TrueBrain> Yexo: /msg DorpsGek kick #openttd <user> <reason>
15:01:22  <TrueBrain> sounds simple enough, not ;)
15:01:38  <glx> and I have an alias for that :)
15:01:42  <TrueBrain> me too :)
15:01:55  <Yexo> I thought you had a script that did that automatically on !password
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15:02:03  <TrueBrain> in fact .. every normal command with a 'd' before it, pipes it through DorpsGek :p
15:02:49  <glx> indeed I have a script that reacts on many !commands
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15:06:25  <LordAzamath> hmm
15:06:27  <LordAzamath> !command
15:06:30  <LordAzamath> yay
15:06:32  <LordAzamath> :D
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15:07:09  <planetmaker> :-D
15:07:25  <LordAzamath> oh noes
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15:20:06  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r17210 /trunk/ (readme.txt src/misc_gui.cpp): -Update: credits to reflect the (current) truth a bit better
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15:57:25  <OwenS> "http://172.168.0.1/" Hmm may have mixed netblocks there :p
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16:00:32  <glx> typo :)
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16:01:53  <OwenS> Nah, wanted 172.16 not 192.168 :p
16:02:43  <glx> still :)
16:03:38  <OwenS> Now if it were 192.168.100.1... (Thats the address my cable modem sits itself at...)
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16:21:33  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: frosch * r17211 /trunk/src/ (engine_type.h newgrf.cpp table/engines.h): -Cleanup: Remove unused RailVehicleInfo::ai_rank.
16:21:43  <frosch123> sorry petern :)
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17:49:06  <planetmaker> frosch123, re "foundation / slope sprites": if we now would come up with foundation sprites, would you on your computer still be able to generate a set of sprites?
17:49:41  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r17212 /trunk/ (16 files in 5 dirs): -Change: move minilzo to its 'own' 3rdparty directory as it belongs there
17:50:33  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: translators * r17213 /trunk/src/lang/ (5 files in 2 dirs):
17:50:33  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
17:50:33  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: dutch - 13 changes by Bart
17:50:33  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: english_US - 5 changes by agenthh
17:50:33  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: latvian - 64 changes by dzhins
17:50:34  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: romanian - 2 changes by kkmic
17:50:34  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: thai - 85 changes by idkidnew
17:54:01  <frosch123> likely, but does that meet your gpl? or are you better using some gimp functionality?
17:55:02  <planetmaker> they could as well have been drawn by hand...
17:55:16  <planetmaker> I consider it a tool, not the product itself.
17:55:24  <planetmaker> After all we may use photoshop, too
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17:56:48  <planetmaker> and it was no fun to copy around the different slopes :-) ... so I'm just curious if it would be easier, should the need arise another time :-)
17:57:41  <frosch123> well, if you put the sprites in the same position with the same dimensions, it should be no problem :)
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17:58:33  <frosch123> though i am searching for a scripted image processor for years. gimp has some, but i never understood it :)
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17:58:44  <planetmaker> what do you mean with "same position and same dimension"? You mean in the pcx? Well... that's another issue then... but might be easier that what I did. Dunno 100% though
17:59:15  <planetmaker> I haven't looked at gimp scripts so far either. Quite powerful, though, I guess.
17:59:27  <frosch123> yes, the source and destination sprites in the same position in the pcx / bmp / png / whatever
18:00:09  <planetmaker> If I'd write it, I'd write it in RSI-IDL. Not difficult there. But... no one except me will be able to run that programme then :-P
18:01:40  <planetmaker> hm... though there are free implementations of IDL...
18:02:24  <planetmaker> hm... and the VM is free of charge, too
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18:11:00  <TrueBrain> hmm .. IDL ..
18:11:04  <TrueBrain> you got to love that language
18:11:27  <planetmaker> it's quite a nice one. For the purposes it's made for
18:11:32  <TrueBrain> and I can run your program, no worries :)
18:11:36  <TrueBrain> astronomy!!!! :p
18:11:37  <planetmaker> one of those is image processing
18:11:42  <planetmaker> :-)
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18:11:57  <TrueBrain> feed it a 2Mx2M image, and you can still do calculations on it :)
18:12:07  <planetmaker> jo :-)
18:12:18  <TrueBrain> sadly enough, we always have to fight for a license ...
18:12:23  <TrueBrain> people leaving their IDL open and shit
18:12:24  <planetmaker> Though I've just found another software which is... felt faster
18:12:37  <planetmaker> hehe. license wars :-)
18:12:54  <TrueBrain> yeah ... their computer always experiences power-loss .. dunno why ...
18:13:02  <planetmaker> Luckily we have enough. I'm loged in 24/7 into IDL license server :-P
18:13:22  <TrueBrain> with normal personal logged in, there are like 12 licenses free (1 computer consuming 3 licenses)
18:13:34  <TrueBrain> so students should run their program, and log out!
18:13:45  <planetmaker> :-)
18:16:10  <petern> ls -l
18:16:12  <petern> er
18:16:30  <planetmaker> haha :-)
18:16:38  <TrueBrain> HACKER!
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18:52:06  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: yexo * r17214 /trunk/ (22 files in 4 dirs):
18:52:06  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Add [NoAI]: GetAPIVersion() as optional function in info.nut. Return "0.7" to get an api compatible (as much as possible) with the 0.7 api or "0.8" to get the latest api.
18:52:06  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Change [NoAI]: move all deprecated functions to a separate squirrel script that is only loaded if an AI requests an old API version.
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18:53:34  * frosch123 would like to know a way how to do that with newgrfs :)
18:53:49  <petern> grf version
18:53:56  <TrueBrain> commite: -Remove: nfo support; -Add: GRF Script support
18:53:58  <TrueBrain> sounds simple :p
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18:54:46  <OwenS> I ought to get my codegen overhaul finished and create my own backup interpreter...
18:54:51  <Wolf01> hello :D
18:55:18  <Chris_Booth> hello
18:55:35  <frosch123> why does you appearance raise the idea to open xkcd?
18:56:13  <Chris_Booth> mine?
18:57:03  <frosch123> no, the guy of whom you have to type 5 of 6 letters to make tab completion work :s
18:57:41  <petern> ?
18:57:55  <Wolf01> me :P
18:58:09  <petern> "w<tab>" is enouhg
18:58:12  <petern> Wolf01, see
18:58:32  * petern ponders investigating gtkmm
18:58:38  <Wolf01> yes, w<tab><tab><tab><tab><tab>
18:59:42  <Wolf01> however, how the life is going?
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19:20:23  <OwenS> petern: I suggest Qt :p
19:22:31  <petern> no chance
19:22:36  <OwenS> :-( Why?
19:25:11  <OwenS> I find the Qt API brilliant to work with
19:25:17  <petern> i don't want to deal with the hell that is moc
19:25:31  <petern> and qt's pseudo c++
19:25:44  <OwenS> Wha? For me Moc is just a single line in my CMakeLists.txt
19:26:11  <petern> signals:
19:26:12  <petern> public slots:
19:26:14  <petern> no
19:26:18  <petern> that shit can fuck off
19:26:27  <OwenS> OK, Q_SIGNALS:? public Q_SLOTS:?
19:26:51  <OwenS> Much better than SigC++'s template hackery and undefined behaviour issues...
19:28:37  *** oskari89 [~oskari89@88.193.124.243] has joined #openttd
19:28:56  <petern> aka standard c++ features
19:29:51  <OwenS> standards compliance but fugly code and the need to implement an accessor for each signal vs running Moc. Aah, I know which I choose!
19:30:19  <OwenS> And Qt is standard compliant. It just uses a few macros
19:32:09  <speed> guys i have question i downloaded all of those ECS GRFs for new industries, but how can i transport that stuff? I can't find wagons for transporting most of new things?
19:33:29  <OwenS> speed: You need an ECS compatible train set
19:33:49  <speed> Ohh
19:33:55  <speed> I thought that's loaded automaticly :P
19:34:06  <OwenS> No, ECS doesn't define any train parts
19:34:24  <OwenS> Only ECS compatible train set I can say off the top of my head is UKRS but many support it
19:34:27  <oskari89> There were an old wagons, new cargos grf somewhere..
19:35:00  <oskari89> I've seen it, maybe on BaNaNaS.
19:35:15  <oskari89> It featured some of ECS cargos.
19:35:42  <speed> hm so which one eGRVTS ?
19:36:11  <planetmaker> :-D
19:36:16  <planetmaker> that's no train newgrf
19:38:18  <speed> which one then? ;)
19:39:03  <planetmaker> any train set on bananas.
19:39:14  <planetmaker> or rather every
19:40:41  <oskari89> Well, Finnish trainset (on construction) will feature extensive ECS support ;)
19:40:49  <oskari89> *under construction
19:41:03  <oskari89> With realistic wagons and such ;)
19:41:42  <planetmaker> maybe I should rephrase: every finished (not finish :-P) train set on bananas has ECS support
19:43:37  <speed> yeh i am looking into it
19:43:42  <speed> but dunno which one to download
19:43:45  <speed> any recomendations?
19:44:00  <Ammler> [21:39] <planetmaker> or rather every <-- jpset now, too?
19:46:00  <planetmaker> I haven't checked. I assume they do?
19:46:33  <planetmaker> speed, that's the same question as "I don't know what to eat, apples or pears. Any recommendations?"
19:47:02  <speed> apples :P
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19:49:45  <speed> but really i don't know what to download
19:49:58  <Yexo> just play a few test game
19:50:15  <speed> besides old wagoons new cargos
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19:50:23  <speed> i'd kinda like new wagoons to be honest
19:52:51  <Eddi|zuHause> hmm... the Kaffeine 1.0 UI is awful compared to Kaffeine 0.8
19:53:15  <frosch123> hmm, who made up "tropic wood"
19:53:15  <Eddi|zuHause> i can't even use the number keys to switch channels...
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19:53:43  <planetmaker> frosch123, afaik it's a very old cargoID
19:54:14  <frosch123> maybe from newcargos :p i.e. it is neither default nor ecs (latter according to wiki)
19:55:02  <speed> ok that 2cc has it
19:59:32  <keoz> so, cargodist or cargodest ? when ? in the official tree or not ?
20:00:11  * keoz is quite excited with the idea playing with that
20:00:19  <frosch123> play ttdpatch
20:00:27  <keoz> i play openttd
20:00:47  <keoz> i'm on linux
20:02:32  <frosch123> why are default train engines not refitable to oil and rubber?
20:03:48  <valhallasw> because they are liquid, probably?
20:04:01  <frosch123> but you can transport water
20:04:57  <keoz> eh. You put it in bottles !
20:07:25  <Yexo> keoz: which one you like more / as soon as it's done / not yet
20:07:59  <keoz> Yexo : i still didnt try any.
20:08:31  <keoz> but I really like the idea, so I will probably integrate it to play my next map
20:08:39  <keoz> (i play on a map for weeks)
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20:11:06  <Yexo> in that case I'd say try cargodist, as cargodest hasn't been updated for a long time
20:11:28  <keoz> the current development is on cargodist, isn't it ?
20:11:45  *** PeterT [~Peter@c-76-19-209-23.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20:11:50  <Yexo> both are created by different people
20:12:18  <Yexo> it are also different projects, they solve the problem in a complete different way
20:12:39  <Ammler> [21:53] <Eddi|zuHause> hmm... the Kaffeine 1.0 UI is awful compared to Kaffeine 0.8 <-- mostly just a config change
20:13:03  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: i don't find such an option in the config
20:14:02  <Ammler> I don't use it, but it i the general experience with my switch from KDE 3.6->4.3
20:14:07  <Ammler> 3.5*
20:14:49  <Eddi|zuHause> some things are not just options...
20:15:11  <Eddi|zuHause> especially since the kaffeine page said a lot of the code was rewritten, and not all features implemented yet
20:15:25  <Ammler> like Konversation
20:15:33  <Eddi|zuHause> and THAT is my general experience with KDE 4
20:15:49  <Ammler> well, then you use something <4.3
20:16:03  <Ammler> which you seriously shouldn't
20:16:16  <Eddi|zuHause> kaffeine is not bound to kde release schedule
20:16:29  <Eddi|zuHause> neither is konversation, ktorrent, amarok
20:16:53  <Eddi|zuHause> and all have or had some misfeatures...
20:17:33  <Ammler> don't use ktorrent, I prefer ttdpatch rtorrent ;-)
20:18:09  <Eddi|zuHause> and yes, my experiences might be tainted by my pre-4.3 attempts
20:18:21  <Eddi|zuHause> and 4.3 is not perfect either...
20:18:37  <Eddi|zuHause> there are still some bugs and weird behaviours
20:19:03  <Ammler> yes, but the general looking was worth to switch.
20:19:32  <Ammler> (I switched with 4.2)
20:20:24  <Ammler> and used some playground apps, but with 4.3 now, I don't need those anymore.
20:25:46  <petern> hmm, weird
20:26:49  <petern> apparently i registered on sourceforge as peter1138 in 2002
20:26:54  <petern> well before openttd
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20:28:22  <petern> i don't remember using that nick outside of ottd
20:29:36  <OwenS> 3.6? I though 3.5 was the last version?
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20:31:35  <Ammler> OwenS: next line :P
20:32:00  <OwenS> lol
20:32:12  <OwenS> Note to self: Check Konversation's scrollbar position
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20:32:41  <Ammler> adie
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20:37:08  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: yexo * r17215 /trunk/src/saveload/afterload.cpp: -Cleanup: remove unused return value
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20:39:06  <petern> hmm, maybe i should just use native gtk ;p
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20:43:02  <Wolf01> gah current cut-off to half town :|
20:43:26  <_ln> hello Wolf01
20:43:33  <Wolf01> hello ln
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21:03:03  <Skasi> Hello. I am having a problem that my OTTD does not play music. A friend of my copied the files from me and once he starts the game it does play music. Could anyone help me with that? :)
21:05:16  <keoz> how do you install it ?
21:05:31  <keoz> I would check for a timidity dep problem
21:05:56  <Skasi> oh wait.. that can't be true
21:06:00  <Yexo> Skasi: what os do you use? what openttd version? Maybe you set the music level to 0?
21:06:15  <Skasi> seems so.. X]
21:06:51  <Skasi> okay so now everyone knows it.. I'm stupid!
21:07:21  <Skasi> sorry for the inconvence
21:08:18  <Skasi> inconvenience*
21:21:17  <Eddi|zuHause> the problem is not if anyone thinks you are stupid...
21:21:35  <Eddi|zuHause> you only get a problem if people think you are more stupid than everybody else
21:21:59  <MyCatVer1s> Skasi: ehhhhh. Don't worry about it. Just be glad that it was an easy problem. :)
21:22:18  <Eddi|zuHause> and my amarok 2 is more stupid than 1.4
21:22:30  <R0b0t1> How do I "transfer" materials/supplies?
21:22:33  <Eddi|zuHause> it seems to forget ratings i give...
21:22:56  <Yexo> R0b0t1: use a tranfer order?
21:23:04  <R0b0t1> I don't see one.
21:23:16  <Yexo> in the dropdown under the load/unload options
21:24:02  <R0b0t1> Nope...
21:24:08  <R0b0t1> All I have is "unload and leave empty"
21:24:12  <R0b0t1> And that doesn't transfer.
21:24:55  <Yexo> http://wiki.openttd.org/images/c/c7/Orders_goto_unload.png <- there is "Transfer"
21:27:36  <R0b0t1> Ah
21:27:37  <R0b0t1> Ok
21:28:04  <R0b0t1> Heh wait
21:28:06  <R0b0t1> Ah well
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21:50:57  <Belugas> Every One LOOOOOOOOVES
21:51:04  <Belugas> MArineLand!
21:51:09  <Belugas> now.. time to eat!
21:51:16  <TrueBrain> enjoy :)
21:51:22  <Belugas> thanks;)\
21:51:32  <Belugas> i'll keep some left ovewrs for yhou...
21:51:36  * Belugas is gone
21:53:49  <TrueBrain> oeh
21:53:50  <TrueBrain> me like
21:53:53  <TrueBrain> too bad you are gone :(
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22:11:23  <Nite_Owl> Hello all
22:11:55  * MyCatVer1s lynches Nite_Owl for breaking someone or other out of prison.
22:12:20  <welshdragon> poor Nite_Owl
22:12:37  <Nite_Owl> You have got the wrong Nite Owl
22:12:56  * welshdragon farts fire in the direction of MyCatVer1s, in punishment for the Lynching
22:13:43  <Nite_Owl> I have no affiliation with any comic book character with a similar name
22:13:54  *** Mucht [~Martin@chello080109200215.3.sc-graz.chello.at] has joined #openttd
22:15:10  <Nite_Owl> In fact I was using this nickname long before The Watchmen was ever written - even before there was an internet.
22:15:19  <MyCatVer1s> Nite_Owl: even if you had, I'd still have the wrong Nite_Owl.
22:15:31  <MyCatVer1s> Because I'd actually be mad at Nite_Owl2. ^_^
22:17:59  <Nite_Owl> plus the _ in the nick is for IRC purposes only - it is actually pronounced Nite Owl
22:19:24  *** MyCatVer1s is now known as MyCatVerbs
22:19:40  <Nite_Owl> or, if you know your Monty Python, it could be pronounced 'Throat Warbler Mangrove'
22:20:19  <MyCatVerbs> But a mangrove is a tree. :(
22:21:06  <Nite_Owl> Then you do NOT know your Monty Python
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22:26:51  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r17216 /trunk/ (13 files in 5 dirs): -Update: MiniLZO from 1.08 to 2.03.
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22:28:24  <pavel1269> gn folks
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22:52:06  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r17217 /trunk/src/3rdparty/minilzo/ (lzodefs.h minilzo.c): -Fix (r17216): silence some warnings for the more exotic GCC-alikes
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22:57:08  <Eddi|zuHause> grr... i hate interactive SQL statements for requiring a ;
22:59:38  <OwenS> Drives me mad also
22:59:47  <OwenS> Sony announced Slim PS3
23:01:10  *** TheMask96 [martijn@greed.vhost.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
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23:02:11  <Xaroth> ugh, i'm such a donkey when it comes to learning new stuff
23:05:25  <FauxFaux> Try dead-tree books.
23:05:39  <Xaroth> meh, books never worked for me
23:05:47  <Eddi|zuHause> Xaroth: try learning old stuff
23:07:16  <Eddi|zuHause> so... apparently amarok has 175 urls which don't have a track but have statistics, 135 urls which have a track but no statistics, and 3 urls which have neither track nor statistics in the database
23:07:18  <Xaroth> then again, I don't think starting out with a lua enabled app is the best place to start C++ :o
23:07:38  <Eddi|zuHause> the question is, where did those entries go...
23:07:52  <Xaroth> /dev/null ?
23:08:10  *** TheMask96 [martijn@greed.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd
23:08:11  <Eddi|zuHause> ok... how do i read them out of there again?
23:08:16  <Xaroth> .. not?
23:08:28  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: glx * r17218 /trunk/src/3rdparty/minilzo/lzodefs.h: -Fix (r17216): missing '(' causing compile error
23:08:41  <Eddi|zuHause> well, obviously they got lost during the conversion from 1.4 to 2
23:08:52  <Eddi|zuHause> so i can reconstruct them from the 1.4 database
23:08:58  <Eddi|zuHause> but that is very tedious...
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