Config
Log for #openttd on 3rd September 2010:
Times are UTC Toggle Colours
00:00:51  <planetmaker> and the problem w/o release: the bug doesn't show ;-)
00:01:30  <Lakie> Heh
00:01:54  <planetmaker> (according to Y3xo who obviously tried)
00:02:54  <glx> yes because memory access in debug are different
00:03:12  <glx> but I know where to put breakpoints
00:03:20  <planetmaker> :-)
00:03:24  <Lakie> Debug includes some memory around allocations to detect memory overwrites
00:04:59  <Lakie> And various other checks release does without.
00:05:36  <glx> 41757992 is indeed -4
00:06:02  <planetmaker> hm. So a clamp is missing
00:06:07  <planetmaker> or a proper cast
00:08:36  *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-26-65-86.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
00:17:56  <glx>         10-20    -10    int
00:17:56  <glx>         10-(uint)20    4294967286    unsigned int
00:18:02  <glx> that's nice
00:19:44  <planetmaker> he
00:21:17  *** Devroush [~dennis@94-225-67-91.access.telenet.be] has quit []
00:26:35  <glx> so when you divide by 2 it's a valid int
00:30:25  *** Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF868F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:31:19  *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÌß]
00:34:12  *** Lakie [~Lakie@91.84.251.149] has quit [Quit: Sleep.]
00:40:23  *** JVassie_ [~James@92.27.149.231] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:44:06  *** Westie [~westie@starfish.typefish.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:48:48  *** avdg [~Adium@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
00:49:17  *** ClampyLubsClarey [~1.1.1@017.c.001.ncl.iprimus.net.au] has joined #openttd
00:53:43  *** Progman [~progman@p57A1D7DC.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
00:55:43  *** Clampy [~1.1.1@017.c.001.ncl.iprimus.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:00:08  *** wollollo [~martin@host86-175-29-209.wlms-broadband.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:06:30  *** Westie [~westie@starfish.typefish.co.uk] has joined #openttd
01:16:04  *** tokai [~tokai@port-92-195-22-222.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:17:56  *** tokai [~tokai@port-92-195-248-176.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd
01:17:59  *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ
01:19:54  *** DDR [~DDR@66.183.124.76] has quit [Quit: In democracy it's your vote that counts; In feudalism it's your count that votes.   - Mogens Jallberg]
01:22:12  *** Fuco [~dota.keys@188.123.106.105] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:30:21  *** robotboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd
02:46:45  *** Mucht [~Martin@chello084115143107.3.graz.surfer.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
03:05:18  *** murr4y [~murray@74.84-49-69.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd
03:05:43  *** Adambean [AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has joined #openttd
03:12:07  *** robotboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
03:21:38  <ln-> ÿßg
03:21:57  *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:6816:2956:ce41:16bf] has quit [Quit: bye]
03:23:04  *** llugo [~lugo@mgdb-4db8d37b.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd
03:27:48  *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd
03:30:23  *** lugo [~lugo@mgdb-4db8d6bf.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:46:06  *** De_Ghosty [~s@75-119-229-111.dsl.teksavvy.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:49:22  *** nicfer [~nicfer@190.50.45.144] has joined #openttd
03:56:21  *** De_Ghosty [~s@69-196-163-194.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #openttd
03:59:37  *** ecke [~ecke@188.75.128.2] has quit [Quit: more listen, more understand, more know]
04:00:18  *** [com]buster [~Combuster@82-171-220-59.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd
04:06:17  *** Combuster [~Combuster@82-171-220-59.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
04:06:18  *** [com]buster is now known as Combuster
04:12:35  *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@89.246.194.222] has joined #openttd
04:19:03  *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@89.246.176.191] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
04:30:44  *** Adambean [AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has quit [Quit: Gone fishing]
04:55:39  *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B7404B.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
04:58:23  *** llugo [~lugo@mgdb-4db8d37b.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
04:59:31  *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B73FA9.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
05:16:54  *** bryjen [~bryjen@cpe-75-81-201-131.we.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
06:03:43  *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@89.246.194.222] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
06:04:26  *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@89.246.194.222] has joined #openttd
06:10:32  *** TomyLobo [~foo@port-212-202-171-176.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd
06:18:40  *** Kurimus [Kurimus@dsl-tlubrasgw1-fe86de00-246.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd
06:23:07  *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd
06:26:22  *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B6A8.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd
06:31:28  *** [com]buster [~Combuster@82-171-220-59.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd
06:31:28  *** Combuster [~Combuster@82-171-220-59.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
06:31:56  *** [com]buster is now known as Combuster
06:37:54  *** ^Spike^ [~spike@d200003.upc-d.chello.nl] has joined #openttd
06:46:48  *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
06:53:28  *** Mek2 [~mek@158.193.90.56] has joined #openttd
06:54:02  <Mek2> hello, is it possible to set up a dedicated server in a way that when noone is playing in 5 years, then a new game is started?
06:57:09  <Yexo> there are no standard configuration options for that
06:57:18  <Yexo> but of course it's possible when using for example ap+
06:58:11  *** thvdburgt [~thvdburgt@z037133.its-s.tudelft.nl] has joined #openttd
06:59:51  *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd
07:02:51  <Eddi|zuHause> but you could pause the game if no players are present... then no 5 years will pass...
07:03:43  <Mek2> yes I know about that option
07:04:00  *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B6A8.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: oO]
07:04:03  <Mek2> but people tent not to connect the server when for example, 20 years have passed (even if there are no companies playing)
07:04:06  <Terkhen> good morning
07:04:09  <Mek2> gm
07:04:53  <Mek2> Yexo, what is ap+, pls?
07:05:07  <Yexo> see google
07:05:26  <Yexo> good morning Terkhen
07:05:52  <Yexo> Mek2: but even then it's not a default option, you'll have to code it yourself
07:06:12  <Mek2> understood
07:33:47  *** Mek2 [~mek@158.193.90.56] has quit [Quit: Mek2]
07:46:08  *** TruePikachu [~chris@cpe-67-49-42-88.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd
07:46:55  *** TruePikachu [~chris@cpe-67-49-42-88.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
07:48:14  *** nicfer [~nicfer@190.50.45.144] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
07:59:21  *** robotboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd
08:06:56  *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
08:25:26  *** robotboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
08:31:29  *** Progman [~progman@p57A1DC20.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
08:33:49  *** robotboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd
08:41:18  *** JVassie_ [~James@92.27.149.231] has joined #openttd
08:45:22  <dihedral> morning
08:53:30  *** [com]buster [~Combuster@82-171-220-59.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd
08:53:30  *** Combuster [~Combuster@82-171-220-59.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
08:53:33  *** [com]buster is now known as Combuster
09:05:52  *** p01ymer [~p01ymer@91.78.106.198] has joined #openttd
09:07:07  *** p01ymer [~p01ymer@91.78.106.198] has quit []
09:24:17  *** Adambean [AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has joined #openttd
09:27:44  *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dba93ea.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd
09:33:34  *** r0b0tb0y [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd
09:38:23  *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dba93ea.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
09:41:09  *** robotboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
09:45:41  *** r0b0tb0y [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
10:03:03  *** perk11 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has joined #openttd
10:10:46  *** Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF8A2D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd
10:18:26  *** JVassie [~James@92.27.149.231] has joined #openttd
10:18:31  *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-157-092.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
10:19:10  *** wollollo [~martin@host86-175-29-209.wlms-broadband.com] has joined #openttd
10:23:38  *** JVassie_ [~James@92.27.149.231] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
10:41:29  *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-157-092.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd
10:51:07  *** dfox [~dfox@ip-89-176-209-74.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd
10:51:48  *** r0b0tb0y [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd
11:00:29  *** Devroush [~dennis@94-225-67-91.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd
11:00:47  *** perk111 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has joined #openttd
11:05:58  *** perk11 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:12:18  *** KenjiE20 [~KenjiE20@92.10.88.193] has joined #openttd
11:20:08  *** wollollo [~martin@host86-175-29-209.wlms-broadband.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:32:33  *** Netsplit synthon.oftc.net <-> resistance.oftc.net quits: Andel, Kurimus, zodttd, @orudge
11:33:48  *** Netsplit over, joins: Andel, @orudge, Kurimus, zodttd
11:42:51  *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4db80ef6.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd
11:45:51  *** ABCRic [~This.is.A@210.84.103.87.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #openttd
11:46:14  <ABCRic> Hi everyone
11:50:19  *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4db80ef6.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
11:51:51  *** robotboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd
11:53:41  <ABCRic> Rubidium: any luck on yesterday's issue with the new sprites?
11:59:25  *** r0b0tb0y [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
12:06:42  *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:484c:50fe:bb80:d1d3] has joined #openttd
12:06:45  *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ
12:07:55  <ABCRic> hi glx, any luck on yesterday's issue with the new sprites?
12:08:17  <glx> yes I know what happened
12:13:55  *** Combuster [~Combuster@82-171-220-59.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
12:14:19  *** Combuster [~Combuster@82-171-220-59.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd
12:14:33  *** Netsplit synthon.oftc.net <-> resistance.oftc.net quits: Andel, Kurimus, zodttd, @orudge
12:15:17  *** Netsplit over, joins: Andel, @orudge, Kurimus, zodttd
12:22:14  *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4db80ef6.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd
12:28:02  *** Combuster [~Combuster@82-171-220-59.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Quit:  HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Now with extra fish!]
12:30:18  *** thvdburgt [~thvdburgt@z037133.its-s.tudelft.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
12:30:32  * TrueBrain slaps orudge for not having a backlog of PMs
12:33:46  *** George|2 [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd
12:33:46  *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
12:35:43  *** JVassie [~James@92.27.149.231] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
12:39:09  *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd
12:39:09  *** George|2 [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
12:44:57  *** Vitus [~chatzilla@138.194.wms.cz] has joined #openttd
12:46:53  *** Sacro [~ben@cpc2-mfld9-0-0-cust880.13-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd
12:50:55  *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-25-2-212.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd
12:52:00  *** r0b0tb0y [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd
12:52:22  <glx> ABCRic: fixed
12:52:31  <CIA-2> OpenTTD: glx * r20722 /trunk/src/statusbar_gui.cpp: -Fix (r20719): signed/unsigned side effect makes a small negative value become a big positive value
12:54:54  <planetmaker> hm... can (int)((uint)a - (unit)b) be negative?
12:55:51  <glx> planetmaker: the problem is ((uint)a -(uint)b)/2
12:56:26  <glx> small negative int -> big uint, /2 -> big int
12:56:53  <planetmaker> so the /2 takes precedence over the cast?
12:57:05  <glx> no the cast takes precedence
12:57:12  <planetmaker> (int)a/2
12:57:18  <glx> but there was no cast ;)
12:57:26  <planetmaker> there's now
12:58:00  <glx> so now it's big uint -> small negative int -> small negative int
12:59:22  <planetmaker> well. my question was what take goes first: ((int)a)/2 or (int)(a/2)
12:59:31  *** robotboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
12:59:31  <planetmaker> the first version would still fail
12:59:42  <glx> it's ((int)a)/2
12:59:57  <glx> and that's why it works
13:00:12  <glx> it was (int)(a/2)
13:00:32  <glx> with 'a' very big
13:02:51  <planetmaker> :-)
13:04:32  <glx> outdated opengfx was a good thing ;)
13:05:39  <planetmaker> yes :-)
13:06:00  <planetmaker> actually an even better thing is the message that people should update ;-)
13:06:17  <planetmaker> but that is / was no bug ;-)
13:06:23  <glx> yes the red box can explain the crash
13:06:31  <glx> even if it should not crash
13:06:58  <glx> but who reads the red boxes ?
13:07:18  <Vitus> I do :P
13:08:00  <planetmaker> Vitus, you must be the odd exception to prove the general rule
13:08:02  <planetmaker> :-)
13:08:11  <Ammler> add a textfield to the redbox and let it only close it the typed text in the box is equal to the message
13:08:21  <planetmaker> :-D
13:08:34  <glx> a captcha in the red box
13:08:38  <Ammler> :-)
13:08:50  <planetmaker> What should I do, if I accidentially switched to arabic and get that message in a translated form?
13:09:23  <glx> just move the box so you can change the language
13:09:44  <glx> it's not a modal box
13:10:00  <planetmaker> oh :-)
13:10:06  <Vitus> Ammler: I still think that most people wouldn't think about what they typed in there :D
13:10:08  <CIA-2> OpenTTD: smatz * r20723 /trunk/config.lib: -Fix: don't define _FORTIFY_SOURCE when not compiling with GCC, other compilers would likely barf on GLIBC code
13:10:35  *** norbert79 [~Norbi@deibp9eh1--blueice2n2.emea.ibm.com] has joined #openttd
13:10:43  <norbert79> Good afternoon everyone
13:10:50  <Vitus> Hello
13:11:01  <norbert79> Hello Vitus
13:12:10  <Vitus> Is Rubidium around? I've got one question about FS#4108.
13:15:36  <norbert79> !seen
13:16:08  <norbert79> Can't get any idle time for him, so maybe he is around
13:16:42  <Belugas> hello
13:16:49  <norbert79> Hello Belugas!
13:16:57  <planetmaker> oh folks. Don't ask whether X or Y is around. Ask the question or keep silent
13:16:57  <Belugas> hello norbert79
13:17:01  <planetmaker> moin Belugas
13:17:10  <norbert79> planetmaker: Sorry pa for waking you ;-)
13:17:15  <Belugas> hello sir planetmaker :)
13:17:32  <planetmaker> I didn't mean you this time, norbert79 :-P
13:17:45  <norbert79> "...this time..." :D
13:19:09  * ABCRic is back from lunch, sees glx fixed the problem, hits UpdateOTTD.bat
13:20:41  <ABCRic> yay! no more crashing! :)
13:21:46  <ABCRic> wow. OpenTTD sure runs fast if full animations and detail are turned off
13:22:09  <Vitus> Full animations are the key thing here
13:22:24  <ABCRic> at least 5x the speed
13:22:33  <Vitus> Likely more :)
13:22:55  <glx> not noticeable when not in fast forward
13:22:56  <Vitus> (if you are talking about FF, of course)
13:23:51  <CIA-2> OpenTTD: smatz * r20724 /trunk/config.lib: -Fix: debug builds with LTO enabled didn't have debug information and were not optimised at all, causing many compile-time warnings
13:24:23  *** Netsplit reticulum.oftc.net <-> resistance.oftc.net quits: Andel, Kurimus, zodttd, @orudge
13:24:40  * ABCRic is trying to betterize his script so it updates OpenGFX as well
13:25:00  <planetmaker> the link to the latest nightly is kinda fixed
13:25:05  <ABCRic> and I will *try* to avoid all the questions this time. :)
13:25:08  <Vitus> Betterize, what a strange word.
13:25:22  *** Netsplit over, joins: Andel, @orudge, Kurimus, zodttd
13:26:32  * r0b0tb0y sugests the word improve to ABCRic
13:26:38  <norbert79> Damn, I just didn't know, that my initiative would be such a failure... No reaction from the hungarian side at all, mainly it seem they don't care at all... :S
13:27:34  <ABCRic> r0b0tb0y: I like to make up new words :D
13:28:09  <planetmaker> norbert79, do yo expect zillion replies in like 24h?
13:28:29  <planetmaker> Many people are not around on a daily basis
13:28:41  <norbert79> No, but at least 1 from those, who are also very active on the forums...
13:28:50  <planetmaker> And it's not like the number of Hungarians is uncountable which roam the forum ;-)
13:29:31  <norbert79> planetmaker: Hey, You were very active :)
13:30:14  <planetmaker> but I've nothing to do with any of the addressed newgrfs
13:30:22  * r0b0tb0y wonders if there are more Japanese or other Asian's on here/TT-F than Australians
13:30:50  <planetmaker> my bet would be that not, r0b0tb0y
13:31:15  <r0b0tb0y> of course I'm only interested in active users
13:35:10  <norbert79> planetmaker: Well, my plan is more like creating GRF-s with all the graphics and ideas what the guys at openttd.info have created so far, or create new ones, but instead of having 50-100 sepereate GRF's they would be only 5 using big categories
13:35:57  <norbert79> Like they have created one GRF for some changes in the roads, one for one type of building, etc... I want to collect all these and releasse it as the TTR GRF
13:36:16  <norbert79> (Total Town Replacement)
13:36:29  <planetmaker> well. you might not want to call it TTR
13:36:38  <norbert79> More like HTTR of course
13:36:46  <planetmaker> but yes. If the licenses of the sprites allow, you can just do that.
13:37:03  <norbert79> thats the plan, thats why the entry, and the open question :)
13:37:10  <planetmaker> And... asking whether X is a good idea usually does not yield useful answers anyway
13:37:17  <planetmaker> Either it gets done. Or it doesn't
13:37:39  <norbert79> True, maybe I am too much used to organized enviroments...
13:37:45  <planetmaker> Asking for licenses is better done by directly writing to the people who did the stuff than an open forum poll / thread
13:39:19  <norbert79> good idea, though like with the Ikarus Set I wanted to build up a communication 'channel' so we will not work in paralell, but more like transferring the results directly to the bigger project
13:39:44  <planetmaker> forums are littered with "I want to do great stuff, please contribute" and "it would be a nice idea, if *someone* would..." ;-)
13:39:58  <planetmaker> The 'big' project will gain momentum if *someone* actually starts it.
13:40:04  <planetmaker> I'm sure of that :-)
13:40:36  <norbert79> This is weird you know, because in multinational companies it's just the opposite
13:40:49  <planetmaker> But this isn't.
13:40:53  <norbert79> normally they just start something without asking first, they create something and end up wioth a pile of crap
13:41:02  <planetmaker> Everything lives from *someone* doing what s/he things would be nice
13:41:03  <norbert79> and here you have to start with it first :)
13:41:25  <norbert79> In big companies it's just totally the oppoisite :)
13:41:31  <planetmaker> maybe :-)
13:42:10  <planetmaker> The only thing you need to really take care of: before you publish anything, make sure you may use the sprites you used. Either by the license or by explicit agreement of the artists
13:42:18  <norbert79> I know I know
13:42:21  <norbert79> Thank you though
13:42:49  <norbert79> I am way informed about that, actually partially I have to deal with these like license on a daily basis
13:42:52  * r0b0tb0y is looking forward to his roadtrip on a bus tomorrow
13:43:30  * ABCRic 's TortoiseHG isn't working so well, needs upgrade to cheetahHG
13:43:57  <norbert79> planetmaker: http://norbert79.deviantart.com (I prefer Common Creatives, but for this one I think I will use GPL3)
13:45:34  <planetmaker> CC licenses are also cool. When I use GPL I still prefer v2 as it's compatible with OpenTTD :-)
13:46:01  <planetmaker> ---> either CC-BY or GPL v2 for my. Maybe CDDL.
13:46:09  <norbert79> Hmm, I think GPL 3 is still compatible as it's just a bit more advanced, yet for simplicity I would use GPL 2 then, just not making things more complicated
13:46:12  <planetmaker> s/my/me/
13:46:34  <planetmaker> IIRC the free software association has some issues with GPL v3
13:46:44  <norbert79> I thought those have been resolved by now
13:48:15  <planetmaker> I don't know. Maybe.
13:48:43  <planetmaker> I didn't follow that too closely lately as I'm content with my licenses
13:48:54  <norbert79> never mind, I have nothing in my hands yet, so I think I will spend more time on this when it's time :)
13:49:01  <planetmaker> :-)
13:49:20  *** George|2 [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd
13:49:20  *** George is now known as Guest525
13:49:20  *** George|2 is now known as George
13:49:21  <planetmaker> the only important thing really is IMHO: allow derivatives and modifications
13:49:24  *** Guest525 [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
13:49:49  <norbert79> Sure, that's the minimum
13:49:55  <norbert79> and I will also share all the sources too
13:50:34  <ABCRic> curse the MSVS Express registration system
13:52:08  *** robotboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd
13:53:06  *** avdg [~Adium@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd
13:53:08  <ABCRic> I like it how they put the tutorials on the home page though. Open MSVB and it'll show some links to tutorials on how to make some programs... It's a good start :)
13:54:30  *** George is now known as Guest526
13:54:30  *** Guest526 [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
13:54:34  *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd
13:56:03  *** p01ymer [~p01ymer@ppp91-78-106-198.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #openttd
13:58:53  *** bryjen [~bryjen@63.147.94.149] has joined #openttd
13:59:28  *** r0b0tb0y [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:00:28  *** perk111 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org]
14:05:36  *** lugo [~lugo@mgdb-4db8d37b.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd
14:12:30  *** George is now known as Guest527
14:12:34  *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd
14:14:18  <CIA-2> OpenTTD: smatz * r20725 /trunk/config.lib: -Codechange: simplify make_compiler_cflags
14:14:49  *** ABCRic [~This.is.A@210.84.103.87.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
14:16:29  *** ABCRic [~This.is.A@210.84.103.87.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #openttd
14:17:08  *** dfox [~dfox@ip-89-176-209-74.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:18:13  *** KouDy [~koudy@ip-89-176-216-203.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd
14:18:51  *** KritiK_ [~Maxim@95-25-2-212.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd
14:19:03  *** Guest527 [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:23:43  *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-25-2-212.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:23:46  *** KritiK_ is now known as KritiK
14:33:04  *** nicfer [~nicfer@190.50.45.144] has joined #openttd
14:37:06  <robotboy> gnight
14:38:23  *** Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF8A2D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:38:52  <norbert79> Good night robotboy
14:40:09  *** p01ymer1 [~p01ymer@91.78.181.7] has joined #openttd
14:44:03  *** p01ymer [~p01ymer@ppp91-78-106-198.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
14:47:02  *** p01ymer1 [~p01ymer@91.78.181.7] has left #openttd []
14:52:14  *** r0b0tb0y [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd
14:54:23  *** George is now known as Guest532
14:54:27  *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd
14:59:08  *** ABCRic_ [~This.is.A@66.71.103.87.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #openttd
14:59:28  *** robotboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:00:33  *** Guest532 [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:01:11  *** PhoenixII [ralph@home.deboom.biz] has joined #openttd
15:02:10  *** guru3_ [~guru3@2002:51eb:a47b::1] has joined #openttd
15:02:49  *** KritiK_ [~Maxim@95-25-2-212.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd
15:02:57  *** George|2 [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd
15:03:23  *** ABCRic [~This.is.A@210.84.103.87.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:03:31  *** Sacro_ [~ben@cpc2-mfld9-0-0-cust880.13-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd
15:03:36  *** ABCRic_ is now known as ABCRic
15:04:00  *** ABCRic [~This.is.A@66.71.103.87.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit []
15:04:16  *** guru3 [~guru3@2002:51eb:a47b::1] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
15:04:16  *** Clampy [~1.1.1@017.c.001.ncl.iprimus.net.au] has joined #openttd
15:04:54  *** George is now known as Guest535
15:04:54  *** George|2 is now known as George
15:04:59  *** ABCRic [~This.is.A@66.71.103.87.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #openttd
15:07:02  *** zachanima [~zach@2506ds3-od.0.fullrate.dk] has joined #openttd
15:07:32  *** jpm [~pekka@194.100.84.38] has joined #openttd
15:07:50  *** jpm_ [~pekka@kone.suomen4g.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:07:53  *** lobstar [~michielbi@86.89.201.189] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:08:20  *** Sacro [~ben@cpc2-mfld9-0-0-cust880.13-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:08:25  *** ClampyLubsClarey [~1.1.1@017.c.001.ncl.iprimus.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:08:30  *** Phoenix_the_II [ralph@home.deboom.biz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:08:35  *** Guest535 [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:08:40  *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-25-2-212.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:08:44  *** KritiK_ is now known as KritiK
15:09:56  *** lobster [~michielbi@86.89.201.189] has joined #openttd
15:13:35  *** KouDy [~koudy@ip-89-176-216-203.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:19:57  *** r0b0tb0y [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:20:34  <norbert79> planetmaker: Does NML come as Linux binary only?
15:20:53  <planetmaker> it's a python module
15:20:59  <planetmaker> that's OS independent
15:21:08  <norbert79> Nice, thank you
15:21:28  *** lobster [~michielbi@86.89.201.189] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:21:38  <planetmaker> nmlc is a bash script, though, IIRC
15:21:45  <planetmaker> so that might need mingw or msys
15:21:51  <planetmaker> or cygwin
15:22:05  <planetmaker> But there might be written possibly a batch file, too
15:22:47  *** lobster [~michielbi@86.89.201.189] has joined #openttd
15:22:55  <norbert79> I am thinking about just installing cygwin then... Does it require a GUI?
15:23:37  <planetmaker> hm... it basically is a wrapper which calls the main nml file
15:23:44  <planetmaker> that could be written as a bat file, too
15:23:51  <planetmaker> no, it's a non-gui thing
15:24:07  <ccfreak2k> The installer uses a GUI.
15:24:17  <planetmaker> might be. But not for me ;-)
15:25:26  <norbert79> I have collected some materials for the GRF, I am quite curious how well I am able to handle this... I am planning going for an easy way and starting with a plain building first
15:25:51  *** KouDy [~koudy@ip-89-176-216-203.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd
15:26:00  <norbert79> I think I am gonna build a flat/condo first, hungarian style :)
15:26:06  *** KouDy [~koudy@ip-89-176-216-203.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:26:11  *** KouDy [~koudy@ip-89-176-216-203.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd
15:28:28  <planetmaker> he, yeah. Fancy things are not yet supported for houses in NML anyway
15:28:54  <planetmaker> It's missing the action2 variables so far
15:29:10  <norbert79> I think I will still go for the hard way, and go from scratch
15:29:36  <norbert79> this is the same way I learned BUILD for Duke 3D too :)
15:29:37  <planetmaker> if you do it in nml, you need to write (at least the code) from scratch anyway
15:30:50  <planetmaker> you shouldn't use NML for houses, if you imediately need variable access. Like "use snowy version, if snow" or "use this version, if date < 1930"
15:31:14  <norbert79> nah I think I will go for basic
15:31:20  <norbert79> NML would be more useful later on
15:31:25  <planetmaker> Just defining houses should work
15:31:31  <planetmaker> what is 'basic'?
15:31:47  <Yexo> planetmaker: that's still possible, using var[number] syntax
15:31:48  <norbert79> Understanding the standard, decompiling some stuff
15:32:00  <norbert79> and first creating the graphics :)
15:32:12  <planetmaker> norbert79: that's... not useful to try to understand the de-compiled NFO
15:32:23  <planetmaker> drawing graphics is, though
15:32:48  <planetmaker> because the de-compiled grf is un-commented nfo which has nothing to do with how NML would allow you to work
15:33:01  <planetmaker> Yexo: interesting :-)
15:33:05  <norbert79> Thats why I am not planning using NML from start :)
15:33:17  <norbert79> Need to understand first how a GRF file works
15:33:42  <planetmaker> well... you define the properties. And you associate graphics
15:33:55  <planetmaker> The latter can be done in a nearly arbitrarily conditional way
15:34:05  <norbert79> yeah, same like BUILD works... You attach vectors and define the textures ;-)
15:34:13  <norbert79> it needs time
15:34:18  <planetmaker> (and properties can be changed depending upon them, too. At least some)
15:40:28  <dihedral> \o/
15:40:33  <dihedral> my new phone just arrived :-)
15:40:38  <dihedral> htc desire (LCD)
15:40:45  <dihedral> android 2.2 :-)
15:40:47  *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4db80ef6.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:41:05  <ccfreak2k> I created a very nice form in Visual Studio.
15:41:17  <ccfreak2k> Then I realized I have NO idea of how to actually use it in C++ code.
15:41:42  <ccfreak2k> I mean, I could probably do it in Qt because it's event-driven.
15:42:53  *** lobster [~michielbi@86.89.201.189] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:43:22  <ABCRic> you could always try doing it using Visual Basic...
15:44:16  *** lobster [~michielbi@86.89.201.189] has joined #openttd
15:45:56  <ccfreak2k> I could use VB.NET actually yes.
15:47:10  *** George is now known as Guest541
15:47:14  *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd
15:49:39  *** b_jonas [~x@dsl51B625B1.pool.t-online.hu] has joined #openttd
15:51:30  *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590f4577.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd
15:53:09  <norbert79> have to rush, bye everyone!
15:53:15  *** norbert79 [~Norbi@deibp9eh1--blueice2n2.emea.ibm.com] has left #openttd []
15:53:22  *** Guest541 [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
15:57:29  *** nicfer [~nicfer@190.50.45.144] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
15:59:52  *** wollollo [~martin@host86-175-29-209.wlms-broadband.com] has joined #openttd
16:04:12  *** Lakie [~Lakie@91.84.251.149] has joined #openttd
16:05:02  <glx> ccfreak2k: just do it in C# :)
16:05:22  <ccfreak2k> That would be, like, the same thing.
16:05:55  <ccfreak2k> Qt would be advantageous because it's event-driven AND somewhat portable.
16:06:16  <glx> windows is event driven too
16:06:17  <ccfreak2k> Qexcept QI Qhave Qto Quse QQt's Qclasses.
16:06:27  <avdg> but less portable
16:06:29  <Lakie> Well, Qt is more portable than .net but both wpf/winforms and qt are event driven by nature
16:06:38  <ccfreak2k> Also I'm not familiar with win32 -at all-.
16:07:03  <glx> all win32 stuff is hidden with .net :)
16:07:12  <Lakie> Well, the majority of it. :)
16:07:15  <glx> no need to know windows deeply
16:07:26  <ccfreak2k> glx, I'm aware of that, as I've used VB.NET.
16:09:33  <glx> the other option for portable stuff is wxwidgets
16:10:06  <ccfreak2k> I tried that. I really hated it.
16:10:47  <ccfreak2k> Really this project is probably best done in Java, but Java ain't my cup 'o tea.
16:11:28  <Lakie> I assume mono (is that the one) isn't quite upto speed with .net 3.5 yet? :(
16:13:18  <ccfreak2k> Mono is the one, but I'd rather not rely on it.
16:13:51  <Lakie> Well obvi