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00:06:43 *** Lakie [~Lakie@91.84.251.149] has joined #openttd 00:11:36 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-25-97-106.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:13:04 <GecK> good night 00:13:06 *** GecK [Geck@pro75-3-82-229-184-63.fbx.proxad.net] has left #openttd [] 00:14:47 *** tokai [~tokai@port-92-195-63-5.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:15:36 *** Eddi|zuHause2 [~johekr@p54B75133.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 00:16:14 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B75133.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:17:01 *** tokai [~tokai@port-92-195-84-139.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 00:17:04 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 00:17:22 *** Eddi|zuHause2 is now known as Eddi|zuHause 00:17:48 *** Xrufuian [~xrufuian-@pool-98-119-100-9.lsanca.btas.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Going to play arriound with Trainz...] 00:27:02 *** Pulec [~pulec@static-cl093181068250.unet.cz] has quit [] 00:27:24 *** fanioz [~fanioz@180.214.233.24] has joined #openttd 00:29:41 *** Pulec [~pulec@static-cl093181068250.unet.cz] has joined #openttd 00:33:48 *** JVassie [~James@92.27.149.231] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:40:11 <GhostlyDeath> That's nice, oil just went poof sometime 00:40:44 <GhostlyDeath> July of lasy year 00:40:47 <GhostlyDeath> so 1.5 years ago =/ 00:44:32 <GhostlyDeath> Least I got 60k back from the train 00:44:50 *** Pulec [~pulec@static-cl093181068250.unet.cz] has quit [] 00:44:57 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@88.130.149.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:49:11 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@88.130.149.103] has joined #openttd 01:05:13 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@s55928dd9.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:14:37 *** pugi [~pugi@p4FCC488B.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: I reject your reality and substitute my own] 01:27:11 *** Progman_ [~progman@p57A1C98B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 01:28:26 *** Mazur [~mazur@53551A99.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:34:23 *** fanioz [~fanioz@180.214.233.24] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:34:37 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1973F.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:34:48 *** Progman_ is now known as Progman 01:35:22 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1C98B.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:36:26 *** enr1x [~kiike@230.227.21.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #openttd 01:52:51 *** enr1x [~kiike@230.227.21.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:03:46 <GhostlyDeath> What's the point of puting a cinema next to a theater? 02:05:54 <GhostlyDeath> If an industry produces goods and accept passengers 02:06:00 <GhostlyDeath> If I supply passengers, would goods go up? 02:06:35 <GhostlyDeath> Also, when the information on a tile says 2/8 Goods, what does that mean? 02:07:39 <GhostlyDeath> or 1/8 passengers 02:15:25 <GhostlyDeath> or is it just some extra micro cash? 02:15:51 <GhostlyDeath> people going to/from work? 02:36:08 <De_Ghosty> no 02:36:21 <De_Ghosty> 2/8 good means it supopply the dmenad of 2/8 people 02:36:45 <De_Ghosty> once u get 8/8 passenger the station covering tiles, it will accept passangers 02:37:14 <De_Ghosty> there is no point 02:37:22 <De_Ghosty> it's random generate location 02:56:49 *** Mazur [~mazur@83.85.26.153] has joined #openttd 03:01:22 *** lugo [~lugo@mgdb-4db8c74b.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:15:10 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 03:27:25 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:7575:9881:28b5:1f73] has quit [Quit: bye] 03:37:27 *** Mazur [~mazur@83.85.26.153] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:50:15 *** Adambean [AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has quit [Quit: Gone fishing] 03:50:16 *** nicfer [~nicfer@190.50.18.112] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:58:19 *** Lakie [~Lakie@91.84.251.149] has quit [Quit: Sleeps.] 04:15:22 <GhostlyDeath> My largest town is 2x larger than the other towns all combined 04:15:46 <GhostlyDeath> a 10k population town with 5 1k population towns 04:19:21 <GhostlyDeath> Will a town expand to where it has no authority? 04:22:47 <GhostlyDeath> It appears it's building where it's listed as "None" 04:26:09 <De_Ghosty> yes 04:26:21 <De_Ghosty> authority is just tiles within 20 unit of the centre? 04:26:25 <De_Ghosty> or less or more don't remember 04:26:35 <De_Ghosty> they can expand indefinetly 04:31:41 <GhostlyDeath> doesn't seem to be breakling 11k, drops down to 10k 04:31:47 <GhostlyDeath> then returns to 11k 04:32:00 <GhostlyDeath> I raised the sea for this town 04:36:28 <GhostlyDeath> How long does it take for a year to pass by normal speed and fast speed? 04:42:14 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:55:02 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B75133.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:55:30 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B7602E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 05:18:03 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@88.130.149.103] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:52:35 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 05:57:30 *** Kurimus [Kurimus@dsl-tkubrasgw1-fe83de00-38.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd 06:07:44 *** ajmiles [~aj@78-86-188-187.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:27:37 *** ^Spike^ [~spike@d200003.upc-d.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 06:36:38 <planetmaker> moin 06:38:26 *** davis [~b@p5B28B5CA.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:38:42 *** davis [~b@p5B28955F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 06:40:05 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-78-102-180-216.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 06:55:20 <Rubidium> moi planetmaker et al. 07:13:24 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 07:18:45 *** TruePikachu [~chris@cpe-67-49-42-88.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:20:37 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:20:50 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd 07:35:25 *** DDR [~DDR@66.183.113.224] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:36:39 *** fmauneko [~fmauneko@88.166.241.226] has joined #openttd 07:41:15 *** andythenorth_ [~andy@host217-44-51-125.range217-44.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 07:41:24 <andythenorth_> morning 07:51:28 <Terkhen> good morning 07:52:21 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:52:36 *** Mucht [~Martin@chello084115143107.3.graz.surfer.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:52:52 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1C98B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 08:05:05 *** GecK [Geck@pro75-3-82-229-184-63.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 08:05:06 <GecK> hi 08:14:42 *** fmauneko [~fmauneko@88.166.241.226] has quit [Quit: fmauneko] 08:18:39 *** andythenorth_ [~andy@host217-44-51-125.range217-44.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth_] 08:19:31 *** andythenorth_ [~andy@host217-44-51-125.range217-44.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 08:28:30 *** xiong [~xiong@netblock-68-183-253-174.dslextreme.com] has joined #openttd 08:28:54 *** pugi [~pugi@p4FCC4FA1.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 08:30:32 <xiong> On Linux, I've downloaded OpenGFX and put the tarball in ~/.openttd but still, OpenTTD refuses to start, saying "Failed to find a graphics set." I have read the readmes for both OpenTTD and OpenGFX. What now? 08:36:09 *** Alberth [~hat@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 08:37:16 <Rubidium> read it again to see it should be in ~/.openttd/data/ ? 08:38:24 *** ecke [~ecke@188.75.128.2] has quit [Quit: more listen, more understand, more know] 08:40:39 *** JVassie [~James@92.27.149.231] has joined #openttd 08:42:27 *** Pulec [~pulec@static-cl093181068250.unet.cz] has joined #openttd 08:45:25 <xiong> I'll try that, too, Rubidium. I'm trying several different approaches -- this folder, that folder, zipped, unzipped, in a folder, loose, etc. 08:46:43 <xiong> Bingo on installing OpenGFX, unzipped, into /usr/share/games/openttd/data/ -- FWIW. 08:47:01 *** rTypo [rTypo@pc54.clicknet.iasi.rdsnet.ro] has joined #openttd 08:59:23 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dba8c7e.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 09:05:15 *** dfox [~dfox@ip-89-176-209-74.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 09:05:20 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B7602E.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:06:05 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B7602E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 09:08:10 *** andythenorth_ [~andy@host217-44-51-125.range217-44.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:10:40 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@s55928dd9.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 09:13:00 *** andythenorth_ [~andy@host217-44-51-125.range217-44.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 09:13:53 *** andythenorth_ [~andy@host217-44-51-125.range217-44.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth_] 09:14:52 *** andythenorth_ [~andy@host217-44-51-125.range217-44.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 09:16:16 *** Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF95B6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 09:21:40 * andythenorth_ ponders a bit 09:22:31 <andythenorth_> is beer a better cargo than food 09:23:06 <Alberth> definitely for transport :) 09:23:11 <fonsinchen> definitely! (when going to a party at least) 09:24:06 <andythenorth_> is planetmaker really here? 09:24:15 <andythenorth_> :P 09:28:50 <Eddi|zuHause> what speaks against Food (Beer) subcargo? 09:29:16 <Pulec> atari have cool package on gog.com this weekend 09:29:21 <Pulec> 3 dollar a game 09:29:40 <andythenorth_> Eddi|zuHause: no subcargos 09:29:44 <andythenorth_> they are a flawed concept 09:29:47 <andythenorth_> :) 09:30:08 <Eddi|zuHause> they are not "flawed", they just have no gameplay effect 09:30:16 <andythenorth_> but they look like they might 09:30:29 <andythenorth_> they just add cognitive work for not a lot of fun 09:30:36 <andythenorth_> (IMHO) :) 09:40:43 <andythenorth_> poop 09:40:52 <andythenorth_> I have a hg conflict and I don't know how to resolve :o 09:42:00 <andythenorth_> I've manually resolved the differences, that was easy 09:42:12 <andythenorth_> but I don't know how to tell hg everything is now ok 09:42:26 <Alberth> hg resolve -m file 09:42:48 <Alberth> and don't forget the -m ! 09:43:33 <andythenorth_> win thanks 09:44:04 <Alberth> you're welcome :) 09:47:01 <G> The problem w/ Beer as a subcargo is that the train driver would jump out and drink a bottle everytime the train has to stop 09:47:30 <Alberth> build a dedicated line for delivering beer 09:51:13 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dba8c7e.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:57:35 *** perk11 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has joined #openttd 09:58:25 *** xiong [~xiong@netblock-68-183-253-174.dslextreme.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:59:36 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dba8c7e.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 10:02:51 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dba8c7e.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:08:49 *** JVassie_ [~James@92.27.149.231] has joined #openttd 10:11:16 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host142-59-dynamic.8-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 10:11:54 <Wolf01> hello 10:11:59 <Alberth> hello 10:14:36 *** JVassie [~James@92.27.149.231] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:15:41 *** goblin [~flo@dslb-094-218-139-084.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 10:29:41 *** dfox [~dfox@ip-89-176-209-74.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:35:57 *** KenjiE20 [~KenjiE20@92.21.227.88] has joined #openttd 10:42:19 *** JVassie [~James@92.27.149.231] has joined #openttd 10:45:06 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-78-102-180-216.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:47:36 *** JVassie_ [~James@92.27.149.231] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:49:48 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-78-102-180-216.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 10:52:32 *** Fuco [~dota.keys@fuco.sks3.muni.cz] has joined #openttd 10:59:46 * andythenorth_ ponders 11:00:00 <andythenorth_> not sure the forge idea really works :P 11:02:16 *** JurrienK [54695188@ircip3.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 11:04:22 <Rubidium> andythenorth_: only in the desert :) 11:04:37 <Rubidium> though it's probably better as an object instead of an industry 11:05:49 <JurrienK> I have a problem: I can start openTTD, can do single player games and scenario editing and stuff, but as soon as I start the multiplayer window, the game freezes 11:06:22 <JurrienK> already tried reinstalling the game, didn't help 11:07:06 <Rubidium> JurrienK: which version? 11:07:23 <JurrienK> latest - 1.0.4 11:08:25 <Rubidium> can you try the nightly? 11:08:48 <JurrienK> ok, ill try 11:09:09 <Rubidium> (there is a bugfix going into 1.0.5 that's related to deadlocking with threads, and the networking code uses threads for address resolution) 11:10:07 *** andythenorth__ [~andy@host217-44-165-106.range217-44.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 11:12:03 <JurrienK> Rubidium - same problem on the nightly 11:12:29 <Rubidium> is my assumption you're using Windows right? 11:12:36 <JurrienK> you're right 11:12:43 *** andythenorth_ [~andy@host217-44-51-125.range217-44.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:12:49 <JurrienK> the strange thing is, that a few weeks ago it worked... 11:13:28 <Rubidium> then I, sadly enough, can't help you any more. Unless you're able to compile OpenTTD yourself and run it in the debugger so you can get a stack trace when it's frozen 11:13:44 <Rubidium> oh, does it use lots of CPU or none? 11:13:56 *** b_jonas [~x@BC24C4DD.dsl.pool.telekom.hu] has joined #openttd 11:14:33 <JurrienK> only a few %'s 11:15:25 <b_jonas> argh. the trains won't come this way at all 11:15:29 *** Devroush [~dennis@94-225-67-91.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 11:16:09 *** Biolunar [mahdi@blfd-5d8208de.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 11:31:05 <glevans2> morning all 11:35:24 <davis> morning. 11:36:48 <Rubidium> JurrienK: so that sounds like a deadlock and not an infinite loop. Still needs someone that can reproduce it and run it in the debugger 11:38:21 <JurrienK> hmm... ok 11:42:59 *** pugi [~pugi@p4FCC4FA1.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: I reject your reality and substitute my own] 11:46:56 *** JurrienK [54695188@ircip3.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 11:50:45 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590f5de8.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 11:58:45 <andythenorth__> quak 12:00:35 <frosch123> moin :) 12:00:38 <Rubidium> moi 12:01:02 <andythenorth__> grr 12:01:06 <andythenorth__> stupid macintosh 12:01:14 <andythenorth__> process won't quit 12:01:30 <andythenorth__> it's running as far as the window manager is concerned, but top disagrees :P 12:01:56 <Rubidium> aqua regina will make that problem go away 12:02:29 <andythenorth__> what do I do? Immerse the mac in it? 12:02:51 <Rubidium> andythenorth__: yes 12:03:05 <andythenorth__> I'll do it later 12:03:16 <andythenorth__> the misbehaving process has now quit 12:04:19 *** `OurMirc` [smile-for-@188.247.92.41] has joined #openttd 12:04:42 *** Priski [priski@ihq.in] has joined #openttd 12:05:16 <glevans2> when I try MP with openttd, I get lots of this in terminal window. 'dbg: [net] getaddrinfo for hostname "", port 0, address family either IPv4 or IPv6 and socket type udp failed: Address family for hostname not supported' 12:08:39 *** perk11 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 12:08:52 *** X-2 [~X-2@5ED67292.cm-7-7b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:08:53 <glevans2> thats using the 'openttd-trunk-r20801-linux-generic-i686' binaries 12:09:43 <Rubidium> what distro and version of distro are you using? 12:10:18 <glevans2> Ubuntu 10.04, 32 bit 12:11:15 *** Priski [priski@ihq.in] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:11:26 <Rubidium> hmm, so I can't blame oldness of distro :( 12:12:42 <glevans2> you could, 10.10 is already in RC ... 12:13:22 <glevans2> makes it nearly 6 months old ... 12:14:46 <Rubidium> well, Debian (unstable) has worked without that warning for at least 18 months, so Ubuntu's of less than 12 months old should contain roughly the same capabilities 12:15:58 * Rubidium wonders why 10.10 isn't released yet. After all it's already 2010-10-10 (in Kiribati) 12:16:45 <Alberth> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=49199&start=0 ? 12:16:58 <frosch123> was 09.09 released on 2009-09-09 ? 12:17:10 <Rubidium> frosch123: nope 12:17:26 <Rubidium> but apparantly Ubuntu fancies The hitchhikers guide to the galaxy 12:17:30 <G> well there is the answer 12:18:32 <Rubidium> although for fun they should release it on 2010-10-10 20:10:10 UTC (or 2010-10-10 10:10:10+10) 12:21:18 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:f40a:cb55:88fd:d750] has joined #openttd 12:21:21 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 12:25:20 *** Speedy [57f51cd5@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 12:25:58 *** Sacro [~ben@150.237.48.99] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 12:26:07 <Speedy> hy all - yesterday all fine, today openttd crashes few seconds past connecting to a server - what can it be? 12:26:27 *** Sacro [~ben@150.237.48.99] has joined #openttd 12:26:29 *** Sacro [~ben@150.237.48.99] has quit [] 12:27:04 *** Sacro [~ben@150.237.48.99] has joined #openttd 12:27:12 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@88.130.149.103] has joined #openttd 12:27:23 <Speedy> nobody? 12:27:30 <glevans2> Rubidium, I get the same error when running the 'openttd-1.0.4-linux-generic-i686' binaries, so it is probably on my end...but thanks for the assistance 12:28:13 <Alberth> Speedy: did you try another server? 12:28:52 <Speedy> all - sometimes it allready crashes in serverbrowser if waiting to long. as soon as the game connects to internet it needs max 20 sec's till a full freeze 12:29:50 *** Tennel [~Tennel@88.150.10.194] has joined #openttd 12:30:10 <Speedy> last days played hours without problems, and didnt change anything 12:36:22 *** `OurMirc` [smile-for-@188.247.92.41] has quit [autokilled: This host violated network policy. Mail support@oftc.net if you think this in error. (2010-10-09 12:37:25)] 12:37:50 * andythenorth__ has way too many boats :P 12:38:19 <b_jonas> these Chimeras are expensive but they earn well 12:38:20 <Rubidium> Speedy: same server? If so, which one? 12:39:42 *** X-2 [~X-2@5ED67292.cm-7-7b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 12:50:31 <b_jonas> I want water tunnels 12:51:00 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-25-213-176.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 12:51:25 <Rubidium> TMGFTLB 12:51:26 <b_jonas> long ones under the whole continent 12:51:49 *** nicfer [~nicfer@190.50.18.112] has joined #openttd 12:52:23 <nicfer> the roadmap to 1.1.0 seems empty 12:53:44 *** rTypo [rTypo@pc54.clicknet.iasi.rdsnet.ro] has quit [] 12:53:48 <andythenorth__> I want a pony 12:54:12 *** murr4y [~murray@112.84-48-67.nextgentel.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:00:14 *** ajmiles [~aj@78-86-188-187.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 13:00:19 <SpComb> Rubidium: too much what? 13:03:26 <frosch123> glitches 13:09:07 <Speedy> rubi - reinstallation of openttd just fixed it - but cant use my old openttd.cfg - if recopy also crashing. doesnt depend on server - mostly luukland but all others - also in serverbrowser if waiting a bit longer 13:09:55 <Speedy> but think i have remade all my settings now :) 13:10:08 * andythenorth__ thinks FIRS 0.5 release might be soon ready 13:10:23 <andythenorth__> planetmaker: Terkhen: http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/issues?fixed_version_id=121&set_filter=1&status_id=o 13:10:27 <frosch123> do it on page 100 of the thread and then request locking :p 13:11:23 * andythenorth__ wonders how FIRS translation framework works.... 13:21:17 *** zachanima [~zach@2506ds3-od.0.fullrate.dk] has joined #openttd 13:22:54 *** X-2 [~X-2@5ED67292.cm-7-7b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:24:05 *** Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF95B6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:25:44 <Terkhen> okay, I'll update the spanish translation now 13:26:33 *** avdg [~avdg@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 13:29:22 <andythenorth__> thanks 13:35:04 *** jpx_ [jpx_@a91-156-239-44.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 13:40:19 *** nstehusanthe [~thok@524B7349.cm-4-4b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 13:41:46 *** Fuco [~dota.keys@fuco.sks3.muni.cz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:41:47 *** elmz [~elmz@184.213-167-126.customer.lyse.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:42:12 *** Fuco [~dota.keys@fuco.sks3.muni.cz] has joined #openttd 13:42:29 *** asnoehu [~thok@524B7349.cm-4-4b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:43:59 *** Netsplit reticulum.oftc.net <-> galapagos.oftc.net quits: elho, Yexo, rasco, +glx, eQualizer, ctibor, dihedral, Pulec, Speedy, FloSoft, (+4 more, use /NETSPLIT to show all of them) 13:44:11 *** SirSquid1ess [~sirsquidn@zomg.dongues.com] has joined #openttd 13:44:41 *** Priski [priski@ihq.in] has joined #openttd 13:45:39 *** TomyLobo [~foo@port-212-202-171-176.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:45:39 *** SirSquidness [~sirsquidn@zomg.dongues.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:46:29 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@s55928dd9.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:47:07 *** Netsplit reticulum.oftc.net <-> synthon.oftc.net quits: Joni-, luckz, bartavelle, guru3, Vadtec, Andel, ack, @Rubidium, LaSeandre, Markk, (+62 more, use /NETSPLIT to show all of them) 13:47:15 *** TomyLobo [~foo@port-212-202-171-176.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 13:47:15 *** valhalla1w [~valhallas@s55928dd9.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 13:47:15 *** elmz_ [~elmz@184.213-167-126.customer.lyse.net] has joined #openttd 13:47:21 *** Netsplit over, joins: SpComb, Speedy, +glx, Pulec, GecK, ctibor, Yexo, Sionide, ccfreak2k, eQualizer (+4 more) 13:48:19 *** Netsplit over, joins: @orudge, Born_Acorn, jpx_, avdg, ajmiles, KritiK, Tennel, Biolunar, Devroush, b_jonas (+62 more) 14:00:15 <andythenorth__> on a scale of 1-10, how annoying would it be to randomise produced cargos at a secondary industry? 14:00:20 <andythenorth__> (10 is highest) 14:03:39 <b_jonas> andythenorth__: could you explain in more detail what that would mean? 14:05:51 <andythenorth__> when industry is constructed, the cargo produced is chosen at random from a list 14:07:56 <b_jonas> wouldn't that only work when there are tertiary industries? 14:08:13 <andythenorth__> not sure 14:08:17 <andythenorth__> what does that mean? :) 14:08:36 *** Priski [priski@ihq.in] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:08:40 <b_jonas> anyway, I don't see how this would be relevant at all, for until you start founding industries it's just like there were multiple industries with the same graphics 14:09:35 <andythenorth__> it means that (a) a player funding industry might not get the cargo production they were seeking (b) player constructing route to industry needs to check produced carg ofirst 14:10:25 <b_jonas> right, (b) means you have to click instead of just look at what the industry looks like (or what color it is on the map), which makes it seem like you were lazy making graphics 14:11:22 <andythenorth__> I think (b) is annoying 14:11:37 <andythenorth__> but fewer industries => better 14:12:27 <b_jonas> what if instead a secondary industry _always_ produced equal of both kinds of products (say goods and paper) 14:14:41 * Alberth ponders 'with some total', so more goods -> less paper and vv 14:14:52 *** dfox [~dfox@ip-89-176-209-74.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 14:16:08 <Alberth> I like predictable meaning for industries, so at least 7 or 8 annoying. 14:20:25 <b_jonas> there's also another problem with too many different industries (or products), namely that it's harder to start because it's less likely to have good short routes 14:23:06 <andythenorth__> b_jonas: currently FIRS secondary industries do always produce equal amounts of both output cargos ;) 14:23:26 <andythenorth__> Alberth: I reckon it's about an 8 as well 14:23:42 <andythenorth__> that means I need to think about the metal chain a bit more 14:27:15 <Wolf01> if ONE industry would have this behavior, like small shops in cities which might accept different goods or ONE tertiary industry which produces a different kind of goods it should be fine, if all industries will have the same appearance and the cargo is random: 10 annoying :P 14:35:36 *** enr1x [~kiike@230.227.21.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #openttd 14:37:53 *** enr1x [~kiike@230.227.21.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [] 14:49:22 *** guru3 [~guru3@2002:51eb:a47b::1] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:51:46 <andythenorth__> my question applies to two industries specifically - glass works and metal foundry 14:52:12 <andythenorth__> in an ideal world, both would produce building materials, manufacturing supplies and goods 14:52:26 <andythenorth__> however only two output cargos are available :) 14:52:41 <andythenorth__> so I wondered about randomising on construction 14:52:56 <andythenorth__> the choice would be between goods and building materials 14:54:20 <andythenorth__> three output cargos is never going to happen right? 14:54:23 <andythenorth__> frosch123: ^ 14:54:42 *** Singaporekid [~notme@cm133.epsilon84.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #openttd 14:58:57 <frosch123> not any time soon 14:59:07 <andythenorth__> would need a lot of changes 14:59:19 <andythenorth__> no bad thing to force two anyway 14:59:54 *** X-2 [~X-2@5ED67292.cm-7-7b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 15:00:57 *** fanioz [~fanioz@180.214.232.17] has joined #openttd 15:04:25 *** goblin [~flo@dslb-094-218-139-084.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 15:24:39 *** Tidret [~delamarde@bas3-quebec14-1177682411.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #openttd 15:26:09 <Tidret> i'm experiencing some problems with my openttd game this morning :(... the game froze every few seconds... ever happened to one of you before? 15:27:17 *** Priski [priski@ihq.in] has joined #openttd 15:28:23 * andythenorth__ thinks FIRS metal chain is under-used 15:28:26 <andythenorth__> http://tt-foundry.com/sets/FIRS/schema/schema/cargo_details?cargo_type=steel&economy=point_5_release 15:28:41 <andythenorth__> considering adding a Fab Shop producing building materials 15:28:46 <andythenorth__> could accept chemicals 15:28:50 <andythenorth__> as well 15:48:25 *** dfox [~dfox@ip-89-176-209-74.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:49:55 *** Tidret [~delamarde@bas3-quebec14-1177682411.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [] 15:50:06 <Pulec> farmers still grow a lot of food even if al their field are destroyed or flooded 15:50:31 <Pulec> xx 15:51:15 *** Speedy [57f51cd5@ircip1.mibbit.com] has left #openttd [] 16:02:58 *** valhalla1w [~valhallas@s55928dd9.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:06:59 *** andythenorth__ [~andy@host217-44-165-106.range217-44.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth__] 16:15:16 *** nicfer [~nicfer@190.50.18.112] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:28:12 *** xiong [~xiong@netblock-68-183-253-220.dslextreme.com] has joined #openttd 16:41:21 <xiong> Hi, I'm very new. It seems when I build bus depots, they all have the same name and I can't edit a depot's name. Is this normal? Or don't I understand? 16:43:15 <frosch123> that's normal in 1.0.x 16:43:22 <frosch123> it will be different in 1.1 16:43:43 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 16:48:32 *** Mazur [~mazur@83.85.26.153] has joined #openttd 16:50:27 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@88.130.165.18] has joined #openttd 16:56:13 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@88.130.149.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:57:46 <GhostlyDeath> My map loves the environment with 3 coal mines and two power stations 16:59:28 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:f40a:cb55:88fd:d750] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:59:38 <xiong> Okay, well, it's both less confusing and more complex than I thought. A depot is not a station. You may only need one depot on a line; you need multiple stations, obviously. 16:59:40 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:f40a:cb55:88fd:d750] has joined #openttd 17:00:32 <Alberth> how did you reach the idea that a depot and a station are the same thing? 17:00:37 <xiong> Now I have one depot, two bus stations, and two truck stations. However, the truck stations are in the wrong places and have no cargo. 17:01:10 <xiong> I suspect OpenTTD is heavily influenced by British usage. I'm in San Francisco. 17:01:27 <xiong> I'm surprised they're called 'trucks' and not 'lorries'. 17:01:53 <Alberth> the original game was was written by british people :) 17:01:57 <Terkhen> you should try the English(US) language 17:02:16 * xiong looks 17:02:32 <Alberth> game options 17:03:09 <xiong> Actually, I have en-us set. 17:04:00 <xiong> It's not a violation of US usage to distinguish between depot and station; but commonly, the terms are interchangeable. I'll bet a real transport pro would know better. 17:04:12 <Terkhen> then the problem is an incomplete or incorrect translation 17:04:53 * Terkhen does not know if the word translation can be used in this case 17:05:09 *** fjb is now known as Guest2228 17:05:10 <xiong> Maintenance facilities are usually called 'shops', or even 'maintenance facilities'. 17:05:11 *** fjb [~frank@p5DDFC74E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 17:05:48 <Terkhen> xiong: if you are interested, you can become a translator for English(US) (check http://translator.openttd.org/en/faq) 17:06:04 <xiong> The word 'depot' isn't much used in US. If it's for storage and not maintenance, then 'garage' (which can also imply maintenance) or 'yard'. 17:06:37 <xiong> Ha ha, I always knew the day would come when we needed a US <-> UK Babelfish! 17:08:57 <xiong> My difficulty wasn't caused so much by the use of the word 'depot' but by my failure to understand the sophistication of the game. Most toys let a station, however called, load passengers and freight, and do maintenance, all. 17:09:10 <Alberth> :) 17:09:31 <Alberth> having multiple depots saves the vehicles driving to the 'yard 17:10:01 <Alberth> (if you have not disabled servicing not added a depot in their orders 17:10:18 <xiong> Back when, I downloaded a free demo of RRT2 and liked it, so I bought it. Imagine my annoyance when I discovered that the full game had not much more than the demo. 17:10:22 * Alberth misses closing ) and ' a lot :p 17:10:31 <xiong> That game is seriously broken. 17:11:10 <Alberth> I have played that game too, luckily before encountering TTD :) 17:11:20 <xiong> So, if there's a depot on the road, it's not necessary to add it to the timetable? A passing vehicle will automatically put in for service? 17:11:47 <__ln__> how do i restore the taskbar to its original width once i've closed OpenTTD? 17:12:24 *** Guest2228 [~frank@p5DDFD969.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:12:37 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-78-102-180-216.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:12:50 <Alberth> if you open the vehicle details, there is a service interval set, unless you have disabled breaksdown and enabled 'disable servicing when disabling breakdowns' (I think it is called). 17:13:27 <Alberth> xiong: also, if you add a depot in the orders for servicing, they will not go elsewhere for servicing 17:13:54 <Terkhen> I have never played any transport games besides TTD and OpenTTD... a friend showed me RRT3 but I did not like it 17:14:04 <Alberth> but yes, they will drive to a depot on their own 17:14:31 <Alberth> that's where having several depots pays off, as they have to drive less far 17:16:28 <xiong> Ah. Then it's not importantly useful to be able to distinguish depots, since you don't need to add them to the timetable by name. 17:16:32 <xiong> Now, it's all clear. 17:17:53 <Alberth> timetable gets copied from the orders doesn't it? and orders get created by clicking on stations (and depots). 17:18:20 <Alberth> it is just a bit confusing when depots all have the same name 17:18:25 <xiong> Well, it's all irrelevant as far as depots are concerned. 17:18:43 <xiong> I can safely ignore them, so long as I have a few on each line. 17:18:51 <xiong> -- I think. 17:19:11 <Alberth> but you can jump to the place by CTRL+click in the order list 17:19:39 <Alberth> just try :) 17:19:55 <xiong> Stations are another issue. I seem to recall a setting to display the working area of a station -- the area within which goods or people are gathered. Now I can't find the setting. 17:24:22 *** rTypo [rTypo@pc54.clicknet.iasi.rdsnet.ro] has joined #openttd 17:25:33 <Terkhen> in the station building window, set "Coverage area highlight" to on 17:26:18 <xiong> It's not a global setting. 17:27:32 <xiong> You can only see coverage when building, not for built stations? 17:28:37 <Terkhen> yes 17:30:07 <xiong> Hm. 17:30:46 <xiong> Of what use are the dead-end stations? For both bus and truck I see 6 types of station; 4 are dead ends. 17:31:31 <Alberth> they were the original truck/bus stations 17:31:43 <Alberth> s/were/are/ even 17:31:59 <ashb> then can have 3 in at a time 17:32:06 <ashb> the on-the-road stops can only have one 17:32:14 <ashb> and anything behind will sit in a traffic jam 17:32:36 <Alberth> also, they look more pretty in the game imho 17:35:11 *** Tennel [~Tennel@88.150.10.194] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 17:38:03 *** Chris_Booth [~Chris_Boo@cpc7-newt30-2-0-cust37.newt.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 17:40:07 <xiong> Oh, that's a significant difference for a busy station. 17:40:32 <xiong> I have finally transported a successful cargo! 17:41:05 <xiong> My bus is still going back and forth from town to the factory. Apparently, factory workers don't ride the bus. 17:41:26 <xiong> s/back and forth/back and forth empty/ 17:41:51 <xiong> I will try an intercity bus line. 17:42:08 <Katje> xiong: what does the factory's bus stop say it accepts ? 17:44:27 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: translators * r20911 /trunk/src/lang/ (spanish.txt unfinished/marathi.txt): 17:44:27 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 17:44:27 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: marathi - 42 changes by jcravi 17:44:27 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: spanish - 3 changes by Terkhen 17:44:43 *** Wizzleby [~wizzleby@pool-108-16-114-12.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:46:30 <xiong> Katje, Well, it's a combined bus-truck station. It doesn't demand pax -- or supply them either. I saw that but ignored it. 17:46:48 <xiong> Now I have got an intercity line; we'll see how that performs. 17:50:57 <xiong> Hm. Buses may be harder to start than freight. Even though I have two stations, both near center of their towns, no pax await. 17:51:24 <ashb> they won't start turning up intil after the first bus arrives 17:51:59 <xiong> Perhaps this is just terribly realistic: Freight is profitable, pax are not, but good pax service improves community relationships and enables you to expand your frieght service. 17:52:14 <Katje> xiong: not atall 17:52:29 <Katje> passengers work very very well, 17:52:33 <Katje> but just like real life 17:52:41 <Katje> they want to get to their destination quickly 17:52:46 <Katje> and they want to go along way 17:53:29 <Katje> in short: buses suck, trains rock 17:53:35 <xiong> Vehicles have a bad habit of going down dead-end streets for no good reason. Should I add blocking sections (one way both way)? 17:53:55 <Katje> they are turning round 17:54:03 <Katje> they don't do a 3 point turn in the middle of the road 17:56:13 <xiong> I may be confused about the way that the dead-end stations dead-end. 17:56:29 <xiong> Surely, a bus can turn around in a dead-end station. 17:58:03 <xiong> My bus drives right past the station, without going in. I think I have it turned wrong way. 17:59:36 *** Devroush [~dennis@94-225-67-91.access.telenet.be] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:02:07 <xiong> Interesting! I just saw a bus overtake a truck. 18:06:30 *** a1270 [~a1270@72-24-233-98.cpe.cableone.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:08:07 *** a1270 [~a1270@72-24-233-98.cpe.cableone.net] has joined #openttd 18:13:14 *** rTypo [rTypo@pc54.clicknet.iasi.rdsnet.ro] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:16:05 *** fanioz [~fanioz@180.214.232.17] has quit [Quit: Leaving, good bye] 18:18:40 *** andythenorth_ [~andy@host217-44-165-106.range217-44.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 18:22:51 <ccfreak2k> What is a bus but a truck full of people? 18:23:09 <Katje> ccfreak2k: where you from ? 18:25:19 <azaghal> lol 18:26:35 <xiong> Ah. I see the issue with the dead-end bus stations. It's not obvious to me which side is the entry. Depending on the topography, I can't see clearly if the through road joins up into the driveway. There's no way to rotate the board, is there? 18:28:06 <Alberth> it has a bus driver demanding money from the cargo 18:28:50 <Alberth> xiong: no, but there is 'x' and CTL+x for setting the transparancies 18:29:18 <xiong> I've tried the transparencies, thanks. 18:29:44 <xiong> The orientation issue isn't a big deal but it's tough for the newcomer. 18:30:51 <xiong> You see a choice of 4 but depots, for example. 2 of them have the entry facing away. Which do you use on a given street? You have to infer from the other 2, where the entry faces you. 18:31:01 <xiong> s/but/bus/ 18:42:50 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: frosch * r20912 /trunk/src/newgrf_industries.cpp: -Fix [FS#4157]: NEW_INDUSTRYOFFSET != NEW_INDUSTRYTILEOFFSET. 18:44:20 <avdg> wow, quick fix :p 18:45:30 <frosch123> easy reproducible, easy fixable :) 19:01:16 *** nicfer [~nicfer@190.50.18.112] has joined #openttd 19:01:22 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 19:01:47 <Wolf01> 'nighty night 19:01:51 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host142-59-dynamic.8-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 19:02:39 <Chris_Booth> good evening all 19:08:35 <planetmaker> moin 19:10:23 <Chris_Booth> where are you planetmaker if its morning? 19:10:52 <planetmaker> you mistake my greeting for being specific for a particular time of day. :-) 19:11:02 <planetmaker> You're forgiven. Many do that mistake ;-) 19:11:17 <planetmaker> (even people who speak my language) 19:11:30 <Chris_Booth> i thought you meant morning 19:11:40 <planetmaker> no typo there ;-) 19:11:48 <planetmaker> Just the regionally used greeting w/o translation 19:12:11 <Chris_Booth> ooh I see 19:12:25 <Chris_Booth> next time I join then I will have to yell Hollar 19:14:10 <planetmaker> :-) 19:17:53 *** Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF95B6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 19:18:28 <Chris_Booth> planetmaker: I want to ask you something about AP+ 19:18:42 *** Kurimus [Kurimus@dsl-tkubrasgw1-fe83de00-38.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [] 19:19:03 *** Phoenix_the_II [ralph@home.deboom.biz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:19:22 <Alberth> mind the rules :p 19:19:54 <Chris_Booth> well I need to boot my VM 19:20:03 <Chris_Booth> before I can get my error 19:20:28 <Chris_Booth> and in that time pm can decide if he wants to help me or not 19:20:35 <planetmaker> Chris_Booth: I can't 19:20:38 <planetmaker> decide 19:20:45 <planetmaker> before I know any question 19:20:56 <planetmaker> (which is exactly the rule) 19:21:04 <planetmaker> and why it is useful 19:21:07 <Alberth> planetmaker: this is just 'willing', not 'be able to' :) 19:21:17 <planetmaker> :-) 19:21:41 <planetmaker> Alberth: but... 'willing' might also depend on the question 19:21:47 <planetmaker> I might be able to help in many things. 19:21:56 <Alberth> yeah, then it gets tricky :) 19:21:59 <planetmaker> But some might just (for me) be WAY too much work on my part 19:22:47 <Chris_Booth> ok planetmaker I am running AP+ in suse with openttd 1.0.4 19:22:48 <planetmaker> I'm both able to answer a simple yes/no question as (help) building a house. 19:22:54 <planetmaker> I'll probably decline the latter ;-) 19:22:59 <Chris_Booth> I followed the instructions to the word 19:23:30 <Chris_Booth> but when I run ./autopilot.tcl I get and error about line 77 19:23:50 <planetmaker> paste? 19:23:54 <Chris_Booth> config file openttd.cfg has no autopilotsection 19:24:10 <planetmaker> uhm... why not? 19:24:51 <Chris_Booth> well that is my question 19:25:00 <Chris_Booth> where would I put an AP section? 19:25:16 <planetmaker> doesn't matter. I'd put it in the end 19:25:26 <planetmaker> just cat a b > c 19:25:38 <planetmaker> and then copy c to openttd.cfg 19:25:41 <Chris_Booth> ok 19:26:29 <Chris_Booth> can i copy it from the example cfg? 19:28:22 <planetmaker> sure 19:28:38 <planetmaker> you might need to adjust a few things to your config 19:36:11 <Priski> http://img831.imageshack.us/img831/3234/kyy2.jpg does this snake appear in other countries much? 19:36:37 <Priski> that one is alive in picture, and it's a viper 19:36:46 <Priski> poisonous and deadly 19:38:27 <avdg> snakes can only life on places where its hot 19:39:21 <Priski> well that is only poisonous snake that appears in finland 19:39:36 <Priski> in summer they are everywhere 19:39:39 <planetmaker> Chris_Booth: any success? 19:41:18 <Chris_Booth> yes thanks 19:41:19 *** Lurimax [~quassel@ti0028a380-dhcp1125.bb.online.no] has joined #openttd 19:42:12 <planetmaker> great :-) 19:42:13 <avdg> priski: maybe wikipedia helps you 19:42:59 <Priski> http://img203.imageshack.us/img203/1467/talo.jpg this is where I live 19:43:03 <Priski> in winter 19:43:19 <Priski> avdg: I just cheked 19:43:31 <Priski> arg spelling so bad 19:43:56 <Priski> you like the picture? 19:44:07 <avdg> hehe, how would a snake survive there 19:44:30 <Priski> they crawl deep undeground and go into hybernation 19:44:39 <Priski> like bears 19:44:49 <Priski> or frogs 19:45:24 <Priski> life just stops in winter, but does not go away 19:48:01 *** perk11 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has joined #openttd 19:54:09 *** Singaporekid [~notme@cm133.epsilon84.maxonline.com.sg] has quit [] 20:00:17 *** perk11 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 20:07:10 *** Priski [priski@ihq.in] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:07:43 *** guru3 [~guru3@2002:51eb:a47b::1] has joined #openttd 20:23:19 <xiong> Ha ha, this is serious, isn't it? Mistake to call it a game. I just found out that I can't handwave off the siding issue. Either I put in sidings and signals or I need two tracks all the way from town to town. 20:23:55 <Alberth> sidings? 20:24:12 <xiong> What with the grading issue -- hills in the way, not to mention the need to demolish an odd farm or two, rail routes can be expensive. 20:24:51 <xiong> Alberth, Must be another US-UK translation issue. What do you call them? Runarounds? Bypasses? 20:25:12 <andythenorth_> 'in the hole' 20:25:13 <andythenorth_> :P 20:25:24 <Alberth> a piece of double track, you mean? bypass seems fine 20:25:29 <xiong> It used to be common to connect low-traffic towns with single track lines. 20:25:31 <andythenorth_> UK is mostly double track, or lightly used single traffic 20:25:36 <andythenorth_> we don't have meets 20:26:18 <Alberth> it is much cheaper to lay your tracks around the farms rather than right thrugh them :p 20:26:39 <xiong> So oncoming trains can pass one another, you put a siding every several miles -- a section of double track with turnouts at each end. A siding can also lead to a loading platform. 20:26:45 <Alberth> you can make a one-way circle through several towns 20:27:57 <xiong> Oh, I'll build double track now. Live and learn. As I said, this is a serious game; no handwaving. 20:27:58 <planetmaker> ^ that can be a quite efficient means to organize things 20:28:15 <planetmaker> eh...? serious? 20:28:20 <planetmaker> it's meant to be fun ;-) 20:28:35 <xiong> It's not possible to do anything while time is stopped, is it? 20:28:48 <Chris_Booth> I hate networks 20:28:54 <planetmaker> xiong: find the depth of insanity in OpenTTD track building in our PublicServer Archive at http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/PublicServer:Archive 20:29:03 <Alberth> it is, just not construction (unless you cheat) 20:29:08 <planetmaker> xiong: yes. cheat 'build in pause' 20:29:47 <andythenorth_> xiong: if you have the right map, single-track railroading is a fun challenge 20:29:52 <xiong> Dunno why that should be considered a cheat. Most of construction time is spent fiddling with the interface and the mouse; it's not 'real time'. 20:30:11 <avdg> its considered as a cheat against ai 20:30:13 <planetmaker> xiong: you cheat you fellow players 20:30:18 <xiong> In fact, actual construction seems instant. 20:30:22 <Chris_Booth> it would be lees of a cheat if there was a planing mode 20:30:36 <Chris_Booth> then it took 5 - 10 years to build your track 20:30:39 <planetmaker> it would be the same cheat as the AI could do nothing 20:30:54 <planetmaker> thus you'd be given infinitely more time than your opponents 20:31:10 <xiong> It would make more sense to me if I could plan out some construction while paused and then it took 'real time' to complete the building of it. 20:31:29 <Chris_Booth> xiong: planing takes time 20:31:36 <Chris_Booth> often it takes more time than building 20:31:46 <Chris_Booth> so planing could take 20 years 20:32:00 <planetmaker> xiong: but then the AIs would need the same authority 20:32:01 <xiong> It's not comparable. A quibble. 20:32:13 <planetmaker> how not? 20:32:19 <xiong> Well, why not give AI the same benefit? 20:32:20 <planetmaker> AI cannot do more or less than you 20:32:36 <planetmaker> And I'd be seriously annoyed if an AI decided to halt the game 20:32:44 <planetmaker> Consider that with 14 competitors 20:32:48 <planetmaker> You'd never run the game 20:32:59 <planetmaker> Or consider the same thing in true multiplayer 20:33:12 <Chris_Booth> it would be like openttdcoop planing but a million times worse 20:33:13 <xiong> Real-world planning goes on continuously, simultaneously with operations and actual construction. 20:33:14 <planetmaker> I'd not play with / against you, if you paused it at your free leasure 20:33:29 <planetmaker> xiong: exactly 20:33:35 <planetmaker> thus time is also not paused 20:33:43 <andythenorth_> I made one ship in FISH a little faster for variety 20:33:47 <andythenorth_> guess which one I use most :P 20:33:57 <xiong> But as a practical matter, I'm only one person and it takes me time to get around the interface. 20:34:04 <planetmaker> hehe @ andythenorth_ 20:34:45 <planetmaker> xiong: yes, but OpenTTD is (also) a MP game. Such constructing while paused is a cheat 20:35:11 <xiong> I don't play MP games. I'm old and I have got no speed in me. 20:35:40 <Chris_Booth> xiong: mp is slow on some servers 20:35:56 <xiong> Last time I played anything MP, it was StarCraft. Kids were building dozens of swarms while I was still getting my fingers on the buttons. 20:36:28 <Chris_Booth> some mp games go on for 1000s of years 20:36:29 <planetmaker> xiong: MP in OpenTTD needs not be really competitive, you know ;-) 20:36:30 <xiong> Even locally, I play mostly turn-based games and put a lot of thought into each turn. 20:36:53 <xiong> That's just me, I don't want to start a debate about this. 20:37:08 <Chris_Booth> a game with a plan is a great idea 20:37:13 <Chris_Booth> I always use plans 20:37:26 <xiong> 'Plans'? 20:37:50 <planetmaker> xiong: as in: people propose a network design with a small scetch, then vote on the best proposal. Then jointly build that 20:37:50 <Chris_Booth> yes draw your self a plan on paper of in game of what your end network will be 20:37:53 <Chris_Booth> then follow it 20:38:05 <planetmaker> that's how we play coop 20:38:09 <Chris_Booth> planetmaker: that is a coop plan 20:38:16 <planetmaker> yes :-) ^ 20:38:17 <xiong> Well, if the game is constantly running, then there's even less time for drawing on paper. 20:38:24 <Chris_Booth> I have plans on my own games but that are more detailed and extreme 20:38:48 <planetmaker> xiong: depends. We don't start building before a we haven't decided on one of the propsoed plans 20:38:49 <Chris_Booth> use the pause button? 20:39:17 <planetmaker> and you have about one or two real time days to devise a good plan for a map ;-) 20:39:44 <xiong> Okay, well, obviously you have an approach that suits. I'm very new and for me, all I want to do is get something running. Took me a couple hours just to get one working bus line. 20:40:40 <xiong> By the time I get a decent double-track line from one town to another, properly graded and signaled, I suspect the bank interest will bankrupt me. 20:40:43 <Chris_Booth> I was the same way today with simutrans until I decided the game was rubish 20:41:23 <xiong> Perhaps later, when I get familiar with the game, I'll turn off the cheat. 20:41:24 <Chris_Booth> xiong: a good way to make money fast is with planes from one side of the map to the other 20:41:33 <planetmaker> or coal... 20:41:40 <planetmaker> coal has the best revenue 20:41:42 <Chris_Booth> or give you self 10,000,000 to start with 20:41:49 <planetmaker> and not short route but rather one long 20:42:35 *** Tennel [~Tennel@88.150.10.194] has joined #openttd 20:53:01 *** Chris_Booth__ [~Chris_Boo@cpc7-newt30-2-0-cust37.newt.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 20:55:02 *** Tennel [~Tennel@88.150.10.194] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 20:55:52 *** Chris_Booth [~Chris_Boo@cpc7-newt30-2-0-cust37.newt.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:55:58 *** Chris_Booth__ is now known as Chris_Booth 20:56:36 <xiong> "Playing with virtual toy trains can be quite addictive, so remember to get some sleep." -- I'm going to take that good advice, and a nap. 20:57:36 <Alberth> otherwise you have to stay awake for a very long time :p 20:57:36 *** avdg [~avdg@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:58:03 *** avdg [~avdg@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 21:04:37 *** xiong [~xiong@netblock-68-183-253-220.dslextreme.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:11:05 *** Alberth [~hat@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has left #openttd [] 21:16:57 *** ecke [~ecke@188.75.128.2] has joined #openttd 21:21:17 *** andythenorth_ [~andy@host217-44-165-106.range217-44.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth_] 21:34:15 *** a1270 [~a1270@72-24-233-98.cpe.cableone.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:36:24 *** dfox [~dfox@ip-89-176-209-74.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 22:23:10 *** Chris_Booth_ [~Chris_Boo@cpc7-newt30-2-0-cust37.newt.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 22:25:46 *** elmz_ [~elmz@184.213-167-126.customer.lyse.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:27:50 *** Chris_Booth [~Chris_Boo@cpc7-newt30-2-0-cust37.newt.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:27:52 *** Chris_Booth_ is now known as Chris_Booth 22:35:27 *** nicfer [~nicfer@190.50.18.112] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:36:57 *** nicfer [~nicfer@190.50.18.112] has joined #openttd 22:40:41 *** Lurimax [~quassel@ti0028a380-dhcp1125.bb.online.no] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:41:38 *** dfox [~dfox@ip-89-176-209-74.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:54:51 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-25-213-176.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:03:01 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:04:00 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1C98B.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:05:55 *** Phoenix_the_II [ralph@home.deboom.biz] has joined #openttd 23:31:51 *** avdg [~avdg@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:32:48 *** avdg [~avdg@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 23:32:55 *** Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF95B6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:33:58 *** avdg [~avdg@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:34:24 *** avdg [~avdg@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 23:36:56 *** b_jonas [~x@BC24C4DD.dsl.pool.telekom.hu] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:42:32 *** Pulec [~pulec@static-cl093181068250.unet.cz] has quit [] 23:44:59 *** avdg [~avdg@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:46:00 *** avdg [~avdg@94-227-100-192.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 23:52:10 *** Biolunar [mahdi@blfd-5d8208de.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: All your IRC are belong to us!] 23:54:44 *** Chris_Booth [~Chris_Boo@cpc7-newt30-2-0-cust37.newt.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:59:36 *** ^Spike^ [~spike@d200003.upc-d.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]