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00:17:32 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A5B3.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:28:33 <supermop> hello 00:34:08 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 00:41:45 *** Phoenix_the_II [~ralph@home.deboom.biz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:45:06 *** Biolunar [mahdi@blfd-4db1a3d8.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: All your IRC are belong to us!] 02:26:28 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-188-109-247-140.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 02:30:58 *** rhaeder1 [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-152-083.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:49:43 *** DDR [~DDR@142.179.78.88] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:26:26 *** Elukka [Elukka@89-166-103-135.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 03:26:31 *** Kurimus [~stabbity@dsl-tkubrasgw3-fe93dd00-34.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd 03:54:11 *** DDR [~DDR@142.179.78.88] has joined #openttd 04:18:20 *** supermop [~daniel_er@cpe-67-243-25-39.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: supermop] 04:50:25 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-88-242.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:56:02 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B74225.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:56:22 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B73DD3.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 05:23:42 *** JVassie [~James@2.27.87.116] has joined #openttd 05:43:53 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has joined #openttd 06:07:32 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 06:19:25 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@027af076.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:21:15 *** Br33z4hSlut5 [~static.kp@92.68.154.34] has joined #openttd 06:22:08 *** JVassie [~James@2.27.87.116] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:32:20 *** norbert79 [~Norbi@deibp9eh1--blueice2n2.emea.ibm.com] has joined #openttd 06:32:23 <norbert79> Morning 06:32:45 <Markk> Oi :) 06:44:30 <norbert79> Morning Markk ! 06:45:37 <Markk> How are you doing? :) 06:45:46 <Markk> Are you better than last week? 06:46:06 <norbert79> Better, thank you, catched something like a flu, got KO-ed for the last 4 days 06:46:22 <Markk> ah 06:46:24 <norbert79> I am not recovered full, but feeling ok 06:46:32 <Markk> Okey.:) 06:46:39 <Markk> Good that you're better atleast. 06:46:52 <norbert79> Was a bit early for flu :) 06:47:18 <norbert79> And you Markk ? 06:47:29 <Markk> Alot of people here catches cold and flu's atm. 06:47:44 <Markk> It's fine. :) 06:48:52 <Markk> I've slept well, eaten breakfast, got my morning cigarette (even 4 of them already :x ), got my morning bike ride (from the bus to work, about 15 mins) and also my morning coke. :) 06:49:16 <Markk> So, I shouldn't complain I guess. :) 06:49:24 <norbert79> Sounds nice 06:51:28 <Markk> Yes, indeed it is. :) 06:51:40 <norbert79> Do you know the movie Matrix, I assume, right? 06:51:43 *** DDR [~DDR@142.179.78.88] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:51:53 <Markk> Would be perfect with some OTTD right now, but I don't think my supervisor would fancy that as much as I would. :) 06:51:56 <Markk> Yep. 06:52:10 <Markk> Think I've seen all of them. 06:52:12 <norbert79> And do you also know the movie it was basically based of, Dark City from 1998? 06:52:38 <Markk> Hm, I don't, acctually. :o 06:53:09 <norbert79> Well, during the weekend I had a chance watching it, and I must say it was quite exciting and interesting for me 06:53:30 <__ln__> Better watch the Director's Cut though. 06:53:35 <norbert79> __ln__: Did 06:53:38 <__ln__> Good. 06:53:50 <norbert79> __ln__: I must say I was impressed 06:53:51 <Markk> :) 06:54:11 <norbert79> Mr Hand :) 06:54:53 <__ln__> But that Matrix would be based on Dark City... I don't think that's possible. 06:55:16 <norbert79> __ln__: Ehm, shall I come with pages, which compare both movies? (DC - Matrix 1) 06:55:18 <norbert79> :) 06:55:24 <norbert79> There are tons of similarities 06:55:51 <norbert79> and you can feel on Episode 1, that it was extraordanary, while 2nd and the 3rd episode kinda sucked 06:57:05 <norbert79> __ln__: http://www.retrojunk.com/details_articles/540/ - Actually this article made me to watch Dark City 06:57:37 <__ln__> norbert79: I know, but the premiere of Dark City was only 13 months before the premiere of Matrix. 06:58:05 <norbert79> __ln__: Sure, but 13 months are a lot of time 06:58:18 <__ln__> Which IMHO is a short time to copy the ideas, write a script, shoot, do a lot of special effects, and have it released. 06:58:38 <norbert79> __ln__: Nah, you would be suprised... 06:58:56 <norbert79> __ln__: Besides, the main focus was on bullet time 06:59:48 <norbert79> either way the Watchowsky brothers could gather a copy of the screenbook of Dark City any time 06:59:50 <__ln__> norbert79: While you're at it, you could also watch ExistenZ, the third movie from the same era with a sort of similar theme. 07:00:00 <norbert79> __ln__: Now you made me curious 07:00:20 <norbert79> __ln__: I watched the 13th Floor too, which also was used by the Watchowsky brothers 07:00:32 <__ln__> Oh yes, that's the fourth. 07:00:34 <norbert79> Let me check ExistenZ 07:00:36 *** Neon [~Neon@dslb-178-004-186-157.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 07:00:45 <norbert79> 13th floor rocked too :) 07:01:22 <norbert79> http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0120907/mediaindex - No shots from the movie... Dang 07:01:49 <norbert79> Hah, found some though on outnow.ch 07:02:32 <norbert79> I think I have seen this, or at least I can remember having seen it on German television once 07:02:35 <norbert79> yet not in full 07:02:43 <norbert79> I remember the controllers 07:03:35 <norbert79> I should rewatch it again... Thanks for the tip __ln__ 07:06:23 <norbert79> __ln__: Basically if you recall the end of Matrix 2, you remember a scene where Neo disables some sentry robots in real life with the same method he used within the Matrix. That was the point, where I stopped watching Matrix, but if you also recall Dark City, you remmeber the main character doing the same, yet there was at least an explanation to that how he was able doing so. Yet that scene is also an exact proof of copying Dark Cit 07:06:23 <norbert79> y, but it was used at the worst part of the story... 07:06:37 *** DDR [~DDR@142.179.78.88] has joined #openttd 07:07:15 <__ln__> I've been trying to forget Matrix 2 and 3 because they sucked so much. 07:08:02 <norbert79> __ln__: So does everyone :)) 07:08:13 <norbert79> __ln__: Yet the scene with the candy and the girl was fun :D 07:08:30 <norbert79> I mean dessert 07:18:16 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:24:24 *** TWerkhoven [~twerkhove@cpc14-linl7-2-0-cust28.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 07:29:55 *** devilsadvocate [~quassel@109.200.19.188] has joined #openttd 07:54:34 * __ln__ has forgotten 07:59:03 *** DDR [~DDR@142.179.78.88] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:13:01 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 08:22:26 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590fed07.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 08:33:29 <devilsadvocate> z-MaTRiX: one day as 1 day in game would be impossible to play with 08:34:26 <devilsadvocate> and what about construction? would you wait for a month for your first track to be laid? 08:34:44 <norbert79> devilsadvocate: That would be quite a challenge :)) 08:37:17 <b_jonas> as long as you still have a fast-forward control... 08:38:31 *** DDR [~DDR@142.179.78.88] has joined #openttd 08:39:30 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1B0CE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 08:42:03 *** erik1984 [~erik1984@vhe-490300.sshn.net] has joined #openttd 09:09:55 *** hanf [~Klaus@host-89-240-253-174.as13285.net] has joined #openttd 09:21:46 *** DDR [~DDR@142.179.78.88] has quit [Quit: In democracy it's your vote that counts; In feudalism it's your count that votes. - Mogens Jallberg] 09:27:20 *** norbert79 [~Norbi@deibp9eh1--blueice2n2.emea.ibm.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:31:58 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip2.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 09:32:39 *** norbert79 [~Norbi@deibp9eh1--blueice2n2.emea.ibm.com] has joined #openttd 09:32:54 <appe> seriosly, wouldnt it be nice as a parameter? 09:33:33 <appe> where the setting goes from normal (plus fast-forward), slow, slower, slowester, slowie mc'finnegan and realistic 09:33:56 <peter1138> realistic... 09:34:01 <appe> you dont have to change track completion 09:34:15 <norbert79> peter1138: I would also call it 'real time' instead 09:34:22 <appe> simply change the ratio between city growth and game speed. 09:34:34 <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, "simply" 09:35:26 <appe> hehe 09:35:30 <appe> as an idea, of course 09:35:54 <peter1138> one tick every ~ 19 minutes 09:35:59 <peter1138> that would be painful 09:36:37 <appe> btw 09:36:47 <appe> you guys always use the fast-forward button? 09:37:06 <norbert79> appe: Almost never 09:37:13 <norbert79> appe: it's fast enough for me already 09:37:37 <norbert79> appe: In Single I tend using the 'Pause' often 09:37:43 <norbert79> while thinking 09:37:58 *** hanf [~Klaus@host-89-240-253-174.as13285.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:38:10 <appe> ah, i see 09:38:11 <Eddi|zuHause> same here 09:42:22 <V453000> I use pause only when debugging some signals tbh 09:43:35 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-057-084.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 09:47:01 <planetmaker> hello 09:47:08 <norbert79> moin planetmaker 10:00:59 *** TWerkhoven [~twerkhove@cpc14-linl7-2-0-cust28.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: He who can look into the future, has a brighter future to look into] 10:06:05 *** TWerkhoven [~Turbulent@cpc14-linl7-2-0-cust28.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 10:16:07 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-83-134-160-229.dsl.scarlet.be] has joined #openttd 10:16:19 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-057-084.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has quit [Quit: I reject your reality and substitute my own] 10:28:36 *** KenjiE20 [~Kenji@host-92-9-224-33.as43234.net] has joined #openttd 10:35:04 *** papa [~chatzilla@ppp-58-11-133-186.revip2.asianet.co.th] has joined #openttd 10:35:08 <papa> hey 10:35:17 <z-MaTRiX> ho 10:35:20 <papa> why do i get Erro:failed to find agraphics set? 10:35:31 <papa> i installed openttd 1.1.3 on ubuntu using a .deb from the site 10:35:32 <z-MaTRiX> because you dont have one ? 10:35:54 <papa> i have openttd.grf 10:35:57 <papa> does that count? 10:36:38 <papa> no_sound.obs ogfxh_tropical.grf opntitle.dat orig_win.obg 10:36:40 <papa> ogfx1_base.grf ogfxi_logos.grf orig_dos_de.obg orig_win.obs 10:36:42 <papa> ogfxc_arctic.grf ogfxt_toyland.grf orig_dos.obg 10:36:43 <papa> ogfxe_extra.grf openttd.grf orig_dos.obs 10:36:58 <planetmaker> and where's opengfx.obg? 10:37:17 <planetmaker> why didn't you install OpenGFX via your package manager, too? It should be a recommended install for OpenTTD 10:38:11 <papa> oh 10:38:19 <papa> that makes sense 10:41:13 <papa> thx brah 10:42:44 <appe> uhm 10:42:53 <appe> is the standard maps and stuff also made as grfs? 10:43:57 <norbert79> Standard maps? 10:44:36 <norbert79> you mean heightmaps and scenarios? Those can be downloaded using the game's built-in downloading feature 10:44:54 <appe> no, the type of map (tropical, etc) that comes with the game 10:45:03 <planetmaker> grf stands for "graphics resource files"... 10:45:09 <appe> i see 10:45:25 <planetmaker> a NewGRF of course can totally re-define what "tropical climate" means 10:45:29 <appe> i thought it was used only as additional information 10:45:37 <appe> oh 10:45:40 <appe> aha 10:45:44 <appe> grf != newgrf 10:45:50 <planetmaker> yes and no 10:45:58 <planetmaker> grf includes the base sets. 10:46:06 <planetmaker> But generally NewGRF is a grf, too 10:46:14 <appe> a newgrf is of course a grf, but the "new" is added to mark that it's not a part of the core? 10:46:20 <planetmaker> yes 10:46:26 <appe> i see, thank you. 10:46:32 <planetmaker> you're welcome 10:46:39 <Markk> appe: Get back to work now. 10:46:55 <norbert79> Markk: Look who's talking ;-) 10:46:58 <Markk> You shouldn't play with OTTD or yourself right now. :( 10:47:04 <Markk> norbert79: :) 10:48:32 <planetmaker> Markk: why should he? It' a public holidy today ;-) 10:48:38 <Markk> Nope. :) 10:48:40 <Markk> Not here. 10:48:55 <Markk> And I know he's at work, or atleast should be. :D 10:48:58 <planetmaker> see. Broaden your horizon ;-) :-P (scnr) 10:50:07 <appe> Markk: markymark. 10:50:08 <appe> huh. 10:50:08 <appe> :D 10:53:12 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@nsc.ciup.fr] has joined #openttd 10:57:32 *** papa [~chatzilla@ppp-58-11-133-186.revip2.asianet.co.th] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 7.0.1/20110928224103]] 10:58:43 *** FHerne [~francis_h@host81-152-100-192.range81-152.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 11:00:52 <FHerne> Would it be possible to make a NewGRF for whales? 11:01:44 *** FHerne [~francis_h@host81-152-100-192.range81-152.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:02:28 <planetmaker> I call that impatient ;-) 11:04:59 <Eddi|zuHause> nah, there have been way worse :p 11:05:46 <peter1138> newgrf whales? 11:05:56 <peter1138> is that a ship type? 11:06:35 <peter1138> transports cargo type "jonah" 11:06:43 <appe> :D 11:06:57 <frosch123> do whales fly when filled with helium? 11:07:06 <appe> nope. 11:07:19 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm fairly sure they explode :p 11:07:45 <Eddi|zuHause> (given that you can prevent the gas from escaping in the first place) 11:07:55 <appe> think of a balloon 11:08:06 <appe> the ratio between the thickness of the plastic and the volume inside it 11:08:13 <appe> would be a bit difficult with a whale. 11:08:21 <appe> unless you are carvy mc'knife 11:09:48 <Eddi|zuHause> is that a reference of some sort? 11:12:33 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1B0CE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:13:19 *** FHerne [~francis_h@pmsmail01.perse.co.uk] has joined #openttd 11:14:40 <Terkhen> hello 11:29:06 *** FHerne [~francis_h@pmsmail01.perse.co.uk] has left #openttd [] 11:29:23 *** FHerne [~francis_h@pmsmail01.perse.co.uk] has joined #openttd 11:45:47 *** FHerne [~francis_h@pmsmail01.perse.co.uk] has left #openttd [] 11:46:46 <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: i'm still missing "email notification on commit" 11:51:57 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@nsc.ciup.fr] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 12:09:53 <Ammler> Eddi|zuHause: you have enabled email notifications "for any event" ? 12:10:15 <Ammler> might not work for commits, not sure 12:11:26 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, that is exactly the problem 12:12:05 <Ammler> ok, I guess that it only meant for tickets 12:12:29 <Ammler> and you do not want to use rss feed? 12:13:35 <Eddi|zuHause> i'd have to set up yet another background program for that... 12:17:12 <Eddi|zuHause> hm, exclude refrigerated from mail wagons? 12:18:19 <Ammler> also you know the other IRC channel? 12:18:21 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has joined #openttd 12:23:55 *** Biolunar [mahdi@blfd-4d08fe87.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 12:26:13 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-057-084.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 12:29:33 <Eddi|zuHause> no, i don't know any other irc channels. 12:36:00 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1B0CE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 12:42:06 *** LordAro [d92b6cbd@ircip3.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 12:48:30 <Eddi|zuHause> now it's getting totally weird... it complains that bitmask entries cannot be > 31, but after make clean it works... 12:49:48 <planetmaker> something not re-compiled maybe while it should? Which resulted in an index being >31 while it is not when properly re-generated? 12:51:26 <Eddi|zuHause> all i did was change src/cargo_definitions.pnml 12:53:11 <Eddi|zuHause> hm, cargo wagons 1870-1910: transport liquids in barrels on open wagons? 12:58:42 <planetmaker> why not? 13:04:24 <Eddi|zuHause> narf, these damn cargo multipliers 13:04:55 <Eddi|zuHause> need code like: 13:05:42 <Eddi|zuHause> if (defined(GOOD)) { capacity : 2*<cap>; cargo: GOOD } else { capacity: <cap>; cargo: first_refittable } 13:08:55 *** Doorslammer [7da86216@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 13:12:39 <planetmaker> eh? why not just via callback? 13:13:08 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: because if first_refittable happens to be GOOD, all capacities are halved 13:13:17 <Eddi|zuHause> instead of the GOOD one doubled 13:13:59 <planetmaker> nah, just make an unconditional callback. Which returns the goods capacity and otherwise always the other 13:14:08 <planetmaker> independent of what cargos are defined 13:14:16 <Eddi|zuHause> you mean cb15? 13:14:25 <planetmaker> 36 13:14:27 <planetmaker> iirc 13:14:33 <planetmaker> but nml takes care of that 13:14:38 <planetmaker> you just set the units 13:14:42 <Terkhen> nml uses both IIRC 13:14:44 <Eddi|zuHause> cb36 is subject to the multipliers 13:14:57 <planetmaker> nml handles both simultaneously 13:15:16 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: anyway, the default behaviour is plain stupid 13:15:35 <planetmaker> I still don't see your issue. 13:16:03 <planetmaker> Just set goods capacity via that cargo_capacity CB and you're done 13:16:19 <Eddi|zuHause> it's more complicated than that 13:16:35 <planetmaker> in nfo 13:17:05 <Eddi|zuHause> assume a wagon that is refittable to LVST and GOODS 13:17:15 <Eddi|zuHause> and sets a capacity of 10 13:17:31 <Eddi|zuHause> then by default it carries 10 LVST and 20 GOOD 13:17:52 <Eddi|zuHause> now assume an industry set reshuffles the cargo slots, so GOOD comes before LVST 13:17:54 <planetmaker> the action0 capacity is totally unimportant, if you use the CB 13:18:06 <Eddi|zuHause> now that same wagon carries 5 LVST and 10 GOOD 13:18:43 <planetmaker> http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/608/ 13:18:56 <planetmaker> ^ that as target for cargo_capacity CB and it always should work 13:19:46 <Eddi|zuHause> but then i have to know _all_ cargo multipliers 13:19:54 <planetmaker> no 13:19:58 *** Doorslammer [7da86216@ircip1.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 13:20:06 <planetmaker> you don't care about them. You set the capacity 13:20:17 <planetmaker> 20 goods. 10 other units 13:20:20 <Eddi|zuHause> but i want to care about them 13:20:25 *** supermop [~daniel_er@cpe-67-243-25-39.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 13:21:09 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1B0CE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:21:21 <planetmaker> why do you want to care about them? 13:21:43 <Eddi|zuHause> why not? 13:22:55 <planetmaker> for example to avoid the issue you complain about 13:26:14 *** chats [~chats@cpc2-pmth10-2-0-cust1018.6-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 13:26:24 <__ln__> http://www.flightforum.fi/forum/index.php/topic,100684.0.html 13:27:02 <chats> can someone please help me i am trying to get ttd to run on my 64 bit vista system i can install it but it wont let me build anything 13:27:38 <planetmaker> start in 1950 and don't use NewGRFs 13:27:51 *** perk11 [~perk11@188.255.47.217] has joined #openttd 13:27:58 <Terkhen> chats: what error do you get? 13:28:03 <planetmaker> If you use NewGRFs: make sure you start at a date where the NewGRFs supply vehicles 13:28:32 <chats> i see i tried to start at 1850 for a longer game sorry i am not to good at this 13:28:44 <supermop> should ogfx + vehicle sets supply earlier vehicles? 13:28:55 <planetmaker> it should not (yet) 13:29:10 <planetmaker> s/should/does/ 13:29:41 <supermop> didn't tto have a few from the 20's, so that when you started in 1930 they were there already? 13:30:07 <planetmaker> yes, one can start 1920+ 13:30:09 <supermop> i was testing my grf in alpine/north america/whatever the other day 13:30:14 <supermop> with no other grfs 13:30:28 <Terkhen> supermop: IMO OpenGFX+ should supply earlier vehicles, yes 13:30:29 <Belugas> hi 13:30:38 <Terkhen> as soon as I get nice sprites for earlier trucks :P 13:30:39 <supermop> i didnt realize it bc i'd never played alpine before (i only had tto as a kid) 13:30:42 <Terkhen> hi Belugas 13:30:54 <supermop> but i had nothing but the passenger boat when i started 13:30:58 <chats> thankyou for the help been wanting to get this game again for years 13:31:10 *** chats [~chats@cpc2-pmth10-2-0-cust1018.6-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [] 13:31:12 <Terkhen> chats: enjoy ;) 13:31:41 <supermop> i did manage to build a nice ferry network while i waited for trains to be invented, so that I could build a train station to see if it worked... 13:38:18 <Belugas> hello Terkhen :) 13:38:50 <Terkhen> I hope monday is going fine for you :P 13:39:40 <supermop> ooooh grf is working! 13:39:49 <Belugas> so far yes , thanks :) bad wether, but who gives a shit wne woking inside ;) 13:39:56 <Terkhen> :) 13:44:13 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-83-134-160-229.dsl.scarlet.be] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:44:17 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: err... is the makefile creating the grf twice? 13:44:39 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-83-134-175-22.dsl.scarlet.be] has joined #openttd 13:44:42 <planetmaker> no, why? 13:45:01 <planetmaker> it's calling nml twice 13:45:15 <planetmaker> once with -M --MT and once with --grf 13:48:47 <Eddi|zuHause> ah 13:48:57 <Eddi|zuHause> because i was getting the warning twice 13:49:15 <Eddi|zuHause> what does -M and -MT do? 13:50:58 <Eddi|zuHause> and might that be the reason why changing cargo_definitions.pnml does not immediately get recognized? 13:55:11 <Yexo> planetmaker: there is no reason to call nml twice 13:55:46 <Yexo> you only need to recompute the dependencies when the final nml file has been changed, and at that time you also need to rebuild the grf 13:55:51 <Yexo> the two go hand in hand 13:56:59 <planetmaker> I need to recompute dependencies when one pnml file or (if used) one of the graphics source list files changed 13:58:15 <Eddi|zuHause> i suppose we should not allow fish in a mail wagon 13:59:51 <planetmaker> Yexo: alternatively I'd have to get rid of the option to do a separate dependency check - which is bad, if you remove a dependency. As then make will fail and not re-generate dependencies as it should 14:00:18 <planetmaker> (now dependencies are not used / read during dependency generation) 14:00:25 <Yexo> <planetmaker> I need to recompute dependencies when one pnml file or (if used) one of the graphics source list files changed <- but if one of those files changes, you also need to recompile the final grf 14:00:55 <Yexo> hmm, true 14:01:03 <Yexo> I forgot about removing dependencies 14:01:14 <Yexo> perhaps ignore the output from nml during depcheck? 14:01:18 <Yexo> 2> /dev/null ? 14:01:27 <planetmaker> hm, probably a good idea 14:02:05 <Yexo> maybe not, what if nml fails to generate dependencies due to a bug in the nml code? 14:02:27 <planetmaker> also true 14:02:46 <planetmaker> but then make already failed 14:02:54 <planetmaker> but yes, we'd not know why... 14:03:21 <Eddi|zuHause> perhaps a --quiet option to nmlc? 14:04:37 <peter1138> V453000, "Unfortunately there is one thing in OpenTTD to remember - the depot counters are ... weird" < bug report? 14:05:00 <Yexo> Eddi|zuHause: good idea, added to issue tracker as #3106 14:05:05 <V453000> I think it is reported already 14:05:29 <Eddi|zuHause> V453000: it's not the depot counters that are off 14:05:31 <peter1138> (and the screenshot doesn't make sense, but if you're using invisible things, then i guess it's hard to see) 14:05:35 <Eddi|zuHause> it's basically fs#3569 14:05:58 <Eddi|zuHause> bounding boxes for shortened vehicles are still full length 14:06:24 <Eddi|zuHause> (affects turning point in curves, reservations, etc.) 14:06:29 <V453000> yes, that 14:07:15 <peter1138> iirc, curve speed was always based on number of wagons, not length 14:07:27 <peter1138> (not necessarily right ofc) 14:07:37 <supermop> do only special types of fonts work in ottd? 14:07:37 <Eddi|zuHause> curve speed is based on number of turns in the vehicle chain 14:07:42 <V453000> that would be odd, shorter wagons would automatically slow down 14:08:04 <peter1138> supermop, no 14:08:08 <supermop> whenever i set a custom font i just get a generic sans serif that doesnt look anything like it 14:08:13 <V453000> as Eddi says, but the problem is that you dont "know" the length when the depot says something else 14:08:28 <supermop> whether i use .ttf or .otf 14:08:36 <Eddi|zuHause> the problem only shows if the last vehicle is (significantly) shortened 14:09:30 <Eddi|zuHause> "cigarette smoke contains polonium-210" 14:09:45 <V453000> http://bugs.openttd.org/task/3569/getfile/7525/tl2[1].png those wagons arent that short, are they? :o 14:09:55 <V453000> well, obviously are :( 14:10:42 *** Elukka [Elukka@89-166-103-135.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 14:10:55 <Eddi|zuHause> "the issue was discovered 40 years ago, but publishing was suppressed" 14:12:40 <supermop> is there something I might be doing wrong but am missing? 14:13:04 <supermop> i just put the path to the font in the cfg, right? 14:13:18 <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: should rather use the font name 14:13:45 <supermop> doesnt work when i do that 14:14:34 <Terkhen> supermop: http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/609/ 14:14:39 <Terkhen> that's how my font options look 14:14:44 <Terkhen> that works on both linux and windows 14:15:15 <supermop> do i need to set the anti aliasing to true? 14:15:25 <supermop> im just playing in 8bpp 14:15:44 <peter1138> no 14:16:03 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-94-112-27-144.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 14:17:35 <peter1138> yeah, curve speed limits are still based on number of parts, not length 14:17:42 <peter1138> so that "bug" is expected 14:17:59 <peter1138> "does not fit in the station" ... well... 14:19:20 <V453000> the only problem I have is that the depot tells me it should 14:19:36 <V453000> but still, not a big problem 14:20:33 <peter1138> i look at that picture and i see a train fitting into the station... 14:21:19 <V453000> which picture 14:21:30 <peter1138> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=973864#p973864 14:21:43 <V453000> ah 14:21:52 <V453000> well, then why is the track behind the station occupied 14:22:04 <V453000> but the train does load with normal speed 14:22:14 <Eddi|zuHause> reservations are affected by fs#3569, station loading not 14:22:23 <peter1138> is it actually occupied, or not unreserved? 14:22:25 <Eddi|zuHause> do you ever listen to what i say? 14:23:06 <V453000> peter1138: the block behind the signal is occupied 14:23:35 <V453000> I can make a larger screenshot to make it visible if you want 14:23:38 <peter1138> looks empty to me ... 14:23:55 <Elukka> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-8gV4DJZUw&feature=relmfu 14:24:06 <V453000> looks, isnt 14:24:44 <supermop> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=56877 14:25:22 <Terkhen> supermop: did you try what I pasted? (font name only, no path) 14:25:39 <supermop> yes, but then i get an error on opening ottd 14:25:43 <Terkhen> what error? 14:25:53 <supermop> one sec ill screen shot it 14:26:09 * Terkhen just uses whatever name office uses for the font 14:26:44 <V453000> peter1138: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/20419525/tl5wrong.png 14:27:31 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... internet is acting up today... constantly getting dns errors 14:28:28 <Eddi|zuHause> V453000: solution, put the invisible engine in front 14:29:10 <V453000> interesting, works 14:29:23 <peter1138> i guess the problem is the concept of a wagon being on *a* tile 14:29:32 <peter1138> when clearly they are often on two tiles 14:30:06 <peter1138> thus you can enter and leave tiles independently... 14:30:39 <supermop> ok I added another picture: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=56877&p=973898#p973898 14:32:30 *** Devroush|2 [~dennis@ip-83-134-175-22.dsl.scarlet.be] has joined #openttd 14:32:33 *** Devroush|2 [~dennis@ip-83-134-175-22.dsl.scarlet.be] has quit [] 14:32:36 *** Devroush|2 [~dennis@ip-83-134-175-22.dsl.scarlet.be] has joined #openttd 14:32:40 *** Devroush|2 [~dennis@ip-83-134-175-22.dsl.scarlet.be] has quit [] 14:35:21 <peter1138> _vehicle_initial_*_fract and _initial_tile_subcoord are scary 14:40:43 <frosch123> V453000: peter1138: fs#3569 14:40:58 <peter1138> peter1138, yes, we know 14:41:19 <frosch123> whenever the last vehicle is <= 4/8 it fails 14:41:42 <peter1138> and to fix it requires messing about with sprite offsets or some such 14:41:53 <frosch123> ironically newgrf specs say that for ttdp short wagons only work at the end of a train, while it is the other way around for ottd :p 14:42:05 <Eddi|zuHause> "fixing" this must be relayed to the GRFs 14:42:07 <peter1138> probably the same issue in ttdp 14:42:13 <frosch123> (mind that short wagons do not work for ttdp at the end as well for the same reason) 14:42:22 <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause, every single newgrf that uses shorter wagons? 14:42:45 <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: i mean like a special flag similar to 32px vehicles 14:43:03 <peter1138> oh. possible. 14:43:06 <Eddi|zuHause> any grf not setting this flag has the old behaviour 14:43:24 <V453000> well, my newgrf is going to have only 0.5 tile wagons for a reason :P 14:43:31 <supermop> Terkhen, that suppressed the error for Transport, but not for Minion 14:43:54 <supermop> and in game the medium font still does not look like transport 14:44:07 <Terkhen> minion is truetype? 14:44:23 *** erik1984 [~erik1984@vhe-490300.sshn.net] has quit [Quit: Doei!] 14:44:27 <supermop> minion is otf 14:44:30 <supermop> i think 14:44:37 <supermop> transport is ttf 14:44:55 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: ottd should put the vehicle on the tile which is in the middle of the shortened vehicle, not of a 8/8 vehicle 14:45:00 <frosch123> no need for a flag in a newgrf 14:45:05 <norbert79> supermop: OTF might not be supported by OpenTTD. it's a different format 14:45:08 <frosch123> only for a complicated savegame conversion 14:45:17 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: but that changes the values for var45 etc 14:45:19 <supermop> ok 14:45:32 <supermop> that's a shame but understadable 14:45:33 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: you mean it fixes them? :p 14:45:49 <supermop> but i dont get why the transport still does not appear 14:46:00 <norbert79> supermop: Guess noone really came up with the need of supporting OTF 14:47:06 <supermop> ah, about 90% of my fonts are otf, never thought about it until now 14:47:07 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: and how do you intend to handle sprite offsets? 14:47:28 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: they'd depend on travel direction 14:47:35 <frosch123> yes 14:47:56 <frosch123> the bounding box also depends on travel direction 14:48:05 <frosch123> just add two more values to the table 14:48:08 <supermop> ok I just tried the same thing with a true type font 'commercial script' copying the name out of MS Word, and still get that 0x1 error 14:48:16 <Eddi|zuHause> but the anchor point is always the back (hidden) corner of the bounding box 14:48:22 *** Br33z4hSlut5 [~static.kp@92.68.154.34] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:48:36 <frosch123> no 14:48:40 <frosch123> not for vehicles 14:48:45 <Eddi|zuHause> so if the vehicle drives towards you, and you shorten the bounding box, you need to offset the anchor point, where you didn't before 14:49:21 <supermop> likewise with Bank Gothic 14:49:28 <frosch123> Vehicle::x_offs any ::y_offs are already orientation specific 14:50:49 <Terkhen> supermop: Arial works? 14:52:09 <supermop> lets see 14:52:37 <Terkhen> did you download the 9x binary/installer? 14:52:39 <peter1138> norbert79, openttd doesn't support fonts, treetype does 14:52:52 <peter1138> if freetype doesn't support otf... well 14:53:16 <supermop> arial gives no errors, and looks like arial 14:53:18 <supermop> but 14:53:30 <supermop> I dont want arial in my game.... 14:53:34 <norbert79> peter1138: That arises a question since Freetype does support it 14:54:08 <peter1138> (heh, treetype :S) 14:55:35 <Terkhen> supermop: then I'm guessing that freetype does not support those fonts, but I don't know why 14:56:08 * Terkhen never had those problems with the fonts that are included with windows, office or linux 14:56:24 <supermop> bank gothic is included with office 14:57:00 <Terkhen> not with mine 14:58:40 <supermop> i am sure i used it to write essays in highschool (before i had any adobe fonts etc) 15:00:04 <Terkhen> it's not included in windows 7 / office 2007, that's all I know :) 15:00:32 <Terkhen> what about writing "Bank Gothic" instead of Bank Gothic at openttd.cfg? 15:01:34 <supermop> no luck 15:01:59 <supermop> it seems like if any .ttf fonts are supported, all of them should be... 15:02:56 <supermop> just tried "Transport Heavy" 15:03:05 <supermop> no errors, but it renders as Arial 15:03:14 <peter1138> Tahoma? 15:04:10 <supermop> tahoma works 15:04:26 <supermop> looks roughly more like tahoma than arial 15:07:08 <supermop> although personally, 15:07:28 <supermop> my goal isnt to have some random humanist san serif font 15:07:56 <supermop> so i'd rather use the default sprite font than arial or tahoma 15:08:48 <supermop> transport is a really good readable bold, so i thought it would work well at ttd scales 15:12:41 *** hanf [~Klaus@host-2-96-23-64.as13285.net] has joined #openttd 15:15:09 <supermop> That said, I am going to give up on the fonts, get some lunch, then finish this grf now that the first half is working 15:16:23 <peter1138> heh, it was a suggestion to see if other fonts would work, not a suggestion as to what to use :p 15:17:04 <supermop> i cant figure out why transport does not work though, as it is also ttf 15:17:17 <peter1138> where can i get it? 15:17:41 <peter1138> oh, found it 15:17:48 <peter1138> might not be the same one mind you 15:19:12 <supermop> there used to be a free version linked from its wikipedia page but i dont see it anymore 15:19:33 <supermop> the designer has also released a ver expensve new version 15:21:25 <peter1138> doesn't work for me either 15:21:37 <peter1138> no error given 15:22:17 <peter1138> i get an italic courier as a substitute. lovely. 15:23:03 <peter1138> must be something in the way we open it, cos it works elsewhere 15:23:09 <peter1138> (i assume gnome is using freetype...) 15:24:34 <peter1138> incidentally it puts characters in wrong places 15:25:00 <peter1138> { and } are replaced with 1/3 and 2/3 fractions 15:26:18 <peter1138> dbg: [freetype] Font "/usr/share/fonts/X11/75dpi/courO12.pcf.gz" misses no glyphs 15:26:21 <peter1138> yeah 15:26:25 <peter1138> why? :S 15:36:28 <supermop> hmmmm 15:36:53 <supermop> i know the fractions glyphs are for miles on highway signs 15:42:31 <peter1138> yes 15:42:36 <peter1138> right, i disabled fontconfig 15:42:37 <peter1138> and it works 15:42:49 <peter1138> (and complains that some glyphs are missing) 15:43:24 *** norbert79 [~Norbi@deibp9eh1--blueice2n2.emea.ibm.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving for now. Bye everyone!] 15:43:43 <peter1138> looks pretty bad too 15:44:10 <supermop> hmm? 15:44:15 <supermop> what is fontconfig? 15:44:17 <peter1138> bad aliasing 15:44:27 <peter1138> i dunno if it's used on windows 15:44:42 <peter1138> it's used on *nix as a database of fonts 15:45:05 <peter1138> gah, antialiased fonts are terrible, why did i write that? :S 15:45:19 <supermop> ha 15:45:30 <peter1138> (i know why) 15:45:51 <peter1138> it needs to be a 2-stage process if there are shadows 15:46:09 <peter1138> maybe i should write that... 15:46:31 <peter1138> there's no % symbol :( 15:50:26 <supermop> oh well 15:50:38 <supermop> maybe it was never cut out for this anyway 15:56:02 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@nsc.ciup.fr] has joined #openttd 15:56:59 <supermop> also cannot get this replica of the BR Rail Alphabet to work: 15:57:15 <supermop> http://www.railwaysarchive.co.uk/temp/ 15:58:14 <peter1138> brface3? 15:58:20 <peter1138> or...hmm 15:58:38 <supermop> nah, the one further down 15:59:31 <peter1138> terrible too 15:59:53 <supermop> haha 16:00:10 <supermop> these are amateur efforts 16:00:11 <peter1138> even less correct glyphs 16:00:36 <supermop> well its only meant to contain glyphs used on british signs 16:00:59 <peter1138> yes i know 16:02:12 *** Mucht [~Martin@chello084115143107.3.graz.surfer.at] has joined #openttd 16:03:25 *** enr1x [~kiike@62.57.225.29.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #openttd 16:05:07 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 16:10:29 <supermop> i dont know what to name this station tile 16:11:03 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-88-242.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 16:11:47 <frosch123> "Station tile #1" 16:11:47 <planetmaker> I'd call the tile from your last link 'telescope tile' ;-) 16:12:03 <supermop> haha 16:12:29 <supermop> i have no idea why that guy has fonts and random telescopes together 16:12:39 <planetmaker> light bucket? 16:12:41 <frosch123> though, if you want to make it more interesting, you should call it "Station tile #2" 16:12:52 <planetmaker> haha :-) 16:13:14 <supermop> ill put something up in a few minutes 16:20:24 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@027af076.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 16:22:58 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-057-084.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:24:29 *** pugi [~pugi@dyndsl-091-096-036-031.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 16:28:15 *** olasd [~olasd@cartan.nicolasd.info] has left #openttd [] 16:37:13 *** Hyronymus [~chatzilla@s53757898.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 16:52:35 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:8900:54f1:0:9ddd] has joined #openttd 16:52:38 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 16:59:18 <supermop> hmm grfcodec doesnt recognized dos palette? 17:00:37 *** Adambean [AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has joined #openttd 17:01:40 <Eddi|zuHause> depends what you are trying to do 17:02:51 <supermop> i set all these pcx files to the dos palette in photoshop, but it complains when encoding them 17:04:23 <planetmaker> then the error most likely is not in grfcodec 17:04:33 <supermop> il just change them all to win 17:05:07 <Eddi|zuHause> more likely your photoshop palette was wrong 17:05:14 <Terkhen> ^ 17:05:25 <Eddi|zuHause> grfcodec handles dos palettes just fine for everybody else 17:05:45 <supermop> i downloaded it from a link that planetmaker posted 17:06:06 <supermop> on devzone i thinl 17:06:08 <supermop> think 17:06:52 <supermop> anyway, be right back, I have to finally get lunch 17:07:42 <planetmaker> supermop: I've no idea whether that palette works or not - I personally can't test photoshop, but have to trust people who supply the palette info for it 17:08:06 <planetmaker> but it's most likely from either foobar or michi_cc - both of whom I'd assume to know what they do 17:08:21 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 17:08:34 <supermop> ok cool 17:08:57 <supermop> i think i should stick with win anyway, as that was what i used in previous releases 17:09:21 <planetmaker> changing it for an existing NewGRF mostly is pointless... 17:09:31 <supermop> anyway, thanks for everyone's help this morning 17:09:46 <supermop> i will be back later 17:14:19 *** Ryo [~rrgreen12@host86-141-188-92.range86-141.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 17:15:00 *** Ryo [~rrgreen12@host86-141-188-92.range86-141.btcentralplus.com] has left #openttd [] 17:15:05 *** Ryo [~rrgreen12@host86-141-188-92.range86-141.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 17:15:13 *** Ryo [~rrgreen12@host86-141-188-92.range86-141.btcentralplus.com] has left #openttd [] 17:16:41 *** Ryo [~rrgreen12@host86-141-188-92.range86-141.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 17:16:56 *** Ryo [~rrgreen12@host86-141-188-92.range86-141.btcentralplus.com] has left #openttd [] 17:19:56 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: frosch * r22975 /trunk/src/ (engine.cpp saveload/group_sl.cpp): -Codechange: Do not store Group::num_vehicle in the savegame, but compute it like num_engines on load. 17:20:28 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: frosch * r22976 /trunk/src/ (engine.cpp group.h group_cmd.cpp group_gui.cpp vehicle.cpp): -Codechange: Split group statistics into separate struct. 17:20:35 *** Ryo [~rrgreen12@host86-141-188-92.range86-141.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 17:20:39 *** Ryo [~rrgreen12@host86-141-188-92.range86-141.btcentralplus.com] has left #openttd [] 17:20:57 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: frosch * r22977 /trunk/src/ (5 files in 2 dirs): -Codechange: Rename SetCachedEngineCounts() to GroupStatistics::UpdateAfterLoad(). 17:21:42 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: frosch * r22978 /trunk/src/ (group.h group_cmd.cpp train_cmd.cpp vehicle.cpp): -Codechange: Replace IncreaseGroupNumVehicle() and DecreaseGroupNumVehicle() with GroupStatistics::CountVehicle(). 17:22:13 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: frosch * r22979 /trunk/src/ (group.h group_cmd.cpp vehicle.cpp): -Codechange: Add GroupStatistics::CountEngine(). 17:22:49 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip3.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 17:22:57 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: frosch * r22980 /trunk/src/ (6 files): -Add: GroupStatistics for DEFAULT_GROUP. 17:23:42 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: frosch * r22981 /trunk/src/ (9 files in 2 dirs): -Add: GroupStatistics for the ALL_GROUP. 17:24:32 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: frosch * r22982 /trunk/src/ (company_cmd.cpp company_gui.cpp vehicle.cpp vehicle_func.h): -Cleanup: Remove CountCompanyVehicles() and use ALL_GROUP statistics instead. 17:25:06 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: frosch * r22983 /trunk/src/group_gui.cpp: -Feature: Display the number of vehicles in the group GUI also for the ALL and DEFAULT groups. 17:25:45 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: frosch * r22984 /trunk/src/ (7 files): -Feature: Display profit icons for groups in the group GUI. 17:26:39 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: frosch * r22985 /trunk/src/ (8 files in 2 dirs): -Feature: Display autoreplace status in group GUI. 17:27:57 <Eddi|zuHause> while you're there: for the "ungrouped" group in the "manage list" dropdown an entry "split into shared order groups" 17:30:06 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: frosch * r22986 /trunk/ (6 files in 2 dirs): -Add (r22985): More icons for the vehicle list. 17:31:22 <Eddi|zuHause> foreach(vehicle) { group = find_shared_vehicle_with_group(vehicle); if (group == default_group) { group = create_new_group(); } add_to_group(group, vehicle); } 17:38:36 *** DDR [~DDR@142.179.78.88] has joined #openttd 17:39:08 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host64-51-dynamic.15-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 17:39:58 <Wolf01> evenink 17:43:10 <Terkhen> hi Wolf01 17:45:17 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: translators * r22987 /trunk/src/lang/ (latvian.txt welsh.txt): 17:45:17 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 17:45:17 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: latvian - 54 changes by Parastais 17:45:17 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: welsh - 122 changes by kazzie 17:48:47 *** KenjiE20 [~Kenji@host-92-9-224-33.as43234.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:53:23 *** KenjiE20 [~Kenji@host-92-9-224-33.as43234.net] has joined #openttd 17:57:01 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1B0CE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 17:57:18 *** DDR [~DDR@142.179.78.88] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:01:15 <michi_cc> planetmaker: I think andy reported that Photoshop somehow saves the palette of PCX files reversed of PNG files. I've extracted the palettes out of PNGs, so which is why it likely fails. 18:02:08 <planetmaker> ah, thanks 18:02:22 <planetmaker> sounds like a "useful" feature, though :S 18:02:43 <Terkhen> :D 18:07:18 <michi_cc> No idea if there even is a formal specification of PCX, but it likely only contains "here by 256 palette entries" anyway :) And storing stuff reverse isn't uncommon, just look at BMP files. 18:07:30 <michi_cc> s/by/be/ 18:13:42 *** Lakie [~Lakie@host81-141-101-8.wlms-broadband.com] has joined #openttd 18:15:25 <Eddi|zuHause> so which one to do next: additional vehicle text, vehicle graphics variation or vehicle sprite slicing 18:16:14 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@88.130.165.227] has joined #openttd 18:16:18 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc15-aztw25-2-0-cust3.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 18:19:43 <andythenorth> hello 18:19:58 <Terkhen> hi andythenorth 18:20:12 <Belugas> andythenorth! 18:22:37 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@88.130.191.104] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:23:35 *** JVassie [~James@2.27.105.86] has joined #openttd 18:23:38 <andythenorth> hola 18:23:40 <andythenorth> did I miss much? 18:23:47 <andythenorth> it seems quiet here apart from the arguments 18:24:03 <Terkhen> a shiny new feature 18:24:06 <andythenorth> :o 18:24:32 <andythenorth> road corners on steep slopes? 18:24:41 <andythenorth> climate aware canal stuff? 18:24:58 <V453000> :d 18:25:18 <Belugas> newmaparray 18:25:40 <Wolf01> bah, the newmaparray is like herobrine in minecraft 18:25:44 <planetmaker> hahaha :-) 18:25:54 <planetmaker> Believe the internet, read, the "Transport Tycoon" section: http://rct.wikia.com/wiki/Other_Chris_Sawyer_Games 18:25:57 <planetmaker> It's open source! 18:26:11 <Terkhen> andythenorth: full reimplementation of openttd in 3D 18:26:32 <planetmaker> andythenorth: climate-aware canals are > 2 years old ;-) 18:27:22 <Terkhen> no, they are only from yesterday 18:27:54 <planetmaker> uhm... no? 18:28:05 <planetmaker> Only for the TTD base set they're new 18:28:42 <Terkhen> oh :P 18:28:52 * Terkhen never notices that stuff anyways :P 18:29:12 <frosch123> snow-aware buoys are still missing 18:29:20 <frosch123> though i have not seen buoys covered in snow :p 18:29:26 <planetmaker> yes... I don't find the buoy sprite :-) 18:29:54 <Terkhen> neither did I... maybe some ice chunks? :P 18:30:14 <planetmaker> yes, sounds good 18:37:44 <andythenorth> I noticed we're remaking it in 3D 18:37:52 <andythenorth> I believe there are two people forking for it? :P 18:37:57 <andythenorth> should be done in double the time 18:38:09 <Terkhen> ;) 18:40:54 <frosch123> true, for 32bpp doubling the number of people involved might indeed double the time needed 18:41:17 <andythenorth> it's probably near-geometric actually 18:41:27 <andythenorth> adding four people probably increases the time by 12-16 times 18:41:38 <andythenorth> due to communication ineffciency :P 18:47:07 <andythenorth> is there any sane way to measure 'progress' for ottd development? 18:47:19 <andythenorth> is it even a valid concept? 18:47:42 <Rubidium> progress requires goals, doesn't it? 18:47:52 <planetmaker> maybe https://www.ohloh.net/p/openttd 18:48:19 <V453000> we exchanged rivers for reversing engines :P 18:49:06 <andythenorth> what happened to bump up so much code in 2009? 18:49:30 <frosch123> noai 18:49:32 <planetmaker> noai probably. or yapf. or both :-) 18:49:48 <frosch123> yapf is like 2006/2007 18:50:14 <planetmaker> ah, I meant the path signals 18:50:14 <frosch123> yapp is 2008 18:50:27 <frosch123> merged on 2008-08-03 18:50:31 <frosch123> easy to remember for me :p 18:50:38 <planetmaker> boah, that long ago? 18:50:44 <frosch123> (birthday present) 18:50:44 <planetmaker> hm... significant date for you? 18:50:47 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-83-134-175-22.dsl.scarlet.be] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:50:47 <planetmaker> he :-) 18:51:51 <andythenorth> progress is fewer open bugs? more users? more loc? more features? less features? fewer users? less loc? 18:51:59 <andythenorth> (less / fewer / s) 18:52:36 <frosch123> andythenorth: number of open fs bug tickets is no good measurement. there are too few of them 18:52:39 <Eddi|zuHause> there is no canonic way to measure progress. only activity 18:52:49 <frosch123> it is between 10 and 30 for years 18:53:10 <andythenorth> activity is measurable how? commits? irc discussions? forum threads? downloads? 18:53:21 <frosch123> though maybe we were at 6 when releasing 0.6.3 or so 18:53:26 * andythenorth has no reason other than curiosity to ask this 18:53:46 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: typically number of commits, or number of changed lines, or similar 18:53:51 *** SirSquidness [~sirsquidn@zomg.dongues.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:54:10 *** SirSquidness [~sirsquidn@zomg.dongues.com] has joined #openttd 18:54:14 <Terkhen> andythenorth: I don't understand your obsession with progress :P 18:54:28 <andythenorth> it's an obsession with whether it is a valid question ;) 18:55:00 <frosch123> i guess number of active developers (with commits in past 6 months) is most interesting 18:55:05 *** Kogut [d586afe1@ircip4.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 18:55:11 <andythenorth> one day we might find ourselves asking 'is ottd dying' questions (like ttdpatch and many other projects ) 18:55:30 <andythenorth> but they might be the wrong kind of question 18:55:36 <frosch123> ok, with that measurement it is dieing :) 18:55:47 <planetmaker> he 18:56:23 <frosch123> since r20000 or so :p 18:56:33 <planetmaker> :-P 18:56:38 <Eddi|zuHause> depending on who you ask, openttd has been dying for years 18:56:44 <frosch123> somewhen last year the number of commits per month dropped from 250 to 100 18:56:56 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause I believe there's a relevant quote about that :P 18:57:06 <planetmaker> I wonder why :-) 18:57:10 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: someone said, if ttdp dies, ottd dies as well :p 18:57:22 <andythenorth> does ottd also pay taxes? :P 18:57:49 <andythenorth> this balloon track is somewhat ttd-like: http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=376808&nseq=8 18:57:55 <planetmaker> it has no expenses, andythenorth ;-) 18:58:09 <frosch123> andythenorth: only sales tax 18:58:11 <andythenorth> planetmaker: there are only two certainties in life... :) 18:58:20 <planetmaker> what's the other? 18:58:31 <frosch123> for other stuff it would need to be registered somewhere :p 18:59:07 <andythenorth> third quote here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_misquotations#Arts_and_entertainment 19:01:52 <planetmaker> ah, right 19:01:53 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.237] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:02:09 *** bluebluess [5b7f38a0@ircip3.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 19:03:00 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.237] has joined #openttd 19:03:03 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ 19:03:18 <supermop> hello! 19:04:23 <bluebluess> hi 19:05:00 <andythenorth> also, in the immortal words of lisa loeb :P 19:05:09 <andythenorth> "they've been dying since the day they were born" 19:05:16 <andythenorth> which is highly philosophical :P 19:05:24 <planetmaker> hehe 19:05:29 <andythenorth> so is ottd dying? Or is that a tiresome question? 19:05:35 <frosch123> [20:57] <planetmaker> I wonder why :-) <- today the majority of devs are not students 19:06:18 <planetmaker> yes... 19:06:42 <frosch123> andythenorth: usually the goal of an open source project should be: it dies if noone cares about it dieing 19:07:00 <andythenorth> thereby achieving its destiny.... 19:07:03 <andythenorth> as all code dies 19:07:25 <andythenorth> so the 'perfect' open source project is a dead one? 19:07:32 <andythenorth> as in 'complete' 19:07:46 <planetmaker> a game from fossils for fossils? 19:07:50 <andythenorth> complete = perfect = dead 19:08:50 <frosch123> planetmaker: oh, and the development is more spreading now 19:09:02 <planetmaker> spreadingà 19:09:04 <frosch123> there is not only the ottd project, but also nml and opengfx 19:09:04 <planetmaker> ? 19:09:11 <andythenorth> and noai 19:09:14 <frosch123> and other grf projects 19:09:26 <andythenorth> and soon! 3D! 19:09:27 <planetmaker> that's probably one of the main reasons 19:09:30 <andythenorth> and a gui made in squirrel 19:09:39 <andythenorth> and other ideas that suck 19:10:27 <planetmaker> sometimes I wonder whether things wouldn't become easier to setup if we bundled graphics with OpenTTD 19:10:32 <frosch123> andythenorth: well, none of the usual ottd devs has a noai project; resp. i guess admiralai has a marginal impact 19:10:45 <andythenorth> we don't bundle opengfx? 19:10:50 <Kogut> @noai - is it possible to add small thing to waypoints? ( http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=973719#p973719 ) 19:10:52 <andythenorth> :o 19:11:00 <planetmaker> it's not part of the main openttd package 19:11:14 <V453000> andythenorth: dont you make fun of it, the 3D will bring a whole new wave of people! :D 19:11:14 <frosch123> however, ottd is growing which makes it harder for new guys getting involved 19:11:17 <andythenorth> bad out of the box experience 19:11:21 <planetmaker> the installer may install it, but not automatically 19:11:22 <planetmaker> yes 19:11:36 <andythenorth> basically, 'batteries not included' :P 19:11:40 <planetmaker> kinda 19:12:09 <Rubidium> planetmaker: the installer installs it automatically (it's enabled by default the first time) 19:12:18 <andythenorth> we should just buy atari, and ship the original graphics 19:12:25 <andythenorth> if we all bought one share at a time, slowly... 19:12:27 <peter1138> DO IT 19:14:15 <Kogut> @andythenorth it was suggested and rejected ( http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=49435 ) 19:14:27 *** Hyronymus is now known as Guest12413 19:14:31 *** Hyronymus [~chatzilla@s53757898.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 19:14:50 <planetmaker> http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/GlobalVariables <-- where do we actually return var 0x8D / 0D? 19:15:19 <Rubidium> planetmaker: we should be 19:15:23 <frosch123> somewhere in newgrf.cpp 19:15:59 <frosch123> GetGlobalVariable 19:16:10 <Rubidium> 5461 19:16:10 <frosch123> *value = _cur.grfconfig->palette & GRFP_USE_MASK; 19:16:40 <frosch123> i.e. the palette which is selected for the grf 19:17:27 <planetmaker> ah... 0D... I grep'ed for 8D 19:19:40 <frosch123> ah, answering mb? 19:20:00 *** Guest12413 [~chatzilla@s53757898.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:20:05 <frosch123> ottd also converts recolour sprites according to the palette setting 19:20:17 <frosch123> so, it really does not matter what the grf does. ottd does it right 19:20:33 <frosch123> (if a14 is right :p ) 19:22:20 <Rubidium> just say it returns the palette of the action 14 19:23:34 <planetmaker> hehe... live broadcasting is about 2...3 seconds lag - judging from a comparison of the noise from the nearby stadium and the life stream of the match ;-) 19:23:55 <Rubidium> planetmaker: nice, ain't it 19:24:01 *** Hyronymus is now known as Guest12416 19:24:01 <frosch123> quite few delay 19:24:03 <Rubidium> enough time to turn on the TV to see the goal 19:24:05 *** Hyronymus [~chatzilla@s53757898.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 19:24:07 <frosch123> i guess tv is more 19:24:24 <planetmaker> Not sure that TV is more... 19:24:49 <planetmaker> I'd not assume it's an officially sanctioned stream ;-) 19:25:57 *** Guest12416 [~chatzilla@s53757898.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:27:59 <supermop> they might have a delay so that they can cut out in case something they cannot show happens 19:28:39 <planetmaker> supermop: we're in Europe... 19:28:46 <planetmaker> not in the US ;-) 19:28:49 <frosch123> supermop: we are in eu ... what pm said :p 19:29:53 *** Kurimus [~stabbity@dsl-tkubrasgw3-fe93dd00-34.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [] 19:31:04 <supermop> i imagine there are still penty of things that a european network would rather not show on live tv 19:31:07 *** bluebluess [5b7f38a0@ircip3.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 19:31:19 <planetmaker> like? 19:31:26 <frosch123> murder 19:31:38 *** Wolfsherz [~Wolfsherz@p57A6DB59.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 19:31:43 <Rubidium> 'allo 'allo in Germany (but that ain't live)? 19:32:11 <michi_cc> One main reason for live TV deals is still the way to a satellite and back. While the use of cable transmission is increasing, remote TV trucks are still mainly satellite. 19:32:36 <supermop> well its not illegal in the us if someone does something offensive on live tv, but most networks would cut it out anyway to prevent the bad publicity 19:32:54 <planetmaker> yes... and probably "Sky" goes via satellite. And then via <wherever> to a Russian server and back to this town ;-) 19:33:05 <Eddi|zuHause> i once had a local radio station simultaneously in FM and satellite, you notice a significant delay 19:33:26 <planetmaker> yes... Also national radio is always a second or two behind FM 19:33:30 <Prof_Frink> You notice a delay between FM and DAB, never mind satellite. 19:33:49 <planetmaker> (compared with their stream) 19:34:18 <Eddi|zuHause> did DAB2 actually take off better than the last try? 19:34:58 <Prof_Frink> DAB is great. 19:35:04 <Prof_Frink> Much better quality than... 19:35:09 * peter1138 still has no DAB kit 19:35:15 <peter1138> better than AM? 19:35:16 <Prof_Frink> R4 Longwave for listening to tms. 19:35:42 <peter1138> alway remember listening to R4 LW on the way down through france 19:36:11 <michi_cc> planetmaker: The satellite portion is mostly the remote truck to base station part, base station to broadcast station respectively cable TV head is increasingly becoming cable based. 19:36:13 <Eddi|zuHause> what's R4? 19:36:22 <Prof_Frink> BBC Radio 4! 19:36:23 <peter1138> BBC Radio 4 19:36:40 <peter1138> the one with the archers on 19:37:05 <Eddi|zuHause> michi_cc: i'd have thought base station to broadcast station is likely "Richtfunk" 19:37:12 <Prof_Frink> And other things you may have heard of. Like HHGTTG. 19:38:11 <planetmaker> Unless they uplink from the stadion to the satellite directly 19:38:18 <michi_cc> Eddi|zuHause: It was, but for example with cable TV ARD/ZDF switched all remaining radio/satellite links to cable transmission concurrently with HDTV. 19:38:25 <peter1138> mind you there was always 1053/1089 on MW, back in the day... 19:39:04 <peter1138> music on MW isn' very nice thuogh 19:39:43 *** lugo [bnc4free@209.141.56.5] has quit [Quit: over and out] 19:40:03 <michi_cc> Not sure if all DVB-T emitters are wired, but I'd guess during the analog/digital switch the did that as well. 19:41:21 <Eddi|zuHause> http://www.merian.de/fotostrecke/fotostrecke-73436-6.html <- we should have that in openttd 19:42:41 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-28-87-17.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 19:43:02 <frosch123> why does the tram need to drive slow? 19:43:09 <frosch123> do the houses move from time to time? 19:43:49 <planetmaker> :-) 19:43:56 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe the tram moves more left/right at higher speed. or it needs to wait for people to move away 19:47:18 *** hanf [~Klaus@host-2-96-23-64.as13285.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:49:29 *** Der_Herr [~Bubbel@p4FF0C982.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 19:50:30 <Der_Herr> Hi, is there a console command that allows to generate a map from a heightmap? 19:53:51 <Rubidium> no(t yet) 19:54:20 <Der_Herr> which means, there will be one soon or more far in future? ^^ 19:54:31 *** Wolfsherz [~Wolfsherz@p57A6DB59.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 19:57:32 *** LordAro [d92b6cbd@ircip3.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 19:57:42 *** LordAro [d92b6cbd@ircip3.mibbit.com] has quit [] 19:58:29 <planetmaker> that highly depends on *someone* writing a patch. 19:59:23 <Rubidium> XeryusTC: in what way is not being able to look at a pro game a limitation by OpenTTD? Why can't you just remove the password from the server, set one on the company and reduce the allowed number of companies to 1? After all, a bot can also change the password of a company 20:00:00 <supermop> alright 20:00:09 <XeryusTC> Rubidium: for how long has the server been able to change the password of a company? 20:00:21 <supermop> should i bump the version number of my grf to 1.0.0? 20:00:26 <planetmaker> XeryusTC: > 1 year 20:00:38 <planetmaker> it's rather a limitation of ap+ 20:00:44 <planetmaker> (if it can't do that) 20:01:08 <supermop> i've rewritten it from scratch, and it uses different tiles now 20:01:17 <XeryusTC> ah, i stand corrected then :) 20:01:25 <Terkhen> supermop: do you use any features that are only available from 1.0.0 upwards? 20:02:02 <XeryusTC> i wonder why you have never notified us in .pro or our private universe about it so that it could actually be fixed so we can have people spectate ;) 20:02:15 <planetmaker> supermop: you do that when you think that the NewGRF is about feature-complete ;-) 20:02:39 <planetmaker> XeryusTC: it is known and iirc it was used for some time 20:02:46 <planetmaker> I don't know why it was not used anymore 20:02:53 <planetmaker> probably no-one adjusting apÃŒ+ 20:03:00 <Rubidium> XeryusTC: because I know of you having this problem for only about 5 minutes 20:03:08 <supermop> i think so 20:03:29 <XeryusTC> we had a static company password for a while i think, but that got changed for some unspecified reason even though it was actually a working system 20:03:45 <XeryusTC> Rubidium: that question was directed at planetmaker ;) 20:04:25 <Rubidium> also, dihedral has been pretty aware of the patch that introduced the feature 20:04:25 <planetmaker> XeryusTC: yes, I don't know (anymore) either why it was changed ;-) 20:04:31 <planetmaker> hehe 20:04:41 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590fed07.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:05:18 <XeryusTC> also, in the most optimistic case it would only be changing the command in the the config of ap+, worst case it should only be a few lines i'd recon :o 20:05:23 <planetmaker> XeryusTC: and I assumed that to be common knowledge among those who administer the servers 20:05:33 <planetmaker> XeryusTC: then... go ahead 20:06:17 <planetmaker> (the usual answer, I know...) :-) 20:06:44 <XeryusTC> you do know how good i am at breaking things right? :P 20:06:56 <planetmaker> yes :-P 20:07:04 <planetmaker> but so am I. 20:07:10 <planetmaker> Or anyone who touches code 20:07:13 <planetmaker> ;-) 20:08:48 <XeryusTC> true 20:17:23 <Kogut> Stupid question - I see in code mysterious GB ( StationID station_to_join = GB(p2, 16, 16); ) 20:17:23 <Kogut> What is it? 20:18:14 <planetmaker> get_bits 20:18:34 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: that's why, whenever someone asks me what i am doing, i am saying: "i break everything" 20:18:36 <planetmaker> in that case 16 bits starting from bit 16 from variable p2 20:19:00 <planetmaker> (read backwards) 20:19:02 *** DOUK [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-88-242.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 20:19:37 <Terkhen> Kogut: src/core/bitmath_func.hpp IIRC 20:19:40 <planetmaker> it's a macro function defined... ^ 20:19:54 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-83-134-175-22.dsl.scarlet.be] has joined #openttd 20:20:09 <Eddi|zuHause> i thought it's a template function nowadays 20:20:14 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:21:58 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: rubidium * r22988 /trunk/src/ai/api/ (ai_changelog.hpp ai_vehicle.hpp ai_vehicle.hpp.sq): -Fix: don't return ERR_UNKNOWN when the vehicle would become too long 20:24:07 <Kogut> oh, my bug 20:24:19 <Rubidium> no, not your bug 20:24:32 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-88-242.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:24:35 <Kogut> @planetmaker, Terkhen - thanks 20:24:37 <Rubidium> only related 20:25:25 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm not entirely sure how to do length-refitting yet... 20:25:37 <Eddi|zuHause> in a generic enough fashion 20:26:16 <Kogut> I see 20:26:18 <Rubidium> Kogut: as the failed preconditions are caused by the code 20:27:38 *** TWerkhoven[l] [~turbulent@cpc14-linl7-2-0-cust28.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 20:28:11 <Kogut> OpenTTDDevBlackBook/NoAI/Adding a squirrel function - "To make Squirrel aware of the new function, generate a new Squirrel interface file with squirrel_export.sh. Call that script from within the src/ai/api directory. " - is it required only for new functions? 20:29:09 <Rubidium> for any API change 20:34:12 <Kogut> "To make Squirrel aware of the changes, generate a new Squirrel interface file with squirrel_export.sh. Call that script from within the src/ai/api directory. " - is it possible to do it under Windows? According to wikipedia I need Thompson shell to run it. 20:34:37 <Rubidium> get msys/mingw 20:34:46 <Rubidium> or cygwin 20:38:46 *** FHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 20:41:31 *** lugo [bnc4free@209.141.56.5] has joined #openttd 20:41:36 <Elukka> hmm... 20:41:45 <Elukka> driver san fransisco has been distracting me from spritin' 20:52:44 <Kogut> @Rubidium - so now I should move folder with openttd src inside mingw folder? 20:53:34 <Rubidium> Kogut: no, you can just start the shell from mingw and "browse" to the right directory 20:54:12 *** Neon [~Neon@dslb-178-004-186-157.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Python is way too complicated... I prefer doing it quickly in C.] 20:55:48 <Wolf01> 'night 20:55:52 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host64-51-dynamic.15-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 20:55:56 <Kogut> @Rubidium I am unable to go higher than C:\Users\Kogut\MinGW 20:56:07 <Rubidium> cd /c/ 20:57:09 <andythenorth> good night 20:57:12 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc15-aztw25-2-0-cust3.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has left #openttd [] 21:01:59 <Terkhen> Kogut: follow http://wiki.openttd.org/MinGW 21:02:11 <Terkhen> good night from here too 21:02:12 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-94-112-27-144.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:02:43 *** Hyronymus [~chatzilla@s53757898.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:11:15 *** perk11 [~perk11@188.255.47.217] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 21:13:47 <supermop> ok Grf is done! 21:16:24 <supermop> who wants to try it ut? 21:16:26 <supermop> out 21:18:18 <Kogut> grf? 21:20:23 *** Mucht [~Martin@chello084115143107.3.graz.surfer.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:20:52 <planetmaker> good night :-) 21:22:11 <Kogut> good night 21:24:07 <supermop> new version of my MLSS 21:24:14 <supermop> writing the forum post now 21:28:01 <__ln__> http://sylvainzimmer.com/2011/10/03/day-flash-died/ 21:31:41 *** xoxoxo [xoxoxo@cable-94-189-176-123.dynamic.sbb.rs] has joined #openttd 21:31:51 *** xoxoxo [xoxoxo@cable-94-189-176-123.dynamic.sbb.rs] has left #openttd [] 21:33:20 <supermop> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=48605&p=973967#p973967 21:35:21 <Kogut> argh 21:35:22 <Kogut> #include FT_ERRORS_H 21:35:33 <Kogut> 5>C:\openttd_folder_kompilacyjny\OpenTTD essentials\shared\include\freetype/freetype.h(34) : fatal error C1083: Cannot open include file: 'freetype/fterrors.h': No such file or directory 21:37:49 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@nsc.ciup.fr] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:39:45 *** Sacro [~ben@150.237.48.99] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:40:25 *** Sacro [~ben@150.237.48.99] has joined #openttd 21:43:13 <Elukka> well, this took me longer than it had any right to... 21:43:19 <Elukka> Eddi|zuHause: http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/2000/pr_guterwagen_5lu.png 21:45:04 <Eddi|zuHause> the | view looks like the roof is quite round, which the other views don't really reflect 21:45:32 <Eddi|zuHause> so make it rather look completely flat there 21:45:36 <Elukka> hmm i did the same thing there i did with the compartment coaches.. it's a bit round but not much 21:46:28 <Elukka> it looks kinda odd completely flat in that view, though it's an easy change 21:47:42 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe make that pixel some colour inbetween the brown and the grey 21:48:26 <Elukka> it'll still be equally round on the magic blue side 21:49:24 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip3.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 21:50:02 *** TWerkhoven[l] [~turbulent@cpc14-linl7-2-0-cust28.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:50:14 <Eddi|zuHause> it's less noticeable there, because the braker's cabin is not "merging" with the roof there 21:50:29 <Kogut> fun, fun, fun! I compiled OpenTTD (according to Visual C++) but there is no exe 21:50:48 <Eddi|zuHause> Kogut: have you looked in objs directory? 21:51:03 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip3.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 21:51:22 <Eddi|zuHause> Elukka: if in doubt about the length of a wagon, check the tracking table 21:51:50 <Eddi|zuHause> Elukka: and if you don't agree with the value given there, check back with me and we discuss a solution 21:51:52 <Kogut> I checked it with *.exe search 21:51:58 <Elukka> alright 21:54:44 *** FHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has left #openttd [] 21:55:08 <Elukka> well, it agrees with my length 21:56:07 <Eddi|zuHause> Elukka: also, might you be willing to draw another version with open doors? 21:56:34 <Elukka> sure, not sure how it should look though 21:56:38 <Elukka> i guess i'll go stare at dbset 21:57:27 <Eddi|zuHause> i need something visually changing to devise a scheme how to do loading stages and loaded stages 21:57:39 <Elukka> yeah 21:57:44 <Elukka> any idea which way the door's supposed to open? 21:57:47 <Elukka> http://www.brawa.de/typo3temp/pics/48228-gedecktergueterwagen-bremserhaus-kpev_bda841966d.jpg 21:57:57 <Elukka> oh towards the back i think 21:58:05 <Elukka> brakeman's cab i mean 21:58:12 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 21:58:31 <Elukka> hm and towards the other end on the other side 21:58:35 <Eddi|zuHause> question is if the other side opens to the same direction 21:58:46 <Eddi|zuHause> so always to the right 22:03:22 <Elukka> why am i getting the feeling oberhÃŒmer is going to say it's too textured :P 22:03:59 *** lugo [bnc4free@209.141.56.5] has quit [Quit: over and out] 22:06:18 *** TWerkhoven [~Turbulent@cpc14-linl7-2-0-cust28.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:07:53 *** Vadtec [~Vadtec@2001:470:1f06:13e0::1337] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:08:51 <Kogut> I compiled it again, now compiler decided to do sth with ai_foo.cpp files, and compiled this stupid .exe file. Now I have "no available language packs" 22:09:07 <Kogut> Great 22:09:19 <Eddi|zuHause> you need to compile the complete solution, not only one subproject 22:10:31 *** lugo [bnc4free@209.141.56.5] has joined #openttd 22:10:57 *** Vadtec [~Vadtec@2001:470:1f06:13e0::1337] has joined #openttd 22:11:16 <Kogut> 1>------ Build started: Project: version, Configuration: Debug Win32 ------ 2>------ Build started: Project: langs, Configuration: Debug Win32 ------ 1>Determining version number 2>Generating strings.h 1>Host skryptów systemu Windows firmy Microsoft (R) wersja 5.8 1>Copyright (C) Microsoft Corporation 1996-2001. Wszelkie prawa zastrzeÅŒone. 2>Build log was sav 22:11:39 <Kogut> "Build started: Project: langs, Configuration: Debug Win32" <-- 22:11:43 <Eddi|zuHause> that sounds right 22:12:50 <Kogut> maybe I should move generated exe? 22:13:05 <Prof_Frink> "Debug Win32"? Wouldn't that take a while? 22:13:49 *** KenjiE20 [~Kenji@host-92-9-224-33.as43234.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:14:20 *** Maarten [~dutchusa@99-73-209-18.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:15:04 <Kogut> langs folder is almost empty (except buildLog and tables subfolder)... 22:15:15 *** Vadtec [~Vadtec@2001:470:1f06:13e0::1337] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:18:01 <glx> <Prof_Frink> "Debug Win32"? Wouldn't that take a while? <-- no debug is way faster than release 22:18:55 <glx> Kogut: just press F5 once it is compiled 22:19:13 <MNIM> I think the guy is thinking the compiler debugs win32 itself, lol 22:19:45 <glx> else you need to move generated exe for objs\Win32\... to bin 22:20:53 *** DOUK [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-88-242.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:22:24 *** Der_Herr [~Bubbel@p4FF0C982.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:22:44 <Eddi|zuHause> i think the 5lu template could use some position adjustment 22:23:55 <Eddi|zuHause> Elukka: closed wagon graphics are now in 22:24:53 <Kogut> @glx - thanks 22:25:05 <Kogut> Nice rivers 22:25:43 <Kogut> but it is even more visible that government in is stupid as real government 22:25:52 <Kogut> in openttd* 22:28:03 *** Maarten [~dutchusa@99-73-209-18.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #openttd 22:30:02 <Elukka> eddi, that was fast 22:31:39 <Eddi|zuHause> Elukka: as long as it's only one image, it's actually really simple 22:31:58 <Eddi|zuHause> Elukka: just make an entry in the graphics column of the tracking table, and add the file 22:32:08 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1B0CE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:32:40 <Eddi|zuHause> the joy of meta-programming. only the very first instance is actually complicated, adding more later is really trivial (if done right) 22:33:49 <Kogut> well, I compiled openttd, but my change to noai api changed absolutely nothing :D 22:34:21 <Kogut> is http://wiki.openttd.org/OpenTTDDevBlackBook/NoAI/Adding_a_squirrel_function correct? 22:35:01 <Elukka> hmm 22:35:02 <Eddi|zuHause> "Iran gives Belarus 300 Million â¬" ... and that is news worthy, in times where greece gets like 300 billion â¬? 22:35:18 *** Adambean [AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has quit [Quit: Gone fishing] 22:35:31 <Elukka> perhaps it'd be better if the 4 axle coaches were all one type in game (and it randomly picked a sprite), and 3 and 2 axle coaches would be used for the other types? 22:35:45 <Eddi|zuHause> Elukka: yes, that is only temporary 22:36:03 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-83-134-175-22.dsl.scarlet.be] has quit [] 22:36:21 <Elukka> alright 22:36:25 <Elukka> guess i better draw the other ones :P 22:37:01 <Eddi|zuHause> the plan is to have the 3 axle wagons early, and the 4 axle wagons later, basically replacing the 3 axle ones 22:37:14 <Eddi|zuHause> the D-Zug wagon must get different sprites altogether 22:37:51 <Elukka> in game it looks like the wrong wagon's sprite sometimes overlays the next wagon, or is that just because i don't have that one patch 22:37:58 <Eddi|zuHause> that leaves 2 versions of the 4-axle wagon, one with 70km/h and one with 100km/h (possibly with different running costs) 22:38:30 <Eddi|zuHause> Elukka: yeah, drawing is occasionally wrong, not entirely sure why that is, or whether there is a way around this 22:39:44 <Elukka> http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z113/Elucca/sprites.png 22:39:50 <Elukka> it looks like the other wagon should go on top 22:39:55 <Elukka> dunno if there's anything you can do about it though 22:40:05 <Elukka> it's less noticeable in motion 22:40:44 <Eddi|zuHause> partially the problem is that the wagon gets longer in - view 22:41:06 <Eddi|zuHause> it would be less noticeable if it behaved euclidean 22:41:44 <Elukka> hm. if the length of the coaches is alright, i'll go finish up the mail wagon 22:42:09 <Eddi|zuHause> a 10lu mail wagon? 22:42:18 <Eddi|zuHause> or a shorter one? 22:42:35 <Eddi|zuHause> the value in the tracking table is not a realistic one yet 22:42:46 <Elukka> well it looked like it used the same chassis as the 4 axle coaches 22:42:52 <Elukka> haven't really done much work on it yet 22:43:44 *** lugo [bnc4free@209.141.56.5] has quit [Quit: over and out] 22:45:47 <Elukka> http://hfkern.hf.funpic.de/Fleischmann_Wagen/Abteil_post_5088.jpg 22:45:49 <Elukka> that sort of thing 22:47:51 <Kogut> Interesting "tower" on the left side 22:47:55 <Kogut> what is this? 22:48:04 <Eddi|zuHause> that is the braker's cabin 22:48:26 <Kogut> but why it is elevated? 22:49:02 <Eddi|zuHause> before brakes could be controlled from the engine, each wagon needed a person operating the brakes 22:49:25 <Eddi|zuHause> the braker must have some overview, so the cabin is usually elevated 22:50:03 <Eddi|zuHause> e.g. to see the engine 22:51:13 <Elukka> http://www.brawa.de/typo3temp/pics/48228-gedecktergueterwagen-bremserhaus-kpev_bda841966d.jpg 22:51:14 <Elukka> another one 22:51:34 <Elukka> "Working in brakeman's cabins was dangerous, especially in winter because the cabins were unheated and draughty and there was little room to move around and keep warm. As a result brakemen frequently froze, sometimes even to death, placing the entire train at risk due to lack of braking power." 22:51:36 <Elukka> the worst job 22:51:51 <Eddi|zuHause> later a closed air pressure line was introduced, first to passenger trains, later to cargo trains. so by changing the pressure in the line, the engine can operate all brakes simultaneously 22:52:23 <Pinkbeast> Um... vacuum brakes? 22:52:38 <Kogut> interesting... thanks! 22:52:40 <Kogut> bye 22:52:59 <Pinkbeast> In a lot of places, air brakes are much later. 22:53:35 <Elukka> yeah, like... 70's 22:54:05 <Elukka> but you brits tended to have separate brake vans 22:54:10 <Elukka> rather than a cab on each wagon 22:54:22 <Pinkbeast> On goods trains, yes. 22:54:56 <Pinkbeast> But what I'm saying is that we (like most places) went brakemen -> vacuum brakes -> air brakes because it's a lot easier to make vacuum with a steam locomotive than it is compressed air. 22:55:16 <Eddi|zuHause> cargo trains tend to have less braking power 22:56:08 <Pinkbeast> When's the vehicle in that picture from? 22:56:54 <Elukka> around the turn of the 20th century i think 22:57:29 <Pinkbeast> Huh. We mandated automatic brakes on pax trains in 1889, but I guess that was first. 22:59:43 <Elukka> Eddi|zuHause: did they retrofit those coaches with continuous brakes when the brakeman's cabs started to disappear? 23:00:05 <Eddi|zuHause> don't know. possibly 23:01:47 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:03:24 <Elukka> since they ran well into the 50's... i'd think so 23:04:23 *** Lakie` [~Lakie@host81-141-101-8.wlms-broadband.com] has joined #openttd 23:05:10 *** mikegrb [~michael@mikegrb.netop.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:05:16 *** mikegrb [~michael@mikegrb.netop.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 23:09:20 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:8900:54f1:0:9ddd] has quit [Quit: bye] 23:10:37 *** Lakie [~Lakie@host81-141-101-8.wlms-broadband.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:18:12 *** JVassie [~James@2.27.105.86] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:20:46 *** Lakie` is now known as Lakie 23:25:35 *** pugi [~pugi@dyndsl-091-096-036-031.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has quit [Quit: I reject your reality and substitute my own] 23:28:05 *** Lakie [~Lakie@host81-141-101-8.wlms-broadband.com] has quit [Quit: Night.] 23:29:50 <Elukka> Eddi|zuHause: the 4 axle mail car is the same length as the passenger coaches, right? 23:30:16 <Eddi|zuHause> i have no information about that 23:30:29 *** Biolunar [mahdi@blfd-4d08fe87.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: All your IRC are belong to us!] 23:30:41 <Elukka> well, i suppose they would be 23:36:32 *** lugo [bnc4free@209.141.56.5] has joined #openttd 23:40:33 *** lugo [bnc4free@209.141.56.5] has quit [] 23:41:45 *** tparker_ [~tparker@2600:3c03::1d:4242] has joined #openttd 23:43:33 *** tparker [~tparker@2600:3c03::1d:4242] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:43:37 *** tparker_ is now known as tparker 23:44:10 *** Kogut [d586afe1@ircip4.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 23:50:02 *** lugo [bnc4free@209.141.56.5] has joined #openttd 23:50:35 *** Vadtec [~Vadtec@2001:470:1f06:13e0::1337] has joined #openttd 23:51:25 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip3.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 23:51:30 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip4.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd