Config
Log for #openttd on 14th March 2013:
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00:07:14  <ondono88> !password
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00:10:04  <Eddi|zuHause> we haven't had that in a while :p
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00:11:46  <V453000> haha :D
00:13:55  <V453000> !assword
00:14:04  <V453000> hm not entirely idiotproof
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06:28:37  <Flygon> "This train requires a brakevan"
06:28:44  <Flygon> But it's already got a locomotive on each end D:
06:28:54  <Flygon> Stupid union movement...
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10:01:13  <dihedral> greetings
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11:36:50  <__ln__> http://digg.tumblr.com/post/45240117617/this-water-is-coming-out-of-the-faucet-in-zig
11:47:18  <Pikka> I especially enjoy the way they explain that it doesn't actually look like that
11:47:41  <Pikka> it only looks that way because of the 24fps camera
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11:53:27  <peter1138> err
11:53:57  <Pikka> errrrrrrrr
11:54:13  <Pikka> are we doing racing car impressions?
12:29:11  <Flygon> So, we need a 600fps camera, and then a good CRT?
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12:46:27  <Eddi|zuHause> your eyes only see 15-18fps
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12:49:04  <TinoDidriksen> ...so wrong.
12:52:42  <Pikka> your eyes don't see any fps
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12:54:14  <Pikka> but anyway, that water would just look like a splashy fan of water IRL, it's only because the camera catches the water in a particular phase each time that it appears to have a static shape.
12:56:35  <Pikka> this is also why they don't use sodium bulbs or old-fashioned fluorescent tubes in machinery shops ;)
12:57:23  <Pikka> they have a steady flicker which is too fast for the human eye to see, but can make, for example, a spinning saw blade appear to be stationary.
12:58:13  <Pinkbeast> "and then comedy ensued"
13:02:31  <Eddi|zuHause> ok, i should phrase that differently: your the receptors of your eyes are slower than any movie fps, which is why movies appear "smooth". it is, however not an "off/on" kind of fps, it's an "integrating" kind, i.e. all light impressions over some time are added up to one single picture in the brain
13:08:31  <__ln__> but you see a clear difference between 24 fps movies and the 48 fps Hobbit.
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13:15:46  <andythenorth> hi
13:17:39  <Pikka> hello andy
13:18:01  <andythenorth> hello pikka
13:20:31  <Pikka> what are the haps?
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13:22:39  <andythenorth> almost no haps
13:22:45  <andythenorth> I went to the pub
13:22:47  <Pikka> hapless
13:22:49  <andythenorth> now I went to the working
13:22:52  <andythenorth> haplessly
13:23:04  <andythenorth> keine haps
13:23:07  <Pikka> the pub then work
13:23:14  <andythenorth> the pub then sleep then work
13:23:19  <Pikka> oh, well
13:23:22  <Pikka> in that case, carry on
13:23:26  <Pikka> carry on regardless
13:23:29  <andythenorth> is it done yet?
13:23:42  <Pikka> for a given value of it, certainly
13:24:21  <Ammler> Eddi|zuHause: around?
13:24:29  <Eddi|zuHause> depends
13:24:37  <Ammler> you test fails, that is why i failed
13:24:48  <Ammler> http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/eddi-nml/push/ERROR/r2073/eddi-nml-r2073-build.test.log
13:25:00  <Ammler> you could also disable the whole windows building part
13:25:14  <Ammler> s/i/it/
13:25:14  <Eddi|zuHause> interesting...
13:25:22  <Pikka> carry on sergeant, too, andythenorth
13:25:28  <Eddi|zuHause> let me read that first :)
13:25:36  <Ammler> just the bottom :-)
13:25:39  <Pikka> with doctor who and bob monkhouse
13:26:08  <Ammler> http://hg.openttdcoop.org/eddi-nml/file/ff4c96a300da/.devzone/build/nml.spec <-- remove the wine/windows part
13:26:26  <andythenorth> car transporters?
13:26:30  <andythenorth> cement trucks?
13:26:36  <Ammler> (well, not that it matters, would just speed up things...)
13:26:36  <andythenorth> meh wagons
13:27:00  <Pikka> cars on flatwagons
13:27:13  <Pikka> as a gudes subtype and/or vehicles cargo
13:27:29  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: should be fixed
13:27:39  <Pikka> you can leave that to me though, I'll do some cars as part of hoqus or something for the benefit of towncar AI
13:29:57  <Ammler> just run the regression locally, you can also run just one test
13:30:14  <Ammler> next time :-P
13:32:08  <Ammler> hmm, still failed
13:32:51  <Ammler> http://hg.openttdcoop.org/eddi-nml/file/ff4c96a300da/.devzone/build/files
13:33:17  <Ammler> it is called eddi-nml-r2074-suse1230.noarch.rpm
13:34:14  <Ammler> then it should work
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13:36:12  <Pikka> andythenorth: are you going to do mostly/exclusively UK wagons, if any? :)
13:36:25  <andythenorth> not sure yet
13:36:30  <Pikka> k
13:36:30  <andythenorth> wholly lacking inspration
13:36:38  <Pikka> just want to make sure we don't duplicate an effort
13:36:44  <andythenorth> what other countrees are you working on?
13:36:49  <andythenorth> North America?
13:36:54  <Pikka> once I've got the UK and US locos done I'll let you play with the grfs
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13:36:57  <Pikka> might be inspiring
13:36:59  <andythenorth> k
13:38:20  <andythenorth> we have a Hornby catalogue here in the office for work-related reasons
13:38:23  <andythenorth> maybe I look in that :P
13:39:00  <Pikka> maybe ;)
13:40:00  <Pikka> don't worry about doing loads, btw, because I'm not entirely sure how I'm going to do those yet
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13:46:45  <Ammler> Eddi|zuHause: I would fix it on nml and you pull it, ok?
13:48:30  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: i'm kinda busy the next few minutes, so i won't react
13:48:37  <Eddi|zuHause> just do what you think :)
13:49:24  <Ammler> well, committed, you can either pull or whatever :-P
13:51:30  <Ammler> or I do... :-)
13:57:00  <Ammler> http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/eddi-nml/push/r2077/
13:58:38  <Eddi|zuHause> whatever that did, it hopelessly confused my checkout :/
13:59:31  <Ammler> hmm, I thought, you don't have time?
14:01:20  <Eddi|zuHause> well, that occasionally changes :)
14:01:30  <Ammler>  guess, the support for build branches is broken :-)
14:01:45  <Ammler> majonaise
14:02:10  <Ammler> or I am just stupid, it is suffix, not prefix :-(
14:03:31  <Ammler> oh, and we need a new grfcodec
14:04:34  <Eddi|zuHause> how do i discard an attempted merge?
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14:05:54  <Ammler> backout?
14:06:03  <Ammler> hg up to whatever
14:06:27  <Eddi|zuHause> i have done hg merge but not hg commit, and now whatever i try it says "uncommited merge"
14:06:36  <Ammler> what did I break with the merge?
14:06:53  <Eddi|zuHause> not, you, i did...
14:07:09  <Ammler> then revert
14:07:16  <Ammler> uncommited changes
14:07:27  <Ammler> hg up -c
14:07:49  <Ammler> etc. :-)
14:08:23  <Eddi|zuHause> no workie
14:09:05  <Eddi|zuHause> > hg up -r2046
14:09:07  <Eddi|zuHause> Abbruch: outstanding uncommitted merges
14:10:20  <Eddi|zuHause> ah
14:10:22  <Eddi|zuHause> -C
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14:10:41  <Eddi|zuHause> not -c
14:11:07  <Ammler> ah well, my mind is case insensitiv
14:12:53  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: the tar.gz still have the wrong name?
14:13:14  <Ammler> why?
14:13:27  <Eddi|zuHause> "nml" instead of "eddi-nml"?
14:13:43  <Ammler> not such file in the list afaik
14:13:45  <Eddi|zuHause> here: http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/eddi-nml/push/r2077/
14:14:02  <Ammler> oh, does it matter?
14:14:21  <Ammler> I guess, that would need editing setup.py
14:14:22  <Eddi|zuHause> it seems wrong/confusing
14:14:49  <Ammler> well, it does not matter for devzone, it is your fork, do what you like with it :-P
14:15:33  <Ammler> I would not change too much things on the fork, easier to pull back
14:17:16  <Ammler> oh, and btw. pull cets :-P
14:23:09  <Eddi|zuHause> warning: i now break everything(tm)
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14:24:25  <Belugas> hello
14:24:45  <Eddi|zuHause> oh, Belugas lives an hour earlier than usual :)
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14:29:20  <Belugas> we're living under US time now :S
14:29:28  <Belugas> hi Eddi|zuHause
14:32:17  <__ln__> i thought they didn't have any territorial demands against you
14:37:01  <Belugas> tell that to our pal Steven Harper :S
14:52:28  <Eddi|zuHause> something is not right :/
14:53:07  <Eddi|zuHause> cets.rgf only 27kb :/
14:53:12  <Eddi|zuHause> *grf
14:53:36  <Sacro> eesh
14:53:53  <Sacro> stupid coworker, check whether a subnet is used locally before getting a VPN to use it
14:56:14  <__ln__> https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/531567_220051318137684_130733328_n.jpg
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14:58:03  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: can the make on devzone be "verbose"?
14:59:12  <Ammler> it is what you define
15:00:09  <Eddi|zuHause> thank you, tautology cat.
15:01:22  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: i might need some temporary playground to figure out what's different on the devzone build environment than my own build environment
15:02:38  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: i think dependencies are called in the wrong order
15:02:47  <Eddi|zuHause> which may be my fault
15:02:50  <Ammler> http://hg.openttdcoop.org/misc/file/30bde4f7fb22/compiler/.default/nml/nml.spec <-- this is how "default" nml projects are build
15:03:07  <Ammler> either you tell me what to change or you copy it to your project and customize
15:05:10  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: the problem is, i don't know what to change without trying it out
15:05:33  <Ammler> could it be a issue of grfcodec?
15:05:37  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: so i'd need some test system at the "make" step
15:05:44  <Ammler> since it has a new libpng
15:05:58  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: no, something before that step is wrong
15:06:17  <Eddi|zuHause> the cets.nfo on the bundles page has empty engine files in it
15:06:42  <Eddi|zuHause> so something in the generation or assembly process went wrong/different
15:07:35  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: that you pass "--nfo cets.nfo" in NML_FLAGS sounds fishy, though
15:08:43  <Ammler> make %{?_smp_mflags} bundle_zip ZIP="7za a" ZIP_FLAGS="-tzip -mx9" NML_FLAGS="-c --nfo %{name}.nfo"
15:09:03  <Eddi|zuHause> yes, why do you do that?
15:09:33  <Ammler> well, some wanted to have nfo for debug
15:09:56  <Eddi|zuHause> it may be redirecting the output of my intermediate compile steps to the wrong file
15:10:11  <Eddi|zuHause> because i pass NML_FLAGS there as well
15:10:35  <Ammler> maybe easier to use your own spec then?
15:10:47  <Ammler> not sure, if we should change the default nml spec
15:12:08  <Eddi|zuHause> i think i'll remove NML_FLAGS from that step in the makefile instead
15:12:14  <Ammler> just copy theat nml.spec to cets/.devzone/build/
15:12:26  <Ammler> and customize to your needs
15:13:52  <Eddi|zuHause> but i still need a fast/interactive way to test if that change will solve anything
15:14:23  <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: will -j<X> do anything on the compile farm?
15:15:42  <Ammler> theoretically it should force to -j1, not sure if you can overrule
15:16:14  <Ammler> part of %{?_smp_mflags} afaik too
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15:31:51  <Ammler> Eddi|zuHause: but if you keep -c, it will still overrule your flag
15:34:18  <Eddi|zuHause> that shouldn't do any harm for now
15:35:05  <Eddi|zuHause> but it didn't solve anything either :/
15:45:32  <Ammler> the nml on devzone is fine?
15:45:48  <Ammler> you use the same locally?
15:49:57  <Eddi|zuHause> not entirely sure
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15:53:01  <Eddi|zuHause> but if the nmlc steps would fail, then there should be errors about that, right?
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16:00:35  <Ammler> well, you said, the nfo looks bad
16:01:42  <Eddi|zuHause> yes, but it's the combination script inbetween that gets confused because of non-existing files
16:01:47  <Eddi|zuHause> but i think i found the problem
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16:02:52  <Ammler> also since you use a custom spec, you might also configure the publisher (file files)
16:03:07  <Eddi|zuHause> yes, next step :)
16:03:32  <Eddi|zuHause> first, correctness, then completeness :)
16:03:43  <Ammler> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/entry/.devzone/build/files <-- with comments
16:10:14  <Eddi|zuHause> hah! finally a large grf :)
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16:17:41  <Eddi|zuHause> now, i count 3 bugs: the tenders are broken, the 32bpp-template-graphics are broken, and the extra purchase text is broken :/
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17:00:19  <Maverick> Hey guys, setting up a chilli cargo dist server for a bit
17:00:30  <Maverick> think someone can test join for me?
17:00:35  *** Maverick is now known as Guest1831
17:00:47  <welshdragon> afternoon
17:00:48  *** Guest1831 is now known as Mavzor
17:00:53  <Mavzor> hey welshdragon
17:01:47  <welshdragon> When I edit a .sav to a .scn using NotePad, and try to open with OpenTTD it says it's been made with a newer version, how can I get around this?
17:02:13  <TinoDidriksen> ...using notepad? Aren't save files binary?
17:02:26  <welshdragon> (On my Mac, I had no issues editing .sav's to .scn)
17:02:45  <TinoDidriksen> Probably using a better editor there.
17:02:53  <welshdragon> No, you can edit the extension, and they will open
17:03:11  <TinoDidriksen> Sure, but extension has nothing to do with notepad.
17:04:22  <welshdragon> true. what I meant is that you open a .sav in notepad, and save as .scn (and VV) On a Mac with TextEdit, the conversion works
17:04:36  <TinoDidriksen> Why open it at all? Just copy and rename.
17:04:45  <TinoDidriksen> Notepad will screw up all the bytes.
17:05:23  *** valhallasw [~valhallas@wirenat-ulcn.strw.leidenuniv.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
17:05:31  <welshdragon> so I guess I'll have top get Notepad++
17:05:43  <TinoDidriksen> ...or just don't open the file!
17:06:17  <welshdragon> as your suggestion TinoDidriksen didn't work, the file is still seen by Windows and OpenTTD as .sav ...
17:06:38  <TinoDidriksen> Enable showing extensions, change the extension.
17:08:05  <welshdragon> *pumps fist* That works, thanks TinoDidriksen
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18:00:34  <Eddi|zuHause> i have no clue why the 32bpp graphics are broken :/
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18:00:54  <Eddi|zuHause> especially why only the "template" graphics are broken, the vehicles with real graphics are fine
18:01:28  <SigHunter> is there a way to have "cloned" vehicles automatically set "shared orders" with the one it was cloned from?
18:03:12  <Eddi|zuHause> yes, hold CTRL while cloning
18:04:18  <SigHunter> awesome, thx
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18:23:41  <Eddi|zuHause> ugh! i think i have a suspicion why the purchase text is not working: nml is "optimizing out" unused strings, so the references are all wrong :/
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18:41:47  * NGC3982 puts stuff in Eddi.
18:42:41  * Eddi|zuHause puts NGC3982 in ignore list
18:45:44  <NGC3982> By the way, Sim City has taken my soul and does not seem to be keen on returning it.
18:46:01  <NGC3982> Yet, i'm still failing miserably at it.
18:49:25  *** Progman [~progman@p57A193AD.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:50:43  <__ln__> http://inhabitat.com/man-transforms-obsolete-tv-screens-into-a-solar-death-ray-that-can-reach-2000-degrees-fahrenheit/
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18:56:57  <Terkhen> hello
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19:04:50  <Eddi|zuHause> is there a less crazy workaround other than making a "switch(dummy_strings, STORE_TEMP(string(STR_1) | string(STR_2 | ...)"?
19:35:15  <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r25086 trunk/src/lang/swedish.txt (2013-03-14 18:45:08 UTC)
19:35:16  <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
19:35:17  <DorpsGek> swedish - 34 changes by Joel_A
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21:43:57  <Terkhen> good night
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22:22:48  <LordAro> evening all
22:23:26  <__ln__> buonasera
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22:36:20  <Eddi|zuHause> "nmlc ERROR: There are not enough registers available to perform all required computations in switch blocks. Please reduce the complexity of your code."
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22:36:49  <Eddi|zuHause> so much for that idea :/
22:39:47  <LordAro> cets?
22:40:12  <peter1138> nfo
22:40:14  <peter1138> much simpler
22:40:34  <peter1138> you can't write valid nfo that won't compile :p
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22:48:38  <LordAro> 10GB for TF2? jeez...
22:50:37  * LordAro needs to sort out his partitions before serious linux gaming can occur
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23:02:05  <peter1138> have they made steam for linux yet?
23:02:13  <peter1138> or is it still steam for ubuntu (but we call it linux anyway)
23:04:10  <peter1138> ah, still the latter
23:04:22  <frosch123> in ottd you can have steam since 1830 with the right train set
23:04:37  <peter1138> har har
23:07:50  <TinoDidriksen> It's apparently easy enough to use the Ubuntu package on other distros.
23:08:41  <peter1138> manually unpacking a .deb? great stuff. just give me a tarball instead o_O
23:08:58  <frosch123> night
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23:12:20  <peter1138> heh, "nice" it automatically installs their pgp key as trusted o_O
23:13:20  <blathijs> peter1138: Why would they do that? Users will have installed their pgp key in advance to verify the .deb integrity right and not install random downloaded packages just like that? Oh wait..
23:14:00  <peter1138> also it's all 32bit
23:14:03  <peter1138> in this day & age
23:15:21  *** Devroush [~dennis@dD5765BAC.access.telenet.be] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:18:30  <LordAro> ha, you sound like linux torvalds complaining about c++ :P
23:18:34  <LordAro> *linux
23:18:36  <LordAro> dammit
23:18:41  <LordAro> *linus
23:18:44  <LordAro> F***
23:19:14  <LordAro> it's automatic key presses :L
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23:22:51  <peter1138> good
23:23:01  <peter1138> when linus complains about something he has good reasons
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