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00:15:01 *** lofejndif [~lsqavnbok@9IOAADJG4.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: gone] 00:29:00 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~flex@88.130.168.226] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:42:38 *** Aristide [~quassel@2a01:e35:2eb9:64b0:1e4b:d6ff:feca:6b69] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:51:43 *** Brumi [~quassel@78-131-41-191.pool.digikabel.hu] has quit [] 01:03:48 *** Djohaal [~Djohaal@189.58.5.61.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has joined #openttd 01:09:11 *** kais58__ is now known as kais58|AFK 01:16:16 *** DDR [~kvirc@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:16:38 *** DDR [~kvirc@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 01:20:12 *** Donations [~Donations@181.177.64.48.cable.dyn.parinternet.be] has joined #openttd 01:21:30 *** Donations [~Donations@181.177.64.48.cable.dyn.parinternet.be] has quit [autokilled: Do not spam. Mail support@oftc.net with questions. (2014-04-21 01:21:29)] 01:29:10 *** luaduck is now known as luaduck_zzz 01:43:36 *** glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Bye] 01:56:35 *** Superuser [~superuser@cpc11-lewi15-2-0-cust98.2-4.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:01:29 *** gelignite_ [~gelignite@i5387AC99.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: http://bit.ly/nkczDT] 02:19:38 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:19:57 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 02:27:02 <Supercheese> Good Lord, this Andrex character 02:27:23 <Supercheese> I've heard less complaining from children throwing tantrums over not getting their candy 02:30:58 *** Jerik [~Jerik@c-68-80-55-194.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:33:20 *** Jerik [~Jerik@c-68-80-55-194.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 02:35:39 *** Jerik [~Jerik@c-68-80-55-194.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [] 02:36:54 *** Dan9550 [~dan9550@122.298.dsl.mel.iprimus.net.au] has joined #openttd 02:41:29 *** MJP [~mjp@hq.z77.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:11:12 *** Pereba [~UserNick@177.17.20.223] has quit [Quit: A clean quit, because my messages are already in your mind.] 03:17:36 *** Hazzard_ [~quassel@c-67-174-253-44.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 03:17:36 *** Flygon [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:17:38 *** Flygon [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has joined #openttd 03:22:06 *** Hazzard is now known as Guest7055 03:22:06 *** Hazzard_ is now known as Hazzard 03:24:05 *** Guest7055 [~quassel@c-67-174-253-44.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:25:30 *** ABCRic [~ABCRic@a79-169-2-218.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:12:15 *** Snail [~jacopocol@cpe-74-73-132-105.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Snail] 04:55:32 *** George|2 [~George@185.43.94.91] has joined #openttd 04:55:32 *** George is now known as Guest7059 04:55:32 *** George|2 is now known as George 04:56:17 *** Eddi|zuHause2 [~johekr@p5DC66138.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 05:00:32 *** Guest7059 [~George@185.43.94.91] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:03:48 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p5DC66F37.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:13:55 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@76.178.136.186] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:14:24 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@76.178.136.186] has joined #openttd 05:58:10 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@76.178.136.186] has quit [Quit: Valete omnes] 06:04:55 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@76.178.136.186] has joined #openttd 06:05:28 <Supercheese> Google Translate actually isn't half bad going from Latin -> English 06:05:40 <Supercheese> its English -> Latin is horrible though 06:16:18 *** LSky [~LSky@5ED4B2EA.cm-7-5c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 06:20:24 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-88-126.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 06:26:23 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:26:49 *** George is now known as Guest7066 06:26:51 *** George [~George@185.43.94.91] has joined #openttd 06:30:58 *** Guest7066 [~George@185.43.94.91] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:33:39 *** Pensacola [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 06:34:04 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 06:36:19 <planetmaker> moin 06:36:53 <andythenorth> oops 06:37:51 * andythenorth went in suggestions forum 06:38:16 <andythenorth> or as I currently call it, the âconfused, wrong or whiningâ 06:39:04 <juzza1> +entitled 06:39:34 <andythenorth> we should just have polls 06:39:40 <andythenorth> then re-title them 06:40:30 <planetmaker> we should suggest more polls? 06:40:44 <planetmaker> totally +1. 06:40:54 <planetmaker> Keeps them occupied. Thus maybe less whining :D 06:44:23 <Supercheese> eh, I doubt it 06:46:02 <planetmaker> totally +1 on your posting, Supercheese :) Though we also got a complaint about that being backseat moderation - which I dispute it being 06:46:25 <planetmaker> I consider it a favour being said 06:46:36 <Supercheese> I've been restraining myself 06:46:53 <Supercheese> :S 06:47:17 <planetmaker> favour that you said it, instead of a mod 06:47:35 <planetmaker> or he would also start whining about the evil mods, too 06:48:33 <Supercheese> the Whine is strong with him 06:49:01 <planetmaker> lol, yeah :P 06:50:02 <planetmaker> I'll send my air force, some sea hawk to feast on that: https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/107191069901530811927/albums/5588142349480607121/6004435538370020866?pid=6004435538370020866&oid=107191069901530811927 07:06:19 *** planetmaker [~planetmak@188.cimarosa.openttdcoop.org] has left #openttd [Verlassend] 07:06:25 *** planetmaker [~planetmak@188.cimarosa.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 07:06:28 *** mode/#openttd [+o planetmaker] by ChanServ 07:09:02 <Rubidium> okay... I just had to make a post after Supercheese ;) 07:10:54 <planetmaker> nice one! :) 07:37:02 <andythenorth> hmm 07:37:45 <andythenorth> Rubidium: I would just revert the feature 07:37:53 <andythenorth> first one to whine is the one that causes a revert 07:38:51 <andythenorth> start a new thread, pinned, in bold. 07:39:00 <andythenorth> âNames of users who caused features to be removed" 07:39:16 <andythenorth> winner is the one who causes the final feature to be removed 07:39:25 <andythenorth> inverse âFirst post!â 07:39:42 <Supercheese> the winning whining eh 07:47:46 *** Alberth [~hat@2001:981:c6c5:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has joined #openttd 07:47:49 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 08:09:39 <andythenorth> I am very +1 to changing the payment 08:10:03 <andythenorth> it would make a lot more sense for payment to increase as distance decreases 08:10:05 <andythenorth> more logical 08:10:45 <andythenorth> if we allow that transporting 0 tiles is infinite payment, then just divide by number of tiles 08:10:48 <andythenorth> should work well 08:17:03 <Supercheese> Valete 08:17:05 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@76.178.136.186] has quit [Quit: Valete omnes] 08:17:27 <Alberth> simple and easy :) 08:17:50 <andythenorth> now we just need to program infinity 08:18:12 <Alberth> the only minor niggle is that it totally kills the need to build nice networks :( 08:18:24 <Alberth> nah, just forbid transport over 0 tiles 08:18:55 <andythenorth> if I go 1 tile, need to do infinity / 1 08:19:28 <andythenorth> donât think it will work 08:19:33 <andythenorth> maybe we could cap infinity? 08:19:41 <andythenorth> min(infinity, some value) ? 08:19:44 <Alberth> hmm, we can use MAX_INT64 as an approximation? 08:20:07 <andythenorth> Alberth: metric or imperial MAX_INT64? 08:20:36 <Alberth> we'll add a setting for that, we don't want to have the wrong kind of infinity, dowe? 08:20:43 <Alberth> *do we 08:21:01 <andythenorth> weâll need a setting to decide if you see the setting or not 08:21:08 <andythenorth> oh wait, we have that already :( 08:21:24 <Alberth> yep, way ahead of you :) 08:21:50 <andythenorth> itâs nice that we plan ahead 08:22:00 <Alberth> but you'd need a setting to state whether to also search the non-visible settings, perhaps 08:22:07 <andythenorth> what we need is a design 08:22:11 <andythenorth> and a project manager 08:22:14 <Alberth> what?! 08:23:05 <Alberth> but we've made such a nice random collection of functionalities 08:23:54 <Alberth> most of them are sort-of functioning within specs, even 08:27:42 *** Devroush [~dennis@dd5765bac.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 08:29:35 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@95.76.164.39] has joined #openttd 08:33:14 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1AB97.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 08:42:55 <andythenorth> I read that as âwithout specsâ for some reason 08:44:55 <andythenorth> ha 08:48:54 <Alberth> you're probably right in that :) 08:53:13 <andythenorth> so how about we make rivers unmovable? 08:53:27 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@s55978e11.adsl.online.nl] has joined #openttd 08:57:03 <Alberth> +1 08:57:56 <Alberth> although I'll probably get annoyed sufficiently with them to disable their generation :p 09:00:49 <Taede> rcon unpause should only ever unpause if min_active_clients is met, right? 09:02:25 <andythenorth> Alberth: magic bulldozer :P 09:02:27 <Taede> or is it different for non-dedicated servers? 09:03:22 * peter1139 ponders having another go at the landscape generator. 09:04:20 * andythenorth ponders encouraging peter1139 09:04:26 <andythenorth> how do you encourage a peter1139 ? 09:06:31 <peter1139> Beer 09:08:58 * andythenorth considers reviving pintware 09:12:17 <andythenorth> V453000: FIRS farms - default production a bit low? 09:16:21 <andythenorth> is âunmovableâ just a ReturnCommandCost or something 09:16:22 <andythenorth> ? 09:16:35 * andythenorth might try patching in a bit 09:16:43 <andythenorth> have to make wooden train track first :P 09:17:04 *** Dan9550 [~dan9550@122.298.dsl.mel.iprimus.net.au] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:21:50 *** Dan9550 [~dan9550@122.298.dsl.mel.iprimus.net.au] has joined #openttd 09:24:19 <Alberth> object_cmd.cpp:490 if (!_cheats.magic_bulldozer.value && (spec->flags & OBJECT_FLAG_CANNOT_REMOVE) != 0) return CMD_ERROR; 09:24:31 <Alberth> looks like it :) 09:26:46 <Alberth> 496 does something similar for owned things 09:41:24 *** Brumi [~quassel@78-131-41-191.pool.digikabel.hu] has joined #openttd 09:46:26 *** yorick [~yorick@ip51cd0513.speed.planet.nl] has joined #openttd 09:48:38 <andythenorth> fonsinchen: both of the extra cdist modes sound good 09:49:24 *** fjb is now known as Guest7079 09:49:26 *** fjb [~frank@000158aa.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 09:52:12 <fonsinchen> andythenorth: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=41992&p=1118368#p1118368 is a radical simplification of the cargo reduction thing 09:52:42 <andythenorth> Yeah I read that :) 09:52:51 <fonsinchen> I'm wondering if that's a good idea as you can definitely cheat it if I do it like that. 09:52:54 <andythenorth> ok, so I donât 100% understand it, but letâs assume thatâs my problem 09:52:59 <andythenorth> I understand the outcome I think 09:54:02 <fonsinchen> You can set a base cargo amount and some bonus cargo for large link graphs and you can define how large a link graph has to be to get the whole bonus. 09:54:08 <fonsinchen> That's it, basically 09:54:30 <andythenorth> so more destinations served => more cargo delivered to station 09:54:38 <andythenorth> (source station) 09:55:05 <fonsinchen> No, more stations in link graph => more cargo delivered to any station in that link graph 09:55:45 <fonsinchen> There are obvious ways to inflate the number of stations in your link graph and to temporarily connect separate link graphs to get more bonus. 09:55:59 <fonsinchen> I'd say it doesn't matter, though. 09:56:01 <andythenorth> is this all independent of station rating? 09:56:06 <fonsinchen> yes 09:56:17 *** Guest7079 [~frank@000158aa.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:59:30 *** MJP [~mjp@hq.z77.fr] has joined #openttd 10:03:46 *** Pensacola [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:04:12 <andythenorth> fonsinchen: these modes could be per-cargo, as for current cdist? 10:04:28 <andythenorth> could != should 10:04:34 <fonsinchen> The actual new mode, waybill, yes. 10:04:41 <fonsinchen> The cargo reduction would be global. 10:04:57 <fonsinchen> I don't want to introduce 3*4 new settings 10:05:01 <andythenorth> indeed 10:05:53 <fonsinchen> What I'm actually interested in is opinions about the cheating possibility. 10:06:16 <andythenorth> I am the wrong person for that :) 10:06:19 <andythenorth> I donât care 10:06:20 <andythenorth> at all 10:06:55 <andythenorth> I am much more interested in cargo flow between different classes of industry 10:07:53 *** oskari89 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 10:12:50 <andythenorth> fonsinchen: for waybill mode, is it possible to calculate capacity for cases with complex transfers? 10:14:00 *** Eddi|zuHause2 is now known as Eddi|zuHause 10:14:30 <fonsinchen> Actually for the waybill mode I'm envisioning a simpler solution, too: Just leave out the second pass of the MCF algorithm. That will effectively cap flows to capacities. 10:14:43 <fonsinchen> andythenorth: I don't quite understand your question, though. 10:15:32 <andythenorth> I canât actually state the question any better, Iâm going to ignore it, itâs probably meaningless 10:16:15 <fonsinchen> Ignore what? The question? The new mode? 10:17:19 <fonsinchen> andythenorth: Do you compile openttd yourself and are you up for a little test? 10:19:51 <andythenorth> fonsinchen: the question ;) 10:19:53 <andythenorth> and yes and yes 10:19:59 <andythenorth> afk a bit - kids 10:21:07 <fonsinchen> I'll prepare a patch for you 10:24:16 *** DDR [~kvirc@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:24:38 *** DDR [~kvirc@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 10:26:19 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d0121b1.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 10:27:49 <fonsinchen> andythenorth: Try http://devs.openttd.org/~fonsinchen/andy.diff for the waybill mode and tell me what you think 10:28:06 <fonsinchen> Ignore the link graph overlay colors for now. 10:28:48 <fonsinchen> With that patch the routing will coniuously adapt to the available capacity instead of trying to force a predetermined distribution. 10:28:59 <fonsinchen> Choose "asymmetric" as distribution mode. 10:33:59 *** pthagnar [~pthagnar@cpc7-pres17-2-0-cust28.18-3.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:34:50 <andythenorth> ok ta 10:36:18 * andythenorth gives the game time to catch up 10:36:32 <andythenorth> fonsinchen: worth testing for pax as well? 10:37:00 <fonsinchen> for whatever you'd use the waybill mode 10:37:47 <fonsinchen> Except for the colors in the link graph that _is_ what I would call waybill mode. 10:39:06 <fonsinchen> andythenorth: I remember you had that funny problem with engineering supplies not being delivered to the "right" place. It shouldn't happen with that patch. 10:40:10 <andythenorth> I think Iâll leave pax on symmetric, I donât know what data Iâd gain. I tend to connect ~every station in the pax graph 10:40:26 <andythenorth> pax seems to take care of itself - my vehicles are full, I make money 10:43:07 <fonsinchen> I find it quite hard to get all the passengers delivered in most cases ... but it your choice. 10:48:52 <andythenorth> so now I can test supply feeders 10:58:01 *** lugo [lugo@apple.bnc4free.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:00:43 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:04:03 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 11:05:14 *** Pereba [~UserNick@177.17.20.223] has joined #openttd 11:12:31 *** lugo [lugo@apple.bnc4free.com] has joined #openttd 11:19:47 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~flex@88.130.160.167] has joined #openttd 11:31:14 <andythenorth> fonsinchen: so far, for limited cases, this mode seems to Just Work ⢠11:31:28 <fonsinchen> nice to hear 11:31:40 <fonsinchen> If you have the time feel free to test something more complex 11:33:46 <andythenorth> in previous games, the hard case has been âspine routesâ - trunk trains with many stops, collecting and dropping to feeders 11:34:15 <andythenorth> I have seen cargo going wrong-direction, and also unloading and reloading at intermediate stations 11:34:31 <andythenorth> this was a while ago, first time I test cdist 11:35:48 <fonsinchen> We have to separate the bugs from the new features here. If you think you've found a bug please open a report. I'd like to test the new feature now. Specifically I'd like to know if it helps with cargo getting stuck because it doesn't want to go where you want it to go. 11:37:19 <andythenorth> ok ta 11:39:49 <andythenorth> bbl - kid stuff 11:39:50 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 11:53:40 *** Snail [~jacopocol@cpe-74-73-132-105.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 12:01:10 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:01:25 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 12:18:51 *** Phreeze [~p@vodsl-4721.vo.lu] has joined #openttd 12:24:37 <Phreeze> i always feel drunk after family meals....don't know why 12:31:40 *** Pereba [~UserNick@177.17.20.223] has quit [Quit: AdiIRC is updating to v1.9.3 Beta Build (2014/04/21) 64 Bit] 12:32:07 *** Pereba [~UserNick@177.17.20.223] has joined #openttd 12:37:08 *** Snail [~jacopocol@cpe-74-73-132-105.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Snail] 12:47:20 <peter1139> Is it due to the pint of vodka? 12:49:27 <Phreeze> btw, opengfx link in the ingame website-button is wrong -> it misses the "/projects/" in the URL 12:49:42 <Phreeze> nope, it' sprobably due to champagne + vine + whisky 12:49:46 <Phreeze> @peter 12:50:10 <peter1139> vine? 13:01:59 *** Superuser [~superuser@cpc11-lewi15-2-0-cust98.2-4.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 13:13:35 *** gelignite [~gelignite@i528C3D4A.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 13:47:04 *** ABCRic [~ABCRic@a79-169-2-218.cpe.netcabo.pt] has joined #openttd 14:12:31 *** Pikka [~Octomom@d110-32-11-122.rdl800.qld.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 14:19:40 <Phreeze> wine 14:19:41 <Phreeze> ^^ 15:08:28 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 15:08:43 <andythenorth> Pikka: I am intrigued by your proposal for costs 15:08:56 <andythenorth> for example, could we have different costs for faster, more powerful engines? 15:09:03 <andythenorth> they could cost more to buy for example 15:10:08 <Phreeze> andythenorth : is it normal that i don't have any road vehicles to transport stuff from firs basic economy ? and the armored van can transport milk, i dont have an "oil" transporter 15:10:16 <Phreeze> no road vehicle for the new cargos 15:10:49 <andythenorth> DEFINE NORMAL 15:11:17 <Phreeze> it is "intended to be that way" 15:11:33 <Phreeze> i have firs + uk trainset 15:11:56 <Phreeze> do i need another grf to transport FIRS stuff by road ? 15:12:00 <andythenorth> FIRS isnât a vehicle set 15:12:18 <andythenorth> :) 15:14:51 <ToBeFree> afaik/iirc the original vehicles can simply be refitted 15:14:56 <ToBeFree> so I'd say no 15:15:07 <ToBeFree> (what about *trying* it) 15:15:08 <ToBeFree> ^^ 15:16:01 <andythenorth> Phreeze: I reckon eGRVTS is a common choice for use with FIRS 15:16:50 <Phreeze> ill add egrvtsvflfnsÚr 15:17:53 *** Hazzard_ [~quassel@c-67-174-253-44.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 15:19:43 <Pikka> andy: It's a crazy idea, but it might just work. 15:20:02 <andythenorth> might be BAD 15:20:33 <Pikka> you're right 15:21:58 <andythenorth> ok 15:22:06 <Pikka> ok? 15:22:06 <andythenorth> letâs replace it with a much more complicated, harder to explain mechanic 15:22:12 <Pikka> yes 15:22:45 <andythenorth> I donât know which is worse 15:22:52 <andythenorth> suggestions from the inept 15:23:01 <andythenorth> or suggestions from those who understand algorithms 15:23:34 <Phreeze> lol a truck cant overtake a horse 15:23:51 <Phreeze> my "truck without egbrt grf" is no a " horse" i think, it goes 2kmh 15:23:58 <Phreeze> my new trucks cant overtake it ^^ 15:23:59 <Pikka> articulated road vehicles are a bad feature, Phreeze 15:24:05 *** Hazzard [~quassel@c-67-174-253-44.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 15:24:08 <andythenorth> nah 15:24:12 <andythenorth> just FEATURE 15:24:15 <Phreeze> i dont know if it is, grpahically its still a balogh trucks 15:28:39 <Pikka> andy: for industrial trams, perhaps, but they're a bit silly if you're doing "normal" semi-trailers or horsedrawn carriages 15:28:49 <Pikka> can't overtake 15:29:04 <Pikka> can't use "normal" truck stations 15:29:37 <Pikka> and you only see them articulate for half a second when they go round corners, most of the time they may as well be a solid vehicle. 15:30:52 <Phreeze> is it a BAD FEATURE ? 15:31:08 <Pikka> it's a fair to middling feature 15:33:45 <Phreeze> until what date, brake vans are required ? 15:33:49 <Phreeze> @firs - andythenorth 15:34:48 <Alberth> firs is an industry set, not a train set 15:34:52 <Pikka> I don't know about FIRS, but it's probably either 1965 or 1970 in UKRS. 15:34:53 <frosch123> you cannot brake firs, it's always gung ho 15:35:14 <Pikka> required cabeese is a BAD FEATURE 15:35:57 <frosch123> only as long as we have no audio-interactive explanation of what a caboose is 15:36:06 <Alberth> at the time, it's author had a different idea about that :) 15:39:46 <andythenorth> Phreeze: FIRS requires brake vans until 1982 15:40:00 *** retro|cz [~retro@ip-89-176-82-80.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 15:40:05 <andythenorth> Pikka: your point about semi-trucks isâŠdangerous to my new truck set :( 15:40:14 <andythenorth> now I have Thoughts 15:40:41 <Pikka> whoops 15:41:25 <andythenorth> I will ignore Te Thoughts 15:41:29 <andythenorth> The * 15:41:34 <Pikka> BAD THOUGHTS 15:43:24 <andythenorth> BAD https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsUXAEzaC3Q&feature=kp 15:46:37 <andythenorth> fonsinchen: how does the waybill dispatcher handle capacity? Is speed a factor? 15:54:08 *** Dan9550 [~dan9550@122.298.dsl.mel.iprimus.net.au] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:01:13 <Phreeze> 1982...wtf 16:07:46 <Phreeze> hm coal cars dont need a brake wagon 16:08:22 <Pikka> must be realism 16:08:44 <andythenorth> I thought it would be useful if FIRS controlled how trains work 16:08:50 <andythenorth> specifically brake vans 16:18:21 <fonsinchen> andythenorth: Capacity is measured, just like with the other modes. 16:19:35 <fonsinchen> Capacity will never fall below what the largest consist serving a link would transport if travelling along the link once a month. 16:21:07 <andythenorth> I have what looks like disproportionate allocation between route A (2 ships, 110t total capacity) and route B (3 trains, 144t total capacity) 16:21:31 <fonsinchen> Link capacity is not vehicle capacity 16:21:31 <andythenorth> itâs probably correct, but would be interesting to know what factors affect the split 16:21:58 <fonsinchen> Link capacity is the amount of cargo you can transport over a link within a month. 16:22:07 <andythenorth> so throughput 16:22:28 <fonsinchen> Yes. So I guess, as the ships are very slow they produce a low throughput. 16:23:39 <andythenorth> Iâll adjust and see 16:24:19 <fonsinchen> It may be the other way around, actually: As the ships are very large their link has a higher minimum capacity. 16:25:54 <andythenorth> I think their throughput would be lower than the trains 16:26:13 <andythenorth> I should normalise it for tiles travelled, then work it out :P 16:26:44 <fonsinchen> Yes, but I need to cut it off at some point to avoid excessive link drop. That's why there is the largest consist once a month rule. 16:26:57 * andythenorth needs âton miles / monthâ measure :P 16:28:07 <fonsinchen> Actually the link capacity may temporarily fall below that minimum value. It will just be restored to the minimum whenever a ship loads or the link is about to be dropped. 16:28:49 *** Pereba [~UserNick@177.17.20.223] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:29:06 *** Pereba [~UserNick@177.17.20.223] has joined #openttd 16:36:03 *** DanMacK [~0a0a6574@188.cimarosa.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 16:36:07 <DanMacK> Hey all 16:40:41 <Pikka> bonsoir herr MacK 16:46:05 <DanMacK> Hey how goes it? 16:47:30 <Pikka> andy's having trouble with the brakevans in FIRS 16:52:12 <DanMacK> FIRS has brakevans? lol 16:52:20 <Pikka> apparently 16:56:17 *** efess [~Efess@c-50-169-48-221.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 17:01:36 *** Brumi [~quassel@78-131-41-191.pool.digikabel.hu] has quit [] 17:02:14 *** Brumi [~quassel@78-131-41-191.pool.digikabel.hu] has joined #openttd 17:19:11 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 17:39:21 *** ABCRic [~ABCRic@a79-169-2-218.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Quit: Herp derp] 17:42:13 <frosch123> http://devs.openttd.org/~frosch/whatnow.png <- hmm 17:43:09 <frosch123> i don't think it can manage that for 4096 17:45:21 <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r26478 /trunk/src/lang (czech.txt serbian.txt) (2014-04-21 17:45:13 UTC) 17:45:22 <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 17:45:23 <DorpsGek> czech - 4 changes by djst 17:45:24 <DorpsGek> serbian - 2 changes by ivan_mile 17:47:17 *** kais58|AFK is now known as kais58__ 17:47:32 *** luaduck_zzz is now known as luaduck 17:50:01 <Phreeze> frosch123 still playing that game !? 17:50:09 <Phreeze> at least play the boobs version ;) 17:50:23 <frosch123> not "still", i only started now 17:50:41 <frosch123> blame eddi 17:51:24 <frosch123> but now that i know about how it works, i consider most of the results of google image search fake 17:51:29 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@76.178.136.186] has joined #openttd 17:54:09 <__ln__> https://scontent-b-fra.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/l/t1.0-9/1011799_799027256784954_2968978455914325637_n.jpg 17:55:56 <peter1139> - authchunks = malloc(sockopt_len); 17:55:58 <peter1139> - memset(authchunks, 0, sizeof(sockopt_len)); 17:56:04 <peter1139> I'm glad nobody uses that software. 17:56:35 <frosch123> :) 17:56:57 <__ln__> peter1139: is that openssl? 17:57:02 <peter1139> Yes. 17:57:12 <frosch123> really? 17:57:38 <frosch123> i just wanted to make a joke about proper api usage and using calloc to prevent that 17:58:08 <peter1139> + authchunks = calloc(1, sockopt_len); 17:58:10 <peter1139> funnily enough... 17:59:44 <Phreeze> that facebook pic is nice ;) 17:59:51 <Phreeze> saw it on "i fucking love science"-FBpage 18:01:13 <frosch123> hmm, how does a search for "openssl bashing" not result in anything 18:02:19 <peter1139> http://opensslrampage.org/ 18:04:33 <frosch123> sounds like ottd 18:04:54 <frosch123> "Short answer - send diffs, expect criticism - not because you suck but because all diffs get criticism. If you can't handle it and improve, don't post." 18:05:21 <peter1139> Yeah 18:09:38 <Phreeze> need one way signs for rails, without being them a signal (aka: point where the train stops) 18:09:55 <Phreeze> (or waypoints...) 18:10:32 *** SkeedR [~SkeedR@cpc4-wolv15-2-0-cust60.wolv.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 18:11:06 *** SkeedR is now known as Guest7114 18:11:09 *** jjavaholic [~jjavaholi@grahamg63.plus.com] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 18:11:19 *** DanMacK [~0a0a6574@188.cimarosa.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:18:02 *** Guest7114 is now known as SkeedR 18:18:10 *** SkeedR [~SkeedR@cpc4-wolv15-2-0-cust60.wolv.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:18:14 *** SkeedR [~SkeedR@cpc4-wolv15-2-0-cust60.wolv.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 18:18:46 *** SkeedR is now known as Guest7115 18:20:40 <__ln__> http://www.tedunangst.com/flak/post/analysis-of-openssl-freelist-reuse 18:23:43 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 18:24:11 <Wolf01> hello o/ 18:24:36 <Phreeze> hi 18:25:27 *** Guest7115 is now known as SkeedR 18:31:12 <DorpsGek> Commit by rubidium :: r26479 trunk/src/stringfilter.cpp (2014-04-21 18:31:06 UTC) 18:31:13 <DorpsGek> -Codechange: use MallocT instead of malloc 18:33:20 <__ln__> .... openttd goes openssl? 18:33:49 <frosch123> no, we are switching to cvs 18:35:17 <DorpsGek> Commit by rubidium :: r26480 trunk/src/stringfilter.cpp (2014-04-21 18:35:12 UTC) 18:35:18 <DorpsGek> -Fix (r26479): forgot to remove a * 18:38:49 <planetmaker> good evening 18:39:22 <frosch123> hola pm 18:39:54 <__ln__> solamente inglés 18:40:06 *** DanMacK [~0a0a6574@188.cimarosa.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 18:46:46 *** glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 18:46:49 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 18:48:25 <Phreeze> playa del ingles 18:48:46 *** efess [~Efess@c-50-169-48-221.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 18:52:01 *** henrikhodne [henrikhodn@virgule.cluenet.org] has joined #openttd 18:53:01 <henrikhodne> Hey, I'm running OpenTTD 1.4.0 on OS X and I don't seem to be able to build any buses or trucks anymore, even though there are some listed in "Available Road Vehicles". Any ideas? 18:53:54 <Phreeze> did you build normal roads ? 18:53:57 <Phreeze> ROAD depot ? 18:54:23 <glx> looks like the usual click on the main list but not on depot list 19:03:31 <henrikhodne> Yeah, it's a road depot. I built buses in it eariler in the game. 19:07:02 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@76.178.136.186] has quit [Quit: Valete omnes] 19:07:12 <Brumi> is the list empty when you click 'buy vehicles' from the road depot? 19:07:19 <henrikhodne> Yes, it is. 19:07:32 <Wolf01> sounds like your vehicles become obsolete, which year it is? 19:07:40 <henrikhodne> 2117 19:08:05 <Brumi> what vehicles show up in the 'available road vehicles' window? 19:08:15 <Brumi> tell a few examples 19:08:35 <henrikhodne> Oh, duh, they are all Trams -_- 19:08:45 <henrikhodne> The window was too narrow, so I didn't realise. 19:08:48 <Brumi> that's what I was suspecting 19:09:03 <Brumi> you can bring back the old vehicle 19:09:04 <Brumi> s 19:09:17 <Brumi> if you go to the advanced settings 19:09:29 <Brumi> in game, not from the main menu 19:09:54 <Brumi> then set Vehicles / Vehicles never expire to 'on' 19:10:05 <Brumi> then open the console 19:10:16 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:10:20 <Brumi> by pressing the button left to the '1' button on your keyboard 19:10:27 <Brumi> and type 'resetenginges' 19:10:41 <Brumi> resetengines* 19:11:09 <henrikhodne> Awesome, thanks. 19:11:10 <Brumi> that way you'll have all vehicles available again, no matter how old they are 19:12:54 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 19:18:26 <henrikhodne> I also seem to have messed up my signaling or something. I have a train that goes up to a junction, stops and backs up to the closest signal. 19:20:15 <henrikhodne> Ah, looks like it's working again. 19:20:23 <frosch123> missing electification? 19:21:24 <henrikhodne> Ahhh, yes. 19:28:07 <andythenorth> FFS 19:28:18 <andythenorth> if you donât want people stopping vehicles on your infrastructure 19:28:26 <andythenorth> then donât apply infrastructure sharing patch 19:28:50 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:28:55 <Taede> also dont build roads 19:30:45 <andythenorth> seems completely stupid, complaining about patches that arenât part of trunk anyway 19:31:11 *** Progman_ [~progman@p57A180ED.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 19:34:05 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1AB97.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:34:15 *** Progman_ is now known as Progman 19:34:34 <andythenorth> fonsinchen: in the case discussed earlier, reducing the train capacity has caused the amount assigned for that route to reduce 19:34:42 <andythenorth> the ship amount remains static 19:34:59 <andythenorth> expected result? 19:35:05 <fonsinchen> I guess so. 19:35:16 <andythenorth> so if I want more assigned to the ship route, add ships? 19:35:22 <andythenorth> even though 2 are waiting, empty? 19:35:23 <fonsinchen> The waybill dispatchment is supposed to adapt to your capacities 19:35:38 <andythenorth> emergent behaviour :) 19:35:55 <fonsinchen> Where did the cargo go if it didn't take the trains? 19:36:22 <fonsinchen> There is a certain delay between planning and execution ... 19:36:42 <andythenorth> I canât relate the amount produced by industry with the amount planned by station 19:37:01 <fonsinchen> Well, before more cargo was taking the trains, right? 19:37:05 <andythenorth> yes 19:37:12 <andythenorth> now the total amount of cargo is reduced 19:37:18 <andythenorth> Iâll ffwd a bit 19:37:22 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 19:37:25 <fonsinchen> If still the same amount of cargo is being produced it must be going somewhere else 19:38:12 <andythenorth> âMonthly supplyâ - the unit is same as cargo unit? 19:38:23 <andythenorth> looks same 19:38:30 <fonsinchen> yes 19:38:43 <andythenorth> ok so I have 80 crates supplied / month 19:38:52 <andythenorth> how far ahead does âplannedâ look? 19:39:05 <fonsinchen> That's not much for two ships of the usual capacity. 19:39:14 <fonsinchen> How big are the ships? 19:39:28 <andythenorth> 55t each 19:39:29 <fonsinchen> It looks until next recalculation of link graph. 19:40:20 <andythenorth> Iâll add more ships and see what it does 19:40:25 *** KenjiE20 [kenjie20@irc.blinkenshell.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:40:31 <andythenorth> hmm 19:40:36 <andythenorth> the capacity is measured, not calculated? 19:40:56 <fonsinchen> Then if only the ships serve the route they have to wait 20 days each until they fill up - in case they get all 80 crates 19:41:43 *** KenjiE20 [kenjie20@46.246.119.109] has joined #openttd 19:41:44 <fonsinchen> Well, OK, that's not counting how long it takes them to travel, which usually is significant for ships 19:41:44 <andythenorth> Iâll stop the trains and see what the calculation does 19:41:57 <andythenorth> Iâm wondering if the travel time means capacity = min 19:42:05 <fonsinchen> What does the result look like? Where is the cargo actually going? 19:42:39 <fonsinchen> As long as they're both only waiting for cargo, the capacity will be estimated at 55t per month 19:42:50 <fonsinchen> that means the trains will get the remaining 25t, yes. 19:43:04 <fonsinchen> (at least) 19:43:48 *** George is now known as Guest7120 19:43:50 *** George [~George@185.43.94.91] has joined #openttd 19:45:30 <fonsinchen> In general the link capacity is measured. However, if not enough samples can be collected for whatever reason it's estimated as the cargo capacity of the largest consist serving the link. 19:48:59 <andythenorth> so the ratio is currently 4:41 for ships:trains 19:49:17 <andythenorth> I have tried more ships, and fewer trains :) 19:50:15 *** Guest7120 [~George@185.43.94.91] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:52:39 <fonsinchen> Can you upload the savegame somewhere? 19:53:07 <andythenorth> yup 19:53:16 <andythenorth> just replacing the ships with trains to see what that does 19:53:42 *** Alberth [~hat@2001:981:c6c5:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has left #openttd [] 19:54:07 <andythenorth> nothing noticeable 19:55:19 <fonsinchen> It could also be that the train route is just shorter 19:55:42 <fonsinchen> Given enough capacity on both sides it will prefer shorter routes 19:56:48 <andythenorth> fonsinchen: https://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/6016/cdist%20waybill%20test.zip 19:56:53 <andythenorth> if I forgot any grfs, ping me 19:57:07 <andythenorth> Puddleton Port is the interesting station 19:57:15 <fonsinchen> Thank you. I'll check it right away 19:58:12 <andythenorth> could be EAndythenorth 19:58:26 *** oskari89 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 20:02:09 <fonsinchen> Well, the sandbank is closer than the pit 20:02:28 <fonsinchen> But the difference in amounts is pretty large for that 20:04:20 <andythenorth> some setting? 20:04:26 <andythenorth> I did check I applied the patch :P 20:04:32 <andythenorth> that was my first concern :P 20:04:58 <fonsinchen> The settings look OK. 20:06:09 <fonsinchen> That's quite interesting. I'll give it a closer examination 20:08:33 * andythenorth always breaks things ;) 20:12:00 *** pthagnar [~pthagnar@cpc7-pres17-2-0-cust28.18-3.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 20:17:09 <fonsinchen> It already fails when calculating the demand. It's 40:712 there (before scaling) 20:19:03 <andythenorth> is that based on tiles? 20:20:21 <fonsinchen> ES is cargo id 24, right? 20:20:30 * andythenorth looks 20:20:54 <andythenorth> fonsinchen: yes http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/push/LATEST/docs/html/code_reference.html#cargos 20:24:45 <fonsinchen> Ah, tile demands! 20:25:48 <andythenorth> dredging site is single tile 20:27:49 <fonsinchen> The other one has 17 tiles 20:27:55 <fonsinchen> That's the difference 20:28:43 <andythenorth> I am -1 to tile-based demands :) 20:28:45 <andythenorth> for industries 20:28:49 <andythenorth> might make sense for houses 20:30:36 <fonsinchen> I see. That's a separate fix, though. Maybe ignore it for now. 20:31:23 <andythenorth> so the dispatcher is probably correct, just the demand is wrong 20:31:40 <fonsinchen> yes 20:31:45 <andythenorth> when I adjusted capacity on the trains, the dispatcher did the right thing afaict 20:32:06 <fonsinchen> The dispatcher will only ignore the demands if it cannot satisfy them 20:32:31 <fonsinchen> If you have enough capacity everywhere it behaves just like asymmetric distribution. 20:34:53 <andythenorth> Iâll keep playing 20:35:02 <Phreeze> my openttd is weird...when i move the screen with the right mousebutton, it sometimes accelerates like a fool 20:41:51 <frosch123> night 20:41:54 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d0121b1.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: be yourself, except: if you have the opportunity to be a unicorn, then be a unicorn] 20:54:01 *** LSky [~LSky@5ED4B2EA.cm-7-5c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:56:05 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:56:28 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 21:10:43 <Phreeze> tram invasion ! 21:10:47 <Phreeze> thx to cargodist^^ 21:19:54 <andythenorth> fonsinchen: transfer orders are unhelpful with cdist? 21:20:04 <andythenorth> not required? 21:20:23 <fonsinchen> You can use them, cargodist will try to figure out what to do. 21:20:47 <fonsinchen> They aren't required, of course. 21:21:18 <fonsinchen> There are some cases where you want some sort of "leave empty" order to suppress the creation of the following link 21:21:36 <andythenorth> thanks 21:22:00 <andythenorth> turned on cdist existing gameâŠremoving outdated orders 21:31:26 <Phreeze> cdist is cool 21:36:59 *** Phreeze [~p@vodsl-4721.vo.lu] has quit [] 21:37:49 *** Progman [~progman@p57A180ED.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:45:46 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 21:46:02 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@s55978e11.adsl.online.nl] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:48:18 *** efess [~Efess@c-50-169-48-221.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:52:29 *** Aristide [~quassel@2a01:e35:2eb9:64b0:1e4b:d6ff:feca:6b69] has joined #openttd 21:59:19 *** jjavaholic [~jjavaholi@grahamg63.plus.com] has joined #openttd 22:00:30 *** Aristide [~quassel@2a01:e35:2eb9:64b0:1e4b:d6ff:feca:6b69] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:05:57 *** SkeedR [~SkeedR@cpc4-wolv15-2-0-cust60.wolv.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:08:21 *** Brumi [~quassel@78-131-41-191.pool.digikabel.hu] has quit [] 22:09:10 *** Devroush [~dennis@dd5765bac.access.telenet.be] has quit [] 22:12:29 *** Aristide [~quassel@2a01:e35:2eb9:64b0:1e4b:d6ff:feca:6b69] has joined #openttd 22:13:27 *** retro|cz [~retro@ip-89-176-82-80.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:24:50 *** Natio [~Natio@x1-6-e0-46-9a-98-35-7a.cpe.webspeed.dk] has joined #openttd 22:26:37 *** Natio [~Natio@x1-6-e0-46-9a-98-35-7a.cpe.webspeed.dk] has quit [] 22:31:06 <Wolf01> 'night 22:31:12 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 22:35:38 *** gelignite [~gelignite@i528C3D4A.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: http://bit.ly/nkczDT] 22:53:58 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:01:58 *** DanMacK [~0a0a6574@188.cimarosa.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 23:21:44 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 23:22:00 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [] 23:40:27 *** efess [~Efess@c-50-169-48-221.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 23:45:35 *** yorick [~yorick@ip51cd0513.speed.planet.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]