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Log for #openttd on 17th January 2015:
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04:42:42  <supermop> ive been manually drawing rivers and correcting valleys on this heightmap for 3 days
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06:10:22  <mgrunin> what a loser
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06:54:12  <andythenorth> o/
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07:35:34  <supermop> yo
07:39:16  <andythenorth> lo
08:02:16  <andythenorth> ugh
08:02:19  <andythenorth> also ugh
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08:36:04  <andythenorth> moin Alberth
08:36:11  <Alberth> moin
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08:52:15  <Alberth> firs shuffles :)
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08:58:31  <andythenorth> yair
08:58:41  <andythenorth> got inspired to work on it again
08:58:43  <andythenorth> due to BB
08:58:52  <Alberth> :)
09:01:17  <Alberth> unfortunately, I seem to have lost inspiration, currently
09:03:05  <andythenorth> it comes, it goes
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09:03:50  <Alberth> yeah, in this case it got killed by troubles at work
09:05:10  * andythenorth has not troubles at work this week, but definitely stuff that needs doing, 10-12 hours / day
09:05:29  <andythenorth> BB is the kind of thing to let cook for a while anyway
09:06:51  <andythenorth> last FIRS release was 2013
09:06:59  <andythenorth> there’s 1 year of lang updates I should ship :P
09:09:47  <Supercheese> err, could you wait just a bit
09:09:54  <Supercheese> I am working on the Latin translation as we speak (type)
09:11:00  <andythenorth> it won’t ship today
09:11:11  <andythenorth> got a bug I have to try and fix (bulk terminals are stupidly hard to build)
09:11:27  <Supercheese> too... bulky, perhaps :P
09:12:26  <andythenorth> 3 industries: you can tell these apart now, right? http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/7020/harbours_compared.png
09:12:36  <andythenorth> previously the port and fishing harbour used same buildings
09:12:37  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: you went to the ECS-tourist-center-school-of-placement-rules?
09:13:19  <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: I made some kind of...error
09:13:30  <andythenorth> I think over-use of magic tile 255, probably
09:13:36  <andythenorth> otherwise I’m stumped
09:15:21  <Alberth> harbours look good to me
09:15:46  <V453000> omg moar sea stuff? :D
09:16:20  <andythenorth> not new
09:16:26  <andythenorth> V453000: fixing Full FIRS economy
09:16:33  <andythenorth> by CHEATING
09:16:37  <V453000> XD
09:16:42  <andythenorth> oops, child #2 pressed caps lock
09:16:59  <Eddi|zuHause> yeah. sure. let's go with that :p
09:17:02  <andythenorth> I’ve added port + bulk terminal
09:17:44  <andythenorth> adds alternative source of ENSP and FMSP
09:17:52  <andythenorth> should break the dominance of metal / oil chains
09:18:06  <andythenorth> and incentivises farms, non-ENSP secondary cargos
09:18:35  <Supercheese> moar industries to full economy?
09:18:59  <andythenorth> yes
09:19:11  <andythenorth> flattens everything out a bit
09:19:16  <andythenorth> some people will hate it, but eh
09:19:22  <andythenorth> they can use 1.3.0
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09:19:35  <Supercheese> "some people will hate it" is valid for any change whatsoever
09:20:41  * andythenorth -> children, football
09:20:42  <andythenorth> bbl
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09:40:41  <Wolf01> hello o/
09:50:12  *** Pikka [~Octomom@d58-106-59-198.rdl801.qld.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd
09:51:57  <Pikka> busy bee!
09:58:41  <Alberth> hi hi
09:58:55  <Pikka> moin alberth
09:59:24  <krinn> hi
09:59:29  <Wolf01> hi pikka
09:59:41  <Pikka> hello
09:59:53  <V453000> HEYOO
10:00:06  <Pikka> BONSOIR
10:00:37  <Pikka> how is everyone this thing?
10:00:41  <krinn> Pikka, bonjour : bonsoir is when daylight goes off
10:00:54  <Pikka> true that, but it is 8pm
10:01:20  <krinn> erf, wonder when english will use 24hours, it piss me off always the am/pm
10:01:26  <Wolf01> your silly side of the world
10:01:34  <Pikka> 2000 then
10:01:41  <krinn> just like metric system, should have use it for years
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10:03:02  <krinn> do military use am/pm too or are more sane and goes with 24h?
10:08:08  <krinn> is there any plant to get that IsMultihead function for the AI API soon, it is odd to work without it
10:09:20  <Pikka> how would it be useful for the AI?
10:09:40  <V453000> Pikka working on landscape yet? :P
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10:10:06  <krinn> pikka: do know how many engine a train have in it
10:10:06  <Pikka> V - started work on a tram
10:10:11  <V453000> =D
10:11:01  <krinn> you can ask if engine is not a wagon, so a loco, but you can't know if the two locos you found are one multihead or two of the same type
10:12:27  <Pikka> v: moving house this week so that's taking a bit of time :) also a few other things...
10:12:36  <V453000> oh :)
10:12:50  <V453000> I might have landscape ~soon :P
10:12:58  <Pikka> I saw the screenshots
10:13:19  <V453000> well it looks majorly different already :D
10:14:09  <Wolf01> moving house? http://www.housemovechecklist.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/moving-house.jpg
10:15:02  <Pikka> exactly
10:15:34  <Pikka> it's a fairly common procedure in australia, our houses are on stilts and made of wood so they're easy to move. :)
10:17:25  <Wolf01> you should think about adding legs and cannons, then http://film110.pbworks.com/f/1260336766/howlscastle.jpg
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10:53:02  <V453000> woot when you download new notepad++ it writes down a je suis charlie message =D
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10:54:24  <Pikka> andythenorth, busy bee!
10:54:32  <andythenorth> lo Pikka
10:54:44  <andythenorth> Pikka!
10:54:50  <andythenorth> where has pikka been? o_O
10:55:00  <Pikka> moving house next week
10:55:33  <Pikka> also http://www.gayledallaston.com/
10:55:59  <andythenorth> busy busy
10:56:16  <Pikka> very
10:56:43  <andythenorth> no mobile games yet? o_O
10:56:52  <Pikka> nope
10:57:05  <Pikka> been working on a 32bpp steam tram though :)
10:57:10  <andythenorth> :)
10:57:15  <andythenorth> so Busy Bee
10:57:25  <Pikka> trying it for the first time now
10:57:25  <andythenorth> the GS for people who mostly want a sandbox
10:57:38  <V453000> we want pictures of the tram
10:57:50  <andythenorth> it is definitely ‘throw a GS at the wall, see what sticks’ ;)
10:58:30  <Alberth> :D
11:03:45  * andythenorth has ideas for GS
11:03:52  <andythenorth> but not doing them right now
11:03:59  * andythenorth making FIRS less bad
11:05:08  <V453000> moar pixulz! :D
11:08:22  <Pikka> http://i.imgur.com/ks2nuKl.png such as it is so far. :P
11:09:19  <V453000> :0
11:09:23  <V453000> wtftram
11:09:30  <V453000> more like train =D
11:10:20  <Pikka> very tiny train
11:10:29  <V453000> :)
11:10:32  <Pikka> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aG6Nf1P7BHE
11:11:18  <Pikka> too tiny for 1x pixels really ;)
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11:14:28  <V453000> everything needs x4
11:14:43  <V453000> omg it has a real counterpart =D
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11:24:00  <andythenorth> much realisms
11:24:47  <Pikka> slightly
11:25:03  <peter1138> That tram sounds diesel...
11:25:16  <peter1138> But that might've been a nearby bus :p
11:25:33  <Pikka> they're diesel powered replicas :P
11:25:46  <peter1138> I was right!
11:25:49  <peter1138> So... er... why?
11:27:19  <peter1138> Causes lots of pointless queues.
11:27:23  <peter1138> Lol @ turning around.
11:27:27  <Pikka> why diesel powered replicas? because they're a tourist attraction. the original steam trams were mentioned in a very popular japanese novel.
11:27:35  <Pikka> I know, self-contained turntable. pretty cool. ;)
11:27:49  <peter1138> That poor regular tram behind it, stuck for hours!
11:28:24  <andythenorth> Pikka: which novel?
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11:28:50  <Pikka> botchan
11:28:58  <Pikka> and so the trams are known as botchan ressha
11:29:43  <Pikka> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Botchan_Ressha
11:31:36  <andythenorth> ho
11:31:46  <andythenorth> I just read Kokoro http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kokoro
11:31:51  <andythenorth> maybe I should read Botchan next
11:32:00  <peter1138> Love the tiny little platforms in the middle of the road... I can't imagine that being allowed here...
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11:35:00  <Flygon> peter1138: They exist in Australia
11:35:38  <Flygon> The platforms
11:35:59  <Pikka> I keep meaning to read botchan, never quite get around to it
11:36:17  <Pikka> especially since I've been to matsuyama (and ridden on the trains :))
11:37:59  <andythenorth> Pikka: any comments on BB then?
11:39:10  <Pikka> seems pretty good to me. :)
11:39:21  <Pikka> from a sandboxy, non-competitive point of view.
11:39:56  <Pikka> perhaps a counter of completed and expired tasks would be nice, for those who like to challenge themselves?
11:40:19  <andythenorth> probably the story book
11:40:30  <Pikka> is it already there?
11:40:31  <Pikka> I didn't look
11:40:42  <krinn> or gives a static amount of money when a goal is done, even none really needs the money, it gave a motivation to do the goal (like subsidies)
11:40:53  <andythenorth> story book not handled yet
11:41:02  <Pikka> I see
11:42:19  <andythenorth> we’ve considered money reward for goal
11:42:26  <andythenorth> I think it’s interesting to not have it
11:43:43  <Pikka> just a "point" for completion would be enough
11:43:45  <andythenorth> a counter of goals completed
11:43:50  <Pikka> yes
11:43:53  <andythenorth> means you’re doing it just ftw
11:43:55  <andythenorth> which is nice
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12:05:59  <andythenorth> so is FIRS Latin done? o_O
12:06:04  <andythenorth> my bug was easier to fix than I though
12:06:08  <andythenorth> thought *
12:06:14  <andythenorth> any other translations to go in?
12:06:20  <andythenorth> who knows when next FIRS will be
12:06:58  <andythenorth> after 1.4.0, might be another year :P
12:24:00  <andythenorth> Pikka: wot, you broke my tram? o_O
12:27:11  <Pikka> "oops"?
12:27:37  <Pikka> yes, fitted to farm supplies it would not load, I didn't try it fitted to anything else. :) the older tram works fine.
12:27:53  <andythenorth> bloody trams
12:27:56  <Pikka> the amblecote
12:30:33  * andythenorth will look
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12:36:12  <dreck> hi
12:37:44  <peter1138> Dragons!
12:37:46  <peter1138> Horses!
12:37:47  <peter1138> Boys!
12:37:53  <peter1138> Wait, that sounds wrong :s
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12:43:35  <Wolf01> oh, they found signs on alien life on Mars... wait no, it's just the lost Beagle2 from 2003
12:44:26  <peter1138> Technically it is alien.
12:44:34  <peter1138> We're the aliens.
12:44:59  <shempi> mind blown
12:47:40  <dreck> lol wol01
12:47:45  <dreck> wolf*
12:51:58  <Wolf01> https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?act=url&depth=1&hl=it&ie=UTF8&prev=_t&rurl=translate.google.it&sl=it&tl=en&u=http://bizzarrobazar.com/2015/01/13/il-babbuino-ferroviere/&usg=ALkJrhhJHV0aKU_XrEN-z2NG45dKEN4VDg interesting, we should make a baboon-AI
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13:05:38  <dreck> wolf*
13:05:41  <dreck> er sorry
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13:13:44  <Wolf01> quak
13:13:52  <frosch123> ciao
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13:23:36  <dreck> hi frosch
13:25:17  <andythenorth> quak
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13:28:21  <dreck> so whats everyone doing anyway?
13:28:29  <Wolf01> 9gagging
13:28:53  <dreck> how come?
13:28:58  * NGC3982 is coding.
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13:29:24  <dreck> coding what ngc? :P
13:29:27  <dreck> heh
13:32:28  <NGC3982> A messageparser for NGCone
13:32:42  <NGC3982> Take a look in the the game chat and you'll see.
13:33:10  <dreck> heh ok
13:33:45  *** shirish [~quassel@0001358e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:34:29  <dreck> hope the parser goes well when you finish it ok ngc? :)
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13:36:17  <NGC3982> dreck: Yes. Sorry, but it will take 3-4 minutes before restart, since i need to change a ..thing.
13:36:35  <dreck> its ok take your time :)
13:36:46  <dreck> <has a few websites to look at anyway
13:39:51  <NGC3982> dreck: Server is started. Please note the changes on http://rules.henjoh.se
13:40:57  * andythenorth plugs in to the mains to compile FIRS :P
13:41:49  <dreck> andy..I still like FIRS a lot fyi :)
13:42:38  <__ln___> http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-30863024
13:43:11  <andythenorth> working on FIRS again gives me time to do yoga that I need to do for backache
13:43:18  <andythenorth> maybe glacial compiles are good
13:43:34  <peter1138> NGC3982, "lot's" ... please fix?
13:44:13  *** Hoppe [~oftc-webi@62.61.159.141] has joined #openttd
13:44:19  <Hoppe> helllo
13:45:10  <Hoppe> sorry for asking.. how do u disable fights in the game ?
13:45:25  <peter1138> Fights?
13:45:45  <NGC3982> peter1138: Where?
13:45:46  <andythenorth> crashes?
13:45:54  <peter1138> NGC3982, server 4's title.
13:46:04  <NGC3982> Ah.
13:46:05  <NGC3982> Thanks.
13:46:56  * andythenorth is nostalgic for the days when ‘full animation’ worked on OS X
13:47:12  <Hoppe> @peter1138 Flights
13:47:22  <peter1138> One day I'll find a copy of OS X to see if I can see what the problem is.
13:47:33  <peter1138> Logically... there's no reason for it not to work.
13:47:41  <andythenorth> it’s on my to-do list to send you a DVD
13:47:42  <peter1138> Hoppe, set the max aircraft to 0, I guess.
13:47:42  <andythenorth> or something
13:47:51  <Hoppe> :)
13:48:05  <andythenorth> I think it only affects my self-compiled OTTD, iirc the nightly is fine
13:48:28  <andythenorth> so it’s probably some crap about which SDK I’m linking, or configure options for 8bpp or something else I don’t understand
13:51:48  <NGC3982> Hoppe: Do you know how to use the console in OpenTTD?
13:52:09  <Hoppe> yes
13:52:38  <NGC3982> Hoppe: And you want to disable aircraft in a single-player game?
13:53:19  <andythenorth> fixed another harbour industry (the left-most one) http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/7021/harbours_compared_2.png
13:53:25  <andythenorth> they all look different enough now?
13:53:27  <andythenorth> and not crap?
13:54:34  <Hoppe> ngc3982 a friend set up a server for me in germany so me and a friend can play togeather
13:55:28  <Alberth> andy, a bit full?
13:55:38  <NGC3982> Hoppe: I see. The owner of the server (or you with the owners permission) can change configuration parameters with rcon. You open console, and do 'rcon password "set max_aircraft 0"', without the '.
13:55:50  <NGC3982> Hoppe: The rcon password can be provided by the person who owns or started the server.
13:56:13  <Hoppe> i will try,, i have the password
13:56:54  <andythenorth> Alberth: ?
13:57:12  <Alberth> every tile of the harbour has a house or crane or ..
13:58:22  <Hoppe> NGC3982 Thanx alot my friend :D
13:58:23  <Alberth> no place to dump cargo from the ship :p
13:58:32  <NGC3982> Hoppe: :-).
13:59:28  <andythenorth> Alberth: yeah I filled the empty tiles
13:59:32  <andythenorth> maybe that was unwise
13:59:35  <andythenorth> I thought they looked odd
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14:08:50  <Hoppe> 'NGC3982 is there a webpage where i can see all the Settings command +
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14:15:07  <andythenorth> planetmaker: any idea about this FIRS bug? o_O http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/6992
14:15:14  * andythenorth has no idea
14:15:39  <V453000> votes on how fat should a road be?
14:15:50  <V453000> assuming 10mx10m is a  tile
14:15:54  <V453000> 5m is probably too thin
14:15:58  <V453000> something like 6-7?
14:19:28  <peter1138> Depends on the type of road... 4.5-7.5m...
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14:32:14  <krinn> i'm crazy but we don't have a steel wagon in stock openttd?
14:33:28  <frosch123> we do, you are crazy :)
14:34:35  <krinn> just start a new game to make sure: no steel wagon while i have SH40 already
14:36:39  <krinn> wow found it: with opengfx industries, i don't have the steel wagon
14:37:08  <krinn> (earlier i said "stock openttd" because i didn't think opengfx industries could alter vehicle)
14:37:27  <Wolf01> bad feature
14:39:07  <NGC3982> Is there a way to increase terraforming cost without a mod?
14:40:08  <frosch123> andythenorth: i vote for nml bug
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14:42:59  <michi_cc> NGC3982: Basecost NewGRF, or is that already a mod for you?
14:43:32  <krinn> pfff it sucks to update 100m of content with a connection as good as with a 56k modem
14:45:35  <andythenorth> frosch123: really? o_O
14:46:20  <NGC3982> michi_cc: Oh, it's a NewGRF? I see.
14:46:48  <frosch123> andythenorth: no, actually ottd bug
14:48:22  <krinn> ok, update to ogfx+industries 0.3.5 still no steel wagon with it...
14:48:29  <krinn> can someone check it miss it too?
14:51:28  <frosch123> andythenorth: https://paste.openttdcoop.org/psj9ajiax?/psj9ajiax
14:52:53  <frosch123> andythenorth: anyway, firs breaks toyland completely, doesn't it?
14:52:58  <frosch123> it even crashed ottd
14:54:09  <frosch123> does it disable all cargos including pax and mail or something?
14:55:15  <frosch123> andythenorth: yeah, starting a toyland game with firs 1.3.0 results in industries, but no cargos
14:55:17  <krinn> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/6878 (looks really strange, anyway i have my answer)
14:56:06  <frosch123> and ottd crashes if all railtypes are disabled because all vehicles are disabled or something
14:57:24  <frosch123> apparently ottd even disables the default engines which carry no cargo, if pax is disabled :p
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15:00:06  <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r27119 trunk/src/newgrf.cpp (2015-01-17 15:00:02 UTC)
15:00:07  <DorpsGek> -Fix: Action 7/9 condition 0A failed for present, but disabled, NewGRF.
15:00:42  <andythenorth> how rare :)
15:03:21  <frosch123> still, firs is broken in toyland, so disabled firs was actually better :p
15:04:58  <andythenorth> I should probably just allow it in toyland
15:05:01  <andythenorth> dumb restrictions
15:05:05  <V453000> peter1138: openttd road, not real road :P
15:06:34  <V453000> lets go with 6m
15:06:39  <V453000> 60% of a tile sounds fine enough
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15:54:58  <frosch123> hmm, i added a visualisation for "focussed window"
15:55:17  <frosch123> but it mainly shows how bonkers the focus changes in ottd :p
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15:57:54  <Flygon> http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/man-fined-for-driving-esky-on-footpath-20150117-12sjpq.html
15:58:00  <Flygon> I demand Esky NewGRF
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16:35:07  <alluke> how to get those lines onto the map? http://media.openttd.org/images/screens/1.4/cargodist.png
16:35:43  <frosch123> map toolbar dropdown
16:36:04  <frosch123> i.e. hold mouse button on the smallmap button in the toolbar
16:36:26  <frosch123> about half of the buttons have a dropdown :p
16:38:50  <andythenorth> how interesting
16:39:33  <andythenorth> supply + demand view would be interesting
16:39:46  <frosch123> nope
16:40:12  <frosch123> you would need a limitation on how far the lines go
16:40:27  <frosch123> else every ore mine is connected to every steel mill
16:40:31  <frosch123> which is pretty useless
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16:41:51  <andythenorth> I was thinking of rectangles or triangles rather lines
16:41:54  <andythenorth> than *
16:42:03  <andythenorth> upward triangle = supply
16:42:07  <andythenorth> downwad = demand
16:42:13  <andythenorth> downward *
16:42:39  <frosch123> no idea where you would want to display them
16:43:09  <frosch123> you mean select cargo in smallmap and then highlight industries with triangles instead of rectangles?
16:43:29  <frosch123> (i mean select cargo in cargo flow window)
16:43:38  <frosch123> s/flow/chain/
16:44:01  <andythenorth> I would draw them right on the map
16:44:06  <andythenorth> :P
16:44:20  <frosch123> based on what?
16:46:27  <alluke> thanks
16:49:56  <andythenorth> frosch123: no idea, this is not a well-formed plan :D
16:50:21  <andythenorth> by supply + demand, I just mean provide / accept
16:50:46  <andythenorth> it’s probably bad
16:51:21  <frosch123> well, make a patch to draw lines for the closest provider p
16:51:33  <frosch123> but not sure anyone would use it :p
16:52:21  <frosch123> or draw cargo icons as overlay over the industry, and draw the lines when hovering the icons :p
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16:57:48  <Alberth> build busy bee into openttd :p   (it does closest supplier calculations)
16:58:47  <frosch123> oh, make the whole map foggy and only reveal the industries you have goals for?
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17:00:14  <andythenorth> fog of war!
17:00:19  <andythenorth> my liege
17:00:21  <Alberth> gradual disclosure of the map :)
17:00:35  <andythenorth> I kind of had that in mind for a GS somehow
17:00:41  <andythenorth> at least, unlocking the map
17:00:46  <andythenorth> can we obscure the map?
17:00:50  <andythenorth> all we have to do is draw black :P
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17:01:14  <frosch123> i always disable fog-of-war if possibly
17:01:15  <andythenorth> let GS control it by tile co-ordinates
17:01:19  <frosch123> e.g. in widelands
17:01:27  <andythenorth> I only saw it in Warcraft 1
17:01:33  <andythenorth> where it was perfect
17:01:44  <andythenorth> can imagine it being annoying in other games
17:01:47  <frosch123> not seeing other units is fine, but not seeing the map is stupid
17:01:56  <frosch123> esp. if you play the same map multiple times
17:02:25  <frosch123> then you don't see what you could know anyway
17:02:36  <Alberth> you can do terraforming, build cities and build industries, so you could make a GS that "releases" a part by building it all?
17:02:42  <andythenorth> I think warcraft maps were procedural
17:02:52  <andythenorth> Alberth: yes, that’s what I have in mind
17:03:01  <andythenorth> something like ‘Build the West’ or whatever
17:03:03  <frosch123> oh, make the whole map water, and make the gs add land over time? :p
17:03:07  <andythenorth> you start on one side of the map
17:03:18  <andythenorth> after completing goals, the game starts adding cities in the interior
17:03:19  <V453000> lol that sounds fun
17:03:23  <V453000> frosch
17:03:30  <andythenorth> or delete land
17:03:33  <andythenorth> never-ending story
17:03:42  <andythenorth> weird film
17:03:50  <Alberth> weird book :)
17:04:28  <andythenorth> bah, over a year ago, someone diagnosed the cause of this issue http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/6667
17:04:37  <andythenorth> but I don’t remember, and didn’t write it down
17:04:52  <andythenorth> probably the graphics chain needs random bits in it somewhere?
17:06:31  <frosch123> andythenorth: does it belong to 6899?
17:06:39  <frosch123> though 6899 is newer than 6667
17:07:11  <Alberth> wouldn't be the first time a ticket is a duplicate of a newer ticket :p
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17:13:43  <andythenorth> they’re related
17:13:58  <andythenorth> if they have common cause then one is a dupe
17:14:10  <andythenorth> they probably have common cause right?
17:14:36  <andythenorth> hmm they’re different issues
17:15:02  <andythenorth> one is during construction, one is after construction
17:15:03  <frosch123> stop trying to solve issues with bureaucracy :p
17:15:13  <andythenorth> best way
17:15:25  <andythenorth> I close so many tickets with bureacracy
17:15:35  <andythenorth> often cheap in the short and long term
17:17:00  <andythenorth> I think my date sensitive spritelayouts must be quite borked
17:17:01  <andythenorth> meh
17:17:32  <frosch123> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/peistqkuh?/peistqkuh <- is that any good? (not code-wise, it's a quick hack; just from a usability pov)
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17:17:47  <frosch123> highlight windows with focus
17:17:59  <frosch123> return focus to parent window when closing
17:18:05  <frosch123> make ESC close the focussed window
17:18:38  <frosch123> and some fixes to focus-stealing, but likely there are more
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17:28:58  <Alberth> I don't remember ever having trouble with focus
17:30:23  <frosch123> i think some hotkeys won't work if you have a tooltip displayed, or when news pop up
17:30:26  <frosch123> stuff like that
17:30:45  <frosch123> it's just more noticeable with the highlighting
17:31:35  * andythenorth wonders how much to obsess about construction states
17:31:37  <andythenorth> probably not a lot
17:33:54  <Alberth> for getting bug reports, seems like a useful notion
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17:40:23  <andythenorth> Pikka: nice sprites in TAI
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17:43:59  <Samu> "The currently used base graphics set is missing a number of sprites..." etc. Is there a development snapshot of the base graphics somewhere?
17:45:04  <Samu> for OpenTTD 1.5.0-beta1, that is
17:45:25  <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r27120 trunk/src/lang/korean.txt (2015-01-17 17:45:21 UTC)
17:45:26  <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
17:45:27  <DorpsGek> korean - 1 changes by telk5093
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17:51:05  <Alberth> Samu: the project page: http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/opengfx
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17:53:49  <Samu> ah, there's a 0.5.1
17:53:58  *** guenstig_werben [~androirc@178-190-53-204.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd
17:54:04  <Samu> http://www.openttd.org/en/download-opengfx it only shows 0.5.0 here, and download content also only shows 0.5.0
17:54:08  <guenstig_werben> Hi
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17:54:21  <Samu> ty for link
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17:56:24  <Alberth> newest release seems  0.5.1
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17:56:37  <andythenorth> Suicyder: you done on FIRS Latin?
17:56:44  <andythenorth> oops sorry wrong highlight :o
17:56:49  <andythenorth> Supercheese: ^^
17:57:17  <Alberth> there are very few people downloading beta versions, I guess the opengfx link gets updated on the real release of 1.5
17:58:54  <andythenorth> hmm
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17:59:07  <andythenorth> is very bad if I don’t credit all the translators in the changelog for FIRS 1.4.0?
17:59:14  <andythenorth> there are lots :|
18:00:33  <frosch123> yeah, we need a script for that :)
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18:00:57  <frosch123> process eints commit messages from a branch into credits
18:01:15  <andythenorth> not a bad idea
18:01:22  <andythenorth> I just need the lang, and the names of the people
18:01:32  <frosch123> we could put that into jenkins and push a credits.txt to bundles
18:01:47  <andythenorth> oh that would make changelogs so much less painful :)
18:01:56  *** MTsPony [~MTsPony@008-086-128-083.dynamic.caiway.nl] has quit []
18:02:00  <andythenorth> I always find all the contributors and consolidate it per language
18:02:09  <frosch123> so do i :p
18:02:15  <frosch123> but it's tedious
18:02:23  <andythenorth> +lots
18:03:08  <frosch123> hmm, let's try something
18:03:15  <Samu> strange, I'm on 0.5.1 opengfx now, and still getting the warning message
18:03:34  *** MTsPony [~MTsPony@008-086-128-083.dynamic.caiway.nl] has joined #openttd
18:03:45  <guenstig_werben> I've got a question
18:04:05  <guenstig_werben> In what language is it written
18:04:12  <frosch123> Samu: http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/opengfx/push/LATEST/
18:04:13  *** lobster [~mccrabbym@94.231.249.233] has joined #openttd
18:04:37  <Alberth> Samu: latest release is 9 months old
18:04:48  <Alberth> guenstig_werben:  c++
18:04:51  <guenstig_werben> In what language is it written
18:05:00  <guenstig_werben> Oh thx
18:05:12  <Alberth> at least the main program :p
18:05:19  <guenstig_werben> So it is possible to build for Mac OS X
18:06:11  <guenstig_werben> If so I would compile it for mac
18:06:11  <Alberth> given that we build that, I'd expect so :)
18:06:22  *** Haube [~Michi@ip25048c11.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
18:06:24  <guenstig_werben> And give it to you
18:06:29  <guenstig_werben> Thx
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18:06:48  <frosch123> that made no sense :)
18:07:04  <Alberth> not really at least :)
18:07:30  * andythenorth goes back to playing ottd on OS X
18:07:41  <andythenorth> actually /me goes back to trolling Lego fans
18:08:09  <Alberth> openttd suggestions not busy enough? :)
18:08:36  <andythenorth> I stopped looking there
18:08:41  <andythenorth> the fun doesn’t last
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18:09:34  * andythenorth ponders
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18:10:23  <andythenorth> guenstig_werben: the compile farm builds for OS X
18:10:26  <andythenorth> just FYI
18:10:27  <guenstig_werben> Pls change the subversion link on homepage/devopement to the new one
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18:11:17  <Samu> got it working
18:12:00  *** MTsPony [~MTsPony@008-086-128-083.dynamic.caiway.nl] has joined #openttd
18:12:16  <Samu> had to go delete the opengfx that came with the installer
18:12:35  <Samu> C:\Program Files\OpenTTD\baseset\opengfx
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18:13:50  <guenstig_werben> If I build for Mac should I build stable or nightly
18:14:23  <guenstig_werben> ?
18:14:43  <glx> we already build both
18:14:51  <guenstig_werben>  for Mac?
18:14:55  <glx> yes
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18:15:09  <guenstig_werben>  where can I download...
18:15:58  <andythenorth> http://www.openttd.org/en/download-stable
18:16:06  <guenstig_werben> Oh got it
18:16:10  <glx> http://www.openttd.org/en/download-stable and http://www.openttd.org/en/download-trunk
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18:16:17  <andythenorth> hrm
18:16:30  <andythenorth> anybody ever played a FIRS Basic economy?  Thinking of changing them a bit
18:16:47  <frosch123> it's the stupid smartphone/table irc client that always quits, right?
18:17:03  <glx> yes
18:17:13  <Alberth> I did andythenorth
18:17:19  <glx> or the user killing it everytime
18:17:35  <andythenorth> I made a boo boo, and forgot to provide a source of Farm Supplies before 1920 or so
18:17:45  <andythenorth> might swap the fertliser plants for bulk terminals
18:17:45  <glx> because I think it should stay connected in background
18:17:52  <andythenorth> fertiliser *
18:18:25  <Alberth> I never play much for supplies until later in the game
18:19:15  <andythenorth> just wondering if too many harbour industries will trip up players
18:19:18  <andythenorth> they’re not very TTD
18:19:32  <andythenorth> nvm
18:19:36  <andythenorth> I’ll try it anyway
18:19:52  <Alberth> they have had a year to get used to them? :)
18:20:41  <Alberth> it's nicely different from land-based industries, in less places where you can find them , and less accessible
18:20:49  <andythenorth> also they make for easy gameplay
18:20:55  <andythenorth> turns out long chains are not so interesting :P
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18:21:16  <Alberth> the only thing that's weird is that you cannot visit a harbour by ship directly
18:21:21  <andythenorth> ha yes
18:21:22  <andythenorth> well
18:21:25  <andythenorth> NewStations :(
18:21:31  <andythenorth> would have fixed that
18:21:53  <Alberth> ok, that must have been before I arrived :)
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18:23:33  <Samu> is double size interface a 1.5.0 feature?
18:23:57  <Samu> needs some work
18:24:02  <Samu> but it's a nice one
18:24:15  <frosch123> what work is needed?
18:24:55  <Samu> the window sizes for example
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18:25:51  <frosch123> yeah, some people try to run 4x zoom-in on 320x200 resolution
18:27:29  <andythenorth> NewStations included industry station tiles
18:27:37  <andythenorth> I have a branch and a newgrf somewhere
18:27:49  <andythenorth> landing helicopters on offshore wind turbines :P
18:27:54  <andythenorth> with no ship route
18:28:01  <Alberth> spiffy
18:28:09  <andythenorth> it was mostly Yexo I think
18:28:18  <andythenorth> in FIRS, you can go helicopter-fishing
18:29:22  <Alberth> I tend to collect fish from several sites before bringing it to a harbour :)
18:29:52  <andythenorth> me too
18:30:05  <andythenorth> helicopters might be optimum for that
18:30:14  <Alberth> never tried that :)
18:30:17  <andythenorth> I should draw a ship with a helipad
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18:30:48  <andythenorth> quite like it when the game does this http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/7022/offshore_bulk.png
18:30:55  <andythenorth> amusing
18:31:11  <Samu> http://i.imgur.com/RpV9asQ.png
18:31:48  <Samu> the map window isn't double-sized
18:31:57  <Samu> the borders that is
18:32:25  <Alberth> haha, off-shore industry :)
18:32:41  <Samu> the message window neither
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18:33:20  <Samu> the bottom bar with date, company name and money size seems off
18:33:33  <Samu> but i like the feature
18:35:28  <frosch123> you can give the map window a custom size
18:35:37  <frosch123> using the dot-button on the window caption
18:35:49  <frosch123> about the news... i guess noone cared :p
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18:39:56  <Samu> another image: https://rupavq.dm2304.livefilestore.com/y2pHMYhrnVWya-RUS4VdOsuEnVedJCkXmp4QAtEy0YmuRq4pn-orAa9itLIngr8x9LJ9FPZ1wDBRAZaFM_NM3C3fXVHPLk3eGRD51qz5xzLkyKZvAgV53B0bk--fym_ARoO2Ywlw6CDVBCL1uRrACiLmQ/double-size%20interface.png?psid=1
18:40:12  <Samu> console text width didn't double
18:40:15  <andythenorth> hmm
18:40:24  <andythenorth> Sub-Arctic, mining cargos: coal or iron ore?
18:40:25  <Samu> news message with (Manager) cut off
18:40:32  <andythenorth> it’s for export, so eh, doesn’t matter to me either way
18:40:49  <andythenorth> Canada has coal, dunno what else.  Scandinavia has that huge iron ore mine
18:42:39  <Alberth> I'd associate oil or methane  with export from sub-arctic :)
18:42:43  <andythenorth> got that already
18:42:48  <Alberth> ah, ok
18:43:31  <andythenorth> I’ll do Iron Ore
18:43:49  <Alberth> yeah, coal is done too much
18:44:00  <Alberth> too often, even
18:44:16  <andythenorth> could have done Nickel or something, but eh it’s just ore
18:44:41  * andythenorth needs to put paper into FIRS
18:46:57  <Alberth> card board :p
18:47:33  <glx> empty boxes for cats :)
18:47:57  <Samu> https://rupavq.dm2304.livefilestore.com/y2pL9OE5DCeHq4_i_Wll2BTLspIcYuIZESsYETA82M_CN37CTt3Iljs4s7Sv8pzCqF_Zo1imeBt3PFZV9IscbBAvzOWp_6G4ryffiz3MtYbQ3quf1LtkCHszOEbMeIwglxRHo34kgLnhbDPgVWfwCr09w/double-size%20interface%202.png?psid=1
18:48:19  <glx> oh nice a hl
18:48:38  <Samu> On that one, the vehicle windows seem really strange
18:48:48  <Samu> it isn't zoomed
18:49:27  <glx> viewports are never zoomed
18:51:11  <Samu> story book and company goals, the income graph... heh, well I like the idea of a double-interface, but it needs some way to keep that "double of everything" perspective in my opinion
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19:20:23  <andythenorth> regression testing via generated docs
19:20:24  <andythenorth> ftw
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19:26:39  <frosch123> we need a central website to manage language descriptions...
19:26:53  <frosch123> some mapping between iso codes, language name, langfile name, ...
19:27:09  <frosch123> it's part of ottd, eints, lang_sync, ... now i need it in the credits generator :ÃŒp
19:28:58  <Alberth> eints has a dict with that information
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19:29:24  <Alberth> copied from openttd, should have a revision listed
19:30:22  <frosch123> yes, and now i copy it again from eints, put it though sed and get a new dict :p
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19:31:19  <Alberth> some form of CSV file or so could be useful
19:31:32  <frosch123> yup, like langs.openttd.org or something
19:32:03  <Alberth> :o an online query ?
19:32:30  <Alberth> oh, json file is simpler
19:33:24  <frosch123> Alberth: something that does not require updating n tools when adding a language to ottd
19:34:20  <Alberth> that would be ideal indeed
19:36:25  <Rubidium> but then your tools won't work without internet
19:37:54  <andythenorth> can’t we just use externals of some kind?
19:38:00  <andythenorth> ‘just’
19:38:03  <andythenorth> externals :(
19:38:15  <andythenorth> and then we have 2 problems
19:39:03  <Alberth> just keep an authorative file somewhere with a version indication, which gets copied into the tool when needed, imho
19:39:15  <Alberth> it's not like we have a new language every week or so :)
19:41:37  <andythenorth> manifest.json
19:41:41  <andythenorth> c+P
19:46:03  <Wolf01> about json, andythenorth how well do you know angular? I'm trying to load a json to populate a chart, but I can't understand how to make the directive to work
19:48:26  <Alberth> alternatively, we can perhaps make a program to parse all openttd language files
19:48:54  <Alberth> (for the meta data)
19:49:30  <Alberth> it would still need encoding to a file though
19:54:24  <andythenorth> Wolf01: I know zilch about angular, other than it was the cool thing of 2013
19:54:47  <andythenorth> “if you’re not using angular your [career | app | company] is dead” etc
19:54:51  <andythenorth> meh
19:54:55  <andythenorth> :)
19:55:22  <Alberth> oh dear, I don't even know it existed :D
19:56:28  <Eddi|zuHause> "how many moons does the earth have"... they have a different answer for that every other season, it seems :p
19:57:14  <Eddi|zuHause> first it was two, then it was five, then it was one, then it was hundreds, and then it was none...
19:57:48  <Alberth> just the debris is a few thousand already, isn't it? :)
19:57:58  <Wolf01> mmmh stupid env variables, I might need to reboot, I'll be back soon
19:58:00  <Rubidium> Eddi|zuHause: that's quite interesting ;)
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19:58:12  <Eddi|zuHause> very much so :p
19:59:21  <Eddi|zuHause> the idea this time was that the earth-moon system may actually be a binary planet
19:59:36  <andythenorth> hrm, deliver grain, get FMSP
19:59:38  <__ln___> https://vine.co/v/OjqeYWWpVWK
19:59:39  <andythenorth> dunno if that’s wise
19:59:41  <andythenorth> but eh
19:59:50  <Alberth> lol :)
19:59:53  <andythenorth> next
19:59:54  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: that sounds the wrong way to make a fedback cargo
20:00:02  <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: you’d think so eh?
20:00:35  <Alberth> just like livestock and grain to the same factory in stock openttd
20:00:44  <frosch123> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pxfvk7htf <- output for firs
20:00:48  <Rubidium> Eddi|zuHause: yeah, but the reasoning behind it doesn't seem iron clad
20:01:01  <andythenorth> frosch123: \o/
20:01:03  <andythenorth> that is awesome
20:01:08  <andythenorth> small things :)
20:01:08  <frosch123> the "Developers" looks busy, if email is included
20:01:39  <frosch123> http://devs.openttd.org/~frosch/gen_credits.py <- uncommented scripts are the best :p
20:02:01  <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: about 15 years ago the theory was that the moon is actually earth-mantle-material that was scraped off when an asteroid with about twice the mass of mars hit the earth
20:02:08  <frosch123> andythenorth: you still need to merge the pre-eints things
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20:02:27  <Eddi|zuHause> that's why the moon has a "depleted core"
20:02:34  <andythenorth> frosch123: self-commenting :P
20:02:55  *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@95.76.27.245] has quit []
20:02:56  <andythenorth> all it needs is a few lines of explanation at the top, you don’t even need a readme :P
20:03:08  <frosch123> parts of it are stolen from busy-bee and eints :)
20:03:55  <frosch123> planetmaker: what do you think on putting that script on jenkins, and make it create a credits.txt to bundles?
20:04:34  <Rubidium> Eddi|zuHause: regardless, the three definitions for a binary/double planet are not iron clad
20:04:58  <Rubidium> each has some problems
20:05:01  <andythenorth> industry chain view \o/
20:05:43  <Eddi|zuHause> __ln___: is that the rocket lander thing?
20:08:31  <andythenorth> ho ho
20:08:39  * andythenorth considers cheese cargo
20:09:58  <__ln___> Eddi|zuHause: that's the one
20:10:03  <Rubidium> Eddi|zuHause: co-accretion (created at the same time) doesn't match the Moon, by centre-of-mass the Moon isn't a binary planet but will become one in a few hundred million years (which is kinda troublesome) and the last definition thinks that some tiny moons of Neptune are binary planets (where the tiny moons are one billionth of the mass of Neptune)
20:10:53  <andythenorth> ach, bulk terminals in every economy
20:10:57  <andythenorth> not very interesting eh?
20:11:25  <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: my knowledge of these things is not quite detailed enough to judge that
20:11:53  <Wolf01> it's nice how Musk stated "the next time we'll put more hydraulic fluid, so it should explode for a different reason"
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20:21:11  <Samu> Wow, can't believe I can stream OpenTTD
20:21:18  <Samu> check it out http://www.twitch.tv/xarickpreto
20:21:53  <peter1138> Can't believe?
20:22:01  <peter1138> What's unbelievable about it?
20:22:40  <Wolf01> you can stream notepad too
20:23:32  <Samu> the codec is bad for 256 colors :(
20:24:07  <Samu> but well, yeah, Open Broadcast is quite flexible
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20:54:21  <andythenorth> ho ho FIRS has gone past 4k commits
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21:25:01  <Alberth> :)
21:31:55  <andythenorth> hmm
21:32:00  <andythenorth> should I release?
21:32:06  <andythenorth> probly
21:32:15  <Alberth> finizhed?
21:32:33  <andythenorth> 1.4.0
21:32:41  <andythenorth> didn’t play test yet
21:32:48  <andythenorth> but that’s what 1.4.1 is for :P
21:33:13  <Alberth> otherwise you have to wait a year to make a new version :)
21:33:19  <Alberth> gn
21:33:22  <andythenorth> bye :)
21:33:25  * andythenorth should write a changelog
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21:38:46  <Pikka> changelogs are overrrated
21:39:14  <Pikka> good morning andythenorth
21:39:23  <andythenorth> herro
21:39:55  <Pikka> TaI you say?
21:40:13  <Pikka> I am getting fed up with the default towns... perhaps I should start with a scrabble board again.
21:41:14  <andythenorth> hmm
21:41:17  <andythenorth> tramz not loading
21:41:23  <andythenorth> yes TaI is nice
21:41:23  <Pikka> si
21:41:36  <andythenorth> I don’t normally get into 2000+ but I saw the office blocks today
21:41:38  <andythenorth> nice
21:41:43  <andythenorth> tropic + arctic? o_O
21:41:47  <Pikka> yes
21:42:39  <andythenorth> eh, one of these trams is loading, the other isn't
21:42:40  <andythenorth> same model
21:43:01  <Pikka> one built before the fix and the other hafter?
21:43:17  <Pikka> one with a callback after refitting?
21:43:27  <andythenorth> hrm
21:43:35  <andythenorth> shared orders
21:43:47  <andythenorth> both just built by auto-replace
21:43:54  <andythenorth> same station
21:44:19  <Pikka> uhoh
21:45:06  <andythenorth> well
21:45:11  <andythenorth> loading speed might be silly
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21:49:06  <andythenorth> hrm, loading speed is 0
21:49:07  <Samu> town road trees don't become transparent: https://rupavq.dm2304.livefilestore.com/y2pk1CCQtETwNZrRPzGh_32uPTggC_LAwKhuRbEDIfi3r4XpoXc_VCfIqtgPrsYRHHTqE0MRme2g4Nw9gPZpIU_mC0yHaTVpEiQ89Ilxz5RNEuUTAECYFz9_J-UMZGoll4zFAuFPL4KlsmPuwzNGaAhNA/Funtway%20Transport%2C%201996-08-18.png?psid=1
21:49:10  <andythenorth> how is that even working ever?
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22:05:54  <frosch123> Samu: check "full detail" in menu
22:06:43  <frosch123> it has been considered to move it to transparency options, but noone came up with a decent layout for all the other weird show/hide name settings
22:08:44  <Wolf01> heh
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22:10:15  <andythenorth> Pikka: think I’ve fixed it, thanks :)
22:10:33  <Pikka> splendide
22:10:56  <andythenorth> wonder if IH has same bug? :P
22:10:58  <Samu> they're trees and lamp posts that only towns can build
22:11:08  <Samu> so why not add to the town category?
22:13:23  <Samu> "Toggle transparency for houses. Ctrl-Click to lock" -> this one
22:16:31  <Samu> oh, catenary
22:16:38  <Samu> maybe that one
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22:54:42  <krinn> is there an easy way to list the newGRF in use?
22:57:22  *** tokai|noir [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
23:01:04  <frosch123> in-game there is only the gui
23:01:19  <frosch123> there are tools to get newgrf lists from ottd-made screenshots, and from savegames
23:01:45  <krinn> got the list thru savegame and openttd -q
23:03:04  <frosch123> he, i didn't even know that option :o
23:03:45  <krinn> :D
23:04:12  <Eddi|zuHause> in the game, type "gamelog" (or so) into the console
23:04:37  <krinn> ah yes, it list them with gamelog
23:05:26  <Eddi|zuHause> i don't think there is a console way to list or manipulate newgrfs directly
23:05:44  <Eddi|zuHause> might be useful for servers
23:07:03  <Eddi|zuHause> but so far, no server owner bothered enough to implement that
23:07:20  <Eddi|zuHause> the current workarounds are to change openttd.cfg, or to upload a savegame
23:08:47  <krinn> i upload a savegame (so people can simply use it to get newgrf version i use)
23:09:07  <krinn> i'm feeling sad to always fall into weird bugs
23:09:27  <Eddi|zuHause> are there non-weird bugs?
23:09:42  <krinn> YES: any bugs i didn't fall into
23:10:20  <krinn> it's not they are weird, it's like i feel, what the hell i found it while others seem to pass thru
23:10:36  <andythenorth> bye
23:10:42  <krinn> bye andythenorth
23:10:44  *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth]
23:17:19  <Eddi|zuHause> well, assume that lots of people encounter the same errors, but are not bothered enough to report them
23:19:15  <krinn> ah, well, it looks better said like this :)
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23:28:19  <krinn> night everyone
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23:48:17  <supermop> yo
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