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Log for #openttd on 17th June 2015:
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03:21:23  <supermop_> yo Pikka
03:22:02  <supermop_> why is the total power of a rake of EMUs in ukrs2 lower than the sum of powers of each unit?
03:22:57  <Pikka> some kind of "realism", I don't know
03:23:03  <Pikka> it probably seemed like a good idea at the time :)
03:24:06  <supermop_> i kind of get the notion that maybe 8 motor cars can't draw enough current
03:24:30  <supermop_> but then my class 91 shouldn't be able to draw enough either?
03:25:16  <Pikka> like I said, seemed like a good idea at the time. :) UKRS is silly.
03:25:25  <supermop_> trying to figure out whether to replace a fleet of 4 tile AL1 hauled trains with 321s
03:25:37  <supermop_> do the EMUs load faster?
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03:46:20  <Pikka> I don't remember. probably.
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03:49:25  <supermop_> cascading all of these guys is a bit of a mess
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06:45:14  <Pikka> exactly
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07:03:00  <andythenorth> agreed
07:04:05  <andythenorth> Pikka: ‘Dump Tram / Dump Truck’ or ‘Mining Tram / Mining Truck’ ?
07:04:25  * andythenorth suspects scrap metal is not mined
07:09:06  <Pikka> I went with "tipper", I think.
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07:12:38  * andythenorth considers it
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07:23:44  <andythenorth> Pikka bob, presumably you don’t have any stupid big mining trucks in your plan?
07:24:13  <Pikka> nope, not at all
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07:24:30  <andythenorth> what do your tipper trucks refit?
07:24:35  <andythenorth> or is there a link to something I can read?
07:24:36  <andythenorth> :P
07:24:43  <Pikka> just about anything bulk
07:25:54  * andythenorth hmms
07:26:08  <Pikka> hmm
07:26:26  <Pikka> they refit (currently)
07:27:34  <Pikka> anything bulk, not powderised or covered (those go in the covered hopper)
07:27:55  <Pikka> and explicitly allow wood and scrap and explicitly disallow grain, wheat, maize and fruit.
07:29:22  <andythenorth> grain is disallowed because...?
07:29:49  <V453000> asdf
07:29:57  <Pikka> because it goes in the covered hoppers
07:30:11  <andythenorth> k
07:30:23  <Pikka> and it's more consistent with the train wagons
07:32:01  <andythenorth> I am trying to keep consistent with Iron Horse
07:32:07  <andythenorth> but I think it’s a slavish consistency :P
07:35:48  <V453000> what things are baking dudez? :)
07:36:31  <V453000> I am on a serioze mission of learning blender now
07:36:44  <V453000> shitting pants daily
07:40:05  * andythenorth wonders whether to add pointless Box Truck
07:40:11  <andythenorth> for consistency with Iron Horse
07:40:17  <Pikka> definitely
07:42:45  * andythenorth steals from pikka
07:42:52  <andythenorth> http://pikkarail.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/3rd_gen_rvs.png
07:43:19  <andythenorth> box / flat / tanker / tipper / livestock / covered hopper
07:43:26  <andythenorth> did I win a prize?
07:43:36  <Pikka> splendid :)
07:43:38  <V453000> =D
07:43:47  <V453000> that dude
07:43:54  <andythenorth> do box and flat refit everything?
07:44:05  <V453000> the other-than-dude trucks are nice too Pikka :P
07:44:11  <Pikka> just about
07:45:15  <Pikka> iirc box is mail, valuables, express and piece. flat is piece and goods (containers). Livestock is express and piece.
07:45:46  <Pikka> thanks v :P
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07:49:56  <planetmaker> moin
07:50:02  <andythenorth> hmm
07:50:07  <andythenorth> woodchips in dump trucks
07:50:11  <andythenorth> overthinking it
07:50:13  <andythenorth> stuff that
07:50:41  <Pikka> all danmack's fault, with his woodchip hoppers for NARS
07:51:23  <Pikka> anyway, my light-coloured generic bulkstuff looks a bit like woodchips, so I thought why not?
08:00:33  * andythenorth tweaks
08:10:52  <andythenorth> also bbl
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08:29:20  <supermop_> dump tram?
08:30:58  <supermop_> wood in hopper confuses me
08:31:12  <supermop_> i dont really consider sawdust to still be wood
08:31:41  <supermop_> but ive never played ecs so idk if it has some significance there
08:32:24  <supermop_> i just imagine they'd make the mdf at the same place they make the plywood, not at the forest
08:33:23  <Pikka> woodchips, not sawdust...
08:33:31  <supermop_> finally replaced these type 2s with 92s on this ore line
08:33:41  <Pikka> dan's idea :P
08:34:09  <supermop_> takes forever to get considerable production out of a mine in manpower ind.
08:34:43  <supermop_> still seems to wasteful to chew up the trees straight away
08:35:10  <supermop_> maybe if sawmill produced chips as waste as well as lumber
08:35:24  <supermop_> and paper mill could use either wood or chips
08:37:52  <supermop_> now cut up the type 2s or displace some class 20s on small ore line
08:43:03  <supermop_> i guess displacing class 20s is not very historically accurate
08:43:29  <supermop_> do have a pair of 08s moving lumber could replace
08:44:03  <supermop_> Pikka: i'm going to try modelling an A class and B class in the next few days
08:44:23  <Pikka> awesome :)
09:02:52  <supermop_> how was the end of your semester?
09:10:07  <Pikka> all good
09:10:21  <Pikka> kickstarter time now, as soon as I stop playing ksp :P
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09:33:31  <supermop_> haha
09:34:03  <supermop_> fiance had her last exam ever last night- now we're down to only 3 weeks left
09:34:22  <supermop_> may squeeze in a quick qld trip if we can find a cheap flight
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12:12:59  <Flygon> supermop_: See Puffing Billy if you haven't already
12:30:24  <supermop_> sounds like a stoner
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13:51:57  <EXetoC> import("util.superlib", "SuperLib", 36); where do I put superlib on linux for that to work?
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14:08:57  <planetmaker> EXetoC, into your game/library or ai/library folder - whatever you write
14:11:09  <planetmaker> also see section 4.2 of the readme :)
14:11:31  <planetmaker> 	GS Libraries:        game/libraries          (or a subdirectory thereof)
14:11:50  <planetmaker> (thus I was kinda wrong)
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14:13:35  <EXetoC> not game/library? I've tried a lot of combinations
14:17:37  <planetmaker> hm... library. Probably. I only have 'library' folders
14:24:45  <DorpsGek> Commit by planetmaker :: r27299 trunk/readme.txt (2015-06-17 16:24:41 +0200 )
14:24:46  <DorpsGek> -Doc: game script and ai library paths were wrong in readme.
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14:36:09  <EXetoC> "~/.openttd/game/library/util/SuperLib-39.tar.gz" is that wrong? and yes I'm trying to request version 39 now. I downloaded the latest version
14:37:56  <planetmaker> path looks ok to me. However you don't import it with any path given
14:38:23  <planetmaker> (all IIRC, I didn't ever write any script for OpenTTD)
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14:44:17  <Alberth> hihi
14:45:00  <planetmaker> hi albert :)
14:45:44  <Alberth> fork a bee, get hacking :)
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14:46:08  <planetmaker> hehe, yeah
14:46:14  <Alberth> (don't do import either though :) )
14:46:21  <EXetoC> it works now. I installed it via the game
14:47:37  <EXetoC> maybe I should have omitted .gz
14:48:20  <Alberth> unpacking it, more likely
14:49:20  <Alberth> ie    gzip -d superlib-39.tar.gz
14:50:04  <EXetoC> yeah
14:52:59  <EXetoC> when are we getting a neural network-based AI?
14:55:14  <Alberth> as soon as you publish one
14:55:42  <EXetoC> d(:)|<
14:56:50  <Alberth> no idea what that means, but since none has been published yet, apparently, you can safely assume it won't happen unless you do something yourself
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15:11:09  <FLHerne> It looks like a person wearing a baseball cap?
15:11:22  <FLHerne> But sideways and made out of ASCII
15:14:26  <Alberth> you don't happen to know the meaning of persons with baseball caps, do you?
15:21:29  <EXetoC> it's all on me? oh the pressure. ok give me a week, just gotta read up on machine learning :>
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15:21:57  <EXetoC> Alberth: I don't. I hope I didn't use that emoticon inappropriately
15:22:51  <Alberth> :)
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15:25:20  <Alberth> hihi
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18:21:56  <frosch123> moin
18:22:19  <Alberth> moin
18:22:38  <EXetoC> kartoffel
18:22:42  <EXetoC> or something
18:26:23  <frosch123> planetmaker: https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=65&t=73204 <- i guess we need a new devzone compile target :)
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18:31:37  <andythenorth> o/
18:33:01  <Alberth> o/
18:33:14  <andythenorth> is cat tired?
18:33:15  * andythenorth is tired
18:33:23  <andythenorth> called code freeze today
18:34:28  <andythenorth> seems a long time since April 13th :P
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19:22:09  <andythenorth> Road Hog
19:22:10  <andythenorth> is terrible
19:36:14  <Eddi|zuHause> what is ever not terrible?
19:39:24  <EXetoC> bacon
19:41:04  <djdave> agreed. Bacon is never terrible.
19:42:36  <andythenorth> smoked bacon when you’re expecting unsmoked
19:42:37  <andythenorth> terrible
19:42:39  <andythenorth> green bacon
19:42:41  <andythenorth> terrible
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19:43:02  <Wolf01> hi hi
19:43:09  <Eddi|zuHause> i'm not living in a world where bacon is not really a thing
19:43:13  <Eddi|zuHause> -not
19:43:25  <Eddi|zuHause> (either one of those)
19:44:57  <andythenorth> can we remove RVs from the game?
19:45:03  <andythenorth> then my set design is easy
19:45:07  <Eddi|zuHause> no.
19:45:18  <Alberth> just disable the default RVs ?
19:45:34  <andythenorth> composable RVs?
19:45:35  <EXetoC> andythenorth: vegetarian bacon, made out of leaves and stuff?
19:46:02  <andythenorth> similar to train consists
19:46:03  <Eddi|zuHause> this "can't we just remove X and be done with it" is exactly the type of scenario where the world ends from a robot rebellion, when they decide X=human
19:46:21  <andythenorth> well
19:46:42  <peter1138> "Can't we just remove" said every Gnome developer, ever.
19:46:50  <andythenorth> we need to distract the AI with sim games
19:47:31  <Alberth> with humans killing AIs ?
19:47:44  <Eddi|zuHause> <andythenorth> composable RVs? <-- as it stands, nobody ever attempted to code this.
19:48:03  <andythenorth> hmm
19:48:10  <andythenorth> I think frosch started something
19:48:12  <andythenorth> a long time ago
19:48:36  <Eddi|zuHause> that is only marginally above "i started something" :p
19:48:36  <andythenorth> also I patched a cb that we decided would be needed for controlling attachment
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19:49:01  <andythenorth> it was far enough to see that it was probably not worth bothering :P
19:49:20  <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, i don't think it's the right way to go
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19:49:51  <peter1138> "Would you like to make Internet Explorer your default browser?" nnnngggg
19:49:52  <andythenorth> it would make set design easier, on one level
19:49:52  <andythenorth> superficially :P
19:49:57  <Eddi|zuHause> just offer multiple versions, one single and one or two articulated of every vehicle
19:50:12  <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: there should be a box that says "never ask this again"
19:50:35  <andythenorth> there should be a box that says never ask this, ever :P
19:51:09  <andythenorth> 'should'
19:51:16  <andythenorth> composable vehicles don’t actually solve any of my problems
19:51:34  <andythenorth> precisely zero of them
19:52:58  <andythenorth> a portion of the problem is “IRL vehicles are like xyz”
19:53:05  <andythenorth> which makes my buy menu messy :P
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19:55:55  <Eddi|zuHause> like this? https://xkcd.com/1267/
19:56:18  <andythenorth> yup
19:56:20  <andythenorth> that
20:01:10  <andythenorth> should Road Hog truck types map 1:1 to Iron Horse train wagon types?
20:01:15  <andythenorth> or 1:1 real life?
20:01:19  <andythenorth> or 1:1 to own rules?
20:01:20  <andythenorth> :P
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20:06:09  <peter1138> Copying 93GB takes so long ;(
20:08:03  <planetmaker> hm, interesting, frosch123 :)
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20:14:42  <frosch123> andythenorth: i never did anything with rv composition
20:14:57  <andythenorth> someone wrote a spec
20:15:09  <andythenorth> that counts as 50% done around here
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20:32:07  <juzza1_> "just" needs an implementation
20:32:49  <Eddi|zuHause> my personal favourite is to end on "there exists a solution"
20:37:56  <EXetoC> has anyone seen my hat?
20:38:04  <EXetoC> peter1138: I think you need more mhz thingies
20:38:36  <peter1138> Doesn't everyone?
20:39:39  <andythenorth> hmm
20:39:43  <andythenorth> ship smoke is really nice
20:39:49  <andythenorth> remember when we didn’t have that? o_O
20:40:15  <Wolf01> train fever -75% (€6.24)could be a good deal?
20:41:54  <peter1138> Do we have ship smoke?
20:42:10  <EXetoC> anything that has trains is nice
20:44:54  <andythenorth> we have smoking ships
20:44:58  * andythenorth does anyway
20:45:14  <peter1138> Bah, ETS 2 Scandinavia is only 20% off ;(
20:45:16  <andythenorth> we also have ‘build one station per set of orders’
20:45:20  <andythenorth> thanks to cdist :)
20:45:27  <andythenorth> peter1138: ETS 2 doesn’t work anyway
20:45:32  <andythenorth> it’s ugly as all sin
20:45:46  <peter1138> Works for me.
20:46:19  <andythenorth> ugly schmugly
20:46:20  <EXetoC> one station per.. wut?
20:46:37  <andythenorth> you have a secondary industry producing cargo
20:46:44  <andythenorth> and you want to send it to multiple destinations
20:47:00  <andythenorth> so at the industry, you build one pickup station per destination
20:49:48  <EXetoC> ok
20:50:26  <andythenorth> without cdist, you don’t do this
20:50:30  <andythenorth> it’s a cdist tactic
20:54:43  <andythenorth> also bedtime
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22:08:19  <Wolf01> 'night
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