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Log for #openttd on 28th January 2016:
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08:41:56  <Wolf01> moin
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09:20:29  <Eddi|zuHause> what a "security warning" looks like to normal people: https://i.imgur.com/H0uVqFe.jpg
09:26:19  <Wolf01> yes
09:27:09  <planetmaker> hehe, indeed
09:31:22  <^Spike^> XD
09:31:25  <^Spike^> sounds true :)
09:31:59  <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: did you get anywhere with the build dependency problem?
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09:50:26  <peter1138> pretty much
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10:13:35  <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause, sorry not yet... there was work work
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12:28:27  <Wolf01> nice, would I be able to do paris-amsterdam in 1 hour?
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12:42:48  <argoneus> good morning train friends
12:44:08  <Wolf01> o/
12:44:28  <argoneus> turns out dytech makes factorio fun
12:44:34  <argoneus> I'm not sure I can play vanilla anymore
12:45:14  <argoneus> having stuff like smart short long handed close inserter makes stuff more flexible
12:45:33  <argoneus> and the metallurgy thing is great
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15:14:55  <Wolf01> reboot
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16:52:15  <tt_johannes> where should one lookup the tile indices?
16:52:19  <tt_johannes> is there a tile pool?
16:52:51  <tt_johannes> e.g., BaseStation has a "TileIndex xy;"
16:58:58  <Eddi|zuHause> there are helper function that turn an (x,y) coordinate into a TileIndex and back
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17:02:41  <Eddi|zuHause> try src/map_func.h
17:03:42  <Eddi|zuHause> and to find out what's on the tile you need to use the map accessor functions (in src/*_map.h)
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17:10:10  <tt_johannes> Eddi|zuHause: ah, ok, looks like a tileindex is just two tiles pushed into one 32 bit int
17:10:45  <Eddi|zuHause> yes, there's no deep magic involved...
17:11:05  <planetmaker> but use the proper accessor functions. Don't re-invent the wheel
17:11:30  <planetmaker> get_tile_by_index or similar exists. etc
17:11:50  <tt_johannes> I know: TileX(), TileY(), right?
17:12:52  <tt_johannes> get_tile_by_index... does not exist
17:13:43  <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, that's nonsense
17:14:49  <tt_johannes> :)
17:15:51  <_dp_> there are Industry::GetByTile(TileIndex) and similar
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17:22:49  <tt_johannes> how to compile with -g ? something like CXXFLAGS=-g ./configure ?
17:25:33  <tt_johannes> --enable-debug=3 ?
17:25:35  <Alberth> ./configure --enable-debug=3
17:25:39  <tt_johannes> :)
17:28:54  <tt_johannes> hm it recompiled, but valgrind keeps saying: ==15017==    at 0x855B95: VideoDriver_Graph::MainLoop() (in /data/cprogs/openttd/installed/games/openttd)
17:29:36  <tt_johannes> the CFLAGS variable has no -g
17:29:50  <tt_johannes> oh it has!
17:29:52  <tt_johannes> strange
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18:31:27  <Terkhen> Hello
18:32:48  <Rubidium> tt_johannes: running the wrong openttd binary? (i.e. not the built one but an installed one)
18:33:21  <tt_johannes> Rubidium: ah indeed! I had to run make install first!
18:35:18  <Alberth> make gdbrun  or something?
18:35:52  <tt_johannes> valgrind should do it...
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18:45:13  <Eddi|zuHause> i think it was make run_gdb (or possibly run-gdb)
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18:45:32  <andythenorth> o/
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18:45:39  <Alberth> hi hi
18:45:49  <Eddi|zuHause> whichever i pick, it's always the wrong one :p
18:47:15  <Rubidium> Eddi|zuHause: those are better odds than an USB connector ;)
18:48:01  <andythenorth> so pypy3 for nml?
18:48:10  * andythenorth is trying to work out under what conditions it is better
18:48:32  <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: yeah. USB only ever works in the 3rd try :p
18:48:51  <andythenorth> for code changes only, a FIRS recompile with primed cache is *substantially* faster with pypy3 than any py3.x I have
18:49:14  <V453000> how great idea is it to have 6448 sprites per engine? XD
18:49:44  <andythenorth> awesome
18:50:04  <V453000> hm might need to almost double that
18:50:06  <V453000> XD
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18:50:18  <Eddi|zuHause> V453000: depends on how big you expect people's sprite cache to be :p
18:50:24  <V453000> :)
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18:51:26  <Alberth> one engine per newgrf? :)
18:51:38  <V453000> maybe? :D
18:52:58  <andythenorth> for a change to a single png and otherwise primed cache, the FIRS compile time with pypy3 (50s) is close to the unprimed cache condition (1m)
18:53:05  <andythenorth> which is
interesting
18:53:59  <andythenorth> same condition for all python 3.x afaict
18:54:16  <andythenorth> so a single changed png negates much of the caching?
19:00:07  <andythenorth> hmm
19:00:14  <andythenorth> docs rendering seems much slower under pypy3
19:00:20  <andythenorth> maybe chameleon performance is poor
19:01:31  <Wolf01> o/ cat man
19:05:44  <Alberth> meow
19:09:59  <Wolf01> andy, how many claas xerion will you purchase?
19:10:34  <Wolf01> with my technic group we decided that at least 2 each is a fair number
19:23:37  <tt_johannes> configure does not work somehow...
19:23:44  <tt_johannes> when I type make it compiles
19:23:49  <tt_johannes> (including a configure)
19:24:07  <tt_johannes> when I then tell qtcreator to run make in the same directory, it configures and makes again
19:24:19  <tt_johannes> and when I go back to the commandline, make is invoking a configure again
19:32:04  <planetmaker> uhm... qtcreator? The question is, does that happen, if you only ever use make. And not qtcreator in between
19:32:26  <planetmaker> it might update whatever files in between. And with newer time stamp on some relevant ones, configure has to be re-executed
19:33:19  <tt_johannes> planetmaker: If I type make twice, it works
19:33:29  <tt_johannes> it's just when I switch between konsole and the IDE
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19:34:44  <tt_johannes> when I typed make after qtcreator, it said: "The system detected that source.list or any configure file is altered. Going to reconfigure with last known settings...
19:34:47  <tt_johannes> "
19:37:19  <planetmaker> well. There you go. Don't touch those files, unless you want a re-compile
19:37:36  <planetmaker> it's not configure's fault but your IDE, saving crap all over, without it being changed
19:37:56  <planetmaker> s/re-compile/re-configure/
19:37:58  <Alberth> check for changes relative to the repo?
19:38:12  <Alberth> clearly the ide is doing something :)
19:38:43  <Alberth> but yeah, pseudo-smart software, such joys.... :p
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19:42:40  <tt_johannes> planetmaker: what files could the IDE change? Of course, it has project files that it changes, but does openttd's configure tool know about them?
19:42:47  <tt_johannes> I did not register these prohect files
19:43:05  <andythenorth> Wolf01: probably no Xerion
19:43:11  <andythenorth> probably only the Volvo
19:43:16  <andythenorth> and even that, not sure
19:43:17  <andythenorth> :)
19:45:53  <Wolf01> :)
19:46:27  <andythenorth> it’s all nice, but eh, maybe I have enough technic
19:46:32  <andythenorth> and it’s mostly very expensive
19:47:31  <andythenorth> I am not sure about all these AFOL focussed sets
19:47:38  <andythenorth> not sure if there are enough AFOLs
19:48:30  <Wolf01> we are a nice group here :P
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19:50:02  <glx> [19:48:48] <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: yeah. USB only ever works in the 3rd try :p <-- still better than SCART
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19:50:54  <Eddi|zuHause> hehe ;)
19:56:52  <tt_johannes> an unformatted graph, not yet improved, just for fun to show some progress: https://www.docdroid.net/6XS14j9/graph1.pdf.html
19:57:01  <andythenorth> USB is for putting essential malware on your machine?
19:57:26  <andythenorth> SCART can’t do that
19:57:28  <andythenorth> AFAIK
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20:01:01  * Supercheese had never heard of SCART before now
20:01:08  <Supercheese> you learn something new each day
20:01:28  <andythenorth> Wolf01: there is some serious reverse engineering of the Porsche in Eurobricks
20:01:37  <Wolf01> :o
20:01:57  <andythenorth> mostly the sequential gear paddles
20:02:01  <andythenorth> nobody knows much else
20:02:09  <andythenorth> but if they’re right, it’s very technically neat
20:10:31  * andythenorth back to FIRS
20:12:40  <andythenorth> ho
20:12:47  <andythenorth> Road Hog doesn’t compile under pypy3
20:12:49  <andythenorth> what larks
20:13:13  <planetmaker> tt_johannes, if you have them open, it might simply save them w/o any change. Maybe. I don't know that IDE
20:13:43  <Wolf01> wow, sequential gearbox :O
20:14:36  <andythenorth> yup
20:14:47  <andythenorth> Lego pushing envelope
20:15:02  <andythenorth> hmm nmlc -s isn’t getting me a useful stack trace
20:17:15  <andythenorth> ah 2 definitions of flags in makefile
20:17:30  <andythenorth> well: http://pastebin.com/raw/0dcW7k1h
20:18:29  <andythenorth> dropping the -c option for nmlc does not help
20:23:59  <frosch123> it's the sprite compression
20:24:04  <frosch123> you cannot disable that :p
20:24:05  <andythenorth> it’s pypy3 FWIW
20:24:19  <andythenorth> I was surprised it worked for FIRS :P
20:24:29  <andythenorth> I am curious why Road Hog fails, Iron Horse and FIRS don't
20:24:38  <andythenorth> same nmlc, PILLOW etc
20:25:37  <andythenorth> you might validly suspect simple user error
20:25:41  <andythenorth> but I can’t see what I did wrong
20:27:39  <andythenorth> FISH works also
20:27:48  <frosch123> different palette?
20:27:53  <frosch123> did you go 32bpp?
20:28:07  <frosch123> what about the spritecache?
20:28:14  <frosch123> it won't encode if the spritecache is filled
20:29:25  <andythenorth> how would I determine that?
20:30:07  * andythenorth tries other pythons meanwhile
20:30:59  <andythenorth> road hog is surprisingly big
20:31:02  <andythenorth> 4600 sprites
20:31:10  <andythenorth> FIRS has only 3864
20:31:44  <andythenorth> vehicle cargo support I guess
20:32:04  <andythenorth> 0 cached
20:32:08  <andythenorth> even on repeat runs
20:32:56  <andythenorth> ah, they probably don’t cache because they’re regenerated every time in the compile
20:33:00  <andythenorth> maybe
20:33:20  <tt_johannes> planetmaker: well, it's a very good IDE (the one most kde/qt developers use), I don't think that it will do that :P
20:33:32  <andythenorth> road hog sprites all get pixa processed on every compile :P
20:33:47  <tt_johannes> I mostly wonder why it re-calls the configure file, that's really strange
20:34:32  <andythenorth> balls, instead of finishing FIRS I am pissing around timing compile runs :)
20:34:49  <andythenorth> not even trying to make them faster, just pure timewasting
20:35:18  <andythenorth> how does that xkcd ‘automate’ chart apply, when you don’t bother with the ‘automate’ bit :P
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20:49:17  <Supercheese> I generally find myself firmly on the "don't bother automating" side of that chart
20:49:39  <andythenorth> I would like to automate tasks like shaving
20:49:42  <andythenorth> and cleaning teeth
20:49:48  <Supercheese> like the paperwork I have to do at the office... yeah, there's quite probably a better way to automate it, but it would not be worth the time investment
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23:37:36  <Wolf01> 'night
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