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Log for #openttd on 7th August 2016:
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07:08:06  <andythenorth> o/
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07:08:43  <Ethereal_Shiver> o/
07:09:40  <andythenorth> iz realism?
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07:30:35  <andythenorth> lo Alberth
07:31:07  <V453000> iz chibby?
07:31:36  <andythenorth> quite
07:31:39  <andythenorth> oil tankers
07:31:43  <andythenorth> that are electric trams
07:31:49  <andythenorth> electric things spark
07:31:53  <andythenorth> too explodey?
07:32:37  <V453000> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/20419525/BRIX/chibby-af.png
07:32:47  <V453000> I thought if trains look chibby in openttd
07:32:53  <andythenorth> not that chibby
07:32:55  <V453000> why not make them ultra chibby to make it seem like it's on purpose
07:33:07  <andythenorth> but would suit yeti dudes
07:33:16  <V453000> it's BRIX vehiculs
07:33:25  <andythenorth> seems fair
07:33:29  <andythenorth> I like the engine more than the wagon
07:33:35  <andythenorth> the engine looks heft
07:33:38  <andythenorth> due to huge boiler
07:33:52  <V453000> well the wagon isn't quite done, it is just a placeholder to test sizes in game
07:34:05  <V453000> to detect glitches etc
07:36:13  <V453000> this little shit is chaney jubilee. :D
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07:36:50  <V453000> trying to start with a steamer which seems more complex than making a diesel brick
07:45:11  <Alberth> moin
07:45:37  <V453000> hy
07:45:40  <V453000> u chibby?
07:45:49  <Alberth> probably
07:46:07  <V453000> I totally chibby right now
07:46:23  <Supercheese> getting' chibby with it
07:46:27  <Supercheese> gettin'
07:46:30  <Supercheese> weird autocorrect
07:46:34  <V453000> XD
07:47:31  <Supercheese> Do Yetis have flamethrowers yet?
07:48:41  <V453000> noep
07:48:48  <V453000> yetis are asleep now
07:48:52  <V453000> brix on fire
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08:07:26  <andythenorth> http://www.weekendnotes.com/im/001/02/adelaide-tram-bus-time-table-tram-adelaide-trams-a21.jpg
08:07:38  <andythenorth> if that carried petrol, would it explode? o_O
08:13:58  <Supercheese> depends on how full
08:14:12  <Supercheese> mostly vapour, yeah perhaps if a spark gets where it shouldn't
08:14:19  <Supercheese> completely full, no probably not
08:16:51  <andythenorth> I could do loco + wagons
08:16:53  <andythenorth> dunno
08:17:06  <andythenorth> this is current tramz for it http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/7938/tanker_tramz_such.png
08:29:12  <Ethereal_Shiver> Playing this game again for the first time in a long time... let's see if I remember how to play properly
08:35:59  <Supercheese> good luck; try not to cross the trains
08:36:17  <Ethereal_Shiver> I already made kind of a crappy junction
08:36:31  <Ethereal_Shiver> http://i.imgur.com/qnpzUwB.png
08:40:37  <Supercheese> might I recommend Path Signals? https://wiki.openttd.org/Signals#Path_signals
08:40:47  <Supercheese> they're pretty much superior in every way
08:41:39  <Ethereal_Shiver> Well, that's what the priority lane in the main line uses, but the side lines get block signals
08:53:29  <andythenorth> exploding tanker tramz it is then
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08:54:49  <andythenorth> qwak
08:59:08  <Supercheese> quak indeed
08:59:32  <frosch123> morning mammals :)
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09:03:37  <andythenorth> hmm
09:03:46  <andythenorth> too many trams to draw for ~1950
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09:06:26  <roboboy> hello
09:20:05  <V453000> heyo frosch123
09:20:17  <V453000> didn't you by chance have some time for foundation shit? :)
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09:29:59  <frosch123> more shit to pull
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09:53:02  <Wolf01> o/
10:00:42  * Ethereal_Shiver shoots Wolf01
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10:16:50  <Alberth> o/
10:17:02  <Alberth> this wolf is very friendly
10:17:10  <Alberth> no need to shoot
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10:27:14  <Wolf01> o/
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10:43:11  <Samu> atidxx64.dll!AmdLiquidVrD3D11WrapDeviceContext+0x878f
10:43:17  <Samu> lel
10:43:53  <Samu> i don't understand that name
10:45:19  <Samu> HeroesOfTheStorm_x64.exe!AmdPowerXpressRequestHighPerformance+0x319b4d1
10:45:36  <Samu> blizzard treatment to amd
10:49:09  <Wolf01> conspiracy
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11:07:43  <andythenorth> hmm
11:07:57  <andythenorth> tankers coloured per cargo is the way forward
11:08:02  <andythenorth> V453000 ^ :P
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12:07:03  <V453000> frosch123: :D
12:13:20  <frosch123> V453000: we need to change all ground sprite offset from (-128,0) to (-124,-2) :p
12:13:54  <frosch123> and we need an extension to ottd
12:16:08  <V453000> moving those isn't a huge problem, but tracks, roads and bridges need to move as well then
12:16:15  <V453000> extension to openttd?
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12:17:27  <roboboy> hello]
12:19:03  <Alberth> o/
12:19:49  <roboboy> Istarted a TT-Forums thread to get help with Cross Compiling.
12:20:10  <frosch123> fuck, i mean (-124,+2)
12:22:28  <V453000> right, didn't start to make changes yet :P
12:22:32  <V453000> but what do you mean by extension?
12:25:13  <frosch123> no idea, whether i mean -2 or +2 :p
12:25:31  <V453000> XD
12:25:32  <Alberth> roboboy:  first guess is to disable the pkgconfig call, and add -I  directory for the zlib header files, and -L and -l for the libraries
12:25:40  <frosch123> i guess -2 :p
12:26:41  <V453000> can try both :P will do in the evening
12:26:48  <V453000> now baby
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12:31:53  <roboboy> Alberth: I need to figure how to do that from the scripts. I am a windows guy and not a Linux guy :P
12:34:26  <frosch123> V453000: https://devs.openttd.org/~frosch/foundations_zoom2.png <- this is what it now looks like
12:34:29  <frosch123> with fixed foundation offsets
12:34:42  <frosch123> and groundsprites changed to (-124,-2)
12:34:51  <frosch123> though i am not sure whether i caught all ground sprites
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12:35:51  <V453000> seems fixed?
12:35:53  <V453000> :)
12:35:56  <frosch123> about the ottd extension: when you look at the halftile foundations in the middle-right at the top, you can see that both the north and south foundation show a bit too much of the slope
12:36:12  <V453000> yeah
12:37:32  <roboboy> gnight
12:38:38  <V453000> should I then make 1px extra on the inside of the foundations so it doesn't create that alpha, but neither exceed the current sprite eize?
12:39:19  <V453000> it looks like there is that kind of 1px problem all over the place
12:40:52  <Alberth> roboboy:  something like https://paste.openttdcoop.org/ptnzvsmcv
12:41:43  <frosch123> V453000: i pushed my changes
12:42:12  <Alberth> ah, you're scripting V?  :)
12:42:19  <frosch123> V453000: generally, the schema should now be: 1x-offset (x,y)  -> 4x-offset (4*x,4*y-2)
12:42:42  <V453000> nice, I will merge it and see
12:42:57  <V453000> right
12:43:10  <frosch123> V453000: about the sprites, yes they need an additional pixel on some sides, also you may need to check alpha borders in some places
12:43:53  <V453000> how do I check alpha borders?
12:44:01  <V453000> just manually/visually or do we have a tool for it?
12:44:27  <frosch123> i added NOALPHA to the foundation sprites, so it prints warning if there is any alpha in the foundations :p
12:44:49  <V453000> nice
12:44:59  <frosch123> if foundations half no alpha, it is easy to check whether they connect to the neighbouring tiles
12:45:00  <V453000> I see now
12:45:23  <frosch123> in theory foundations may have semi-transparent pixels where they overlap with other tiles, but that is f-ing hard to see :)
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12:45:43  <V453000> xd
12:46:39  <V453000> oh there is even a wrogly made sprite :d
12:47:18  <V453000> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/20419525/BRIX/foundations-wrong.png
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12:48:18  <V453000> but nice, I will fix things manually now by extra pixels
12:48:37  <V453000> since I have each of the slope-parts defined only once, it will be easy to fix them one by one
12:48:42  <V453000> so I don't have to fix all of them individually
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12:51:09  <V453000> frosch123: -98 is a weird number isn't it
12:51:28  <V453000> would have expected -96
12:51:32  <V453000> as 4*24
12:51:48  <frosch123> [14:42] <frosch123> V453000: generally, the schema should now be: 1x-offset (x,y)  -> 4x-offset (4*x,4*y-2)
12:52:10  <V453000> oh right
12:52:18  <V453000> missed the y part
12:52:23  <frosch123> the -2 is to account for half a pixel, this puts the slope-edge between two pixels
12:53:20  <V453000> XD
13:00:41  <frosch123> V453000: btw. you can use templates inside templates
13:00:49  <frosch123> that way you do not have to copy that much :p
13:01:15  <V453000> what?
13:02:05  <V453000> can you show an example please?
13:02:13  <frosch123> line 9565
13:02:21  <frosch123> just what i did for foundations
13:02:31  <frosch123> one template to address a sprite in the spritesheet
13:02:35  <V453000> O_O
13:02:36  <frosch123> then templates which group slopes
13:03:11  <frosch123> in the replacenew i only have 11 template calls, instead of 90
13:03:35  <V453000> well that's wtf
13:03:37  <V453000> :D
13:06:47  <V453000> I think I understand
13:06:51  <V453000> pretty nice
13:07:10  <V453000> could be useful for shit like bridges
13:07:17  <V453000> there I have stupidly many templates
13:07:46  <V453000> for now I gtfo, thank you very much yet again frosch123 . :)
13:22:17  *** Samu [~oftc-webi@po1-84-91-250-188.netvisao.pt] has joined #openttd
13:22:46  <Samu> 1991, 2003, 2006, 2025
13:23:19  <Samu> Wormnest:
13:23:35  <Samu> nonocab ships still got a few problems
13:24:21  <Samu> it needs a better detector when placing docks/depots, or it may end up locking ships
13:24:58  <Samu> or maybe openttd itself could need a patch to avoid these ship lockups?
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13:42:27  <Samu> but overall, you nailed all ship problems other than this
13:42:31  <Samu> great job
13:48:25  <Wormnest> Samu: Yes I am aware that there still are some problem areas but the worst should be fixed
13:48:38  <Wormnest> and will have to do until I have more time again
13:52:28  <Wormnest> I wonder if there is a limit to the number of buoys that can be used
13:52:48  <Wormnest> If not just always put buoys in spots that you donÂŽt want blocked
14:16:41  <Samu> saves are discarding a few ship conections
14:16:49  <Samu> about 60 out of 1100
14:17:44  <Wormnest> Yea not much I can do about that unless I do a lot more revising of the save/load code than I want to do
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14:48:37  <andythenorth> awesome
14:48:46  <andythenorth> self-repainting tankers :D
14:51:42  <Samu> 4824 out of 5000 yapf ships are profiting
14:52:14  <Samu> 4855 out of 5000 original ships are profiting
14:52:35  <Samu> 3627 out of 5000 npf ships are profiting
14:52:45  <Samu> npf seems to be a problem
14:53:48  <Samu> i will wait till 2051 as always
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15:01:50  <andythenorth> silver tankers for petrol?
15:01:56  * andythenorth thinks yes
15:02:20  <Alberth> looks nice
15:02:25  <Eddi|zuHause> context?
15:02:35  <Alberth> openttd :p
15:02:50  <Eddi|zuHause> not enough :p
15:03:06  <andythenorth> trucks and trains
15:03:12  <andythenorth> Iron Horse uses silver currently
15:03:16  <andythenorth> I could change it
15:03:30  <andythenorth> it’s based on real-life train colours in UK, so not a particularly good reason
15:03:37  <andythenorth> I have 2CC for RFPR
15:03:42  <andythenorth> black for oil
15:03:48  <andythenorth> black for unknown liquid cargos
15:03:57  <andythenorth> oops, 1CC for RFPR
15:03:58  <andythenorth> think it could be done better
15:04:14  <andythenorth> other liquid cargos include at least rubber, which I think should maybe be dark red?
15:05:09  <andythenorth> maybe 2cc for unknown cargos?
15:05:16  <Eddi|zuHause> i'd probably go for a grey wagon with a stripe in the colour of the cargo, and some symbol in CC
15:05:56  <andythenorth> any suggestions for cargo colours in that model? o_O
15:06:11  <Eddi|zuHause> not really
15:06:48  <Eddi|zuHause> but probably should build a scheme that is consistent, like it also appears on the map, and on freight stations, industries, etc.
15:20:53  * andythenorth wonders which liquid cargos there are
15:20:59  <andythenorth> wiki probably knows
15:23:18  <andythenorth> not very many
15:23:31  <andythenorth> ‘chemicals’ catches the majority of them
15:23:44  <V453000> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/nuts/wiki/GearCargoSystem
15:24:57  <Eddi|zuHause> off the top of my head: water, oil, fuel oil/refined oil, milk, beer, chemicals, fertilizer (potentially rather bulk/pourable)
15:26:37  <andythenorth> dyes
15:26:44  <andythenorth> rubber
15:26:48  <andythenorth> that’s about all of them
15:26:59  <V453000> did you open that page? :)
15:27:01  <V453000> has them all
15:27:09  <andythenorth> waiting for the images to load :P
15:27:12  <Eddi|zuHause> somebody will come up with crazier cargos
15:27:26  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: don't forget cola
15:27:37  <andythenorth> and plastic
15:27:39  <andythenorth> or plastic
15:27:41  <andythenorth> both
15:27:41  <V453000> all cargoes I have in that table are what exists in the game, thus is reasonable for the set to support it
15:27:56  <andythenorth> oh fizzy drinks also
15:27:58  <andythenorth> lawks
15:28:17  <Eddi|zuHause> there was a set where livestock is liquid (simulating milk)
15:28:25  <V453000> ukrs
15:28:31  <andythenorth> oh my code seems to contain option for *sets* of colours :P
15:28:41  <andythenorth> for container vehicles, where same colour all the time is boring :P
15:28:45  <andythenorth> randomised on load
15:28:50  <V453000> is good
15:28:53  <andythenorth> who writes this stuff?
15:29:24  <andythenorth> nearly all the code I have written now relates to creating or displaying cargos :P
15:29:48  <andythenorth> there are almost no clever cost algorithms, or vehicle aging tricks or anything :(
15:29:55  <V453000> I will do something very similar for BRIX+ too
15:29:57  <andythenorth> just endless cargo sprite things
15:30:10  <V453000> clever cost algorithms are pointless
15:30:17  <andythenorth> is this game about just watching sprites move around?
15:30:19  <V453000> cargoes matter
15:30:20  <V453000> yes
15:30:23  <andythenorth> or is it about Serious Economic Choices?
15:30:31  <V453000> you know the answer :)
15:30:44  <andythenorth> hmm my kids are fighting in the hot tub
15:30:46  <andythenorth> see how that goes
15:31:41  <andythenorth> not well
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15:53:41  <andythenorth> meh
15:53:47  <andythenorth> could recolour box vans to match cargo
15:53:56  <andythenorth> seems messy, not sure why
15:54:02  <andythenorth> tankers seems fine
15:57:50  <Alberth> it reduces randomness somewhat, but you can see what's inside, which can be useful too
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16:19:44  <andythenorth> currently all box vans are just 2CC
16:19:47  <andythenorth> I dunno
16:19:57  <andythenorth> there are a *lot* of cargos for those vans
16:20:45  <andythenorth> 23 or so in a FIRS extreme game
16:20:58  <andythenorth> nah
16:21:36  <andythenorth> @calc 8*23
16:21:36  <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 184
16:21:38  <Alberth> is that because you make many cargoes transportable in a boxvan
16:21:41  <andythenorth> yes
16:21:52  <andythenorth> they’re one of the two ‘catch alls’
16:22:02  <V453000> that alone is showing some problem :P
16:22:06  <V453000> moar flatbeds I sez
16:22:13  <andythenorth> they’re a fallback choice, most cargos have a specific better wagon type
16:22:28  <andythenorth> V453000: +1, visible cargos ftw
16:22:48  <andythenorth> in 256 colour palette, there just aren’t enough colours to do this for box vans
16:22:54  <andythenorth> tankers there much fewer cargos
16:23:26  <V453000> XD
16:23:36  <frosch123> https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NML:Alternative_sprites#zoom_level <- wrote some stuff
16:24:13  <frosch123> https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NML:Alternative_sprites#Advanced_example_with_templates <- also added complicated example, which only those will understand who do not need it
16:25:42  <andythenorth> template the templates? o_O
16:25:43  <andythenorth> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/road-hog/repository/entry/src/templates/vehicle_with_cargo_specific_liveries.pynml
16:25:45  <andythenorth> for more fun?
16:27:14  <frosch123> yay, for fish in tankers :)
16:29:49  <andythenorth> I should make a new FISH
16:30:10  <V453000> frosch123: I can't fix it 100% with just sprite fixing
16:30:23  <V453000> at the corners there it often is necessary to add 1 extra pixel to the foundation sprite
16:30:31  <frosch123> andythenorth: iron horse, road hog, sea ape?
16:31:40  <V453000> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/20419525/BRIX/foundations-asdf.png bottom 2 pixels
16:31:44  <V453000> this shit occurs very often
16:32:21  <V453000> is there anything we are able to do about it?
16:32:28  <andythenorth> sea ape :P
16:32:39  <Alberth> sea monkey :p
16:32:48  <andythenorth> sea monkeys
16:32:50  <andythenorth> not bad
16:33:08  <andythenorth> sea or river?
16:33:10  <andythenorth> or lake?
16:33:29  <frosch123> V453000: why is that not fixable with sprites?
16:33:38  <V453000> more sprite height that way?
16:33:41  <frosch123> adding pixels at the bottom does not affect offsets
16:33:44  <V453000> oh
16:33:48  <V453000> ok :D
16:33:53  <frosch123> only top and left are troublesome
16:34:01  <V453000> so I just make it 1px higher and increase height in template by 1px?
16:34:02  <frosch123> you cannot change xxxx about top and left
16:34:21  <frosch123> yes, changing height should be fine
16:34:26  <V453000> amazing
16:34:28  <V453000> thank you
16:34:36  <andythenorth> lake placid?
16:34:54  <andythenorth> suits the monsters idea :P
16:35:00  <andythenorth> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Placid_(film)
16:35:48  <frosch123> nessie?
16:37:19  <frosch123> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea-Monkeys <- didn't know that word was a thing
16:39:32  <andythenorth> yup :)
16:39:33  <andythenorth> hmm
16:39:42  <andythenorth> improving river generation is probably way beyond me :P
16:39:44  <andythenorth> shame
16:39:46  <andythenorth> rivers are lame
16:40:07  <andythenorth> well, lame is too harsh :)
16:40:16  <andythenorth> rivers have unfulfilled potential
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17:10:06  <V453000> frosch123: how does this happen? something is over foundation, something isn't :D https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/20419525/BRIX/foundations-horizontal-wtf.png
17:10:14  <V453000> I guess it's just cause there is no tile under it, but still :D
17:10:19  <V453000> is there a way to fix that?
17:12:01  <frosch123> ignore the border in the front for now
17:12:13  <frosch123> just make the foundation align at the back side
17:13:01  <frosch123> the front border can only be fixed with a new ottd feature
17:13:39  <V453000> ah right
17:13:40  <V453000> ok :)
17:13:53  <V453000> will just add 1 pixel at the purple bottom, too
17:14:05  <V453000> the back is obvious. ;)
17:15:57  <frosch123> the ground sprite is drawn on top of the foundation
17:16:08  <frosch123> so can also just fill the inside of the foundation :p
17:16:27  <frosch123> though maybe not as cool for adding textures later
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17:39:08  <fjb> Moin.
17:41:58  <Alberth> o/
17:45:46  <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r27624 trunk/src/lang/spanish_MX.txt (2016-08-07 19:45:36 +0200 )
17:45:47  <DorpsGek> -Update from Eints:
17:45:48  <DorpsGek> spanish (mexican): 24 changes by Absay
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18:23:53  * LordAro waves
18:25:16  <LordAro> did some wikiing earlier
18:25:27  <LordAro> someone hasn't been keeping an eye on the release pages for me :p
18:52:16  <Alberth> hi hi
18:52:35  <Alberth> thanks for the update
19:36:55  <andythenorth> iz tram http://www.railpictures.net/photo/585115/
19:39:34  <Eddi|zuHause> i'd say "no"...
19:39:42  <Eddi|zuHause> that is a railcar with a regular wagon
19:43:24  <andythenorth> iz tram http://www.tramz.com/mx/lt/lt07.jpg
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19:48:57  <Eddi|zuHause> that would work
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21:05:02  <Samu> 4897/5000 original ships profit
21:05:02  *** sla_ro|master [~sla.ro@89.136.141.100] has quit []
21:05:22  <Samu> 4806/5000 npf ships profit
21:05:39  <Samu> 4965/5000 yapf ships profit
21:05:54  <Samu> nice npf recovery
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23:44:23  <Wolf01> 'night
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23:49:08  <Samu> trrans got 1023 lost ships
23:49:11  <Samu> trans*
23:49:29  <Samu> on the same route, the performance of that server is horrible
23:50:09  <Samu> worse than nocab trying to sell trains
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