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00:09:15 <Wolf01> 'night 00:09:18 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 00:13:10 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 00:14:18 *** JezK has quit IRC 00:17:28 *** JezK has joined #openttd 00:18:06 *** __ln__ has quit IRC 00:18:19 *** __ln__ has joined #openttd 00:20:05 *** SpComb^ has quit IRC 00:30:16 *** SpComb has joined #openttd 00:42:31 *** Flygon has quit IRC 00:48:02 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 01:16:09 *** Supercheese has quit IRC 01:17:29 *** MartinTheSupervisor has joined #openttd 01:35:06 *** chomwitt has quit IRC 01:38:43 *** markasoftware has joined #openttd 02:13:17 *** MartinTheSupervisor has quit IRC 02:20:31 *** ConductorCat has quit IRC 02:27:38 *** ConductorCat has joined #openttd 02:30:59 *** markasoftware has quit IRC 04:00:02 *** glx has quit IRC 04:25:36 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 04:35:13 *** markasoftware has joined #openttd 04:51:13 *** ConductorCat has quit IRC 04:55:35 *** ConductorCat has joined #openttd 05:00:29 *** Supercheese has quit IRC 05:41:14 *** markasoftware has quit IRC 06:01:04 *** chomwitt has joined #openttd 06:25:33 *** Snail has quit IRC 06:31:22 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 06:32:24 *** snadge__ has joined #openttd 06:37:01 *** chomwitt has quit IRC 06:39:05 *** snadge_ has quit IRC 06:45:21 *** JezK has quit IRC 06:54:45 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 07:39:39 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 07:48:50 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 08:19:56 <V453000> puny humanz' 08:20:03 <V453000> morning have good 08:20:04 <V453000> or else 08:20:14 <Supercheese> ya 08:20:21 <Supercheese> Have indeed good 08:21:07 <V453000> g 08:21:14 <V453000> do you even automate? 08:21:36 <Supercheese> Yes, Otto is my mate 08:22:08 <V453000> dayummm 08:22:40 <V453000> some new mods comin? 08:32:21 *** Supercheese has quit IRC 08:33:04 *** Arveen|Home is now known as Arveen|Work 08:57:51 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 09:06:45 *** DDR has joined #openttd 10:03:58 *** Biolunar has joined #openttd 10:10:33 *** Stimrol has joined #openttd 10:24:40 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 11:20:26 *** gelignite has quit IRC 11:24:47 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 11:25:01 <Wolf01> Moin 11:29:39 <Wolf01> https://img-9gag-fun.9cache.com/photo/a6bQAN8_460s.jpg eh, they will go skynet in microseconds 11:31:01 <__ln__> that would be more interesting if it was properly sourced 11:31:29 <Wolf01> http://www.sciencealert.com/google-s-new-ai-has-learned-to-become-highly-aggressive-in-stressful-situations 11:34:35 <Wolf01> Three laws of robotic needed as soon as possible 11:34:39 <__ln__> they should adapt it to be an openttd AI 11:35:28 <Wolf01> It's already pointing on starcraft, just to learn some warfare strategies 11:37:24 <Wolf01> Btw, it seem that intelligence brings to war, which is a nonsense 11:38:17 <crem> I hoped they finally they built a robor which can gather real apples from tree. But no, it's just some pixels on 8x16 screen. 11:39:03 <Wolf01> The principle is the same, we played with 320x200 games and even inferior resolution :P 11:52:43 *** matt11235 has joined #openttd 12:06:31 *** tokai|noir has joined #openttd 12:06:31 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai|noir 12:13:43 *** tokai has quit IRC 12:23:40 *** Flygon has quit IRC 12:23:52 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 12:44:41 *** Stimrol has quit IRC 13:11:02 *** chomwitt has joined #openttd 13:16:40 *** Mazur has quit IRC 13:22:12 *** Compu has quit IRC 13:24:49 *** Mazur has joined #openttd 13:28:04 *** Compu has joined #openttd 14:02:44 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 14:21:15 <Alkel_U3> Wolf01: https://youtu.be/dLRLYPiaAoA 14:23:59 <Wolf01> Wtf? 14:29:17 <Alkel_U3> in relation to that google's AI :-) 14:37:34 <Wolf01> It's too psychedelic, I can't follow it 14:48:20 *** maciozo has joined #openttd 15:26:19 *** Alberth has joined #openttd 15:26:20 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Alberth 15:43:49 *** ConductorCat has quit IRC 15:44:03 *** Lejving has quit IRC 15:46:03 *** ConductorCat has joined #openttd 15:59:55 *** dark_pingus has joined #openttd 16:11:43 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 16:12:37 <dark_pingus> hi I'm looking for documentation on scenario file. I am interested to the structure of scenario file. 16:17:54 <Wolf01> https://git.openttd.org/?p=trunk.git;a=tree;f=docs;hb=HEAD you can find some docs here 16:20:00 <dark_pingus> thank you 16:21:57 <Alberth> o/ 16:22:02 <Wolf01> o/ 16:22:20 <dark_pingus> Wolf01, seems that the link had a lot of info! so probably you have really helped me! thank you again 16:23:09 <Alberth> not so much about the scenario file format 16:23:29 <Alberth> it's just a savegame, docs is the code, in src/saveload 16:23:43 <Wolf01> You should read it while looking at the code, at least it explains what are the numbers :P 16:24:43 <dark_pingus> yes ... these numbers was driving me mad ... I was trying somekind of reverse engineering ... using simple scenario and building a "road" at time... 16:25:42 <dark_pingus> I want to realize a tool to put a "city" in a given place in the scenario in an automatic way. BUT: proportionally to lat and long... 16:26:36 <LordAro> sounds like you want a gamescript 16:27:21 <Alberth> there is a patch "reproducable <something> generation" that also aims to create scenarios 16:27:31 <Alberth> hi hi sirt Aro 16:27:33 <Alberth> *sir 16:27:56 <Wolf01> He's a Sith 16:28:07 <Alberth> :O 16:28:09 <LordAro> :o 16:28:19 <LordAro> o/ 16:28:31 <Alberth> unexpected qualities, just like that :) 16:30:30 <Wolf01> https://science.slashdot.org/story/17/02/19/2330251/serious-computer-glitches-can-be-caused-by-cosmic-rays <- I always said that 16:32:22 <Alberth> ha, we didn't leave bugs, you are affected by cosmic rays, or energy fields :) 16:33:04 <Wolf01> Or "you are holding it with the wrong hand", that works too 16:33:12 <Alberth> lol 16:36:00 <Alberth> I once read about error rates of cpus, I think, and while it was above 99.9<something>, given the high rate of these devices, you'd expect that errors do creep in sometimes 16:36:29 <Alberth> (likely it had more 9 figures :p ) 16:36:40 <Alberth> *digits 16:37:44 <dark_pingus> LordAro I want to realize something that given a scenario with given lat e long, and a file of lat-long and name it puts the cities on the scenario ... 16:38:25 <LordAro> i think a GS should be able to do that 16:38:37 <LordAro> probably can't take an arbitrary file as input though 16:39:02 <Wolf01> As I studied electronics, and knowing that IRL nothing works like a charm, it's more like an over-voltage of any kind, maybe even a bad ground connection and the bit-shift was triggered with a static from a guy with a pullover/pile jacket 16:39:33 * LordAro shifts Wolf01 16:39:49 * Wolf01 static-stabs LordAro 16:40:49 * LordAro dies 16:41:11 <Wolf01> Nah, just paralyzed 16:51:30 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 17:18:28 <dark_pingus> someone has other hints about the load/save code documentation ? 17:22:52 <Wolf01> The savegame/scenario might be compressed 17:23:49 <Wolf01> But if you don't need to use it outside the game... 17:29:52 *** ZirconiumX has joined #openttd 17:33:09 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 17:33:25 <dark_pingus> I have disabled compression to "none" in openttd.cfg 17:34:07 <dark_pingus> So, now I can use an hex editor to see save/scenario file contents 17:42:24 <Alberth> sounds a bit complicated if you can also read the source code 17:44:30 *** Snail has joined #openttd 17:44:38 <dark_pingus> yeah I am just reading source code ... 17:44:47 <dark_pingus> (use the source luke! :-) ) 17:45:16 <dark_pingus> but really I will love to have some nice documentation to read :-) 17:47:03 <dark_pingus> or maybe some nice comment embedded into the source code ! :-) 17:49:38 <Alberth> it's not a simple offset format 17:49:56 *** chomwitt has quit IRC 17:50:08 <Alberth> it's also not a fixed format, it changes every now and then 17:50:32 <Alberth> fields change or get added or get removed 17:50:53 <dark_pingus> Hi Alberth are you telling me that the scenario/save game format are unstable ? 17:51:12 <dark_pingus> are changing from a version to next one ? 17:51:28 <planetmaker> yes. Even more often 17:51:32 <planetmaker> good evening :) 17:51:39 <dark_pingus> good evening ... 17:51:44 <Wolf01> We are at version 195 actually iirc :P 17:51:48 <dark_pingus> wow... :-( 17:51:52 <planetmaker> ^^ around that, yes 17:52:09 <Alberth> extern const uint16 SAVEGAME_VERSION = 195; ///< Current savegame version of OpenTTD. <-- dark_pingus we're at version 195 17:52:10 <planetmaker> but it's all documented in the source. And also how it changes 17:52:16 <Alberth> see saveload.cpp, line 267 17:52:20 <Alberth> hi hi planetmaker! 17:52:32 <dark_pingus> Can I ask why you/they are changing format so often ? 17:52:39 <Alberth> new features 17:53:23 <dark_pingus> ok but I have seen "object" hooks into the code ... I was figuring that in a such way you can stabilize the format... 17:53:28 <Alberth> not to mention it's a save game, so it follows the internal storage format of openttd 17:53:44 <Alberth> so you pretty much have to rebuild a lot of openttd 17:54:04 <dark_pingus> And now are three hour that I am reading code to look for the internal format! :-) 17:54:11 <planetmaker> why? A stable format itself is no gain 17:54:37 <planetmaker> What we have is the 'promise' that we load savegames from all older versions 17:54:39 <Alberth> a loader and saver routine exists, it's openttd 17:54:56 <dark_pingus> planetmaker, why are you telling me so'? I am customed to have developing version and stable version ... 17:55:06 <planetmaker> yes, of the programme 17:55:29 <dark_pingus> if you can't port your data from a version to the next one 17:55:37 <planetmaker> we can and do 17:55:43 <dark_pingus> this seems to me a bad thing 17:56:02 <dark_pingus> a really bad one. 17:56:12 <planetmaker> you fail to explain why :) 17:56:14 <Alberth> old versions get loaded and converted in afterload 17:56:29 <dark_pingus> Alberth ok 17:56:32 <planetmaker> what's bad about changing savegame format if we can load any version we ever created? 17:57:07 <Alberth> it's not simple, probably :) 17:57:12 <dark_pingus> planetmaker: nothing if you maintain compatibility with the data previuosly saved 17:57:28 <planetmaker> we do. And even beyond the start of this project into prehistoric age 17:57:41 <Alberth> all the way back to 200<something> 17:58:03 <dark_pingus> ok this is good... I have misunderstood your words . 17:58:10 <Alberth> as well as the original game 17:58:21 <dark_pingus> THIS IS AN IDEA! 17:58:35 <Alberth> no it's 4 words :) 17:58:36 <dark_pingus> I can start to read the initial version... 17:58:44 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 17:58:48 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 17:58:49 <dark_pingus> probably is more simple 17:58:51 <Alberth> quak 17:59:08 <Alberth> my guess is, it's more confusing 17:59:08 <dark_pingus> quak!:-) 17:59:08 <Wolf01> Quak 17:59:16 <frosch123> moi 17:59:40 <Alberth> dark_pingus: look at a few commits that change the line I indicated 17:59:54 <Alberth> that should give you a good idea how changes are handled 18:02:01 <dark_pingus> true 18:05:21 <dark_pingus> nice ... 18:05:43 <dark_pingus> I will google to look for external tools to manage the scenarios :-( 18:11:59 <Alberth> search tt-forums.net 18:13:11 <dark_pingus> thank you! 18:13:34 <Alberth> but basically, there is only openttd that reads/writes save games and scenarios 18:13:50 <Alberth> there are patches for openttd, and probably a few game scripts 18:20:14 <dark_pingus> I see :-( 18:20:18 *** Gja has joined #openttd 18:20:45 <dark_pingus> se seems that to have an object automatically placed on map, I have to : 18:21:14 <dark_pingus> get the loadsave ccp 18:21:24 <dark_pingus> understand it 18:21:44 <dark_pingus> then understand the resulting data structure 18:22:05 <dark_pingus> and you have told me that these things change frequently ... 18:22:18 <dark_pingus> :-( 18:22:41 <dark_pingus> I would daresay that I am unfortunate! :-) 18:24:07 <frosch123> openttd savegame are not self-descriptive 18:24:21 *** glx has joined #openttd 18:24:21 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 18:24:31 <frosch123> you cannot make a tool that can process all savegames there may ever be 18:24:43 <frosch123> only openttd can read its savegames, noone else 18:24:57 <planetmaker> o/ 18:25:04 <planetmaker> it's an idea which frequently surfaces, though 18:25:06 <dark_pingus> yes I want it but I have found really few docs ... 18:25:07 <frosch123> a rare planetmaker :) 18:25:45 <frosch123> dark_pingus: https://devs.openttd.org/~frosch/texts/printhunk.c <- that is as much as you can get 18:25:45 <dark_pingus> well now I have some other things to do ... but thank you all! 18:28:05 <dark_pingus> thank you frosch123 18:34:42 *** Progman has joined #openttd 18:36:26 <frosch123> damn... now there is a second submission for the title game 18:36:34 <frosch123> i hopes we could get away without having to vote 18:37:27 <frosch123> meh, and it's close to the troll submission :/ 18:38:32 <Alberth> :( 18:39:38 <planetmaker> :( 18:43:22 <frosch123> well, forum poll it is then 18:43:51 <frosch123> no secret vote, but good enough 18:45:24 <LordAro> lol 18:55:13 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 19:04:45 <Wolf01> Ha! "for the lulz" 19:06:47 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 19:18:12 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 19:18:23 <andythenorth> o/ 19:18:32 <Wolf01> o/ 19:23:02 <Alberth> o/ 19:29:46 <Alberth> 0800-0CFF looks like an off-by 100, shouldn't that be 0800-0BFF ? 19:50:11 * andythenorth will count on fingers :P 19:55:26 <frosch123> Alberth: yes :) 19:56:36 <Alberth> :o lots of fingers andy 19:59:16 <planetmaker> millipede or so ;) 19:59:29 <frosch123> Alberth: that was an accident when forking 20:00:06 <frosch123> parallelized pixel pushing 20:01:50 <Alberth> :D 20:04:09 <Alberth> Even milllipede isn't enough, only 750 legs 20:04:14 <Alberth> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millipede 20:07:16 <planetmaker> too bad :) But I learnt something new :) 20:09:23 <andythenorth> it’s planetmaker :) 20:10:31 <andythenorth> that title game needs diagonal corners 20:10:32 *** Stimrol has joined #openttd 20:10:39 <andythenorth> pixel N glyphs are poor :P 20:10:45 <planetmaker> :) 20:11:28 *** chomwitt has joined #openttd 20:13:23 <andythenorth> meanwhile I recommend this (the song more than the video) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_UmOY6ek_Y4 20:16:09 <Alberth> tempted to write func(void) instead of func(), written too much C lately :p 20:28:29 <frosch123> maybe try k&r c for once 20:29:09 <Alberth> ha, not old enough :p 20:29:54 <Alberth> ANSI had already taken over C when I learned it 20:30:21 <frosch123> i also only learned it when encounting it in production, and i wondered, why does this even compile :p 20:30:30 <frosch123> +about 20:31:01 <frosch123> i never learned fortran either, but somehow it reminded me about it 20:31:53 * andythenorth is still learning python :P 20:32:01 <andythenorth> devloloper 20:32:19 * andythenorth wishes PHP_CEO was his twitter account :P 20:33:02 <andythenorth> https://twitter.com/PHP_CEO 20:33:26 <planetmaker> is func(void) not good in C++? or talking about python, Alberth ? 20:33:30 <frosch123> andythenorth: anything that writes reserved words in all-uppercase, you can safely ignore 20:34:13 <frosch123> planetmaker: only if you put "extern C" in front :) 20:34:42 * andythenorth should knuckle down and refactor some FIRSes 20:35:37 *** Biolunar has quit IRC 20:35:50 <frosch123> he, when comparing a fortran77 tutorial with a fortran95 tutorial.. it mostly seems to differ in upper/lowercase 20:36:01 <__ln__> func(void) is valid in C++ but Stroustrup considers it ugly 20:37:41 <Alberth> planetmaker: I think it's deprecated 20:37:59 <Alberth> Python has no void type :) 20:38:26 <andythenorth> seems FIRS needs incompatible checks for “Preindustrial era houses” and “Oil rig layout" 20:39:37 <Alberth> the former makes sense, presence of FIRS would break the set :) 20:41:14 <andythenorth> definitionally :) 20:41:26 <andythenorth> I probably have to look up the grfids or something 20:41:29 <andythenorth> and put them in a templae 20:41:32 <andythenorth> or template 20:47:33 <planetmaker> I see :) So we did bad stuff when we recently hacked around Arduinos and stuff :P 20:49:34 <V453000> o/ 20:51:02 <planetmaker> \o 20:52:33 <Alberth> there are enough C++ versions to choose from :) 20:52:46 <V453000> how are you ?:) 20:53:01 <Alberth> iirc one of the earlier did do that, to stay compatible with C 20:53:18 <Alberth> fine V, thanks, how are you? 20:54:12 <planetmaker> fine as well :) And you? Still drawing factori(o)es 20:54:13 <planetmaker> ? 20:57:14 <V453000> drawing factorioes like mad, it's amazing 20:57:39 <V453000> learning new things every day, can't complain at all 20:58:00 <V453000> I feel fully utilized, we're planning some seriously crazy things visually 20:58:04 <V453000> not slugs though :( 20:58:45 <Alberth> V is slowly turning into a programmer :) 20:59:02 <frosch123> Alberth: i just tried. --std=c++14 still compiles func(void) 20:59:13 <frosch123> no warning either 20:59:34 <Alberth> hmm, sed pattern? :p 20:59:40 <V453000> yeah, learning a lot of python, mainly blender python but normal python as well, is great 21:00:21 <frosch123> do pythons count as slugs? 21:00:41 <frosch123> or does english have a third term next to snail/slug? 21:01:26 <frosch123> oh, "snake"... 21:01:45 <frosch123> meh, i am too tired or so 21:02:03 <frosch123> they seemed similar :p 21:02:33 <V453000> guess they should yeah 21:02:40 <V453000> it's just longer slug 21:03:29 <planetmaker> hehe 21:19:29 <Alberth> nn 21:20:00 *** Alberth has left #openttd 21:20:25 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 21:23:19 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 21:23:31 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 21:25:36 *** orudge has quit IRC 21:25:41 *** orudge has joined #openttd 21:26:14 *** orudge` has joined #openttd 21:26:14 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o orudge` 21:31:58 *** Progman has quit IRC 21:44:17 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 21:44:34 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 21:45:25 *** Supercheese has quit IRC 21:57:35 *** andythenorth has left #openttd 21:59:23 *** supermop_ has joined #openttd 22:03:54 *** supermop has quit IRC 22:16:22 <__ln__> @seen Gonozal_VIII 22:16:22 <DorpsGek> __ln__: I have not seen Gonozal_VIII. 22:21:51 <Eddi|zuHause> today's episode of "we dig up a name from 5 years ago"? 22:23:17 <__ln__> more or less, except DorpsGek was supposed to tell how many years. 22:25:26 <Eddi|zuHause> my logs say 2008 22:25:35 <Eddi|zuHause> and in 2010 DorpsGek already didn't know him 22:27:36 <__ln__> DorpsGek's clearly not an elephant then 22:31:37 *** Biolunar has joined #openttd 22:36:22 *** ZirconiumX has quit IRC 22:43:06 *** gelignite has quit IRC 22:46:04 <planetmaker> @seen TrueBrain 22:46:05 <DorpsGek> planetmaker: TrueBrain was last seen in #openttd 7 weeks, 1 day, 10 hours, 13 minutes, and 28 seconds ago: <TrueBrain> LordAro: it is working for me now (tm) :P 22:46:37 <Eddi|zuHause> he was superceded by the bot... 22:46:48 <planetmaker> yeah, I know :| 22:59:41 *** matt11235 has quit IRC 23:00:50 *** FLHerne has quit IRC 23:11:06 *** dark_pingus has quit IRC 23:17:40 *** JezK has joined #openttd 23:19:34 *** Biolunar has quit IRC 23:21:57 <Wolf01> 'night 23:22:00 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 23:22:58 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 has joined #openttd 23:27:28 *** Gja has quit IRC 23:27:59 *** Stimrol has quit IRC 23:29:10 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 23:33:15 *** maciozo has quit IRC 23:34:13 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 23:42:22 *** Supercheese has quit IRC 23:43:47 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 23:45:55 *** Wormnest has quit IRC