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00:00:46 *** Arveen2 has joined #openttd 00:02:08 <Eddi|zuHause> "The new express train from Göteborg to Stockholm is now called 'Trainy McTrainface'" 00:05:47 *** Arveen has quit IRC 00:17:44 <Gustavo6046> Swedish detected. 00:17:50 <Gustavo6046> I'm from Brazil. 00:17:54 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 00:21:23 <Wolf01> 'night 00:21:26 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 00:35:13 *** Mahjong has joined #openttd 00:35:37 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm not swedish, btw. 01:15:58 *** glx has quit IRC 01:21:59 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 01:36:45 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 02:05:45 *** Supercheese has quit IRC 02:06:22 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 02:10:36 *** Gustavo6046 has quit IRC 02:25:04 *** chomwitt has quit IRC 02:27:01 *** tokai|noir has joined #openttd 02:27:02 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai|noir 02:33:12 *** cosmobird has joined #openttd 02:33:52 *** tokai has quit IRC 02:41:47 *** cosmobird has quit IRC 02:43:22 *** cosmobird has joined #openttd 03:36:27 *** cosmobird_ has joined #openttd 03:42:48 *** cosmobird has quit IRC 03:44:49 *** cosmobird_ has quit IRC 04:11:21 *** cosmobird has joined #openttd 04:22:17 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 05:25:03 *** cosmobird_ has joined #openttd 05:30:34 *** cosmobird has quit IRC 05:34:27 *** sim-al2 is now known as Guest7070 05:34:28 *** sim-al2 has joined #openttd 05:37:59 *** Guest7070 has quit IRC 05:38:28 *** cosmobird__ has joined #openttd 05:40:30 *** sim-al2 is now known as Guest7071 05:40:31 *** sim-al2 has joined #openttd 05:41:08 *** ToffeeYogurtPots has quit IRC 05:42:34 *** ToffeeYogurtPots has joined #openttd 05:44:48 *** cosmobird_ has quit IRC 05:46:28 *** Guest7071 has quit IRC 05:58:30 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 05:58:57 <andythenorth> such http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8703/horse_tank_6_4.png 06:30:30 *** sim-al2 has quit IRC 06:35:47 *** Supercheese has quit IRC 06:36:22 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 06:54:38 <V453000> andythenorth: I'd say it's good enough for now, although the progression feels weird 06:54:43 <V453000> why black - black - CCstripes - black ? 06:54:49 <V453000> I'd expect black-black-black-CC 06:57:08 <andythenorth> mostly for maximum difference between each generation 06:57:14 <andythenorth> but I had same concern 06:57:22 <andythenorth> more CC => more modern? 06:57:45 <V453000> maybe not just that, but simply the difference 06:57:58 <V453000> you expect the thing to be evolving from one to the other, not from one, through another, and back 06:58:14 <V453000> maybe try to give some of the longer tankers just 2 holes at the top? is detail but eh 06:58:45 <andythenorth> or 4... 06:58:50 <V453000> or 8 06:58:58 <andythenorth> depends how many smaller tankers in gen 6 06:59:03 <andythenorth> smaller ones have 1 or 2 holes 06:59:16 <V453000> :) I can't way to try horse 06:59:29 <andythenorth> you will hate all of itr 06:59:36 <andythenorth> such fuckery http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8698/horsey_tanks_a_lot.png 06:59:54 <andythenorth> integer madness 07:00:07 <V453000> that's a lot of fuckery 07:00:28 <V453000> pretty cool fuckery though 07:00:38 <V453000> my shit is going to be in an 8/8 array always, boring :P 07:00:44 <Arveen2> g'mornig 07:00:47 <andythenorth> I considered just randomising lengths :P 07:00:52 <V453000> XD 07:00:59 <V453000> luckily you can't do that, right 07:01:08 <andythenorth> dunno, think I _probably_ could 07:01:14 <andythenorth> somehow 07:01:18 <V453000> really 07:01:27 <V453000> I Think I tried that at some point 07:01:28 <V453000> but eh 07:01:33 <V453000> maybe not correctly 07:02:20 <andythenorth> some hax 07:02:24 <andythenorth> articulated consists or something 07:02:46 <andythenorth> could even measure train length, to force it to always integer or 0.5 of a tile 07:02:47 <V453000> you can't change amount of articulated units on the fly afaik 07:03:01 <V453000> haha that would be super wtf 07:03:08 <andythenorth> totally bonkers 07:03:21 <V453000> or boners if done well :P 07:05:13 <V453000> I was drawing some boxcars today 07:05:32 <V453000> NUTS has auschwitz against boxcars, but in the next set I want to have those as well 07:05:35 <V453000> variety and stuff 07:05:44 <V453000> I'm just figuring out how to show cargo in them 07:05:55 <V453000> open/closed door and being able to see inside through door during loading sounds like yes 07:06:21 <V453000> while needing to keep in mind x1 zoom, some door are really small 07:11:43 * andythenorth has had similar ideas for box car 07:12:01 <andythenorth> 50% alpha :P 07:12:01 <V453000> yeah well honestly there aren't many possibilies 07:12:13 <andythenorth> ban box cars? o_O 07:12:21 <V453000> I'm considering to have wagons see-through and reveal cargo without obstructions during loading, maybe as a parameter 07:12:27 <andythenorth> why would new NUTS need box cars? 07:12:29 <V453000> would be awesome for boxcars and tankers 07:12:52 <V453000> just for variety of wagons, since I have 1 ultimate wagon it makes even more sense to actually make each cargo wagon different 07:13:05 <V453000> because it doesn't inflate purchase menu yet gives variety 07:13:20 <V453000> I'm probably going to be rather lazy and just do the usual bunch but let's see 07:13:31 <andythenorth> https://i.pinimg.com/originals/38/9b/9b/389b9b7413efeb712d649e22bd52b455.jpg 07:13:33 <andythenorth> solved 07:13:43 <V453000> :D well that's kind of halfway nuts 07:14:16 * andythenorth might try recolour box cars to cargo 07:14:18 <andythenorth> like tank cars 07:14:30 <andythenorth> dunno 07:14:53 <V453000> but imagine you have a boxcar and you can see inside when it's loading 07:14:58 <V453000> not realistic but kind of cool, no? 07:15:11 <V453000> like the front walls would be removed and you see the cargo directly 07:15:28 <V453000> with 3d model I just slice a part off, iz rather cheap 07:16:12 <andythenorth> seems fine 07:16:18 <V453000> and since it's just about defining it in the loading spritegroup, I don't even need extra sprites for parameter 07:16:24 <V453000> so easy to turn off 07:16:34 <andythenorth> just reuse flat cars 07:16:38 <andythenorth> paint walls over 07:16:45 <V453000> I'll do some experimenting, it's not exactly easy in Blender either 07:16:46 <V453000> haha 07:16:55 <V453000> nah the back walls are a part of the bottom layer 07:17:12 * V453000 is going for full retard mode of 4 layer wagons 07:17:42 <V453000> OpenTTD might reject my shit by throwing rendering performance issues at me 07:17:50 <V453000> but someone has to test it (tm) 07:18:57 *** chomwitt has joined #openttd 07:19:17 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 07:23:18 *** mindlesstux has quit IRC 07:23:48 *** mindlesstux has joined #openttd 07:25:27 <V453000> but yeah, plans, dreams 07:28:26 <andythenorth> :D 07:29:27 <V453000> honestly I have been planning this set for so long that I'm not sure if I'm not just a total dreamy faggot who will never do it 07:29:34 <V453000> is about time I start making it reality 07:30:13 <andythenorth> bbls 07:30:15 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 07:30:55 <V453000> gg :) 07:35:45 *** Defaultti has joined #openttd 07:39:21 *** cosmobird__ has quit IRC 07:45:13 *** juzza1 has quit IRC 07:50:38 *** cosmobird has joined #openttd 07:56:28 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 08:02:42 *** Biolunar has joined #openttd 08:13:48 <Mahjong> um, I have two oil ships on the edge of the map looping round in circles, thoughts? 08:14:27 *** Prof_Frink has quit IRC 08:15:23 <Mahjong> some weirdness happened.. not sure but i've got them out of their little dance for now 08:18:47 *** cosmobird_ has joined #openttd 08:21:47 *** juzza1 has joined #openttd 08:21:59 *** ShrewdSpirit has joined #openttd 08:24:48 *** cosmobird has quit IRC 08:25:51 <ShrewdSpirit> Hello. Why the game's pathfinding for vehicles is so dumb? ._. http://up.vbiran.ir/uploads/15195150848785027682_Untitled.png 08:26:08 <ShrewdSpirit> They can't use the other road I made for them .-. 08:27:51 *** cosmobird_ has quit IRC 08:28:07 <V453000> yeah road vehicles are quite specific 08:28:29 <ShrewdSpirit> Dumb* 08:28:47 <ShrewdSpirit> Isn't there a way to avoid causing such messes? :c 08:29:02 <V453000> https://wiki.openttdcoop.org/Road_Vehicle_Networking 08:29:26 <V453000> this is basically the only thing that you can do with RVs 08:29:41 <V453000> ... it's why trains are so much superior, RVs are just too shallow 08:29:48 <ShrewdSpirit> Oh, let me see 08:30:22 <V453000> basically you build a dual station and when there is a car in 1 station, cars will try to go to the other one 08:30:34 <V453000> so with full enough road they will pretty much perfectly alternate betwen the two 08:30:43 <V453000> making sure the 1 road doesn't get overcrowded 08:30:55 <ShrewdSpirit> Hmm, right 08:31:04 <V453000> there are settings to set the exact amount of pathfinder penalties you get from it but overall the concept tends to work 08:31:23 <V453000> since it's all just "is value high enough", it can be situational if some detours override the other numbers 08:31:28 <ShrewdSpirit> What if it was a looong road connecting multiple kinds of stations? 08:31:49 <V453000> that would work fine, especially if the long road would be similar lengths 08:32:03 <V453000> the more the length difference between them, the more likely it is to break 08:32:22 <V453000> but you can increase the penalty-from-occupied-station to make it work more reliably 08:33:11 <V453000> is it kind of weird to work with numbers? is it kind of just masturbation over RV pathfinder? Yes to both, but that's really the only thing you can do if you want to work with RVs in large scale 08:34:19 <Mahjong> yep... I have a spot where ships get stuck in a whirpool, very confusing i've tried changing a bunch of things 08:34:32 <V453000> well ships are just another level :D 08:34:56 <V453000> there you don't even have this kind of trick 08:35:15 <ShrewdSpirit> I'm much more comfortable with RVs :D Trans make me sick to manage and they get stuck and stuff like that 08:35:23 <Mahjong> a-ha! I don't know exactly why but one ship depot was causing it to freak out 08:35:42 <Mahjong> like it was trying to get through solid land or something I don't know 08:36:07 <V453000> you can masturbate over train pathfinder 1000 times more than over RV pathfinder :P the shit and hacks you can do there is just off the scale 08:36:39 <ShrewdSpirit> The cool thing about trains is that I can increase their length as much as I want :D So cool 08:36:57 <V453000> yes the modularity is super nice 08:37:32 <V453000> the main thing in trains is the almost unlimited amount of complexity you can discover, where RVs really only have a few tricks 08:38:06 <ShrewdSpirit> Exactly 08:38:15 <ShrewdSpirit> And all those features bring more complexity to them 08:38:20 <ShrewdSpirit> They are hard to manage 08:38:30 <ShrewdSpirit> I only use the block signal bc I don't know the rest xD 08:38:57 <V453000> well yeah the signals can be rather unintuitive but once you learn all the things, shit gets real 08:41:49 <ShrewdSpirit> I've seen rail systems that only gods can make 08:42:28 <V453000> I built https://blog.openttdcoop.org/2013/08/06/dont-try-this-at-home-prozone-game-2013/ 08:42:37 <V453000> you can't get much more retarded than that 08:43:37 <Mahjong> V453000, you lunatic 08:43:41 *** ShrewdSpirit_ has joined #openttd 08:44:59 <ShrewdSpirit_> V453000: Nice 08:50:56 *** ShrewdSpirit has quit IRC 09:14:04 <V453000> gg 09:25:18 *** ShrewdSpirit_ has quit IRC 09:26:11 *** Supercheese has quit IRC 09:33:01 *** ToBeFree has joined #openttd 09:41:53 *** ToBeFree has quit IRC 09:52:15 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 10:03:17 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 10:05:53 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 10:06:08 <Wolf01> Moin 10:28:54 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 10:29:07 <Wolf01> Meow 10:34:53 <V453000> anus 10:34:56 <andythenorth> funny wolf noise 10:35:07 <V453000> wold doesn't even know 10:35:11 <V453000> wolf 10:35:12 <andythenorth> V453000 has gone like an alt-right bot :( 10:35:21 <andythenorth> he would have an egg if he was on Twitter 10:35:24 <V453000> alt right? 10:35:37 <Wolf01> "Alt Gr" 10:35:39 <andythenorth> bots that rock up and are rude to liberals 10:35:40 <V453000> ah nice alt arrows switch channels in webirc :D 10:35:46 <andythenorth> and wolves 10:35:53 *** debdog has quit IRC 10:35:56 <V453000> I'm rude to everyone including myself 10:35:58 <V453000> is fair 10:36:04 <V453000> fuck you all yo 10:38:13 *** Arveen2 has quit IRC 10:38:43 *** debdog has joined #openttd 10:58:18 *** Gja has joined #openttd 10:58:34 *** Gja has quit IRC 11:06:05 <Wolf01> Yay, biscuits 11:07:03 *** ToffeeYogurtPots has quit IRC 11:07:04 *** murr4y has quit IRC 11:34:34 *** murr4y has joined #openttd 12:11:26 *** sim-al2 has joined #openttd 12:15:27 *** Samu has joined #openttd 12:15:34 <Samu> hi 12:15:53 <Samu> your forum ads are becoming a bit naughty recently 12:16:14 <Samu> "explore asian women, join now" 12:17:43 <V453000> send pics 12:18:07 <Samu> k 12:20:17 <Samu> https://imgur.com/iX0OkAt 12:20:31 <Samu> so it's japanese, not asian 12:24:49 <Wolf01> Is there a banner there? 12:30:21 <V453000> I meant pics from the detailed exploration 12:30:28 <Wolf01> XDXDXDXD 12:40:39 <peter1139> Samu, the meaning of 'Asian' differs depending on where you are. 12:41:12 <peter1139> Samu, https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/153890/why-dont-americans-refer-to-indians-and-others-from-the-subcontinent-as-asian etc 12:41:45 <andythenorth> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8704/horse_tank_6_5.png 12:41:49 <andythenorth> V453000: all won ^ 12:41:51 <andythenorth> enough 12:42:27 <V453000> ultimate victory achieved, go collect your japanese bitches now 12:42:34 <andythenorth> V453000 :( 12:42:44 <V453000> :D 12:43:03 <andythenorth> I have to no let my kids in this channel :| 12:44:10 <V453000> do they join this channel? 12:44:12 <Samu> indians are indians 12:44:37 <Samu> asians are chinese, japanese, koreans, that kind of stuff 12:44:50 <andythenorth> V453000: they read it on my username :P 12:45:04 <V453000> nice so sometimes I'm not talking to you actually 12:45:05 <V453000> sick 12:45:30 <andythenorth> they’re not allowed to ttype 12:45:36 <andythenorth> talking to strangers online is banned 12:45:40 <V453000> doesn't mean they don't do it 12:45:48 <andythenorth> yair 12:46:00 <andythenorth> they get upset really quickly 12:46:02 <Samu> the portuguese empire had some part of india as theirs, i guess that's some influence 12:46:06 <andythenorth> lots of hate in YT comments 12:46:09 <andythenorth> etc 12:46:10 <Samu> as to why we call them indians 12:46:37 <andythenorth> internet is basically over 12:46:37 <Samu> our current prime-minister is indian 12:46:40 <andythenorth> drowned in hate 12:46:51 <Samu> not even portuguese 12:47:27 <V453000> :D hm 12:47:28 <Samu> peter1139: 12:48:15 *** mindlesstux has quit IRC 12:48:46 *** mindlesstux has joined #openttd 12:51:18 <Wolf01> andythenorth: still missing octan livery 12:51:30 <andythenorth> Wolf01: needs Octan cargo :P 12:51:38 <Wolf01> Octan cargo is petrol 12:52:04 <Wolf01> They invented "octan" since they broke the partnership with Shell 12:53:26 <Wolf01> https://www.humblebundle.com/store/sid-meiers-civilization-iii-complete also, for who still doesn't have it, it's free for limited time (steam code) 12:59:06 <Samu> Sid Meier's Civilization® III: Complete is provided via Steam key for Windows. For key redemption, a free Steam account is required. 12:59:14 <Samu> i don't have a steam account, :( 12:59:20 <andythenorth> hmm these Horse tank cars remind me of something 12:59:22 <Wolf01> Make one 12:59:28 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 12:59:38 <Samu> not really free is it 12:59:50 <Wolf01> Making the account is free 13:00:02 <Wolf01> Also redeeming that game is free 13:00:06 <andythenorth> https://www.flickr.com/photos/andythenorth/sets/72157624453772117 13:00:13 <andythenorth> https://www.flickr.com/photos/andythenorth/14070189228/in/album-72157644406618728/ 13:00:15 <Samu> "free, if u do a ton of shit u don't really want to!" 13:00:29 <Wolf01> Lolwhat? 13:00:44 <Wolf01> Nice tank wagon, andythenorth :D 13:00:56 <andythenorth> Horse clearly 13:01:02 <Wolf01> Totally 13:01:19 <Samu> well, windows 10 was also free! 13:01:27 <andythenorth> dear Apple, please can my keyboard work, thanks, love andythenorh 13:01:34 <andythenorth> see 13:01:40 <andythenorth> fucking ’t’ key doesn’ttt work 13:01:45 <andythenorth> down arrow doesn’t work 13:01:50 <andythenorth> space and left-shift don’t work 13:02:00 <Wolf01> Did you try to not eat over it? 13:02:14 <andythenorth> I never had to change my behaviour like that before 13:02:36 <andythenorth> yes there are things stuck to it that are food 13:02:53 <andythenorth> but all previous macs managed actual real life situations 13:02:56 <Wolf01> Also me, if I look carefully I should be able to make a biscuit from what's inside the keyboard... not edible thought 13:12:46 <peter1139> Samu, 1) Steam isn't like that. 2) Everyone has a Steam account. 13:13:19 <andythenorth> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8705/horse_tank_mayhem.png 13:14:20 <Samu> heh... everyone has windows 13:14:49 <peter1139> Linux lachesis 3.2.0-4-686-pae #1 SMP Debian 3.2.78-1 i686 GNU/Linux 13:14:51 <peter1139> Yeah 13:14:55 <peter1139> Hmm, that's a bit old :p 13:15:28 <peter1139> oldoldstable 13:15:35 <Samu> they just forgot to say I needed a microsoft account tied up to my windows 10 license/install or so 13:15:47 <Mahjong> VERSION 13:16:05 <Wolf01> Wut? 13:16:51 <Samu> if you reinstall your "free" copy of windows 10... you have to log in to your microsoft account 13:17:02 <Samu> else. 1 month later, you get a nice surprise 13:17:09 <Wolf01> I know, I meant this: [15:15:43] [Mahjong:#openttd VERSION] 13:17:53 *** chomwitt has quit IRC 13:17:57 <Samu> be sure to reinstall windows 10 using the same system specs 13:18:07 <Samu> so much free it is... 13:18:27 <Mahjong> "Magic thought waves" this is my favourite 13:18:46 <Mahjong> I wish I could connect to IRC through magic thought waves 13:18:52 <Wolf01> Samu: it's not anymore like that, you only need to reactivare it manually if you change hardware 13:20:19 <peter1139> Samu, anyway, don't you use adblockers? :p 13:20:25 <Samu> nop 13:20:34 <peter1139> ublock origin 13:20:59 <peter1139> Oh wait, you are using Edge? LOLOL 13:21:04 <peter1139> What a weirdo. 13:21:20 <Samu> well, it works 13:21:23 <Samu> that's all that matters 13:21:52 <Wolf01> I use edge with ublock origin 13:22:01 <ST2> yup, it worked perfectly fine to get Firefox and Opera xD 13:23:26 <Wolf01> It works fine, at least I can sync passwords and bookmarks with my phone 13:25:09 <Flygon> I'm still not sure how the heck I haven't had to use a Microsoft Account on my Windows 10 copy. 13:25:36 <Flygon> Then again, I've somehow torn through the install enough that it's more a facsimile of 7. 13:25:48 <Flygon> Problem - It still has the bloody ribbon interface for Explorer. 13:25:54 <Flygon> And it's a bloody nightmare. 13:26:13 <Wolf01> You don't need to use a hotmail/live email to create an account, you can use any email now 13:26:47 <Flygon> You've been able to use custom emails for MS accounts since at least 2003. 13:27:04 <Flygon> > I wonder how I managed to do that 13:30:28 <Flygon> (Honestly - It was by complete accident) 13:31:25 <Wolf01> BTW, I like the ribbon, and you can doubleclick to hide it 13:31:49 <Wolf01> Still opens a ribbon when you select a menu item 13:31:51 <Flygon> But can it bring back classic explorer menu? D: 13:32:03 <Wolf01> You mean the vertical one? 13:32:26 <Flygon> Yeah. 13:32:37 <Wolf01> No, that's long dead 13:32:41 <Flygon> Shit. 13:32:51 <Wolf01> Use a different file explorer 13:32:52 <Flygon> Looks like I'm beating dead life out of 7 where possible. 13:33:13 <Flygon> (The 7 drivers supplied for the laptop, erm, didn't work >_>) 13:33:49 <Wolf01> I had less problems to make the tablet work with win 10 than win 8, and it was born with 7 13:34:16 <Wolf01> With win 10 I didn't even had to install the utilities, it downloaded everything on its own 13:34:36 <Flygon> (Soo it's stuck on 10, thanks to the range of Windows-only apps I'm stuck on. - I know about the whole 'Go use Linux and WINE' thing, but... I'm both lazy and confronted with software-driver interaction concerns. :V) 13:34:46 <Flygon> (Emphasis on the lazy) 13:35:19 <Flygon> (So instead I'm so lazy I beat Windows 10 into submission knowing it's futile because a future update's gonna sh... shoot all over my work. :V) 13:36:47 <Flygon> Ehh... 13:36:53 <Flygon> I'm a very particular man, I'll put it that way. 13:37:00 <Flygon> I have zero idea what I'm going to do past 2020. 13:37:14 <Flygon> I seriously don't know. It'll be the date software finally stops actually supporting 7. 13:37:29 <Flygon> Regardless of if it really needs to stop supporting it. 13:38:00 <Flygon> (Never mind people will find ways to cheese their way into the ultra-long term support updates - XP style :V) 13:39:08 <Flygon> Seems those XP updates run out 2019 13:39:47 *** supermop_ has joined #openttd 13:40:55 <Samu> have you considered inflation: Off by default on future openttds? 13:41:21 <andythenorth> inflation is such crap 13:41:47 <supermop_> seems like someone could write a less dumb inflation 13:42:02 <supermop_> even a meaningless x% across the board 13:42:19 <Wolf01> Why I feel like targeted every time you write "someone"? 13:42:41 <supermop_> just as an option for people who feel like they absolutely need it 13:42:52 <supermop_> Wolf01: do you have a highlight on 'someone'? 13:43:15 <Wolf01> Nope, but my brain highlights that word 13:43:23 <Flygon> (Anyway, g'night!) 13:43:32 <Wolf01> Nn 13:43:42 <__ln__> someone's a bit paranoid (not saying who) 13:43:56 <Wolf01> See, that happened again 13:44:16 <Wolf01> https://bugs.openttd.org/task/6628 <- ROFL "bug" 13:45:48 <supermop_> respond with 'cannot reproduce' 13:45:55 <Wolf01> andythenorth should be more polite than me to reply :P 13:46:02 <supermop_> just to see what happens 13:49:27 *** Flygon has quit IRC 13:50:28 *** sim-al2 has quit IRC 13:50:36 <Wolf01> And we have the first W10:FCU bug! 13:50:53 <Wolf01> I'm waiting to update so I can try to reproduce it 13:51:40 <Wolf01> https://bugs.openttd.org/task/6629 <- isn't a similar behavior of the OS X one? 13:55:57 <Samu> on settings.ini file, how do I make a setting become disabled if the value of another setting is also disabled? 13:56:18 <Wolf01> Non on settings.ini 13:56:21 <Wolf01> *Not 13:56:35 <Wolf01> You need to check it on the UI when you change the values 13:56:40 <Samu> so, on settings_gui.cpp? 13:57:09 <Wolf01> Yes 13:57:24 <Wolf01> Look how other settings do it 13:57:36 <Samu> i don't think there's any other setting that do it 13:59:38 <Samu> Enable extra running costs for trains: On / Off 13:59:59 <Samu> Extra running costs for trains divisor: Auto, 1-255 14:00:03 <peter1139> Enable features that should be provided by NewGRF: No / Off 14:00:43 <Samu> the 2nd setting should have the buttons grayed out if the 1st setting is off 14:00:50 <Wolf01> No / Off / Auto (never) 14:04:06 <andythenorth> peter1139: I already suggested that Samu reimplement original trains in a grf :) 14:04:16 <andythenorth> but samu likes projects :) 14:04:52 <andythenorth> it’s always good having an extensible content framework, but refusing to use it :) 14:05:01 <Wolf01> I still think we should try to strip everything from the core game and reimplement as paid DLC 14:05:25 <Samu> i don't know how to use grfs 14:06:31 <Samu> code* 14:07:28 <Samu> it seems limited 14:07:46 <Samu> controlled 14:07:55 <Wolf01> Multiplayer safe 14:11:27 *** ATMunn has quit IRC 14:12:09 *** ATMunn has joined #openttd 14:12:47 *** ATMunn is now known as Guest7094 14:13:50 <supermop_> Samu: its pretty easy 14:19:39 <supermop_> i should make a double headed industrial tram 14:20:04 <supermop_> although if yu want to be carrying 300t of coal really should build a train 14:20:12 <Samu> can u make a newgrf for me, involving wagons? 14:22:56 <Samu> i was looking for a newgrf with wagons/engines without any running cost specified, kinda like nars. it has some obscure features like reduced running costs 14:23:03 <Samu> different sizes 14:23:23 <Samu> i don't really know what other features can affect running costs 14:23:29 <Samu> but i wanted to explore them 14:23:56 *** Gustavo6046 has joined #openttd 14:24:01 <Samu> the problem with nars is that... everything has a cost 14:24:07 <Samu> a running cost, that is 14:24:39 <Samu> and there's that misterious shift value which i dunno what it is 14:24:48 <Samu> can't decipher nars entirely 14:27:09 <supermop_> are all the australians gone? 14:27:21 <supermop_> is a stevedore or longshoreman a tradie? 14:27:56 <supermop_> i wonder what they'd call them, dockie? crane-ie? 14:28:14 <supermop_> need a melb-ish name for a harbor tram 14:30:43 <Samu> melbish tram 14:41:19 *** Alberth has joined #openttd 14:41:19 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Alberth 14:41:26 <Wolf01> o/ 14:41:43 <Alberth> hi hi 14:51:03 *** Gustavo6046 has quit IRC 14:53:27 *** Gustavo6046 has joined #openttd 15:17:01 <supermop_> hmm need a germanish name for an 1860-ish steam dummy 15:18:05 <supermop_> Alberth: any ideas for cute tiny diesel locomotive nickname? 15:18:29 <Gustavo6046> Lumberchap 15:18:32 <Gustavo6046> ? 15:18:56 <Alberth> I was thinking about the steam thingie, something "Dampf" 15:19:09 <Alberth> (ie steam) 15:19:40 <Alberth> Bert and Erny perhaps? 15:19:54 <Alberth> LittleBert and SmallErny 15:22:09 <supermop_> because it is for stret running, i was thinking about Strasse something 15:22:18 <supermop_> but that sounds too much like a regular tram 15:22:48 <Alberth> what's the "dummy" thing? 15:24:29 <supermop_> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steam_dummy 15:24:33 <supermop_> tram engine 15:24:44 <supermop_> that is made to look like a tram car 15:25:04 <supermop_> Dampfstraßenbahn 15:25:09 <supermop_> is too literal 15:25:19 <Alberth> ah, steam machine in disguise 15:25:26 <Alberth> 007dampf 15:26:32 <supermop_> ha 15:28:01 <Alberth> passengercar007 15:35:28 <supermop_> what is a stevedore/dockworker in german 15:35:29 <supermop_> ? 15:37:05 <peter1139> What is it in Egnlish? :p 15:37:23 <Samu> ST2, using server 7 settings and my patch: https://imgur.com/7fRu5Eg 15:37:50 <Samu> trucks vs trains 15:38:31 <Samu> started in 1935, and made the last adjustments in 1939, then let 1940 unchanged 15:39:44 <Samu> trains lost 2 wagons in 1939, trucks lost 2 trucks in 1939 15:40:03 <Samu> 2 wagons ,each, so 4 wagons 15:40:48 <Samu> i did it to optimize coal mine output with the vehicles 15:41:08 <Samu> i think i achieved some degree of parity 15:41:09 <supermop_> peter1139: stevedore? 15:41:15 <Samu> i like what i see 15:42:39 <Samu> however... it's still cheaper to construct a very long train than have a decent truck going very far 15:43:09 <Samu> decent truck route* 15:43:46 <peter1139> supermop_, never heard the term before 15:44:07 <supermop_> guy who works at a dock and puts stuff on a boat 15:44:24 <peter1139> Hmm, phonetic corruption of estivador 15:44:58 <supermop_> apparently in the UK it is only the foreman or master 15:45:19 <supermop_> the regular guys are dockers? 15:45:51 <supermop_> in oz it is 'wharfie' which is cute enough to be a tram name 15:46:27 <Samu> your server 7 is still all about making a long route with a very big train, i ought to test how much my running costs cannibalize the profits 15:46:45 <Alberth> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stevedore apparently, never heard of the term before 15:48:25 <Alberth> Samu: wouldn't it be easier to add running costs to the wagons? 15:49:46 <supermop_> ok newly compiled now to test again 15:50:03 <supermop_> hopefully fixed the remaining sprite issues 15:50:03 <Samu> how exactly? 15:52:06 <Samu> a fixed value? 15:52:47 <Samu> i wanted to penalize long trains, but not much on short trains 15:54:24 <Samu> i tried using fixed values for wagons and it didn't feel right 15:55:23 *** TheMask96 has quit IRC 15:55:26 <Samu> it was either too much for short trains, or too little for long trains, and trying to come up with a value that could suit both wasn't cutting it. I like the exponential cost increase approach more 15:56:13 <Alberth> ah, right, I read the first post to understand the problem you're solving, and may have missed that 15:56:25 <Wolf01> I think you should also change airplanes, a lot of little airplanes for 2-20 people should be better than one airbus a380 or boeing 747 15:56:34 *** TheMask96 has joined #openttd 15:56:53 <Samu> i'm not sure how to go about aircraft yet 15:57:46 <Samu> the biggest impact on their profits was with the profit patch that I did which ended penalizing horizontal/vertical routings 15:57:48 <Alberth> but an a380 is ideal, you can have a living room for each passenger! 15:58:02 <Samu> so, every vehicle was impacted 15:58:13 <Samu> aircraft impact was more pronounced however 15:58:41 <Wolf01> But a lot of pax with only one airplane mean a lot of earnings 15:59:31 <Alberth> hmm, maybe make the passengers less patient in waiting for the ride? 16:00:21 <Alberth> would be nice if they could leave the aircraft while it's loading :p 16:01:32 <Samu> i've also done something else, can't remember, let me find brb 16:02:05 <Samu> ah 16:02:06 <Samu> increased aircraft breakdown rate based on travelled tiles v3 r27795 16:02:41 <Samu> so, after travelling x tiles, the aircraft will breakdown more quickly 16:03:15 *** Montana has joined #openttd 16:03:48 <Alberth> easily defeated with "disable breakdowns" that most players use :) 16:04:00 <Samu> :/ 16:05:21 *** oskari89 has joined #openttd 16:06:19 <Wolf01> Running cost depends on travel lenght 16:07:18 <Alberth> for deep-space probes, sure, but regular buses/trains? 16:07:19 <Wolf01> Multiplied by loaded pax, divided by livery colour 16:08:03 <Alberth> ha, make ugly colors more cheap :p 16:08:34 <Wolf01> Also you should know how many engines there are and base the running cost for each engine 16:10:25 <Samu> i've always thought of breakdowns being necessary for aircraft 16:10:50 <Samu> there are some models that appear to have better reliability than others 16:10:58 <Samu> as a differentiator 16:11:03 *** Biolunar has quit IRC 16:11:06 <Samu> english* 16:12:38 *** roidal has joined #openttd 16:13:01 <Samu> a model with big capacity but low reliability vs a model with lower capacity but with high reliability 16:13:19 <andythenorth> reliability is randomised per game afaik 16:13:22 <Samu> with breakdowns disabled... the big capacity model always wins 16:14:03 <supermop_> andythenorth: apt thing made me laugh 16:14:16 <andythenorth> I need 3 more names :P 16:14:45 <supermop_> also the 70s ish regular passenger car 16:15:00 <supermop_> has 2cc stripe like a mk3 at top in / 16:15:04 <supermop_> but not in _ 16:15:20 <andythenorth> only the – views are drawn at all :) 16:15:23 <andythenorth> the rest is nonsense 16:15:28 <supermop_> i see 16:15:35 <andythenorth> there is a high deletion rate 16:15:44 <andythenorth> so no point drawing the missing angles until set is designed 16:15:46 <supermop_> i could have used a little bear too 16:16:03 <andythenorth> shoebox doesn’t fit? 16:16:07 <andythenorth> same power, faster 16:16:17 <supermop_> seemed like overkill 16:16:55 <andythenorth> what would have made it just kill? 16:17:26 <Gustavo6046> My favorite OST is Modern Motion. 16:19:26 <supermop_> andythenorth: looking tiny and weak 16:19:47 <supermop_> looks wrong to have what looks like a mainline loco pulling 2-3 cars 16:19:49 <andythenorth> I could split ‘tiny freight’ and ‘tiny pax' 16:20:01 <andythenorth> and even go to 4/8 16:20:05 <andythenorth> dunno 16:20:06 <supermop_> half a chinook 16:20:19 <supermop_> its all fin tho 16:20:28 <supermop_> i wouldn't worry about that part 16:21:10 <andythenorth> there’s a 4/8 sprite test here http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/iron-horse/repository/entry/src/graphics/pony/shoebox_0.png 16:21:46 *** Progman has joined #openttd 16:28:28 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 16:34:23 *** Guest7094 is now known as ATMunn 16:40:27 *** synchris has joined #openttd 16:59:04 *** Alberth has left #openttd 17:00:59 *** glx has joined #openttd 17:00:59 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 17:02:11 *** oskari89 has quit IRC 17:12:16 *** FLHerne has quit IRC 17:12:56 *** Arveen has joined #openttd 17:22:59 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 17:23:19 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 17:30:16 *** oskari89 has joined #openttd 17:37:10 *** Bluelight has joined #openttd 17:40:47 *** Bluelight has quit IRC 17:44:01 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 17:56:43 *** orudge` has joined #openttd 17:56:43 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o orudge` 17:56:54 *** orudge` has quit IRC 17:57:31 *** orudge` has joined #openttd 17:57:31 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o orudge` 18:00:54 <Samu> should i make a patch pack? seems to be the rule 18:05:41 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 18:07:23 <andythenorth> hola 18:07:33 <frosch123> annulated tank cars are win :) 18:08:36 <andythenorth> wondering if all wagons should use that style :P 18:08:43 <andythenorth> but then….all look same 18:22:53 <andythenorth> stripes for flat cars? o_O http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8683/horse_flat_3.png 18:23:29 <Samu> @calc 2489885/2204711 18:23:29 <DorpsGek> Samu: 1.12934756528 18:24:13 <Samu> a ~13% nerf 18:24:18 <Samu> in train profits 18:24:35 *** mindlesstux has quit IRC 18:25:13 *** mindlesstux has joined #openttd 18:25:44 <frosch123> http://www.on-rail.com/fileadmin/_processed_/csm_Res_072-1_OK_3eabe237ca.jpg <- does that count as striped? 18:26:22 <frosch123> http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/img/s/v-3/p1400374485-3.jpg <- what is transported with that? 18:27:02 <supermop_> rolls of steel sheet 18:27:20 <supermop_> the blue one is nice looking frosch123 18:27:38 <Samu> @calc (88034-10417) / (88034-3443) 18:27:38 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.917556241208 18:27:48 <Samu> meh, the other way 18:28:04 <Samu> calc (88034-3443) / (88034-10417) 18:28:17 <Samu> @calc (88034-3443) / (88034-10417) 18:28:17 <DorpsGek> Samu: 1.08985145007 18:28:22 <andythenorth> blue one is stake wagon 18:28:32 * andythenorth has that problem to solve already :) 18:30:05 <andythenorth> could do deck greeble https://photos.smugmug.com/UKRailRollingstock/B-tops-codes/BAA-bogie-steel-flats/i-V6CbTLf/0/84783486/S/BAA_900014_Newport_210807a-S.jpg 18:30:24 <andythenorth> I wanted a consistent deck appearance, but then all look same so eh 18:30:37 <Samu> a ~9% nerf in "income - running cost" is equivalent to a ~13% in company value 18:30:45 <Samu> only tested 1 train though 18:30:50 <Samu> over the course of 40 years 18:31:14 <andythenorth> Samu: you are starving yourself by not learning NML :P 18:31:35 <andythenorth> newgrf has many many ways to adjust these parameters 18:32:24 <andythenorth> at least 3 styles of ‘flat’ wagon here https://photos.smugmug.com/Wagons/B-TOPSCode/BBA/i-rGKwwxt/0/e05f9f42/L/BBA_910001_a_TeesYard_04102007-L.jpg 18:33:18 <andythenorth> interesting load https://pgmodels.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/img_4151.jpg 18:37:40 *** Tcm0 has joined #openttd 18:45:54 <supermop_> andythenorth: always go for more greeb 18:52:32 *** debdog has quit IRC 18:55:29 *** debdog has joined #openttd 19:13:32 <supermop_> i use stacks to randomly stick greeble on roofs of trams 19:15:23 <Gustavo6046> Actually no, I'm not kidding. 19:15:37 <Gustavo6046> Thinking I were was really what I wanted to induct. 19:15:39 <Gustavo6046> Seems I did it. 19:15:52 <Gustavo6046> Err~, wrong channel... 19:24:03 *** Montana has quit IRC 19:39:07 *** Montana has joined #openttd 19:50:33 <Samu> https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/GRFActionsDetailed this is hell 19:51:29 <andythenorth> it’s just nfo 19:51:53 <peter1139> Mmm NFO 19:52:20 <Samu> little-endian byte order... i call it, hell-order 19:52:21 <Samu> chaos 20:00:53 *** roidal has quit IRC 20:01:43 <Samu> 38 00 in little-endian byte order 20:02:04 <Samu> means 0038, 38, is this hexadecimal? 20:02:37 <Samu> 38 in hex, 56 in decimal? 20:03:58 <supermop_> don't remember. i purged all nfo and hex from my brain 20:04:25 <Gustavo6046> 38 in hex is the same as 3 * 16 + 8 in decimal 20:04:29 <Gustavo6046> so 48 + 8 20:04:31 <Gustavo6046> = 56 20:05:04 <Gustavo6046> if 38 were decimal it'd be 3 * 10 + 8 in decimal 20:05:13 <Gustavo6046> just like if* 20:06:22 <Samu> so i got the speed of this engine, wiki says: Speed in mph*1.6 (see below) 20:06:35 <Samu> 56 in decimal, and it's 56 km/h in the game 20:06:44 <Samu> why complicate! 20:06:53 <supermop_> ask chris sawyer 20:06:55 <Samu> why not just say speed in km/h 20:07:16 <supermop_> british man thinks of british trains as going in mph 20:09:56 <Samu> @calc 56/1.6 20:09:56 <DorpsGek> Samu: 35 20:09:59 <Samu> :( 20:10:32 <Samu> @calc 35*1.6 20:10:32 <DorpsGek> Samu: 56 20:10:56 <Samu> well... technically correct, just complicated for no reason at all 20:12:38 <andythenorth> there will be a reason 20:13:02 <andythenorth> @calc 128*1.6 20:13:02 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 204.8 20:13:40 <andythenorth> @calc 255*1.6 20:13:40 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 408 20:13:46 <andythenorth> might be that 20:13:59 <andythenorth> Lev4 chimera is 400mph 20:14:05 * andythenorth might be barking up wrong tree though 20:29:42 <supermop_> https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=76402&p=1193264#p1193264 20:44:14 <supermop_> i am sure there is a lot wrong that i can't see from spending so much time looking at, 20:44:40 <supermop_> if anyone wants to look for messed up sprites, or has suggestions for running costs/capacities etc 20:44:42 *** sim-al2 has joined #openttd 20:44:52 <supermop_> happy to hear feedback 20:44:55 <andythenorth> :) 20:46:48 <supermop_> andythenorth: i think the thing that makes me feel weird about using the shoebox for branchline freight is the panto 20:47:09 <andythenorth> what if it was lowered on diesel? 20:47:26 <supermop_> feels somehow wrong to use bimode loco on line that is only ever un-wired 20:47:31 <supermop_> you know what i mean 20:47:50 <supermop_> thats why it feels overkill or gratuitous 20:48:10 <supermop_> bimode seems special, and feels weird to use something special 20:48:24 <supermop_> for mundane turns 20:49:11 <supermop_> why in horse 1 i was shy about replacing gridiron with cyclops - felt too fancy for freight 20:50:01 <andythenorth> maybe needs a small freight engine 20:50:02 <andythenorth> dunno 20:50:07 <supermop_> "in which supermop talks to his therapist at length about vehicle selection in OpenTTD" 20:51:23 <andythenorth> covered hoppers now much less good thank tank cars :P http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8706/horse_hopper_vs_tank.png 20:51:32 *** gelignite has quit IRC 20:51:48 <andythenorth> roof hatches are horrible 20:52:36 <supermop_> stand-alone little bear add on grf 20:52:50 <andythenorth> add horse 1 20:52:54 <andythenorth> different grfids 20:53:05 <supermop_> haha 20:53:08 <supermop_> chinook race 20:54:04 <supermop_> shoebox is good captures spirit of the southern bimodes 20:54:14 <supermop_> gestaltwise 20:54:59 <supermop_> why should i buy stake car over flat car? 20:55:35 <supermop_> other than the cool looking stakes 20:57:35 <supermop_> will the flats get stakes when hauling logs? 20:58:45 <andythenorth> nah 20:59:03 <andythenorth> probably not anyway 20:59:06 <supermop_> i put 2 flats on the back of the rake just to mix it up 20:59:17 <andythenorth> stake car = original steel car 20:59:29 <andythenorth> oops, no original wood car 20:59:32 <frosch123> andythenorth: make the early hoppers not covered by metal, but rather tarpaulins 20:59:44 <andythenorth> maybe 20:59:53 <andythenorth> I could just draw them ‘not rubbish’ too :) 20:59:56 <frosch123> possbily also more similar to open wagons 21:00:04 <supermop_> but the 5t dry tare weight savings vs 14t capacity difference doesn't make stake attractive 21:00:22 <andythenorth> supermop_: sounds like a bug, all capacities should be levelled :) 21:00:24 <supermop_> andythenorth: what frosch123 said ^ more tarps 21:00:47 <supermop_> 120km medium stake is 40t, flat car is 54 21:01:03 <supermop_> flat is slightly longer 21:01:21 <supermop_> but not 35% longer 21:01:39 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 21:01:49 <supermop_> maybe it is 35% didn't count px 21:01:56 <andythenorth> seems like a bug 21:02:24 <supermop_> i still bought mostly stake cars bc looks better with the logs 21:10:54 <Samu> 3>..\src\window.cpp(1685): warning C4146: unary minus operator applied to unsigned type, result still unsigned 21:13:01 <Samu> int offset_x = rtl ? -NWidgetLeaf::closebox_dimension.width : NWidgetLeaf::closebox_dimension.width; 21:13:12 <Samu> that's the line 21:23:58 *** Arveen has quit IRC 21:25:30 <supermop_> andythenorth: https://imgur.com/a/8iBl6 there's 4 stake cars followed by 2 flats in / 21:25:54 <andythenorth> $someone should draw those other views :) 21:31:50 <V453000> andythenorth: tanks winning 21:32:12 <andythenorth> scrap other types 21:32:16 <andythenorth> liquid cargos only 21:32:18 <andythenorth> new FIRS 21:32:47 <andythenorth> water, milk, beer, wine, cola, petrol, chemicals, sulphur, kaolin, oil, edible oil, rubber 21:33:12 <V453000> :D 21:33:22 <frosch123> banana juice 21:34:06 <andythenorth> blood 21:34:06 <frosch123> but you will hit the industry input cargo type limit for cocktails 21:34:14 <andythenorth> fair 21:34:31 <frosch123> though a shaker-industry could we animated 21:37:45 <andythenorth> tomorrow, flat cars :P 21:37:49 <andythenorth> "something must be done” 21:38:07 <frosch123> multi-level flat cars? :p 21:38:22 <andythenorth> sounds like a car transporter :P 21:38:32 <andythenorth> flat cars with vertical stripes? :P 21:39:12 <frosch123> stripes may break the flat-ness impression 21:40:13 <andythenorth> what if I scrapped flatbeds? 21:40:20 <andythenorth> keep the stake cars? 21:40:37 <Gustavo6046> My pathfinder takes 8 mins for a single source outlet... most cities have like 20 of these! :/ 21:41:15 *** synchris has quit IRC 21:41:28 <Gustavo6046> So yeah, 2 + 2/3 hours... 22:03:20 <andythenorth> bed 22:03:21 *** andythenorth has left #openttd 22:03:38 *** Progman has quit IRC 22:06:12 <Gustavo6046> ok ._. 22:17:42 *** sim-al2 is now known as Guest7117 22:17:43 *** sim-al2 has joined #openttd 22:22:47 *** Guest7117 has quit IRC 22:33:16 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 22:41:51 *** FLHerne has quit IRC 23:14:00 *** Biolunar has joined #openttd 23:14:15 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 23:26:36 *** Montana has quit IRC 23:30:36 *** oskari89 has quit IRC 23:39:04 *** Flygon has joined #openttd