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00:00:00 <Samu> atm Convoy is leading 00:01:13 <supermop> man unspooled code is really short 00:01:26 <supermop> 800 lines 00:01:27 <LordAro> do the 5(?) AIs that haven't done anything count? 00:06:46 <Samu> yes 00:07:02 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 00:13:46 <supermop> should trolleywires over end-of-line form a loop, like the tram tracks? 00:14:11 <Eddi|zuHause> don't they do that already? 00:14:36 <supermop> or end on poles with weights for tension, assuming that they'd switch to the other wire to turn around 00:14:41 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, busses don't enter end-of-line segments 00:15:22 <Eddi|zuHause> they basically turn one tile earlier than trams 00:15:24 <supermop> Eddi|zuHause base graphics just seem to have the same plain trolleywire as any other bit of tramway or road 00:16:59 <supermop> turning around on a tile already looks really messed up for trams and articulated buses - if the vehicle can make that sharp of a turn it doesn't seem too far fetched that they could pull the trolley pole around to the other wire first 00:18:11 <supermop> whereas the very tight radius in the wires might call attention to how absurd the end of line loops are 00:19:00 <Eddi|zuHause> so why again do you worry about a tile that the bus cannot enter anyway? 00:19:28 <supermop> I worry about what looks least ugly for the overhead wires 00:23:52 *** TigerbotHesh has quit IRC 00:27:46 *** TigerbotHesh has joined #openttd 00:28:41 <supermop> I guess tram and bus wires could terminate differently 00:29:28 <supermop> but until NRT allows stacking catenary sprites, the road wires will have to look at least ok for trams as well 00:45:45 *** FLHerne has quit IRC 00:48:08 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 00:49:40 <supermop> Eddi|zuHause: I guess it would look like this... https://imgur.com/a/Ade9U 00:50:49 <Eddi|zuHause> the perspective looks way off on that... 00:51:00 <Eddi|zuHause> but i guess that's a general problem of openttd 00:51:30 <Eddi|zuHause> it's a bit weird that the two poles on the right seem to merge 00:51:59 <Eddi|zuHause> the poles could use a dark top to make it clear that it ends there 00:52:05 *** TigerbotHesh has quit IRC 00:57:20 *** TigerbotHesh has joined #openttd 00:58:58 *** Biolunar has quit IRC 01:00:10 *** Samu has quit IRC 01:06:08 <supermop> yeah that could work 01:06:21 <supermop> maybe some kind of insulator 02:00:59 *** sim-al2 has joined #openttd 02:03:38 *** iSoSyS has quit IRC 02:51:29 *** DDR has joined #openttd 03:05:57 *** fkinglag has quit IRC 03:24:21 *** Snail has quit IRC 03:24:47 *** Snail has joined #openttd 03:25:12 *** Snail has quit IRC 03:48:20 *** glx has quit IRC 04:41:40 *** smoke_fumus has quit IRC 05:25:17 *** ToffeeYogurtPots has quit IRC 05:26:19 *** ToffeeYogurtPots has joined #openttd 05:27:54 *** ToffeeYogurtPots has quit IRC 05:51:14 *** Cubey has quit IRC 06:06:16 *** chomwitt has joined #openttd 06:17:10 *** chomwitt has quit IRC 06:53:36 *** Celestar has joined #openttd 06:58:13 *** Celestar1 has quit IRC 07:40:55 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 07:47:40 *** Celestar has quit IRC 07:55:06 *** TigerbotHesh has quit IRC 07:57:44 *** Celestar has joined #openttd 08:00:11 *** TigerbotHesh has joined #openttd 08:05:58 *** EarthlingKira has joined #openttd 08:14:26 *** EarthlingKira has quit IRC 08:15:48 *** EarthlingKira has joined #openttd 08:18:55 *** TigerbotHesh has quit IRC 08:24:07 *** TigerbotHesh has joined #openttd 09:01:29 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 09:05:38 *** Biolunar has joined #openttd 09:08:11 *** stefino has joined #openttd 09:11:03 <stefino> hi guys...if I'm making foundations slopes, why are tiles under the buildings fixed at my new walls? When I want to move with wall I move with tile too. Yes I can choose tile and move it back but this changes its offsets. Thanks 09:16:12 <peter1138> Er, what? 09:21:01 <stefino> https://s10.postimg.org/538cjpm3d/V_st_i_ek.jpg 09:21:42 <stefino> some tiles are OK, some tiles were moved when I change wall offsets 09:35:23 *** Breckett has joined #openttd 10:41:48 *** Celestar has quit IRC 10:43:29 *** Celestar has joined #openttd 10:49:46 <peter1138> Ah you are making graphics. 10:56:27 *** ericnoan has quit IRC 11:00:08 *** ericnoan has joined #openttd 11:02:56 <stefino> yep...I know where the problem is now. It is about ingame engine. Slopes are joined with tiles. 11:13:08 <peter1138> Sorry I don't remember the specifics. Been about 10 years since I looked at that stuff. 11:21:30 *** suertes has joined #openttd 11:24:22 *** suertes has left #openttd 11:30:33 *** JacobD88 has joined #openttd 11:35:07 *** Biolunar has quit IRC 11:37:58 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 11:42:25 *** EarthlingKira has quit IRC 11:51:50 *** stefino has quit IRC 11:56:07 *** iSoSyS has joined #openttd 12:02:36 *** Samu has joined #openttd 12:15:56 <Samu> where is earthkira dude? :( 12:22:48 *** iSoSyS has quit IRC 12:29:16 <Samu> @seen EarthlingKira 12:29:16 <DorpsGek> Samu: EarthlingKira was last seen in #openttd 1 day, 14 hours, 21 minutes, and 45 seconds ago: <EarthlingKira> I'd guess that AI doesn't build routes which are nearly as busy as routes built by humans 12:33:08 <Samu> some AIs do 12:37:11 <Samu> v->breakdown_chance doesn't decrease if the vehicle is stopped, only v->reliability 12:39:05 *** iSoSyS has joined #openttd 12:48:44 *** iSoSyS has quit IRC 12:55:21 *** supermop_home has joined #openttd 13:00:24 *** supermop has quit IRC 13:03:17 *** supermop has joined #openttd 13:06:24 *** supermop_home has quit IRC 13:32:32 *** Flygon has quit IRC 13:58:44 *** iSoSyS has joined #openttd 14:27:08 *** RafiX has joined #openttd 14:36:37 *** FLHerne has quit IRC 14:38:16 *** Gja has joined #openttd 14:38:51 <Samu> 2 RoadRunner v12 - bankrupt 01-1986 14:48:32 *** TheMask96 has quit IRC 14:53:47 *** TheMask96 has joined #openttd 14:55:06 *** chomwitt has joined #openttd 14:56:08 *** sim-al2 has quit IRC 15:12:10 *** chomwitt has quit IRC 15:14:29 *** Gja has quit IRC 15:16:05 *** LordAro has quit IRC 15:23:50 *** JacobD88 has quit IRC 15:26:57 <Samu> lalalaal 15:27:20 <Samu> where is the breakdown guy? 15:27:39 <supermop> probably out enjoying his life 15:27:44 <supermop> or at work 15:28:17 <supermop> not every office lets their employees sit on IRC all day 15:28:32 <supermop> nor does every employee work in an office 15:28:52 <Samu> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/p0bxkwjug 15:28:57 <supermop> pretty hard to check IRC if you are working on a factory floor or in a shop 15:34:16 <Samu> his code makes it so that it takes longer, on average, to breakdown, the lower the v->reliability 15:35:30 <Samu> wish i could graph these results 15:40:02 <Samu> it gives me that impression, but i can't show proof :( 15:44:06 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 15:51:01 *** LordAro has joined #openttd 15:52:01 <Samu> @calc 1/256 15:52:01 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.00390625 15:53:50 <Samu> @calc (1*30)/256 * (1 + 1/25) * 30 15:53:50 <DorpsGek> Samu: 3.65625 15:54:19 <Samu> uh... can't be 15:54:20 <Samu> i fail 15:57:04 *** Gja has joined #openttd 15:57:47 <Samu> everyday, the chance is increased by 1 plus a 1/25 chance to add 25 15:57:54 <Samu> @calc 1 + 1/25 15:57:54 <DorpsGek> Samu: 1.04 15:58:02 <Samu> average of 1.04 per day 15:58:31 *** Snail has joined #openttd 15:59:44 <Samu> also, everyday a random number from 0 to 255 is rolled 16:00:39 <Samu> "random number from 0 to 255" <= "1.04 per day on average" 16:01:09 <Samu> how do I graph this? 16:01:11 <Samu> halp 16:06:57 <Samu> day 1: 0-255 <= 1.04 : what are the chances that a random number from 0 to 255 is less or equal than 1.04 16:07:20 <Samu> day 10: 0-255 <= 10.4 : what are the chances that a random number from 0 to 255 is less of equal than 10.4 16:08:15 <Samu> presuming it didn't broke down on the previous 9 days 16:13:08 *** RafiX2 has joined #openttd 16:13:10 <Samu> 3 DictatorAI v183 - bankrupt 11-1990 16:14:31 *** chomwitt has joined #openttd 16:15:08 *** RafiX has quit IRC 16:15:25 <Samu> what are the chances to breakdown on the 1st day 16:15:32 <Samu> what are the chances to breakdown on the 10th day 16:15:41 <Samu> what are the chances to breakdown on the nth day 16:15:44 <Samu> halp! 16:22:33 <Samu> day 1: (256-1.04)/256 16:22:43 <Samu> @calc (256-1.04)/256 16:22:43 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.9959375 16:23:35 <Samu> @calc (1+1.04)/256 16:23:35 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.00796875 16:24:25 <Samu> @calc 1-(256-1.04)/256 16:24:25 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.0040625 16:28:04 <Samu> day 2: (256-1.04)/256 * (1 - (256-2.08)/256) 16:28:12 <Samu> @calc (256-1.04)/256 * (1 - (256-2.08)/256) 16:28:12 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.0080919921875 16:29:05 <Samu> @calc (256-1.04)/256 * (256-2.08)/256 16:29:05 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.987845507813 16:32:13 <Samu> @calc 1-((256-1.04)/256) * ((256-2.08)/256) 16:32:13 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.0121544921875 16:48:15 <Samu> day 3: (256-1.04)/256 * (256-2.08)/256 * (1-(256-3.12)/256) 16:48:55 <Samu> @calc (256-1.04)/256 * (256-2.08)/256 * (1-(256-3.12)/256) 16:48:55 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.0120393671265 16:49:27 *** Cubey has joined #openttd 16:50:02 <Samu> @calc (256-1.04)/256 * (256-2.08)/256 * (256-3.12)/256 16:50:02 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.975806140686 16:51:06 <Samu> @calc 1-(256-1.04)/256 * (256-2.08)/256 * (256-3.12)/256 16:51:06 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.024193859314 16:55:20 <Samu> 1 MailAI v21 - bankrupt 11-1990 17:00:53 *** Borg has joined #openttd 17:02:21 *** stefino has joined #openttd 17:04:54 <Samu> i can't figure this out 17:05:12 *** stefino has quit IRC 17:08:47 *** Gja has quit IRC 17:14:47 <Samu> @calc 3/4 17:14:47 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.75 17:15:37 <Samu> @calc 1-3/4 17:15:37 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.25 17:16:53 <Samu> @calc (3/4)*(2/4) 17:16:53 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.375 17:17:17 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 17:17:19 <Samu> grrr, why is this so complicated to undesrtand 17:17:21 *** Gja has joined #openttd 17:17:31 <Samu> @calc 4/5 17:17:31 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.8 17:17:41 <Samu> @ calc 1-4/5 17:17:41 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.2 17:18:29 <Samu> @calc (4/5)*(3/5) 17:18:29 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.48 17:19:26 <Samu> @calc (4/5)*(1-(3/5)) 17:19:26 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.32 17:19:39 <Samu> @calc 1-(4/5)*(3/5) 17:19:39 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.52 17:24:56 <Samu> @calc 1/5 17:24:56 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.2 17:25:03 <Samu> @calc 1-1/5 17:25:03 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.8 17:25:35 <Samu> @calc (1/5)*(2/5) 17:25:35 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.08 17:27:19 <Samu> @calc (1-1/5)*(2/5) 17:27:19 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.32 17:27:47 <Samu> @calc (1-1/5)*(1-2/5) 17:27:47 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.48 17:29:04 <Samu> i give up 17:29:23 *** Alberth has joined #openttd 17:29:23 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Alberth 17:29:30 <Alberth> o/ 17:29:34 <Samu> hi 17:29:47 <Samu> are you a probability expert 17:33:22 <Samu> the cranberries singer died today.... 17:33:57 <Alberth> :( 17:38:03 <Samu> help me Alberth. probability to breakdown on first day: (256-1.04)/256 17:38:28 <Samu> what would be the probability to breakdown on the second day if it didn't breakdown on the first day? 17:39:30 <Samu> actually, that the probability not to breakdown on first day, my bad 17:40:01 <Alberth> P(not at day 1) * P(at day 2) 17:41:02 <Samu> probability to breakdown on first day: 1-(256-1.04)/256 17:41:20 <Samu> probability not to breakdown on first day: (256-1.04)/256 17:42:20 <Samu> probability to breakdown on second day: (256-1.04)/256 * (1-(256-2.08)/256) 17:43:09 <Samu> and for the 3rd day how would it be? 17:43:22 <Alberth> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binomial_distribution is the generic form 17:43:45 <Alberth> P(not at day 1) * P(not at day 2) * P(at day 3) 17:45:47 <Samu> probability not to breakdown on second day: ((256-1.04)/256) * ((256-2.08)/256) 17:46:11 <Samu> hmm, and here's where things confuse me :( 17:48:19 <Samu> probability to breakdown on third day: (256-1.04)/256 * ((256-1.04)/256) * ((256-2.08)/256) * (1-(256-3.12)/256) 17:48:35 <Samu> is this correct? 17:49:41 <Alberth> no idea at all 17:54:41 <Samu> probability not to breakdown on second day: (256-2.08)/256 17:55:37 <Samu> probability to breakdown on third day: (256-1.04)/256 * (256-2.08)/256 * (1-(256-3.12)/256) 17:56:03 <Samu> one of these is wrong, I dunno which one 17:58:33 <Samu> 8 Convoy v11 - bankrupt 01-2000 17:59:32 *** Snail has quit IRC 18:04:33 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 18:07:37 *** glx has joined #openttd 18:07:37 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 18:11:11 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 18:11:16 <Alberth> o/ 18:13:17 <Wolf01> Moin 18:21:33 <Samu> @calc 1-(256-1.04)/256 18:21:33 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.0040625 18:21:45 <Samu> @calc (256-1.04)/256 18:21:45 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.9959375 18:22:00 <Samu> @calc (256-1.04)/256 * (1-(256-2.08)/256) 18:22:00 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.0080919921875 18:22:33 <Samu> @calc ((256-1.04)/256) * ((256-2.08)/256) 18:22:33 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.987845507813 18:23:36 <Samu> @calc (256-1.04)/256 * ((256-1.04)/256) * ((256-2.08)/256) * (1-(256-3.12)/256) 18:23:37 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.0119904571975 18:23:49 <Samu> @calc (256-2.08)/256 18:23:49 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.991875 18:23:54 <Wolf01> Do you really need to use the chat like an excel sheet? 18:23:59 <Borg> yeah 18:23:59 <Samu> @calc (256-1.04)/256 * (256-2.08)/256 * (1-(256-3.12)/256) 18:23:59 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.0120393671265 18:24:04 <Borg> use bc or dc 18:26:12 <Samu> bc? 18:26:49 <Alberth> https://linux.die.net/man/1/bc 18:28:44 <Samu> 2 TeshiNet v4 - bankrupt 08-2000 18:28:50 <Samu> all from server 2 bankrupted 18:30:05 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 18:30:15 <Alberth> hola 18:35:01 <Borg> Samu: bc - An arbitrary precision calculator language 18:37:17 <Borg> Alberth: hola nacho! 18:37:18 <Borg> ;))) 18:38:47 <Alberth> bc(1) would have been a little too cryptic :p 18:40:35 <frosch123> moi 18:42:05 *** Breckett has quit IRC 18:53:42 <LordAro> hoihoi 18:53:54 <Alberth> o/ 18:54:00 <Wolf01> Quak 18:54:32 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 18:54:42 <andythenorth> o/ 18:54:43 <Alberth> more o/ 18:54:52 <Wolf01> o/o/ 18:55:18 <Wolf01> That looks too much nazi :( 18:56:12 <Wolf01> o/\o o/ better 18:56:35 <Wolf01> Also RIP Dolores O'Riordan :( 18:56:55 <Alberth> much so, indeed 18:59:21 <andythenorth> she didn't let it linger 19:09:20 <Samu> 1 AIAI v97 - bankrupt 11-2003 19:09:58 <Samu> 13 AIs remain 19:11:37 <Wolf01> And then the player tried to purchase a ship... but canals disappeared from the game! 19:12:17 <Wolf01> (short horror story) 19:12:46 *** Progman has joined #openttd 19:13:33 <Samu> I expect everyone to bankrupt 19:13:59 <Samu> how long does it take for inflation to reach its max? 19:19:42 <Alberth> 170 * 13.something minutes 19:22:22 *** Breckett has joined #openttd 19:29:13 <supermop_work> yo 19:29:32 <supermop_work> andythenorth: i might release new spool tonight 19:29:38 <supermop_work> if cc is now in nrt 19:30:08 <andythenorth> did I push>? 19:30:16 <andythenorth> looks like it 19:30:19 <andythenorth> cool 19:31:29 <supermop_work> im unsure how i want to draw the wires at the end of line loops 19:31:42 <supermop_work> having them make the tight U looks a little odd 19:31:57 <Wolf01> Put them like a V 19:32:10 <Wolf01> With a pole in the middle 19:32:47 *** Breckett has quit IRC 19:32:54 <supermop_work> Wolf01: that would be realistic in many cases, but when tramway ends but road continues, the pole will be in the middle of the road 19:33:01 <V453000> I READ V I GET TRIGGERED 19:33:02 <V453000> WHAT 19:33:14 <V453000> POLE IN THE MIDDLE? 19:33:14 <Wolf01> Put them like a slug 19:33:19 <V453000> I'm going to put a pole in your middle! 19:33:36 <Alberth> \|/ ? 19:33:50 <__ln__> do we even have any regular poles on the channel anymore 19:33:50 <Wolf01> Lol 19:33:58 <__ln__> @seen MeusH 19:33:58 <DorpsGek> __ln__: I have not seen MeusH. 19:34:15 <supermop_work> and NRT doesn't let you give poles a bounding box or position, so it wont draw as 'between' the RVs in the two lanes 19:34:19 <Alberth> just the North and South pole, I think 19:35:37 <andythenorth> biab 19:36:06 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 19:45:28 *** Gja has quit IRC 19:47:36 <Samu> https://1drv.ms/x/s!Ah9vX-Q9n7IjiwSCQurVLKEo9JMa 19:48:08 <Samu> the day with the highest chance to breakdown is the 16th 19:48:54 <Samu> 0,03950078 19:50:08 <Samu> this is with Kira's patch 19:50:45 <Samu> i dunno, maybe i'm missing something in it 19:51:50 <Samu> it is assuming 0% reliability 19:51:57 <Samu> normal breakdowns 19:51:59 <Samu> and not a ship 20:01:21 *** supermop_work_ has joined #openttd 20:05:12 *** supermop_work has quit IRC 20:07:38 <Samu> 1 CPU v5 - bankrupt 05-2008 20:07:44 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 20:07:44 <Samu> 12 AIs remaining 20:08:28 *** iSoSyS has quit IRC 20:09:11 <andythenorth> anyone got FIRS translations? 20:09:19 <andythenorth> might as well release...again 20:10:34 *** Stimrol has joined #openttd 20:11:17 <Alberth> bye 20:11:23 *** Alberth has left #openttd 20:19:18 <andythenorth> Wolf01: what's next? 20:19:20 <andythenorth> o_O 20:19:32 <Wolf01> Sleep 20:20:36 *** iSoSyS has joined #openttd 20:21:37 <supermop_work_> andythenorth: greeble on poles 20:21:48 <supermop_work_> greeble on everything 20:21:55 <supermop_work_> trees 20:21:57 <supermop_work_> water 20:22:05 <supermop_work_> greeble on greeble 20:31:37 <Samu> strange, Rondje is no longer restarting its routes 20:31:41 <Samu> sold everything 20:33:51 <andythenorth> rise of the machines 20:33:56 <andythenorth> Wolf01: Monday bad for code eh? 20:34:06 <Wolf01> Bad for everything 20:34:43 <Wolf01> Headache, low bandwidth... 20:35:31 <andythenorth> woe is jenkins https://jenkins.openttdcoop.org/job/firs/2070/console 20:35:49 <frosch123> we need someone who knows ngynx :) 20:36:26 <andythenorth> self-maintained things scare me :) 20:36:37 <andythenorth> but when it works, it works 20:36:38 <andythenorth> so eh 20:37:12 <LordAro> frosch123: sup 20:38:45 <frosch123> was it just me, or was c++17 released silently in december? 20:40:01 *** Borg has quit IRC 20:43:09 *** iSoSyS has quit IRC 20:44:43 <andythenorth> santa c++ 20:46:19 <LordAro> frosch123: marginally silently 20:47:32 <andythenorth> does a FIRS ever get done? o_O 20:47:38 <andythenorth> or do I just keep refining until I die? 20:49:15 <frosch123> maybe you turn away disgusted after doing the oil&dates economy 20:53:14 <supermop_work_> ^+1 20:58:16 <V453000> frosch123: nerf bots ?:) 20:58:42 <frosch123> V453000: twinsen always has my opinion 20:58:59 <V453000> always is a strong word :) 20:59:20 <V453000> I'm just curious what you think on the subject 20:59:55 <frosch123> i only use logistic rebots for character transport, other usages were as boring as ottd planes after the first game 21:00:02 <V453000> exactly 21:00:06 <frosch123> so i never did it again 21:00:16 <frosch123> even if you nerve them i would not use them 21:00:23 <V453000> but the megabase builders are so attach to them :0 21:00:26 <frosch123> so, i do not care :) 21:00:55 <V453000> I kind of expected that, but then it's not great to have the game require you to realize that it's a dumb feature :D 21:01:05 <frosch123> well, i think there is only one achievement "no logistics" 21:01:16 <V453000> yes 21:01:30 <frosch123> is there some other kind of scoring? 21:01:52 <V453000> well usually people rate their factory by amount of science packs produced per minute 21:02:05 <V453000> the big base builders that is 21:02:27 <frosch123> yes, i also used that metric 21:02:39 <frosch123> but more as a benchmark when to stop 21:02:54 <V453000> :D :D 21:03:25 <V453000> well the thing is that they are trying to reach as much SPM as possible, currently 4000 seems to be the max for 60UPS 21:03:43 <V453000> and they do it with robots, any smallest nerf of robots makes them mega triggered 21:04:09 <V453000> they don't even care that the game is about building many things, they just want to see the number 21:04:19 <frosch123> anyway, from last fff, the option "increase charging time to only affect requesters, but not player" sounded most reasonable 21:05:03 <frosch123> V453000: yes, that's where ottd fails :p we cannot change anything 21:05:20 <V453000> I think reducing the cargo size limit would actually be more interesting, possibly even making the charging faster 21:05:30 <V453000> because currently the charging gets annoying really quickly 21:05:37 <andythenorth> frosch123: a fork could change things :P 21:05:54 <V453000> :P 21:06:03 <frosch123> V453000: or add collisions :p 21:06:09 <V453000> yeah that's not going to happen :D 21:06:15 <frosch123> flying biters who eat them 21:06:43 <frosch123> degrade solar power when the robots darken the sky 21:07:44 <frosch123> V453000: anyway, i do not like the "reduce cargo size" 21:08:06 <frosch123> the thing with only using them for player transport is that you need a very limited amount of them 21:08:18 <V453000> my suggestion is basically making belts as convenient to use a possible with some things like upgrade/replace planner (basically deconstruction planner which issues replacement), power armor equipment which stops belts from moving the player character, changing beacon formula so that the more beacons you add, the more beacon efficiency decreases so that making 1-4 beacon layouts is quite close to optimal setup too, and moving the express bel 21:08:20 <frosch123> i never can decide whether to automate that or handcraft them 21:08:23 <V453000> but giving express belt more speed 21:08:28 <frosch123> handcrafting is easier if you only need like 50 21:08:35 <V453000> hm 21:08:40 <V453000> fair point 21:09:26 <V453000> well the current attempts are reducing charging like 4 times while doubling the battery capacity, so it makes them charge like 8 times longer if they deplete completely 21:10:35 <frosch123> hmm, i really like belts moving the character 21:10:50 <frosch123> also, beacons are another thing i never use :p 21:11:11 <V453000> it's a nice detail early, but late when you have belts basically everywhere, it becomes really frustrating when you missclick when building more belts all the time 21:11:27 <V453000> especially now when you can replace the splitter/UGbelt with a normal belt 21:11:57 <frosch123> true, misclicks got more annoying since they can remove splitters and tunnels :p 21:12:30 <frosch123> oh, you said the same :) 21:13:21 <andythenorth> I gave up on F because of the belts 21:13:25 <andythenorth> I couldn't understand them 21:15:04 <frosch123> well, solar power is the problem 21:15:22 <frosch123> robots cost only electricity 21:15:42 <frosch123> they use would be limited if they would require more energy than the coal they are transporting would give 21:16:12 <frosch123> but nuclear is already pretty effective, and solar is infinite 21:16:45 <frosch123> V453000: maybe robots could eat repair packs? 21:17:20 <frosch123> something which is not as free as energy 21:20:22 <V453000> hm 21:20:35 <frosch123> or fuel like trains 21:23:58 <V453000> having them consume Something is an idea I read multiple times already and I'm not sure what do I think 21:24:16 <V453000> you are definitely right that infinite non-UPS affecting solar just makes energy irrelevant 21:24:51 <V453000> nuclear is good but megabases don't even use it because solar panels calculate all as 1 entity as they share the same state, so ... :) 21:24:57 <V453000> can't optimize vs that 21:25:53 *** Snail has joined #openttd 21:29:30 <V453000> I'll think further about the repair pack consumption 21:30:06 *** Gustavo6046 has joined #openttd 21:30:07 <V453000> thing is I'm not sure if that really makes them more interesting and what exactly happens when they are out of repair packs 21:30:18 <V453000> they'd get slow like if they had no battery I guess 21:30:20 <Gustavo6046> why is the latest OpenTTD not in apt? 21:30:36 <frosch123> V453000: sit silent inside the robotport 21:30:42 <V453000> mhm 21:30:45 <V453000> :) 21:31:05 <V453000> well the thing is you can still let robots deliver the service packs to the roboport :P 21:31:28 <frosch123> ah, so want to make them recover themself 21:31:32 <frosch123> +your 21:31:49 <V453000> ? 21:31:51 <frosch123> i thought everything would stop and you would at least have to deliver the repair packs to the ports via belts :p 21:32:29 <V453000> well yeah that's in theory but once it starts running and they always deliver enough new service packs to the roboport's requester ... :) 21:32:46 *** RafiX2 has quit IRC 21:32:46 <frosch123> well, possibly annoying for ports far aways from the center of the base 21:33:01 <V453000> hm 21:33:40 <V453000> well you can always just blueprint service pack makers all over the place and deliver everything from/to them by more robots ._. 21:33:42 <V453000> is the thing 21:33:49 <V453000> they are the logical answer to everything 21:34:04 <frosch123> no, i was thinking about the less extreme case 21:34:13 <V453000> which one? :) 21:34:16 <frosch123> like when a casual gamer just wants a few robots for fun 21:34:38 <frosch123> and everything breaks down because you temporarily run out of packs 21:34:52 <frosch123> and it does not automatically resume or something 21:35:19 <frosch123> like when you run out of train fuel, and you do not notice, and then have to collect the broken down trains from all around the network 21:35:29 <V453000> well yeah like a burner power system capable of blackout 21:35:30 <frosch123> but ok, i see, that case also exists for trains :) 21:36:29 <V453000> it's a tough topic :) 21:36:49 <V453000> and just adding a service pack price to running them would keep the throughput potential anyway 21:38:03 <Gustavo6046> I can't install OpenTTD's .deb package using apt-get because it can't find libicu52 on the repostiory! 21:38:05 <frosch123> but at a way higher cost 21:38:44 <Gustavo6046> I have to download it manually. 21:38:46 <V453000> I guess :) 21:38:58 <Gustavo6046> But I shouldn't have to download all the dependencies it doesn't find by hand! 21:38:59 <frosch123> what would be the impact if a rocket would cost 10% more iron, just because you transport everything by robot? 21:39:20 <frosch123> Gustavo6046: use the generic binary, it links icu statically, all the .deb are too old 21:39:38 <V453000> hm, yeah, like an anti-productivity module :D 21:39:41 <Gustavo6046> huh? 21:39:54 <Gustavo6046> frosch123, what is that? 21:39:57 <Gustavo6046> there is no 'generic' package 21:40:03 <frosch123> on openttd.org 21:40:05 <Gustavo6046> oh 21:40:09 <frosch123> there is a generic linux package 21:40:11 <V453000> what seems weird is that nothing else is being upkept in the game :) 21:40:24 <frosch123> V453000: trains use fuel 21:40:33 <Gustavo6046> where do I find that 21:40:56 <V453000> fuel = energy = electricity 21:40:57 <frosch123> Gustavo6046: http://www.openttd.org/en/download-stable 21:41:03 <Gustavo6046> yes 21:41:10 <V453000> service pack feels different 21:41:10 <Gustavo6046> where 21:41:13 <V453000> yet makes sense 21:41:21 <Gustavo6046> is it this zip thing? 21:41:32 <Gustavo6046> .tar.gz 21:41:33 <Gustavo6046> idk 21:41:38 <Gustavo6046> that is just a copy of the game 21:42:05 <Gustavo6046> I don't have an idea what you mean, frosch123 21:42:10 <Gustavo6046> that is just a copy of the game 21:42:20 <frosch123> V453000: argueably, building more solar panels also just costs copper 21:42:21 <Gustavo6046> I already have it but I want to install a newer version of it 21:42:25 <Gustavo6046> because in apt the latest version is 1.5.2 21:42:35 <V453000> solar panels are broken AF 21:42:42 <frosch123> Gustavo6046: so, unpack the tar.gz and run the binary which is inside 21:43:01 <Gustavo6046> unpack it where? 21:43:01 <V453000> and now they are also annoying to stamp due to cliffs :D you have to find a non-cliffy area for your farm 21:43:12 <frosch123> Gustavo6046: doesn't matter, your home folder? 21:43:15 <Gustavo6046> no 21:43:24 <Gustavo6046> I must unpack it where the old OpenTTD installation is 21:43:27 <Gustavo6046> it was made by apt 21:43:30 <Gustavo6046> apt-get 21:43:41 <frosch123> V453000: i must have had bad luck, almost no cliffs on my map 21:43:53 <V453000> the randomness noise has a giant scale 21:44:02 <V453000> it's entirely possible to get a map without -thing- 21:44:32 <frosch123> Gustavo6046: i can't help you fight the problems you invent yourself 21:44:35 <V453000> it's one of the things being looked at for 0.17 21:44:40 <Gustavo6046> well 21:44:50 <Gustavo6046> I did not invent it 21:45:03 <Gustavo6046> apt-get's version of OpenTTD is 1.5.2 but it's too old for this server I'm trying to join 21:45:10 <frosch123> you want to pack it where the old version was, but there is zero need for that, just have both 21:45:22 <Gustavo6046> but I don't want to install OpenGFX etc again 21:45:25 <Gustavo6046> (yes I'm that lazy) 21:45:29 <frosch123> also no need for that 21:45:34 <frosch123> they can share the data files 21:45:38 <Gustavo6046> ugh whatever 21:46:11 <Gustavo6046> wait 21:46:12 <Gustavo6046> they can share? 21:46:20 <Gustavo6046> is that another tedious proceeding? 21:46:47 <frosch123> just unpack the .tar.gz in your home folder, start the binary, and find everything you had before 21:47:28 <Samu> 6 gelignAIte v1 - bankrupt 11-2011 21:47:51 <V453000> well thank you for your input frosch123 :) I'll think about it 21:47:52 <frosch123> maybe "find" is the wrong word, i meant to say, it just works 21:48:08 <frosch123> V453000: you're welcome, also blame twinsen 21:48:18 <V453000> we do that every day :P 21:49:43 <frosch123> also i expect 4 authors for "bots vers belts (part 3)" :p 21:50:11 <V453000> there will hopefully not be any, or at least lengthy part3 :) 21:50:17 <frosch123> i wonder when you run out of staff that way 21:50:20 <V453000> :D 21:51:27 <Gustavo6046> okay then 21:51:28 <Gustavo6046> thanks 21:51:59 <V453000> good night, thanks :) 21:52:49 <andythenorth> bye 21:52:49 *** andythenorth has left #openttd 22:02:27 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 22:21:18 *** Thedarkb1 has quit IRC 22:23:58 *** Thedarkb1 has joined #openttd 22:27:44 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 22:30:45 <Wolf01> 'night 22:30:50 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 22:31:19 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 22:36:08 *** Laedek has quit IRC 22:37:18 *** Stimrol has quit IRC 22:56:19 <Samu> 5 NoNoCAB v5 - bankrupt 11-2020 22:56:41 <Samu> 10 AIs remain 22:57:56 <Samu> did anyone really test infrastructure maintenance costs with inflation? 22:58:02 <Samu> the costs are absurd! 23:00:10 *** Progman has quit IRC 23:00:13 *** Long_yanG has joined #openttd 23:02:08 <Samu> all the current AIs that have vehicles are unable to make a profit 23:02:29 <Samu> they're living with what they had in the reserves 23:03:00 <Samu> sooner or later, they will start loaning, they won't last 23:03:12 <Samu> everyone will bankrupt 23:06:27 <Samu> 7 CluelessPlus v38 - bankrupt 08-2021 23:17:37 *** ToffeeYogurtPots has joined #openttd