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11:32:30 *** murr4y has joined #openttd 11:52:31 *** ToBeFree has joined #openttd 12:00:11 *** Samu has joined #openttd 12:08:25 *** Flygon has quit IRC 12:22:52 *** Compu has quit IRC 12:28:39 *** Compu has joined #openttd 13:13:32 *** Gja has quit IRC 13:16:08 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 13:21:41 *** john-aj has joined #openttd 13:30:59 *** supermop has joined #openttd 14:04:28 *** john-aj has quit IRC 14:11:26 *** riso has joined #openttd 14:16:17 *** TheMask96 has quit IRC 14:16:56 * riso slaps dihedral around a bit with a large trout 14:18:04 *** TheMask96 has joined #openttd 14:22:45 <Samu> eh, dune is back? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7oyrTZxieI 14:26:19 <Samu> A brand new Hardcore Vibes Version is coming in 2018 14:26:23 <Samu> "k" 14:26:27 <Samu> waiting... 14:30:23 *** riso has quit IRC 14:53:09 <supermop_work> so there is a limit on number of switch blocks? 14:59:27 *** sim-al2 has quit IRC 15:00:36 *** Gja has joined #openttd 15:13:18 *** john-aj has joined #openttd 15:33:45 *** john-aj has quit IRC 15:37:28 *** synchris has joined #openttd 15:40:01 *** Gja has quit IRC 15:41:21 *** Gja has joined #openttd 16:00:18 *** Alberth has joined #openttd 16:00:19 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Alberth 16:00:26 <Alberth> o/ 16:04:02 <supermop_work> yo 16:04:14 <supermop_work> i ran out of switches i think 16:05:25 *** supermop has quit IRC 16:11:46 *** Gja has quit IRC 16:15:02 *** MKultra2u has joined #openttd 16:28:08 *** Cubey has joined #openttd 16:29:18 * dihedral gave his switches packets.... 16:29:22 <dihedral> switches looove packets 16:29:39 * MKultra2u sees dihedral 16:40:43 *** john-aj has joined #openttd 16:53:36 <Alberth> unfortunately, they don't replicate themselves 16:57:18 *** FLHerne has quit IRC 16:59:20 <supermop_work> i got an nml error saying it couldn't allocate the switch, and to try reducing the number of such blocks 16:59:46 <supermop_work> i would have thought i only had a few hundred but idk 16:59:57 *** TheMask96 has quit IRC 17:02:40 <supermop_work> i only added 18 since the last time i compiled 17:03:05 <supermop_work> but i plan on adding many more, like for drive-side specific graphics 17:05:05 *** TheMask96 has joined #openttd 17:08:05 *** beno has joined #openttd 17:13:59 <Alberth> maybe merge a few together? 17:14:34 <Alberth> if you have chains of switches 17:19:47 *** Gja has joined #openttd 17:23:10 <Samu> time to inflate the number of clients 17:23:14 <Samu> on my server, muahahu 17:32:59 <Samu> oh, the server also counts as a client, hmm ok 17:33:19 <Samu> so i can only have 63 clients 17:33:22 <Samu> not 64 17:34:52 <Samu> most played server https://imgur.com/cw3cr8K 17:35:00 <Samu> no cheating 17:38:48 <Samu> wait a minute, the server, when dedicated doesn't count as a client, but i still can't have 64 clients 17:39:14 <Samu> only 63 could join 17:39:44 <Samu> if server is not dedicated, it counts as a client, the 64 limit is correct then 17:40:07 <supermop_work> Alberth: probably some i can omit, but not sure how many i can really merge 17:40:19 <Samu> i better confirm 17:40:20 <Samu> brb 17:40:40 <supermop_work> very few are chains 17:41:13 <supermop_work> the ones that are are typically a sprite stack, where each layer in the stack is a switch 17:43:23 <supermop_work> can't find anything in nml specs that says what the limit is, and if it is separate for switches and sprite groups etc, or if they all the same 17:43:52 <Alberth> nml doesn't output some statistics about it? 17:44:36 <Alberth> iirc a switch has a number so you can refer to it, that's a finite range 17:45:05 <Alberth> but that sort of depends on how many you would need to refer to at the same time 17:45:12 <Alberth> no idea how smart nml is there 17:45:34 <supermop_work> hm 17:45:55 <supermop_work> well i tried this compile at home before leaving for work 17:46:11 <supermop_work> so i don't have the nmlc output in front of me right now 17:49:15 *** john-aj has quit IRC 17:50:32 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 17:50:38 <Samu> I confirm. When I'm a non dedicated server, openttd counts me as a client. If I set a max number of 64 clients, I'm included in 17:51:18 <Samu> When I'm dedicated server, openttd doesn't count me. Only 63 clients can join, while the limit is 64 17:53:06 <Samu> and yet, the total is still 64 17:53:39 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 17:53:59 <Samu> there is a bug in the counting 17:54:31 <supermop_work> nmlc's message wan't helpful though... it didn't say 'you have too many switches' instead it says 'could not allocate switch, spritegroup, etc' 'try reducing the number of such blocks' 17:54:53 <supermop_work> to me that is not clear as to whether i actually have too many, or there is some other problem 17:55:54 <supermop_work> also it is unclear if switches and spritegroups affect each other's allocation, like part of some common pool, or if it just reuses the same error message for the same 17:56:26 <supermop_work> i guess it is possible that a spritegroup internally is essentially just another switch 18:01:13 *** Gja has quit IRC 18:04:24 *** MKultra2u has quit IRC 18:08:56 *** MkUltraUp has joined #openttd 18:10:18 *** glx has joined #openttd 18:10:18 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 18:10:51 *** Biolunar has joined #openttd 18:16:06 *** MkUltraUp has left #openttd 18:20:35 *** Stimrol has joined #openttd 18:20:52 <Alberth> sorry, no idea how that works 18:40:16 *** Gja has joined #openttd 18:47:50 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 18:50:08 <supermop_work> me neither 18:55:00 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 18:56:10 <andythenorth> o/ 18:58:41 *** ToffeeYogurtPots has joined #openttd 18:59:45 *** john-aj has joined #openttd 19:01:34 *** Wolf01|Phone has joined #openttd 19:01:37 *** ToffeeYogurtPots has quit IRC 19:01:44 <Wolf01|Phone> o/ 19:01:46 *** ToffeeYogurtPots has joined #openttd 19:02:56 <Wolf01|Phone> Andy, tried town roads yet? 19:03:01 <andythenorth> no sorry 19:03:30 <andythenorth> ah 19:03:33 <andythenorth> I did try to compile it 19:03:50 <andythenorth> OK I pulled the fixes now 19:04:30 <Wolf01|Phone> I fixed the path separator for the header I used 19:04:59 <andythenorth> ok compiled 19:05:16 <Wolf01|Phone> Also I think I could remove that header from there as I moved the function too 19:06:01 <andythenorth> ok towns are building unspooled stone roads 19:06:19 <andythenorth> so I need to patch nml 19:06:37 <Wolf01|Phone> Yup 19:08:00 *** Alberth has left #openttd 19:08:04 <andythenorth> I have to make dinner, tidy house, do recycling 19:08:09 <Wolf01|Phone> o/ 19:08:10 <andythenorth> but the nml patch is one line :P 19:08:27 <Wolf01|Phone> 😃 19:08:29 <andythenorth> what are we calling the property? 19:08:43 <andythenorth> urgh, do I need to branch for this? 19:08:48 <andythenorth> how stable is this idea? 19:08:55 <Wolf01|Phone> I called it town road choice weight 19:09:39 <Wolf01|Phone> Pretty stable, the problem is if we want it with this implementation 19:09:49 <andythenorth> what's the property, byte, word, etc? 19:10:01 <Wolf01|Phone> Byte 19:10:09 <Wolf01|Phone> 0x0 to 0xFF 19:10:32 *** ToffeeYogurtPots_ has joined #openttd 19:10:42 <Wolf01|Phone> just like the sort order 19:10:51 *** ToffeeYogurtPots_ has quit IRC 19:11:11 *** ToffeeYogurtPots_ has joined #openttd 19:11:40 *** ToffeeYogurtPots has quit IRC 19:12:21 *** ToffeeYogurtPots_ has quit IRC 19:12:44 *** ToffeeYogurtPots has joined #openttd 19:14:44 <Wolf01|Phone> Ok, bbl, going to find something else to eat (I'm at the restaurant) 19:15:09 *** Wolf01|Phone has left #openttd 19:17:07 <supermop_work> andythenorth: "town_weight"? 19:17:13 <andythenorth> https://github.com/andythenorth/nml-andythenorth/commits/town-road-choice-weight 19:18:00 <supermop_work> neato 19:18:23 <supermop_work> andythenorth: do you know if there is a ceiling on the number of switches in nml or newgrf? 19:18:31 <andythenorth> hmm 19:18:36 <andythenorth> there is yes 19:18:41 <andythenorth> you shouldn't run into it 19:18:50 <supermop_work> got an opaque error to that effect this morning 19:19:00 <andythenorth> got it to hand? 19:19:23 <supermop_work> but i would have assumed it would be between 10,000 and 1,000,000 19:19:33 <supermop_work> not at the office no 19:19:42 <supermop_work> should have brought it along 19:19:42 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 19:19:48 <supermop_work> hi frosch123 19:20:18 *** beno has quit IRC 19:20:38 <supermop_work> unspooled does not yet have choice weights by the way 19:20:46 <andythenorth> you wouldn't be able to compile them :P 19:21:39 *** Progman has joined #openttd 19:22:41 <supermop_work> anywhere i might be able to find at least the order of magnitude of number of switches i can have? 19:23:10 <frosch123> moi 19:23:23 <supermop_work> i've about 36,000 lines of code, on average i probably have one switch every 10-20 lines 19:23:29 <frosch123> supermop_work: there is only a limit on concurrent switches 19:24:06 <supermop_work> frosch123: does that mean number of concurrent lines of code containing a switch, or length of a switch chain? 19:24:38 <frosch123> https://jenkins.openttdcoop.org/job/firs/2079/console <- on successful compile, nml outputs the usage, see 16:49:20 19:24:51 <frosch123> if you run into the limit, you have to reshuffle your code 19:25:05 <frosch123> bad grf: all spritesgroups, all switches, all items 19:25:05 <supermop_work> i did lump a bunch of cargo and running cost switches together into a long list 19:25:13 <supermop_work> :( 19:25:23 <supermop_work> that is basically my grf 19:25:29 <frosch123> good grf: spritegroups for item 1, switches for item 1, item 1, spritegroups for item 2, switches for item 2, items 2, ... 19:25:54 <supermop_work> items 1..100 often share the same switches though 19:26:06 <supermop_work> i'll see what i can reshuffle 19:26:09 <frosch123> if they share the identical ones, it is fine 19:26:15 <andythenorth> hmm I need to fix Road Hog 19:26:20 <andythenorth> I broke all the AIs :( 19:26:57 <frosch123> supermop_work: anyway, check the previous compile that worked, and see what nml tells you there, about Concurrent spritegroups and in which line the peak was reached 19:27:19 <supermop_work> ok 19:27:42 <supermop_work> andythenorth: just make new AIs 19:27:57 <frosch123> TrueBrain: django is 504 19:28:47 *** Knogle has joined #openttd 19:28:55 <Knogle> !alogin 19:29:05 <Knogle> wrong window sorry 19:29:13 <andythenorth> one day we rebuild ottd web 19:29:16 <andythenorth> :P 19:29:18 <andythenorth> I have the VM 19:36:38 *** ToffeeYogurtPots has quit IRC 19:36:45 *** ToffeeYogurtPots_ has joined #openttd 19:43:28 <supermop_work> andythenorth: i sent yesterdays RVs 19:43:40 <andythenorth> I got it :) 19:49:56 *** synchris has quit IRC 19:58:17 <supermop_work> whats all this then: https://sites.google.com/site/boekabart/sealevel 19:59:43 <supermop_work> never saw that before 20:00:42 <andythenorth> sea level patch 20:00:49 <andythenorth> anyone tried the ships stuff in forums? 20:00:52 <andythenorth> multi docks 20:01:12 <supermop_work> seems like some people are 20:01:49 <supermop_work> all my limited playing time is testing nrt grfs 20:02:21 <Knogle> is the website down for a reason? 20:03:32 <supermop_work> which site? 20:03:35 <Samu> great video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rf6h4vPm7Vo 20:04:33 <Knogle> www.openttd.org 20:05:41 <andythenorth> django is 504 20:05:52 <andythenorth> website backend has gone away 20:09:07 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 20:10:10 <Wolf01> o/ 20:11:15 <andythenorth> https://github.com/andythenorth/nml-andythenorth/commits/town-road-choice-weight 20:11:34 <Wolf01> http://store.steampowered.com/news/externalpost/pcgamer/2361446846767185518 peter1138, we should try it soon or later 20:12:10 <Wolf01> :D really one line 20:13:49 *** drdoom has quit IRC 20:20:57 <andythenorth> yup 20:21:48 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 20:28:30 <Eddi|zuHause> if only there was a linux version... 20:28:44 <Wolf01> Heh 20:36:50 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 20:36:58 *** Knogle has quit IRC 20:39:36 <supermop_work> so can i add choice weights to unspooled now? 20:39:45 <Wolf01> Yes 20:39:57 <supermop_work> and is 0 or ff more likely to be chosen? 20:40:10 <Wolf01> That's a good question 20:43:41 <Wolf01> I think less is better, but that's random, also FF has really a low chance, like 1 if all others have high values 20:43:49 <andythenorth> you'll need a new nml again 20:44:24 <supermop_work> also is it absolute, like if asphalt is better than stone, will the town rebuild everything to asphalt as soon as it is available? 20:44:31 <supermop_work> andythenorth: yep 20:45:06 <supermop_work> im thinking of cobblestone roads in old city centers 20:45:07 <Wolf01> No, not yet, but you can convert the seed tile and make the town build that one when it expand 20:45:15 <supermop_work> hmm 20:45:41 <supermop_work> town builds new roads to match it's seed tile? 20:45:47 <Wolf01> I'm thinking about storing it another way, so you can also change it in the town ui without relying on the seed tile 20:46:10 <Wolf01> Currently yes, it's only an experimental branch 20:46:18 <supermop_work> i don't think player needs to control it necessarily 20:46:53 <Wolf01> It can change everything but the grf property, that's "stable" enough 20:47:32 <supermop_work> i think there are a few things that might be expected behavior, but not absolutely required 20:47:45 <andythenorth> supermop_work: dunno how to get you a windows build 20:48:32 <supermop_work> 1) in ancient times towns have primitive roads, in modern times they have modern roads 20:49:11 <supermop_work> 2) towns might have different roads in different areas depending on the age of those areas 20:50:02 <supermop_work> 3) town might have different roads in different areas depending on the nature of those areas (town zones) 20:50:30 <supermop_work> 1) i think is the most critical to have, and seems like your method allows for this 20:50:44 <Wolf01> supermop_work: I set the filter so you can't have towns with asphalt road if that's not yet available 20:52:07 <Wolf01> Maybe we could extend the feature so you can set which roadtype could be used as upgrade 20:52:22 <Wolf01> But we have to think really well about it 21:03:23 *** ToffeeYogurtPots_ has quit IRC 21:03:36 *** ToffeeYogurtPots has joined #openttd 21:09:43 <supermop_work> 2) is nice to have, and seems like would probably be possible as is 21:09:51 <supermop_work> 3) i don't know if is needed 21:10:47 <supermop_work> Wolf01: I dont know if we need to get that nuanced for upgrading 21:11:49 <supermop_work> maybe some preference for different town zones, but i think the simple choice weight probably provides enough, and we should play with that first 21:12:21 <Wolf01> We could work it out with time 21:12:58 <Wolf01> I would like to have nrt in trunk first, then we'll extend it with more and more features 21:13:50 <supermop_work> me too 21:14:22 <supermop_work> i think the most simple possible way of allowing a town to build something other than ROAD is most important for now 21:14:52 <supermop_work> just to allow for "ROAD isn't available until year x' 21:17:00 <supermop_work> i think you've done more than enough for this year 21:18:23 <supermop_work> i need to figure out how to set a parameter based on the drive side game setting 21:18:43 <supermop_work> so i can draw intersection stripes on correct side 21:20:53 <Wolf01> That would be nice 21:23:53 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 21:24:14 *** beno has joined #openttd 21:26:58 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 21:31:58 *** andythenorth has left #openttd 21:33:22 *** ToffeeYogurtPots has quit IRC 21:33:22 *** Progman has quit IRC 21:33:22 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 21:33:22 *** john-aj has quit IRC 21:33:22 *** argoneus has quit IRC 21:33:22 *** Lamp- has quit IRC 21:33:22 *** UncleCJ has quit IRC 21:33:22 *** rustyshackleford[m] has quit IRC 21:33:22 *** __ln__ has quit IRC 21:33:22 *** tokai|noir has quit IRC 21:33:22 *** lastmikoi has quit IRC 21:33:22 *** IgnoredAmbience has quit IRC 21:33:22 *** TheIJ has quit IRC 21:33:22 *** ericnoan has quit IRC 21:33:22 *** Osai has quit IRC 21:33:22 *** Prof_Frink has quit IRC 21:33:22 *** Hirundo has quit 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ERROR: "moprv55.nml", line 4527: Unable to allocate ID for [random]switch, sprite set/layout/group or produce-block. Try reducing the number of such blocks. 22:31:27 <supermop> hmm 22:36:34 <supermop> i put in some useless sprite definitions to try to break up the switches 22:36:49 <supermop> but the error still occurs at the same switch 22:38:55 <supermop> [K nmlc info: Concurrent spritesets: 10/255 ("moprv55.nml", line 2293) [K nmlc info: Concurrent spritegroups: 256/256 ("moprv55.nml", line 6136) [K nmlc info: Concurrent Action2 registers: 1/127 ("moprv55.nml", line 33433) [K nmlc info: Concurrent ActionD registers: 17/64 ("moprv55.nml", line 29491) [K nmlc info: GRF parameter registers: 11/64 22:39:08 <supermop> ^ from last sucessful compile... 22:49:12 *** beno has quit IRC 22:58:26 *** beno has joined #openttd 22:59:13 *** john-aj has quit IRC 23:05:02 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 23:09:57 *** Biolunar has quit IRC 23:18:19 <supermop> is an 'action D register' equivalent to a switch? 23:32:16 <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: the problem is the number of IDs it has to remember simultaneously 23:32:28 <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: try to put the definitions closer to when they are used 23:34:03 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 23:35:05 *** sim-al2 has joined #openttd 23:35:12 <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: do you have code somewhere? 23:40:09 <supermop> yeah 23:40:12 <supermop> one sec 23:40:56 <supermop> i am currently moving some of the switches around and replacing my purchase_capacity switches with just an expression 23:41:03 <supermop> so doesn't need to be a switch 23:41:18 <supermop> hope that helps 23:42:28 <supermop> " purchase_capacity_xy = (param_capacity*10) " etc 23:42:56 <supermop> tho maybe that still counts 23:43:21 <Eddi|zuHause> that'll use up parameters, i think 23:43:43 <supermop> oh 23:43:44 <supermop> hm 23:43:59 <Eddi|zuHause> "ActionD registers" 23:44:07 <supermop> yeah it is a lot, like 18 23:44:46 <supermop> if i already used 11/64 params i dont want to waste another 18 23:45:47 <supermop> but it also seems dumb to use up a switch for something that will only ever have one possible result 23:45:59 <Eddi|zuHause> technically, there are 128 such registers, but nml splits them 64/64 for user-selectable and internal uses 23:46:25 <supermop> how do you know all this off hand? 23:46:43 <supermop> were you one of the nml developers? 23:47:35 <Eddi|zuHause> not really, but i came across some of the internals when i wanted to do a high-level nfo replacement myself (before nml existed) 23:48:12 <Eddi|zuHause> and i also looked into nmlc when trying to maximise my (ab)usage of it :p 23:49:31 <Eddi|zuHause> and then some of the things i don't actually know but are educated/lucky guesses 23:52:48 *** Gja has quit IRC 23:57:09 <supermop> oh i need 54 of those expressions, not 18 23:57:17 <supermop> that puts me over 64 23:58:47 <supermop> if we could just build the tractors and trailers of trucks separately, that would save me a lot of trouble