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has quit IRC 03:14:22 *** yellyFish has quit IRC 03:20:06 *** yellyFish has joined #openttd 03:21:31 <yellyFish> finally. i was getting 0.7 speed. now i get 0.8 :D 03:23:07 <yellyFish> about 14% increase in speed 03:23:25 <yellyFish> simulation rate 03:26:17 <yellyFish> or maybe i am measuring wrong :D 03:26:17 *** TheMaster is now known as Unit193 03:35:55 *** glx has quit IRC 04:24:20 *** dvim has quit IRC 04:32:20 *** snail_UES_ has quit IRC 05:41:02 *** yellyFish has quit IRC 07:13:14 *** glavinics has joined #openttd 07:13:25 *** glavinics has quit IRC 08:02:34 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 08:24:23 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 08:51:54 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh approved pull request #6954: Doxygen update and warning fixes https://git.io/fxFXo 08:58:22 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 09:00:37 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 09:05:53 *** matt21347 has joined #openttd 09:15:50 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 09:16:21 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 09:17:48 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 09:28:01 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 10:24:18 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 10:24:24 *** andythenorth has left #openttd 10:43:16 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #6935: Add: EnsureNoShipFromDiagDirs https://git.io/fxFdU 10:45:57 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #6935: Add: EnsureNoShipFromDiagDirs https://git.io/fxFdm 11:29:14 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 11:35:58 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 merged pull request #6954: Doxygen update and warning fixes https://git.io/fxdxf 11:41:41 <LordAro> :) 11:41:43 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 approved pull request #6948: Various minor code cleanups found by scan-build https://git.io/fxFxs 11:41:52 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 merged pull request #6948: Various minor code cleanups found by scan-build https://git.io/fxHhE 11:42:01 <LordAro> :)) 11:44:22 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 approved pull request #6932: Change: Gradually slow down aircraft speed on breakdown https://git.io/fxFxr 11:45:24 <nielsm> I'm looking at #6928 atm, it looks like way too much work and special casing 11:45:26 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 merged pull request #6932: Change: Gradually slow down aircraft speed on breakdown https://git.io/fxGAO 11:46:03 <frosch123> yes, that applies to at least half of samu stuff 11:46:27 <frosch123> corner cases over corner cases 11:49:37 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 approved pull request #6754: Don't automatically deactivate the vehicle clone tool after cloning a vehicle https://git.io/fxFpL 11:50:54 <nielsm> wow wtf is up with the YAPF method of selecting functions to call depending on settings 11:51:13 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 merged pull request #6754: Don't automatically deactivate the vehicle clone tool after cloning a vehicle https://git.io/vp8bd 11:51:35 <frosch123> nielsm: inline fetishism 11:52:04 <frosch123> someone trying to have a complete inlined copy of the whole algorithm for each combination of parameters 11:53:23 <nielsm> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/blob/master/src/pathfinder/yapf/yapf_rail.cpp#L617-L625 11:53:24 <nielsm> like that 11:53:46 <nielsm> function pointers to a static function that just constructs an object of the type and calls a similarly named function on the object with parameter pass-through 11:53:57 <LordAro> yapf is scary code 11:54:37 <nielsm> like, just use a damn virtual method 11:54:43 <nielsm> it's still a level of indirection 12:04:17 *** snail_UES_ has joined #openttd 12:10:38 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 opened pull request #6955: Fix: [NewGRF] Make VA2 operator 11 (ror) behave well-defined when rotating by 0 bits. https://git.io/fxFjB 12:12:25 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro approved pull request #6955: Fix: [NewGRF] Make VA2 operator 11 (ror) behave well-defined when rotating by 0 bits. https://git.io/fxFjH 12:12:46 <frosch123> :) 12:15:44 <LordAro> though i wonder if that branch will slow things down 12:16:57 <peter1138> Yeah it was meant to be super fast. 12:17:09 <frosch123> ROR is only used in 3 places 12:17:31 <frosch123> 2 of them have a fixed constant for n, so i hope on the compiler 12:17:36 <frosch123> the 3rd is the just added one 12:18:20 <peter1138> I meant YAPF, sorry. 12:18:40 <frosch123> ROL is used in md5sum 12:19:28 <frosch123> which also has a chance to be inlined 12:21:45 *** snail_UES_ has quit IRC 12:34:43 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 requested changes for pull request #6906: Fix #6742: Only possible to build station next to competitor by using CTRL+click https://git.io/fxbfz 12:46:06 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 commented on pull request #6831: Fix #6742: Only possible to build station next to competitor by using CTRL+click https://git.io/fxbJs 12:46:07 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 closed pull request #6831: Fix #6742: Only possible to build station next to competitor by using CTRL+click https://git.io/f4DWv 13:33:00 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh requested changes for pull request #6928: Fix #5713: Use pathfinder to find closest ship depot https://git.io/fxbLs 13:35:49 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh merged pull request #6955: Fix: [NewGRF] Make VA2 operator 11 (ror) behave well-defined when rotating by 0 bits. https://git.io/fxFjB 13:45:51 <nielsm> I don't really know about release preparations etc., but would it be an idea to make a "project" board on github for collecting tickets that should be addressed for 1.9.0 release? or does github have a better way of managing that? 13:56:42 <peter1138> There is a release procedure document somewhere, I'm sure. 13:57:25 <frosch123> nielsm: http://devs.openttd.org/~frosch/backport.txt <- we used to collect stuff for the backports and changelogs together 13:57:48 <frosch123> not sure how to format the changelog with git hashes :p 13:58:48 <frosch123> https://wiki.openttd.org/To_do_for_releases <- that's the old workflow, which is now mostly obsolete due to git and new compile farm :p 13:58:55 <LordAro> can't, really 13:59:07 <LordAro> wellz you could, but they'd be even less useful than the revision numbers 13:59:52 <LordAro> a project board for collecting issues sounds like a good idea though 14:00:07 <LordAro> assuming a 1.8.1 release is actually desired 14:00:36 <frosch123> depends when we have a farm that can build it :) 14:01:24 <nielsm> I was thinking catching both bugs and desired features (open PRs) we want on a project board 14:06:07 <peter1138> Does any of the old farm still exist? 14:06:18 <peter1138> Cos that did still work, didn't it? 14:07:57 <frosch123> i don't think the disk was full 14:08:40 <frosch123> but we would have to revert some c++11 changes :p 14:11:39 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 14:15:53 <LordAro> nielsm: couldn't hurt to make one, even if it ends up not being used 14:19:59 <nielsm> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/projects/3 14:30:12 <LordAro> ah, i was referring to bugfix releases, rather than major releases 14:30:39 <nielsm> I don't think it makes sense to make a 1.8.1 at this point 14:30:39 <LordAro> major release projects could easily turn into the roadmap pages on the wiki :p 14:31:39 <peter1138> So anybody else have experience of setting these kind of compile farms up? 14:32:38 <peter1138> I have VM resources that could potentially be used, but it's not super high-end. 14:33:01 <LordAro> i fear not 14:37:27 <nielsm> also, how to do windows build, non-containerized on a desktop windows version, or containerized cross-compile from linux? 14:38:06 <nielsm> renting a windows server version is probably somewhat expensive 14:39:00 <LordAro> this was what blocked TrueBrain, iirc 14:41:50 <frosch123> https://github.com/TrueBrain/OpenTTD-CF/tree/windows <- that's the last status, i think 14:47:34 <peter1138> Does it need to be a server version? 14:47:58 <LordAro> it makes certain ...server things easier 14:48:22 <nielsm> also avoids some windows update fun times 14:54:02 <nielsm> https://github.com/tpoechtrager/wclang ? 14:55:12 <peter1138> i686-w64-mingw32-clang++ < mixed messages about architecture there... 14:55:35 <peter1138> How to target different Windows versions with that? 14:57:00 <nielsm> that's really an issue I have with all gcc/clang-derived compilers that target win32, they want to use the microsoft C runtime, instead of their own 14:57:21 <nielsm> despite that windows does not have any such thing as "system C runtime" 14:57:41 <nielsm> it's kind of expected that a compiler vendor supplies their own runtime 14:58:51 <nielsm> hm bbl, I should really go for a walk while there's still some daylight 15:19:49 *** hph^ has quit IRC 15:33:10 <peter1138> You can walk in the dark too. 16:13:36 <planetmaker> <LordAro> [13:59:52] a project board for collecting issues sounds like a good idea though <-- isn't that like the issues on GitHub? And maybe an additional tag as to which version they should be fixed in like we had on FlySpray? 16:14:14 <planetmaker> (or is 'project board' a github feature I don't know yet? How does it relate to the issues?) 16:17:37 *** Stimrol has quit IRC 16:25:56 <nielsm> back... I accidentally bought a new coat too 16:27:24 <nielsm> planetmaker: a project board is more or less a category of mutually exclusive tags, forming a single orthogonal dimension of categorisation of tickets, but they can also hold non-tickets (single-line notes) 16:27:52 <nielsm> and items in each category on a board have an explicit ordering 16:48:02 <LordAro> planetmaker: https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/projects/3 basically a github trello thing 17:28:01 *** Progman has joined #openttd 17:41:13 *** yellyFish has joined #openttd 17:49:40 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Hemaolle dismissed a review for pull request #6906: Fix #6742: Only possible to build station next to competitor by using CTRL+click https://git.io/fxddj 17:49:42 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Hemaolle updated pull request #6906: Fix #6742: Only possible to build station next to competitor by using CTRL+click https://git.io/fxddd 17:51:55 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Hemaolle commented on pull request #6906: Fix #6742: Only possible to build station next to competitor by using CTRL+click https://git.io/fxbid 17:57:52 *** yellyFish has quit IRC 18:20:03 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick commented on pull request #6935: Add: EnsureNoShipFromDiagDirs https://git.io/fxbMt 18:23:50 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 approved pull request #6906: Fix #6742: Only possible to build station next to competitor by using CTRL+click https://git.io/fxbMM 18:24:25 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 merged pull request #6906: Fix #6742: Only possible to build station next to competitor by using CTRL+click https://git.io/fxddd 18:28:09 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 18:28:18 <Wolf01> o/ 18:28:29 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick commented on pull request #6935: Add: EnsureNoShipFromDiagDirs https://git.io/fxbDk 18:31:05 *** yellyFish has joined #openttd 18:32:49 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 18:33:37 <andythenorth> o/ 18:34:54 <andythenorth> loads of merges :o 18:35:30 <andythenorth> pull queue, -samu https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pulls?utf8=%E2%9C%93&q=is%3Apr+is%3Aopen+-label%3A%22waiting-on-author%22+-author%3ASamuXarick+ 18:35:38 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick commented on pull request #6935: Add: EnsureNoShipFromDiagDirs https://git.io/fxbDD 18:51:02 <Arveen> this channel needs more egg plants 🍆🍆🍆 19:02:47 <andythenorth> it has enough now 19:04:54 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 19:11:08 <yellyFish> so after decoding a newGRF, how should a line calling for var 0x61 look like? 19:11:23 * andythenorth looks 19:16:51 <yellyFish> found it 19:17:40 <andythenorth> can't find it in nars 2.5.1 19:17:41 <andythenorth> :P 19:17:44 <andythenorth> oof 19:21:47 <LordAro> https://help.github.com/articles/transferring-an-issue-to-another-repository/ sounds useful for the dorpsgek repos :p 19:24:46 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #6935: Add: EnsureNoShipFromDiagDirs https://git.io/fxbQP 19:24:56 <nielsm> could I get someone else to weigh in on that as well? 19:25:58 <andythenorth> I read it, but I can't comment on the answer :( 19:40:22 <yellyFish> is there any overarching logic to how the game connects NewGRFs and set variables,etc? or is it just something that got more and more features and needs a rework? 19:42:23 <Xaroth> andythenorth: mind testing something (if you're on windows that is) 19:42:37 <Xaroth> if I set `mono_font = Tahoma` in my openttd.cfg, and start openttd, it will start crashing randomly. 19:42:37 <andythenorth> such not windows :) 19:42:41 <Xaroth> ah, lame :P 19:42:50 <andythenorth> I should test the macOS ICU port though 19:43:16 <nielsm> Xaroth is that 1.8.0 or a dev version? 19:43:21 <Xaroth> 1.8.0 19:43:34 <nielsm> probably the ICU layout issues then 19:44:06 <Xaroth> fair enough 19:44:29 <Xaroth> Related to https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/6882 then I take it? 19:44:30 <nielsm> I can make a build of current master if you want to try 19:44:56 <Xaroth> meh, I'm not fussed 19:44:56 <nielsm> (will you need 32 bit or 64 bit?) 19:45:05 <Xaroth> simply not using Tahoma as mono font would work :P 19:45:21 <Xaroth> but if it's related to #6882, I have a crash.dmp 19:49:12 <LordAro> can't hurt to shove it into the issue 20:07:39 *** glx has joined #openttd 20:07:39 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 20:12:23 <andythenorth> oops 20:12:27 * andythenorth reading youtube comments 20:13:02 <LordAro> ono 20:13:12 <Xaroth> why would you read youtube comments? 20:13:31 <andythenorth> to remind myself 20:13:44 <andythenorth> I was watching a video about electricity smart meters 20:13:55 <andythenorth> and then there were comments 20:14:03 <andythenorth> about conspiracy theories 20:17:16 <andythenorth> it's funny 20:17:51 <andythenorth> the dumb conspiracy fucks are scared of networks and devices and governments 20:17:58 <andythenorth> but they're happy to sit posting on YT 20:18:14 <andythenorth> self-identifying :P 20:18:45 <andythenorth> basic violation of opsec 20:19:28 * andythenorth back to pixels 20:21:22 <yellyFish> does anyone know how to read and make sense of a nfo file? 20:21:35 <andythenorth> kinda 20:21:43 <andythenorth> it's hard from compiled source 20:21:47 <andythenorth> but somewhat 20:22:11 <yellyFish> i am trying to isolate 4 lines and why are they being called so much 20:23:54 <andythenorth> can you paste them? 20:23:58 <andythenorth> with a bit of context? 20:24:02 <andythenorth> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/ 20:24:58 <yellyFish> yeah i was searching pastebing but it was giving me garbage text 20:25:32 <andythenorth> if it's NARS 2.5.1 I have some guesses for var 61 20:25:49 <andythenorth> but I'd need to see the rest of the action 2 chain 20:26:03 <andythenorth> and what it's reading from the other vehicle 20:26:36 <nielsm> it'd be a huge amount of work, but it might be interesting to add detailed logging to openttd itself of newgrf happenings 20:27:00 <andythenorth> the forum post suggests it's looking for C6? 20:27:22 <andythenorth> do we need to shift that to get the actual var it's reading? 20:27:40 <andythenorth> where is eddi when he's needed? o-o 20:27:49 <andythenorth> @seend Eddi|ZuHaus 20:27:56 <andythenorth> @seen Eddi|ZuHaus 20:27:57 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: I have not seen Eddi|ZuHaus. 20:27:57 <Wolf01> "send" 20:28:01 <andythenorth> oof 20:28:20 <Wolf01> @seen __ln__ 20:28:20 <DorpsGek> Wolf01: __ln__ was last seen in #openttd 16 weeks, 3 days, 0 hours, 23 minutes, and 20 seconds ago: <__ln__> TrueBrain: also, how hard can it be to figure out my comment COULD be related to a repo that was mentioned on the previous line? 20:28:25 <Wolf01> Mmmh 20:28:34 <LordAro> rip 20:28:47 <Wolf01> Must be in a trip again 20:28:54 <andythenorth> oh C6 is the ID 20:29:01 <frosch123> nielsm: problem with that is that only few people can read it 20:29:11 <andythenorth> NARS used to have a thing where it adjusted engine HP depending on wagons 20:29:13 <frosch123> i did http://devs.openttd.org/~frosch/inspect_backtrace.png somewhen 20:29:23 <andythenorth> it might also be running costs, or just livery stuff 20:29:28 <frosch123> but stopped continueing it, once i had solved the problem at that time :p 20:29:35 <Wolf01> It's perfectly readable 20:29:43 <andythenorth> yellyFish: you could also try with Iron Horse 2 dev build 20:29:51 <andythenorth> which probably calls 0x61 a lot 20:29:59 <andythenorth> but has full source :P 20:30:11 <yellyFish> fug. i can't paste it. can i upload the file somewhere? 20:30:11 <andythenorth> http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/iron-horse/push/LATEST/ 20:30:21 <andythenorth> if it's NARS 2.5.1 I've got it decompiled here 20:30:24 <andythenorth> which sprite numbers? 20:30:46 <andythenorth> or line numbers, either, just tell me which :D 20:30:55 <andythenorth> so much wasted time confusing those two :) 20:31:20 <Wolf01> I had a discussion with my boss today because he isn't sure we should use guids as primary key on every table for the new project, having composite clustered keys (like 5-7 columns) helps readability... 20:31:39 <andythenorth> ah the endless guid debate 20:31:40 <yellyFish> 4190 20:31:52 * andythenorth likes UUIDs starting at 0 :P 20:31:57 <andythenorth> and incrementing by 1 20:32:01 <andythenorth> then we all know where we stand 20:32:14 <andythenorth> apparently it goes wrong when you merge UIDS from multiple sources :P 20:33:08 <yellyFish> or search for '61 C6'. it should give you 4 ocurrences 20:33:19 <andythenorth> yellyFish: my suspicion, based on scanning that, it's livery stuff 20:33:23 <andythenorth> I need to read more though 20:33:31 <andythenorth> so long since I did this 20:33:43 <yellyFish> it is getting the engine ID offset by register 0x10F 20:34:19 <andythenorth> so it's high speed mail and pax cars? 20:35:01 <yellyFish> i think so 20:36:15 <andythenorth> I'd have to reformat the action 2s to read them properly 20:36:21 <andythenorth> I can't read single line bytecode :P 20:36:51 <yellyFish> 02 00 10 81 // 19 Bytes, A2, Feature 00 (Train), A2 set ID 10, type 81(1 byte variable) 20:36:53 <yellyFish> 4191 61 C6 00 FF // var 0x61, parameter 0xC6, get engine ID offset by register 0x10F 20:36:55 <yellyFish> 4192 02 // 2 ranges and default 20:36:57 <yellyFish> 4193 10 00 55 55 // A2ID 10, low 55, high 55 20:36:59 <yellyFish> 4194 10 00 59 59 // A2ID 10, low 59, high 59 20:37:01 <yellyFish> 4195 30 00 // default: A2ID 30 20:37:10 <yellyFish> that's what i dissected from the first occurrence 20:37:26 <andythenorth> my suspicion is that it's returning results for sprites 3925-3927 20:37:38 <andythenorth> or similar, depending which block you're in 20:37:58 <andythenorth> the sprites for these vehicles depend on the engine ID 20:38:20 <andythenorth> it might be something else, but pikka removed most of the BAD FEATURES in NARS 2.5.1 20:39:04 <andythenorth> you should see the same 0x61 calls in Iron Horse 2, for consists with a caboose, or pax cars or mail cars 20:39:09 <andythenorth> I linked it above 20:39:20 <yellyFish> but it is getting called a lot. isn't there a more CPU friendly way of doing that? 20:40:18 <frosch123> do you want to change the grf or ottd? 20:40:44 <yellyFish> if it's inevitable, the latter, else the former 20:42:00 <frosch123> you need to figure out what is put in register 10f for var61 20:42:09 <yellyFish> -1 and 1 20:42:12 <yellyFish> alternating 20:42:34 <frosch123> ok, so you have an articulared wagon or engine 20:43:10 <frosch123> multiple vehicles are composed from the same articulated parts with different heads 20:43:45 <frosch123> you can remove that by duplicating the code 20:43:59 <frosch123> like templates instead of virtual methods :) 20:44:17 <frosch123> but without a compiler which does that, you won't have fun :p 20:45:03 <andythenorth> it will get called on every redraw no? 20:45:17 <andythenorth> is it particularly expensive? 20:45:23 <yellyFish> i think lies in why am i getting so much calls for that than anything else 20:45:34 <yellyFish> and they get quit expensive if you add them 20:45:39 <yellyFish> quite* 20:46:23 * andythenorth tries to remember difference between 81 and 85 20:46:25 <frosch123> usually you should get var 0C the most 20:46:37 <andythenorth> I thought there was a way to trivially get the ID of the lead vehicle 20:46:42 <frosch123> if you get 61+vehicle id more often, you have a case of virtual functions 20:46:56 <frosch123> andythenorth: it's not the lead vehicle 20:47:14 <andythenorth> no 20:47:18 <andythenorth> it does some other stuff 20:47:31 <andythenorth> it varies sprite by position in consist of similar ID? 20:47:35 <frosch123> it's articulated wagons 20:47:48 <yellyFish> it calling 0x61 with par 198 that in turn returns u->GetEngine()->grf_prop.local_id; 20:48:03 <yellyFish> u being the vehicle offset by register 0x10F 20:48:42 <andythenorth> I am just guessing from trying the vehicles in game and reverse engineering their behaviour :P 20:48:49 <andythenorth> my nfo-reading days are a distant memory 20:51:18 <yellyFish> i want to know why it is trying to get that value so much, is it necesary? can it be removed, modified or optimized in the newGRF or the game 20:51:25 <yellyFish> i have already optimized a little bit 20:51:46 <yellyFish> but still it is not enough. 20:53:56 <frosch123> yellyFish: callbacks are decision trees 20:54:33 <frosch123> you can optimise them by calling them less often, by rebalancing the decisions, or by making the evaluation faster per node 20:55:20 <frosch123> with var61 + vehicle id + offset +-1: i only see the second option 20:56:06 <yellyFish> i have made the evaluation a bit faster by skipping a second call to vehiclegetvariable again when i am sure of the result 20:56:29 <yellyFish> just for var61 wit parameter 198 20:56:55 <yellyFish> beside that i would like to know if i can reduce the number of calls 20:58:03 <frosch123> if the call comes from UpdateViewport, you can optimise it a lot 20:58:51 <frosch123> but it requires some refactoring of the vehicle drawing and hashing 21:07:06 <andythenorth> or drop this from newgrf spec? o_O 21:09:44 <frosch123> does iron horse use it? 21:10:08 <frosch123> sounds like an attempt to increase your market share by banning the competitors :p 21:12:24 <yellyFish> i would prefer to learn from this so it doesn't happen again or diminish the chance of it happening 21:12:57 <andythenorth> Iron Horse uses it extensively 21:13:18 <andythenorth> there's no performance warning on it iirc 21:13:42 <yellyFish> are you using it for trains? 21:13:45 <andythenorth> yes 21:13:50 <andythenorth> but I could delete a lot of BAD FEATURES if it was removed 21:14:04 <yellyFish> what kind of parameter? 21:14:08 <frosch123> i doubt the var is more expensive than any other 21:14:18 <yellyFish> is the var,par pair 21:14:24 <yellyFish> that determines if it is expensive 21:15:21 <yellyFish> at least for 0x61, depending what parameter you pass you get a different branch 21:19:29 <yellyFish> i think i am getting confused 21:19:49 <yellyFish> i'll re-run the profiling 21:20:28 <frosch123> what do you use for profiling? 21:25:26 <yellyFish> callgrind 21:25:47 <frosch123> can you post a screenshot of the callgraph? 21:26:19 <frosch123> http://kcachegrind.sourceforge.net/html/CallGraph.html <- that thing 21:30:14 <yellyFish> uh, sure, wait a sec 21:36:59 <yellyFish> ok. where do i upload it to? 21:37:54 <frosch123> no idea, we do not run our own imagebin 21:38:26 <LordAro> imgur 21:39:09 <yellyFish> https://postimg.cc/JsS3ybTq 21:39:43 <yellyFish> callgrind it's pretty cool, can refer to source code and even assembly 21:39:58 <frosch123> yep :) 21:41:05 <frosch123> so, 100% via UpdateViewport 21:41:47 <frosch123> oh, only 98%, 2% is industries 21:45:10 <frosch123> ah, found the cb backtrace queue, should probably port that one to git 21:55:05 <frosch123> hmm, can't find any diffs wrt. UpdateViewport :( 21:59:06 <LordAro> bottom of cargoaction.cpp, there are some template function definitions for some types 21:59:10 <LordAro> ...are these necessary? 21:59:17 <LordAro> it doesn't seem to break anything if i remove them 22:00:29 <frosch123> those functions are called in cargopacket.cpp 22:00:47 <frosch123> but they are not defined in a header, so someone needs to instantiate them 22:00:53 <frosch123> cargopacket.cpp can't 22:01:52 <LordAro> the template function is in the header, why does it need the instantiated version like that? 22:01:54 <frosch123> for some reason ottd likes to put template implementations into source files, hoping to make compilation faster or something 22:02:22 <frosch123> cargoaction.cpp:44 and 63 22:02:33 <frosch123> they are not in the header 22:03:50 <LordAro> the definitions aren't, but the declaration is 22:04:02 <LordAro> i'm missing something about why that matters... 22:04:29 <frosch123> in *normal* code you have template definitions in the header 22:04:40 <frosch123> templates are instantiated when used 22:04:51 <frosch123> every source file creates those instantiations it needs 22:04:56 <frosch123> the linker removes duplicates 22:05:26 <frosch123> in *ottd* code template definitions are in source files, so other places cannot instantiate them 22:05:35 <frosch123> you have to force instantiation 22:05:46 <LordAro> ah right 22:05:51 <LordAro> yes, that... makes sense 22:06:29 <frosch123> it's like yapf with templates instead of virtual methods :p 22:07:21 <frosch123> you make stuff complicated in the hope that it is faster somehow 22:08:01 * andythenorth has never seen that pattern ever 22:08:04 <andythenorth> never ever 22:08:28 <planetmaker> o/ 22:08:42 <frosch123> hoi pm 22:08:46 <andythenorth> like the records store 'optimised' for performance 22:09:15 <andythenorth> but you can't actually query it, because that would be o(n) complexity or something 22:09:31 <andythenorth> it's only optimised for reading in the way the optimiser intended 22:09:33 <andythenorth> and nothing else works 22:09:38 <andythenorth> and it's not actually faster 22:09:49 <andythenorth> and it adds a second source of truth to the system 22:09:57 * andythenorth may have bitterness 22:10:16 <frosch123> think about * and whether to put them left or right 22:10:51 <frosch123> then let others argue about it, and enjoy your beverage 22:10:59 <planetmaker> hehe :) 22:13:00 *** matt21347 has quit IRC 22:13:15 * andythenorth wonders if santa will bring 44 more Iron Horse sprites 22:13:16 <frosch123> at work i once argued for "let's use the code style the other teams use, instead of making ourown" :p 22:13:26 <planetmaker> nielsm, thanks for the explanation and link earlier. Appreciated :) 22:13:29 <andythenorth> that's fantastic, you're hired frosch123 22:13:56 <andythenorth> we have a rule about 4 spaces, except when somebody has already formatted the file with 2 22:14:23 <frosch123> actually, that is an understatement. my boss raised the question whether we should discuss a style for a new project, and i cut him short before finishing the question :p 22:14:32 <nielsm> learning C is all about placing * correctly the first time around, every time 22:15:20 <andythenorth> what is learning python all about? o_O 22:15:24 * andythenorth has been trying 22:15:30 <andythenorth> since about 2004 22:16:05 <planetmaker> hm... learning python... is it about using OO appropriately - and doing without strict typing 22:16:07 <nielsm> python is just throwing shit at the REPL until something works, then add it to a random module 22:16:11 <frosch123> python is about people. who are not able to indent correctly, to fail completely on the first meters 22:16:33 <frosch123> early filters are the best 22:16:36 <andythenorth> is it mostly about cargo-culting from stack overflow? 22:18:33 <andythenorth> I can't tell if I am doing it wrong or not :P 22:20:15 <frosch123> https://xkcd.com/1306/ <- just make sure you hit at the bottom of the curve 22:20:35 <frosch123> s/hit/enter programmnig/ or something 22:21:02 <andythenorth> oof 22:21:06 <andythenorth> imagine programming in twitter 22:21:16 <andythenorth> we did try to invent a programmatic control language in twitter 22:21:23 <nielsm> nah, to understand python you have to understand "from __future__ import braces" 22:21:27 <andythenorth> it didn't get far as an April fool joke 22:21:39 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 22:21:50 <andythenorth> I treat python as a game, where I win by using @property as much as possible 22:22:15 <andythenorth> and I award myself bonus points for list comprehensions that are (1) complex (2) but easy to read 22:22:48 <andythenorth> it's not a good language to play 'paste from stack overflow' though 22:23:02 <andythenorth> all the answers get a counter answer about why a is more pythonic than b, or not 22:23:14 <andythenorth> and someone benchmarks something 22:23:39 <andythenorth> whereas JS, someone says 'I made a fiddle' and then you just paste that straight to prod 22:24:00 <andythenorth> maybe adding in a paste from an alternative answer too, because, more is better right? 22:25:00 <frosch123> i am still trying to figure out java 22:25:41 <andythenorth> get an enterprise patterns poster for your wall 22:25:43 <andythenorth> profit 22:25:46 <frosch123> i have difficulties connecting my observations "used a lot in corporations" and "not used at all in open source" 22:25:52 <andythenorth> ha 22:25:55 <andythenorth> I should go to bed 22:26:01 <nielsm> the core of java is a deep taxonomy of namespaces, and a heavy use of inner classes 22:26:01 <andythenorth> tomorrow won't just arrive on its own 22:26:05 <andythenorth> it needs my support 22:26:10 <andythenorth> by sleeping 22:26:23 <frosch123> i think a good java library has more directories than files 22:26:44 <nielsm> preferably so many directories it breaks win32 MAX_PATH 22:27:05 *** andythenorth has left #openttd 22:27:52 <nielsm> AbstractFactoryBuilders are also very useful 22:29:10 <frosch123> :) 22:33:33 * LordAro notes there is a cargo_type.h & cargotype.h 22:33:36 <LordAro> this is... unfortunate 22:34:19 <frosch123> we have that multiple times 22:34:57 <frosch123> for example industrytype, industry_type 22:35:52 <frosch123> though i think at some point we started calling the classy one _base 22:36:04 <nielsm> one relates to programmatic types and one to kinds of the gameplay element 22:36:15 <LordAro> ah, that makes slightly more sense 22:36:24 <LordAro> several _base.h's around 22:37:04 <frosch123> goal_base and goal_type is a good example 22:41:02 <yellyFish> why do we use NULL instead of nullptr? 22:41:26 <frosch123> what? 22:41:29 <LordAro> legacy 22:42:12 <nielsm> nullptr is c++11 which is not-quite-yet officially adopted here 22:42:17 <frosch123> we do not even have a c++11 compile farm running, and you ask about nullptr :p 22:42:39 <yellyFish> really? didn't know that 22:43:08 <LordAro> well, we do 22:43:11 <LordAro> it's just not complete 22:45:52 <nielsm> https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=1214289#p1214289 <- manual nighttime builds :P 22:47:00 <planetmaker> :) 22:47:22 <frosch123> halloween release 22:47:56 <nielsm> time to play classic Trains vs Zombies again? 22:48:25 <planetmaker> let's add a few showels of coal then before we start :) 22:55:41 <frosch123> https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?t=4039 <- i underestimated your age :) 22:56:41 <LordAro> positively ancient 23:02:04 <planetmaker> jfs = niels? 23:03:06 <frosch123> "danish" is a unique identifier, right? 23:03:14 <planetmaker> @seen Bjarni 23:03:14 <DorpsGek> planetmaker: Bjarni was last seen in #openttd 7 years, 3 weeks, 5 days, 22 hours, 44 minutes, and 8 seconds ago: <Bjarni> heh 23:03:52 <planetmaker> more or less :) 23:09:13 <nielsm> planetmaker yes 23:16:31 *** Supercheese has quit IRC 23:22:31 <planetmaker> I guess I fell for the same misjudgement as froshc 23:25:43 <planetmaker> he, a whopping 12 years in the forums without any posting in between 23:26:23 <nielsm> and I'll let you know that for a very long time (until about 1-2 years ago) I absolutely refused to touch anything OTTD at all, for moral reasons (essentially theft/reappropriation of IP) 23:27:02 <nielsm> but decided recently to adopt a ship of theseus model, in that most things have been replaced by now making it a different same thing 23:27:48 <nielsm> I was owner of #tycoon on quakenet for several years too :) 23:29:27 <planetmaker> I wouldn't know that... never been on that network. I guess I dropped-in here somewhen in the ~2006 and got sucked-into :D 23:30:05 <planetmaker> probably I read forum already before that w/o registering 23:30:22 <frosch123> there was a quakenet time before freenode? 23:30:33 <frosch123> or was tycoon on quakenet and openttd on freenode? 23:31:19 <nielsm> #tycoon was originally on quakenet, I think #openttd was too for a little while but not sure 23:31:43 <nielsm> but for the above reasons #tycoon had a strict "do not talk about ottd" policy 23:32:21 <frosch123> oh, indeed, my logs from 2007-05-16 say quakenet 23:33:20 <frosch123> ottd was already on oftc at that tiem 23:34:52 *** ST2 has left #openttd 23:35:01 *** ST2 has joined #openttd 23:35:28 <ST2> lazy way to check if channel was still with +R 23:35:29 <ST2> :D 23:42:25 <nielsm> wow, look at the time 23:42:25 <nielsm> gn 23:42:50 <planetmaker> night 23:50:28 *** nielsm has quit IRC