Log for #openttd on 22nd May 2019:
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01:18:56  <Hazzard> Is there a way to send commands to an OpenTTD *client* ?
01:19:19  <Hazzard> I assumed that running it from command line would let me run commands from there but it seems that is not the case
01:27:20  <Eddi|zuHause> what kind of command?
01:28:07  <Eddi|zuHause> you open the ingame console with the key left of 1
01:28:41  <Eddi|zuHause> running from command line only helps if you convert the openttd.exe to a console app
01:29:20  <Hazzard> I used xvfb to run it without an interface :0
01:29:33  <Hazzard> without a gui
01:29:45  <Hazzard> definitely not intended way to play
01:30:02  <Hazzard> but I am trying to write some automatic integration tests
01:30:09  <Eddi|zuHause> i've still no clue what you're trying to do
01:30:23  <Hazzard> Thats fair
01:35:55  <Hazzard> I'm basically trying to run an openttd client headless, like you would run a server headless
01:35:56  <Hazzard> I'm guessing its not possible
01:37:19  <Eddi|zuHause> Hazzard: you might want to check the regression test?
01:38:00  <Eddi|zuHause> or the "-v null:ticks=1000" option
01:43:28  <Hazzard> Eddi|zuHause: Where can I find the regression tests?
01:43:39  <Eddi|zuHause> "make regression"
02:16:06  <glx> regression test is just an AI
02:18:41  <Hazzard> It seemed like that
02:18:45  <Hazzard> guess its not possilbe without custom build
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02:32:56  <Hazzard> Different question, is there a new version of somewhere?
02:40:49  <Corns[m]> Yeah the github repo has the latest changelog
02:48:20  <Hazzard> Found it
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06:36:53  <andythenorth> moin
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07:29:29  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] JGRennison opened issue #7600: Stack buffer over-read in ReadRawLanguageStrings
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08:05:28  <Hazzard> Is there the intention to have linux binaries included in the nightly releases?
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08:44:10  <LordAro> Hazzard: as soon as someone solves the issue of compatibility
08:44:28  <LordAro> previous generic linux binaries barely worked on any distro other than ubuntu
08:44:38  <planetmaker> in other words: someone [TM] "just" needs to create an appropriate docker container
08:44:39  <LordAro> and were barely downloaded anyway
08:44:48  <LordAro> hence why they've been dropped for now
08:44:50  <planetmaker> but... yes, it would be very nice
08:45:09  <LordAro> something involving a centos6 container + static build would likely do the job
08:45:21  <planetmaker> uhm... rather centos7 ?
08:45:31  <LordAro> centos6 is still in support :)
08:45:44  <planetmaker> yes... but setting up a new container... I'd rather choose 7
08:45:59  <LordAro> could go back as far as centos5, given RH5 is just about still in support if you pay them enough :p
08:46:03  <planetmaker> </bike shedding xxl>
08:46:15  <LordAro> there are existing docker containers for them, no setup required
08:47:20  <LordAro> as per
08:49:58  <planetmaker> well, still, for building OpenTTD. But probably one can look at other openttd build containers for reference
08:53:00  <peter1138> Generic static binary might be more useful.
08:53:22  <peter1138> Although, that'd get somewhat large quite quickly.
08:53:38  <planetmaker> peter1138, I think that is what was being meant
08:53:53  <planetmaker> but it needs some system they're built on
08:56:08  <LordAro> a "generic binary" has to be static, the dependencies just wouldn't work otherwise
08:56:33  <LordAro> but even a static binary is usually dynamically linked to libc, so you need maximum compatibility for that
08:57:25  <peter1138> You were talking about Centos or some other rubbish.
08:58:01  <peter1138> Sensibly, you'd use a Debian container to make a static binary.
08:58:19  <LordAro> yes, because that's typically the oldest linux distro that peoplr are likely to still be using
08:58:30  <peter1138> Everyone running Centos seems to have issues upgrading from one release to another :p
08:58:47  <LordAro> a similarly ancient debian distro would work as well
08:58:51  <peter1138> LordAro, that too, but being static it doesn't matter.
08:58:57  <LordAro> but that would be out of support, technically speaking
09:03:55  <dwfreed> you could go the factorio route, and make centos 6 users have to set up glibc 2.18 in an alternate root :)
09:04:34  <dwfreed>
09:04:56  <dwfreed> also I know millisa
09:07:44  <peter1138> That's somewhat missing the point.
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09:18:11  <dwfreed> you're still going to have versioned symbols linked from libc, unless you go full static (which is just crazy); the reality is that not many people are going to run openttd on centos of any version (if anything, they'd be using a relatively modern fedora), so building on something like debian jessie would be sensible, and you can static everything except libc (or the other libs listed in PEP 571 linked,
09:18:11  <dwfreed> because their ABIs never change)
09:22:27  <peter1138> Debian is the only way to do it.
09:22:33  <peter1138> Because other distros just suck :p
09:29:55  <LordAro> meh
09:31:06  <LordAro> if we're not going for maximum compatibility, there's no need for "generic" binaries at all
09:31:21  <LordAro> might as well just have lots of debian containers
09:33:03  <LordAro> whole point is moot until someone actually does something anyway
09:33:33  <LordAro> and i do have an irritatingly high amount of experience with getting things to build with centos5...
09:36:44  <Heiki> OpenTTD needs gauge changing facilities (or not)
09:37:27  <peter1138> Yeah why?
09:37:51  <peter1138> Besides, you can do it with railtype compatibility, anyway.
09:38:15  <Heiki> true
09:38:47  <peter1138> If only those train designers knew... no need to design complicated bogies, just set a flag on your railtype...
09:38:56  <Heiki> haha
09:39:35  <peter1138>
09:39:37  <peter1138> Uh... okay?
09:43:26  <Eddi|zuHause> "This item does not ship to Germany - Mainland."
09:45:26  <debdog> heh, Soylent, that's somewhat macabre
09:46:54  <Eddi|zuHause> i heard about them a few years ago
09:47:36  <Eddi|zuHause> i wonder if they had to license the name
09:48:47  <dwfreed> from who?
09:49:06  <Eddi|zuHause> from the author?
09:49:20  <peter1138> If you don't know the name, then I guess the link doesn't mean much :p
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10:02:49  <andythenorth> hmm
10:02:57  <andythenorth> this is promising
10:03:33  <andythenorth> if I can figure out 3 or 4 things I have NFI about, then newgrf publishing is 'fixed'
10:04:37  <andythenorth> AWS and Azure stuff mostly, maybe a bit of git :P
10:08:49  <planetmaker> I just saw that github is offering beta-access to github package registry... not exactly sure what it does... but maybe that's a thing, too
10:09:23  <planetmaker>
10:15:30  <LordAro> "And it supports familiar package management tools: JavaScript (npm), Java (Maven), Ruby (RubyGems), .NET (NuGet), and Docker images, with more to come. "
10:15:37  <LordAro> useful for docker, probably not much else
10:15:40  <LordAro> (for us)
10:26:19  <andythenorth> so I have an Azure build pipeline that works fine for FIRS
10:26:30  <andythenorth> and I have the start of a deploy pipeline, that pushes to AWS
10:27:19  <andythenorth> I need the deploy pipeline to  grab a json or xml listing from S3, and parse it into a classic html 'directory listing' page of links to different FIRS versions
10:27:37  <andythenorth> I also need to figure out how to put the version number into the deployed artifacts
10:27:44  <andythenorth> and how to differentiate tag / nightly /  push
10:27:52  <andythenorth> or just tag / push
10:28:50  <andythenorth> Azure can run all kinds of things in the pipeline, like python scripts or whatever
10:29:06  <andythenorth> and I have given it a service connection to AWS, which can be given permission to enumerate bucket contents
10:29:21  <Eddi|zuHause> i don't see much of a need for nightly if you have push
10:30:09  <andythenorth> +1
10:30:22  <andythenorth> outdated concept imho, from when builds were very slow
10:31:35  <Eddi|zuHause> well, it has some use if you want to reach a slightly larger audience and have much movement in a day
10:31:55  <dwfreed> git describe --tags
10:32:22  <Eddi|zuHause> so the testers can better agree on a common version if there is a nightly
10:36:25  <andythenorth> there's a few initial blockers
10:36:40  <andythenorth> like, there's an Azure plugin for running a python script
10:36:56  <andythenorth> but I have no idea how to get the python script to Azure, unless it can be found in the repo
10:37:00  <andythenorth> maybe it can
10:37:03  * andythenorth could just try :P
10:37:30  <andythenorth> and variables can be passed along the pipeline between tasks, but it's kind of opaque
10:48:37  <planetmaker> <Eddi|zuHause> i don't see much of a need for nightly if you have push <-- very much indeed
10:49:38  * andythenorth should write YAML instead of the using the Azure drag-drop UI 
10:49:44  <andythenorth> it would be more easily shared
10:50:02  <andythenorth> wondering if we should have a Coop Azure account though,
10:51:25  <planetmaker> I'd not be unwilling to have
10:52:26  <andythenorth> oh, unrelated, but beneficial to nml?
10:53:00  <planetmaker> sounds nice
10:53:57  <andythenorth> it would be really nice to have (1) a plan for coop infra (keep / upgrade / migrate elsewhere) (2) a clear idea of what needs done to make the next major nml release  :)
10:54:09  <andythenorth> maybe we need a trello or something :P
10:55:18  <planetmaker> NML builds on current devzone jenkins right now
10:56:10  <andythenorth> yes
10:56:31  <andythenorth> building for NML is probably fine
10:56:38  <andythenorth> we probably can't drop the .exe any time soonn
10:56:52  <andythenorth> we need to get NRT support and other missing spec features applied
10:56:54  <andythenorth> and do docs
10:57:06  <andythenorth> summmer project :P
11:00:11  <andythenorth> coop infra, I am kind of blind to what does what :)
11:12:20  <planetmaker> well... repo hosting, issue tracking, artefact building, artefact storage, translation service... are the important parts for NewGRF authors
11:12:30  <planetmaker> and about each is on a separate VM
11:12:57  <planetmaker> oh... and there's a separate database VM
11:13:42  <planetmaker> and a proxy which handles them being on one
11:13:47  <planetmaker> host machine
11:23:05  <andythenorth> are any of them more of concern or interest than others?
11:23:09  <andythenorth> or is it all pretty even?
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12:05:17  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: that escalated from "embrace" to "extend" within 1 tweet...
12:05:26  <Eddi|zuHause> i'm scared of microsoft
12:18:14  <Xaroth> ms isn't extending python
12:18:35  <Xaroth> they are pointing to the official python release from the python team
12:19:15  <Xaroth> so it's more a goodwill gesture towards the boatload of python developers who prefer linux because it comes shipped with python in most cases
12:20:52  <Eddi|zuHause> Xaroth: so what is that second tweet?
12:21:12  <Eddi|zuHause> if that's not "extend" then i don't know
12:21:21  <Xaroth> about python on the windows store?
12:21:39  <Xaroth> << hover over 'download' .
12:21:40  <dwfreed> the one about making a python package that allows access to all of Windows Runtime
12:22:04  <dwfreed> so apparently microsoft can't make software anymore
12:24:23  <Xaroth> you mean xlang?
12:24:48  <Xaroth> that's been around for a while
12:27:12  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh requested changes for pull request #7596: Add:Three currencies: NTD, CNY, HKD
12:28:03  <Eddi|zuHause> yes, i mean the windows runtime module
12:28:52  <dwfreed> xlang has been around for a while, but the current winrt module is new
12:28:55  <dwfreed> according to pypi
12:29:01  <dwfreed>
12:34:07  <Xaroth> but that's just xlang bindings over winrt
12:34:15  <Xaroth> instead of having to use other very obscure methods
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16:49:51  <Wolf01> o/
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18:09:08  <Wolf01> Hmmm, is it possible to set steam to always download the updates as soon as they appear instead of schedule them at 4:00AM?
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18:12:06  <Eddi|zuHause> i haven't found it...
18:13:02  <Eddi|zuHause> i have an update scheduled for 6AM
18:19:50  <Arveen> hmm, there is an option to restrict downloads between X and Y
18:20:05  <Eddi|zuHause> how would that help anyone?
18:20:09  <Arveen> i didn't change it and it's not set
18:20:24  <Arveen> well maybe it's set for him ?
18:27:54  <Eddi|zuHause> unlikely, as that's the first place you would look...
18:28:59  <Eddi|zuHause> i've checked the setting multiple times, it's never set. yet i've never seen an update that was scheduled less than 12 hours ahead
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18:30:50  <andythenorth> yo
18:33:39  <Markk> oi
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19:00:27  <andythenorth> hmm
19:00:28  <andythenorth> eints
19:00:36  <andythenorth> I knew I'd forgotten something :)
19:00:43  <andythenorth> eints -> GH projects is unsolved
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19:02:56  <frosch123> it works for ottd :p
19:04:14  <andythenorth> send me your newslettter :)
19:04:47  <andythenorth> did you just teach it to commit to git?
19:05:31  <frosch123> i was working on adding login-via-gh, and actually got quite far, but was distracted when it came to building a test environment
19:06:04  <frosch123> eints could already commit to git on devzone
19:06:41  <frosch123> but on ottd it now has dorpsgek's api key to push
19:07:11  <frosch123> i am not sure how eints should actually work with gh
19:07:21  <frosch123> in can either push directly, or it could create PRs
19:07:44  <frosch123> when people login via gh, it could also create personalised commits, instead of committing as "eints"
19:08:59  <frosch123> but well, i think login-via-gh is the most important issue
19:09:23  <frosch123> no more translator@ mails or redmine groups
19:09:55  <andythenorth> that would be good
19:10:07  <andythenorth> I'm potato / potato on PRs or not
19:10:25  <andythenorth> I get a lot translation merge commits from hg, ammler would be sad with me
19:10:55  <Wolf01> is this really mashinky? Wow
19:10:59  <andythenorth> PRs seems a bit more controlled, but in practice I'm probably just going to hit approve without reading the whole diff
19:11:28  <frosch123> it's more about how to give eints access
19:11:52  <frosch123> would there be a eints gh user, which creates PRs, or would you grant them push rights, or something
19:12:17  <andythenorth> I'd rather have PRs personally
19:12:28  <andythenorth> maybe that's tinfoil
19:12:53  <andythenorth> anything having creds to modify stuff that arrives on my laptop scares me
19:13:03  <andythenorth> super tinfoil :P
19:15:02  * andythenorth BBL
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19:19:02  <michi_cc> Hmm, who broke DorpsGek_II? It's not announcing stuff.
19:19:51  <michi_cc> Or maybe more like: who broke GitHub/Azure? CI hasn't started either.
19:21:32  <LordAro> netsplit, probably
19:21:40  <LordAro> oh, CI as well
19:21:52  <LordAro> github then, probably
19:25:08  <glx> I queued it manually
19:25:30  <michi_cc> Thanks.
19:26:00  <glx> maybe it's because no build happened since last translator commits, 3 days ago
19:33:10  <michi_cc> Has peter closed his Azure auto-reload browser window?
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19:38:07  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc opened pull request #7601: Fix #7600: Don't read uninitialised memory when parsing GS language files
19:39:54  <michi_cc> You're very quick today, DorpsGek_II :p
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20:28:19  <Eddi|zuHause>
20:43:03  <frosch123> is that from esc?
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20:44:45  <Eddi|zuHause> no
20:45:04  <frosch123> yeah, australia is missing
20:45:04  <Eddi|zuHause> it's obviously recorded after ESC, as they make a reference to the winners
20:45:17  <frosch123> how would i know who won?
20:45:39  <Eddi|zuHause> dunno...
20:45:39  <supermop_work> anyone know anyone in latin america who can make a few hundred ceramic donkey drinking vessels?
20:46:01  <supermop_work> this is a question just posed in the oddest office-wide email ive yet received here
20:46:19  <Eddi|zuHause> where do you get so many ceramic donkeys from that they need so many drinking vessels?
20:47:52  <supermop_work> just one of the many mysteries raised by this request eddi
20:47:53  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 approved pull request #7601: Fix #7600: Don't read uninitialised memory when parsing GS language files
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20:49:21  <Eddi|zuHause> however, the biggest is that it's not like "latin america" is a narrow enough area to justify local sourcing, so might as well look at global shipping?
20:52:39  <frosch123> hmm, i had too much contact with eu4, i always think armenia is next to turkey
20:53:13  <Eddi|zuHause> hehe :p
20:53:31  <frosch123> s/armenia/albania/
20:53:32  <frosch123> wtf
20:53:41  <frosch123> armenia is actually next to turkey :p
20:53:51  <Eddi|zuHause> yes, i was about to say that
20:54:01  <Eddi|zuHause> you're mixing up armenia and albania
20:55:17  <Eddi|zuHause> well, and to make it more complicated, there's an east armenia and west armenia, with the territory of west armenia actually located within modern day turkey
20:55:40  <frosch123> don't forget iberia
20:56:38  <Eddi|zuHause> (that's the area with the controversial topic of armenian genocide)
20:58:42  <frosch123>
20:59:09  <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, that's a few centuries earlier than EU4 :p
20:59:27  <frosch123> it's in ir2
21:08:56  <Eddi|zuHause> i haven't really looked at that game
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22:08:43  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc merged pull request #7601: Fix #7600: Don't read uninitialised memory when parsing GS language files
22:08:49  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc closed issue #7600: Stack buffer over-read in ReadRawLanguageStrings
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22:40:30  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 opened issue #7602: There are 22 known save games that crash OpenTTD (latest master) on load.
22:43:48  <Hazzard> Is this a bug? There have never been roads there but the town is building there
22:49:35  <Eddi|zuHause> what version?
22:50:05  <Eddi|zuHause> houses can "walk" a slight bit if a big house is replaced by a small house, but this looks a bit extreme
22:51:29  <Hazzard> That actually might be it
22:51:36  <Hazzard> I'm on stable 1.9.1 regardless
22:52:36  <Hazzard> hmm actually they are a bit far huh
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22:54:01  <Hazzard> It also only happens in the negative x and negative y directions
22:56:30  <Eddi|zuHause> that supports the "walking" theory
22:57:02  <Eddi|zuHause> if a big house gets replaced by a small house, this will happen on the northern corner of the house
22:57:57  <Hazzard> Can it happen multiple times?
22:58:18  <Eddi|zuHause> dunno
22:58:29  <Eddi|zuHause> i've never witnessed that much of it
22:59:07  <Eddi|zuHause> i guess your choice of house sets influences this
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23:00:38  <Hazzard> Grfs can change the plot sizes?
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