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00:08:26 *** TooTallTyler has quit IRC 00:15:01 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 01:04:08 *** Eddi|zuHause has quit IRC 01:12:30 *** Eddi|zuHause has joined #openttd 02:17:53 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 03:14:05 *** glx has quit IRC 03:24:02 *** heffer has quit IRC 03:24:17 *** heffer has joined #openttd 03:57:11 *** D-HUND has joined #openttd 04:00:38 *** debdog has quit IRC 05:19:17 *** azubieta has quit IRC 06:00:00 *** m1cr0man has quit IRC 06:03:40 *** m1cr0man has joined #openttd 06:47:37 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 07:28:54 *** Laedek has quit IRC 07:40:56 *** Laedek has joined #openttd 07:50:34 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 07:59:57 *** crem has quit IRC 08:58:38 <andythenorth> yo 08:59:46 *** tokai has joined #openttd 08:59:46 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai 09:06:35 *** tokai|noir has quit IRC 09:09:44 *** arikover has joined #openttd 09:19:49 *** arikover has quit IRC 09:22:09 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 10:15:10 *** DorpsGek has quit IRC 10:17:40 *** arikover has joined #openttd 10:19:27 *** DorpsGek_III has quit IRC 10:21:24 *** DorpsGek_iv has joined #openttd 10:23:43 *** DorpsGek has joined #openttd 10:23:43 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o DorpsGek 10:25:20 *** andythenorth_ has joined #openttd 10:25:34 *** DorpsGek_iv has quit IRC 10:26:42 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/DorpsGek] TrueBrain created new tag: 2.0.0 https://git.io/JIJYy 10:29:15 *** DorpsGek` has joined #openttd 10:29:15 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o DorpsGek` 10:29:15 *** DorpsGek is now known as Guest7271 10:29:15 *** DorpsGek` is now known as DorpsGek 10:29:18 *** DorpsGek is now known as Guest7272 10:29:18 *** Guest7272 is now known as DorpsGek 10:29:18 *** Guest7271 has quit IRC 10:29:18 *** DorpsGek has quit IRC 10:29:19 *** DorpsGek has joined #openttd 10:29:20 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o DorpsGek 10:29:29 *** DorpsGek` has joined #openttd 10:29:29 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o DorpsGek` 10:29:29 *** DorpsGek is now known as Guest7273 10:29:29 *** DorpsGek` is now known as DorpsGek 10:29:40 <TrueBrain> attack of the bots! :P 10:29:41 *** DorpsGek is now known as Guest7274 10:29:41 *** Guest7274 is now known as DorpsGek 10:29:41 *** Guest7273 has quit IRC 10:29:41 *** DorpsGek has quit IRC 10:29:42 *** DorpsGek has joined #openttd 10:29:42 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o DorpsGek 10:29:42 *** DorpsGek` has joined #openttd 10:29:42 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o DorpsGek` 10:29:42 *** DorpsGek is now known as Guest7275 10:29:42 *** DorpsGek` is now known as DorpsGek 10:29:48 <TrueBrain> that is not good ..... 10:29:53 *** DorpsGek is now known as Guest7276 10:29:53 *** Guest7275 is now known as DorpsGek 10:30:38 <andythenorth_> hello :) 10:31:04 <TrueBrain> I somewhat need to tune that, I guess :D 10:31:04 *** DorpsGek is now known as Guest7277 10:31:04 *** Guest7277 is now known as DorpsGek 10:31:07 *** Guest7276 has quit IRC 10:31:50 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 10:34:51 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/aws-infra] TrueBrain pushed 1 commits to master https://git.io/JIJ3Z 10:34:52 <DorpsGek> - Add: updated DorpsGek to version 2.0 (by TrueBrain) 10:35:38 <andythenorth_> 2.0 is always better than 1.0 10:36:33 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/aws-infra] TrueBrain closed issue #1: Migrate supybot from old VM to AWS https://git.io/JUjQV 10:39:27 *** arikover` has joined #openttd 10:44:49 *** arikover has quit IRC 10:51:33 *** arikover` has quit IRC 11:00:50 *** crem has joined #openttd 11:14:54 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/team] glx22 commented on issue #95: [sl_SI] Translator access request https://git.io/JIexN 11:17:48 *** blathijs has quit IRC 11:23:59 *** arikover` has joined #openttd 11:24:34 *** blathijs has joined #openttd 11:39:01 <andythenorth_> oh this might be a thing https://aws.amazon.com/ec2/instance-types/mac/ 11:43:27 <TrueBrain> they do what GitHub has been doing for months now :P 11:43:38 <TrueBrain> okay, I wrote a news post ... it is 260 sentences long .. 11:43:43 <TrueBrain> I might have gone overboard :D 11:44:21 <andythenorth_> is it the best of all posts ever? 11:55:34 *** arikover` has quit IRC 11:57:04 *** Compu has joined #openttd 12:00:29 <TrueBrain> okay, took me 15 minutes to proof-read it .. lol .. now lunch, after that adding a tons of links :P 12:00:38 <TrueBrain> @seen Bjarni 12:00:38 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: Bjarni was last seen in #openttd 9 years, 8 weeks, 2 days, 11 hours, 41 minutes, and 31 seconds ago: <Bjarni> heh 12:00:45 <TrueBrain> I should have tested that earlier :P 12:00:47 <TrueBrain> but it still works :D 12:08:22 <Eddi|zuHause> @seen TrueBrain 12:08:22 <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: TrueBrain was last seen in #openttd 7 minutes and 34 seconds ago: <TrueBrain> but it still works :D 12:08:47 <Eddi|zuHause> always test the other corner case :p 12:22:39 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 12:22:52 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 12:27:13 <Eddi|zuHause> the problem with streaming games, it heavily impacts performance 12:29:35 <LordAro> wonder if anyone is ever going to fix those dependabot alerts for the actions repo... 12:30:00 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 12:36:53 <TrueBrain> LordAro: I am not, as it is a stupid one. But I suggest you change the dependabot alerts to only send for new ones 12:36:57 <TrueBrain> not repeating the same thing over and over :P 12:38:04 <TrueBrain> well, maybe we fix them in this months update-round ... that is possible 12:38:04 * FLHerne wonders about using Github's search API 12:38:16 <TrueBrain> FLHerne: kinda a blank statement :) 12:38:21 <FLHerne> DDG kind of sucks even when it's indexed properly 12:38:21 <TrueBrain> I wonder about going to the toilet :P 12:39:05 <TrueBrain> you are talking about the wiki, or? (sorry, context is difficult to guess :D) 12:39:11 <FLHerne> I mean, we could have some JS that performs a Github search API query when entering something in the wiki search 12:39:29 <TrueBrain> ah, wiki, okay :) Kinda important information :P 12:39:31 <FLHerne> It might get tripped up by all the markup though 12:39:43 <TrueBrain> what kind of search was an issue for you? 12:39:51 <FLHerne> I kind of assumed the wiki was the default topic here :p 12:39:55 <TrueBrain> (mind you, our wiki is still not indexer properly) 12:40:02 <TrueBrain> indexed, typing is hard 12:41:29 <TrueBrain> I think it is pretty important to first understand what people search for and what they do (not) find, before looking into other ways of searching :) 12:41:54 <TrueBrain> the mediawiki search for example is also rather useless for many ways of searching, I found out :D 12:42:52 <TrueBrain> so any indications of what people search and how they got stuck, is very useful information :) 12:42:53 <FLHerne> https://wiki.openttd.org/en/Community/NewGRF/ seems surprisingly unsearchable 12:43:22 <FLHerne> (I tried 'newgrf list', 'newgrf', etc.) 12:43:28 <FLHerne> Might be lack of indexing 12:43:37 <TrueBrain> that page seems to not be indexed :( 12:43:46 <TrueBrain> but it might also be that it is a directory 12:43:55 <TrueBrain> which is something that I can fix :) 12:43:59 <FLHerne> But in general I use DDG as my default search engine, and from experience I know it's hopeless when searching for a specific phrase of more than 2-3 words 12:44:12 <FLHerne> It seems to just ignore "quotes" most of the time 12:44:25 <FLHerne> Perhaps no-one will ever want to search the wiki in that way 12:44:38 <TrueBrain> you cannot find that page with bing either 12:44:56 <TrueBrain> Google does find it 12:45:01 <TrueBrain> which shocks me, honestly :P 12:45:35 <TrueBrain> I am really really disappointed in Google btw ... this is close to insane 12:45:47 <TrueBrain> but it seems Bing doesn't pick it up because it is a folder 12:46:24 <TrueBrain> anyway, I am not against replacing DDG with anything else btw 12:47:07 <FLHerne> Might as well wait until the indexing's finished, and see how much it works 12:48:06 <TrueBrain> I think I can hint to Bing a bit better that it should index that page 12:48:27 <TrueBrain> and I have noticed that DDG picks up Bing results pretty quick 12:49:14 <FLHerne> Hm, from https://wiki.openttd.org/en/Manual/ "OpenTTD is an source open source reimplementation" ... 12:49:31 <FLHerne> where 'source open source' links to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open 12:49:49 <TrueBrain> haha 12:49:52 <TrueBrain> spaces vs %20 :) 12:50:10 <TrueBrain> [https://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open source open source] should be [https://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open%20source open source], I guess 12:50:13 <TrueBrain> feel free to fix it :) 12:50:16 <FLHerne> Fixed 12:50:25 <TrueBrain> <3 12:51:45 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain opened pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJik 12:51:50 <TrueBrain> this might be too much ^^, but I enjoyed writing it :) 12:54:35 <TrueBrain> FLHerne: https://github.com/TrueBrain/TrueWiki/pull/100 <- hopefully that helps out for bing.com. From what I can tell, the issue you have is concentrated around URLs ending with a / 12:54:52 <TrueBrain> all other pages are found more easily, it seems 13:00:41 <TrueBrain> oops, I should have tested my PR it seems :D 13:01:14 <TrueBrain> ah, no, it is fine 13:01:15 <TrueBrain> pfew 13:01:53 <TrueBrain> lol ... every page has a "atom" feed with history 13:01:59 <TrueBrain> bing indexes those as "sitemaps" 13:02:03 <TrueBrain> over 2000 of them :D 13:03:02 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] JGRennison commented on pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJXM 13:03:06 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] JGRennison commented on pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJXD 13:11:17 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain updated pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJik 13:14:11 <TrueBrain> funny, bing tells me it only found 11 URLs in the sitemap 13:14:15 <TrueBrain> pretty sure that is not correct :P 13:14:46 <TrueBrain> when I download the CSV, it is 11k :P 13:14:50 <TrueBrain> minor difference :D 13:15:57 <Eddi|zuHause> that's just 3 orders of magnitude... 13:16:23 <orudge> TrueBrain: was the old server really running Debian Etch? :O 13:16:31 <TrueBrain> it reads 10.997 .. it seems there is a , <-> . issue there 13:16:34 <TrueBrain> orudge: the old old server, yes 13:16:36 <TrueBrain> a VM inside the server 13:16:42 <orudge> Ah 13:17:01 <TrueBrain> so I firewalled the fuck out of it, but still .. not cool 13:17:39 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] orudge commented on pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJyt 13:17:49 <orudge> Yeah 13:18:14 <orudge> A couple of years ago I discovered a client was still using CentOS 5 on a VM 13:18:26 <orudge> and a cPanel version that looked positively antique 13:18:38 <orudge> Migrating that to something more modern was fun 13:19:16 <LordAro> RHEL5 only went out of super-extended-support about a year ago :p 13:19:17 <TrueBrain> your comment is possibly not at a line you referencing too btw .. :D 13:19:32 <orudge> Hmm 13:19:32 <TrueBrain> owh, stupid shit 13:19:33 <TrueBrain> found it 13:19:34 <TrueBrain> nevermind 13:19:35 <orudge> It looks like it's at the right line 13:20:12 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain updated pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJik 13:20:59 <TrueBrain> the bing webmaster tool is better than google's 13:23:16 <TrueBrain> one weird thing, it lowercases URLs ... which doesn't work :P 13:25:59 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] orudge commented on pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJ9J 13:27:37 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain updated pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJik 13:28:34 <TrueBrain> orudge: I have to figure out how to reset passwords via ldap CLI .. as I shut down the services to do it via web. If I manage, it might be nice to imapsync those 3 accounts indeed :) 13:29:31 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] LordAro commented on pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJ9X 13:30:19 <TrueBrain> lol @ google.nl .. oops :D 13:30:39 <LordAro> hmm, i suppose i need to finish up the release CI by the 25th so we can release 1.11.0-beta1 13:31:11 <LordAro> not that there have been *that* many changes this year, tbh 13:33:27 <LordAro> TrueBrain: what was the bug found during the yogscast(?) event? 13:34:17 <TrueBrain> owh, I was going to link those, tnx for reminding me 13:34:30 <TrueBrain> LordAro: if you did 2 specific requests in rapid succession, the software deadlocked 13:34:30 <LordAro> :) 13:34:38 <LordAro> nice 13:35:44 <TrueBrain> I never fixed it btw :P 13:36:06 <TrueBrain> not really anyway 13:36:31 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain updated pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJik 13:36:44 <TrueBrain> removed many "..", tnx for pointing that out LordAro :) 13:37:16 <LordAro> i catch myself adding commas everywhere :) 13:37:34 <TrueBrain> I do too :P Removed many already 13:37:41 <TrueBrain> still sure some are .. unneeded :P 13:49:45 <TrueBrain> orudge: still around? Time to try an imapsync? 13:49:52 <TrueBrain> I might have found how to reset passwords .. not sure :P 13:51:44 *** Smedles_ has joined #openttd 13:52:03 *** Smedles has quit IRC 13:52:43 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] LordAro commented on pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJd2 13:53:33 *** arikover` has joined #openttd 13:53:40 <TrueBrain> LordAro: but do you remember which version of mediawiki it was? 13:54:26 *** arikover` has quit IRC 13:55:01 <LordAro> https://web.archive.org/web/20110918142654/http://wiki.openttd.org/Special:Version archive.org does :) 13:55:04 <LordAro> 1.12.0 13:55:34 <LordAro> assuming it wasn't upgraded after 2011 anyway, i suspect it was not :p 13:56:07 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain commented on pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJFt 13:56:22 <TrueBrain> we upgraded once ... but yeah, I guess that was in 2011 13:59:37 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain updated pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJik 13:59:52 <TrueBrain> thanks a lot LordAro , much appreciated :) 14:10:11 <TrueBrain> okay, we will imapsync the 3 accounts of which we don't know what to do with yet .. after that, I can shut down the old server :D \o/ 14:10:16 <TrueBrain> SO CLOSE! I CAN TASTE IT 14:10:33 <TrueBrain> i am shocked nothing broke so far ..... I expected I missed at least something 14:10:38 <TrueBrain> but so far so good .. lets hope it stays that way :P 14:12:46 <TrueBrain> LordAro / andythenorth_ / FLHerne : any chance you can release a new NML? 14:13:06 <TrueBrain> people are hitting walls, and are starting to try to compile "master" ... with ... various of degrees of success :D 14:13:36 <andythenorth_> I have removed myself from the project, so I can't 14:18:00 <supermop_Home_> andythenorth_ should i buy a book on Cornish clay? 14:21:05 <andythenorth_> hmm 14:21:18 <andythenorth_> the whole industry, or just the actual material? 14:25:54 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain updated pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJik 14:32:08 <FLHerne> TrueBrain: What's wrong with nml? 14:33:22 <TrueBrain> FLHerne: nothing; but from what I understand, master fixes some things 14:33:26 <TrueBrain> and there hasn't been a release in a while 14:34:14 <LordAro> TrueBrain: looks a lot better with the headings now, i was thinking something similar 14:34:17 <LordAro> :) 14:35:41 <TrueBrain> and I rewrote "What next?" 14:35:43 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain updated pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJik 14:35:58 <TrueBrain> let's rename it "What's next?" 14:35:59 <TrueBrain> :P 14:36:01 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain updated pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJik 14:37:18 *** Smedles_ has quit IRC 14:37:18 <LordAro> you made it longer! 14:37:58 <FLHerne> TrueBrain: I don't think there are any fixes for user-visible problems in master 14:38:15 <FLHerne> There's glx's parameter thing, which is a shiny new feature 14:38:22 <FLHerne> And a ton of code cleanups 14:38:39 <TrueBrain> all I see are users installing master, as the latest release is not cutting it :) 14:38:47 <FLHerne> TrueBrain: Where? 14:38:47 <TrueBrain> I know very little about NML :P 14:38:50 <TrueBrain> Discord 14:38:53 <TrueBrain> and I am just relaying information here :) 14:39:05 <TrueBrain> "I need parameters in switches which are not in the latest release build" 14:39:08 <TrueBrain> to copy/paste something 14:39:08 <LordAro> no real harm in doing a new release really 14:39:15 <LordAro> releases are cheap now :) 14:39:18 <TrueBrain> release often, I always think :) 14:39:21 <LordAro> as andy says so often 14:40:15 <andythenorth_> I wouldn't release from current master 14:40:46 <FLHerne> andythenorth_: Warnings spam? 14:40:48 <andythenorth_> yes 14:40:55 <FLHerne> Yeah, that 14:41:01 <andythenorth_> it will be misunderstood by users 14:41:39 <andythenorth_> revs prior to https://github.com/OpenTTD/nml/commit/7f62081693d5e3b0e4a0ea84d5f17bfb5e7947b9 are much quieter 14:41:45 <TrueBrain> LordAro: let me know where my English went wrong in the "what's next" :D 14:42:03 <andythenorth_> I currently build grfs with make install PW=16 2>&1 | grep -v "returns a constant" 14:42:06 <FLHerne> andythenorth_: It's only really an issue for generated code 14:42:06 *** Smedles has joined #openttd 14:42:12 <andythenorth_> the important bit being the grep -v 14:42:13 <FLHerne> Which is mostly you :p 14:42:21 *** glx has joined #openttd 14:42:21 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 14:42:26 <andythenorth_> timing :P 14:42:29 <FLHerne> Well, at that level of complexirt 14:42:44 <TrueBrain> it warns it is doing optimizations? 14:42:46 <TrueBrain> that sounds odd :P 14:42:49 <LordAro> speaking of nml, hi glx 14:43:00 <LordAro> have you fixed all the things yet? 14:43:04 <FLHerne> TrueBrain: It warns that the thing it's optimizing out did nothing 14:43:16 <TrueBrain> it is? 14:43:34 <TrueBrain> "Block '{}' returns a constant, optimising." <- guess it needs better phrasing? 14:43:38 <FLHerne> On the assumption that you typed it, so it's probably intended to do something 14:43:54 <TrueBrain> that warning is telling me the system is doing something :) 14:43:55 <FLHerne> This is fine except for generated code, where you didn't type it and probably don't care 14:44:17 <andythenorth_> the warning is useful to find cases that can be optimised out in the compile 14:44:17 <TrueBrain> "Block '{}' returns a constant, which is now being optimized out; was this intended?" 14:44:21 <TrueBrain> I guess is what the warning means? 14:44:22 <andythenorth_> which can improve compile time 14:45:03 <glx> it also improve run time 14:45:25 <andythenorth_> I mean in the compile of the .nml file, in the code generator :) 14:46:10 <andythenorth_> although that takes 4 seconds, so any claims I make about it getting faster can be ignored :P 14:46:10 <FLHerne> TrueBrain: Which discord? 14:46:19 <TrueBrain> -the- OpenTTD one, in this case :) 14:46:28 * andythenorth_ considers getting discord 14:46:30 <TrueBrain> either way, again, I was just relaying information :) 14:46:46 <TrueBrain> I really do not know how to link a Discord ... lol 14:47:13 <TrueBrain> https://discord.gg/0nQXSRX64lJprTrE <- someone knew that, and pinned a message :D 14:47:54 <TrueBrain> it is shocking, but that Discord has some very helpful people around, and the attitude is very positive 14:49:11 *** azubieta has joined #openttd 14:49:17 <glx> LordAro: what things ? 14:49:27 <TrueBrain> ALL the things 14:49:29 <TrueBrain> you know 14:49:31 <TrueBrain> the world 14:49:31 <LordAro> ^ 14:49:32 <TrueBrain> the universe 14:49:34 <TrueBrain> and the rest! 14:49:49 *** azubieta has quit IRC 14:49:58 <TrueBrain> I removed 2000+ sitemaps from bing for wiki.openttd.org, but 42 I could not delete 14:50:03 <TrueBrain> what ever I tried, it always kept 42 of them 14:50:08 *** azubieta has joined #openttd 14:50:09 <LordAro> glx: the warning "spam", specifically 14:50:09 <TrueBrain> I guess ... it is the right answer 14:50:16 <FLHerne> for example, Arecibo collapsed today, it needs putting up again 14:50:30 <LordAro> osht, it's actually collapsed? 14:50:34 <FLHerne> Yeah 14:50:43 <glx> ah no, still no warning filters 14:50:43 <LordAro> rip :( 14:50:55 <FLHerne> The whole thing went twang-crash-splat a few hours ago 14:51:07 <LordAro> i'd heard it was likely going to be demolished 14:51:13 <FLHerne> Which I suppose vindicates the people who decided it wasn't safely repairable 14:51:28 <TrueBrain> what was their plan .. putting people on ropes connected to a helicopter? 14:51:32 <TrueBrain> that if it collapsed, they would be safe? 14:51:47 <FLHerne> Probably not, because cable snapback can be really nasty 14:51:53 <TrueBrain> like .. if you need to do that, you are already doing it wrong :P 14:51:55 <LordAro> TrueBrain: that was actually considered 14:52:01 <TrueBrain> I know, I wasn't really asking LordAro :) 14:52:02 <LordAro> probably very briefly, but it was considered 14:52:26 <TrueBrain> years of neglect tends to collapse structures like that ... 14:52:30 <TrueBrain> no money for science :( 14:52:49 <FLHerne> What should warning filters look like? 14:52:59 <TrueBrain> -Wall 14:53:00 <TrueBrain> :P 14:53:05 <FLHerne> -Wno-redundant-switch or so? 14:53:26 <TrueBrain> do it the flask way, give every warning an unique number, and allow ignoring numbers based on content of a file 14:53:30 <FLHerne> s/redundant/constant/ 14:54:04 <glx> there are also deprecation warnings to filter 14:54:07 <TrueBrain> file not mandatory btw :P 14:55:56 <FLHerne> -Wno-deprecated-industry in that case? 14:56:14 <FLHerne> (should be specific, so people still see any new deprecation warnings) 14:56:50 <FLHerne> There's --verbosity, but that doesn't seem usefuk 14:57:10 <glx> yeah verbosity is too generic 14:57:56 <FLHerne> And --quiet, which was always a terrible idea 15:00:37 *** iSoSyS has joined #openttd 15:05:58 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain updated pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJik 15:13:36 <orudge> TrueBrain: OK, I synced the other accounts just now, thought I might as well get it done :D Some of those mailboxes are heftier than I expected. But we should be ready for the old server to retire now... 15:13:49 <TrueBrain> w00p 15:13:58 <TrueBrain> what is a bit weird, is the size difference on your server vs my server :P 15:14:10 <TrueBrain> the storage size seems to be excluding the inbox size :) 15:14:32 <TrueBrain> tnx a bunch orudge , going to shut down the server now :D 15:14:51 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] LordAro commented on pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIUty 15:14:53 <LordAro> \o/ 15:14:58 <LordAro> | 15:15:01 <LordAro> \ 15:15:03 <LordAro> shit 15:15:26 <TrueBrain> even more things LordAro ? :P 15:15:29 <orudge> TrueBrain: there's also compression on the new server 15:15:38 <LordAro> TrueBrain: just a few 15:15:42 <LordAro> i roped in a few friends 15:17:12 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain updated pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJik 15:18:02 <TrueBrain> okay, all VMs are now offline \o/ \o/ \o/ 15:18:05 <TrueBrain> now I need to backup them :P 15:18:23 <TrueBrain> the backup of OpenTTD alone is already 600GB 15:18:34 <TrueBrain> I think it will be 200GB more when I am done with the backups :P 15:18:49 <TrueBrain> I am very happy with my 500/500 connection :) 15:18:51 <andythenorth_> hmm 15:19:01 <andythenorth_> I could just rewrite my code to not trigger the warnings? 15:19:11 <TrueBrain> that would be a CRAZY idea :P 15:19:41 <andythenorth_> I'd need to learn more about writing compilers I guess 15:19:51 <andythenorth_> it would need to start analysing the code it's generating 15:19:55 <andythenorth_> instead of just generating it 15:20:14 <andythenorth_> I guess it would need to know something about nml semantics 15:20:19 <TrueBrain> orudge / LordAro: owh, and I now also dare to say the XenServer host was running for 1900 days .. without patches :P 15:20:25 <TrueBrain> that is now safe to say :D 15:20:47 <TrueBrain> XenServer build date: 2015-04-17 ... 15:20:53 <andythenorth_> I guess if I wrote a compiler, it could stop outputting nml? 15:21:01 <andythenorth_> python -> grf 15:21:30 <andythenorth_> I'd need to parse my input into an AST? 15:21:34 * andythenorth_ uses words 15:21:55 <andythenorth_> Compiler Design 101 is now starting :P 15:22:03 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain updated pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJik 15:22:16 <LordAro> TrueBrain: nice. 15:22:27 * LordAro looks at his VPS 15:22:31 <TrueBrain> honestly, that kept me up most at night ... 15:22:46 <TrueBrain> I once replaced the XenServer with a newer version, in 2015 15:22:53 <TrueBrain> was more than a few hours of work :( 15:22:54 * LordAro 's VPS reached 1000 days a year ago 15:23:07 <LordAro> then i upgraded to debian buster :p 15:23:08 <TrueBrain> not something to be proud about :P 15:24:47 <andythenorth_> there's a lot more train chat in this discord 15:24:52 <andythenorth_> it's really on-topic 15:25:06 <TrueBrain> there is an off topic channel, if youlike 15:25:08 <TrueBrain> I have it muted :P 15:25:58 <FLHerne> andythenorth_: I've said before, it would kind of make sense to have your tooling call directly into NML rather than generate text 15:26:12 *** Flygon has quit IRC 15:26:18 <andythenorth_> Eddi did it with CETS 15:26:26 <FLHerne> Unfortunately nml kind of sucks from a Python API perspective 15:26:28 <andythenorth_> it's a step beyond what I could accomplish I think 15:26:53 <andythenorth_> I suspect there is an implicit AST in my compile 15:27:16 <andythenorth_> but most of the control logic is still written in nml 15:27:18 <FLHerne> (which is something I'd like to try and improve; I originally started poking nml because I was trying to use it for a GUI grf builder and that also sucked) 15:27:41 <FLHerne> I think your definition of 'AST' might differ from everyone else's ;-) 15:27:48 <supermop_Home_> andythenorth_ https://shop.cooperhewitt.org/collections/product-design-books/products/colour-and-material-studies-in-porcelain-collection-cornwall 15:28:18 <andythenorth_> supermop_Home_ that colour is correct, and I widely use it in web UIs 15:30:01 <andythenorth_> I think I'll stop saying AST, and stick to 'tree' 15:30:09 <andythenorth_> there is an implicit tree in my compile 15:30:19 <TrueBrain> how many? 15:30:24 <andythenorth_> yes 15:30:46 <andythenorth_> I don't know, it just looks like a forest to me 15:30:50 <TrueBrain> that sounds like the right amount! 15:34:36 *** iSoSyS has quit IRC 15:35:27 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 15:39:32 <andythenorth_> discord is baffling :) 15:39:38 * andythenorth_ should read instructions 15:39:53 <TrueBrain> there is a lot to read and understand if you never used it 15:40:01 <TrueBrain> but .. you also learn it easily when using it :) 15:40:20 <andythenorth_> I just want to spam some stuff into openttd discord channel 15:40:29 <TrueBrain> go for it 15:40:31 <andythenorth_> but I'm not allowed, and there's some kind of slow mode filter 15:40:38 <andythenorth_> and I have to have my own server or something 15:40:42 <andythenorth_> UIs confuse people 15:40:59 * andythenorth_ rephrases 15:41:02 <andythenorth_> UIs confuse andythenorth_ 15:41:16 <TrueBrain> haha, yes, it is possible they configured the server that if you just joined, you cannot speak :) 15:41:29 <TrueBrain> well, I gave you some words of encouragement :) 15:42:02 <andythenorth_> hmm it has push-to-talk? 15:42:05 <andythenorth_> that is interesting 15:42:08 <TrueBrain> voice, yes 15:42:12 * andythenorth_ getting bored of video chat tools 15:42:22 <TrueBrain> well, you are already getting love andythenorth_ :) 15:45:23 <TrueBrain> owh, sorry andythenorth_ , I just never get the opportunity to talk shit about you without you being able to reply :P 15:46:10 <andythenorth_> well you could start a dedicated channel for it 15:46:22 <andythenorth_> or you could do it in OpenTTD issues which I stopped reading 15:47:03 <Xaroth> TrueBrain shittalking? story of my life tbh :P 15:47:12 <glx> wow they are fast to react, I'm already added to openttd dev role 15:47:24 <andythenorth_> not sure I can handle being in 2 channels at once 15:47:34 <andythenorth_> but this answers 'should I join reddit?' at least 15:48:03 <Xaroth> Fun note, you can create folders inside discord to more easily group servers if you're on several :P 15:48:15 <TrueBrain> "fun" he said 15:48:20 <TrueBrain> we need to have a talk about what is "fun" and what not 15:48:48 <Xaroth> What can I say, a lot of people want me to join their server... unlike you, who never invited me! 15:48:52 <andythenorth_> I had fun once 15:48:56 <TrueBrain> glx: it is pnda, he is kind like that, yes :) 15:49:15 <TrueBrain> Xaroth: being in 1 common channel with you is more than enough thank you very much 15:49:29 <Xaroth> :D :D 15:51:02 <TrueBrain> so now we only need to get frosch to Discord, and we can close IRC, right? 15:51:13 <andythenorth_> oof web discord is killing my CPU 15:51:18 <FLHerne> What we need is an IRC-Discord bridge 15:51:26 <FLHerne> I don't want this stupid browser thing open all the time 15:51:28 <TrueBrain> FLHerne: I ran that for a while ... no, we do not :P 15:51:40 <TrueBrain> the protocols really are not compatible enough, basically 15:51:43 <TrueBrain> IRC -> Discord is fine 15:51:48 <TrueBrain> Discord -> IRC .... not so much 15:52:04 <glx> I just use the discord app 15:52:08 <TrueBrain> I do too 15:52:21 <TrueBrain> I have the mobile app and the desktop app 15:52:25 <glx> same 15:52:33 <TrueBrain> but if you don't have many people on Discord, that feels weird at first 15:52:39 <glx> and some muted servers :) 15:52:42 <TrueBrain> before you know it .. all other chat thingies are annoying :P 15:53:08 <FLHerne> Well, I'm not leaving my hundred-odd IRC channels, and I don't want two chat clients 15:53:29 <TrueBrain> I am happy the group "OpenTTD Developer" is a ... broad defined group :P 15:53:57 <FLHerne> I'm very puzzled that I seem to have name recognition on Discord :p 15:53:59 <TrueBrain> FLHerne: there is only one answer for that: https://xkcd.com/1782/ :) 15:54:26 <FLHerne> I mean, I've made a handful of NML commits, and I was active on the forums, like, six years ago 15:54:57 <glx> that's enough to be known 15:55:02 <andythenorth_> FLHerne you're now a maintainer :P 15:55:07 <TrueBrain> it is always fun to realise how other people perceive you :) 15:55:27 <FLHerne> (tbf, I was *very* active on the forums like six years ago) 15:56:03 <FLHerne> andythenorth_: darn 15:56:09 <FLHerne> As if I didn't have enough problems 15:56:56 <TrueBrain> but ... to go back to that "100 IRC channels" .. wtf? 15:57:19 <FLHerne> It just seems disproportionate when TrueBrain's rewritten the entire server stack and andy's single-handedly made half the grf ecosystem :p 15:57:43 <FLHerne> TrueBrain: They stopped fitting on the side of my screen years ago 15:57:53 <FLHerne> You can never have too many arguments 15:58:01 <TrueBrain> FLHerne: that is your perception; mine is different: pretty sure a few of those NML PRs wouldn't have happened without you .. and I wouldn't be able to do it :) 15:58:21 <TrueBrain> we all have our strengths and points of contribution :) 15:58:40 <FLHerne> I suppose I'd better hack on nml a bit more :-/ 15:58:55 <TrueBrain> hahaha, you feel pressured now? :P 15:58:56 <TrueBrain> :D 15:59:37 <FLHerne> IRC channels http://www.flherne.uk/files/Screenshot_20201201_155912.png 15:59:48 <TrueBrain> wtf really 15:59:57 <TrueBrain> I was hoping IRC would die a bit, but it seems a few keep it alive :P 16:00:29 <FLHerne> It's like TTD, all the newer ones are worse 16:00:35 <FLHerne> Or closed-source 16:00:37 <andythenorth_> I don't think I made half the grf ecosystem :P 16:00:37 <TrueBrain> :D 16:00:45 <andythenorth_> I've done about as much as pikka 16:00:56 <TrueBrain> yes ... that makes 99% of the ecosystem :P 16:01:02 <TrueBrain> well done on your math there buddy :) 16:01:23 <glx> and remember TrueBrain knowns newgrf numbers ;) 16:02:18 <glx> based on user migration to github he could see the volume of newgrfs 16:02:18 <andythenorth_> if we just go by download count, other people are way more popular 16:02:23 <andythenorth_> "pls just love me" 16:02:39 <TrueBrain> I was going by: how many people reused what-ever you did :P 16:03:14 <glx> if they reuse andythenorth_'s template system they are crazy ;) 16:03:28 <TrueBrain> people are forking FIRS left and right 16:03:34 <andythenorth_> and centre 16:03:38 <TrueBrain> no 16:03:40 <TrueBrain> never centre 16:03:42 <TrueBrain> fucking weirdo 16:03:45 <TrueBrain> :P 16:03:46 <TrueBrain> <3 16:04:01 <andythenorth_> there are as many as...get this....*7* forks :o 16:04:19 <TrueBrain> and at least 2 are released on BaNaNaS 16:04:24 <TrueBrain> possibly more :P 16:05:34 <TrueBrain> I want to make dinner, but I was like: I will wait for this backup to finish, so I can start the other one over dinner 16:05:41 <TrueBrain> but ... it has been 30 minutes already 16:05:45 <TrueBrain> I am starting to get hungry ... 16:06:37 <andythenorth_> never wait for a machine 16:06:43 <andythenorth_> ideal life goal 16:07:02 <TrueBrain> sounds like a horrible piece of advise when trains are involved 16:07:13 <TrueBrain> walks over crosswalk yelling, I NEVER WAIT FOR A MACHINE 16:07:44 <andythenorth_> machine waits for you 16:07:59 <andythenorth_> there are a lot of dots on icons in discord 16:08:04 <andythenorth_> I should probably click on them all 16:08:37 <andythenorth_> oh peter is in the discord still, I hope he's ok 16:08:47 <andythenorth_> I mean, I could just ask, but I am to blame for him leaving so eh 16:08:51 <TrueBrain> ask him! I have seen him playing games, so I guess he is :) 16:09:06 <TrueBrain> there is a huge difference between direct and indirect causing something 16:09:26 <TrueBrain> one thing caused WW II, but to blame the war on that one thing .. :P 16:09:33 <andythenorth_> there is a big difference between "I am the centre of the world" and objective reality 16:09:36 <andythenorth_> but I prefer option 1 16:09:41 <TrueBrain> we know :P 16:09:42 <TrueBrain> <3 16:10:01 <andythenorth_> I don't always get option 1, unlike Donald J Trump 16:10:06 <andythenorth_> but eh 16:10:15 <TrueBrain> you want the world to laugh at you that badly? 16:10:26 <orudge> [15:20:20] <TrueBrain> orudge / LordAro: owh, and I now also dare to say the XenServer host was running for 1900 days .. without patches :P <-- impressive 16:10:36 <TrueBrain> orudge: not the word I would use, but sure 16:10:45 <orudge> I didn't say it was good or clever :D 16:11:01 <TrueBrain> terrifying, is the word I rather use :) 16:11:21 <TrueBrain> okay, backup done, next backup is running, food time! 16:12:33 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 16:13:05 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 16:24:19 <supermop_Home_> do a lot of people use discord here? 16:24:44 <supermop_Home_> i see basically no use case for myself 16:25:25 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] LordAro approved pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIU86 16:26:27 <TrueBrain> I will ask frosch123 to fact-check the post before merging :) 16:36:53 <TrueBrain> total backup: 672GB 16:36:54 <TrueBrain> lol 16:37:39 <TrueBrain> orudge: I see no reason to renew the server this friday 16:38:03 <TrueBrain> we will see if anything pops up tomorrow, but .. I think we are fine by just letting it expire (which is btw the OVH way of cancelling your subscription) 16:38:18 <TrueBrain> you would think you can cancel it somewhere, but no .. letting it expire is their way of doing so :D 16:39:32 <orudge> TrueBrain: Yes, they tend to keep the server up for a few days then they terminate it 16:39:43 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 16:40:09 <TrueBrain> for my own server I wiped the disks before it expired .. I wonder if I should do that here too 16:40:10 <orudge> You can now do automatic payments via credit card for OVH, and so there is a cancellation option, but I don't think there's an immediate termination option. Well maybe there is, but letting it expire naturally is fine to be honest. 16:40:27 <TrueBrain> I looked, there is no: CANCEL NOW, anywhere :D 16:40:31 <TrueBrain> and yes, their method is fine 16:41:03 <TrueBrain> okay, this is a nice GDPR violation .. send people a newsletter about "subscribe to our newsletter" 16:41:07 <TrueBrain> it is opt-in dipshits, not opt-out 16:42:31 <TrueBrain> (Docker sending an email about a newsletter) 16:48:25 *** jottyfan has joined #openttd 17:02:11 <FLHerne> andythenorth_: I think I'm more directly to blame for upsetting peter :-/ 17:02:22 <FLHerne> I wrote that stupid comment about NRT 17:02:54 <andythenorth_> I campaigned for NRT for about 8 years 17:03:27 *** Progman has joined #openttd 17:03:29 <FLHerne> Yeah, background vs proximate cause... 17:24:44 <Xaroth> was there something that didn't upset peter? 17:27:48 <TrueBrain> Don't be a dick plz 17:29:38 *** TooTallTyler has joined #openttd 17:31:40 <milek7> I'm trying to setup matrix server 17:31:48 <milek7> but that federation feature seems useless honestly 17:32:22 <TrueBrain> Depends on how you want to use it 17:32:34 <TrueBrain> Matrix has different ways it can be used :) 17:32:46 <milek7> maybe it requires i9 and 64gb ram? I dunno 17:33:04 <milek7> joining 'mozilla central' took 15min 17:33:28 <milek7> joining `matrix hq` is doing something for 20min and seems stuck.. 17:33:34 <TrueBrain> You don't need a server to join these servers :) 17:34:00 <TrueBrain> I only run servers non-federated 17:34:08 <milek7> that sort of defeats the point 17:34:09 <TrueBrain> I leave the rest for others :p 17:34:26 <TrueBrain> Depends on what you want from it :) 17:35:27 <milek7> but wtf 17:35:28 <milek7> 4gb ram is not enough for chat!? 17:38:40 <TrueBrain> You are clearly misunderstanding what is going on :) 17:38:54 <TrueBrain> For chat, you only need a client 17:39:40 <TrueBrain> Running a federated server .. that is another league on its own :) 17:42:09 <milek7> oh I know, but that just defeats the point 17:42:14 <milek7> I could use discord or whatever then 17:43:21 <TrueBrain> You keep referring to some magic "point" 17:57:48 *** TooTallTyler has quit IRC 17:58:18 <milek7> well it advertises itself as 'An open network for secure, decentralized communication' 17:58:37 <milek7> but it turns out that 'decentralized' sort of doesn't work in reality 18:01:23 <TrueBrain> It is truly decentralized 18:01:49 <TrueBrain> Well, depends a bit on how many servers are in a federation, I guess 18:01:59 <TrueBrain> My home server is not decentralized :D 18:02:42 <TrueBrain> But if you expect decentralized also means low-memory, that might be a wrong expectation :D 18:04:58 <milek7> I would say that 'decentralized' implies 'you can run it without unreasonable hardware requirements' 18:05:03 <milek7> but apparently not ;p 18:07:28 <TrueBrain> That really was an assumption on your part :) 18:07:55 <TrueBrain> Still, joining huge federations doesnt require that much resources, compared 18:08:34 <TrueBrain> Joining smaller ones take almost nothing btw 18:13:37 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/bananas-api] pyup-bot opened pull request #77: Scheduled monthly dependency update for December https://git.io/JIUiT 18:14:05 <TrueBrain> Let there be spam! 18:14:16 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/bananas-frontend-cli] pyup-bot opened pull request #15: Scheduled monthly dependency update for December https://git.io/JIUiW 18:14:53 <LordAro> \o/ 18:15:03 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/bananas-frontend-web] pyup-bot opened pull request #50: Scheduled monthly dependency update for December https://git.io/JIUir 18:16:16 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/bananas-server] pyup-bot opened pull request #38: Scheduled monthly dependency update for December https://git.io/JIUiF 18:18:39 *** otetede has joined #openttd 18:22:14 <TrueBrain> we are not done yettttt 18:22:16 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/master-server] pyup-bot opened pull request #22: Scheduled monthly dependency update for December https://git.io/JIUP1 18:23:02 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/master-server-web] pyup-bot opened pull request #17: Scheduled monthly dependency update for December https://git.io/JIUPF 18:23:48 <milek7> >doesnt require that much resources, compared 18:23:51 <milek7> compared to what? 18:24:46 <TrueBrain> lol, my mobile ate some letters :) 18:25:05 <TrueBrain> compared to what it does / how it does it / what it offers, etc 18:26:32 <TrueBrain> hmm ... none of the actions are starting up 18:27:41 <milek7> lol 18:27:43 <milek7> 'At least 1GB of free RAM if you want to join large public rooms like #matrix:matrix.org' 18:28:28 <milek7> quite an understatement 18:28:56 <milek7> imo it's nice idea, but implementation it's just broken 18:29:08 <TrueBrain> I think you are judging something without understanding what is going on :) 18:29:20 <TrueBrain> that is easy to do, I get that, but if you dive in .. 18:31:24 <TrueBrain> and in case you missed the memos, Matrix has passed the station of "idea" a while ago :D It has a pretty solid userbase 18:31:43 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 18:32:14 <TrueBrain> https://www.githubstatus.com/incidents/sxthxvdlljk4 <- pfew, it is not me :) 18:33:02 <TrueBrain> will be interesting to see if the new pip is installed in the base docker images, and if things break because of the new pip .. it is likely 18:36:05 <milek7> anyway, I need replacement for mattermost that does have some moderation tools 18:36:14 <milek7> (..unfederated synapse maaybe would do it, but after what I've seen I don't trust it anymore) 18:38:14 <TrueBrain> as mentioned earlier, you are easy to judge a book by its cover :) 18:38:31 <TrueBrain> if you want a private on-premise deployment, an unfederated Matrix works lovely 18:38:42 <TrueBrain> setup your own identity server if you like even 18:38:45 <TrueBrain> smooth sailing 18:39:46 <TrueBrain> but if you measure your experience based on joining the biggest federation out there, and complaining it using a bit of memory .. I guess there is not really an alternative for you :) 18:40:38 <milek7> oh, and I need to migrate mattermost conversation history 18:44:09 <milek7> mattermost is fine, but it just isn't made for public deployments: no way to ban user from channel, no op/permissions except system administrator, anybody can delete channel, anybody can kick anybody.. 18:57:04 <TrueBrain> oowwhhh, one GitHub Action became alive! Of course failed ... commit checker :D 18:57:25 <TrueBrain> the backlog is going to be gigantic :D 19:08:12 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 19:15:45 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] stormcone commented on pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIUS1 19:30:46 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain dismissed a review for pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIU86 19:30:49 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain updated pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJik 19:30:59 <FLHerne> I don't understand *how* such a server requires many GB of RAM 19:31:01 <FLHerne> Text is small :p 19:31:03 <TrueBrain> frosch123: would you mind fact-checking ^^ ? :) You often have this nice memory of the past ;) 19:31:18 <frosch123> already have the first pending comment 19:31:23 <TrueBrain> FLHerne: it is because how Matrix do federations 19:31:27 <TrueBrain> frosch123: <3 19:31:28 <frosch123> no idea what "so why the no?" means 19:31:50 <TrueBrain> "### Is this a bad thing, you ask? 19:31:50 <TrueBrain> Well, yes and no." 19:31:54 <TrueBrain> but that gained distance :D 19:32:54 <TrueBrain> I will rephrase it :D 19:32:57 * andythenorth_ would have published it already :) 19:33:06 <andythenorth_> then re-read it 50 times for improvements :P 19:33:18 <TrueBrain> good thing I am not re-reading it :) 19:37:39 <TrueBrain> 3 hours in GitHub issues, still no update .. mehhhh :P HURRY UP! WE HAVE STUFF TO RELEASE :D 19:38:51 <Wolf01> https://www.commitstrip.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/Strip-Top-langage-web-650-finalenglish.jpg :D 19:39:56 <TrueBrain> stop telling horror stories Wolf01 19:39:58 <TrueBrain> it is not funny :P 19:40:03 <Wolf01> :DDDD 19:44:10 <Wolf01> I need to start making newobjects for OpenTTD 19:44:30 <Wolf01> But first I need to learn how to pixel 19:44:54 <andythenorth_> you just draw 1 pixel to start with 19:45:03 <andythenorth_> then you draw 1 more 19:45:07 <andythenorth_> then you just keep doing that 19:45:32 <Wolf01> I'll end up drawing a defrag screen 19:46:28 <andythenorth_> I _think_ I've drawn about 15 million pixels, at a guess 19:46:50 <andythenorth_> that is actually a shitload of clicks on my trackpad :o 19:47:50 <TrueBrain> and it survived? 19:48:10 <andythenorth_> let's say there was more than 1 19:48:38 <LordAro> andythenorth_: how many ships is that? 19:48:48 <andythenorth_> about 3 19:49:04 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] frosch123 commented on pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIU7N 19:49:11 <frosch123> TrueBrain: quite some essay :) 19:49:48 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain commented on pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIU5f 19:50:52 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain updated pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJik 19:50:59 <TrueBrain> and if you didn't find any errors in my timeline, good :D 19:51:08 <TrueBrain> now we just have to wait for GitHub Actions to act normal again :P 19:51:15 <andythenorth_> what's the next essay!???!! :) 19:51:21 <andythenorth_> future of nml? 19:51:25 <andythenorth_> state of the base game? :) 19:51:34 <andythenorth_> things to watch on TV at christmas? 19:51:41 <LordAro> TrueBrain: "IRC bot *that* was running" 19:51:48 <LordAro> otherwise the tenses(?) don't match 19:52:09 <TrueBrain> LordAro: that sentence is no longer there; reload and let me know what you think about this sentence 19:52:11 <LordAro> "IRC bot *that* was not ..."* 19:52:20 <TrueBrain> ah, okay, I was about to say :P 19:52:28 <LordAro> :p 19:52:48 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain updated pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJik 19:52:51 <LordAro> i wonder whether 'winter' should be capitalised 19:53:32 <TrueBrain> that kind of nitpicking I leave for others :P 19:53:58 <LordAro> well it looks inconsistent with all the others ^^ 19:54:39 <TrueBrain> well, "may" doesn't exist in the English dictionary. It really is May. 19:54:53 <TrueBrain> (I love using May for these kind of jokes :D) 19:55:38 <TrueBrain> but feel free to look it up in a dictionary LordAro , if your OCD is triggering that much :) 19:56:08 <milek7> 'winter' is probably ambiguous? 19:56:20 <TrueBrain> no, I am just messing with LordAro a bit. It really is "winter" 19:56:39 <TrueBrain> it is not like my OCD is any better than his :P 19:56:53 <frosch123> DorpsGek: happy birthday! 19:57:04 <andythenorth_> what is OCD pls? 19:57:11 <frosch123> @logs 19:57:13 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain updated pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJik 19:57:16 <TrueBrain> funny enough, the missing "d" a line above he did not notice :P 19:57:30 <TrueBrain> frosch123: logs are not yet public; something I have to setup first. soon! (tm) 19:57:51 <frosch123> ah, fine, will continue with webster then :) 19:57:55 <milek7> northern/southern hemisphere thing 20:14:30 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] frosch123 approved pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIUFN 20:15:20 <glx> andythenorth_: accidentally joined a vocal channel ? 20:26:18 *** jottyfan has quit IRC 20:32:44 <andythenorth_> glx maybe? 20:32:54 <andythenorth_> let's see 20:33:19 <andythenorth_> was that streaming audio? Mic is blocked to this browser 20:33:40 <glx> you were mute 20:34:03 <andythenorth_> yeah discord has this bouncing yellow exclamation icon 20:34:06 <andythenorth_> so I clicked it 20:34:13 <andythenorth_> but then it said I had to go to the helpdesk 20:34:19 <andythenorth_> [shrug] UI design is hard 20:34:33 <andythenorth_> how do people even computer? 20:39:28 *** otetede has quit IRC 20:41:00 <andythenorth_> yogscast openttd time 20:41:13 <andythenorth_> they're swearing a lot, and my kids are not asleep yet 20:41:25 <andythenorth_> https://www.twitch.tv/yogscast 20:42:27 <frosch123> haha, perfect time for the news post :) 20:42:57 <frosch123> no idea what their target age is 20:44:11 <frosch123> but my 10yo nephew is invested in minecraft songs or something 20:45:20 <andythenorth_> 10yos are weird 20:45:25 <andythenorth_> half child, half teenager 20:45:41 <andythenorth_> they're using some horrible old FIRS 20:45:45 <frosch123> teenager starts as 12 :p 20:45:47 <frosch123> err 13 20:50:08 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain merged pull request #176: Add: news post about finishing aws migration https://git.io/JIJik 20:50:15 <TrueBrain> let's see how stable this stuff is ... 20:50:37 <TrueBrain> wait, they are actually playing OpenTTD now? That is ... funny :P 20:51:15 <frosch123> i keep on forgetting, but i think ottd is always december 1st 20:51:37 <frosch123> just like april 1st is release date :) 20:52:32 <TrueBrain> well, traffic is spiking 20:52:36 <TrueBrain> 3 times the normal volume :P 20:53:09 <FLHerne> andythenorth_: You should do this twitch chat thing and tell them you drew all the pixels 20:53:44 <TrueBrain> https://pasteboard.co/JCXwJGB.png 20:53:50 <frosch123> FLHerne: no, not again :) 20:54:21 <frosch123> there was an early-teen some years ago, who was chatting here and in their twitch 20:54:28 <frosch123> playing mailman 20:55:14 <frosch123> TrueBrain: is that the new twitch game? 20:55:31 <TrueBrain> that is the load of one of our services :P 20:55:37 <frosch123> twitch plays spreadsheet charts 20:56:07 <FLHerne> frosch123: I don't think the fact that a teenager can make something annoying proves that it's a bad idea 20:56:19 *** supermop_Home_ has quit IRC 20:56:23 <FLHerne> Otherwise pretty much everything would be a bad idea 20:56:43 <frosch123> valid theory :) 20:58:07 <TrueBrain> shocker, BaNaNaS traffic is also spiking :P 20:58:32 <frosch123> now only the aws credits need spiking 21:03:13 <TrueBrain> it is 5 times more traffic to www.openttd.org :P 21:03:14 <TrueBrain> haha 21:03:29 <andythenorth_> FLHerne I'd have to register a twitch account :P 21:05:08 <frosch123> andythenorth_: it gets worse. to be a kool kid you have to use bttv (better twitch tv) as chat client, to have more emojis 21:05:37 <TrueBrain> not happy how the news item is styled, but I can't be bothered to dive in CSS .. lets release this :P 21:05:54 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain created new tag: 1.4.5 https://git.io/JIUjG 21:06:26 <andythenorth_> ship it! 21:08:17 <TrueBrain> I AM! 21:08:39 <TrueBrain> it always surprises me how much impact streamers have on sites :) 21:09:06 <andythenorth_> no that's just me hitting refresh 21:09:11 <andythenorth_> to see your post 21:11:37 <TrueBrain> hmm ... publishing to staging worked just fine, but now GitHub Actions seems stuck again :( 21:11:40 *** gelignite has quit IRC 21:15:49 <andythenorth_> poof 21:15:53 <andythenorth_> oof even 21:19:57 <TrueBrain> "make sure to put passwords on companies" 21:20:01 <TrueBrain> best .. advise .. ever 21:21:38 <TrueBrain> https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=87947 21:21:41 <TrueBrain> there 21:21:45 <TrueBrain> done with this migration crap 21:21:58 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/aws-infra] TrueBrain closed issue #3: Shut down the old infrastructure https://git.io/JUj7W 21:22:56 <TrueBrain> now I go on vacation yes yes? 21:24:06 <frosch123> you need a VR set for that 21:24:11 <frosch123> but you can have some cookies 21:24:49 <frosch123> also, why do you have so many posts on the forum? 21:24:59 <TrueBrain> honestly ... I really do not know 21:25:07 <TrueBrain> I cannot remember I was active on the forums 21:25:08 <TrueBrain> guess I once was 21:25:23 <frosch123> 112 posts in the noai topic 21:26:12 <TrueBrain> that is 10% ! 21:27:40 <frosch123> 159 1889 11575 2019-07-14-monthly-dev-post.md 21:27:41 <frosch123> 321 3263 19764 2020-12-01-infrastructure-migration-finished.md 21:27:44 <frosch123> just saying :) 21:27:55 <TrueBrain> I broke the record? Nice! 21:28:11 <frosch123> you just wrote 7% of news posts 21:28:24 <TrueBrain> I used to write these kind of posts on the forum 21:28:32 <TrueBrain> I can port them, if you like :P 21:29:01 <frosch123> actually, most of the long posts are from after jekyll 21:29:10 <frosch123> i guess the old webeditbox did not ask for long posts :p 21:30:14 <TrueBrain> I really REALLY did not like writing in a textbox, no :P 21:30:29 <TrueBrain> (it was django-admin default thingy) 21:30:48 *** m1cr0man has quit IRC 21:31:53 <frosch123> ah, sorting my linecount is unfair. the textbox news do not break liens 21:32:37 <TrueBrain> no, they did not 21:32:38 <frosch123> hmm, sorting by bytecount makes the 2019+ posts even more dominant :p 21:33:01 <TrueBrain> even michi_cc joins Discord? Omg! 21:33:05 <TrueBrain> frosch123: where are you? :P 21:33:23 <frosch123> pff, in my memory the 1.0.0 release post was really long. but there were 3 longer release posts 21:33:45 <michi_cc> I've been using Discord in general already, just not for OpenTTD :) 21:33:54 <TrueBrain> well, welcome :) 21:34:12 <frosch123> TrueBrain: uhm... are you suggesting we shall all leave irc on the day you finished dorpsgek4? 21:34:23 <TrueBrain> hahahaha, yes :D 21:34:36 <TrueBrain> it wouldn't even hurt my feelings, funny enough :) 21:34:52 <frosch123> is there some client that can connect to both irc and discord? 21:34:58 <TrueBrain> not that I am aware 21:34:59 <frosch123> or shall i get a haiku wm? 21:35:16 <TrueBrain> Discord is best viewed in either their app or via the web 21:35:35 <andythenorth_> we need comments on the news posts 21:35:42 <andythenorth_> or...like a forum even? 21:36:05 <TrueBrain> the reason I posted it on the forums is to have a place for comments, as I realised too there was no place what-so-ever :P 21:36:12 <andythenorth_> Buckle Up! 21:36:13 <andythenorth_> etc 21:36:21 <frosch123> andythenorth_: people found github commit comments to comment on wiki pages 21:36:23 <TrueBrain> a GitHub Discussion :P 21:36:26 <frosch123> they will find the same solution for news posts 21:36:30 <andythenorth_> mmmmm 21:36:35 <TrueBrain> but is it one we like? :D 21:36:58 <andythenorth_> so now you can start on the MMORPG version of openttd? With sharded maps and other crap? 21:37:16 <andythenorth_> OpenTTD Forever! 21:37:17 <glx> <andythenorth_> we need comments on the news posts <-- no we don't, else we need moderation 21:37:34 <TrueBrain> andythenorth_: don't tempt me .... 21:38:42 <frosch123> hmm, maybe pidgin can 21:39:24 <andythenorth_> and web saves 21:39:30 <andythenorth_> and a web based content creator 21:39:40 <frosch123> we already have that 21:39:52 <andythenorth_> we do? :o 21:39:55 <frosch123> it's called "irc + talk to andy" 21:40:03 <andythenorth_> that's just a turk 21:40:20 <andythenorth_> I mean makemytrain.farm 21:40:47 <frosch123> i forgot whether we talked about myfirs.farm, or myhorse.farm 21:41:18 <andythenorth_> firs.farm is for christmas trees 21:42:10 <frosch123> TrueBrain: i'll try pidgin tomorrow, see whether it can cannot to irc and discord, and whether it is decent on any scale 21:42:20 <TrueBrain> :D 21:42:27 <frosch123> s/cannot/connect/ 21:42:29 <frosch123> wtf 21:42:45 <frosch123> was thas fore-shadowing? 21:43:51 <TrueBrain> https://pasteboard.co/JCXR4Ax.png 21:43:53 <TrueBrain> I like graphs 21:44:12 <frosch123> did that link already leak to twitch chat? 21:44:45 <LordAro> TrueBrain: congrats :) 21:45:01 <LordAro> we all owe you many drinks 21:45:59 <milek7> about haiku: it needs some cmake fixes 21:46:13 <milek7> -rdynamic is not supported, and it needs extra linker flags: -lbe -lnetwork -lmidi 21:46:56 <milek7> (and sdl2 is glitchy for some reason, sdl1 works better) 21:46:59 <frosch123> TrueBrain: in other news. there was a specifically targeted scam mail wave at work today, and i took the opportunity to thank IT for their "external mail" warning banners :) 21:47:11 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 21:47:11 <TrueBrain> hahahahaha 21:47:15 <TrueBrain> you are such an ass :D I like it :) 21:47:31 <frosch123> i think i am the first one to thank them, so let's see what i can earn from that down the river :p 21:47:55 <andythenorth_> so Yogscast have raised £500k so far 21:48:03 <TrueBrain> its insane .... 21:48:05 <TrueBrain> (in a good way) 21:48:24 <TrueBrain> owh, and if someone links it to Yogcast twitch chat, that graph above, I would love to know their reaction :) 21:49:33 <LordAro> TrueBrain: what is that graph? client download numbers? 21:49:39 <TrueBrain> requests 21:49:54 <TrueBrain> HTTPS requests to the ALB to be exact, which hosts dynamic part of openttd.org :P 21:49:59 <TrueBrain> but the increase is 80% on www.openttd.org 21:50:16 <frosch123> LordAro: doesn't matter. it's a curve twitch chat can influence 21:50:48 <TrueBrain> the details are indeed not as important as the scale they alone caused 21:50:55 <TrueBrain> 3 times more traffic as normal 21:51:37 <andythenorth_> peter is alive on twitter 21:52:07 <frosch123> oh, we actually managed to get more members than teams :) 21:52:07 <LordAro> nice 21:52:19 *** Speedyn has joined #openttd 21:52:19 <TrueBrain> :D 21:52:31 <frosch123> but the number of failed invitations is still insane 21:52:49 <TrueBrain> still not sure they don't understand GitHub enough, or that their attention-span is this low 21:52:53 <frosch123> i wonder how many actually translated a string after applying 21:53:23 <frosch123> well, they are no fresh sign-ups to github 21:53:34 <frosch123> i guess it's more a "like" button 21:53:57 <TrueBrain> https://pasteboard.co/JCXVabJ.png <- www.openttd.org only, 5 minute resolution 21:54:18 <frosch123> some people are member of 10+ github orgs 21:54:32 <frosch123> no idea what a "github org" means in that content. sound like a facebook friend 21:54:51 <TrueBrain> https://pasteboard.co/JCXVvQu.png <- in case anyone wonders if it is "normal" around this time of day :P 21:54:57 <TrueBrain> frosch123: very odd 21:55:29 <frosch123> i guess if we care, we can kick them out after a year of inactivity 21:55:35 <frosch123> not sure whether i care though :p 21:55:49 <SpComb> hey are they playing *that* map 21:55:58 <SpComb> there's more towns than the original, though 21:56:16 <LordAro> which map? 21:56:25 <andythenorth_> I am mostly troubled by old FIRS :( That sand pit :( 21:56:29 <frosch123> the german tt forums used to be very proud of kicking out users with 0 posts. and always compared their pure member numbers with the "inflated" ones from tt-forums :p 21:56:42 <LordAro> i don't have the bandwidth :( 21:57:10 <TrueBrain> the name of your sex-tape? 21:57:43 <LordAro> bad TB 21:57:48 <TrueBrain> :D 21:57:48 *** Speedy` has quit IRC 21:57:54 <frosch123> why are there 3 people on screen, but only 2 in the subject? 21:58:08 <TrueBrain> I wonder when LordAro is joining Discord ... 21:58:41 <frosch123> ah, i see, renaming things is still the most popular thing 21:59:05 <TrueBrain> I am surprised by the spike of traffic tbh; I would expect it to spike for 30 minutes or so, and die off .. but it keeps on going .... :) 21:59:10 <TrueBrain> well, we can handle it, so what-ever :P 21:59:55 <SpComb> autoscaling past one instance yet? 22:00:29 <TrueBrain> There is no pressure on any service yet :) 22:00:41 <TrueBrain> Main website is just nginx with static files 22:02:33 <TrueBrain> okay, no, sorry, the CPU usage doubled .. from 0.4% to 0.8%! 22:02:34 <TrueBrain> :P 22:02:52 <LordAro> TrueBrain: i generally disagree with discord 22:02:54 <SpComb> the orignal TTD came with some pre-made maps/scenarios, one of them was for southwest england / wales and had some of the same towns are the UK map that they're playing now 22:03:36 <TrueBrain> cool you spot that :D 22:08:17 <LordAro> SpComb: ah nice 22:08:28 <LordAro> they're based in bristol, so it makes sense 22:08:40 <LordAro> that was always my favourite TTD map 22:09:21 <frosch123> you mean they use firs only because andy is based in bristol? 22:09:22 <Timberwolf> That and Megarail, 1960 :) 22:10:33 <Timberwolf> I also liked that West Country 90210 had a bunch of signs around the Yate/Chipping Sodbury area denoting the locations of MPS' favoured pubs. 22:13:38 <SpComb> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GyIfeqF2_aM best reference I could find 22:14:44 <SpComb> I definitely still remember playing that scenario 22:15:32 <Timberwolf> I liked it when I was 13/14 and didn't really know how to play, you could just build Leopard buses between all the towns. 22:16:12 *** jottyfan has joined #openttd 22:17:11 <Timberwolf> Megarail looked like such an incredible achievement in that context, it's a bit of a shock loading it up these days with huge maps and the #openttdcoop games and going, "oh, it's only 20 or so trains on a tiny jam-prone network" 22:18:32 <SpComb> state of the art :P 22:18:59 <LordAro> no presignals back then :p 22:19:09 <LordAro> that's clearly the only thing holding you back 22:19:23 <SpComb> I must have played it with TTDPatch and DBset, I can still vaugely remember which trains went where 22:20:05 <SpComb> but seeing Weston Super-mare on an openttd stream just instantly triggers those memories :D 22:20:28 <andythenorth_> Timberwolf West Country reboot? o_O 22:20:35 <andythenorth_> I am planning a FIRS economy for it 22:20:40 <andythenorth_> needs a scenario 22:22:15 <Timberwolf> Pointedly build diesel-hydraulics and send screenshots of your heretic activities to BR management. 22:22:49 <SpComb> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Mup0MMBkJA some megarail gameplay 22:23:38 *** jottyfan has quit IRC 22:23:49 *** jottyfan has joined #openttd 22:25:50 <andythenorth_> how big was megarail map? 22:26:35 <Timberwolf> 256x256 22:26:53 <Timberwolf> It was more enormous on a 486 running at 640x480 :) 22:27:07 <TrueBrain> These good old days 22:27:30 <andythenorth_> crazy talk 22:27:40 <andythenorth_> now I play maps as big as 256x512 22:30:19 <TrueBrain> Omg, can your computer handle that?! 22:30:44 <FLHerne> Well, no, because macOS + OTTD 22:30:51 <frosch123> he has a mac, so not quite 22:31:13 <frosch123> hmm, i see, joke too obvious :) 22:31:51 <andythenorth_> it's not even a joke 22:31:52 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 22:31:53 <andythenorth_> it can't handle it 22:32:20 <andythenorth_> 100% CPU, fans running, and causes lag on the macOS windowserver 22:33:25 <andythenorth_> used to run 30%-40% on older Core2Duo macs, but i9 is unable to handle it 22:34:41 <andythenorth_> one theory is that the removal of palette support from the graphics subsystem is the cause 22:35:33 <andythenorth_> so now the CPU is doing all the paint, and then trying to move image data to the GPU over a limited bandwidth pipe, I don't know how true any of those guesses were 22:35:35 *** Wormnest_ has joined #openttd 22:35:54 * andythenorth_ awaits an M1, which has UMA, and might have 'interesting' performance with OpenTTD 22:39:05 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 22:39:31 * andythenorth_ drove away frosch again :| 22:39:38 <andythenorth_> or it was bedtime! 22:41:34 <SpComb> I'm quite enjoying myself working with the ESP8266, I've still got 20kB of the 80kB user RAM left to spare 22:42:22 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 22:42:49 <SpComb> I also have the ESP32's, but I can't bring myself to upgrade :< 22:43:41 <andythenorth_> how long does it take to compile OpenTTD? :) 22:45:00 <SpComb> it doesn't self-host 22:46:10 <andythenorth_> definitely bedtime 22:46:12 *** andythenorth_ has quit IRC 22:59:42 *** Gustavo6046 has quit IRC 22:59:47 *** Gustavo6046 has joined #openttd 23:26:23 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 23:57:29 *** Progman has quit IRC