Log for #openttdcoop on 19th October 2009:
Times are UTC Toggle Colours
00:15:11  <PublicServer> *** Kenji joined the game
00:15:13  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> hi Kenji
00:15:31  <PublicServer> *** Kenji has left the game (connection lost)
00:15:42  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> feel free to pause so you can join
00:16:00  <KenjiE20> yea, might just have enough b/w for it
00:16:03  <KenjiE20> !pause
00:16:03  <PublicServer> *** KenjiE20 has paused the server.
00:16:04  <PublicServer> *** Game paused (not enough players)
00:16:57  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> we are running 1500 trains, so I'm sure that does something to the load time :)
00:17:08  <PublicServer> *** Kenji joined the game
00:17:15  <KenjiE20> loooong d/ls don't help :P
00:17:24  <KenjiE20> !auto
00:17:25  <PublicServer> *** KenjiE20 has enabled autopause mode.
00:17:25  <PublicServer> *** Game unpaused (enough players)
00:18:01  <PublicServer> <Kenji> why is there and an unmarked SC on half the ML
00:18:11  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> where?
00:18:31  <PublicServer> <Kenji> at !unmarked
00:18:44  <PublicServer> <Kenji> it's built crappy too
00:18:46  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> no clue
00:18:51  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> feel free to destory
00:18:54  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> and destroy
00:18:55  <PublicServer> <Kenji> well "built"
00:18:59  <PublicServer> <Kenji> :P
00:19:22  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> how do you like the shifter rework at BBH 4?
00:19:37  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> still congested, but at least it moves now
00:19:41  <PublicServer> <Kenji> oh, even more pointless, there's a proper SC
00:19:51  <PublicServer> * Kenji kills the bizarre one
00:20:06  <PublicServer> <jondisti> the unmarked is identical to sc02 built by spike
00:20:21  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> and sc01, for that matter
00:20:28  <PublicServer> <Kenji> spikes has bigger in/out lines (>1 TL)
00:20:37  <PublicServer> <Kenji> and spikes is on both dirs
00:21:00  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> spikes in/out were the same length as unmarked
00:21:17  <PublicServer> <Kenji> oh yea, they looked bigger at first glance
00:21:30  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> did you see ! SHIFTERS BACKWARDS ! yet?
00:23:46  <PublicServer> <jondisti> did you fix it already?
00:23:51  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> not yet
00:24:14  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> the merge from steel mill will have to be moved across 4 ML lanes
00:26:37  <PublicServer> <Kenji> oooh, atdt's station is pretty, while clever
00:27:18  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> which station is that?
00:27:28  <PublicServer> <Kenji> the one tha abbr. to atdt :P
00:27:46  <PublicServer> <Kenji> first non space one in the station list
00:28:36  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> not bad - looks a bit like a rip-off of ZD&T ;)
00:29:42  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> debating if the ML at BBH4 needs a third line
00:29:59  <PublicServer> <jondisti> in my opinion,  yes
00:30:00  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> I think it could be useful, but it might be too complex of a merge
00:30:18  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> I still need ~30-40 more trains on that SLH 4.0^0
00:30:25  <PublicServer> <Kenji> wow nunston west has 1440 tonnes of wood
00:30:46  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> yup
00:30:52  <Razaekel> !password
00:30:53  <PublicServer> Razaekel: belies
00:30:56  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> can't add trains on that SLH - it's already at capacity
00:31:09  <PublicServer> <Kenji> yea I noticed
00:31:10  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> not without a third line on that ML
00:31:10  <PublicServer> *** Razaekel joined the game
00:31:24  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> the new shifters helped a lot
00:31:29  <PublicServer> <jondisti> while ago nunston west had all of its trains queued
00:31:33  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> so now the ML merge is a bit more fluid
00:31:40  <PublicServer> <Kenji> those tunnels are starting to jam
00:31:41  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> because the exit was blocked
00:32:23  <PublicServer> <jondisti> in front of the station, not after it :P
00:32:38  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> they were backed up in front because the exit was blocked and they couldn't get INTO the station
00:32:57  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> because the ML at BBH4 wasn't shifting properly, so the new ML couldn't merge
00:33:07  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> causing a total lockup of SLH 4.0^0
00:36:36  <PublicServer> <Kenji> imo east / west BBH's were always going to need a bigger ML than north / south, because of the extra BBH and catchment
00:37:05  <PublicServer> <Razaekel> no
00:37:09  <PublicServer> <Kenji> I say, prep and lay an extra ML line, ready to hook in if general consensus continues to agree
00:37:13  <PublicServer> <Razaekel> N/S shouldve had the extra BBH
00:37:24  <PublicServer> <Razaekel> go look at the plan
00:37:33  <PublicServer> <Kenji> why, maps longer E/W
00:37:46  <PublicServer> <Razaekel> dunno
00:37:53  <PublicServer> <Kenji> oh right
00:37:57  <PublicServer> <Kenji> its a booth plan
00:38:54  <PublicServer> <Kenji> meh, prep and lay an extra line, if agreed, hook it
00:40:14  <PublicServer> <Razaekel> yea, go have fun with that
00:40:21  <PublicServer> *** Razaekel has left the game (leaving)
00:43:01  <PublicServer> *** Kenji has left the game (leaving)
00:53:06  <PublicServer> <jondisti> are you going to build something?
00:53:59  *** Chris_Booth has quit IRC
00:55:12  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> sorry - was AFK a sec
00:55:19  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> no, I think I'm done building for the night
00:55:47  <PublicServer> <jondisti> yeah  i was gonna get some sleep also
00:55:50  <PublicServer> <jondisti> night
00:55:53  <PublicServer> *** jondisti has left the game (leaving)
00:55:54  <PublicServer> *** Game paused (not enough players)
00:55:54  <PublicServer> <Thraxian> g'nite
00:55:58  *** jonde has quit IRC
00:56:02  <PublicServer> *** Thraxian has joined spectators
00:57:44  <PublicServer> *** Thraxian has left the game (connection lost)
01:01:57  *** Thraxian has left #openttdcoop
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01:23:38  <Ammler> !reload config
01:23:38  <PublicServer> Ammler: config reloaded
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02:15:25  <Kupuham> !info
02:15:26  <PublicServer> Kupuham: #:1(Orange) Company Name: '#OpenTTDCoop'  Year Founded: 1950  Money: 7995249187  Loan: 0  Value: 8024558980  (T:1500, R:0, P:0, S:0) unprotected
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02:34:40  <atdt> !password
02:34:40  <PublicServer> atdt: pursed
02:35:22  <atdt> !password
02:35:23  <PublicServer> atdt: lunged
02:35:35  <PublicServer> *** atdt joined the game
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03:17:55  <PublicServer> *** atdt has joined spectators
03:18:01  <atdt> :D
03:33:15  <PublicServer> *** ZarenorDarkstalker has left the game (leaving)
04:04:32  <PublicServer> *** atdt has left the game (leaving)
05:59:49  <PublicServer> *** Stoffe joined the game
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06:46:13  *** openttdcoop sets mode: +v ^Spike^
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08:38:28  <V453000> !players
08:38:29  <PublicServer> V453000: There are currently no clients connected to the server
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09:22:25  <Chris_Booth> !password
09:22:25  <PublicServer> Chris_Booth: swines
09:23:02  <PublicServer> *** Chris Booth joined the game
09:26:50  <hylje> pigs
09:27:28  <V453000> :)
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09:29:50  <PublicServer> <Chris Booth> hello all
09:32:08  <V453000> hi
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11:40:01  <Ammler> it was Fuco, who helped me with the Autopilot fix?
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11:51:04  <planetmaker> iirc, yes
11:51:28  <Chris_Booth> yes it was
11:51:32  <Chris_Booth> he know TCL
11:52:11  * KenjiE20 is seriously considering attempting AP like in perl
11:54:11  <Chris_Booth> KenjiE20: Me and ^Spike^ were considering AP in java
11:54:23  <KenjiE20> I know, I was here last night
11:55:15  <Chris_Booth> but perl is just as good
11:55:16  * KenjiE20 isn't sure how many servers have java on
11:55:22  <Chris_Booth> and would save me the time
11:55:26  <KenjiE20> in my mind, it's always a gui thing
11:55:39  <Ammler> <-- next time I should check our devzone :-)
11:55:41  <Chris_Booth> java is platform independant though
11:55:56  <KenjiE20> pretty sure perl is too
11:56:38  <planetmaker> well... less than Java, I think
11:56:52  <planetmaker> it was written with a *nix environment in mind
11:56:59  <planetmaker> of course win ports exist
11:57:03  <KenjiE20> true
11:57:16  <KenjiE20> python might be better, but I don't know it
11:57:56  <Ammler> ruby?
11:58:03  <KenjiE20> same
11:59:22  <KenjiE20> technically C would be better, but having to compile isn't ideal :P
11:59:50  <Ammler> about what are you speaking, btw.?
12:00:08  <KenjiE20> AP-like rewrite
12:00:21  <Ammler> You guys know about Avignon?
12:00:27  <Ammler>
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12:02:58  <KenjiE20> av, seems to be slow at being born though... webottd might cover all the bases though
12:03:24  <Ammler> nice to see, our games help improving preformance in openttd :-)
12:03:54  <KenjiE20> heh, well it helps to have a dev or two hanging around :P
12:04:30  *** Ammler sets mode: -m 
12:05:13  <Ammler> !version
12:05:14  <PublicServer> Ammler: Autopilot AP+ 3.0 Beta (r699M)
12:05:33  <PublicServer> Server closed down by admin
12:05:33  <PublicServer> Saving game...
12:05:35  <PublicServer> Game saved
12:05:37  <PublicServer> Server has exited
12:05:38  *** PublicServer has quit IRC
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12:06:01  <PublicServer> Autopilot engaged
12:06:01  <PublicServer> Loading savegame: '#openttdcoop - The Public Server ('
12:06:01  *** ChanServ sets mode: +v PublicServer
12:06:02  *** Webster changes topic to "Welcome to #openttdcoop, the Cooperative OpenTTD | PSG #162 (r17779) | STAGE: Building | | New players, use @quickstart & !help | Screenshots: | Coopetition ladder: | IS2/FIRS game at"
12:06:11  <KenjiE20> :D
12:06:23  <Ammler> !info
12:06:24  <PublicServer> Ammler: #:1(Orange) Company Name: '#OpenTTDCoop'  Year Founded: 1950  Money: 7154944113  Loan: 0  Value: 7232172202  (T:1500, R:0, P:0, S:0) unprotected
12:06:35  <Ammler> !version
12:06:35  <PublicServer> Ammler: Autopilot AP+ 3.0 Beta (r740)
12:06:41  <Ammler> M gone :-)
12:06:54  <KenjiE20> heh
12:07:20  <Ammler> how again testing the timestamp part?
12:07:37  <KenjiE20> you mean the regexp for it?
12:07:54  <Ammler> yes, just wondering, if I commited everything right
12:08:14  <Ammler> well, we will see :-)
12:08:16  <KenjiE20> "/^(|\[\d{4}-\d\d-\d\d \d\d:\d\d:\d\d\]\s+)rest of line/"
12:08:26  <Ammler> ?
12:08:36  <Ammler> I do not care about the regex :-P
12:08:49  <KenjiE20> oh, then why say yes?
12:08:50  <Ammler> I am wondering, if it works :-P
12:08:51  <KenjiE20> :P
12:09:17  <KenjiE20> timestamps_in_log or something
12:09:32  <Ammler> hehe, nvm
12:21:27  *** dr_gonzo has quit IRC
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12:24:55  <Ammler> now, who is the first, who loses voice? :-)
12:25:19  <KenjiE20> hmmm
12:25:53  <Chris_Booth> seriously Ammler do we still need this silly voice thingy?
12:26:06  *** Ammler sets mode: -v Chris_Booth
12:26:12  <Ammler> no :-)
12:26:13  <KenjiE20> openttdcoop ( has quit (Quit:
12:26:35  <Chris_Booth> and you took my voice away
12:27:14  <Chris_Booth> then why not just remove the openttdcoop voice bot?
12:27:56  <KenjiE20> openttdcoop ( has quit (Quit: <---
12:27:59  <Ammler> :-D
12:28:38  <Chris_Booth> i thought it just left
12:29:17  <KenjiE20> Mode #openttdcoop [-m] by Ammler <--
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12:42:49  <jonde> !password
12:42:49  <PublicServer> jonde: gravel
12:43:16  <PublicServer> *** jondisti joined the game
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12:44:53  <Chris_Booth> i want my voice back
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13:24:53  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> looks like a small rollback occurred
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13:34:06  <atdt> !password
13:34:06  <PublicServer> atdt: nicety
13:34:19  <PublicServer> *** atdt joined the game
13:34:49  <Thraxian|Work> morning
13:34:57  <atdt> yeah, your fixes to bbh04 are gone
13:34:58  <atdt> morning
13:35:07  <Thraxian|Work> nope - those fixes are still there, I think
13:35:15  <Thraxian|Work> my signs are gone though
13:35:16  <atdt> oh
13:35:19  <atdt> well the sign is gone
13:45:08  <PublicServer> *** atdt has left the game (leaving)
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13:56:32  *** `Fuco`OFF is now known as FUco
13:56:40  *** FUco is now known as Fuco
13:57:14  <Fuco> Hey. ;D BTW, perl really is not a good choice for anything bigger then 1-page script
13:57:33  <Fuco> and, i don't know tcl, im just so awesome i can learn it within minutes =)
13:58:36  <hylje> perl has not chosen you
13:59:07  <atdt> ... just write a shell script
13:59:12  <atdt> :p
13:59:37  <Fuco> im not saying perl is bad, but its not the optimal language for bigger projects
13:59:48  <Fuco> its kinda like php, messy ;D (well, php is like perl actually)
13:59:51  <atdt> python all the way
14:00:00  <Fuco> yep, or java
14:00:04  <atdt> php is like a warm comfy blanket
14:00:47  <Fuco> python is awesome, however i've never used it ;D
14:01:03  <hylje> common lisp
14:01:04  <atdt> its easy to learn
14:01:23  <Fuco> learning syntax is one thing
14:01:31  <Fuco> getting the 110% of it is another
14:02:12  <atdt> true, but everything is just hacking till you're really good
14:02:15  <Fuco> i could probably write a working python app after 2 hours of staring at some python code, however it will be ugly and probably slow etc
14:03:01  <Fuco> hylje: common lisp is an interesting choice
14:03:09  <Fuco> the I/O is pain however ;P
14:12:32  <hylje> (is (syntax nil))
14:13:15  <atdt> argh i wish i had some snus
14:14:03  <hylje> yeah, that's a reason i'm lurking on the mailing list of a cl io lib
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14:58:33  <Donno> !playercount
14:58:33  <PublicServer> Donno: Number of players: 1
14:58:56  <Donno> !password
14:58:56  <PublicServer> Donno: surfed
14:59:06  <PublicServer> *** Donno joined the game
15:03:27  <PublicServer> *** Game unpaused (enough players)
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15:03:59  <PublicServer> *** jondisti has left the game (leaving)
15:04:00  <PublicServer> *** Game paused (not enough players)
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15:05:16  <Ammler> Fuco: indeed, you are our hero :-P
15:05:56  <Fuco> =)
15:06:11  <Fuco> I'm still working on 'some1' tho :D
15:06:24  <Fuco> old habits die hard :(
15:06:41  <Ammler> well, I added
15:06:44  <Ammler> !transfer
15:06:45  <PublicServer> Ammler: !transfer gamenr save: transfer the save to our web
15:07:07  <Ammler> now, your turn again :-P
15:07:19  * hylje kicks Ammler 
15:07:42  <Ammler> we need update server, restart server, patch server, rotate log
15:08:12  <PublicServer> *** Donno has left the game (leaving)
15:08:28  <Fuco> hm, so !transfer should upload a save file somewhere right
15:08:55  <sgt_Zale> !password
15:08:55  <PublicServer> sgt_Zale: primly
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15:09:28  <Ammler> well, basically it uses the already existing ssh script
15:09:34  <PublicServer> *** Sgt.Zale joined the game
15:09:44  <Ammler> (bash)
15:10:48  <Fuco> i guess i can check it out
15:11:59  <PublicServer> *** Sgt.Zale has left the game (connection lost)
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15:13:53  <Ammler> for the restart, I guess, I will also use my exisiting bash scripts
15:15:17  <Fuco> and what exactly doesn't work? TCL binding to bash script?
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15:16:40  <ARGinianPeon27494> !players
15:16:41  <PublicServer> ARGinianPeon27494: Client 3 is Thraxian|Work, a spectator
15:16:49  <ARGinianPeon27494> hehe
15:16:53  *** ARGinianPeon27494 is now known as Zarenor
15:17:40  <Thraxian|Work> hey ZD
15:18:45  <Zarenor> How're you?
15:18:55  <Zarenor> And are you free to troubleshoot for a couple of mins?
15:19:04  <Zarenor> I'm about to go practice piano before my lesson
15:19:18  <atdt> !password
15:19:18  <PublicServer> atdt: primly
15:19:20  <Zarenor> so I have maybe 15 mins if something needs work badly
15:19:25  <Zarenor> !password
15:19:26  <PublicServer> Zarenor: primly
15:19:31  <PublicServer> *** atdt joined the game
15:19:54  <PublicServer> *** Game unpaused (enough players)
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15:19:56  <atdt> we're at max trains
15:20:07  <Zarenor> Again?
15:20:12  <atdt> 1500
15:20:21  <Chris_Booth> Thraxian|Work: can up train limit to 2k
15:20:33  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> well, lets find issues and then we chould be capable of a lot more
15:20:43  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> issues where?
15:20:48  <atdt> looks like its running pretty well right now
15:20:48  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> the ML loop has no capacity issues
15:20:54  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> IDK
15:21:09  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> if 4 and 4.0^0 have been resolver
15:21:14  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> oh and..
15:21:15  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> the only "improvement" I can think of is making BBH4 split to LLL_RRR
15:21:24  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> instead of the current LL_RR
15:21:39  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> that way we can added the needed 40+ trains to our stations :)
15:22:17  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> okay.. just checked to make sure the BBH 1.1 wasnt still having issues
15:22:32  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> spike and stoffe came back and added a 3rd line, so no isues
15:22:37  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> *issues
15:22:56  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> may ned to be re-shiftered at some point, but for now
15:23:05  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> we need to get our stations back to optimal
15:23:16  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> by the time we add the 40 or so trains, it'll be ready for 40 again
15:23:21  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> we can't - our SLH is at capacity
15:23:32  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> oh, it is.. still
15:23:33  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> hen
15:23:34  <PublicServer> <atdt> yeah the slh is full
15:23:37  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> *well then'
15:23:40  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> that's why we need a 3rd line there
15:23:46  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> so we can add more trains and not jam up
15:23:48  <PublicServer> <atdt> the inner northbound line has gaps
15:23:49  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> (worse)
15:23:56  <PublicServer> <atdt> but it wont take muc more
15:24:09  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> we could rework the shifters at SLH 4.0^0 to be like the ones on the ML
15:24:14  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> well, tenfingford may have to go away
15:24:16  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> with queue space for the shift
15:24:25  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> and move the merges further apart
15:24:26  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I tink that may be a good idea
15:24:30  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> but we still need another line
15:24:33  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> we can go around Tenfingford
15:24:34  <Chris_Booth> !password
15:24:34  <PublicServer> Chris_Booth: debuts
15:24:37  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> no need to destroy it
15:25:05  <PublicServer> *** Chris Booth joined the game
15:25:08  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> nice merges, btw thrax
15:25:28  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> the middle one isn't mine
15:25:37  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> and someone changed the PBS to entry/exit on the switchers
15:25:40  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> (unsigned)
15:25:46  <PublicServer> <atdt> oh that was me
15:25:51  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> something isn't set up correctly either there
15:25:54  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> but I did switch the tracks to allow the outer to merge first
15:25:59  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> ah
15:26:11  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> and all my signs disappeared
15:26:11  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> okay, so that's an intentional gap?
15:26:15  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> where?
15:26:15  <PublicServer> <atdt> there was a rollback at some point
15:26:18  <PublicServer> <atdt> the signs went away
15:26:19  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> not connected
15:26:24  <PublicServer> *** Thraxian|Work has joined company #1
15:26:34  <PublicServer> <atdt> i changed the pbs out for entry exit
15:26:45  <PublicServer> <atdt> and added the middle entry
15:26:53  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> doh - my bad on that
15:26:53  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> just making sure it wasn't accidental
15:27:09  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> wait
15:27:10  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> look at MSH04
15:27:12  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> someone screwed
15:27:15  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> at
15:27:16  <PublicServer> <atdt> the pbs's on the waiting lanes were'nt working right
15:27:20  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> don't mess with the shifters, please
15:27:25  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> PBS was very much intentional
15:27:36  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> yes, it was working as intended
15:27:49  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> we checked it multiple ways when we built them
15:27:54  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> now it can block ML
15:27:55  <PublicServer> <atdt> well it was jammed when i found it
15:27:57  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> ZD: look at MSH04
15:28:04  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> do you see where the V is?
15:28:09  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> yup
15:28:18  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> I __JUST__ converted that to e-rail
15:28:25  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> that's why the inner track wasn't being used
15:28:27  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> HOW THE HELL
15:28:31  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> did we miss that last night?
15:28:34  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> (I also fixed it before the rollback)
15:28:38  <PublicServer> <atdt> lol
15:28:49  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> why'd we rollback
15:28:52  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> ?
15:28:53  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> no clue
15:28:57  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> hm
15:29:01  <PublicServer> <atdt> i think ammler was testing the backup script
15:29:02  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> we need to move that split back some
15:29:05  <PublicServer> <atdt> or something
15:29:06  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> ah
15:29:19  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> we need to mopve that split back for more queue space
15:29:32  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> the problem is a 4>1>3 split/merge scenario
15:29:33  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> *improve
15:29:39  <Ammler> atdt: ?
15:29:47  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> yeah....
15:30:00  <PublicServer> <atdt> i dont know, at some point the map got rolled back
15:30:01  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> any 4>1>3 is bad
15:30:01  <Ammler> I am not aware of any reverts
15:30:16  <PublicServer> <atdt> there are a few things that ZD&T did that are missing
15:30:17  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> and x>(<x)>y is bad
15:30:25  <PublicServer> <atdt> dunno how it happened
15:30:26  <Ammler> hmm
15:30:29  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> yeah, exactly
15:30:32  <Ammler> let me check :-)
15:30:33  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> well
15:30:40  <PublicServer> <atdt> we've replaced them now
15:30:46  <Ammler> so?
15:30:54  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> we still have backwards SML too
15:30:55  <Ammler> I don't need to reload?
15:30:58  <PublicServer> <atdt> nope
15:31:00  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> x>y>z where  <x and y<z is bad
15:31:01  <PublicServer> <atdt> :)
15:31:06  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> *y<x
15:31:07  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> and the outer loop seems to behave differently than the inner one
15:31:10  <Ammler> well then :-)
15:31:30  <PublicServer> <atdt> the total distance on the outer loop and inner loops are different
15:31:31  <Ammler> Thraxian|Work: all those things because I loaded a old save?
15:31:42  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> thrax, want me to band-aid that with the longer split?
15:32:02  <Ammler> or is that a general map issue?
15:32:04  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> Ammler: nope.  pre-existing
15:32:14  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> ZD: if you feel it necessary
15:32:19  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> this map is just about complete as it is
15:32:27  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I think it's smart
15:33:56  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> ZD: question for you
15:34:08  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> okay?
15:34:14  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> what about something like that?
15:34:18  <jonde> !password
15:34:18  <PublicServer> jonde: debuts
15:34:18  <PublicServer> <atdt> the backwards sml isn't really a problem
15:34:24  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> Still 4>2>3
15:34:27  <PublicServer> *** jondisti joined the game
15:34:32  <PublicServer> <atdt> because all trains get reshifted before the BBH
15:34:34  <PublicServer> <atdt> merges
15:34:38  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> backwards SML is a HUGE problem
15:34:50  <PublicServer> *** jondisti has left the game (connection lost)
15:34:56  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> the reshift is for the gaps that are created between the two
15:35:12  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> one thing "fixing" the problem later
15:35:16  <PublicServer> *** jondisti joined the game
15:35:16  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> does not make it not a problem
15:35:27  <PublicServer> <atdt> right but regardless, you're going to have a pretty homogenous train stream by the time you get to the bbh
15:35:41  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> no...
15:35:49  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> two shifts >>>>!> 1
15:36:34  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> ZD: see my change at MSH04
15:36:39  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I do
15:36:45  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> it may work for the moment
15:36:48  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> thoughts?
15:37:04  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> thoughts?.. let me show you wha I might change
15:37:54  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> I'd actually rework that entire part
15:38:06  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> each of the 4 ML should split to drop/pickup before merging anything
15:38:07  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and then fix it sooner
15:38:20  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> that's a lengthy rework
15:38:22  <PublicServer> <Chris Booth> i reworked the entire section from BBH 1.0 exit to 1.1 entrance
15:38:27  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> though would be useful
15:38:38  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> Awesome, thanks booth
15:39:46  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> thrax, see my minor change?
15:39:51  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> yes
15:39:52  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> need to make one more
15:40:07  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> but because the first was so favored by both
15:40:20  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> I still say make 8 tunnels for the 4 lines, then split before merging
15:40:27  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> that would work best
15:40:36  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I'm just not sure how to do that
15:40:46  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> but I need to go from here, practice shortly then leave
15:40:53  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> so I'll have to come back to this...
15:41:07  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> So if you're around late tonight
15:41:17  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and want help, I'll be around
15:41:22  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> maybe XD
15:41:50  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> But anyway, I'm gone fore now guys, piano practice then leave for lesson
15:41:53  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> *for
15:42:00  <PublicServer> *** ZarenorDarkstalker has joined spectators
15:42:10  <PublicServer> <atdt> play nice
15:42:11  <PublicServer> <atdt> :)
15:42:25  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I'll try.. I'm getting there
15:46:09  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> thrax, could you remove my suggestion signs?
15:46:19  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> nvm, got them as i was typing
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15:54:15  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> figured out what would make MSH04 much cleaner
15:54:42  <PublicServer> <atdt> whats that?
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15:55:07  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> fix the SML on the CCW loop
15:55:39  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> why are the merges to the CCW loop coming from the middle of the ML instead of the outside?
15:55:48  <PublicServer> <atdt> dunno, raz did them
15:55:50  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> the CW loop is always merged from the outside
15:55:59  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> 3 of the MSHs do that
15:56:08  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> the way I see it, you SML shift left or right, but not both
15:56:28  <PublicServer> <atdt> well i'm not entirely convinced that it is problematic
15:56:46  <PublicServer> <atdt> either way, the train stream becomes more homogenous and the trains are smoothly merged
15:56:57  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> haha - the SML at BBH4 is so good, the outer track is practically empty
15:57:31  <PublicServer> <atdt> it was the entry->exit signaling and the addition of some more penalties at the end of the sml
15:57:51  <PublicServer> <atdt> look at !aggressive
15:58:04  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> too aggressive
15:58:07  <PublicServer> <atdt> it may be a mistake to do that
15:58:08  <PublicServer> <atdt> yeah
15:58:18  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> I tried that - and failed just like the trains are waiting now
15:58:38  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> if a train ever chooses a full switcher instead of an empty line ahead, then it's too aggressive
15:58:41  <PublicServer> <atdt> the way it was before I changed it, the trains were jamming and all preferring the outer track
16:00:00  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> look near plondington
16:00:04  <PublicServer> <atdt> yeah
16:00:11  <PublicServer> <atdt> im seeing that
16:00:18  <PublicServer> <atdt> didnt see that before
16:00:25  <PublicServer> <atdt> watched it for like 15 minutes last night
16:00:28  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> hmmm...only happens sometimes
16:00:37  <PublicServer> <atdt> rarely
16:00:56  <PublicServer> <atdt> its only when a train is merging
16:00:57  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> but look past the bridges
16:00:58  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> nothing on line 1
16:01:02  <PublicServer> <atdt> right
16:01:04  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> haha
16:01:06  <PublicServer> <atdt> too aggressive
16:01:07  <PublicServer> <atdt> lol
16:01:21  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> look how line 4 jams at MSH04
16:01:28  <PublicServer> <atdt> which could cause a problem at the backwards sml as well
16:01:29  <PublicServer> <atdt> yeah
16:01:51  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> that's why I think MSH04 needs to move the merge to the other side of the ML
16:02:18  <PublicServer> <atdt> it would be a smoother way to do it on the northbound line, but not on the west line
16:02:29  <PublicServer> <atdt> it would be a long way to go around
16:03:20  <PublicServer> <atdt> look at from here to here to here to here, that would be fine
16:03:31  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> hmmm
16:03:42  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> I was thinking elsewhere
16:03:49  <PublicServer> <atdt> regardless, its a mess
16:03:56  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> see "tunnel here"
16:03:59  <PublicServer> <atdt> yeah
16:04:06  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> and not that bad
16:04:10  <PublicServer> <atdt> its a longer route though
16:04:15  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> not that bad
16:04:24  <PublicServer> <atdt> nope
16:04:51  <PublicServer> <atdt> so to build the exit, then reverse the sml...
16:07:01  <PublicServer> <atdt> i can't stay to fix this, i've got to practice before class
16:07:16  <PublicServer> <atdt> so if you feel like unmessing the mess, lovely
16:07:19  <PublicServer> <atdt> cheers
16:07:26  <PublicServer> <atdt> cya later
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16:11:51  <PublicServer> *** Game paused (not enough players)
16:16:20  <PublicServer> *** Game unpaused (enough players)
16:16:20  <PublicServer> *** SmatZ joined the game
16:16:24  <PublicServer> <SmatZ> hello
16:16:55  <Mark> evening
16:16:57  <Mark> hello SmatZ :)
16:17:25  <PublicServer> <SmatZ> hello Mark :)
16:17:51  <Mark> how come you're not playing on the pz? :P
16:18:06  <PublicServer> <SmatZ> I am not playing anywhere :(
16:18:39  <PublicServer> *** SmatZ has left the game (leaving)
16:18:39  <PublicServer> *** Game paused (not enough players)
16:20:06  <Mark> !info
16:20:07  <PublicServer> Mark: #:1(Orange) Company Name: '#OpenTTDCoop'  Year Founded: 1950  Money: 7607308519  Loan: 0  Value: 7651234683  (T:1500, R:0, P:0, S:0) unprotected
16:20:12  <Mark> 1500 trains..
16:20:22  <atdt> still running well
16:20:36  <Mark> who the hell makes a TL3 plan for a 512*1024 map
16:20:48  <atdt> a sodding genius
16:20:55  <Mark> imho this plan is perfectly suitable for longer trains
16:20:58  <Mark> ie TL7 or 9
16:21:27  <Cif> !password
16:21:27  <PublicServer> Cif: photon
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16:50:30  <Seppel> !password
16:50:31  <PublicServer> Seppel: circus
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18:28:06  <Zarenor> Thraxian|work, you around?
18:29:40  <Thraxian|Work> yup
18:29:47  <Thraxian|Work> still @work though :)
18:30:21  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> Hence the name.. I'm back from my lesson, so I'll be in and out if you want to both go active and work on some of it between ding what we should be?
18:30:28  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> *doing
18:30:46  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> or at least, what I should be
18:31:01  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> what would be the first thing we "fix"?
18:31:08  <hylje> everything
18:31:17  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> MSH04 west merge?
18:31:20  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I don't know, I have't gotten as far as priorizizing issues
18:31:28  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> where the shifters are backwards
18:31:29  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> *prioritizing
18:31:44  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> Up to you, like I said, I have to be in and out
18:31:54  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> something like here 5, gone for 5
18:32:06  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> or something similar
18:32:13  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> I say we work on that merge - that will clear up around MSH04 for some restructring
18:32:14  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> maybe 15/10
18:32:19  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> okay
18:32:20  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> then I think
18:32:25  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> well wait a sec whil i look
18:32:30  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> yeah
18:32:33  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> because the north->steel mill needs reworking
18:32:36  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I think we should move them away
18:32:43  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> see "tunnel here"
18:32:44  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> from there
18:32:48  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> that's what I'm thinking
18:32:58  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> further down the line
18:32:59  <PublicServer> *** Thraxian|Work has joined company #1
18:32:59  <PublicServer> *** Game unpaused (enough players)
18:33:03  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and spreading out the hub
18:33:08  <PublicServer> *** ZarenorDarkstalker has joined company #1
18:33:20  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> so, work backwards of forwards?
18:33:24  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> see "these two lines go west"
18:33:33  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> swing those wider, and tunnel at the "tunnel here sign"
18:33:43  <PublicServer> *** Spike joined the game
18:33:45  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> ooo
18:33:48  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> see.. I'd rather
18:33:53  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> not turn those north yet
18:34:02  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and jump them over the inbound
18:34:13  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> over there?
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18:34:24  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and then tunnel the mainline
18:34:29  <Rodster> OMG you guys really exist
18:34:30  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> near dennwell
18:34:40  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> hmmm
18:34:49  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> probably just the other side of dneewell
18:34:58  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and see, we could spread the mainline out
18:35:01  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> between dennwell and naningwell?
18:35:10  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> seperate the two directions by more until after the merge
18:35:14  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> right
18:35:15  <PublicServer> *** Spike has joined company #1
18:35:16  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> well..
18:35:21  <Rodster> just found out about openttd, love the work you guys have done, to keep one of my favorite games of all time alive
18:35:58  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> Rodster: actually, I just build.  I don't develop yet :)
18:36:12  <SmatZ> Rodster: great :)
18:36:13  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> but we do come up with some very interesting stuff :)
18:36:14  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> Thrax, see my signing?
18:36:27  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> ZD: not a big fan of that plan
18:36:32  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> much bigger footpring
18:36:35  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> er....print
18:36:41  <Rodster> wondering were i can find a new industry chart for the newgrf industries, still figuring that out
18:36:47  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> the outs will only be one or two lanes though...
18:36:52  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> which ones?  FIRS or ECS?
18:36:57  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> or the standard industries?
18:36:59  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> but i figures spreading out would decomplicate a lot of the issues we have
18:37:09  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> *figured
18:37:14  <PublicServer> <Spike> my bad
18:37:15  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> if you want to keep it tight, we certainly can
18:37:38  <^Spike^> !trains 1502
18:37:39  <PublicServer> *** ^Spike^ has set max_trains to 1502
18:37:40  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> should the CCW loop use the same SML (to the inside), or be left alone?
18:37:48  <Rodster> the ECS set
18:37:50  <KenjiE20> @ecs
18:37:50  <Webster> Extended Cargo Scheme, a patch that provides additional industry/cargo types. See
18:37:52  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> needs to be fixed
18:37:59  <Rodster> cool
18:38:07  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> alwayd either out>in or in<out the whole map
18:38:10  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> ooh - crashed train in the tunnel
18:38:13  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> did you do that?
18:38:16  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> where?
18:38:19  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> train 1063
18:38:20  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I haven't touched a train
18:38:23  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> in MSH04
18:38:32  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> I think someone removed signals at tunnel entrance
18:38:35  <PublicServer> <Spike> like i said my fault
18:38:40  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> oh, missed that
18:38:43  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> sorry :(
18:38:44  <Stoffe> !password
18:38:44  <PublicServer> Stoffe: sequin
18:38:51  <PublicServer> <Spike> thrax.. no use in using PBS when placing normal sigs right behind them
18:38:59  <PublicServer> <Spike> already replaced them btw
18:39:06  <PublicServer> *** Stoffe joined the game
18:39:22  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> ZD: that's what I was thinking
18:39:26  <Rodster> which is better? ECS or FIRS?
18:39:37  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> better is really a matter of opinion
18:39:40  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> which were you thinking? about the shift direction?
18:39:48  <KenjiE20> define 'better'
18:40:02  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> ZD: I meant about the westbound traffic from steel
18:40:24  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> so sign how you want to try it
18:40:31  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> Ive laid some sample rail
18:40:33  <Rodster> well ECS is very detailed? but im not a fan of the stockpile portion of it, does FIRS have the same thing?
18:40:34  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> that same wide out?
18:40:35  <PublicServer> <atdt> hi
18:40:37  <PublicServer> <atdt> im back
18:40:42  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> wb
18:40:45  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> ah
18:40:47  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> urgh
18:40:54  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I don't like it much...
18:40:56  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> kk
18:40:59  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> was just a thought
18:41:08  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> goes in the wrong direction for so long
18:41:13  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> but it'd work
18:41:15  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> it may be faster
18:41:17  <KenjiE20> might be better to ask in .devzone
18:41:17  *** LittleBoyRick has joined #openttdcoop
18:41:33  <LittleBoyRick> !players
18:41:35  <PublicServer> LittleBoyRick: Client 3 (Orange) is Thraxian|Work, in company 1 (#OpenTTDCoop)
18:41:35  <PublicServer> LittleBoyRick: Client 13 (Orange) is atdt, in company 1 (#OpenTTDCoop)
18:41:35  <PublicServer> LittleBoyRick: Client 15 (Orange) is ZarenorDarkstalker, in company 1 (#OpenTTDCoop)
18:41:36  <PublicServer> LittleBoyRick: Client 23 is Cif, a spectator
18:41:36  <PublicServer> LittleBoyRick: Client 28 (Orange) is Spike, in company 1 (#OpenTTDCoop)
18:41:37  <LittleBoyRick> !password
18:41:37  <PublicServer> LittleBoyRick: Client 30 (Orange) is Stoffe, in company 1 (#OpenTTDCoop)
18:41:37  <PublicServer> LittleBoyRick: sequin
18:41:38  <KenjiE20> the FIRS devs live there :)
18:41:55  <PublicServer> *** LittleBoyRick joined the game
18:42:04  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> to be honest, the steel should flow the other direction
18:42:05  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> Thrax: what if we swung the inbound wider?
18:42:12  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> that might alleviate quite a bit also
18:42:35  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> wait
18:42:36  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> hold on
18:42:43  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> look where steel merges as well
18:42:53  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> those shifters are backwards as well
18:42:56  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> northbound
18:42:58  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> not really
18:43:04  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> that whole CCW loop is backwards
18:43:13  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> same at BBH1
18:43:18  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> ah.. really?
18:43:25  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> sec
18:43:26  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> and MSH01 (oil+woods)
18:43:41  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> and BBH2
18:44:01  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> actually, everywhere on the CCW loop
18:44:11  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> the whole thing?...
18:44:11  <PublicServer> <Spike> outside loop shifts out
18:44:12  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> okay
18:44:14  *** highpinger has quit IRC
18:44:19  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> although I think it's very inconsistent with the other direction
18:44:39  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> i agree, I think it's stupid, but I didn't see a specification in the plan, so however it got built
18:44:49  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> it should shift IN ( to the left) to match the other direction
18:44:59  <PublicServer> <atdt> next time SML is in the plan this should be specified
18:44:59  <PublicServer> *** Stoffe has left the game (connection lost)
18:45:05  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> it should be
18:45:06  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> that would be a rather large rework :(
18:45:13  <PublicServer> <Spike> inside loop shifts out aswel mostly
18:45:17  <PublicServer> <Spike> just not at a few spots
18:45:21  *** Kupuham has joined #openttdcoop
18:45:25  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> inside loop only shifts out once
18:45:25  <PublicServer> *** Stoffe joined the game
18:45:26  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> That would be a massive rewprk
18:45:27  <Kupuham> !info
18:45:27  <PublicServer> Kupuham: #:1(Orange) Company Name: '#OpenTTDCoop'  Year Founded: 1950  Money: 7735944051  Loan: 0  Value: 7774742471  (T:1500, R:0, P:0, S:0) unprotected
18:45:45  <PublicServer> <atdt> i dont see the point of doing huge reworks of this station when it hasn't had any significant proplems yet
18:45:46  <PublicServer> <Spike> the one heading W?
18:45:54  <PublicServer> <Spike> that one shifts in
18:45:56  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> the rest of the inside loop has been built to shift in...
18:45:59  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> it backs up line 4 from the north
18:46:03  <PublicServer> <atdt> besides it being a lot of fun
18:46:05  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> atdt: it's CAUSING problems
18:46:06  <PublicServer> <atdt> where?
18:46:10  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> not having them
18:46:13  <PublicServer> *** Stoffe has left the game (connection lost)
18:46:14  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> BBH 4
18:46:23  <PublicServer> <Spike> you mean !these? shifters
18:46:23  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> see "! backups occur here"
18:46:42  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> Spike: yes, those
18:46:42  <PublicServer> <atdt> ah
18:46:44  <PublicServer> <atdt> i see
18:46:47  <PublicServer> <Spike> those shift in
18:46:49  <PublicServer> *** Stoffe joined the game
18:47:05  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> ah, so it depends as to how you define in
18:47:06  <PublicServer> <Spike> almost the whole inner loop shifts out.. but the one @ !these? shifts in
18:47:10  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> Spike: yes - see the sign "!SHIFTERS BACKWARDS!"
18:47:11  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> in asrelative to the traffic, not the loop
18:47:17  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> just east of !these?
18:47:22  <PublicServer> <Spike> in means as in to the center of the map :)
18:47:26  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> there's the backup
18:47:33  <PublicServer> *** Kupuham joined the game
18:47:36  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> shift IN means to the center of the ML
18:47:37  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> right.. Thrax and I are speaking relative to the traffic
18:47:41  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> not the center of of the map
18:47:53  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> if you speak center to the map, those shift in and the rest of the loop shifts out
18:47:56  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> maybe we should say shifts LEFT
18:48:06  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> LEFT/RIGHT makes more sense than IN/OUT
18:48:26  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> the CW loop shifts LEFT(except near MSH04).  The CCW loop shifts RIGHT
18:48:34  <PublicServer> <Spike> ?
18:48:39  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> I think 9 is the boundary for TL3
18:49:09  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I think so
18:49:15  <Zarenor> !tunnels 9 3
18:49:15  <PublicServer> Zarenor: You need 2 tunnels/bridges for trainlength 9 and gap 3.
18:49:19  <Zarenor> !tunnels 3 9
18:49:19  <PublicServer> Zarenor: You need 2 tunnels/bridges for trainlength 3 and gap 9.
18:49:22  <Zarenor> !tunnels 3 10
18:49:23  <PublicServer> Zarenor: You need 3 tunnels/bridges for trainlength 3 and gap 10.
18:49:26  <Zarenor> yup
18:49:32  <Zarenor> according to !tunnels anyway
18:49:51  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> Thrax
18:49:58  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> ZD?
18:50:01  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> better, less debatable fix
18:50:06  <atdt> why not just always shift left regardless of direction in the future?
18:50:08  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> merge before split entry
18:50:19  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> atdt: that's typical
18:50:20  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> with drive on right, we should always shift left.
18:50:26  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> usually what is assumed
18:50:42  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I don't know why outside loop was assumed opposite
18:50:47  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> no clue
18:50:53  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> so - project #1....
18:51:01  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> move the merge at MSH04 while fixing the shifters?
18:51:10  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> It can be
18:51:13  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> stupid question
18:51:20  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> or fix merge before split inbound?
18:51:23  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> can we straighten out the coal/iron entrance
18:51:31  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> make it cross the ML at tutburg
18:51:43  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> wait
18:51:48  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> let's make a ML bypass split
18:51:55  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> for CW loop
18:52:01  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> so we have room to work
18:52:02  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> eh?
18:52:15  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> near the antenna north of MSH
18:52:26  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> split off those going to the MSH
18:52:29  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and those going past
18:52:30  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> hmm...
18:52:37  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> so we have less trains disrupted
18:52:43  <^Spike^> !trains 1500
18:52:44  <PublicServer> *** ^Spike^ has set max_trains to 1500
18:52:45  <PublicServer> <atdt> check !raise this up
18:52:47  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> at least until we finish work, if not permanently
18:52:54  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> yeah, I see that
18:53:15  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> that'd be hard to do
18:53:19  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> with the diagonal track
18:53:35  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> see my sign?
18:53:38  <PublicServer> <atdt> yeah
18:53:52  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> raise there too?
18:53:55  <PublicServer> <atdt> i'm saying raise the whole thing
18:53:56  <PublicServer> <atdt> yeah
18:53:58  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> let's do this instead....
18:54:03  <PublicServer> <atdt> because it raises later anyway
18:54:08  <PublicServer> <Spike> atleast you guys don't take the spike approach to redoing big parts of network.. ;)
18:54:19  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> what approach is that?
18:54:28  <PublicServer> <Spike> *gets dynamite ready*
18:54:29  <PublicServer> <Spike> ;)
18:54:31  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> ahhhh
18:54:40  <PublicServer> <Spike> i just bomb the incoming trains so they can't enter that part
18:54:51  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I lie that approach sometimes, but most of what Thrax does reuses large chunks, so there's no need for that
18:55:00  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> *like
18:55:08  <PublicServer> <Spike> some psgs ago i just bomb a whole station exit :D
18:55:15  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and I've been leeching off of Thrax since i came back to playing
18:55:16  <PublicServer> <Spike> was the big drop.. was no other choice
18:55:43  <PublicServer> <Kupuham> Btw, max trains was 1500 already
18:55:57  <PublicServer> <Spike> i know
18:56:01  <PublicServer> <Spike> and it was 1502 ;)
18:56:05  <PublicServer> <Spike> had to replace 2 :D
18:56:09  <PublicServer> <Spike> so put it back on 1500
18:56:14  <PublicServer> <Kupuham> oh
18:56:55  <PublicServer> <atdt> these waiting lanes at BBH4.0. what purpose do they serve?
18:56:57  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> Thrax, where are ytou working at the moment?
18:57:02  <PublicServer> <atdt> why not merge like all the other sml's?
18:57:08  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> wait lanes where?
18:57:17  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> more space-effieient
18:57:21  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> *efficient
18:57:36  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> forces trains to switch most of the time
18:57:47  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> when done correctly
18:57:53  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> regardless of space
18:58:13  <PublicServer> <atdt> well its not... when a train merges and there's another train coming close behind on the merge target, it forces the train behind to wait
18:58:24  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> why do we want foced outer line use?
18:58:26  <PublicServer> <atdt> because the prios are too short
18:58:26  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> yes
18:58:31  <PublicServer> <atdt> the outer line was empty
18:58:39  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> no, that's as intended with that type of merge
18:58:48  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and it should be
18:58:55  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> once we get more traffic it won't be
18:58:58  <PublicServer> <Spike> you'll get a double red when trains are close on each other..
18:59:01  <PublicServer> <atdt> okie dokie
18:59:04  <PublicServer> <Spike> creating slow downs on the ML
18:59:12  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> the BBH isn't fully loaded, just the SLH
18:59:17  <PublicServer> <atdt> i think the waiting lines aren't helping anything
18:59:27  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> just a different type of shift
18:59:32  <Thraxian|Work> sorry - afk a sec, phone and email
18:59:38  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> np
18:59:42  <PublicServer> <Spike> the normal shifters don't create slow downs on the ML
19:00:01  <PublicServer> <atdt> -agree
19:00:07  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> some people prefer the one thats been used iun other places (mark) and people copy those people because it works, I prefer this type most cases
19:00:26  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> but either type has it's merits
19:00:27  <PublicServer> <atdt> if the prios on this were longer it would be fine, but they arent, and it forces slowdowns on the ml
19:00:43  <PublicServer> <atdt> there are two slowdown cases
19:00:50  <PublicServer> <atdt> not just that one that you're signing
19:01:02  <Donno> !password
19:01:03  <PublicServer> Donno: batter
19:01:08  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> that's because someone made those entry/exit signals
19:01:09  <PublicServer> <Spike> just check my signs
19:01:12  <PublicServer> *** Donno joined the game
19:01:15  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> they were PBS
19:01:21  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and you had less of that
19:01:22  <PublicServer> <atdt> it was happening worse with the pbs
19:01:32  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> then an interval may have been changed
19:01:50  <PublicServer> <atdt> this issue would be nonexistent with a straight merge
19:01:53  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> someone check the pbs_backoff_interval, will you?
19:01:59  <^Spike^> !setdef
19:02:00  <PublicServer> *** ^Spike^ has disabled wait_for_pbs_path, wait_twoway_signal, wait_oneway_signal, ai_in_multiplayer enabled no_servicing_if_no_breakdowns, extra_dynamite, mod_road_rebuild, forbid_90_deg and set path_backoff_interval to 1, train_acceleration_model to 1
19:02:32  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> thanks spike.. that's a long list of things
19:03:11  <PublicServer> <atdt> show me what signals you want on the last merge there and i'll set them all back
19:03:25  <^Spike^> !trains 1503
19:03:26  <PublicServer> *** ^Spike^ has set max_trains to 1503
19:03:35  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I'm not worried abpout it unless is slows something down
19:03:40  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> *about
19:03:50  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I prefer to use oneway PBS there
19:03:56  <Thraxian|Work> kk - back (for now)
19:04:28  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and no signal except the entry on the shift, or, if you want it to clear faster(shift even more) a block or oneway PBS one block into the shift
19:04:30  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> wb
19:05:21  <PublicServer> *** Donno has left the game (connection lost)
19:06:13  <PublicServer> <Spike> look near !sample for a moment
19:06:28  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> watching there
19:06:31  <PublicServer> <Spike> normally trains compressed good are like 2 tiles apart..
19:06:37  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I'm building that example
19:06:46  *** Progman has quit IRC
19:06:58  <PublicServer> <atdt> it just happened, a train merging slowed the ml
19:07:01  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> these trains have too poor accel for that
19:07:05  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I saw it
19:07:06  <PublicServer> <atdt> that is going to happen a lot on a packed ML
19:07:08  <PublicServer> <Spike> i've built one with trains @ W of !sample :)
19:07:12  <PublicServer> <atdt> with the pbs one too
19:07:19  <PublicServer> <atdt> even at full speed it happens
19:07:37  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> that slowing is because of this type of train
19:07:47  <PublicServer> <atdt> there must be a better way
19:07:48  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> longer prio would mean less of that
19:07:51  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and more gap
19:07:54  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and less shifting
19:08:06  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> why was the PBS removed in favor of pre/post?
19:08:09  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> better way would have been choosing a faster train/trainset
19:08:13  <PublicServer> <Spike> i wasn't objecting the shift.. more the trains that stay on ML :)
19:08:13  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> did pbs cause slowdowns too?
19:08:16  <PublicServer> <atdt> yeah
19:08:28  <PublicServer> <atdt> the whole thing was jammed up on the merge
19:08:48  <PublicServer> <atdt> the trains werent shifting
19:09:00  <PublicServer> <atdt> so i added some more penalties and converted to entry/exit
19:09:11  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> that is some pretty awesome shifting though
19:09:15  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and nearly the original plan for ht eones used
19:09:19  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> I love watching trains shift 3 times consecutively
19:09:27  <PublicServer> <atdt> its running well
19:09:53  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> some of those slowdowns
19:09:58  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> aren't acused by trains shifting
19:10:04  <PublicServer> <Spike> why is the train that just joined the track shifting in btw...
19:10:08  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> some are caused by the entry jam
19:10:19  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> because it should if there is room
19:10:25  <PublicServer> *** LittleBoyRick has left the game (leaving)
19:10:29  <PublicServer> <Spike> there is room in front of him
19:10:31  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> because the traffic should eventually be so high
19:10:33  <PublicServer> <atdt> i dont know why Z, but it wasn't shifting
19:10:37  <PublicServer> <atdt> the inner line was empty
19:10:47  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> very strainge
19:10:48  <PublicServer> <atdt> yeah
19:10:53  <PublicServer> <atdt> adding the penalties fixed that
19:11:09  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I'd have had to see it to make an informed guess though, so as long as this works, I'm not going to screw with it
19:11:16  <PublicServer> <atdt> i suspect that would have solved the problem by itself, and the entry/exit signals wouldn't have made a diff
19:11:32  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> ZD: look near the "!raise this up" sign
19:11:41  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> Thrax, shall we work on that entry, or the exit?
19:11:45  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> would that be tighter?
19:12:14  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> would doing what be tighter?
19:12:16  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> oh
19:12:17  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> sec
19:12:23  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> see "!sample"
19:12:24  <PublicServer> <atdt> you could easily just bridge instead of tunnel
19:12:33  <PublicServer> <Spike> btw where did 24 trains go>
19:12:34  <PublicServer> <Spike> ?
19:12:35  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> bridge/tunnel?
19:12:41  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> is that a double shifter?
19:12:45  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> or...
19:12:50  <PublicServer> <atdt> they were left over from an experiment that appears to have been rolled back at some point
19:12:53  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> wait, I'm working on comprehension here
19:12:55  <PublicServer> <atdt> i had gotten rid of them
19:12:58  <PublicServer> <Spike> ah
19:13:06  <^Spike^> !trains 1500
19:13:06  <PublicServer> *** ^Spike^ has set max_trains to 1500
19:13:16  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> ah
19:13:30  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I think it would be, but I'm not sure how much improvement that would be
19:13:40  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I think they should split earlier on the ML personally
19:13:52  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> we could tunnel from tutburg across
19:14:00  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> or bridge (which we can't do now because of all the bridges)
19:14:06  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> Right
19:14:18  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> that's the furthest we can bridge now
19:14:29  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> and we'd need 12
19:14:47  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> that's sick and insane
19:14:50  <PublicServer> <Spike> you got enough space to bridge
19:14:58  <PublicServer> * Spike looks back at a different psg
19:14:59  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> let me see if I have this straight though
19:15:01  <PublicServer> <Spike> insane? :)
19:15:02  <PublicServer> <Spike> nah... :)
19:15:24  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> Spike: not in the literal sense, I know we've had much bigger groups
19:15:44  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> we're looking at rerouting the station entry, correct?
19:15:55  <PublicServer> <Spike> i remember a place where we had a SLH with eh... 24 tunnels :)
19:17:39  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> so if we're hypothetically looking at that why not...
19:18:05  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> one sec, beginning signing near !proposal
19:18:23  <PublicServer> <Spike> if you want to you even got space to mix trains so they use all stations
19:18:58  <PublicServer> <Spike> erail
19:20:42  <PublicServer> <Kupuham> Why tunnels?
19:20:52  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> under the forest
19:20:57  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> can't bridgeindustries
19:21:03  <PublicServer> <Kupuham> I mean near MSH 04
19:21:04  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> *bridge industries
19:21:19  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> just various ideas there
19:21:34  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> atdt was thinking of raising that split
19:21:38  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and tunneling the exit under
19:21:53  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and I'm not against that
19:22:27  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> but thrax doesn't like the idea.. so we're throwing out as many as we can come up with
19:22:57  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> general rule: building major hubs anyone can do, modifying them requires consensus among those on
19:23:19  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Sensible
19:23:27  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> unless it's causing lockups
19:24:06  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> in current situation, it's not completely urgent, so we have not immediate need to modify it, therefore, we have to come to some consensus
19:24:16  <PublicServer> <atdt> i like the tunnel under the forest idea
19:24:22  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> at, you like my idea?
19:24:24  <PublicServer> <atdt> that should happen first, freeing space for other work
19:24:25  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> alrigt
19:24:31  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> exactly, after that
19:24:39  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> we can move all kinds of stuff around if we anted
19:24:45  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> *wanted
19:25:06  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I want to make the MSH bigger so we can work easier, thrax wants to keep the footprint small
19:25:26  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I haven't come up with my way to keep it small yet
19:25:58  <PublicServer> <atdt> yeah i dont see any way except taking the steel line back out the way it comes in
19:26:12  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I'd rather reverse steel flow
19:26:14  <PublicServer> <atdt> and rotating the pickups
19:26:22  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> or have a station that flows one way for one half
19:26:30  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and the other way for the other half
19:26:57  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> if we have from two directions
19:27:04  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> the drop for example...
19:27:46  <PublicServer> <Spike> :)
19:27:54  <PublicServer> <Spike> basicly the same
19:27:57  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> Who is building that example?
19:28:02  <PublicServer> <Spike> moi
19:28:05  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> me first
19:28:06  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> ah, okay
19:28:19  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> that one,, okay
19:28:20  <PublicServer> <Spike> the that works too signed one is well my interp :)
19:28:45  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> so, can we try my proposal, or try thrax's?
19:28:49  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> mine signals like that
19:29:01  <PublicServer> <atdt> aye yay yay
19:29:28  <PublicServer> <Kupuham> why do you make one bridge longer?
19:29:47  <PublicServer> <Kupuham> (then it could be)
19:30:01  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> my example will fit in the space marked "from here" "to here"
19:30:10  <PublicServer> <atdt> all of the bridges are one longer than they could be
19:30:13  <PublicServer> <Kupuham> ah, ok
19:30:14  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> leaving lots of space for ML bridging/tunneling
19:30:18  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> before the split occurs
19:30:37  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> could even be worked a bit more to make it tighter at entrance
19:30:41  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Is there any way to get rid of a stupid radio tower?
19:30:47  <PublicServer> <atdt> nuclear weapons
19:30:58  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> magic bulldozer
19:31:15  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Anyone got a nuke handy?
19:31:21  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> with some syncing
19:31:22  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> I'll pay 10 billion for it
19:32:53  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> that makes it a bit longer though
19:33:12  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> Thrax: I think that works, but I still would rather make the split earlier
19:33:38  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> but I'm not sure everyone wants to move it.. os that certainly may be the better option for now
19:35:36  <PublicServer> <atdt> i dont know guys
19:35:44  <PublicServer> <atdt> no easy way to do this
19:36:06  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> so, split before dennwell?
19:36:25  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> reorganize the whole MSH
19:36:34  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> sometime before dennwell
19:36:37  <PublicServer> <atdt> yeah basically it just has to be reorganized
19:36:44  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> for sure, but I'd think maybe earler
19:40:30  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> see "MSH simplified"
19:40:35  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> okay
19:41:39  <PublicServer> <atdt> makes sense to me...
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19:48:51  <PublicServer> <Spike> plan of attack been made?
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19:49:03  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> may I assist at BBH4?
19:49:19  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> What's goin on at BBH 4?
19:49:23  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> line 3
19:49:28  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> ah
19:49:32  <PublicServer> <atdt> ooh line 3
19:49:54  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I was still waiting forMSH 4 consensus
19:50:27  <atdt> you should have a north pickup or a west pickup, not both
19:50:30  <atdt> there's no need for both
19:51:00  <PublicServer> <atdt> and since the north is so much closer
19:51:01  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> north is the one needed
19:51:04  <PublicServer> <atdt> yup
19:51:11  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker>  i't bd smpi
19:51:18  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> sec
19:51:25  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> kboard issues
19:51:48  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I didn't build the simplified, I thought it ws just to make a point
19:51:59  <atdt> oic
19:52:13  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> I built simplified
19:52:37  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I thought you did, figured it was point-making, notperfect example
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19:58:02  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> should we rebuild shifter array at BBH4 (northbound) to match the southbound one?
19:58:27  <PublicServer> <atdt> there are no trains using it
19:58:29  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Ah, you mean with inline waiting tracks instead of side passbys?
19:58:32  <Osai> !revision
19:58:32  <PublicServer> Osai: Game version is r17779
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19:58:49  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> steel trains use that line
19:59:17  <PeterT> hi\
19:59:41  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> I think it's fine as is - but if you want to do the rebuild, go ahead... :)
19:59:55  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> bigger fish to fry
20:00:02  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Indeed
20:03:34  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> so, can we begin building something in the way of MSH 04?
20:03:54  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I've been waiting to do something, and have just about run out of time
20:04:06  <PublicServer> * Spike gets bulldozer out..
20:04:11  <PublicServer> <atdt> go for it man
20:04:14  <PublicServer> <Spike> or no... stopping traffic? :)
20:04:15  <PublicServer> <atdt> i gotta go practice
20:04:29  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> if I can just go ahead with my idea and let peopledo what they will with it
20:04:40  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> ah - go ahead....
20:04:43  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> myfull idea involves built-in bpasses for later reworks
20:04:44  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> it would take some demo
20:04:50  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> trying to keep the tunnels looking straighter
20:04:56  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> let be build the bypasses
20:05:04  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> *me
20:06:59  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> yes, ugly TF, I'll fix some later
20:07:28  <PublicServer> <Spike> roughly the line ;)
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20:09:03  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> see BBH4 merge now
20:09:13  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Pretty
20:11:26  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> current bypass will be nonfinal
20:11:35  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> because I'm going to go ahead and downmerge it
20:11:49  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> until I have time to come back and rework the shifters and this join
20:13:02  <PublicServer> <Spike> going to change shifters as well btw?
20:13:11  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> not atm
20:13:17  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> don't have that much time
20:13:23  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> maybe later tonight
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20:14:16  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> you mean the shifters near SLH 4.0^0
20:14:18  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> ?
20:14:21  <PublicServer> <Spike> well if tracks are on the outside i can prepare most of them.. or have to do a hack now to get the inner traacks to the outside..
20:14:30  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> no, the ones after MSH 4 going WB
20:14:35  <PublicServer> <Spike> idd
20:14:48  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> ah
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20:17:01  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> what can I be helping with?
20:17:05  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> lesee
20:17:22  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I'm working near one of the MSH bypass sigens
20:17:35  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> or you can work on the shifters
20:17:38  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> or...
20:17:51  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> my proposal for the station entrance rework
20:18:02  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> let me know if it isn't detailed enough
20:18:11  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> steel will reverse direction, right?
20:18:14  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I expect it not to be
20:18:19  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> it can
20:18:34  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I hadn't said anythng about that, either way is fine with me
20:18:43  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> and when we merge to northbound, will we merge from right or left?
20:19:25  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> left, because they shift right
20:19:41  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> CCW loop shifts out, CW in
20:19:46  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> or, rather
20:19:47  <PublicServer> *** Stoffe has left the game (connection lost)
20:19:52  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> right, left
20:20:00  *** georg has left #openttdcoop
20:20:01  <KenjiE20> confooosment
20:20:13  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> you can say that again
20:20:15  <PublicServer> *** Stoffe joined the game
20:20:32  <KenjiE20> conff.f.. no I can't :P
20:20:41  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> ah
20:20:41  *** PeterT has quit IRC
20:20:44  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> okay then
20:20:56  <jonde> !password
20:20:56  <PublicServer> jonde: forges
20:21:05  <PublicServer> *** jondisti joined the game
20:24:51  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> SLH4 is loooong now... four joiners. :)
20:25:08  <PublicServer> *** Stoffe has left the game (connection lost)
20:25:18  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> ugh
20:25:26  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> seems a bit unnecessary, TBH
20:25:33  <PublicServer> *** jondisti has left the game (leaving)
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20:26:03  <PublicServer> *** Stoffe joined the game
20:26:09  <Stoffe> Actually, with three, it jammed from time to time
20:26:32  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Hard to keep the joiners equalized
20:26:33  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> bypass completed
20:26:38  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> sortof
20:27:01  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> to be seperated after the rework, keeping in mind that the bypass will be the ML and should be treated as such
20:27:07  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> or will be removed
20:27:16  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> depending on the consensus..
20:29:28  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> can I temporarily (and quickly) stop eastbound trains on the ML near MSH04?
20:29:45  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> or redirect them to a single line?
20:29:48  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> Sure
20:29:52  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I'd vote single..
20:30:00  <PublicServer> * Spike likes stopage
20:30:03  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I have N trains not going into the hub on t lines
20:30:05  <PublicServer> <Spike> but i guess most don't agree with me :D
20:30:11  <PublicServer> <Spike> i like to have a clean work space :)
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20:30:42  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> I like to  mass dynamite with trains still on the tracks... that's a real challenge
20:30:55  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> =P
20:31:06  <PublicServer> <Spike> i usually just stop the front trains :)
20:33:09  <PublicServer> <atdt> dear lord
20:33:12  <PublicServer> <atdt> ML superjam
20:33:20  <PublicServer> <Spike> that all?
20:33:26  <PublicServer> <Spike> his is nothing.. :)
20:33:29  <PublicServer> <Spike> this*
20:33:32  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> It will get bigger
20:33:41  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> mohahaha
20:33:57  <PublicServer> <Spike> it's big when trains from here to factory drop are jamming
20:34:00  <PublicServer> <Spike> so the whole outer ring
20:34:03  <PublicServer> <Spike> then it's big :)
20:34:21  <PublicServer> <Kupuham> Oh, it was worse for the oil/sawmill drop
20:34:26  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Will take ages to clear though
20:35:54  <PublicServer> *** Stoffe has left the game (connection lost)
20:36:36  <PublicServer> *** Stoffe joined the game
20:37:27  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> And there the jam reached the shifters at bbh1
20:37:57  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> Thrax
20:38:04  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> what are you working on at the moment?
20:38:27  <PublicServer> <Kupuham> And there is the jam gone =0
20:39:04  <PublicServer> <Spike> define gone.. ;)
20:39:20  <PublicServer> <Kupuham> Not there till somebody changed it again? =D
20:39:26  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> who is working under the  9 bridges?
20:39:42  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Well, all the trains are moving again... that's not too bad a jam
20:39:55  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> see "from west to steel"
20:40:08  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> okay....
20:40:13  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> thoughts?
20:40:20  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> sorry about the jam - I did warn you
20:40:25  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> that lloks like notrh to steel at the moment, or am I mixed up
20:40:33  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> no worries there
20:40:36  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> that's what i said :)
20:40:36  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> *looks
20:40:44  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> okay
20:40:51  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I don't as yet have that connected
20:40:58  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> or rather, not fully altered
20:41:00  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> one sec
20:41:15  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> so, assuming reversal
20:41:24  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> it makes sense to
20:41:30  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> right now, steel is doing figure-8
20:41:30  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> sure does
20:41:33  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> instead of a simple loop
20:41:52  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> those that I'm assuming you pus in to stop the useless squiggle
20:41:56  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> *put
20:42:28  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> go ahead and make them so, and connect that as an auxilliary with a bw signal to stop trains from pathfinding down it
20:43:29  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> there, that's simpler
20:44:07  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> so, we'll switch the north and west drop platforms?
20:44:12  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> that sounds like a bad idea :(
20:44:17  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> no, they don't switch
20:44:31  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> kk
20:44:33  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> north dropis unaffected
20:44:40  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> where does west drop lane 1 get trains from?
20:44:41  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> by my current iteration
20:44:47  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> right now, nowere
20:44:52  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> it's connected somewhere else
20:45:08  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> through magic
20:45:13  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I'm about to connect is somewhere, but I was assuming outermost two lanes of ML
20:45:20  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> incoming from west
20:45:29  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> so, we are splitting west lines before denwell, right?
20:45:30  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> which will also be rerouted at a later date
20:45:36  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> and that's where west drop lane 1 will come from
20:45:39  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> that was my assumption
20:46:08  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Shouldn't all four ml's be hooked up to west drop lane 1?
20:46:15  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> see that proposed line?
20:46:16  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> no
20:46:18  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> just 2
20:46:22  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and 2 to lane 2
20:46:25  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Ah
20:46:27  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> that isn't built yet
20:46:31  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> :)
20:46:46  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> gotcha
20:46:59  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> see that thrax?
20:47:13  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> so yours reworks N and mine W
20:47:17  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> that works well
20:47:29  <Kupuham> Anybody know how hard it is to make the UI accept numbers bigger then 999?
20:47:40  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> though you may be able to get rid of a lot of those bridges after we're fully diverted
20:47:59  <Kupuham> (Not really accept, but display in a more neat manner, they jumble up with the graphics)
20:48:47  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> grr...I hate those steel exit lines
20:48:59  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> they make my ore entry much longer than necessary :(
20:49:20  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> lol, oops
20:49:21  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> redir them
20:49:30  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> or close the station temporarily
20:49:42  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> del a square in the entry, and prepare to reverse flow
20:49:53  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> let the treains run around the loop until we get done
20:49:58  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> no jams, just lost trains
20:50:16  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> does that make sense?
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20:52:36  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> can I do as I said, so divert the steel for you thrax?
20:53:16  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> so you can just kill that exit until  the  entry is finished?
20:53:50  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> West drop lane 1 done - just needs  a single track to be operational
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20:54:07  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> those are fine stoffe, connect them
20:54:18  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> They're live
20:54:23  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> First train inbound
20:54:31  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I was just too lazty to do that much, and if someone doesn't agree, simple to reverse
20:54:41  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> awesome
20:54:58  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> soon as this west clears
20:55:03  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I'll delete it
20:55:57  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> You can always delete it immediately, that'll just send the trains for another spin round the ml
20:56:03  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> :)
20:56:10  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> I just had to be sure noone was on the line
20:56:16  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Ah
20:56:56  <PublicServer> <atdt> might have well have
20:56:58  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> So, west drop lane 2, should that start from the ml at the same place as lane 1
20:57:05  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> ?
20:57:08  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> yup
20:57:09  <PublicServer> <atdt> this giant crazy junction reminds me of my life
20:57:12  <PublicServer> <atdt> :p
20:57:18  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> I can start on that then. :)
20:57:26  <PublicServer> <atdt> im sad to see it put right
20:57:28  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> if you like
20:58:02  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> "I like the simple stuff - maybe because I am a simple man"... ;-P
20:58:07  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> grrr...
20:58:10  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> need help with this split
20:58:26  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> "from north to steel" splits to "north drop 1" "north drop 2" and "steel this way"
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20:58:52  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> I'm thinking a drop/pickup split first, then merge the 4 drop lines to the two platform sets
20:59:02  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> i just can't visualize it right nwo
20:59:05  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> now
20:59:06  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Yeah, sounds reasonable
20:59:27  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> see the west drop inbounds...
20:59:28  <PublicServer> *** Stoffe has left the game (connection lost)
21:00:06  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> so, we need a way to split all 4 into 3 lines?
21:00:17  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> sounds like a 4->3 LB
21:00:19  <PublicServer> *** Stoffe joined the game
21:00:24  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and thy'll Pf their way in
21:00:37  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> *they
21:00:46  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> so maybe double each line, go 4>8>6
21:00:54  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> but I gtg for now
21:01:03  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> sorry to leave you hanging for the moment
21:01:53  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> but I have a celebration to get ready for, ceremony for the soccer league I'm a coach in
21:02:01  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> so, I'm off for now
21:02:03  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Cool
21:02:04  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> bye
21:02:22  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> Feel free to delete my signs, they may be useless now that we're building around whatever we have
21:02:45  <PublicServer> <ZarenorDarkstalker> and good luck, I will be back later
21:02:52  <PublicServer> *** ZarenorDarkstalker has joined spectators
21:03:18  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> How is this supposed to work...? :)
21:03:49  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Argh, spike, your build first, think second strategy doesn't work for me. :)
21:04:12  *** Wurzel49 has quit IRC
21:04:13  <^Spike^> was that my strategy?
21:04:26  <^Spike^> i plan.. only i don't build a plan when building :)
21:04:44  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Well... then I'm mistaken... sorry. :P
21:09:34  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> West lane 2 is done
21:09:41  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> -ish
21:10:27  <PublicServer> *** Stoffe has left the game (connection lost)
21:11:20  <PublicServer> *** Stoffe joined the game
21:12:55  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> is steel pickup being reversed, or am I missing something here...?
21:13:07  <PublicServer> <Spike> i wouldn't do that...
21:13:15  <PublicServer> <Spike> but that's my opinion
21:13:19  <PublicServer> <Spike> don't know the plan
21:13:38  <PublicServer> <Spike> cause it would mean rebuilding entrance/exit since you can't keep the pre sig bypass like that
21:14:02  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> I think only ZD knew the plan... ;-P
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21:15:36  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> I'll remove the last remnants of the old W ore entry
21:15:43  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> If noone objects
21:18:10  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> I'd like to reverse steel station
21:18:17  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> :P
21:18:28  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> the old presignal bypass stuff is obsolete with PBS
21:18:35  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> so I don't know why it keeps getting built
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21:19:35  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Well... I agree that it's a major undertaking, but then so is all of this
21:19:36  <hylje> old traditions die out slowly
21:19:45  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> look near that temp sign
21:19:56  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> how does that look for the pickup/drop split?
21:20:00  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> And reversing will make it better
21:20:17  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Well, what happens if there's two steel trains after each other on the same incoming track?
21:20:33  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> They'll have to wait, due to the lower capacity over the bridges
21:20:36  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> right?
21:20:39  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> bridges are for ore
21:20:44  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> and it's a banacer
21:20:46  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> er..balancer
21:20:47  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Well, ore then
21:21:15  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> But from each incoming, there's only one path to the outgoing, right?
21:21:31  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> from each incoming line, there's one to platform set 1, and one to platform set 2
21:21:47  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> And that only line will cross a bridge in most cases
21:22:02  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> So if two follow each other and pick the same way...
21:22:03  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> you've lost me
21:22:11  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> I'll try to sign it then
21:22:26  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> It might be nothing, just my poor understanding of balancers and the pathfinding
21:24:15  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> north drop 1 and 2 go to the same station
21:24:22  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> so it's your basic balancer
21:24:45  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Yes, but are the trains smart enough to not follow each other, and thus block the third train going to the other station?
21:24:59  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> if the other line is clear, it should be smart enough
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21:25:18  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Yes, it _should_
21:25:50  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> But all I'm saying is: can you couble the bridges easily?
21:25:56  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> That'll solve all the problems
21:26:05  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Then the trains can be as stupid as they'd like
21:26:50  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> I think it could be done with minor mods to your plan... but you just blew it  up. :/
21:26:58  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> there was no space
21:27:21  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Ah, yeah
21:27:22  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> True
21:27:28  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> I only saw the one on the W edge
21:27:48  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> But the thought looks good to me
21:27:57  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> how do you make 4 lines go to two sets of platforms
21:28:04  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> with balancing (which is missing on west platforms)
21:28:23  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> 4>2 merger, right?
21:28:40  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Yeah...
21:29:15  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Or, you just skip the problem and feed each ml to a separate 3-wide station
21:29:24  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> 3 isn't enough for 1 line
21:29:30  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> you need 6 plats per line
21:29:47  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Assuming full load, right?
21:29:56  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> yes
21:30:09  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> because you can't assume it's not a full load
21:30:12  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> And we're building worst case. Forgot that
21:30:43  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> You can have enough track before the ml that it doesn't matter, but any statistical anomalies will show up then
21:31:26  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> I'll do some thinking on the 4->2 merger
21:34:00  <PublicServer> *** Stoffe has left the game (connection lost)
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21:42:27  <PublicServer> <Spike> would space them 1 more S
21:42:34  <PublicServer> <Spike> cause of that :)
21:43:01  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> that's what I was thinking
21:43:10  <PublicServer> <Thraxian|Work> but it can change
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21:43:35  <PublicServer> <Spike> was just helping to save well.. big destroy when you found out a bit later :)
21:43:55  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> Any thoughts on the best way to do 4->2 merger anyone? Is 4->3->2 the most balanced way?
21:44:15  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> (see sign 4->3->2)
21:44:18  <PublicServer> <Spike> and prob cause it's a mistake i've made eh.. too much :)
21:46:14  <PublicServer> <Spike> eh...
21:46:19  <PublicServer> <Spike> mixer?
21:46:27  <PublicServer> <Spike> 2 to 1
21:46:30  <PublicServer> <Spike> twice
21:46:55  <PublicServer> <Spike> but time for me to go...
21:47:46  <^Spike^> cya around :)
21:47:52  <PublicServer> *** Spike has left the game (leaving)
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21:59:04  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> The first balancer is too good, the simple merge is jamming. :)
21:59:31  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> And who build a town right in my merger?
21:59:39  <PublicServer> <Stoffe> :)
22:02:12  <PublicServer> Server has exited
22:02:13  *** PublicServer has quit IRC
22:02:23  <Thraxian|Work> doh - server crash!
22:02:28  <Kupuham> lol
22:02:37  <Stoffe> :)
22:02:47  * Thraxian|Work subtlely puts his finger on his nose
22:02:48  <Stoffe> I had nothing broken at the time
22:02:59  * Stoffe subtly puts his finger in his nose
22:03:09  <Stoffe> :P
22:03:19  *** PublicServer has joined #openttdcoop
22:03:19  <PublicServer> Autopilot engaged
22:03:19  <PublicServer> Loading savegame: '#openttdcoop - The Public Server ('
22:03:19  *** ChanServ sets mode: +v PublicServer
22:03:20  *** Webster changes topic to "Welcome to #openttdcoop, the Cooperative OpenTTD | PSG #162 (r17779) | STAGE: Building | | New players, use @quickstart & !help | Screenshots: | Coopetition ladder: | IS2/FIRS game at"
22:03:54  <Thraxian|Work>
22:03:58  <Webster> Title: Types of gestures - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (at
22:04:07  <PublicServer> *** Stoffe joined the game
22:04:13  <Thraxian|Work> gotta run anyhow
22:04:47  <Thraxian|Work> back later tonight....
22:04:55  <Ammler> <-- fixed
22:04:58  *** Thraxian|Work has left #openttdcoop
22:05:00  <Ammler> shall we update?
22:05:09  <Ammler> ok, then I update
22:05:23  <PublicServer> *** Stoffe has left the game (leaving)
22:06:22  <hylje> good
22:12:02  <PublicServer> Server closed down by admin
22:12:02  <PublicServer> Saving game...
22:12:04  <PublicServer> Game saved
22:12:06  <PublicServer> Server has exited
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22:12:25  <PublicServer> Autopilot engaged
22:12:25  <PublicServer> Loading default savegame
22:12:25  *** ChanServ sets mode: +v PublicServer
22:12:26  *** Webster changes topic to "Welcome to #openttdcoop, the Cooperative OpenTTD | PSG #162 (r17814) | STAGE: Building | | New players, use @quickstart & !help | Screenshots: | Coopetition ladder: | IS2/FIRS game at"
22:12:39  <ccfreak2k> openttdchickencoop
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