Log for #openttdcoop on 14th November 2010:
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00:00:03  *** roboboy has joined #openttdcoop
00:00:12  <PublicServer> <Sylf> hmmm
00:00:26  <PublicServer> <malta> bam!
00:06:09  <PublicServer> <malta> beautiful! :)
00:06:46  <PublicServer> <Sylf> ah, that's the problem
00:06:46  <PublicServer> <malta> only it blocks itself now :p
00:06:59  *** Keiya_ has joined #openttdcoop
00:07:03  <PublicServer> <Sylf> that, and no more trains can come to overflow
00:07:14  <PublicServer> <malta> i think this calls for a re-do :)
00:07:44  <PublicServer> <malta> shouldn't one of those turny-things be enough btw?
00:08:12  <PublicServer> <malta> ooh
00:08:26  <PublicServer> <Sylf> let's start with that
00:09:48  <PublicServer> <Sylf> looking good
00:11:11  <PublicServer> <malta> screw the prio
00:11:17  <PublicServer> <Sylf> aww
00:11:35  <PublicServer> <Sylf> and...
00:11:57  <PublicServer> <Sylf> how is any passerby going to understand this >_<
00:12:12  <PublicServer> <malta> he isn't ;)
00:13:47  <PublicServer> <malta> hmm
00:13:50  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 00008739:
00:14:17  *** Keiya has quit IRC
00:14:37  <PublicServer> <Sylf> no signal there
00:14:44  <PublicServer> <Sylf> this should work
00:15:11  *** valhallasw has quit IRC
00:15:39  <PublicServer> <malta> cool :)
00:15:57  <PublicServer> <malta> i love overflow stations :)
00:16:36  <PublicServer> <Sylf> zoom out a bit, and it's hard to tell where one station ends and the other one starts
00:16:50  <PublicServer> <malta> true! :)
00:17:00  <PublicServer> <Sylf> It looks wicked
00:17:01  <PublicServer> <malta> still not as bad as NE part though ;)
00:17:10  <PublicServer> <Sylf> yeah, that mess =D
00:17:17  <PublicServer> <Sylf> lovely mess
00:17:27  <PublicServer> <malta> i think for that amount of space it's awesome :)
00:17:49  <PublicServer> <malta> but can you tell me what the rule is for when you use 2ways and why?
00:18:03  <PublicServer> <Sylf> ok
00:18:45  <PublicServer> <Sylf> It's an option that's turned on here, called yapf.rail_firstred_twoway_eol
00:18:47  <PublicServer> <Sylf> or something
00:19:11  <PublicServer> <Sylf> it says, if a train comes along to a split
00:19:37  <PublicServer> <Sylf> if one (or both) has two-way signal that's red, then they consider that as end of line
00:20:13  <PublicServer> <Sylf> in case of Ponnpool Branch
00:20:31  <PublicServer> <malta> yes
00:20:37  <PublicServer> <Sylf> When both platforms are filled, A of course will be red
00:20:51  <PublicServer> <Sylf> so any trains will pick B automatically.
00:20:53  <PublicServer> <malta> ahh
00:21:07  <PublicServer> <malta> because 2way_red = eol
00:21:09  <PublicServer> <malta> that's what that is
00:21:32  <PublicServer> <malta> good to know, thanks :)
00:21:34  <PublicServer> <Sylf> as for the overflow...
00:21:40  <PublicServer> <Sylf> point C
00:21:50  <PublicServer> <Sylf> we use two-way exit signals
00:22:12  <PublicServer> <Sylf> then, automatically, the trains in the depot acts as they have 2-way combo signal inside
00:22:35  <PublicServer> <Sylf> so they won't stick their head out until that signal is clear, making the path open for other trains to enter the depot
00:22:42  <PublicServer> <malta> clever
00:23:19  <PublicServer> <malta> i'm assuming you put those on all my depots then? because i don't remember ever doing that :)
00:23:30  <PublicServer> <Sylf> I fixed some
00:23:48  <PublicServer> <malta> thanks :)
00:23:50  <PublicServer> <Sylf> I'm sneaky sometimes.
00:23:56  <PublicServer> <malta> :p
00:24:02  <PublicServer> <malta> if that forest dies now i'm going to get cross
00:24:28  <PublicServer> <Sylf> we have one more work
00:24:34  <PublicServer> <malta> where?
00:24:41  <PublicServer> <Sylf> gold mine to the north of papermill south
00:25:27  <PublicServer> <Sylf> I think we'll start with killing another absolooper
00:25:45  <PublicServer> <malta> i'd never object there
00:28:50  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 0001AEB1:
00:29:02  <PublicServer> <malta> :)
00:29:33  <PublicServer> <Sylf> it's a tricky spot for a junction
00:30:02  <PublicServer> <Sylf> oh
00:30:12  <PublicServer> <Sylf> there's one more gold mine to the west of there too
00:30:29  <PublicServer> <Sylf> I'll be back...
00:30:39  <PublicServer> <malta> i'll play around a bit :)
00:30:50  <PublicServer> <Sylf> better start fixing supper
00:42:53  <PublicServer> <Sylf> looking for that pf trap?
00:43:07  <PublicServer> <malta> seems much simpler :)
00:43:26  <PublicServer> <malta> rest should work though right?
00:43:32  <PublicServer> <Sylf> I've been avoiding to use it, since it's easy to abuse
00:43:48  *** pugi has quit IRC
00:43:50  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 0001B1A3:
00:43:55  <PublicServer> <malta> those kind of joins? me too, but else it's 5 loops...
00:44:27  <PublicServer> <Sylf> we're not complying with split before merge principle
00:44:35  <PublicServer> <malta> that as well
00:44:58  <PublicServer> <Sylf> and I can't place signals right
00:45:38  <PublicServer> <Sylf> one more
00:47:22  <PublicServer> <malta> i'm still not happy with the join ...
00:48:15  <PublicServer> <malta> haha, therisen's goldmine is back :)
00:48:29  <PublicServer> <malta> also, there's another under slardhattan
00:49:37  *** Mitcian has quit IRC
00:58:51  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 0001A7AE:
01:01:03  <PublicServer> <malta> there, much much nicer
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01:10:42  <PublicServer> <malta> that should do :)
01:11:57  <PublicServer> <Sylf> It's quite a handiwork
01:12:22  <PublicServer> <malta> i'm just really not used to connecting stuff in all directions on a sideline
01:12:29  <PublicServer> <Sylf> oh
01:12:31  <PublicServer> <Sylf> oh
01:12:34  <PublicServer> <Sylf> oh oh oh
01:12:42  <PublicServer> <Sylf> check out Dronborough
01:12:52  <PublicServer> <Sylf> I'll show youthe PF trap in work
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01:13:04  <PublicServer> <malta> what the
01:13:52  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 000180DA:
01:14:34  <PublicServer> <Sylf> when we were working on the stuff, some trains got lost
01:14:46  <PublicServer> <Sylf> and went into wrong, unopen track
01:14:52  <PublicServer> <malta> and jammed
01:14:58  <PublicServer> <Sylf> that piece of rail, the pf trap, fixes all that
01:15:08  <PublicServer> <malta> ok
01:15:14  <PublicServer> <malta> that's pretty cool
01:15:50  <PublicServer> <Sylf> now that the jam is gone... buffer is back in
01:16:24  <PublicServer> <malta> yay :)
01:16:45  <PublicServer> <Sylf> dinner time
01:16:48  <PublicServer> <Sylf> bbl
01:16:54  <PublicServer> <malta> bon appetit
01:17:39  <PublicServer> *** Sylf has left the game (connection lost)
01:17:41  <PublicServer> *** Game paused (number of players)
01:18:48  <malta> come to think of it
01:18:50  <malta> it's 2:20am
01:18:55  <malta> it should be bed time for me ;)
01:18:59  <malta> see ya later guys
01:19:06  <malta> and sylf, there's still one gold mine left down there :D
01:19:08  <malta> cheers
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01:28:53  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 000156D6:
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01:34:10  <Sylf> OK, I'll see if I can connect it later
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01:49:54  <PublicServer> *** Game still paused (number of players)
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01:58:53  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 0001E422:
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02:22:38  <PublicServer> *** Game still paused (number of players)
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02:24:02  <PublicServer> <glevans2> hey all
02:24:13  <PublicServer> <glevans2> you here Sylf?
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03:14:25  <Sylf> not for a few more minutes; finishing a movie
03:16:52  <PublicServer> <glevans2> ok
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03:40:20  <PublicServer> *** Sylf has joined company #1
03:40:20  <PublicServer> *** Game unpaused (number of players)
03:40:28  <PublicServer> <Sylf> 'evening
03:40:36  <PublicServer> <glevans2> what movie?
03:40:47  <PublicServer> <glevans2> and evening to you also
03:40:48  <PublicServer> <Sylf> Professor Layton and Eternal Diva
03:41:00  <PublicServer> <glevans2> never heard of it
03:41:20  <PublicServer> <Sylf> Professor Layton series is a game for Gameboy DS
03:41:51  <PublicServer> <Sylf> and the movie is an animated one
03:42:49  <PublicServer> <Sylf> malta said there's one more gold mine...
03:43:55  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 0001C6C7:
03:44:07  <PublicServer> <glevans2> i was reading throught the channel logs to see what happened....ISP lost a switch today...guess who was connected to the one they lost?
03:44:53  <PublicServer> <Sylf> ouch
03:45:19  <PublicServer> <glevans2> yeah, down most of the day
03:45:40  <PublicServer> <glevans2> butthey were real polite on the phone...
03:46:15  <PublicServer> <Sylf> polite words don't cost them much...
03:48:47  <PublicServer> <glevans2> wow, a 4 tile incline
03:53:21  <PublicServer> <Sylf> where was that?
03:53:27  <PublicServer> <Sylf> I just made a 6-tile incline
03:53:45  <PublicServer> <glevans2> you made one, or fixed one?
03:54:59  <PublicServer> <Sylf> made one
03:55:21  <PublicServer> <glevans2> I just fixed a 4-tile and a 5 tile going back to ML at Chunningpool Halt/East Valley
03:55:33  <PublicServer> <glevans2> wtg
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03:55:56  <PublicServer> <Sylf> ah
03:58:55  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 000079C2:
04:13:55  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 0001261C:
04:20:13  <PublicServer> <glevans2> are there shortcuts for the terrain toolbar?
04:27:37  <PublicServer> <glevans2> what are you working on now Sylf?
04:28:03  <PublicServer> <Sylf> just checking on various stations
04:28:56  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 0001D5C0:
04:31:44  <PublicServer> <glevans2> I need to go about 30 minutes ago.....or I get to try un-happily married for a bit...
04:31:54  <PublicServer> <glevans2> :D
04:31:59  <PublicServer> <Sylf> hehe
04:32:01  <PublicServer> <Sylf> ok
04:32:37  <PublicServer> <glevans2> may or may not get on tomorrow...not sure what is planned
04:32:43  <PublicServer> <glevans2> take care Sylf
04:32:49  <PublicServer> <Sylf> same to you
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04:43:57  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 0000D09C:
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05:44:11  <ksf> !dl
05:44:11  <PublicServer> ksf: !dl autostart|autottd|lin|lin64|osx|ottdau|win32|win64|win9x
05:44:11  <PublicServer> ksf:
05:44:17  <ksf> !dl lin64
05:44:17  <PublicServer> ksf:
05:46:49  <ksf> !password
05:46:50  <PublicServer> ksf: marina
05:47:00  <PublicServer> *** Game still paused (number of players)
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06:36:45  <Ryton> !password
06:36:45  <PublicServer> Ryton: marina
06:36:57  <PublicServer> *** Game still paused (number of players)
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06:52:37  <ksf> !password
06:52:37  <PublicServer> ksf: marina
06:52:51  <ksf> hmm. I guessed it changed every time someone leaves the channel.
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07:56:53  <planetmaker> moin
07:57:20  <planetmaker> ksf: the pw changes after a certain time. Like 10 minutes or so
07:57:37  <planetmaker> unless no-one is connected
07:57:43  <planetmaker> !playercount
07:57:43  <PublicServer> planetmaker: Number of players: 0 (0 spectators)
07:57:46  <ksf> !password
07:57:46  <PublicServer> ksf: marina
07:57:58  <planetmaker> ^^ :-)
07:58:19  <planetmaker> No point to change it, if noone is playing
07:58:46  <ksf> well, I could exit this chan and play with a 2 hour old password.
07:59:34  <planetmaker> not quite. The game only starts when two people are connected
07:59:46  <ksf> that's a point.
07:59:51  <planetmaker> :-)
08:00:14  <ksf> but if I were two I could exit this chan twice and play with a 2 hour old password.
08:00:19  <planetmaker> but sure there are ways around being in the channel.
08:00:36  <ksf> exiting after connecting, sure.
08:01:09  <planetmaker> :-) But chances are it won't pass unnoticed
08:02:10  <planetmaker> as long as you're the only one, you might then play, but... we won't like it when we find out :-)
08:03:22  <planetmaker> after all the passwords intention is to serve two purposes: a) that not everyone can join the server unnoticed, making destroying games easier and b) that people are also around here
08:03:41  <planetmaker> Coop without talking is... much less coop and missing quite a bit of the fun :-)
08:05:40  <ksf> yep tighter security doesn't make much sense as it can't be completely secure, anyway.
08:05:56  <planetmaker> exactly
08:06:31  <planetmaker> social problems usually cannot be solved by technical means :-)
08:07:43  <PublicServer> *** Game still paused (number of players)
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08:12:40  <planetmaker> very nice map and plan actually :-)
08:15:05  <avdg> hmm, autostart made this error:
08:15:07  <avdg> autostart/start: line 327: [: 21089: unary operator expected
08:16:27  <avdg> oh, library error again -_
08:16:37  * avdg fixes the problem
08:17:11  <planetmaker> library error?!
08:17:33  <avdg> yeah, liblzma update with ports
08:17:51  <avdg> and the binary wasn't updated yet
08:19:06  <planetmaker> hm
08:19:25  <avdg> all I know was the strange version number
08:19:53  <avdg> something like version 14.99999-beta or something, but I can't remind the version number completely
08:20:13  <avdg> so after the update it would be version 15 in this case
08:21:17  <avdg> ok, it was an upgrade to version 5 :)
08:22:40  <PublicServer> *** Game still paused (number of players)
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08:47:35  <avdg> hmm, is the password still the same?
08:47:59  <PublicServer> *** Game still paused (number of players)
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08:48:12  <PublicServer> *** avdg has left the game (connection lost)
08:48:43  <avdg> hmm
08:49:03  <avdg> ^ aren't real disconnects
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10:08:07  <Alendo> !player
10:08:15  <Alendo> !players
10:08:18  <PublicServer> Alendo: There are currently no clients connected to the server
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10:41:07  <V453000> !password
10:41:07  <PublicServer> V453000: marina
10:41:25  <PublicServer> *** Game still paused (number of players)
10:41:28  <PublicServer> *** V453000 joined the game
10:41:44  <V453000> !unpause
10:41:44  <PublicServer> *** V453000 has unpaused the server. (Use !auto to set it back.)
10:41:46  <PublicServer> *** Game unpaused (number of players)
10:43:58  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 00016C48:
10:44:51  <PublicServer> *** Alendo joined the game
10:44:57  <PublicServer> <V453000> hi
10:45:01  <PublicServer> <Alendo> morning
10:45:01  <V453000> !auto
10:45:01  <PublicServer> *** V453000 has enabled autopause mode.
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10:46:14  <malta> good morning :)
10:47:18  <PublicServer> <V453000> I wonder how hard it is for some people to set no Full load order on mail trains
10:47:30  <PublicServer> <Alendo> hehe
10:47:32  <PublicServer> *** malta joined the game
10:47:50  <hylje> the mail must flow!
10:48:42  <Mazur> More ning.
10:48:48  <PublicServer> <V453000> moar
10:48:55  <Mazur> Moar!
10:49:08  <hylje> moar
10:50:16  <PublicServer> <Alendo> seems like almost all the traffic going north is on the inner lane
10:50:42  <PublicServer> <Alendo> trains been waiting to get on there for yrs  :D
10:51:56  <PublicServer> <V453000> yes I see it
10:55:19  <V453000> lunch
10:55:23  <PublicServer> *** V453000 has left the game (leaving)
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10:58:58  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 0000C590:
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11:13:59  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 0000C190:
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11:28:59  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 00007AFC:
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11:43:59  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 00008FC3:
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11:59:00  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 00000835:
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12:14:00  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 00000B3C:
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12:29:00  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 0000CB73:
12:32:16  <PublicServer> <Mazur> No Wheat train in the trainyard?
12:32:29  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Ah, Grain!
12:32:39  <PublicServer> <malta> :)
12:32:41  <PublicServer> <Mazur> *duh*
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12:44:00  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 0000CE79:
12:47:41  <Ammler> !url
12:47:41  <PublicServer> Ammler:
12:47:51  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Damn, !slow insertion is an even greater problem than I thought.
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12:49:13  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Hi, Ammler.
12:49:23  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> Salü :-)
12:49:25  <PublicServer> <malta> hello :)
12:49:39  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Salut.
12:49:56  <malta> servus in that case :)
12:50:26  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> oh, Österreicher?
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12:50:48  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> oder Bayer
12:50:56  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Or a Roman servant.
12:50:58  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> hmm :-)
12:51:57  <malta> bayer ;)
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12:53:34  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Leverkusen oder Muenchen?
12:53:36  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> there is indeed no Grain in temperate
12:53:52  <malta> Erlangen um genau zu sein
12:53:54  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> maybe someone confused this with temperate thanks to the japan land
12:54:00  *** ksf has quit IRC
12:54:13  <malta> aber schon lang nimmer da gewohnt :)
12:54:19  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> which is actually not that bad :-)
12:54:24  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Hm, how do I enter accented chars in OTTD?
12:54:42  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Cut&paste doesn't hack it.
12:55:16  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> hmm, should be completely utf-8 compatible
12:55:24  <malta> é
12:55:35  <PublicServer> <malta> can't enter from here though
12:55:47  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> é works here
12:56:01  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> did you build self?
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12:56:23  <PublicServer> <malta> nope
12:56:27  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> windows?
12:57:20  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> maybe ask in #openttd
12:57:27  <malta> yea, xp 32
12:57:36  <malta> but then again i don't use those crazy letters anyway to be honst
12:57:44  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Linux.  I'll find out.
12:57:51  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> well, might be helpful to fix a bug
12:57:58  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> at least here on linux it is no issue
12:59:01  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 0001396F:
12:59:02  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Well, I tend to use us-intl as keyboard, because all national keyboards I find redefine keys I don't want redefined.
12:59:28  <Ammler> malta: with accented you mean using dead key?
12:59:47  <Ammler> like first ~ and then e = ẽ
13:00:31  <malta> oh, i use us keyboard layout
13:00:39  <malta> if i must use them i use the alt-keys
13:01:02  <Mazur> Ammler, do you use combine keys?  Or (automatic) deadkeys?
13:01:05  <Ammler> us keyboard doesn't have deadkey?
13:01:37  <malta> yea it does, but it doesnt combine them into anything (~e 'e `e etc
13:01:44  <Ammler> well, I have swiss keyboard so the french chars are already here :-)
13:01:50  <Ammler> but I can also combine those
13:02:30  <Ammler> so your problem is you can't type chars with alt in openttd?
13:02:38  <malta> exactly
13:02:43  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> how does that work?
13:02:51  <malta> alt+0233 = é
13:02:56  <malta> for example
13:02:58  <malta> è
13:03:02  <Mazur> Windows.
13:03:05  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> yes, that doesn't work at all
13:03:16  <PublicServer> <malta> just closes the chat window when i try it here
13:03:40  <Ammler> no idea, how to do that on linux
13:07:03  <PublicServer> *** Mazur has left the game (connection lost)
13:07:50  *** fonsinchen has quit IRC
13:08:07  <Mazur> <--- shower and shopping.
13:08:18  <PublicServer> <malta> have fun :)
13:08:24  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> on sunday?
13:08:44  <PublicServer> <malta> where in NL are you mazur?
13:10:16  <PublicServer> <malta> can someone explain what train452 is doing?
13:11:19  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> how to jump to a train #?
13:11:37  <PublicServer> <malta> train in menu bar, sort by number?
13:11:47  <PublicServer> <malta> or else it's at food pickup wheat
13:11:54  <PublicServer> <malta> in the overflow next to the station
13:12:08  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> well, then it would have been easier to sing
13:12:32  <PublicServer> <malta> is it because of the trap thing ?
13:13:24  <PublicServer> <malta> maybe?
13:14:01  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 0000A9F9:
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13:29:01  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 00013590:
13:33:32  <Mazur> Ok, part one (showering) done.
13:33:43  <Mazur> malta: In Leiden,
13:33:56  <PublicServer> <malta> haha, close by then ;)
13:34:09  <Mazur> The largest supermarkets are all open.
13:34:29  <PublicServer> <malta> i'm usually in the hague over the weekends, i love the koopzondags :)
13:35:04  <Mazur> Yeah, now I only need money to use then.
13:35:17  <PublicServer> <malta> 10 more days till stufi...
13:35:42  * Mazur no job, noone wants him anymore.
13:36:09  <malta> i got a paid internship starting tomorrow, got lucky with that one :)
13:36:22  *** perk11 has quit IRC
13:37:42  <PublicServer> *** malta has left the game (leaving)
13:37:47  <malta> ok what the hell
13:38:02  <malta> why does ottd keep ballooning up to >500mB ram usage and then gets all choopy?
13:38:05  <malta> never happened before
13:38:28  <PublicServer> *** malta joined the game
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13:44:01  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 00014C89:
13:46:39  <PublicServer> <malta> coal mines come from the ML from north
13:47:17  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Oh, all sidelines.
13:50:49  <PublicServer> <Mazur> From there, you mean.
13:50:55  <PublicServer> <malta> and the inner line, yes
13:51:41  <PublicServer> *** Amm1er has left the game (leaving)
13:52:12  <PublicServer> <malta> exactly
13:52:16  <PublicServer> <malta> brb
13:56:12  *** fonsinchen has joined #openttdcoop
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13:57:30  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Damn, should have figured the exit, first.  Need to go back bnorth.
13:57:48  <PublicServer> <malta> make it a terminus?
13:58:12  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Still no real exit.
13:58:46  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Curve lengths.
13:59:00  <PublicServer> <malta> right after the exit cl is pretty meaningless
13:59:02  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 00015796:
14:02:38  <PublicServer> <malta> exactly :)
14:03:04  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Insertionm has a CL issue, though, if they want the outer track north.
14:03:20  <PublicServer> <malta> where?
14:03:30  <PublicServer> <Mazur> See !cl
14:04:00  <PublicServer> <malta> oh yea
14:04:24  <dutchie> !password
14:04:24  <PublicServer> dutchie: welted
14:04:29  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Solved.
14:04:31  <PublicServer> <malta> :)
14:04:45  <PublicServer> *** dutchie joined the game
14:04:47  <PublicServer> <malta> heya
14:05:01  <PublicServer> <Mazur> And if there's flak about that, I'll hear it eventually.
14:05:11  <PublicServer> <malta> gave the other track a bit priority
14:05:54  <PublicServer> <malta> still not really
14:06:40  *** roboboy has quit IRC
14:07:04  <PublicServer> <malta> there :)
14:07:18  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Neato.
14:08:22  <PublicServer> <malta> you could even throw in the other mind W 10 tiles of it :)
14:08:28  <PublicServer> <malta> *mine
14:08:44  <PublicServer> <Mazur> That was whby I started this one.
14:09:20  <PublicServer> <malta> i see :)
14:11:04  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Walked it, now, though I'm tempted to use trucks.
14:14:02  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 00014899:
14:16:07  <planetmaker> !grf
14:16:08  <PublicServer> planetmaker: (Version 8.0)
14:18:29  *** TheRisen has joined #openttdcoop
14:19:36  <PublicServer> *** dutchie has left the game (connection lost)
14:29:02  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 00015121:
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14:37:31  <TheRisen> !password
14:37:31  <PublicServer> TheRisen: sicker
14:37:34  <theholyduck> !password
14:37:34  <PublicServer> theholyduck: sicker
14:37:40  <PublicServer> *** TheRisen joined the game
14:37:49  <PublicServer> *** theholyduck joined the game
14:37:53  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> hi there
14:38:03  <PublicServer> <malta> heya :)
14:38:20  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Hi-de-hi.
14:38:22  <PublicServer> * theholyduck fixes some signal issues
14:38:54  <PublicServer> <malta> signal issues?
14:39:04  <PublicServer> <theholyduck> well, some signal gaps in slh07
14:39:37  <PublicServer> <malta> i can't get !here figured out
14:39:55  <PublicServer> <malta> when a train joins the outer track it blocks the entry
14:40:03  <PublicServer> <malta> but i can't get the tracks laid out properly to fix that..
14:40:52  <PublicServer> <Mazur> k
14:41:43  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Yeah, line's too short.
14:41:51  <PublicServer> <malta> i know
14:42:08  *** perk11 has joined #openttdcoop
14:42:23  <PublicServer> <malta> but now you get cl issues
14:42:35  <PublicServer> *** malta has left the game (connection lost)
14:42:42  <malta> and i get booted :p
14:42:55  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> what about a pbs solution?
14:43:10  <malta> i had that earlier, then they never even looked at the outer track join ..
14:43:22  <PublicServer> *** malta joined the game
14:43:38  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> 2 way block sig or 1-way at the exit of the pbs?
14:43:42  <PublicServer> *** theholyduck has left the game (connection lost)
14:43:50  <PublicServer> <malta> didn't do that...
14:43:53  <PublicServer> <malta> 1 way
14:44:02  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 00014C8B:
14:44:03  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> use 2 way instead
14:44:09  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> 1
14:44:19  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> 1-way can confuse the pathfinder
14:44:25  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> when using pbs
14:44:37  <PublicServer> <malta> oooh
14:44:57  <PublicServer> <malta> it works :)
14:45:33  <PublicServer> <malta> me likey
14:45:35  <PublicServer> <malta> thanks :0
14:45:37  <PublicServer> <malta> :)
14:45:39  <PublicServer> <Mazur> TheRisen: You confuse me about that PBS issue.
14:45:49  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> ?
14:45:52  <PublicServer> <malta> anywho, coffee and cake time :)
14:45:54  <PublicServer> <malta> bbiab
14:46:01  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> cya
14:46:07  <PublicServer> <Mazur> BYe.
14:46:17  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> mazur, why?
14:46:31  <PublicServer> <Mazur> You're using a one-way PBS.
14:46:45  <PublicServer> <Mazur> And talking about 2-way needed.
14:46:50  <Ammler> Mazur: basically you can't use pbs anymore on parts where a lost train can end
14:47:03  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> nope i talked about the block signals closing the pbs block
14:47:05  <PublicServer> <Mazur> aa
14:47:30  <Ammler> this is a intended bug introduces from the openttd devs, wasn't part of yapp
14:47:31  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Oh.
14:48:12  <Ammler> please report it :-)
14:48:35  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Erm, I changed a station somewhere to use a PBS entrance.
14:49:02  <PublicServer> <Mazur> With 2-way PBS-es ending that block.
14:49:10  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> can u show me?
14:49:28  <PublicServer> <Mazur> Looking for it.
14:50:29  <Ammler> the openttd devs decided to make pbs as bad as presignals, instead of fixing presignals :-(
14:51:04  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> what needs to be fixed at the presigs?
14:51:16  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> mazur, looks goods
14:51:27  <Ammler> send a lost train in a terminus station with presignals or pbs
14:51:37  <PublicServer> <Mazur> k.  Thought it should be, used to be good.
14:51:48  <PublicServer> <Mazur> And it speeds up entrance/exit.
14:51:58  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> y
14:54:34  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> ammler, on a well built network, there shouldn't be any lost trains though
14:54:54  <Ammler> trains without orders are also lost trains
14:55:01  <Ammler> so that isn't uncommon
14:55:03  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> right
14:55:40  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> what happens with lost trains in terminus stations?
14:55:59  <Ammler> it is imo the worst thing openttd devs did and I saw some really bad things already :-)
14:57:19  <Ammler> If you have a logical explaination, why a train should head to a oneway line back, please tell me
14:57:41  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> hhmm
14:58:41  <PublicServer> *** Mazur has left the game (connection lost)
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14:58:59  * Mazur ponders whether or not to do that shopping.
14:59:02  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 0001431D:
14:59:06  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> does that happen too, when ONLY pbs are used?
14:59:17  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> instead of one way block sigs?
14:59:18  <Mazur> Nah, it rains and tomorrow is soon enough.
15:03:32  *** glevans2 has joined #openttdcoop
15:05:24  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> lost trains and presigs do work
15:06:03  <Sylf> !password
15:06:03  <PublicServer> Sylf: pleats
15:06:19  <PublicServer> *** Sylf joined the game
15:07:33  *** fonsinchen has joined #openttdcoop
15:08:09  <TheRisen> Ammler, the presigs at the terminus work well with lost trains
15:08:22  <PublicServer> <Sylf> with
15:08:38  <PublicServer> <Sylf> with first platform occupied?
15:09:17  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> nope
15:09:20  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> damn it
15:09:39  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> i take back everything i said
15:10:16  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> why the fuck are they doing this?
15:14:03  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 0001C07E:
15:14:36  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> what is the pathfinder of a lost train looking for?
15:14:57  <Ammler> TheRisen: can you show me a working example?
15:15:21  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> working with the meaning "running trains" yes
15:15:35  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> working with the meaning "doing as intended to" no
15:15:55  <Ammler> lost trains don't find path, that is why they are lost :-P
15:16:27  <Ammler> so the pathfinder does not need to look for something
15:17:11  <Ammler> TheRisen: you have such a situation on the current ps map?
15:17:16  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> yes
15:17:34  <PublicServer> *** Amm1er joined the game
15:17:38  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> can you show me?
15:17:40  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> /testarea
15:18:44  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> when does a train decide to change it's direction?
15:18:54  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> now make the trains longer
15:19:37  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> you see :-)
15:19:44  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> yes i see
15:19:50  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> that wouldn't happen with pbs
15:20:12  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> but u see the problem with pbs below
15:20:12  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> but with pbs you have another issue now
15:20:23  *** Jkrueger has joined #openttdcoop
15:20:29  <Jkrueger> o/ guys
15:20:36  <Jkrueger> !password
15:20:36  <PublicServer> Jkrueger: obtuse
15:20:36  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> that is introduces by devs around r19800
15:21:38  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> why does he try to get through a one way pbs?
15:21:43  <PublicServer> *** Jkrueger joined the game
15:22:00  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> stupid isn't?
15:22:05  <PublicServer> <Jkrueger> It's alive!
15:22:07  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> yes it is
15:22:15  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> completely
15:22:19  <PublicServer> <Amm1er> please report it :-)
15:23:11  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> why didn't u report it, when you  alread  knew that?
15:23:38  <PublicServer> <Jkrueger> you discussing train 344?
15:24:29  <PublicServer> <Jkrueger> oh nvm thought that was stuck
15:24:52  <PublicServer> <Jkrueger> just a clever little over flow
15:26:16  <PublicServer> <Jkrueger> I went to sleep at 3:30 am my time. "just a few more minutes" started before midnight. lol ottd is addicting
15:26:28  <Ammler> TheRisen: I tried, but I have other logic then the whole openttd dev team so they failed understanding me
15:26:46  <Ammler> maybe they understand you :-)
15:27:00  <TheRisen> let's check
15:27:22  <planetmaker> hm?
15:27:35  <planetmaker> hm.
15:27:41  <Ammler> :-)
15:28:02  <planetmaker> men can communicate entirely just by different pronounciation of 'hm' ;-)
15:28:10  <PublicServer> <TheRisen> hm
15:28:17  <KenjiE20> hM
15:28:21  <planetmaker> :-P
15:28:21  <Jkrueger> lol
15:28:51  <PublicServer> *** TheRisen has left the game (leaving)
15:29:03  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 00009B2D:
15:29:03  <PublicServer> <Jkrueger> does the riffiting of cars on the wood/paper route cost money?
15:29:04  <Ammler> would be nice, if the issue is reported by a non-member
15:29:41  <Jkrueger> why does #coop tend to get ignored?
15:29:49  <PublicServer> <Sylf> Jkrueger: yes
15:29:54  <Ammler> I wouldn't say that
15:30:06  <PublicServer> <Sylf> In the case of this trainset, it does cost
15:30:15  <Ammler> sometimes, they decide to make a issue coop specific, that is all
15:30:33  <Jkrueger> you guys probably are just too good at making the game break in hard to fix ways
15:30:45  *** v has joined #openttdcoop
15:30:52  <PublicServer> <Sylf> coop stresses the ottd system beyond its means?
15:30:54  <Ammler> we are also the only community using nightlies
15:31:07  <planetmaker> yes :-(
15:31:20  <Jkrueger> is this nightly post 1.0.5c?
15:31:25  *** v has quit IRC
15:31:29  <planetmaker> of course. WAY
15:31:34  <Ammler> it is 1.1
15:31:42  <planetmaker> 1.0.x is only 1.0.0 with bug fixes
15:31:47  *** V has joined #openttdcoop
15:31:52  <Jkrueger> oh gotcha
15:32:04  <KenjiE20> Jkrueger: 1.0.x is a branch of 1.0, nightlies follow the main dev 'trunk'
15:32:07  <planetmaker> and current nightly is 2/3 of 1.1 :-)
15:32:16  *** V453000 is now known as Guest864
15:32:16  *** V is now known as V453000
15:32:21  *** V453000 has left #openttdcoop
15:32:24  <planetmaker> tsk...
15:32:27  <Ammler> mayonaise
15:32:31  <planetmaker> lol
15:32:32  *** V453000 has joined #openttdcoop
15:32:32  *** ChanServ sets mode: +o V453000
15:32:35  <KenjiE20> nom
15:32:37  <Jkrueger> V seems to be wrestling with irc
15:32:42  <planetmaker> :-)
15:32:46  <Ammler> V453000: why not using
15:32:59  <planetmaker> ircs://
15:33:03  <Ammler> no
15:33:05  <Ammler> https
15:33:05  <planetmaker> ?
15:33:09  <V453000> not on my computer
15:33:12  <planetmaker> I need to use ircs://...
15:33:18  <Ammler> he does obvioulsy try to use webchat
15:33:23  *** V453000 has quit IRC
15:33:41  <Guest864> good now :)ú
15:33:47  <Ammler> isn't it?
15:33:54  <Ammler> :-)
15:33:57  *** Guest864 is now known as V453000
15:34:12  <V453000> I just found out the old link doesnt work :D
15:34:17  <V453000> and dont have Xchat here
15:34:35  <planetmaker> :-)
15:34:36  <Ammler> yeah, we made that for you to the default ports
15:34:52  <V453000> :))
15:35:00  <Ammler> so you don't need to use mibbit
15:35:01  <V453000> easier to remember ^_^
15:35:05  <V453000> I see
15:35:15  <V453000> very nice \o/ thanks
15:35:28  <Ammler> exclusively for you ;-)
15:35:44  <Jkrueger> i take it this is not the right way to make a ro-ro station?
15:36:11  <Ammler> Jkrueger: why?
15:36:35  <V453000> as long as it works :)
15:36:46  <Jkrueger> not sure if it will do what i want
15:36:55  <Jkrueger> haven't stuffed it full of trains yet
15:37:11  <V453000> there are CLs, the pre-signal array could be split into 2 so that it could be faster, if you seek improvements
15:37:19  <planetmaker> doesn't look particularily wrong
15:37:23  <Jkrueger> i got another station that is really nice tho i'll put a screencap of it
15:37:34  <Ammler> you don't need so many plattforms for one line
15:37:37  <V453000> it works. not with fully packed incoming line but it is ok
15:38:00  <planetmaker> yup
15:38:01  <Sylf> I have this habit of using ottd mouse-clicks and keyboard shortcuts while looking at openttd screenshots...
15:38:10  <Sylf> *sigh*
15:38:10  <planetmaker> haha :-)
15:38:11  <Jkrueger> i think it is 4 drop 4 picks
15:38:18  <V453000> Sylf: I used to, too :)
15:38:20  <planetmaker> Sylf: I know that just too well :-)
15:38:37  <KenjiE20> we all do
15:38:38  <Ammler> Jkrueger: you should make dedicated stations for drop and pickup
15:38:55  <Ammler> and a overflow protection for pickup
15:38:55  <V453000> !dl win32
15:38:55  <PublicServer> V453000:
15:39:07  <Jkrueger> yeah i need to make overflows
15:39:10  <V453000> Ammler supporting overflows? :D :P
15:39:30  <V453000> overflows should not be needed in most cases
15:39:32  <Ammler> V453000: overflow protection can be a simple waiting line :-P
15:39:39  <V453000> bah :)
15:39:41  <Ammler> no nedd of complcated depots constructions
15:39:53  <V453000> okok :)
15:40:12  <Ammler> but they are cool anyway :-P
15:40:18  <V453000> :p
15:40:34  <Ammler> someone made it wrong on the ps
15:40:34  <Jkrueger> i learned why sideline depots are bad
15:40:46  <Ammler> and trains got stock forever
15:40:54  <V453000> he
15:41:11  <V453000> well, nothing is fail-proof, right? :D
15:41:19  <Jkrueger> is there a good way to upgrade trains from rail to mono/maglev?
15:41:19  <V453000> !password
15:41:19  <PublicServer> V453000: slinks
15:41:27  <V453000> yes
15:41:27  <Ammler> yes, don't
15:41:32  <V453000> universal rail newGRF
15:41:37  <Ammler> :-)
15:41:37  <V453000> or dont :)
15:41:55  <Jkrueger> that would let me use the autoreplacer?
15:41:58  <V453000> yes
15:42:01  <Jkrueger> nice
15:42:05  <V453000> just like normally
15:42:14  <Ammler> but it isn't that easy
15:42:19  <V453000> trains are slower on these rails so it will take some time, but it is as simple as normally
15:42:21  <TheRisen> what version are we using? trunk?
15:42:34  <V453000> TheRisen: what kind of question is that :)
15:42:34  <Ammler> !revision
15:42:34  <PublicServer> Ammler: Game version is r21089
15:42:41  <Jkrueger> <-- i like this station
15:42:47  <Ammler> and yes from trunk
15:43:04  <V453000> !password again??
15:43:04  <PublicServer> V453000: vomits
15:43:07  <V453000> oh yes :D
15:43:09  <TheRisen> hehe
15:43:13  <Ammler> this looks coopish
15:43:17  <TheRisen> indeed
15:43:30  <PublicServer> *** V453000 joined the game
15:43:43  <V453000> doesnt work though
15:43:45  <V453000> :)
15:43:54  <Webster> Latest update from openttd: OpenTTD 1.0.5-RC2 <>
15:44:03  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 0000BE9C:
15:44:04  <V453000> yeeey
15:44:12  <Sylf> I think we're done with presig bypass
15:44:19  <V453000> we could update the stable
15:44:26  <Sylf> :o
15:44:45  <Jkrueger> it was fun to make
15:44:56  <Jkrueger> it did jam once i got all the farms online
15:45:01  <V453000> it does indeed look nice
15:45:12  <V453000> the effectiveness is questionable
15:45:21  <V453000> works in most cases
15:45:26  <PublicServer> *** Jkrueger has left the game (leaving)
15:45:28  <Sylf> Once I learned the thing about twoway eol, I got hooked on that concept...
15:45:46  <Jkrueger> what is that?
15:46:18  <Sylf> it's a yapf option that you turn on
15:46:43  <Sylf> then, if trains see a two-way signal that's red, they consider that as end-of-line
15:46:56  <PublicServer> <V453000> fuck me :| crash
15:47:20  <planetmaker> crash?!
15:47:21  <Sylf> it's exploited in this psg too, where overflows are deployed
15:47:32  <V453000> pm: trainz
15:47:40  <planetmaker> pew
15:47:42  <planetmaker> :-)
15:47:56  <Jkrueger> train crash or ottd crash?
15:48:13  <PublicServer> <malta> back :)
15:48:20  <PublicServer> <V453000> hi
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15:48:49  <PublicServer> <malta> hey hey :)
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15:49:12  <Jkrueger> anyway i think i'm done with that game now. for the next one i'm going to use some newgrfs. NARS or UKRS?
15:49:28  <PublicServer> <Sylf> either =)
15:49:34  <PublicServer> <V453000> UKRS is better
15:49:37  <PublicServer> <V453000> in all regards imo
15:49:52  <Jkrueger> does it do 'gear' refitting?
15:49:57  <PublicServer> <V453000> no
15:50:12  <PublicServer> <V453000> that is quite pointless imo
15:50:16  <Jkrueger> that sounds all together too complicated
15:50:18  <PublicServer> <Sylf> I agree...
15:50:19  <Ammler> V453000: meant better for coop gameplay
15:50:27  <TheRisen> bug reported
15:50:30  <V453000> overall, actually, Ammler
15:50:44  <V453000> with UKRS you have much more possibilities for your network
15:50:52  <PublicServer> <Sylf> oh I like V's suggestion too...  Swedish trainset is fun too
15:51:06  <V453000> it is probably the only set where you really decide how the network looks
15:51:11  <Ammler> NARS has some nice newgrf features
15:51:43  <V453000> well, these might be nice but overall I think NARS is just a flood of nicely drawn engines that are all similar in stats - speed, power, et
15:51:44  <V453000> etc
15:51:51  <Ammler> Sylf: there is a swedish trainset?
15:51:53  <V453000> making the game quite boring
15:52:05  <Ammler> I thought, that is only some kind of testing release
15:52:07  <V453000> Ammler: there is but I am not sure how far finished
15:52:25  <Jkrueger> ukrs it is then
15:52:35  <Jkrueger> and industrial stations
15:52:39  <Jkrueger> and aviators
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15:53:09  <Ammler> stations you don't need to decide, you can simply use all you have
15:53:14  <V453000> !rcon set max_trains 0
15:53:54  <Ammler> or are you preparing a map for a coop game?
15:54:05  <Jkrueger> offline single player game
15:54:07  <Ammler> then you can only use grfpack and bananas
15:54:10  <V453000> all games until 200 are ready to use :p
15:54:21  <V453000> well 200 isnt completely, but almost :)
15:54:25  <Ammler> game 200 also ready?
15:54:50  <Ammler> is that a suprise?
15:54:52  <V453000> only if we agree on the suggestion I made :) with similar of tneo, KenjiE20 agreeing
15:54:56  <Jkrueger> is there an archive of initial saves of the public game maps?
15:55:10  <Ammler> kind of
15:55:19  <Ammler>
15:55:25  <KenjiE20> Jkrueger: only what's not been purged on the starting directory
15:55:57  <Jkrueger> 404 error
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15:56:20  <Ammler>
15:56:20  <KenjiE20>
15:56:24  <KenjiE20> bah
15:56:25  <Ammler> :-P
15:56:26  <malta>;O=D
15:56:37  <malta> oh. oops :)
15:56:39  <KenjiE20> that's autosaves malta, not starting
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15:59:04  <PublicServer> ***  made screenshot at 000120CE:
16:03:44  <Jkrueger> do you use the 'variety distribution' in the terrain generator?
16:03:50  *** Keiya has quit IRC
16:05:05  <V453000> rarely
16:05:12  <V453000> it makes too flat maps imo
16:05:45  <Jkrueger> hilly with rough smoothness setting good?
16:06:01  <V453000> yes
16:06:09  <V453000> hilly and rough makes very nice maps
16:06:19  <V453000> with no variety distribution
16:06:27  <Jkrueger> what sealevel do you use?
16:06:35  <V453000> depends
16:06:47  <V453000> current game has Low
16:06:54  <V453000> for example PSG 190 had high
16:06:57  <Jkrueger> thats what i've been using
16:06:59  <Jkrueger> low
16:08:29  <PublicServer> *** V453000 has left the game (leaving)
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20:41:10  <malta> i'm off to bed
20:41:14  <malta> laters guys :0
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21:41:03  <planetmaker> <-- hehe. On PSG #2 the terraforming rules were *slightly* different :-)
21:42:03  <glevans2> there were rules?
21:42:08  <planetmaker> :-)
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21:57:49  <Ammler> the TF rules started around game 10 or later
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21:58:21  <planetmaker> seems like, yeah :-)
21:58:43  <planetmaker> looking at that map w/o trees really surprised me at the amount of flattening which took place
22:01:31  <Ammler> well, also those games were called sandbox
22:01:39  <planetmaker> :-)
22:01:41  <planetmaker> true that
22:02:01  <Ammler> the coop games on that time were on MZ
22:02:08  <Ammler> or MS
22:02:13  <Ammler> Mainserver
22:02:47  <Ammler> with popularity we changed Sandbox to PublicServer
22:02:54  * planetmaker feels like a rookie :-)
22:03:00  <Ammler> and Mainserver to Memberzone
22:03:45  <Ammler> and with the Prozone, the Memberzone died too
22:03:59  <glevans2> everyone was there at one time, but it is hard for me to imagine planetmaker as a noob...
22:04:07  <glevans2> or V453000
22:04:13  <planetmaker> :-)
22:04:16  <Ammler> pm was never a noob
22:04:26  <SmatZ> :)
22:04:26  <Ammler> V453000: maybe was :-P
22:04:36  <^Spike^> .........
22:04:40  <planetmaker> actually... I did really do
22:04:42  <V453000> maybe is :p
22:04:43  <planetmaker> @slowstart
22:04:43  <Webster> Read everything on the wiki, and I mean everything
22:04:46  <planetmaker> :-)
22:04:55  <^Spike^> V never grows up to be a pro... ;)
22:05:06  <^Spike^> we just took him in to make sure he followed the right path and not go insane ;)
22:05:11  <^Spike^> we failed on the last part :)
22:05:14  <Ammler> yeah, I still don't believe, how he became a Member
22:05:14  <planetmaker> and then I found out that it's much more fun to actually build here than that stuff on my own
22:05:29  <planetmaker> also it's faster results. There are others for tedious work, too :-)
22:05:43  *** ODM has quit IRC
22:05:55  <Ammler> ^Spike^: indeed, he got even more mad as member :-D
22:06:02  <V453000> :|
22:06:17  <planetmaker> mad-V :-P
22:06:17  <^Spike^> pm same thought here.. :)
22:06:21  <^Spike^> i hate playing solo..
22:06:25  <^Spike^> much more fun with others :)
22:06:29  <^Spike^> and faster work :D
22:06:30  <planetmaker> :-) very much indeed
22:06:40  <glevans2> the 'Mad' designer V453000.... sharing his madness with all...
22:06:58  <^Spike^> you can do what you like.. and other do what they like...
22:07:05  <^Spike^> combines to a nice piece of work :)
22:07:07  <V453000> all of us here are utterly lazy :)
22:07:10  <planetmaker> outsourcing madness since 2009 - meet our V ;-)
22:07:15  <glevans2> heh
22:07:18  <V453000> because we just cant put enough effort to play our own games :D
22:07:38  <planetmaker> except Progman ;-)
22:07:38  <^Spike^> nah.. it's more... ehm... ok... is this.. ehm.. yeah.. it will work... i think...
22:07:49  <V453000> :S
22:07:49  <^Spike^> then you made the whole network and you go like: Oh... it looks good and works
22:07:53  <^Spike^> then you notice all the holdups
22:08:02  <^Spike^> and just throw it away cause it's too much work :)
22:08:04  <planetmaker> (will he wake-up now? I recall we made fun of him by calling the PSB stations always Progman-style :-) )
22:08:19  <planetmaker> though it'd be a proper name...
22:08:40  <Progman> I'm still awake
22:08:45  <V453000> \o/
22:08:54  <planetmaker> juho :-)
22:08:56  <Progman> \o/
22:09:15  <Ammler> /o\
22:09:23  <^Spike^> it's alive!.. oh ehm..
22:09:31  * ^Spike^ goes back to boring WEP cracking..
22:09:37  <planetmaker> tsk
22:09:51  <planetmaker> ^Spike^: why did we member you... ? :-P
22:09:57  <^Spike^> ehm.. ask odm? :)
22:09:58  <Ammler> you still have WEP encrypted Wifi around?
22:10:06  <^Spike^> nah.. i did get it to work
22:10:13  <^Spike^> now terrorizing the neighbourhood :)
22:10:20  <planetmaker> lool
22:10:27  <^Spike^> as far as i get that to work.. :)
22:10:29  <planetmaker> good that I have wpa2
22:10:41  <^Spike^> wpa2.. i hope with self made passphrase :D
22:10:42  <planetmaker> and not you as my neighbour ;-)
22:10:44  <Ammler> at that time, it was more secure to just make MAC address restrictions
22:10:45  <^Spike^> wpa2 is crackable.. :)
22:10:48  <^Spike^> just takes time
22:10:50  <planetmaker> ^Spike^: take your bet
22:11:04  <planetmaker> the participants of the 20k party complained about its length :-)
22:11:09  <^Spike^> Ammler mac restrictions/filtering doesn't help if i spot the mac of 1 of the clients connected to it
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22:11:30  <^Spike^> then i can spoof the mac address to do what i want :)
22:11:49  <^Spike^> basicly only way you're safe is WPA/wpa2 with a long passphrase :)
22:11:51  <planetmaker> ^Spike^: both :-)
22:12:02  <^Spike^> pm both what? :)
22:12:13  <planetmaker> mac + strong pw + good cipher
22:12:21  <planetmaker> s/cipher/algorithm/
22:12:24  <^Spike^> true.. but still macs are spoofable.. :)
22:12:28  <planetmaker> sure
22:12:38  <^Spike^> so that just disables the script kiddies :)
22:12:39  <Ammler> have the wifi outside of your lan and use vpn :-P
22:12:45  <^Spike^> :)
22:12:52  <planetmaker> ^Spike^: and what do you do, if noone is connected?
22:12:57  <^Spike^> ehm... with WEP?
22:13:05  <^Spike^> try to make it make arp requests etc :)
22:13:08  <^Spike^> with WPA?
22:13:09  <^Spike^> i'm screwed
22:13:13  <^Spike^> and need to wait for a client
22:13:20  <^Spike^> but.. if i got a client.. i got a handshake
22:13:20  <planetmaker> :-)
22:13:26  <^Spike^> if i got a handshake i can use a cracker :)
22:13:33  <^Spike^> if there are clients on the network already...
22:13:34  <planetmaker> yup
22:13:38  <^Spike^> i just force a reauth
22:13:41  <^Spike^> by deauthing them
22:13:47  <^Spike^> that way i get the handshake
22:13:53  <^Spike^> and see a few lines above :)
22:13:57  <planetmaker> I guess my pw is about 20 characters or so... that's good enough, especially as it's more than alphanumeric ;-)
22:14:03  <Ammler> is that legal in NL?
22:14:05  <^Spike^> :)
22:14:07  <^Spike^> ehm...
22:14:21  <^Spike^> ehm...
22:14:23  <^Spike^> prob not :)
22:14:36  <planetmaker> :-D
22:14:44  <^Spike^> but as long as i don't change stuff who will notice... it's just a simple test... i get my results for my subject.. and delete the data
22:14:51  <Ammler> better question might be, is it illegal, I wouldn't know
22:14:59  <^Spike^> Ammler better question: Is it legal anywhere? ;)
22:15:02  <planetmaker> cat /whois ^spike^ > /dev/police/nl ? ;-)
22:15:29  <^Spike^> you just get the ip of the bnc here :)
22:15:42  <Ammler> it might not be legal anyway, but it might also not be a crime everywhere
22:16:00  <glevans2> haha.... I would hope he wouldn't get caught that easy...
22:16:15  <KenjiE20> afaik it's illegal to hack an AP hat you *don't* own
22:16:21  <^Spike^> true...
22:16:39  <planetmaker> and which you have no contract for hacking for ;-)
22:16:46  <KenjiE20> yeah
22:16:46  <^Spike^> KenjiE20 i can't help it they send packages through the air.. and my wlan just captures them :)
22:17:17  <KenjiE20> heh, there's four SSIDs on only two channels around here :p
22:17:22  <^Spike^> :)
22:17:32  <KenjiE20> gerrof my wavelengths
22:17:41  <^Spike^> if i'm outside (where it's cold.. been there earlier this night to test) i can get about.. 10-15 APs
22:17:46  <Mazur> I'm within a police Wifi area.
22:17:49  <planetmaker> there are >= 8 WLAN around here
22:18:05  <KenjiE20> got about 6 total, plus my non broadcasting AP
22:18:07  <^Spike^> alot of them have wpa(2) but like 25% uses wep
22:18:11  <^Spike^> and a few a just open
22:18:20  <^Spike^> non broadcasting AP doesn't say a thing
22:18:22  <planetmaker> with such nice names as "Penunientopf" and "Scheißegal" :-P
22:18:32  <^Spike^> ti still broadcasts but just doesn't show... until enough packages are captured
22:18:50  <^Spike^> my own AP at home shouldn't broadcast either..
22:18:52  <KenjiE20> it would stop a casual drive by though
22:18:53  <^Spike^> it shows up as hidden
22:19:06  <^Spike^> the more packages it sends out (like to my phone for example)
22:19:10  <^Spike^> adter 5 mins
22:19:13  <^Spike^> i got the ESSID
22:19:15  <^Spike^> after*
22:20:05  <planetmaker> ^Spike^: the German federal court just ruled that even deep links are illegal, if the webpage itself makes it clear that the content itself shall not be accessible directly or via deep links
22:21:19  <planetmaker> so even a non-working security system is enough to be able to sue other people for walking around it
22:21:45  <planetmaker> like... leave the window open, lock the door and sue the person who walks through the window...
22:22:54  <^Spike^> KenjiE20 just for example my AP now shows in some monitor this:
22:22:55  <^Spike^> 54e WPA2 TKIP PSK <length: 8>
22:23:17  <^Spike^> and already now:
22:23:17  <^Spike^> 54e WPA2 TKIP PSK tomaatje
22:23:18  <^Spike^> this
22:23:26  <^Spike^> under a minute even
22:23:30  <theholyduck> planetmaker, so, are you saying
22:23:38  <theholyduck> that my favorite way of passing time
22:23:39  <theholyduck> url guessing
22:23:43  <theholyduck> is now illegal in germany?
22:23:50  <^Spike^> so not broadcasting the ssid doesn't say much :)
22:23:59  <planetmaker> doing it commercially is
22:24:09  <KenjiE20> heh, true enough
22:24:29  <^Spike^> just makes it harder for ppl using their avg windows client
22:24:35  <^Spike^> cause they need to guess an AP name
22:24:42  <^Spike^> but with monitoring software it doesn't take long :)
22:24:57  <^Spike^> ap name is send somehow.. cause the client needs to verify if it's connected right? :D
22:25:02  <planetmaker> the case was such that there was a map service which actually tried to sell maps. But there was a way to directly link to the maps. And another company did that, without using the authentication mechanism which the map service wanted to be used (and paid for)
22:31:44  <^Spike^> oh well.. for me it's just a simple college research thingie i mainly use my own AP
22:32:49  <^Spike^> but if you know your own pass it's always easy... i intent not to harm anyone in anyway when doing it somewhere else
22:35:39  <^Spike^> and then.. silence dawned upon us.. or something? :)
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