Log for #openttdcoop on 9th March 2012:
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03:20:08  <thecogwheel> !password
03:20:09  <PublicServer> thecogwheel: snuffs
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03:44:22  <xav> !password
03:44:23  <PublicServer> xav: lander
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03:44:58  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> hiya
03:45:01  <PublicServer> <Xav> hello
03:45:16  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> yay i can blow stuff up again! :)
03:45:35  <PublicServer> <Xav> by which you mean build :-p
03:45:57  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> destroy stuff that was built to make it more efficient, so yeah :P
03:47:32  <PublicServer> <Xav> I wish the city would build just a bit faster
03:47:54  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> yeah to SE ^^
03:48:00  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> SW*
04:04:10  <PublicServer> <Xav> gotta switch comps, but I'll leave this open. The other one tends to bring the router down, jfyi
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05:44:02  <Steven> !password
05:44:02  <PublicServer> Steven: friars
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05:44:21  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> hello
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05:56:39  <Steven> It's night where I am, I need to go to bed, gn.
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06:23:14  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> nn
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07:27:44  <Hazzard> !password
07:27:44  <PublicServer> Hazzard: tolled
07:27:46  <Hazzard> !players
07:27:48  <PublicServer> Hazzard: Client 2417 (Orange) is Xav, in company 1 (Skyscrapist inc.)
07:27:48  <PublicServer> Hazzard: Client 1586 is Sietse, a spectator
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07:28:38  <Hazzard> DAMMIT
07:28:41  <Hazzard> Whoops
07:28:42  <Hazzard> Caps
07:29:14  <PublicServer> *** Game still paused (number of players)
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07:29:44  <PublicServer> <Hazzard> 1.3
07:29:50  <PublicServer> <Hazzard> very disapointing
07:30:25  <V453000> how can you be disappointed when you do nothing with it :)
07:30:56  <PublicServer> <Hazzard> Well, another disapointing thing is that I cant do anything with it
07:30:58  <PublicServer> <Hazzard> Due to my internet
07:31:20  <PublicServer> <Hazzard> The population a couple days ago was 1.3
07:31:26  <PublicServer> <Hazzard> At one point I saw it reach 1.4
07:31:35  <V453000> which isnt surprising since there were no changes made
07:31:38  <PublicServer> <Hazzard> I don't know how long it has been paused though
07:31:52  <PublicServer> <Hazzard> But the city should still grow
07:32:18  <V453000> well, it doesnt, so something needs to be done :)
07:33:33  <PublicServer> <Hazzard> The tall buildings cant seem to get past the mainline
07:34:31  <PublicServer> <Hazzard> GAY
07:34:37  <PublicServer> <Hazzard> My bad
07:34:44  <PublicServer> <Hazzard> My friend..
07:35:04  <PublicServer> <Hazzard> is2
07:35:14  <PublicServer> <Hazzard> \
07:35:16  <PublicServer> <Hazzard> ''
07:35:27  <Hazzard> Being attacked
07:35:28  <Hazzard> Sorry
07:35:49  <Hazzard> erm
07:35:51  <Hazzard> yeah
07:36:22  <V453000> wtf?
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07:38:35  <PublicServer> <Hazzard> sorry about that
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07:50:58  <Hazzard> !password
07:50:58  <PublicServer> Hazzard: brassy
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07:53:03  <Hazzard> Is the coopetition server ever up?
07:53:58  <V453000> dont know if it ever was
07:55:12  <V453000> the welcome stable pretty much works that way
07:55:20  <V453000> not officially, but does
07:58:08  <Hazzard> Ahh
07:58:20  <Hazzard> Is it up right now?
07:59:48  <V453000> pretty much always
08:00:08  <V453000> #openttdcoop.stable
08:00:20  <V453000> runs the latest stable(testing) releases
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08:37:47  <Vinnie_nl> !dl osx
08:37:47  <PublicServer> Vinnie_nl:
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08:39:32  <PublicServer> <Vinnie> hi
08:43:25  <PublicServer> <Vinnie>  @@records
08:43:27  <Webster> #openttdcoop Records: Clients: 26 | Trains: 2666 (PSG#219) - 2522 (PZG#5) - ( 3000 (PSG#180) logic net) | Single cargo type output: 200,169 (PZG#13) | World Pop: 6,150,671 (PSG#201) 
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10:21:34  <PublicServer> <bassals> hello!
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11:45:07  <Tray> !password
11:45:07  <PublicServer> Tray: refill
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15:49:06  <Firestar> hi
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15:57:06  <Troy_McClure> !password
15:57:06  <PublicServer> Troy_McClure: gropes
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16:04:04  <Troy_McClure> #openttcoop.stable
16:15:01  <thecogwheel> !password
16:15:01  <PublicServer> thecogwheel: bribed
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17:37:25  <morphee> Hello. How can I troubleshoot Autopilot+?
17:37:46  <morphee> I added it to my server successfully yet none of the included-by-default commands work
17:38:01  <morphee> Like writing "!version" in chat doesn't give any output
17:38:14  <morphee> !help
17:38:15  <PublicServer> morphee:
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17:39:57  <mfb-> hi
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17:51:27  <Chris_Booth> Hi!
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17:55:45  <hylje> hey
18:00:52  <Chris_Booth> hi hylje long time no speek
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18:10:27  <xav> !password
18:10:27  <PublicServer> xav: ocular
18:10:50  <xav> !password
18:10:50  <PublicServer> xav: pianos
18:11:07  <PublicServer> *** Game still paused (number of players)
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18:11:40  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> hello
18:11:48  <PublicServer> <Xav> hello
18:13:32  <PublicServer> <Xav> according to the pop count, the city has actually shrnk
18:13:42  <PublicServer> <Xav> *shrunk
18:14:41  <Chris_Booth> you must have moved the growth tunnels
18:15:46  <PublicServer> <Xav> the growth tunnels have been moved about, apparently
18:15:57  <PublicServer> <Xav> but I imagine there's a reason for it
18:17:35  <PublicServer> <Xav> actually, under this scheme, the outer ring of growth tunnels aren't connected to the city center at all
18:17:46  <PublicServer> <bassals> hello!
18:17:50  <PublicServer> <Xav> (well, they are, but not as growth tunnels)
18:17:52  <PublicServer> *** bassals has joined company #1
18:18:26  <mfb-> I am working on a new road layout in singleplayer
18:18:33  <mfb-> but it will not be compatible with this town
18:18:48  <PublicServer> <bassals> but why don't we start growing the city?
18:18:54  <mfb-> I guess it will show the real limit of town growth
18:19:06  <mfb-> bassals: you explain us how now?
18:19:34  <PublicServer> <bassals> ah, I thought that you had disconnected the tunnels
18:19:40  <PublicServer> <bassals> for it not to grow
18:19:51  <mfb-> I did not do anything today
18:20:03  <mfb-> (in the game)
18:20:06  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> i think part of the problem is that west was developed earlier so all of the population is moving in that direction
18:20:25  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> even the central part of town is receding from the west
18:20:26  <mfb-> that should just be a matter of old houses
18:20:32  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> err that first one was supposed to be east
18:20:41  <mfb-> and not modify new houses
18:21:25  <mfb-> road layout is the important thing
18:23:23  <mfb-> and, interesting enough: small houses and skyscrapers do the same thing in terms of city expansion
18:23:34  <mfb-> they just have different population/pax/whatever
18:23:47  <mfb-> but for town growth, both help in the same way
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18:34:05  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> oh... someone moved the West growth tunnel in towards the WEST station
18:34:28  <PublicServer> <Chris Booth> I added some bridges
18:34:30  <PublicServer> <Xav> its like that for all of them
18:34:52  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> i wonder if that's why population is receding from West?
18:35:02  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> 'cause it wasn't like that yesterday
18:35:05  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> :P
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18:41:34  <Tray> mfb, what you're up to and may I help in some regard?
18:44:07  <Tray> !password
18:44:07  <PublicServer> Tray: trader
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18:46:50  <Firestar> hows going with the growing?
18:46:58  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> negatively
18:47:10  <Firestar> !password
18:47:11  <PublicServer> Firestar: trader
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18:59:59  <mfb-> my single-player game is so slow :(
19:00:08  <hylje> gotta go fast
19:08:17  <V453000> mfb send me I can do some fast forwarding :)
19:08:35  <mfb-> ?
19:09:00  <mfb-> faster than "fast forward"?
19:17:55  <V453000> no but I think my cpu might be faster
19:18:54  <mfb-> no idea
19:20:18  <mfb-> it's not like the days are long. but the growth of a 2million+ city takes some decades ingame
19:20:40  <V453000> ah right
19:20:44  <V453000> nevermind then :)
19:21:02  <mfb-> 1,1 now
19:22:21  <mfb-> (and I don't want to spoil the concept at the moment :p)
19:22:48  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> hilbert curve? ;)
19:23:25  <mfb-> no
19:35:38  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> i think growth may be happening again. population bottomed out at 1345000ish and now it's above 13500000
19:35:53  <mfb-> 1,22... my city is coming :D
19:36:03  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> hehe
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20:03:30  <mfb-> 1,6 millions :)
20:05:24  <Tray> So, mind to share what your raoddesign makes it better than the current one?
20:08:22  <mfb-> less ways for the town to get lost somewhere
20:08:30  <mfb-> but first I want to test how big the city can become
20:13:43  <V453000> so each road from the center has no road junctions and connects to others at the outside?
20:14:15  <mfb-> well, that was the idea I tried first
20:14:22  <mfb-> I posted a screenshot here
20:14:30  <mfb-> but that has other problems
20:31:42  <mfb-> still growing at 1,73, but slower than before
20:33:06  <PublicServer> <Xav> I'm temporarily connecting other growth tunnels... city immediately starts to grow where they are
20:33:29  <mfb-> of course it does ;)
20:33:51  <PublicServer> <Tray> growing tunnels are not the problem and no solution either
20:34:01  <PublicServer> <Xav> right, but for receeding areas?
20:34:41  <V453000> my original testing file ... I apparently didnt save in the final stage but it was about 2.2M iirc
20:34:45  <V453000> going to get there again
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20:37:59  <PublicServer> <Xav> Tray, are you building?
20:38:13  <PublicServer> <Tray> no
20:38:19  <PublicServer> <Xav> alright, heading out
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20:38:59  <Booth> Hi all
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20:40:43  <mfb-> hi
20:41:01  <PublicServer> <Chris Booth> hi mfb
20:42:04  <Booth> oh thats my old old old nick XD
20:42:12  <Booth> I might keep it though :P
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20:52:27  <mfb-> well V: my target is to reach at least the München-savegame I showed you
20:53:15  <mfb-> hmm 2,2 million, too
20:53:27  <mfb-> so everything beyond that is new
20:56:56  <mfb-> but I think somewhere at this value is the limit
20:57:16  <mfb-> where the growth rate is equal to the rate of buildings which die
21:00:17  <V453000> I guess
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21:21:09  <Ryton> !password
21:21:09  <PublicServer> Ryton: wrests
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21:22:53  <PublicServer> <Ryton> South 07 fails to attract a train
21:22:57  <PublicServer> *** mfb joined the game
21:23:05  <PublicServer> <Ryton> and others too
21:23:08  <PublicServer> <Ryton> in the 7th line
21:24:54  <PublicServer> <Ryton> the signal should be 2-way I guess?
21:26:23  <PublicServer> <mfb> hmm
21:26:35  <PublicServer> <mfb> so many uncovered houses north of South 0x-y
21:27:53  <PublicServer> <mfb> but the pointless growinr bridges make it hard to change that
21:31:35  <PublicServer> <Ryton> are the orders for trains 996 , 923 etc normal? none at all?
21:31:54  <PublicServer> <Ryton> ok, its normal
21:31:57  <PublicServer> <Ryton> nvr mind
21:31:59  <PublicServer> <mfb> 996 has orders?
21:32:22  <PublicServer> <Ryton> no, just unload
21:32:49  <PublicServer> <mfb> 996 is at TW B-06
21:33:07  <PublicServer> <Ryton> oh, did I make a train error ? could be , sorry
21:33:13  <PublicServer> <mfb> and just unload is normal for south
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21:40:19  <PublicServer> <Ryton> still strange behaviour at South 07-3 and northward
21:40:25  <PublicServer> <Ryton> but I dont know what causes it
21:40:27  <PublicServer> <Ryton> trains wait at the wrong bays
21:40:41  <PublicServer> <Ryton> see !strange behaviour here
21:40:45  <PublicServer> <Ryton> I'm off :-)
21:40:52  <PublicServer> *** Ryton has left the game (leaving)
21:42:12  <PublicServer> <mfb> that is not so strange
21:42:26  <PublicServer> <mfb> what do you expect with these signals
21:55:40  <PublicServer> *** Chris Booth joined the game
21:55:54  <PublicServer> <Chris Booth> hi
21:57:41  <PublicServer> <Chris Booth> so you think that 2.2million is limit mfb?
21:57:56  <PublicServer> <mfb> something in this range
21:57:58  <PublicServer> <mfb> maybe 2.5
21:58:16  <PublicServer> <mfb> maybe different with different house sets
21:58:40  <PublicServer> <Chris Booth> I would think Total Tower or Jap Town would be higher than no Grfs
21:59:10  <PublicServer> <mfb> but I think house number is a better measurement
21:59:32  <PublicServer> <Chris Booth> I would guess so
21:59:34  <PublicServer> <Chris Booth> which is 50k?
21:59:52  <PublicServer> <mfb> 23k houses for ~2 millions
22:00:02  <PublicServer> <mfb> ~29k for 2.5
22:00:21  <PublicServer> <Chris Booth> so we are at the house limit then with 22k
22:00:55  <PublicServer> <mfb> not so far away at least
22:01:34  <PublicServer> <Chris Booth> then I guess we should contain the central city, and add some more
22:05:16  <PublicServer> <Chris Booth> mfb: does it make a difference if you use 3xn rather than 2xn grids?
22:06:06  <mfb-> I think the difference would be small. the 3n grid gets more houses far away from the city, probably more smaller houses
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22:07:38  <PublicServer> <Chris Booth> I guess station tiles also count toward your growth?
22:09:04  <PublicServer> *** Chris Booth has left the game (leaving)
22:09:37  <mfb-> ?
22:10:26  <Chris_Booth> I mean count against, a tile used for anything apart from a house / office near the centre reduces growth?
22:11:48  <mfb-> if the town can build the same house elsewhere: no
22:11:57  <Chris_Booth> ok
22:12:10  <mfb-> (and the town finds a place for it)
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22:21:18  <thecogwheel> just catching up with chat... btw: i re-instated the groth tunnels at the West edge and Southwest corners earlier this morning (around 6 hours ago) and that seemed to spark teh new growth
22:21:50  <thecogwheel> !password
22:21:50  <PublicServer> thecogwheel: molten
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22:33:20  <mfb-> 23800 houses, the town is really busy with rebuilding other houses
22:33:53  <mfb-> 2,05 millions, but I can boost that a bit by removing houses in some corners
22:34:21  <mfb-> I think that explains our problems in the PSG
22:34:28  <mfb-> the growth tunnels give new small houses
22:34:53  <mfb-> and too many houses are built there and not close to the city, therefore we get holes there
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22:39:06  <Dwarden> hi
22:40:58  <PublicServer> <Cogwheel> so population is going down because it's building a lot of low population buildings and removing high capacity ones?
22:42:21  <Dwarden> i have lil question, i was updating my old sets and ottd whichw as terribly out of date, as result i lost some grf/vector which shown icons like oil pump, cars etc. on towns, any idea which one was it or what i did to lose those ? :)
22:42:39  <Dwarden> all within towns
22:51:36  <mfb-> and removing high capacity ones? <-- well, they just die after some time
22:51:42  <mfb-> and the town does not replace enough
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22:52:03  <Dwarden> nvm, fixed
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23:01:03  <Tray> mfb-: So you suggest adding more towns?
23:01:29  <mfb-> to fill the map? I think this is the only way to really do that
23:01:35  <V453000> I agree
23:01:55  <V453000> and plan says it too I believe, contain center, do others on outside
23:02:26  <V453000> !password
23:02:26  <PublicServer> V453000: hooves
23:02:43  <PublicServer> *** V453000 joined the game
23:04:55  <PublicServer> <V453000> lets do that?
23:08:01  <PublicServer> <Tray> Let's do it.
23:08:13  <PublicServer> <Tray> Option disabled ):
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23:09:17  <thecogwheel> network plan says "grow 1 city over the whole map"
23:10:11  <thecogwheel> oh "if for any reason we cannot..."
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23:18:11  <PublicServer> <V453000> well not so hastily Tray
23:18:17  <PublicServer> <V453000> we should first contain the center town inside
23:18:19  <PublicServer> <V453000> and kill buildings outside
23:18:26  <PublicServer> <V453000> well outer buildings die on their own
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