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Log for #openttdcoop on 23rd November 2014:
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02:42:00  <Sylf> !password
02:42:00  <coopserver> Sylf: sooner
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05:58:42  <Big_MEECH> yoooooooooooo
05:59:39  <Big_MEECH> yolo! :P
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07:34:55  <Maraxus> !password
07:34:55  <coopserver> Maraxus: bijker
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09:46:12  <Vinnie> !password
09:46:12  <coopserver> Vinnie: commas
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10:28:34  <damalix> !password
10:28:34  <coopserver> damalix: dimmed
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10:30:01  <Vinnie> well well well
10:30:02  <coopserver> <Damalix> hellow
10:30:05  <Vinnie> i see you
10:30:09  <coopserver> <britboy3456> Hello
10:30:14  <Vinnie> hey\
10:31:21  <coopserver> <Damalix> trying to understand the industries
10:32:02  <Vinnie> i tought you knew yeti industries already
10:32:44  <coopserver> <Damalix> didn't play for a looong time
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10:34:53  <coopserver> <britboy3456> How do I find out CL?
10:35:47  <Vinnie> mostly experience
10:35:56  <coopserver> <britboy3456> MF Torture?
10:37:08  <theholyduck> well, as a general rule, if your CL is equal or longer than your TL then you are fine.
10:37:09  <Vinnie> MF?
10:37:33  <theholyduck> on slower trains you can go shorter, but, like, in generall, if unsure, just make them as long as your trains
10:37:36  <Vinnie> also i think there is a wiki page somewhere with a table
10:37:55  <theholyduck> not knowing any specifics of the map you are currently playing
10:38:03  <theholyduck> ah, planning phase
10:38:10  <theholyduck> !dl lin64
10:38:11  <coopserver> theholyduck: http://binaries.openttd.org/nightlies/trunk/r27018/openttd-trunk-r27018-linux-generic-amd64.tar.xz
10:39:00  <Vinnie> http://blog.openttdcoop.org/2009/05/13/about-curve-lengths/
10:39:28  <damalix> and you also can give it a try as some trains can get through shorter CL without slowing down
10:39:37  <Vinnie> if you know excell you can make an easy table with that formula
10:39:38  <coopserver> <britboy3456> That's what I'm about to do
10:39:40  <damalix> make a test track to test
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10:43:44  <V453000> !password
10:43:44  <coopserver> V453000: soften
10:45:25  <V453000> !password
10:45:25  <coopserver> V453000: signed
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10:45:41  <coopserver> <V453000> yoyo
10:51:34  <Vinnie> hey
10:51:37  <coopserver> <V453000> hihi
10:51:52  <coopserver> <V453000> I think you are missing 3AA, 3BB and 3CC in your plan
10:52:42  <Vinnie> damnit these codes again
10:52:58  <coopserver> <V453000> steel mill, power plant, refinery
10:53:09  <coopserver> <V453000> you only have Industrial Complex Iore/Uran/Oil
10:53:14  <coopserver> <V453000> and then machinery factory
10:53:38  <Vinnie> oke
10:53:50  <Vinnie> !password
10:53:50  <coopserver> Vinnie: signed
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10:54:51  <coopserver> <Vinnie> gonna combine that with port
10:56:16  <coopserver> <V453000> hm
10:56:22  <theholyduck> ;D thats a big grf i didnt have for playing on this game
10:56:25  * theholyduck is on a new install
10:56:32  <theholyduck> 368 megs of grfs :D
10:56:35  <coopserver> <V453000> port would be cute in the middle of Construciton yard and Food plant
10:56:39  <V453000> hi duck :)
10:56:42  <V453000> totally not my fault
10:56:43  <theholyduck> ello
10:56:52  <theholyduck> im guessing its NUTS thats nuts?
10:56:54  <theholyduck> and hueg
10:57:05  <theholyduck> or not
10:57:16  <theholyduck> is it yeti?
10:57:18  <V453000> YETI mainly
10:57:26  * theholyduck hasnt played with yeti 
10:57:27  <theholyduck> i think
10:57:31  <V453000> NUTS is just about 15MB (at the moment)
10:57:35  <V453000> then you are missing out a lot :
10:57:36  <V453000> :)
10:57:50  <V453000> NUTS will grow quickly too now, 32bpp in progress :)
10:58:24  <coopserver> <V453000> Vinnie: if you had port there, you could just transfer it to FPP pickup
10:58:48  <theholyduck> V453000, looking at the graphs for how it works
10:58:53  <theholyduck> a lot saner than most industry mods.
10:58:59  <theholyduck> sort of suprising comming from you
10:58:59  <V453000> it is very sane
10:59:08  <V453000> well it is sort of like nuts
10:59:16  <V453000> you as a player have a TON of options what to do
10:59:22  <V453000> but it works without stupid restrictions etc
11:00:21  <coopserver> <Vinnie> sylf also has nice plan
11:00:26  <coopserver> <V453000> yes
11:01:02  <damalix> !password
11:01:02  <coopserver> damalix: stream
11:01:04  <coopserver> <V453000> regarding the "how to send BDMT to merchant" I would just leave that to be done manually
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11:01:10  <coopserver> <V453000> like by adding more/less trains
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11:01:44  <coopserver> <Vinnie> my plan BM?
11:01:56  <coopserver> <V453000> well you have there try to find a way :
11:01:57  <coopserver> <V453000> :)
11:02:09  <coopserver> <V453000> ha maybe I know a solution
11:02:15  <coopserver> <Vinnie> my plan allowes multiple ways
11:02:25  <coopserver> <Vinnie> i tried a way before but became to restricting
11:02:56  <coopserver> <Vinnie> so leaving it builders choice seemed nice and more creative
11:03:13  <coopserver> <V453000> well sending excess BDMT to mechant isnt builders choice
11:03:17  <coopserver> <V453000> is systematically important
11:04:28  <coopserver> <V453000> how about something liek that
11:06:02  <coopserver> <V453000> "correct" BDMT count is hard to tell
11:06:12  <coopserver> <V453000> but around 1:5 sounds about right
11:06:24  <coopserver> <V453000> can be done by separate trains, probably for the better
11:06:55  <coopserver> <Vinnie> yeah that is a way
11:07:10  <coopserver> <V453000> I did the fixed ratio method, it worked well
11:07:28  <coopserver> <V453000> you can have like 1:4,5 and have them a bit emptier if you transfer less bdmt
11:08:00  <coopserver> <V453000> both  ways are controllable, but the combined trains work a lot nicer, because you can have trains for each SLH done very easily, and with very regular delivery of bdmt
11:08:09  <coopserver> <V453000> could matter with tropic towns
11:08:36  <coopserver> <Vinnie> i tought the SLH transfers could use smaller trains for regualar drops
11:08:44  <coopserver> <V453000> sure, also an option
11:08:53  <coopserver> <V453000> just having cargo rot in stations over time is ugly :)
11:09:39  <coopserver> <Vinnie> true but that would be part of the design you build
11:09:49  <coopserver> <Vinnie> if you build correctly it will not happen
11:11:44  <coopserver> <Vinnie> but dont you produce equal amounts of BM and food if you divide all traffic equally?
11:12:23  <coopserver> <V453000> you do which is why the merchant
11:13:23  <coopserver> <V453000> id say get heavy is better btw
11:13:30  <coopserver> <V453000> they dont care about CL2 that much either
11:14:28  <coopserver> <Vinnie> oke that needs some explaining then, look
11:14:37  <coopserver> <Vinnie>  @@(clcalc maglev 2)
11:14:38  <Webster> coopserver: A maglev Curve Length of 2 (3 half tiles) gives a speed of 264km/h or 165mph
11:14:59  <V453000> @clcalc
11:14:59  <Webster> V453000: (clcalc <railtype> [<tilt>] <cl|km/h>) -- For a number <30 this calculates the speed for <cl> on <railtype>. For any other numbers, this calculates the CL required for <railtype> travelling at <km/h>, assuming TL is small enough. [<tilt>] will apply tilt bonuses to the calculation.
11:15:04  <V453000> @clcalc maglev tilt 2
11:15:04  <Webster> V453000: A maglev Curve Length of 2 (3 half tiles), with tilt bonus, gives a speed of 316km/h or 197mph
11:15:06  <coopserver> <Vinnie> pet destroyer already goes 334
11:15:13  <coopserver> <V453000> yes because short wagons
11:15:19  <coopserver> <V453000> similar effect as tilt
11:15:36  <coopserver> <Vinnie> first time someone tells me :D
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11:16:16  <coopserver> <Vinnie> what defines short wagons then?
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11:17:46  <theholyduck> !password
11:17:46  <coopserver> theholyduck: bigger
11:17:49  <coopserver> <V453000> 2x wagon?
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11:18:04  <coopserver> <V453000> btw nuts wiki says it
11:18:16  <coopserver> <Vinnie> so if a wagon is 2x, it is short and the train using it will have tilt?
11:19:07  <coopserver> <Player> i should probably get some 32bbp base set aswell
11:19:15  <coopserver> <Player> looks a bit weird with original ttd graphics
11:19:20  <coopserver> <Player> oh
11:19:24  <coopserver> *** Player has changed his/her name to theholyduck
11:19:32  <coopserver> <theholyduck> derp
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11:19:52  <coopserver> <theholyduck> but yeah, your industries look a bit weird with the original ttd graphics next to them
11:21:02  <coopserver> <V453000> brb lunch
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11:22:28  * damalix goes for lunch too
11:23:10  <coopserver> <Vinnie> oke im gonna type some stuff hopeing you read it back
11:23:41  <coopserver> <Vinnie> So reading some more i see you need 10 food and 1 bmt for each 50 citizens
11:24:13  <coopserver> <Vinnie> making the conversion rate 1:5 as you suggested
11:24:31  <coopserver> <Vinnie> changing my plan with your port input
11:25:10  <coopserver> <Vinnie> where we use one massive logic device to reach that conversion rate and send trains to the yards directly
11:25:22  <coopserver> <Vinnie> removing thew slh transfers
11:25:50  <coopserver> <Vinnie> that is how i understand what you told me
11:27:25  <coopserver> <Vinnie> that will need shorter trains for drops to yards to make regular drops to grow towns
11:28:05  <coopserver> <Vinnie> but will that not make one giant mess out of the orerlist?
11:28:46  <coopserver> <V453000> back
11:28:48  <coopserver> <Vinnie> given that the logic will require 4 orders + 1 for drop meaning maximum 50 yeti stations in the orderlist
11:29:28  <coopserver> <V453000> meh doesnt matter much :)
11:29:41  <coopserver> <V453000> all of the options you mention work, really
11:29:46  <coopserver> <V453000> just a bit differently
11:30:18  <coopserver> <V453000> nyway, back later
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11:32:01  <Vinnie> cya
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12:12:00  <coopserver> <Damalix> yeti are attached to towns and the bigger the town the most yeti in the yard, right ?
12:20:05  <Vinnie> thats what this: http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/6663/YETIscheme08-05.png tells me
12:26:09  <Suicyder> I should try the whole yeti thing once
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14:28:55  <Vinnie> !playercount
14:28:55  <coopserver> Vinnie: There are currently 1 players and 2 spectators, making a total of 3 clients connected
14:54:36  *** Vinnie is now known as Vinnie_nl
15:01:32  <Vinnie_nl> !password
15:01:32  <coopserver> Vinnie_nl: bigger
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16:08:19  <Maraxus> !password
16:08:19  <coopserver> Maraxus: speeds
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16:19:15  <coopserver> <Vinnie> hey
16:23:19  <Maraxus> hi
16:23:47  <coopserver> <Vinnie> want to start some voting?
16:23:56  <Maraxus> sure
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16:24:10  <Maraxus> @stage Voting
16:24:10  *** Webster changes topic to "Cooperative OpenTTD | PSG290 (r27018) | STAGE: Voting | New players, use @quickstart and !help | www.openttdcoop.org | TS3: voice.openttdcoop.org"
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16:25:56  <Vinnie_nl> !rcon move 1040 255
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16:26:13  <Vinnie_nl> you been in company all day, im thinking you are afk, thats why
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16:33:14  <V453000> !password
16:33:14  <coopserver> V453000: picker
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16:33:32  <coopserver> <V453000> yoyo
16:33:38  <coopserver> <Maraxus> hi V
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16:39:09  <coopserver> <V453000> Vinnie I think you should specify How does 5X distribute to all, how 2X distributes to all, and how to decide 1X -> 5X etc
16:39:18  <coopserver> <V453000> because that is very unclear in the plan
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16:44:26  <coopserver> <Vinnie> fixed
16:44:56  <coopserver> <Vinnie> 1X to 5X is basicly what you do in your SLH
16:45:21  <coopserver> <Vinnie> and that one is different depending on what the builder makes
16:45:40  <coopserver> <Vinnie> no fixed design more options for a builder
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16:55:26  <coopserver> <V453000> Vinnie I think code says per houses
16:55:33  <coopserver> <V453000> which means no ratio between bdm
16:55:35  <coopserver> <V453000> and food
16:55:37  <coopserver> <V453000> can be fedined
16:56:23  <coopserver> <V453000> no fixed design for things which define how whole network can work is bullshit
16:56:29  <coopserver> <V453000> plan has to say that
16:58:19  <coopserver> <Vinnie> not whole network just the BM to Port part
16:58:33  <coopserver> <V453000> and BM to elsewhere?
16:58:48  <coopserver> <Vinnie> same as food on the right side
16:59:04  <coopserver> <V453000> sure but how do you decide amount of bdmt that goes to 5X
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16:59:27  <coopserver> <Vinnie> that will be different in each slh
16:59:34  <coopserver> <Vinnie> as the guy building it makes it
16:59:39  <coopserver> <V453000> what
16:59:48  <coopserver> <V453000> bdmt going to the merchant is only 1 place?
17:00:02  <coopserver> <V453000> you would need to have one 5X per SLH with what you just said
17:00:06  <coopserver> <Vinnie> BM from 1X always goes to a SLH
17:00:16  <coopserver> <V453000> oh wtf
17:00:19  <coopserver> <Vinnie> if it is not needed it will overflow to a port
17:00:22  <coopserver> <V453000> ._.
17:00:30  <coopserver> <V453000> that is very bad.
17:00:36  <coopserver> <V453000> taking cargo back and forth
17:00:47  <coopserver> <Vinnie> yes i agree it is bad
17:00:50  <coopserver> <Vinnie> but
17:00:54  <coopserver> <V453000> ...
17:01:07  <coopserver> <Vinnie> it is the only way too make something up that lets people
17:01:27  <coopserver> <Vinnie> create there own mechanisms to trade excess overflow to port
17:01:45  <coopserver> <Vinnie> whilst allowing a clean orderlist from the main stations
17:01:53  <coopserver> <V453000> that is utter bs
17:01:59  <coopserver> <Vinnie> how so
17:02:20  <coopserver> <V453000> if you want people to make their own mechanism then let them have a port at each SLH
17:02:22  <coopserver> <V453000> not bring it back the whole way
17:02:55  <coopserver> <V453000> OR, a centralized method - create a ratio at the 1X -> food plant already and pickup everything at the food plant, both food and bdmt
17:03:00  <coopserver> <Vinnie> didn't cross my mind, but yes you are right
17:03:20  <coopserver> <V453000> if someone needs more BDMT, they just pickup more, and make less trains go to 5X by simple logic
17:03:39  <coopserver> <Vinnie> that is a way
17:03:51  <coopserver> <Vinnie> and it means building logic once
17:04:05  <coopserver> <Vinnie> and then all other players look at it and accept it
17:04:16  <coopserver> <Vinnie> or have fun and design your own contraption
17:04:20  <coopserver> <V453000> god
17:04:25  <coopserver> <V453000> you can just edit the thing
17:04:30  <coopserver> <V453000> which you will need to do
17:04:33  <coopserver> <Vinnie> i know
17:04:41  <coopserver> <Vinnie> but that is work for 1 player
17:04:49  <coopserver> <Vinnie> not everyone on this server
17:04:50  <coopserver> <V453000> and people wont build a contraption, people will simply put x amount of trains to 5X
17:05:22  <coopserver> <Vinnie> i was hopeing people would use more skill here
17:05:38  <coopserver> <V453000> logic doesnt necessarily mean skill
17:05:48  <coopserver> <V453000> and if you cant even define ratio between bdmt and food
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17:08:16  <V453000> gtg
17:08:27  <coopserver> <Vinnie> no i cant because its like my first game with the new stuff
17:08:44  <coopserver> <Vinnie> and i based plan on what i know so far
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17:42:10  <o11c> !password
17:42:10  <coopserver> o11c: dimmed
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17:56:40  <coopserver> <britboy3456> Is anyone around who can explain Vinnie's plan to me?
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18:12:44  <Sylf> !password
18:12:44  <coopserver> Sylf: rename
18:12:49  <coopserver> *** Game still paused (connecting clients, number of players)
18:12:56  <coopserver> *** Sylf has joined
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18:15:59  <coopserver> <Vinnie> back
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18:31:34  *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Maraxus
18:35:00  <Maraxus> @stage Voting
18:35:00  *** Webster changes topic to "Cooperative OpenTTD | PSG290 (r27018) | STAGE: Voting | New players, use @quickstart and !help | www.openttdcoop.org | TS3: voice.openttdcoop.org"
18:35:04  <Maraxus> !password
18:35:04  <coopserver> Maraxus: listen
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18:45:28  <britboy3456> !password
18:45:28  <coopserver> britboy3456: severe
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19:26:35  <Sylf> !password
19:26:35  <coopserver> Sylf: dialog
19:26:48  <coopserver> *** Game still paused (connecting clients, number of players)
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19:41:45  *** Progman_ is now known as Progman
20:10:01  <V453000> !password
20:10:02  <coopserver> V453000: prints
20:10:28  <coopserver> *** Game still paused (connecting clients, number of players)
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20:10:38  <coopserver> *** Game still paused (number of players)
20:10:38  <coopserver> *** Game unpaused (number of players)
20:10:41  <coopserver> <V453000> yoyo
20:10:52  <coopserver> <V453000> wat up Sylf :)
20:11:58  <coopserver> <V453000> Sylf what TL /engines does your plan use?
20:12:08  <o11c> didn't it say "fast" ?
20:13:11  <coopserver> <V453000> I cant see it anywhere :d
20:13:16  <coopserver> <V453000> might be blind
20:13:27  <coopserver> <V453000> it only says TL5 The Fall for pax network
20:22:08  <coopserver> *** V453000 has joined spectators
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20:24:01  <coopserver> <V453000> manual control ftw :)
20:26:10  <o11c> !password
20:26:10  <coopserver> o11c: spaced
20:26:13  <coopserver> *** Game still paused (connecting clients, number of players)
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20:28:40  <coopserver> <o11c> have to say Sylf's plan does feel weird with no actual diagram
20:28:46  <coopserver> *** o11c has joined spectators
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20:29:02  <coopserver> <V453000> none is necessary
20:29:24  <coopserver> <o11c> but where do you actually choose the industries and such?
20:29:36  <coopserver> <V453000> on the go :)
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20:30:16  <Sylf> we're capable of playing chaos games
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20:30:25  <Hazzard> !players
20:30:25  <coopserver> Hazzard: There are currently 0 players and 4 spectators, making a total of 4 clients connected
20:30:27  <Hazzard> !password
20:30:27  <coopserver> Hazzard: locale
20:30:33  <Sylf> consider my plan as semi chaos.
20:30:43  <Sylf> times two.
20:30:57  <coopserver> *** Game still paused (connecting clients, number of players)
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20:31:31  <coopserver> <V453000> as long as you make the gap between LR and build hubs far from each other (should be moderately easy to do), you are fine
20:31:33  <coopserver> *** Game still paused (connecting clients, number of players)
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20:31:44  <coopserver> <V453000> which is why Sylf writes L____R not LR
20:32:00  <coopserver> *** Hazzard has joined spectators
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20:32:06  <coopserver> <V453000> the only thing that is unnecessary in the plan is I think the extra worker yards in the start
20:32:15  <coopserver> <V453000> you can get it working from scratch with 9 I believe
20:32:29  <coopserver> <V453000> it will just take a little longer
20:33:04  <coopserver> <Maraxus> seems voting is nearly done
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20:34:35  <coopserver> <V453000> Sylf is it 1 worker yard has exclusive access to only one "primary" ?
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20:39:22  <coopserver> <Sylf> v: yes
20:39:48  <coopserver> *** Sylf has joined company #1
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20:40:24  <britboy3456> !password
20:40:24  <coopserver> britboy3456: locale
20:40:29  <coopserver> *** Game still paused (connecting clients, number of players)
20:41:01  <coopserver> *** Game still paused (number of players)
20:52:31  <V453000> right :)
20:52:32  <V453000> sgood
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21:23:59  <Hazzard> !players
21:23:59  <coopserver> Hazzard: There are currently 0 players and 3 spectators, making a total of 3 clients connected
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23:11:09  <Djanxy> !password
23:11:09  <coopserver> Djanxy: visual
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