Log for on 9th May 2009:
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11:26:49  <Hirundo> !playercount
11:26:50  <Tycoon> Hirundo: Number of players: 0
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12:48:11  <Brot> [IS2 log] [IS] Do not pay sharing fees if the vehicle owner cannot afford them. This prevents exploits. (Swallow) -
12:50:39  <SmatZ> coo, I can use others' tracks for free :)
12:50:41  <SmatZ> l
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13:11:25  <Hirundo> the track owner will be warned with a news message, though
13:15:56  <Ammler> SmatZ: better idea?
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13:40:10  <Brot> [IS2 log] [IS] Do not use the same variable name twice and expect everything to work as it should. (Swallow) -
13:40:17  <Brot> [IS2 log] [IS] Enumify the line numbers of the sharing window. (Swallow) -
13:40:23  <Brot> [IS2 log] [IS] Reorganize SharingSettingsWindow::OnClick. (Swallow) -
13:46:10  <Brot> [IS2 log] [IS] Simplify ShouldDrawLine() in the sharing window. (Swallow) -
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13:49:10  <Brot> [IS2 log] [IS] Remove hard-coded string left/right offsets. (Swallow) -
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13:52:12  <Brot> [IS2 log] (svn r16259) -Codechange: Added nested widgets to the load and save dialogue windows. (alberth) -
13:52:18  <Brot> [IS2 log] (svn r16260) -Codechange: Add Vehicle::IncrementOrderIndex() to deduplicate some code. (frosch) -
13:52:24  <Brot> [IS2 log] Merge from trunk (Swallow) -
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14:09:26  <SmatZ> Ammler: this doesn't prevent "exploit" by borrowing millions and then spending them
14:10:00  <Ammler> how do you borrow millions?
14:10:11  <Brot> [IS2 log] [IS] Add some padding around the on/off and arrow buttons in the sharing window. (Swallow) -
14:12:08  <SmatZ> Ammler: from bank?
14:12:17  <SmatZ> in the Company finances window?
14:12:52  <Hirundo> In general the bank only allows a couple of hundred thousand pounds, inflation-adjusted
14:14:10  <Ammler> well, IS will never be able to run without rules, like trunk won't
14:14:56  <Hirundo> SmatZ: It could be changed to become similar to the 'give money to xxx' function
14:15:16  <Hirundo> i.e. only allow fees to be paid above (money - loan)
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14:19:28  <Ammler> Hirundo: is it possible to "save" the dept
14:19:37  <Ammler> so it could paid, when available?
14:21:14  <Hirundo> possible: yes; worth the work and complication: questionable
14:21:53  <Ammler> well, possible is everything
14:22:38  <Ammler> the problem is just, if you also include (money-loan), you can transport for free.
14:47:03  <Hirundo> companies can just choose not to allow you until you have enough money?
14:48:12  <Hirundo> or introduce a new patch setting?
14:49:19  <planetmaker> moin
14:50:18  <planetmaker> Hirundo: I guess it will help this patch in the eyes of a lot of people, if we have an option like "allow sharing only to companies with value > xxx"
14:50:45  <Hirundo> I would not use company value for this purpose
14:50:49  <planetmaker> default = -1 == allow always
14:51:00  <planetmaker> What would you use?
14:51:15  <Hirundo> money or (money - loan)
14:51:16  <planetmaker> it directly relates to being able to pay :)
14:51:29  <Hirundo> company value isn't measured properly
14:51:41  <planetmaker> well. ok. money - load then :)
14:51:45  <Hirundo> I can increase it by e.g. building pointless road stops
14:51:56  <Hirundo> + it is expensive to calculate and, IIRC, not cached
14:52:12  <planetmaker> Hirundo: but cash is deducted and a road stop built -> no gain - or do I err on that?
14:52:34  <Hirundo> road stop is worth far more in the company value calculation
14:52:40  <planetmaker> oh, ok
14:53:10  <Ammler> it doesn't need a setting, you know, you don't get money, if the other company is in dept, still. So you if you won't let him run for free, don't share.
14:53:14  <planetmaker> well. My main point is not "company value" but "need to have option..." :)
14:53:53  <Ammler> -you
15:01:09  <Hirundo> -> Make a decision and I shall implement it.
15:01:20  <planetmaker> :O
15:02:23  <planetmaker> It's mostly your patch :) But if company value isn't cashed... money - loan is a fine thing
15:03:09  <planetmaker> Also it was my thought that company value was linear in the price of things and not doing some fancy "adjustments". So another point for your proposal.
15:03:52  <planetmaker> Though I'd like this option to be configurable
15:04:37  <Hirundo> Your wish is my command :P
15:04:45  <planetmaker> he...
15:04:45  <Hirundo> An advanced setting seems wise indeed
15:05:16  <planetmaker> yet another... :P
15:05:42  <Hirundo> _settings_game.sharing._yet_another_advanced_setting ?
15:06:16  <planetmaker> sound exactly like what we want :P
15:06:33  <planetmaker> or maybe _settings_game.sharing.new_advanced_setting
15:06:56  <planetmaker> it would open the opportunity for ...sharing.even_newer_advanced_setting later on
15:08:13  <planetmaker> the question is: how is that money called: cash - loan?
15:08:42  <Hirundo> allow_payment_in_debt is the new setting name
15:10:08  <Hirundo> edit: "payment_in_debt" is shorte
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15:15:38  <Ammler> well, I like settings.
15:17:11  <Ammler> but that settings also allow to go to minus like before your last changeset?
15:19:17  <Ammler> so you can still play a cooperative sharing game.
15:20:12  <planetmaker> Ammler: if disabled nothing changes
15:20:44  <planetmaker> if enabled, you'll have to start differently as each company has to make some money before they can use other company's infrastructure.
15:21:52  <Ammler> they can use it, but they wont pay
15:21:55  <Ammler> '
15:22:44  <Ammler> one usage of IS is to split infra and operating
15:23:38  <planetmaker> dunno. What does Hirundo think?
15:23:46  <planetmaker> Ternary logic :P
15:24:03  * Hirundo fails to see the problem
15:25:03  <planetmaker> Hirundo: no problem. Just a decision: disallow sharing, if in debt, or just make it free for that company :)
15:25:20  <Hirundo> currently it is made free
15:25:25  <planetmaker> ok. Good.
15:25:39  <Hirundo> the decision is left to the infra owner whether he wants to allow that or not
15:25:48  <planetmaker> yep, true
15:26:01  <planetmaker> disallow isn't needed.
15:27:21  * Hirundo pushed
15:28:26  * planetmaker pulls
15:28:41  <planetmaker> :O
15:28:45  <planetmaker> many updates.
15:28:53  <planetmaker> ah.. trunk merges
15:29:10  <Brot> [IS2 log] [IS] Add a setting to allow / disallow payment of sharing fees by companies in debt (Swallow) -
15:31:04  <Ammler> but Hirundo is the setting now splitted for money < 0 or money-loan <0 ?
15:31:16  <Hirundo> no
15:31:31  <Ammler> which one?
15:31:40  <Hirundo> money-loan
15:32:10  <Ammler> that is fine, imo.
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19:52:57  <Booth> anyhting actualy going no here?
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20:01:34  <combuster> looks like there is...:)
20:02:14  <Tycoon> <Combuster> well, maybe
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20:03:52  <Tycoon> <Combuster> Hi matt
20:03:58  <Tycoon> <Combuster> ...Bye matt...
20:04:08  <Tycoon> <Combuster> :(
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