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00:03:13 *** Phazorx has quit IRC 00:19:31 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: 2cc train set - Revision 205: Change: simplify handling of pnfo files in the build system even mo... @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/2cctrainset/repository/revisions/205 (by planetmaker) 01:33:25 <Brot6> Backup done! (Usage: 56M) 01:33:25 <Brot6> Don't hit me!! I'm in the Twilight Zone!!! 02:04:02 <Brot6> 2cctrainset: Backup push to ssh://hg@bitbucket.org/OpenTTD/2cctrainset/ initiated. 05:52:45 *** DJNekkid has quit IRC 06:02:33 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 06:32:17 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: 2cc train set - Revision 206: Doc: document the desired directory structure within Makefile.config @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/2cctrainset/repository/revisions/206 (by planetmaker) 06:32:17 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: 2cc train set - Revision 207: Change: add a few more file types to .hgignore @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/2cctrainset/repository/revisions/207 (by planetmaker) 06:35:27 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 52: Add: template nfo for raw material industry (work in... @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/52 (by andythenorth) 06:36:37 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 06:38:31 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: 2cc train set - Revision 208: Change: make sure that the bundle only contains files which shall b... @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/2cctrainset/repository/revisions/208 (by planetmaker) 06:39:10 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 06:39:29 <planetmaker> morning andythenorth :) 06:39:36 <andythenorth> morning 06:40:59 <planetmaker> Just something I noticed / like to point out: it might be a good idea to name all original nfo files to something like pnfo 06:41:34 <planetmaker> I then indicates that they're still subject to processing of the makefile. Even though in most cases that may just be copy it into a common file 06:42:06 <planetmaker> e.g. rename the template to template...pnfo 06:43:45 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 53: Change: added some missing comments to nfo @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/53 (by andythenorth) 06:43:56 <andythenorth> planetmaker: doing it now 06:44:06 <planetmaker> thanks :) 06:44:53 <planetmaker> I just played around with the 2cctrainset's makefile. And those changes look good and cleaner and I plan to transfer them here now :) 06:45:04 <planetmaker> Kinda heading to the universal makefile :) 06:45:16 <planetmaker> Of course I mis-use all these grfs for testing :P 06:46:01 <andythenorth> there was some discussion while you were away... 06:46:14 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 54: Change: renamed template_raw_material_industry.nfo t... @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/54 (by andythenorth) 06:46:23 <planetmaker> oh? what did I miss? 06:46:32 <planetmaker> there's no log, I guess :S 06:47:01 <planetmaker> or is there somewhere where I can read up on it? 06:47:18 <andythenorth> there wasn't much 06:47:24 <andythenorth> I was trying to figure out if we can use templating even more 06:47:41 <andythenorth> (just a minute) 06:48:03 <planetmaker> you mean like for the grf's name? 06:48:23 <andythenorth> I was looking at the defines for the dutch set 06:49:25 <andythenorth> FIRS will have around 60 industries... 06:49:46 <andythenorth> ...but the codebase for most will fall into one of a few common types 06:49:55 <andythenorth> i.e. raw material, secondary etc 06:50:09 <andythenorth> and I dislike lots of copy and paste to add code features, bug fixes 06:50:19 <planetmaker> understandable :) 06:50:30 <andythenorth> it looks like defines could be elegant, smart and labour saving 06:50:37 <andythenorth> if we go to the effort of setting them up 06:51:05 <planetmaker> sounds good to me in principle. I haven't looked much at the Dutch set, though, so far. 06:51:27 <andythenorth> it's the stations set that uses the defines 06:52:13 <andythenorth> for example: http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/dutchstations/repository/entry/ids.hnfo 06:53:40 <planetmaker> yes, that's the way to go, IMO, too 06:54:20 <planetmaker> defining theses names, makes it way less likely to mix up than mixing up numbers 06:55:04 <andythenorth> I think it will take some thought to make it work though 06:55:20 <andythenorth> I want to use it to define production value, accepted / produced cargo etc 06:55:24 <planetmaker> it will 06:55:52 <andythenorth> we will end up with some very long strings if that's the only way to provide variable names 06:55:59 <andythenorth> there's only one name space right? 06:56:07 <planetmaker> I have some drafts on this issue, but nothing really finished. 06:56:23 <planetmaker> but basically one could end up with a kind of pseudo-nfo 06:57:25 <andythenorth> ...which has been tried before...only wrong (IMO) 06:57:27 <planetmaker> where many numbers are replaced by far easier to understand strings like in the link you just gave 06:58:05 <andythenorth> I recall at least three attempts to provide a parser for a pseudo nfo 06:58:12 <andythenorth> they always fail on varaction 2 06:58:22 <planetmaker> yes. That's the hard part. 06:58:25 <andythenorth> the makefile defines solution is much better 06:58:33 <andythenorth> I'll write the varaction 2 in nfo 06:58:37 <andythenorth> as it should be done :) 06:58:38 <planetmaker> Not sure that we should attempt a complete parser, though 06:58:50 <planetmaker> he, yes :) 07:01:13 <planetmaker> in any case I prefere a step-by-step implementation 07:01:31 <planetmaker> e.g. starting with using global IDs for the single industries as a starter 07:01:40 <planetmaker> and then one could go further, if desired 07:02:41 <planetmaker> depends on how broad you want to define the word "template" :) 07:03:58 <planetmaker> simple defines which replace a string by the appropriate number are actually quite easy 07:04:11 *** DJNekkid has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 07:06:39 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 07:07:15 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 07:21:47 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 55: Fix #159, only depend on really needed files, rework... @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/55 (by planetmaker) 07:21:47 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #159 (Closed): sprites/nfo/.pnfo is required @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/159#change-522 (by planetmaker) 07:22:04 <DJNekkid> good morning planetmaker :) 07:22:13 <planetmaker> moin DJNekkid :) 07:23:15 <planetmaker> I made some changes to 2cctrainset... having the build system obey a bit more stringent system 07:23:25 <DJNekkid> i saw that 07:23:28 <planetmaker> :) 07:23:32 <DJNekkid> well, i saw the commits 07:23:32 <DJNekkid> :) 07:23:47 <planetmaker> all nfo files are renamed to pnfo :) 07:23:54 <DJNekkid> i have no idea on how thoose scripts work :) 07:24:16 <planetmaker> he :) 07:24:34 <planetmaker> quite easy actually. It's just a batch file with slightly different syntax so to speak 07:24:50 <DJNekkid> no doubt :) 07:24:51 <planetmaker> look for "grf: " and see what it does there 07:25:14 <DJNekkid> nah, currently waiting for the ferry (it leaves in 5 minutes), plus a 35 minute ride 07:25:21 <andythenorth> planetmaker: so does the makefile use make macros? 07:25:34 <DJNekkid> so i were thinking i should make the MU-template for the 2cc set 07:25:48 <planetmaker> andythenorth: not really. Though: what is a "macro"? 07:26:42 <planetmaker> it employs the usual operations available within a shell and combines them into a usable sequence 07:27:17 <planetmaker> btw, the makefile now does overwrite the previous nightly 07:27:26 <DJNekkid> btw planetmaker ... that mac of yours, does it have some kind of "mac linux" installed, or are OSX a linux-like OS ? 07:27:30 <planetmaker> I understood that you and Ammler liked that 07:27:46 <planetmaker> DJNekkid: it's quite similar, if you work with the command line 07:28:04 <planetmaker> in the heart a Mac is a linux-like OS 07:28:19 <planetmaker> on the surface, though, rather windows like :) 07:28:35 <planetmaker> with its distinct differences 07:29:20 <DJNekkid> well, i've driven mac a few times, and the GUI is windows ish 07:29:20 <DJNekkid> i were more thinking of the "core" now :p 07:29:59 <planetmaker> yes. The core is *nix like 07:30:06 <DJNekkid> oki :) 07:31:09 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 56: Fix (r52): the name is FIRS... @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/56 (by planetmaker) 07:33:30 <DJNekkid> planetmaker: are u SURE we cant just skip the MU express wagon? 07:33:33 <DJNekkid> it just causes problems! 07:34:05 <DJNekkid> for example: 07:34:10 <DJNekkid> build a TGV atlantique or thalys ... 07:34:32 <DJNekkid> add a few coaches. 07:34:32 <DJNekkid> clone it 07:34:32 <DJNekkid> and put them after eachother 07:35:00 <DJNekkid> now the gfx dont get where its supposed 07:35:17 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 07:35:30 <DJNekkid> same on BM73 07:36:13 <planetmaker> eh? Why should we skip them? 07:36:43 <DJNekkid> [09:34:56] <DJNekkid> now the gfx dont get where its supposed 07:37:09 <DJNekkid> unless we make it fixed consists (i.e. articulated vehicles) its not possible to get them at proper places 07:37:51 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 07:38:56 <DJNekkid> the TGV's loose their "powered wagons" 07:39:02 <DJNekkid> in the middle 07:39:11 <DJNekkid> the BM73 loose its panto on the 2nd concist 07:39:32 <DJNekkid> ET420 the same 07:40:29 <DJNekkid> thats why :) 07:41:39 <DJNekkid> Refits can be done either way, to mail and valuables 07:44:31 <planetmaker> you have me confused. You make it sound like I did or want to remove some wagons, the MU express wagon. 07:44:46 <DJNekkid> you did not 07:44:49 <DJNekkid> i want to remove the MU Express 07:45:14 <DJNekkid> and the normal PAX wagon torun to simply "MU wagon", but is also refittable to valuables and mail 07:45:33 <DJNekkid> torun=turn 07:46:16 <planetmaker> well... you know. I'm not a fan of that idea as a small purchase list is no gain as opposed to a refit-hassle. 07:46:25 <planetmaker> especially for mixed consists. 07:46:47 <DJNekkid> and when the gfx turns out wierd? 07:46:52 <planetmaker> eh? 07:46:59 <DJNekkid> as i saied 07:47:00 <planetmaker> what's wrong with as is? 07:47:00 <DJNekkid> build a TGV-A 07:47:09 <DJNekkid> add 5 MU wagons 07:47:16 <DJNekkid> (dont matter what kind) 07:47:16 <DJNekkid> clone it 07:47:30 <DJNekkid> put the two consists together, so it's one train 07:47:57 <DJNekkid> do the same with BM73 07:47:58 <DJNekkid> or ET420 07:51:39 <planetmaker> ok, I'll test it. Tonight hopefully. At work it's bad :P 07:52:03 <DJNekkid> i'll post a screenie... 07:56:57 <DJNekkid> http://redmine.ammler.ch/attachments/download/191/glitzhes.PNG 07:57:26 <DJNekkid> to put it this way, unless the train have symetric wagons, it will glitch 07:57:33 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: 2cc train set - glitzhes.PNG @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/191/glitzhes.PNG (by DJNekkid) 07:57:42 <Ammler> who is highlighting me? 07:57:48 <Ammler> good morning guys :-) 07:58:06 <DJNekkid> damn, ill change my bookmark! 08:03:24 <planetmaker> hello Ammler :) 08:04:04 <planetmaker> ok, I see that. Livery failure :) 08:04:32 <DJNekkid> well 08:04:48 <DJNekkid> no not really planetmaker... 08:04:56 <DJNekkid> its becuase it's _only_ 08:05:05 <DJNekkid> hmm 08:05:07 <DJNekkid> no 08:05:20 <DJNekkid> its because one can only check for two things 08:05:23 <DJNekkid> in this case atleast 08:05:35 <planetmaker> last and first wagon 08:05:41 <DJNekkid> yes 08:05:57 <planetmaker> but not something with two double headed engines (or more) 08:06:34 <DJNekkid> if i could use type 41, and not 40, i could check "number in a chain of vehicles of same vehicle ID" 08:06:47 <DJNekkid> and thus, if last in such a chain, use the proper wagon 08:07:37 <DJNekkid> or first, or whatever is needed :) 08:07:44 <planetmaker> and that means? 08:08:05 <planetmaker> can't you use prop41 on trains? 08:08:19 <DJNekkid> that, in theese cases would the panto or whatever be there in the 2nd consist as well 08:08:19 <DJNekkid> i.e. 08:09:13 <DJNekkid> the BM73's panto in the 2nd "part" of the train would be there 08:09:30 <DJNekkid> and on the TGV's would the "gray roofs" be there 08:32:17 *** DJ_Nekkid has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 08:32:38 *** DJNekkid has quit IRC 08:37:22 *** DJNekkid has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 08:39:12 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 08:40:20 *** DJ_Nekkid has quit IRC 08:40:24 *** DJ_Nekkid has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 08:45:23 *** DJNekkid has quit IRC 08:50:12 <DJ_Nekkid> what do u call a lesbian dinosaur? 08:52:14 *** Phazorx has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 09:06:28 *** Beardie has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 09:20:58 *** FooBar_ has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 09:22:13 *** Phazorx has quit IRC 09:23:54 *** Phazorx has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 09:29:42 *** DJNekkid has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 09:34:59 *** DJ_Nekkid has quit IRC 09:35:13 *** DJ_Nekkid has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 09:35:29 *** DJ_Nekkid has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 09:37:45 *** DJNekkid has quit IRC 10:04:02 <Brot6> 2cctrainset: Backup push to ssh://hg@bitbucket.org/OpenTTD/2cctrainset/ initiated. 10:04:08 <Brot6> firs: Backup push to ssh://hg@bitbucket.org/firs/firs/ initiated. 10:10:18 *** DJNekkid has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 10:13:02 *** DJ_Nekkid has quit IRC 10:13:28 *** DJ_Nekkid has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 10:17:48 *** DJ_Nekkid has quit IRC 10:18:23 *** DJNekkid has quit IRC 10:45:50 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 10:54:52 <FooBar_> Whoever finds my new grf in the Online Content gets to download it first! :P 10:56:24 <FooBar_> Too bad...already downloaded 3 times 10:56:45 * FooBar_ wonders how people find a completely unannounced grf 10:56:57 <Ammler> hehe 10:57:02 <Ammler> a lot just downlaod all 10:58:01 <FooBar_> that's quite a feat, as you have to check all boxes manually... 10:58:28 <FooBar_> 5 times... :S 10:59:08 <Ammler> 6 10:59:32 <FooBar_> I see 10:59:42 <Ammler> why do you mean unannouced? 11:00:17 <FooBar_> Well, apart from here I nowhere stated that I created and/or uploaded it to the content service 11:00:21 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 11:00:32 <planetmaker> He... the tbrs could need a big over-haul, too 11:00:48 <Ammler> hmm, just liked to say that 11:00:58 <planetmaker> but having "only" those limited bridge numbers is a bit sad. 11:01:22 <planetmaker> But especially sad is that road / rail is not separated from the brigde sprites themselves 11:01:26 <FooBar_> If that can be done in one pseudosprite like the grf I just did... :P 11:01:28 <planetmaker> *bridge 11:01:48 <FooBar_> Changes are underway with newroutes 11:02:04 <planetmaker> I know. But they're "underway" for 12(?) months or alike 11:02:23 <FooBar_> Might take a while still, but I'm confident that petern will actually finish it some day... 11:03:56 <planetmaker> Well, yes. :) 11:04:03 <planetmaker> Some things just take longer 11:04:22 <FooBar_> In TTD world, everything takes longer :P 11:04:43 <planetmaker> like the command line password patch. It was FS entry #571 11:04:46 <planetmaker> from 2007 or so 11:05:19 <planetmaker> or the Ctrl+click signs = delete sign. Took also over a year. 11:05:45 <planetmaker> and OpenGFX :P 11:06:04 <FooBar_> what now? Never heared of that last one... :P 11:06:15 <planetmaker> :) 11:07:46 <FooBar_> Anyways, I'm quite pleased with my new grf. 11:08:17 <Ammler> FooBar_: that is candiate for MiniGRFs 11:08:30 <FooBar_> It was already a feature of the transrapid track set, but now it's available seperately as well. 11:09:04 <FooBar_> Ammler: Yes and no. Yes as in it's a small grf. No as in I'm not going to bugger to share the source of one single line of code 11:09:26 <Ammler> hmm, does it have graphics? 11:09:29 <FooBar_> nope 11:09:59 <FooBar_> This is the actual code: 2 * 7 00 06 01 01 09 0A 03 11:10:10 <FooBar_> The rest is either comments or action8 11:11:10 <Ammler> that is why you didn't make it GPL :P 11:11:19 <FooBar_> exactly 11:11:37 <FooBar_> CC-0 was closest to public domain without having to write a custom license document 11:11:46 <FooBar_> which I considered too much effort :P 11:12:08 <Ammler> is public domain not choseable? 11:12:26 <FooBar_> no 11:12:28 <Ammler> another lack then, well, not the only one :-) 11:13:14 <FooBar_> I don't consider that a lack. "public domain" isn't a legal license here in the Netherlands 11:13:28 <FooBar_> More countries have that "problem" 11:14:22 <FooBar_> So if I were to put something in the "public domain" it would be the same as providing no license at all: copyright would still persist. 11:15:27 <FooBar_> In lots of countries copyright is an undeniable right. 11:16:53 <FooBar_> 9 downloads. Only 405 more and I'm off the bottom of the list :P 11:17:56 <Hirundo> It is strange how many people want omg#!#1337 features added to IS :S 11:19:15 <FooBar_> Well ofcourse. omg#!#1337 features are tha bom! 11:21:07 <Hirundo> I think I can derive a mathematical formula: suggestion_chance = code_size * 1337 11:21:52 <FooBar_> lol :P 11:24:13 <Ammler> Hirundo: still subsidaries? 11:24:37 <Hirundo> yeah 11:24:54 <Ammler> what is wrong with starting openttd as MP? 11:25:56 <FooBar_> well, subsidiaries is nice, but it's not IS. People don't seem to understand that it's best to finish one feature first (and get it in trunk!) and /then/ concentrate on combining it with something else... 11:27:32 <Hirundo> this is a nice one: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1 11:27:34 <Webster> Title: Bug #1 in Ubuntu: “Microsoft has a majority market share” (at bugs.launchpad.net) 11:28:22 <Ammler> FooBar_: do you know, if the sources of the "tt-forums GPL grfs" available, or need that request? 11:28:45 <Ammler> I guess, I start a bulk request ;-) 11:28:55 <FooBar_> what do you mean by "tt-forums GPL grfs"? 11:29:10 <Ammler> usset, jpsets, isr 11:29:25 <FooBar_> oh ok, random grfs licensed gpl 11:29:30 <FooBar_> I think those need request 11:29:48 <Ammler> grfs which claim to be GPL but no souces findable 11:30:21 <planetmaker> he. Good idea Ammler. We could host it :P 11:30:33 <planetmaker> as backup. Or bitbucket. 11:30:52 <Ammler> well, they have all userspace at tt-forums 11:31:06 <Ammler> don't think, it is a issue of quoata 11:31:16 <planetmaker> true 11:31:23 <planetmaker> a zip file would suffice there actually 11:31:26 <Ammler> -a 11:32:01 <FooBar_> even a big thing as openGFX is less than 50 MB in size 11:32:08 <FooBar_> And that's including the hg overhead 11:32:52 <planetmaker> yup. And ALL things ever added, deleted or whatever 11:33:20 <Ammler> > du -sh opengfx/ 11:33:22 <Ammler> 11M opengfx/ 11:33:53 <Ammler> FooBar_: run "hg up null" :-) 11:34:36 <FooBar_> 0 files updated, 0 files merged, 123 files removed, 0 files unresolved 11:34:43 <FooBar_> I wonder what got removed... 11:35:07 <planetmaker> FooBar_, everything :) 11:35:08 <FooBar_> ah, the repo it removed... 11:35:12 <FooBar_> well, thanks... 11:35:25 <planetmaker> you still have .hg :) 11:35:30 <planetmaker> make hg up tip and you have it again 11:35:36 <FooBar_> If you want me to resign, you can just ask :P 11:35:36 <planetmaker> -make 11:35:45 <planetmaker> uh? 11:36:09 <FooBar_> 123 files updated, 0 files merged, 0 files removed, 0 files unresolved 11:36:12 <FooBar_> :) 11:36:17 <planetmaker> :) 11:36:45 <FooBar_> my green tortoisehg ticks are still missing though :S 11:37:14 <FooBar_> dunno where those went. They disappeared a while ago, but never came back... 11:37:46 <FooBar_> More precisely, they disappeared when I deinstalled bzr... 11:38:01 <FooBar_> I probably just should reinstall hg... 11:39:05 <planetmaker> I've no idea about what those ticks even might be... 11:39:08 <Ammler> don't have those either on my linux box 11:39:19 <Ammler> planetmaker: they show status of the files 11:39:27 <FooBar_> exactly 11:39:32 <planetmaker> I assumed so :) 11:39:33 <Ammler> nice feature 11:39:34 <FooBar_> they are actually quite nice to have 11:39:36 <FooBar_> :) 11:39:56 <planetmaker> like what hg st tells me, I assume 11:40:04 <Ammler> hg st -v 11:40:38 <FooBar_> yes, but then without asking 11:41:12 <Ammler> even hg st -v is less verbose ;-) 12:01:00 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: Infrastructure Sharing - Revision 12399: (svn r16590) -Fix [FS#2967]: don't crash when tars/newgr... @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/is2/repository/revisions/12399 (by Rubidium) 12:01:00 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: Infrastructure Sharing - Revision 12400: (svn r16591) -Codechange: some coding style in strgen @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/is2/repository/revisions/12400 (by Rubidium) 12:01:00 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: Infrastructure Sharing - Revision 12401: [IS] Merge: trunk up to r16591 @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/is2/repository/revisions/12401 (by Hirundo) 12:18:50 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 12:24:00 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: 2cc train set - Revision 209: added a MUS template @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/2cctrainset/repository/revisions/209 (by DJNekkid) 12:24:38 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 12:28:58 <planetmaker> HGREPOS="2cctrainset firs heqs opengfx worldairlineset ../trunk dutchtrainset" 12:28:58 <planetmaker> SVNREPOS="nforenum grfcodec tbrs dutchstations" 12:28:58 <planetmaker> ^^ my to-pull-list gets longer and longer... 12:29:39 <FooBar_> you want too much :) 12:29:48 <Ammler> do you pull per cron? 12:30:32 *** DJNekkid has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 12:31:03 <Ammler> planetmaker: else you could use my backup script which visits every subdir and execute action there 12:31:03 <planetmaker> no, I don't. But makes it easier, if I update makefiles in a few grfs ;) 12:31:14 <Ammler> -else 12:31:29 <planetmaker> I have a small shell script called update_repos.sh which visits all those. 12:31:41 <planetmaker> Just added is2, too :) 12:32:03 <Ammler> so you have to wait until every repo is up2date, that would suck me :-) 12:32:13 <planetmaker> hu? 12:32:33 <Ammler> or what is this list for? 12:32:45 <planetmaker> doesn't take long usually. And I only run it when I start to work on something 12:32:55 <planetmaker> yes, it's vars in my shell script 12:33:27 <planetmaker> running an automatic update here... actually a nice idea for cronjob :) 12:33:30 <planetmaker> thanks :) 12:33:50 <Ammler> well, manually run it would make me impatience 12:35:31 <planetmaker> well... not too much to update right now, but it took 17 seconds. 12:35:57 <planetmaker> I added a cronjob at 7am, though :) 12:37:22 <DJNekkid> hi guys, did u see my Mu template? 12:39:08 <planetmaker> hm... I could even add to build everything... 12:39:26 <planetmaker> DJNekkid, not really yet. Is it in the repo? 12:39:47 <FooBar_> I've seen a message passing by 12:40:01 <FooBar_> didn't bugger to click it, as I as playing OpenTTD :P 12:40:22 <DJNekkid> i added it a few minutes ago 12:40:51 <planetmaker> btw, Ammler the makefiles of firs and 2cctrainset don't create a doc subdir anymore in the bundled files and the rXX is stripped from the bundled files, too. The rXX only shows in the newgrf seleciton window from ingame now. 12:41:59 <FooBar_> DJNekkid: quite nice indeed. Just fill in the details and you're done :) 12:42:13 <DJNekkid> hehe... aye 12:43:14 <planetmaker> nice, yes 12:43:59 <planetmaker> very well documented. 12:44:31 <DJNekkid> even you can .nfo now planetmaker :) 12:44:37 <planetmaker> :D 12:44:43 <DJNekkid> even nekomaster :p 12:45:21 <planetmaker> !! :O 12:46:22 * Hirundo objects 12:46:36 <FooBar_> objection denied 12:46:45 <FooBar_> :D 12:47:02 <Hirundo> 11. Thou shalt not object. 12:48:00 <FooBar_> ok, you win ;) 12:48:44 <planetmaker> uff. I'm relieved 12:49:33 <FooBar_> or to be more precise: the 11 commandments win 12:58:35 <DJNekkid> hmm 12:58:41 <DJNekkid> perhaps i'd even make a test-pcx... 13:00:14 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 13:03:07 <Ammler> maybe we should make a newgrf framework :P 13:03:20 <Ammler> with the Makefile and templates 13:03:26 <DJNekkid> well ... 13:03:29 <DJNekkid> that _is_ hard 13:03:35 <DJNekkid> but one can make one per project... 13:03:42 <DJNekkid> i _kinda_ have one for the dutchset as well 13:03:47 <FooBar_> and would be like reinventing the wheel... 13:04:07 <Ammler> which wheel? 13:04:10 <FooBar_> grfmaker 13:04:21 <planetmaker> Ammler, there's a repo... 13:04:28 <DJNekkid> point is, all trainsets will have focus on different stuff 13:04:33 <planetmaker> maybe I should rename / delete it and give it a more universal name 13:04:35 <FooBar_> I believe that's some kind of framework. Have never used it though 13:05:02 <planetmaker> there's the empty project newgrf_makefile 13:05:08 <planetmaker> we could call it newgrf_template 13:09:28 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 13:18:58 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 13:20:58 *** Phazorx has left #openttdcoop.devzone 13:29:16 *** Simozzz has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 13:53:46 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: Heavy Equipment Set - Revision 84: Change: rework makefile system in order to use the standard ma... @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/heqs/repository/revisions/84 (by planetmaker) 13:55:55 <Ammler> planetmaker: nice, is there a makefile target for a tar with revision? 13:56:02 <Ammler> tar/path* 13:56:05 <planetmaker> no, there isn't. 13:56:11 <Ammler> ok 13:56:16 <planetmaker> make tar will create e.g. 2cctrainset-nightly.tar 13:56:30 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: 2cc train set - Bug #240: Make the pcx files a dependency for the build system @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/240 (by planetmaker) 13:56:30 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #241: Make the PCX files a dependency of the build system @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/241 (by planetmaker) 13:56:30 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: Heavy Equipment Set - Bug #242: Make the pcx files a dependency for the build system @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/242 (by planetmaker) 13:56:35 <planetmaker> or - for releases - unchanged 2cctrainset-1.0.3.tar 13:56:41 <Ammler> and make ? 13:56:56 <planetmaker> make without anything will just create the grf file. 13:57:00 <planetmaker> as before 13:57:12 <Ammler> no dir? 13:57:26 <planetmaker> no 13:57:32 <planetmaker> it never did. Should it? 13:57:40 <Ammler> oh? 13:57:48 <Ammler> hmm, how does the tar look? 13:57:53 <Ammler> isn't it in a dir? 13:58:13 <planetmaker> yes, that is. 13:58:34 <planetmaker> 2cctrainset-nightly.tar/2cctrainset-nightly/2cctrainset.grf 13:58:43 <planetmaker> and the doc files with the same path 13:59:00 <Ammler> hmm 13:59:00 <planetmaker> so - I hope - basically what you wanted for testing purposes :) 13:59:12 <Ammler> why "nightly" in the path? 13:59:15 <planetmaker> as make install will now always overwrite. 13:59:28 <Ammler> will that overwrite a release? 13:59:31 <planetmaker> to make it clear that it's a dev thing. 13:59:42 <planetmaker> no, releases have their own naming scheme unchanged. 13:59:54 <Ammler> hmm 13:59:58 <planetmaker> I just removed the version from all nightlies (except in the display ingame) 14:00:30 <Ammler> then you will still have multiple versions in your data directory 14:00:51 <Ammler> I mean, 1.0.1 should overwrite 1.0 14:02:01 <Ammler> but that is the second part :-) 14:02:05 <planetmaker> no, that shouldn't happen with releases. 14:02:21 <Ammler> why not? 14:02:45 <Ammler> why should someone keep the buggy compatible version 1.0? 14:04:02 <Brot6> 2cctrainset: Backup push to ssh://hg@bitbucket.org/OpenTTD/2cctrainset/ initiated. 14:04:08 <Brot6> heqs: Backup push to ssh://hg@bitbucket.org/firs/heqs/ initiated. 14:04:13 <Brot6> is2: Backup push to ssh://hg@bitbucket.org/OpenTTD/infrastructure-sharing/ initiated. 14:04:15 <Ammler> and if a advandced user really like to keep buggy history, he could always rename the directories, like I did with grfpack 14:05:22 <Ammler> but you shouldn't need to make manual effort to keep you data dir clean 14:06:26 <planetmaker> Ammler, it's one thing to make it easy for us to test new versions. That's what I enabled now. 14:06:55 <planetmaker> But! A person who gets the grf from bananas will not delete the grfs anyway. So there's no point 14:07:11 <Ammler> no, don't speak about banans 14:07:19 <planetmaker> That's how it is distributed 14:07:27 <Ammler> that is out of our control anyway 14:07:28 <planetmaker> all other means of distribution don't matter 14:07:37 <planetmaker> not really. 14:07:45 <Ammler> it does 14:08:11 <Ammler> it was the most annoying part of grfs, I can remember 14:08:26 <planetmaker> and for checking back on bug reports it is very sensible for us developers to keep the old versions 14:08:44 <Ammler> if they renamed the files according to revision, also if it was compatbile and didn't change the id 14:08:57 <Ammler> you do 14:09:00 <Ammler> with bananas 14:09:03 <planetmaker> I'm not going to cripple the make system only in order to go and rename every release grf. 14:09:19 <Ammler> well 14:09:49 <planetmaker> that - IMO - doesn't make really sense, does it? 14:10:24 <Ammler> planetmaker: we are at same stage as yesterday, 14:10:29 <planetmaker> I don't want to force warnings about grfs not found onto the general public. 14:10:36 <planetmaker> No. You argued about us developers. 14:10:41 <planetmaker> I implemented that. 14:10:44 <Ammler> why should you differ between release and nightly? 14:10:54 <planetmaker> development vs. release? 14:11:03 <planetmaker> testing vs. production? 14:11:04 <Ammler> n 14:11:08 <Ammler> oh nvm 14:11:33 <planetmaker> I see the point that we like to see by a simple "apply newgrfs" the effect of a newer version of the grf. 14:11:37 <Ammler> I need a cleaning script for bananas anyway. 14:11:58 <Ammler> still not possible now 14:12:00 <Ammler> sorry 14:12:04 <planetmaker> I honestly like to keep the old releases :) 14:12:16 <Ammler> not if you bugfix a relase, i.e :P 14:12:16 <planetmaker> what is still not possible now? 14:12:21 <planetmaker> ? 14:12:23 * FooBar_ just buys a new hard drive if it's full rather than cleaning it up 14:12:35 <planetmaker> FooBar_, that's how I do it, too :P 14:12:49 <Ammler> FooBar_: nothing to do with disk usage :P 14:12:51 <planetmaker> it's just not worth the time to clean up hard drives 14:13:23 <planetmaker> Ammler, but I'm really a bit disappointed about it now. 14:13:29 <Ammler> do you really think, I would make such a script, because I am worry about those bytes? 14:13:33 <planetmaker> We talked in length about what the makefile system should do. 14:13:43 <FooBar_> Ammler: then the problem sits in the newgrf selection window: it only should show the newest of files with the same grfid 14:13:57 <Ammler> we have currently quite a big hassle, because openttd just loads randomly grf versions 14:13:58 <planetmaker> And now you come and say that it's not what you want. You really should then work on your error descriptions. 14:14:38 <planetmaker> it's a bit frustrating to go, check out "hey, yeah, here you go" only to find out "oh, no, I wanted it all different and also for blah". 14:14:50 <Ammler> planetmaker: show me please on the ticket, where it sais, "DON'T CHANGE RELEASE" 14:15:20 <Ammler> but it is fine, 14:15:25 <Ammler> anaway :P 14:15:31 <planetmaker> Ammler, the point is you have to specify everything you want changed. How can I elsewhere know what you all mean or intend? 14:15:34 <Ammler> I just commented it. 14:15:46 <Ammler> you solved one part of the issue, we had 14:15:50 <planetmaker> no, honestly, that saddens me and de-motivates. 14:15:57 <planetmaker> quite a lot 14:16:47 <planetmaker> you really should say what you want. 14:17:01 <planetmaker> and not assume that I think alike 14:17:07 <Ammler> well, the problem I had and thought really well described yesterday was 14:17:16 <Ammler> that we have more then one grf in the data dir 14:17:33 <planetmaker> yes. I saw that. And we only talked about nightlies. 14:17:44 <planetmaker> And I conceded that for testing purposes that's ok. 14:17:46 <Ammler> if you now differ between release and nightly, that won't change, that is all I said 14:17:50 <planetmaker> You NEVER talked about releases. 14:18:10 <planetmaker> I always differed between release and nightly. They had and have a different name. 14:18:13 <Ammler> do you store releases in an other directory? 14:18:49 <planetmaker> I use make install. So releases get their usual naming convention 14:19:14 <planetmaker> firs-0.1.tar/firs-0.1/firs.grf 14:19:21 <Ammler> as nightly will get 14:19:23 <planetmaker> but see above 14:19:34 <planetmaker> firs-nightly.tar/firs-nightly/firs.grf 14:19:38 <Ammler> so you will have around 4 different versions now in your data dir 14:19:44 <planetmaker> why? 14:19:58 <planetmaker> I'll have all stable releases and one nightly. Yes 14:20:08 <Ammler> e.g. 2cc: 1.0, 1.0.1, nightly 14:20:15 <planetmaker> exactly 14:20:22 <planetmaker> by design actually 14:20:25 <Ammler> yes 14:20:32 <Ammler> well, if you like that, it is fine 14:21:01 <Ammler> it wasn't just what I wanted, but believe me, it should at least fix andys issue. 14:21:25 <planetmaker> so you want to keep only the latest stable, compatible release, rightß 14:21:28 <planetmaker> ß=? 14:21:38 <Ammler> no 14:21:45 <Ammler> i would like to have only ONE 14:21:52 <planetmaker> ? 14:21:57 <Ammler> no matter, stable or dev 14:21:58 <planetmaker> even if it's incompatible 14:22:21 <Ammler> if I run make install on a dev version, it should overwrite the stable 14:22:24 <planetmaker> what? ONE? nightly overwriting stable? 14:22:25 <planetmaker> :O 14:22:41 <Ammler> if it is incompatible, you will change the ID and name 14:22:46 <planetmaker> yes 14:22:56 *** DJ_Nekkid has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 14:23:00 <Ammler> like nars -> nars2 14:23:16 <Ammler> 2cc -> 2cc2 :-) 14:23:33 <planetmaker> :P 14:23:36 <DJ_Nekkid> 3cc? :p 14:23:36 <Ammler> hmm 14:24:01 <Ammler> planetmaker: I see what you mean 14:24:18 <Ammler> then the solution is to have only the major version in the path 14:24:40 <planetmaker> like 1? or 1.0? 14:24:45 * FooBar_ agrees 14:24:46 <Ammler> anyway 1.0.1 should replace 1.0 14:24:59 <Ammler> and 1.1 should replace those too 14:25:05 <planetmaker> hm... 14:25:08 <FooBar_> so just '1' 14:25:09 <Ammler> as it will still be compatible 14:25:18 <planetmaker> FooBar_, you agree to what exactly? :) 14:25:26 <Ammler> but 2.0 will kepp seperately 14:25:38 <FooBar_> to ammler's solution to only have the major version in the path 14:25:46 <planetmaker> yeah, but different grfIDs won't be seen compatible anyway, I guess. But it needs to be different. 14:26:01 <planetmaker> Well. Feasable is everything :) 14:26:26 <planetmaker> But are you sure that a nightly should overwrite the releases? 14:26:45 <FooBar_> I like to keep: a nightly version and the latest version of every incompatible release. 14:27:08 <FooBar_> the latter for backward compatibility with savegames 14:27:15 <Ammler> and banans has every release version, too. 14:27:23 <planetmaker> well. incompatible is something which we need not discuss. That's a different newgrf anyway 14:27:41 <Ammler> but we shold reflect that with version number, imo 14:27:50 <FooBar_> sure it's a different newgrf, but in my book with the very same name 14:28:21 <planetmaker> yes. But major version. Let's skip that, that's clear IMO, that you want to not mix incompatible stuff :) 14:28:34 <Ammler> do you plan to make 2cc 1.1 already incompatible with 1.0? 14:28:43 <planetmaker> Just: should nightly and stable have different paths? 14:28:56 <planetmaker> Ammler, no. But besides the point 14:29:22 <planetmaker> e.g. firs1.tar/firs1/firs.grf 14:29:36 <planetmaker> and firs-nightly.tar/firs-nightly/firs.grf 14:29:38 <FooBar_> planetmaker: IMO yes. I like to keep the latest stable AND one nightly 14:29:43 <planetmaker> or should it be 14:29:52 <planetmaker> firs-nightly.tar/firs1/firs.grf? 14:29:58 <planetmaker> Then the nightly would replace the stable. 14:30:00 <Ammler> FooBar_: but you have the stable already in the content folder? 14:30:08 *** DJNekkid has quit IRC 14:30:48 <Ammler> well 14:30:48 <FooBar_> Ammler: I built the stable myself, so it's in the plain data folder 14:31:12 <FooBar_> I'm not interested in having to download a stable that the makefile can install for me automatically ;) 14:31:16 <planetmaker> yup. And then you cannot download it again :) 14:32:02 <Ammler> in fact 14:32:11 <Ammler> it depense how openttd behaves 14:32:17 <FooBar_> I'd say: firs1.tar/firs1/firs.grf; firs2.tar/firs2/firs.grf; firs-nightly.tar/firs-nightly/firs.grf etc. 14:32:18 <Ammler> if you have a stable and a nightly 14:32:47 <Ammler> you start a game with the nightly, change something and replace the nightly, which grf will then be loaded? 14:33:19 <FooBar_> The one with the same path, and a random one if the path is different 14:34:01 <Ammler> ok, planetmaker let us keep your current solution 14:34:01 <FooBar_> in the latter case you get the "compatible grf loaded for missing" message 14:34:27 <Ammler> and in the first case? 14:34:35 <Ammler> (md5sum changed either) 14:35:09 <FooBar_> if a file with the same path exists, it uses that one. dunno about the message though. 14:35:24 <Ammler> same, akaik 14:35:26 <FooBar_> I don't recall any in that case, besides the usual "don't change in running game" 14:35:35 <Ammler> afaik 14:35:59 <FooBar_> Maybe on gameload 14:36:34 <FooBar_> I usually keep the game open while changing nightlies for testing purposes and hit 'apply' in the newgrf window from there 14:37:30 <Ammler> yes that should work now 14:38:10 <FooBar_> stupid AI... It put a road where I planned to put my railroad :S 14:39:03 <FooBar_> Then I'll put a level crossing where it planned to drive it's road vehicles :P 14:40:40 <Ammler> good ais make bridgtes 14:41:37 <FooBar_> not if there's nothing to bridge yet 14:41:55 <FooBar_> the railroad wasn't there when it built it's road 14:42:04 <planetmaker> <FooBar_> I'd say: firs1.tar/firs1/firs.grf; firs2.tar/firs2/firs.grf; firs-nightly.tar/firs-nightly/firs.grf etc. <- I can live with that, if it's desired 14:42:33 <FooBar_> Desired is a big word, but it is my preferred solution :P 14:43:04 <planetmaker> <FooBar_> Maybe on gameload <-- well, that's what is important for stable ones. 14:43:36 <FooBar_> Correct, therefore it's important to keep the path the same to allow seamless upgrades 14:43:56 <Ammler> planetmaker: it could be the last byte of the grfid 14:44:13 <planetmaker> For development we can with the same nightly name - as now - update on a running game. 14:44:45 <FooBar_> yes, what you did for nightlies is goed 14:44:52 <FooBar_> good* 14:44:59 <FooBar_> darn Dutch... 14:45:05 <planetmaker> hehe... pronounced dutch it should sound the same, eh? ;) 14:45:17 <Ammler> yeah, ugly :P 14:45:54 <FooBar_> the translation of "good" in Dutch is "goed". 14:46:09 <planetmaker> he, yes :-) 14:46:13 <FooBar_> add that the transation of "is" in Dutch is "is" and you see where it went wrong :P 14:46:34 <Ammler> GRFID should be part of Makefile.local anyway ;-) 14:46:43 <planetmaker> good idea :) 14:46:48 <Ammler> Makefile.config I meant 14:46:52 <planetmaker> yeah^ 14:47:38 <DJ_Nekkid> FooBar_: can you find any flaws? 14:47:39 <DJ_Nekkid> http://paste.openttd.org/183420 14:47:44 <planetmaker> ok, but I see that the desired solution for stables is to have them only use the major path in the filenames / directories. Then I'll do that 14:47:49 <Ammler> maye a Makefile.project ? 14:47:58 <DJ_Nekkid> "invalid escape sequense" 14:48:08 <planetmaker> Ammler, what would be the difference to makefile.config? 14:48:29 <FooBar_> DJ_Nekkid: hang on, I need the manual with that... 14:48:38 <Ammler> hehe 14:48:52 <DJ_Nekkid> nvm 14:48:54 <DJ_Nekkid> its the callback 14:49:09 <Ammler> planetmaker: forget it :-) 14:49:19 <DJ_Nekkid> callback is \b, not \w :) 14:49:41 <planetmaker> I actually think of moving some of the definitions back to the makefile itself... but not sure. 14:49:58 <FooBar_> ok, can I stop checking then? 14:50:07 <DJ_Nekkid> i think so :) 14:50:13 <FooBar_> good :) 14:50:24 <Ammler> well, some configs are for the system 14:50:24 <DJ_Nekkid> nah 14:50:26 <DJ_Nekkid> even more! 14:50:29 <Ammler> some for the project 14:50:43 <DJ_Nekkid> oh 14:50:45 <DJ_Nekkid> hmm 14:50:46 <planetmaker> what's your distinction betwen project and system? 14:51:06 <DJ_Nekkid> running cost didnt fix it eithre 14:51:08 <Ammler> i.e. the tools (zip/grfcodec etc.) 14:51:26 <Ammler> or the install dir 14:51:37 <Ammler> everything which would be the same for every project, even. 14:51:41 <planetmaker> hm... they could be moved to makefile.local 14:51:55 <planetmaker> and removed from makefile.config 14:52:06 <planetmaker> and put into makefile straight away 14:52:12 <planetmaker> though... hm. 14:52:21 <Ammler> maybe, yes :-) 14:52:23 <FooBar_> yes, probably. 14:52:27 <FooBar_> :) 14:52:54 <FooBar_> by the way, on windows I can just run grfcodec without the .exe 14:53:03 <planetmaker> FooBar_, I know. 14:53:13 <planetmaker> no system needs anything else then "grfcodec" 14:53:21 <planetmaker> *than 14:53:22 <Ammler> DJ_Nekkid: doesn't :P 14:53:30 <FooBar_> what's that cygwin distinction for then? 14:53:35 <planetmaker> I know that, too, Ammler :P 14:53:48 <DJ_Nekkid> Ammler: i dont what? 14:54:03 <planetmaker> FooBar_, no idea :) 14:54:13 <Ammler> DJ_Nekkid: nvm, not really important ;-) 14:54:21 <planetmaker> I haven't tested it with cygwin, but copied this from nforenum or grfcodec makefile. 14:54:30 <Ammler> (the .exe part) 14:54:35 <DJ_Nekkid> but WTF, why dont it compile! 14:55:05 <FooBar_> lol... get rid of it then. If cygwin needs it, then it should be configured in makefile.local IMO, apart from cygwin needing fixing 14:55:18 <Ammler> if nobody does/can test it, you should remove it maybe 14:55:25 <Ammler> same with /bin/sh :-) 14:55:27 <planetmaker> though, FooBar_ where does the firs makefiles have cygwin stuff? 14:55:49 <FooBar_> I saw it in OpenGFX once IIRC 14:55:53 <planetmaker> (I consider that my reference one :P ) 14:55:57 <FooBar_> dunno about FIRS from the top of my head 14:56:37 <planetmaker> ah, I guess old code there :P 14:56:53 <FooBar_> nope, FIRS one doesn't have it. Good work :) 14:57:02 <planetmaker> I cannot make it completely compatible to the newgrfs. Therefor OpenGFX makefiles is a bit more hassle to update as I cannot just copy&paste 14:57:26 <FooBar_> ok, that figures 14:58:03 <planetmaker> heqs, 2cctrainset, firs - they basically should all run on the same makefile and only differently configured makefile.config 14:58:43 <planetmaker> other newgrfs could use the very same one, too. 14:58:49 <FooBar_> in theory yes. They're all newgrfs with only one file needing to be compiled 14:58:52 <planetmaker> It's just simple copy & paste 14:59:06 <planetmaker> FooBar_, exactly. And that's what the makefile is taylored to do. 14:59:27 <FooBar_> "taylored"... I like that :P 14:59:27 <Ammler> that is restricted from banans too 14:59:29 <planetmaker> OpenGFX dependencies are different 14:59:43 <Ammler> it only support newgrfs with one grf 14:59:59 <planetmaker> Which is not really a bad thing, though. 15:00:18 <planetmaker> Why would you want more than one in one thing. You can define dependencies :) 15:00:20 <Ammler> doesn't matter 15:00:32 <Ammler> ECS 15:00:48 <planetmaker> "download all" :P 15:01:11 <DJ_Nekkid> MY GOD! why dont it work! *frustrated* 15:01:49 <Ammler> woot the grf bitch doesn't know? :P 15:02:03 <DJ_Nekkid> action 0's... 15:02:13 <DJ_Nekkid> in a documented fashion 15:02:15 <DJ_Nekkid> i hate that! 15:02:19 <DJ_Nekkid> much easier when its not :) 15:08:35 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: OpenGFX - Bug #243: Toyland Buildings' Construction Stages @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/243 (by athanasios) 15:08:35 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: OpenGFX - Bug #243: Toyland Buildings' Construction Stages @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/243#change-525 (by athanasios) 15:08:58 <DJ_Nekkid> found it! 15:09:34 <FooBar_> good, don't let it escape ;) 15:10:21 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: OpenGFX - Feature #243: Toyland Buildings' Construction Stages @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/243 (by athanasios) 15:10:21 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: OpenGFX - Feature #243: Toyland Buildings' Construction Stages @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/243#change-525 (by athanasios) 15:11:16 <FooBar_> Ammler: I just logged in to do that :P 15:12:46 <Ammler> :P 15:13:11 <DJ_Nekkid> bleh 15:13:19 <DJ_Nekkid> i ALWAYS mix up CB 11 and 12 15:20:48 <DJ_Nekkid> k... why isnt the mail working! 15:20:51 <DJ_Nekkid> no ... armored! 15:27:51 <DJ_Nekkid> the template seem to lack an action 12 ... 15:33:21 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 57: Change: move the GRF-ID into makefile.config @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/57 (by planetmaker) 15:35:34 <Ammler> planetmaker: use the last byte of the ID for the path :-) 15:37:37 <planetmaker> hm... I think it should depend upon the tag. 15:38:06 <planetmaker> part of tag before the "." or so 15:38:44 <planetmaker> it will fail for transition 0.9 -> 1.0 15:38:49 <planetmaker> but I guess that's ok... 15:39:04 <FooBar_> yes, how often do you have such? 15:39:09 <planetmaker> once :) 15:39:18 <FooBar_> exactly 15:40:34 <planetmaker> Of course, I could also use the last part of the GRF-ID... is that better? 15:41:25 <FooBar_> Would make a bit of a weird of a tar/folder name if the last byte of the grfid doesn't start numbering from 01 15:41:40 <FooBar_> But in general I think it's a better solution 15:41:58 <FooBar_> As it /only/ keeps the last one of a range of compatible releases 15:42:04 <planetmaker> well... it only changes IF the grfID changes. 15:42:28 <FooBar_> but on the other hand... 15:42:41 <Ammler> that is the point 15:43:05 <FooBar_> FIRS 2.0 might contain features not wanted by die-hard FIRS 1.0 users, having both would be better in that case... 15:43:53 <Ammler> yep 15:44:03 <Ammler> won't you change the ID then? 15:44:15 <FooBar_> if it's compatible: no 15:44:29 <FooBar_> but then maybe I should... 15:44:34 * FooBar_ is confused 15:44:35 <planetmaker> FooBar_, well... it'd make sense :) 15:44:44 <Ammler> then you make FIRS 1.1 15:45:04 <planetmaker> if it's something new... 15:45:23 <planetmaker> ... it's not compatible anymore anyway. 15:45:35 <planetmaker> different industrial behaviour isn't compatible anyway. So... 15:45:47 <Ammler> it could be additinal 15:45:50 <planetmaker> uh... indeed that may give problems. 15:46:01 <planetmaker> so that will have to be well planned :) 15:46:57 <FooBar_> in that case we have derived that 1.0 and 2.0 should never have to be compatible, so using the tag or using the last byte of the grfID should then yield the same results... 15:47:26 <FooBar_> so... 15:47:36 <Ammler> well 15:47:37 <FooBar_> do whatever you like, I'm fine with either :) 15:47:47 <planetmaker> he :) 15:47:48 <Ammler> I guess, it is too much hassle 15:49:51 <planetmaker> well. It's feasable. Both. Just: what's better? In a general case? 15:51:06 <FooBar_> In a general case, using the tag is never wrong, but it could leave some unneccesary files behind 15:52:40 <FooBar_> Using the grfid never leaves unnecessary files and one usually would bump the grfid when going from 1.x to 2.x 15:53:18 <planetmaker> hm... I guess tag is nicer. As grfID may be chosen in a deviating way from the ... 01 rule, I guess 15:53:29 <FooBar_> So the only benefit of using the grfid would be the cleanup of 0.x as soon as 1.x gets available 15:53:33 <planetmaker> and how many v2.0 are compatible to v1.0? 15:53:39 <Ammler> tag isn't feasable 15:53:44 <planetmaker> Ammler, why? 15:53:45 <Ammler> as it could be everything 15:53:52 <planetmaker> it should not be. 15:54:17 <Ammler> well, you could "guide" hot the tag has to look 15:54:23 <Ammler> hwo 15:54:25 <Ammler> how 15:54:28 <planetmaker> :P 15:55:11 <FooBar_> but you could "guide" the last byte of the grfid as well... 15:56:05 <planetmaker> hehe 15:56:08 <FooBar_> 2cc set has a problem then though: it calls itself 1.0.1 but last byte is 02 15:56:11 <Ammler> well, that is also in the grf spec already. 15:56:14 <planetmaker> 2cctrainset would be 2 then already :) 15:56:20 <Ammler> recommend to use as version. 15:57:14 <planetmaker> Dutch Trainset would be 6 15:57:14 <Ammler> well version 2 would then be ASCII 2 :-) 15:57:33 <Ammler> or 3 :P 15:57:54 <Ammler> hehe, or directly release version 3 :P 15:58:09 <planetmaker> Dutch station set would be the equivalent of "S" 15:58:28 <FooBar_> dutch tramset will fail as well once I add it. The RC is at 02 :P 15:58:44 <Ammler> it doesn't matter 15:58:53 <FooBar_> don't convert to ascii, that's silly and might result in characters not allowed in filenames 15:58:54 <Ammler> as long as it rises from rlease to release 15:59:40 <Ammler> I meant ASCII "3" as GRFID 15:59:48 <planetmaker> <patchbot> SVN commit: r2124 by DaleStan to misc/nforenum/pseudo.cpp: Comments not prefixed by whitespace could cause NFORenum to reject the preceding escape. (Reported by DJ_Nekkid) 16:00:01 <Ammler> the path is then something like 2cc-65 16:00:15 <FooBar_> ah ok 16:00:39 <FooBar_> the other way round as I was thinking :) 16:03:24 <FooBar_> AI has built a shiproute: 59 buoys :P 16:04:44 <planetmaker> :O 16:04:59 <planetmaker> ok, shall I go by GRF-ID then? 16:05:26 <planetmaker> taking the numerical value of the last character 16:05:29 <Ammler> FooBar_: every tile? 16:05:57 <FooBar_> every 8 or so 16:06:38 <DJ_Nekkid> planetmaker: wanna supply a r2124 of renum then? 16:06:39 <DJ_Nekkid> :p 16:06:40 <Ammler> planetmaker: you mean converting to decimal? 16:06:40 <FooBar_> planetmaker: I'd take the exact value of the last byte 16:07:05 <planetmaker> Ammler, yes. Taking it as a decimal (base 10) number 16:07:16 <FooBar_> I tend to use that byte as decimal anyways 16:07:17 <Ammler> yeah, why not, sounds ok 16:07:58 <Ammler> 2cctrainset2.grf looks better then 2cc01 16:08:13 <Ammler> he 16:08:25 <FooBar_> Mind you that I'll be complaining if I go from FBFB0309 to FBFB0310 ;) 16:08:36 <planetmaker> hm... I think I'll require the GRF_ID to be in the form of \b<number> then within makefile.config ;) 16:08:55 <planetmaker> FooBar_, yes, sure ;) 16:09:17 <planetmaker> I take the entry (whole byte) 16:09:22 <FooBar_> ok cool 16:09:33 <planetmaker> or I'd have a problem with "S" :P 16:09:34 <FooBar_> then I'm good 16:10:24 <planetmaker> but I'll require GRF_ID then be written as GRF_ID = A0 03 04 \b01 16:10:31 <planetmaker> but that doesn't hurt, I guess 16:10:38 <FooBar_> I'm fine with that 16:10:53 <Ammler> planetmaker: basically, you don't change the path for releases anymore now, is that fine with you? 16:11:35 <planetmaker> I change it with the GRFID. Majority seems to like it :P 16:11:49 <Ammler> but zip and such do still have the version, I assume? 16:12:09 <planetmaker> what has version? 16:12:18 <planetmaker> I would remove it from all file and path names. 16:12:20 <Ammler> the tag 16:12:46 <Ammler> yes, tar without 16:12:54 <Ammler> I meant the bundle for distribution 16:13:01 <planetmaker> so we have two grfs being made: firs-01 and firs-01-nightly 16:13:16 <FooBar_> just firs-nightly would doi 16:13:18 <FooBar_> do* 16:13:22 <planetmaker> should it have, Ammler? 16:13:34 <planetmaker> FooBar_, yeah, could do, no problem 16:13:35 *** andythenorth has left #openttdcoop.devzone 16:13:46 <planetmaker> But... maybe you introduce a branch :P 16:13:57 <Ammler> planetmaker: how do I see the version of a pack I downloaded? 16:14:06 <planetmaker> you don't, Ammler :P 16:14:23 <planetmaker> yes, it makes sense to keep it there. 16:14:29 <planetmaker> and also in the tar filename. 16:14:39 <Ammler> and in the readme, if available 16:14:40 <planetmaker> as tar filenames don't matter 16:14:50 <planetmaker> readme is another issue. Completely independent :) 16:15:08 <Ammler> preproccessor 16:15:27 <planetmaker> yes 16:16:28 <FooBar_> I think you should have a case of "make bundle" that puts the revision/full tag in the tar filename AND the folder-in-tar and a case of "make install" that only keeps the last byte of the grfid in both. 16:16:44 <Ammler> well, basically, you can use the "sheme" of ususal software 16:16:46 <DJ_Nekkid> jeesus, this is wierd... 16:16:48 <Ammler> like openttd :-) 16:17:38 <Ammler> FooBar_: that is like now :-) 16:17:47 <FooBar_> In case bundles have a different tar name but same folder-in-tar name, OpenTTD starts guessing what's the newest... 16:18:05 <Ammler> no, it doesn't 16:18:06 <Brot6> OpenGFX: nightly compile not needed. (r72) 16:18:13 <Ammler> it usese randomly one 16:18:25 <FooBar_> yeah...that I meant 16:18:46 <Ammler> so it important, that the old one will be replaced. 16:18:52 <Ammler> is* 16:19:28 <FooBar_> true, but it's important that the tar name is different in case of a nightly, which might result in it not getting replaced... 16:20:21 <Ammler> I can live with that, but imo, it wouldn't be needed, either. ;-) 16:20:58 <FooBar_> I too, but users can't. 16:21:31 <FooBar_> You'll get all sorts of bug reports like "I downloaded nightly rxx but can't find it in the list I can't" 16:23:03 <FooBar_> therefore the disctinction between "make bundle" and "make install" 16:23:30 <FooBar_> i.e. "make bundle" being used on the compile farm for users and "make install" for us not wanting to keep multiple nightlies 16:31:08 *** Frankr has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 16:32:43 <Ammler> maqunista is able to make such silly grfs, but a bit ActionA is too much? 16:33:09 <Ammler> or whatever the openttdw.grf would need 16:33:55 <FooBar_> what? 16:34:21 <Ammler> actually a nice idea, to make some sprties available as station :-) 16:34:40 <FooBar_> either you're in the wrong channel or I missed something :S 16:35:03 <Ammler> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=796838#p796838 16:35:05 <Webster> Title: Transport Tycoon Forums View topic - [32bpp] Extra zoom levels Graphics (at www.tt-forums.net) 16:35:21 <Ammler> well, a bit OT it might be :P 16:36:40 <FooBar_> you can say that again :P 16:42:48 <Frankr> is DJ_Nekkid there? 16:43:21 <FooBar_> he was about 20 mins ago 16:43:32 <Frankr> kk 16:44:17 <Ammler> Frankr: just ask him , what you like, he might read it later and answer you then. 16:48:39 <Frankr> do either of u two know wat variation 1 is partially obscured means? 16:49:49 <FooBar_> sounds like something with a bitmask... 16:53:19 <Frankr> ty anyway 16:56:55 <Ammler> never ask, if someone knows something :P 16:57:14 <Ammler> it is much easier to find out, if you ask and see if someone answers 16:58:25 <planetmaker> hm... it should be no problem for openttd to use differently named tar files. The filename of the tar is stripped from the path. So there could be the version in any case. 16:58:44 <planetmaker> but then we'd have again... different files :P 16:58:58 <FooBar_> ...with the same path and name 16:59:36 <FooBar_> which is actually two problems and no solution at all :P 16:59:41 <planetmaker> :P 16:59:51 <planetmaker> hm... make install for us and make bundle for others? 17:00:01 <FooBar_> seems the best solution if you ask me 17:00:08 <planetmaker> with different paths and filenames? 17:00:18 <FooBar_> bundle: yes 17:00:19 <planetmaker> e.g. make bundle as now, only make install differently 17:00:26 <FooBar_> yep 17:00:26 <planetmaker> with all the same name? 17:00:28 <Ammler> no 17:00:33 <Ammler> attention :P 17:00:42 * FooBar_ pays attention 17:00:54 * planetmaker senses tension ;) 17:01:04 <planetmaker> or rather a tension ;) 17:01:09 <Ammler> sorry :-D 17:01:19 <planetmaker> hey, just playing words. go on 17:01:25 <Ammler> I have first to check it self 17:02:23 <FooBar_> planetmaker: bundle: different path different filename; install: same path same filename 17:02:45 <Ammler> if you have 2 tars with same path, which one will be loaded? 17:02:51 <planetmaker> feasable. Though it's... a peculiar interpretation of these names. 17:02:54 <Ammler> that is randomly, not? 17:03:01 <FooBar_> Ammler: yes, random 17:03:02 <planetmaker> I thinks so, Ammler 17:03:25 <Ammler> so you can't use different named tar files 17:03:45 <FooBar_> only if you do the path inside the tar different as well 17:03:54 <Ammler> yep 17:04:07 <FooBar_> and we /need/ different tar names for the bundle repo 17:05:42 <Ammler> bundle repo? 17:05:53 <FooBar_> http://mz.openttdcoop.org/bundles/ 17:06:06 <Ammler> you mean the nightly server? 17:06:17 <FooBar_> yeah whatever :P 17:06:17 <Ammler> well, that doesn't matter there 17:06:21 <planetmaker> hm... I wonder whether it might not seem sane to introduce something like make dev-install 17:06:28 <planetmaker> and leave the rest as is 17:06:35 <FooBar_> Ammler: why wouldn't it matter? 17:07:00 <Ammler> if the Makefile doesn't support it, the script can make a "move" 17:07:19 <Ammler> Makefile needs to be perfect for dev 17:07:31 <planetmaker> dev-install would just use one common filename and path - no matter what ... 17:07:36 <FooBar_> yes, but then you're still stuck with same path names in differently named tars 17:07:46 <planetmaker> Ammler, "perfect" depends upon what one wants - which may differ from dev to dev ;) 17:08:15 <Ammler> indeed perfect is a ugly word :P 17:08:24 <planetmaker> hm... the idea of make dev-install sounds intriguing. 17:08:57 <FooBar_> four characters too much. Let users have something different: make user-install :P 17:09:20 <planetmaker> FooBar_, but that's vs. the common concepts. That's bad IMO 17:09:28 <planetmaker> Standards are not there for the simple minded only. 17:09:43 <FooBar_> I guess you're right... 17:10:18 <FooBar_> Invent a shorter alias for dev-install then :P 17:10:31 <planetmaker> dev :P 17:10:37 <FooBar_> perfect 17:11:34 <FooBar_> see, if used in the right context, "perfect" ain't that ugly ;) 17:11:40 <planetmaker> so... what do we do with nightlies? Do they behave like dev, e.g. like now, always the same name and path? 17:12:06 <planetmaker> e.g. a make install on a nightly = make dev on a nightly? 17:12:11 <FooBar_> if so, then we can't keep a nightly repository 17:12:37 <planetmaker> ok. I kinda revert my last change then (partially) and move that to make dev or so. 17:12:47 <planetmaker> nightly archive is nice and an argument 17:13:02 <FooBar_> exactly my point being 17:13:14 <planetmaker> I was just agreeing ;) 17:13:33 <FooBar_> good :) 17:13:43 <FooBar_> or "goed" if you like :P 17:13:50 <planetmaker> I don't mind either. 17:14:00 <planetmaker> If you wanna teach me Dutch, I'll actually be glad :) 17:14:19 <planetmaker> It's a 'project' of mine which I have in mind for like ages, but alas... 17:14:22 <FooBar_> Blij? Waarvoor dat dan? 17:15:04 <Ammler> "what is it for" ? 17:15:31 <FooBar_> Either English or German works perfectly fine in dutchyland if you're a tourist or something 17:15:32 <planetmaker> voor de pret 17:16:01 <FooBar_> ok, whatever floats your boat ;) 17:16:19 <FooBar_> I didn't learn English for fun, it's a mere neccessity 17:16:58 <planetmaker> voor de grooter plezier in de Nederlands in de vakantie 17:17:10 <FooBar_> Nor German, but I'm not so good at that... 17:17:45 <FooBar_> planetmaker: that look like a bad google translator translation :P sorry to say, but it just does... 17:18:12 <planetmaker> wellicht och voor het werk. 17:18:14 <FooBar_> try "voor meer plezier op vakantie in Nederland" ;) 17:18:22 <planetmaker> FooBar_, it kinda is :P 17:18:30 <planetmaker> looking up words :P 17:18:33 <FooBar_> hehehe 17:18:40 <FooBar_> och -> ook 17:18:55 <planetmaker> he :) 17:19:25 <FooBar_> if you want to be taught, you'll know it ;) 17:19:42 <planetmaker> yes, probably :) 17:19:54 <planetmaker> I didn't look up that :) And wrongly went by memory 17:19:59 <FooBar_> do you live close to NL? 17:20:20 <planetmaker> moderatly. It's maybe 3...4 hours drive or so. 17:20:28 <FooBar_> och seems a bit of a combination of "ook" and "auch"... 17:20:34 <planetmaker> yup. :) 17:20:39 <FooBar_> not so close... 17:21:05 <planetmaker> close enough to go there for an occasional weekend. 17:21:25 <FooBar_> I'm probably quicker in Germany from where I am now. And I'm all the way at the west coast :P 17:21:32 <planetmaker> :P 17:21:46 <planetmaker> well... The border might be half way, maybe not quite. 17:21:57 <planetmaker> which town are you in? 17:22:09 <FooBar_> make that city: the hague 17:22:22 <planetmaker> I don't distinguish between town and city :) 17:22:45 <FooBar_> I do appearently 17:22:50 <FooBar_> :P 17:23:48 <FooBar_> was born and raised like 20 minutes driving from the German border though 17:23:49 <planetmaker> hm... google tells me, that wel then live 4:46h apart :) 17:24:32 <planetmaker> hm... 125km isn't far... it isn't 4h for sure :P 17:24:38 <planetmaker> to the border 17:25:03 <planetmaker> must be that I usually go to Eindhoven or Utrecht that it seems longer :) 17:25:44 <planetmaker> or Tilburg or Leiden when we're at it. 17:26:53 <FooBar_> where you live then? 17:27:16 <planetmaker> Braunschweig. about half an hour East of Hanover 17:28:09 <FooBar_> ok, I would've guessed a little closer to the border 17:28:22 <planetmaker> well. It's obviously only 125km :) 17:28:51 <planetmaker> wait... no. 17:29:02 <planetmaker> I did mis-interpret google map's route planning ;) 17:29:05 <FooBar_> I guess around 200 17:29:39 <FooBar_> around 260 it tells me 17:30:14 <planetmaker> makes sense, yes 17:31:52 <FooBar_> I see Wolfsburg is close to Braunschweig... 17:31:57 <FooBar_> ever been to Autostadt? 17:32:17 <planetmaker> yep. We did an excursion there last year from our institute. 17:32:37 <planetmaker> it's impressive :) 17:32:50 <FooBar_> you can say that again. I've seen it on tv a while back 17:32:53 <planetmaker> they have more area covered with roof than Lichtenstein has total state area :P 17:33:13 <FooBar_> If I'm ever buying a volkswagen, I'm collecting it there myself :P 17:33:20 <planetmaker> hehe :) 17:34:18 <FooBar_> I'm still interested in a golf convertible, but I don't know if they still make those... 17:34:32 <planetmaker> hm... dunno either actually. 17:34:37 <planetmaker> I *think* they might 17:36:21 <FooBar_> On the Dutch volkswagen website they only have the beetle as convertible 17:38:27 <FooBar_> and so it seems on the German website as well... 17:38:51 <FooBar_> otoh, the older model is way nicer as convertible anyways 17:39:41 <FooBar_> although that wouldn't have an automatic "make convertible" function 17:40:05 <FooBar_> and that being enough about cars and the bridge back to makefiles 17:40:53 <FooBar_> I'm off for a while... I'm gonna do the dishes 17:42:39 <planetmaker> enjoy :P 17:53:52 <planetmaker> Ammler, FooBar_ maybe you can check whether in the firs repository make grf, make bundle, make install and make dev now work as they should 17:53:57 <Ammler> someone knows, how hg log -X works? 17:54:12 <planetmaker> basically make dev is what we want, if we want no changing file, path and tar name. 17:54:15 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 58: Feature: introduce 'make dev' which installs a grf w... @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/58 (by planetmaker) 17:54:18 <planetmaker> installed in our install path 17:54:54 <FooBar_> lemme try 17:54:57 <planetmaker> bundle is as it was before, creating versioned path and filenames 17:55:05 *** Simozzz has quit IRC 17:55:11 <Ammler> with the whole version? 17:55:18 <planetmaker> as before 17:55:30 <planetmaker> haven't changed that yet. 17:56:01 <Ammler> well, the thing with only ONE grf in the data was thought for users too :-) 17:56:25 <planetmaker> Ammler, but foobar's point is to keep a nightly repository :) 17:56:31 <planetmaker> that wouldn't be possible then :) 17:56:38 <Ammler> I think, you don't need to invest effort in support both. 17:56:49 <planetmaker> it's no real effort. 17:57:04 <planetmaker> it's just another name :) 17:57:10 <planetmaker> and the same thing applied there. 17:58:18 <FooBar_> make bundle failed on zip here, but that's probably my problem 17:58:19 <Ammler> so make dev is make install but in same path 17:58:42 <planetmaker> kind of yes. 17:58:54 <Ammler> sounds well :-) 17:58:56 <planetmaker> it constantly overwrites the same tar file in your install dir 17:59:07 <planetmaker> with the seemingly same content 17:59:17 <planetmaker> judging by filenames and paths. 17:59:43 <planetmaker> FooBar_, that might be. I have to change that locally on one of my computers, too 17:59:57 <planetmaker> edit your makefile.local accordingly :) 18:00:11 <Ammler> use 7zip 18:00:17 <planetmaker> I used what works on my linux box 18:00:21 <FooBar_> make install and make dev work as expected for me 18:02:31 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 18:02:48 <planetmaker> ok, that's good. 18:02:51 <Ammler> he, something we don't have on our devzone: AIs ;-) 18:03:01 <planetmaker> Ammler, not yet, yes... 18:03:41 <planetmaker> I talked with Yexo about that once. Basically it seems to be difficult to get to terms what you want with an AI ;) 18:03:44 <Ammler> admiralai is on version 22, last time I used that was around 10 18:04:03 <Brot6> firs: Backup push to ssh://hg@bitbucket.org/firs/firs/ initiated. 18:04:15 <planetmaker> hehe :) We should play PS with one competition. Will teach people efficiency :) 18:05:21 <Ammler> nah, they are easy beatable 18:05:43 <Ammler> don't think, AdmiralAI has any chance, either Version 22 18:06:43 <Ammler> noaicomp is still installed on my server ;-) 18:07:49 <planetmaker> nice :) 18:08:38 <FooBar_> actually, I don't need the zip anyways, so let it fail :) 18:08:53 *** Simozzz has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 18:11:34 <FooBar_> make: ohnoyoudont: Command not found :P 18:11:47 <planetmaker> :P 18:12:18 <FooBar_> as I don't need the bz2 either :P 18:17:11 <planetmaker> FooBar_, then you don't need make bundle. You could just as well use make tar then :) 18:17:45 <FooBar_> there you have a point... 18:17:49 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 59: Fix: have make bundle do nothing if everything is up... @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/59 (by planetmaker) 18:20:57 <planetmaker> so... question: should I introduce another target 'nightly' in order to keep the versioned files (e.g. rename bundle to it) and strip the minor versions from make install as discussed before? 18:23:34 <FooBar_> yes, I think you should 18:23:52 <FooBar_> in that case you can drop make dev altogether, as make install would do essentially the same 18:24:03 <planetmaker> he... true. 18:24:09 <planetmaker> :P 18:33:08 <Ammler> well, i thought about changing the nightly repo with additional folder 18:33:15 <Ammler> like openttd 18:33:49 <planetmaker> hm? 18:33:59 <Ammler> <title>/<rev|tag>/<title>.tar 18:34:32 <Ammler> or zip 18:35:16 <FooBar_> possible... 18:35:16 <andythenorth> (watching makefile discussion with interest)...been climbing in the roof of our building. dusty 18:35:33 <planetmaker> /home/ingo/ottd/openttd-trunk-r15896-linux-generic-i686: <-- that's how openttd does it. 18:35:43 <Ammler> because I would like to include a changelog.txt there :-) 18:35:56 <planetmaker> title-rev|tag/file.grf 18:36:16 <planetmaker> what does changelog.txt have to do with this? 18:36:31 <Ammler> planetmaker: that is how the cf of openttd does it :-) 18:37:02 <planetmaker> define "that". I just posted verbatim what openttd distributes. 18:37:39 <Ammler> well in the current folder, how or where would you solve that? 18:37:43 <planetmaker> I have the strong feeling you want to make the point for something which is already feasable without any change. 18:37:59 <Ammler> planetmaker: I meant, it is not up to the makefile 18:38:18 <Ammler> the openttd install doesn't make "versioned" folders 18:38:45 <planetmaker> yes. 18:38:48 <planetmaker> and? 18:38:49 <Ammler> but for distribution, this would be nice. 18:38:56 <planetmaker> exactly. 18:39:29 <planetmaker> distribution = what make bundle does right now 18:39:49 <planetmaker> testing purposes = what make dev does right now 18:40:25 <planetmaker> so... make install should overwrite a compatible grf. 18:40:39 <planetmaker> with the major version as derived from the GRFID 18:40:50 <planetmaker> hm... 18:40:51 <Ammler> oh 18:40:54 <planetmaker> or? 18:40:57 <Ammler> you added that either :-) 18:41:12 <FooBar_> planetmaker: make install should indeed do that imo 18:41:18 <Ammler> for make dev? 18:41:27 <planetmaker> make install _currently_ installs the verbose paths. 18:42:03 <planetmaker> ok... confusion comes up. 18:42:06 <planetmaker> What do we want? 18:42:11 <Ammler> :-) 18:42:14 <planetmaker> what do we need? 18:42:29 <planetmaker> I don't feel like changing everything in circles constantly. 18:42:52 <FooBar_> :) 18:43:13 <planetmaker> a) dev install: same filename and path always 18:43:16 <andythenorth> :) I spend a lot of time tweaking offsets. When I have finished one vehicle I like to make a commit (more) 18:43:28 <planetmaker> b) distribution files: zip, bz2, tar with full versions 18:43:46 <planetmaker> c) update files which overwrite compatible newgrfs 18:44:06 <planetmaker> andythenorth, I play with the firs set. So heqs is save :P 18:44:16 <planetmaker> right now that is :) 18:44:18 <andythenorth> good, but I have problems of my own :) 18:44:26 <DJ_Nekkid> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/193/tempplate.nfo.grf 18:44:31 <DJ_Nekkid> template! 18:44:35 <DJ_Nekkid> have a look! 18:44:47 <Ammler> is it a grf? 18:44:50 <DJ_Nekkid> yes! 18:44:52 <FooBar_> a) -> make dev-install b) -> make nightly c) -> make install 18:44:53 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: 2cc train set - tempplate.nfo.grf @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/193/tempplate.nfo.grf (by DJNekkid) 18:45:01 <DJ_Nekkid> just a bit fucked up batfile :p 18:45:18 <andythenorth> FooBar_: makes sense. sorry missed some of this earlier :( 18:45:21 <planetmaker> FooBar_, shouldn't b) be called make bundle? 18:45:27 <DJ_Nekkid> attach the normal pax coach 18:46:08 *** Simozzz has quit IRC 18:46:11 <FooBar_> planetmaker: make bundle is fine 18:46:36 <planetmaker> FooBar_, but then: do the bundles not overwrite the old version? 18:46:45 <andythenorth> fine with me. Make dev looks like it might solve the problem I have 18:46:49 <FooBar_> in this case: no 18:46:50 <planetmaker> they should then do that, shouldn't they? 18:46:57 <planetmaker> I mean, if you unpack them 18:47:27 <FooBar_> if so, then you shouldn't provide a tar 18:47:41 <planetmaker> hm... wouldn't suffice to keep a zip with the appropriate name? 18:47:45 <FooBar_> as the risk of two tars with different names but same paths is unacceptable 18:48:03 <FooBar_> imo 18:48:06 <planetmaker> yes. then we need to skip tar as distribution. Doesn't hurt, though 18:48:25 <andythenorth> I don't distribute tar. What's the use case for it? 18:48:41 <FooBar_> that you don't need to extract it 18:48:47 <planetmaker> andythenorth, just put in into your data dir and be fine 18:48:55 <andythenorth> ah yes 18:49:09 <FooBar_> which is a major advantage, but also a major problem at the moment 18:49:16 <planetmaker> he, yes. 18:49:43 <andythenorth> Because I want to distribute a pdf manual, I'm preferring zip for distribution. That could be changed. 18:50:05 <planetmaker> ok. So I'll create a zip and bzip2 with the full version information. Which can also be put in our nightly archive 18:50:10 <FooBar_> I'd say do just two options: create a fully versioned bundle and create a major-only versioned bundle 18:50:51 <planetmaker> wouldn't it suffice to just keep distinct zip files? 18:51:07 <planetmaker> the files packed would overwrite a previous version? 18:51:09 <FooBar_> with the filenames inside being the same for each release? 18:51:13 <planetmaker> yes 18:51:14 <planetmaker> ? 18:51:19 <FooBar_> ok, yes that would do 18:51:31 <planetmaker> then we would have solved that issue for all people :) 18:51:41 <FooBar_> indeed we do 18:51:50 <DJ_Nekkid> Ammler: "looks" good? :p 18:51:51 <andythenorth> FYI, I manually keep a 'releases' folder locally outside the repo for reference to previous releases. I'm also uploading those to devzone 'files' section. I store the zips in there, to the scheme FooBar_ described just now above (same grf name) 18:51:52 <planetmaker> maybe not bananas. But that's nothing we can help 18:52:02 <Ammler> DJ_Nekkid: nice 18:52:19 <DJ_Nekkid> too bad Valuables dont work 18:52:27 <DJ_Nekkid> but as far as i can see is that a bug in ttd 18:52:38 <FooBar_> bananas eats zip files iirc 18:53:06 <andythenorth> bananas hates my pdf :( 18:53:17 <FooBar_> it shouldn't... 18:53:37 <andythenorth> well it does 18:53:40 <andythenorth> :D 18:53:53 <FooBar_> As long as it's named "readme.pdf" it should be accepted. At least that's the theory 18:54:04 <planetmaker> andythenorth, you name it wrongly :) 18:54:11 <andythenorth> name would explain it 18:54:16 <planetmaker> it does :) 18:54:32 <planetmaker> the usuage information of bananas tell you the acceptable filenames and types 18:54:32 <Ammler> bundle: create a dir (withoutversion), compile grf there and copy the docs there 18:54:54 <Ammler> install copy a tar of that dir 18:55:18 <Ammler> release: copy a tar with version of that dir 18:55:32 <planetmaker> hm... 18:56:00 <FooBar_> release goes wrong: it cannot be a tar for reasons of multiple files with same path/name info 18:56:06 <planetmaker> Ammler, ^ 18:56:20 <planetmaker> release make a zip with version information of that dir 18:56:24 <planetmaker> ^ how does that sound? 18:56:25 <FooBar_> if release copies a zip and bzip2 of that dir with version info, then it works 18:56:34 <FooBar_> :) 18:57:00 <Ammler> basoh 18:57:04 <Ammler> oh 18:57:11 <Ammler> we shouldn't make tar anyway 18:57:27 <Ammler> didn't we find out that already, planetmaker? 18:57:31 <FooBar_> tar is only really useful for OpenGFX anyhow 18:57:44 <Ammler> tar is only useful, if you have more than one grf 18:57:52 <Ammler> yes :-) 18:57:55 <FooBar_> :) 18:58:13 <andythenorth> :) 18:58:32 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: Heavy Equipment Set - Revision 85: Change: renamed manual to readme.pdf @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/heqs/repository/revisions/85 (by andythenorth) 18:58:32 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: Heavy Equipment Set - Revision 86: Change: renamed manual source to readme.pages for Bananas comp... @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/heqs/repository/revisions/86 (by andythenorth) 18:58:32 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: Heavy Equipment Set - Revision 87: Merge @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/heqs/repository/revisions/87 (by andythenorth) 18:58:34 <Ammler> but 18:58:47 <Ammler> shouldn't the release overwrite the dir, too? 18:58:54 <planetmaker> yes. 18:59:06 <Ammler> so just the zip itself has the version info? 18:59:10 <planetmaker> yes 18:59:16 <planetmaker> just the zip filename 18:59:20 <Ammler> NICE 18:59:28 <planetmaker> now you have what you want :P 18:59:29 <andythenorth> yes 18:59:32 <Ammler> that is how I wanted, isn't? 18:59:36 <FooBar_> can we still have major release in path/file? 18:59:37 <Ammler> hehe 18:59:51 <Ammler> hmm 18:59:58 <Ammler> now, back to the compile farm 18:59:58 <planetmaker> Ammler, correct wording would be: "you may get what you want" :P 19:00:09 <planetmaker> once the makefile changed ;) 19:00:28 <FooBar_> or last byte of grfid thingy? 19:00:35 <Ammler> and we still have the "issue" with Bananas 19:00:46 <planetmaker> yes, that will be included, FooBar_ in the "unversioned thing" 19:00:47 <Ammler> you need a target bananas ;-) 19:01:00 <planetmaker> Ammler, can be done, too 19:01:11 <Ammler> which makes a zip without dir 19:01:28 <planetmaker> can one upload a zip there? 19:01:35 <FooBar_> or just don't put the dir in the zip, as for a zip that isn't really needed anyhow 19:01:42 <FooBar_> IIRC one can upload a zip 19:01:52 <Ammler> it is for the release 19:02:56 <planetmaker> for releases it's needed. People unpack it and then it's in the proper dir. I like that actually if it doesn't spam the current folder but neatly creates its own with the files unpacked. 19:03:08 <planetmaker> avoids overwriting readme.txt and stuff 19:03:36 <FooBar_> ok, I usually only extract the actual grf and throw the rest out 19:03:42 <planetmaker> :D 19:03:50 <planetmaker> do-not-readme.txt :P 19:04:00 <planetmaker> never complain about users not reading it then ;) 19:04:07 <FooBar_> I don't 19:04:36 <FooBar_> But I do redownload it again if something isn't working like expected to read the readme 19:04:41 <andythenorth> this is kind of useful, and I kind of need to go offline for 20 mins :( 19:05:08 <planetmaker> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/244 <-- that's our baseline / target now ? 19:05:27 <FooBar_> andythenorth: ask for a transcript when you get back 19:05:34 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Support #244: Re-wamp makesystem @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/244 (by planetmaker) 19:05:40 <planetmaker> andythenorth, get a bouncer :) 19:05:42 <andythenorth> re wamp :) 19:05:54 <planetmaker> ah... I knew it was wrong ;) 19:06:03 <planetmaker> forgot to check before I hit "sent" ;) 19:06:10 <andythenorth> my mother-in-law says rewamp. She's indian :) She also says wodka 19:06:23 * planetmaker does that probably, too ;) 19:07:09 <andythenorth> ok, so 'make dev' is dropped from that list then? 19:07:19 <planetmaker> it's not really needed then... 19:07:28 <FooBar_> yes, as make install is basically the same 19:07:29 <andythenorth> make install gets the same result 19:07:30 <planetmaker> well. Check it and add :) 19:07:55 <Ammler> and a "make dir" ? 19:08:19 <planetmaker> Ammler, that's nothing which the user of the makefile needs to know about. But I'll need it as dependency. 19:08:33 <planetmaker> we have it actually. 19:08:34 <Ammler> well; i would that too 19:08:39 <planetmaker> why? 19:08:44 <andythenorth> will do later. Constantly quitting open ttd and reloading it when the file version incremented was driving me nuts. 19:08:48 <Ammler> then I don't need to install 19:08:55 <Ammler> that is like make bundle in openttd 19:09:08 <planetmaker> it has no use for you, Ammler... use make tar :) 19:09:16 <FooBar_> as long as "unversioned" reads <name>[nightly|major_rev] I think it's fine 19:09:18 <planetmaker> or use make dir. It will be there. 19:09:21 <Ammler> nah, no tar 19:09:26 <Ammler> I like to see the files 19:10:05 <andythenorth> unzip? :) 19:10:06 <planetmaker> FooBar_, unversioned = really no version except major rev. No distinction between nightly and releases 19:10:10 <planetmaker> or is it needed? 19:10:12 <Ammler> lol 19:10:26 <Ammler> not here :P 19:10:42 <andythenorth> unversioned not wanted by me 19:10:46 <FooBar_> like said this afternoon: i like to keep the latest release and a nightly 19:11:17 <FooBar_> or to be more precise: latest release and latest home-made build 19:11:54 <andythenorth> 'keep' in your data folder, or in your local repo? 19:12:02 <FooBar_> in data folder 19:12:09 <Ammler> FooBar_: but then you can't just hig apply, if you fix a stable ;-) 19:12:10 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: 2cc train set - Revision 210: added the template .grf and .pcx ... This will work on _MOST_ mus @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/2cctrainset/repository/revisions/210 (by DJNekkid) 19:12:39 <planetmaker> you two sort that out ;) 19:12:46 <FooBar_> Ammler: nightly <=> stable transitions will be very rare 19:12:55 <andythenorth> FooBar_: I used to do that. It helps check 'did this work in a previous version, did I break it, or did ottd nightly break it??' 19:13:12 <andythenorth> FooBar_: I currently have stopped doing that 19:13:27 <andythenorth> because openttd has retarded behaviour in the 'rescan' files window 19:13:41 <andythenorth> but that's an ottd problem, not a make problem? 19:14:08 <planetmaker> andythenorth, there was at least one fix today. It doesn't crash anymore, if you delete files. 19:14:09 <Ammler> but that problem doesn't exist, if you overwrite the grf, imo. 19:14:32 <Ammler> then it just reloads 19:14:43 <Ammler> rescan doesn't work here either 19:14:44 <andythenorth> But if you overwrite the grf, it doesn't meet the use case I described above. i.e. something broke - did it used to work? 19:14:57 <andythenorth> I had that problem with HEQS several times recently. 19:14:58 <Ammler> sometime, I will look why. 19:15:09 <andythenorth> Mostly due to the ottd nightlies breaking newgrf features 19:15:39 <andythenorth> In that case I could check old versions of the grf and latest version to be sure it wasn't me who had broken something 19:15:46 <Ammler> andythenorth: hg up 1.0 && make -> test -> hg up tip && make -> apply test 19:16:19 <planetmaker> make install instead of make ;) 19:16:25 <Ammler> or that :P 19:16:29 <andythenorth> meh. might as well move the files around :P 19:16:39 <Ammler> yep 19:16:40 <andythenorth> from my well-maintained release archive 19:16:41 <andythenorth> :) 19:17:05 <FooBar_> all too much effort if I could just have the latest compile and the latest stable in the data dir... 19:17:06 <Ammler> but as long as the path is identical, it should load the new grf 19:17:21 <Ammler> at least, it did last time I fixed something on 2cc 19:17:29 <planetmaker> FooBar_, then you cannot compare with a simple "re-apply" 19:17:29 <FooBar_> yes, it does do that 19:17:29 <andythenorth> my example is an edge case. but it happened. 19:17:56 <FooBar_> planetmaker: I don't care. To be sure I need to start a new game anyways. 19:17:56 <andythenorth> gah, newgrf needs versions. then this would go away 19:18:22 <planetmaker> FooBar_, somewhat true. 19:18:38 <Ammler> andythenorth: that needs time, we need a good solution now :-) 19:18:41 <planetmaker> should I add a 4th target: make versioned-archive ? 19:18:53 <planetmaker> with paths? 19:19:05 <andythenorth> hell why not 19:19:08 <andythenorth> :) 19:19:22 <Ammler> planetmaker: that would then also be for the compile farm? 19:19:43 <Ammler> with a changelog.txt :P 19:19:45 <planetmaker> I thought you would use make release 19:20:08 <planetmaker> zip-filename with version containing unversioned path and newgrf 19:20:18 <Ammler> ah, versioned-archive has the version string 19:20:30 <Ammler> in the dir? 19:20:33 <planetmaker> no 19:20:42 <planetmaker> in the filename of the zip 19:20:52 <planetmaker> so that people can update :) 19:21:10 <planetmaker> but hell.... does it all make sense? 19:21:29 <andythenorth> well I'm lost. but I think you're getting there ;) 19:21:31 <FooBar_> can you do if(tag) { path = path + major_version; } ? 19:21:37 <planetmaker> yes 19:21:44 <planetmaker> I actually do that :) 19:21:46 <andythenorth> that would do. 19:21:48 <FooBar_> that's everything I need 19:21:52 <planetmaker> well. not major version but revision. 19:21:57 <andythenorth> the case I gave above, I only test against releases 19:21:59 <planetmaker> but that's "details". 19:22:10 <planetmaker> major version is giving me headaches, but should be feasable. 19:22:23 <andythenorth> would you rather be writing varaction 2 :) 19:22:34 <FooBar_> well, instead of major version you can do the last byte of the grfid. That's sufficient as well 19:22:38 <Ammler> well, the Compile Farm needs: <project>/[releases|nightlies]/[tag/rXX]/title-[tag|rXX].zip 19:23:02 <planetmaker> what is that many paths you have there? 19:23:02 <FooBar_> with no version in the zip 19:24:22 <Ammler> example for 2cc-nightly: 2cctrainset/nightlies/r45/2cctrainset-r45.zip 19:25:04 <Ammler> 2cc-release: 2cctrainset/releases/1.1/2cctrainset-1.1.zip 19:25:24 <Ammler> but I can do that with scripts 19:25:46 <planetmaker> Ammler, well... the makefile should IMO create the files always in the main repo dir 19:25:51 <planetmaker> or the dirs. 19:26:11 <planetmaker> that's where I look at least :) 19:26:17 <Ammler> or without the subdir for versions? 19:26:26 <Ammler> (like it is now) 19:27:05 <planetmaker> now we have everything in the same dir 19:27:14 <planetmaker> firs/firs-r45.zip 19:27:20 <Ammler> yep 19:27:24 <planetmaker> firs/firs-0.1.zip 19:27:33 <Ammler> but I would like to add at least a changelog.txt 19:27:45 <planetmaker> Ammler, it is enclosed in the zip... 19:27:49 <planetmaker> already. now 19:27:53 <Ammler> not the manually one 19:27:55 <planetmaker> look at makefile.config 19:28:02 <Ammler> one which will be generated by hg log 19:28:15 <planetmaker> well. Then figure out how to do that and make it part of the makefile. 19:28:24 <planetmaker> should be no issue. 19:28:37 <Ammler> well, doesn't need to be in the Makefile 19:28:44 <planetmaker> well... s/no issue/feasable/ :P 19:28:52 <planetmaker> Ammler, but makes sense. 19:29:01 <Ammler> that is just the reason, why I think about subdir for versions 19:29:07 <planetmaker> or make a script for now and I'll see :) 19:29:23 <Ammler> as you have more then just the zip per compile 19:29:34 <planetmaker> ? 19:29:57 <Ammler> the changelog is outside of the zip 19:30:13 <Ammler> it is for reading, if you should download the zip :-) 19:30:20 <Ammler> like openttd :-) 19:30:40 <andythenorth> back in a bit...have fun :) 19:30:58 <Ammler> http://mz.openttdcoop.org/bundles/is2/IS2.0-beta3/ 19:31:37 <Ammler> there is a changelog.txt made from the cf 19:31:41 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 19:31:49 <Ammler> oh 19:32:15 <planetmaker> hg log > changelog.txt 19:32:21 <Ammler> yes 19:32:28 <Ammler> well, just the part since last compile 19:32:50 <planetmaker> true. :) 19:33:11 <Ammler> he, dunno, how it is in the is 19:33:27 <planetmaker> hg log -r<old>:tip > changelog.txt 19:34:15 <Ammler> yes, that is how I would do it. 19:34:35 <Ammler> so back to my question, subdir for it? 19:34:37 <planetmaker> hm, yes. That is the job of the compile farm, though, I think 19:34:57 <planetmaker> that's nothing the usual person needs. 19:35:07 <Ammler> I couls also just make changelog-rXX.txt 19:35:34 <Ammler> yep, it is just a indicator for people, if they should download the new nightly 19:36:05 <planetmaker> changelog-rXX sounds ok to me. 19:36:14 <Ammler> then without 19:36:31 <Ammler> (subdir, I mean :-P 19:37:01 <Ammler> the compile log is enough for the last build only? 19:37:42 <planetmaker> I would keep them as long as the build itself is available. 19:42:11 <Ammler> so log-rXX.txt :P 19:47:53 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Revision 177: Added 737-100 to 7F @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/worldairlineset/repository/revisions/177 (by Frank) 19:48:40 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 19:54:25 <andythenorth> did something get resolved then? 19:54:29 <andythenorth> :0 20:47:57 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Revision 178: Changes to 737 Co-ord file£ @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/worldairlineset/repository/revisions/178 (by Frank) 20:50:42 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 20:52:55 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 20:57:04 <Ammler> he, that is actually nice 20:57:26 <Ammler> you can just push the is2 to a trunk repo, it does upload without conflict 20:57:48 <Ammler> is2 is now officially fork of trunk :-) 20:59:12 <planetmaker> :) 21:00:17 <DJ_Nekkid> in other words 21:00:33 <DJ_Nekkid> in a couple of months is IS2 _in_ the nightlies? :p 21:00:44 <Ammler> no idea 21:00:52 <DJ_Nekkid> well ... most likely :) 21:01:04 <Ammler> I fear, not. 21:01:41 <Ammler> well, let us suprise ;-) 21:03:05 <Ammler> nice graph about merge: https://bitbucket.org/OpenTTD/infrastructure-sharing/changesets/ 21:03:08 <Webster> Title: OpenTTD / Infrastructure Sharing / changesets bitbucket.org (at bitbucket.org) 21:03:24 <DJ_Nekkid> planetmaker: did u check out the tempplate.grf? :) 21:04:12 <planetmaker> DJ_Nekkid: not yet. But I should :) Can you give me the link again, please? 21:04:32 <DJ_Nekkid> 2cc-set dir, and hg pull -u :) 21:04:49 <Ammler> oh :-( 21:04:52 <planetmaker> then I have it :) 21:04:57 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 21:05:06 <DJ_Nekkid> then copy to openttd dir 21:05:07 <Ammler> a grf in the repo? 21:05:21 <planetmaker> hm... indeed. Why not uploaded to the files section? 21:06:13 <Ammler> I downloaded it from there 21:06:14 <DJ_Nekkid> it is there as well ... 21:06:35 <DJ_Nekkid> just thought it were a good idea at the time:) 21:07:14 <planetmaker> not really as it's not needed (or helpful) in building the grf or programming it. Its sources might be, though 21:07:32 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:08:02 <DJ_Nekkid> doh, didnt i add the sorce to it? 21:08:13 <planetmaker> dunno. I didn't check. 21:08:17 <DJ_Nekkid> i didnt... 21:08:22 <Ammler> but what does make the template special? 21:08:49 <Ammler> I see a nice train with front engine and back control cabine or what does it mean? 21:08:52 <DJ_Nekkid> it will work for 90% of the mus 21:09:01 <DJ_Nekkid> plus: 21:09:12 <DJ_Nekkid> mail capacity and gfx changes 21:09:12 <Ammler> you mean same nfo, just other sprites? 21:09:17 <DJ_Nekkid> yes :) 21:09:26 <DJ_Nekkid> and, ofcourse, edit about 10 lines... 21:09:41 <DJ_Nekkid> it's "frameworked" for precompiling 21:09:51 <Ammler> well, the lines, which need edit mgith be vars? 21:09:53 <planetmaker> that's cool. But indeed the nfo is enough then. But it's a very good start for that framework :) 21:09:57 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: 2cc train set - Revision 211: tempplate to repo @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/2cctrainset/repository/revisions/211 (by DJNekkid) 21:09:59 <planetmaker> Ammler: they ARE 21:10:24 <Ammler> already, sorry :P 21:10:27 <planetmaker> but there's no point to make the weight a var or the introduction date :) 21:10:39 <planetmaker> as they're individual and only used in that one place 21:10:59 <planetmaker> but ID is a var etc. Looks really clean code-wise :) 21:12:06 <Ammler> why not make the the individual things vars too? 21:12:16 <Ammler> and define those on the head? 21:13:07 <Ammler> so you have something like cat mus.header mus.template mus.sprites > mus.nfo 21:13:21 <Ammler> and mus.template has no changes 21:13:55 <DJ_Nekkid> individual things? 21:14:00 <planetmaker> uhm... ? you need to programme an example for that, I guess, Ammler 21:14:18 <Ammler> DJ_Nekkid: where is that source DJ_Nekkid? 21:14:30 <Ammler> -1 hightlight 21:14:43 <DJ_Nekkid> the template souce itself is in the nfo/mus folder 21:15:00 <DJ_Nekkid> the sourse for the current .grf is in the sprites folder 21:15:13 <andythenorth> Looks useful. 21:15:27 <andythenorth> Definitely the sort of thing I was hoping to do for FIRS 21:17:26 <Ammler> hmm, I don't see vars there 21:17:30 <Ammler> what do I miss 21:17:32 <Ammler> ? 21:17:47 <DJ_Nekkid> look in the mus folder Ammler 21:17:53 <DJ_Nekkid> nfo/mus 21:18:02 <DJ_Nekkid> template.pnfo or something 21:18:03 <Ammler> yes, there is a template.nfo 21:18:23 <Ammler> but already filled with values 21:18:26 <Ammler> not variables 21:18:43 <DJ_Nekkid> look at the action 3 for example 21:18:50 <DJ_Nekkid> the "cannot attach" line 21:18:57 <planetmaker> andythenorth: yes, that I hope, too :) 21:18:57 <DJ_Nekkid> directly under ----- engine ---- 21:19:18 <DJ_Nekkid> P-list text 21:19:23 <DJ_Nekkid> -1 * 0 02 00 4F 81 0C 00 FF 01 STR_<engine> 80 23 23 40 00 21:19:37 <DJ_Nekkid> the first line of them all 21:19:40 <DJ_Nekkid> -1 * 0 00 00 \b29 01 ID_ENGINE // ID 21:19:40 <Ammler> ok, I see 21:19:56 <DJ_Nekkid> how much more is actually practical? 21:20:06 <andythenorth> that would just need expanding to more vars 21:20:08 <Ammler> I thought about all :-) 21:20:17 <DJ_Nekkid> for example? 21:21:03 <DJ_Nekkid> one can ofcourse do stuff like load_pax_fast load_pax_slow 21:21:19 <andythenorth> has anyone figured out if there is just one namespace for make? 21:21:40 <Ammler> then you have "cat default.vars individual.vars action0.tmpl > action0.pnfo" 21:21:43 <planetmaker> andythenorth: what do you mean with namespace? 21:22:07 <planetmaker> you mean like all vars are global? 21:22:15 <andythenorth> I may be abusing the term, but yes, are all vars global? 21:22:18 <planetmaker> then: probably yes. 21:22:24 <andythenorth> or can they be localised, to a macro or something for example 21:22:26 <planetmaker> I haven't found differently 21:22:42 <andythenorth> we do similar things with page templates in web cms's for example 21:22:44 <planetmaker> but you can use sub-makefiles for sub dirs 21:22:59 <Ammler> andythenorth: you could use usual bash 21:23:07 <Ammler> with sed and awk 21:23:13 <andythenorth> can make run scripts, e.g. python files or similar? 21:23:18 <planetmaker> but... either that ^or the point is to be general that it applies to the rules 21:23:45 <planetmaker> andythenorth: it could. But then it's not a universal makefile anymore 21:23:52 <andythenorth> nope, agreed 21:23:54 <andythenorth> just wondering 21:23:55 <planetmaker> I'd like to avoide that 21:23:59 <Ammler> python shouldn't be a problem either 21:24:04 <Ammler> as hg is python already 21:24:10 <planetmaker> hg requires it, yes. But... 21:24:48 <Ammler> :-) 21:25:02 <andythenorth> I am halfway to thinking that I could generate config or pnfo files for FIRS from the existing cms for my site (which is object orientated). 21:25:14 <andythenorth> which would be a bit insane, but only slightly 21:25:26 *** FooBar_ has quit IRC 21:25:57 <andythenorth> who upset FooBar_ :D 21:25:59 <andythenorth> ? 21:26:07 <Ammler> is the cms something selfmade? 21:26:40 <andythenorth> no, it's Zope. Python based. Reason I learnt python in fact. But the specific pages for FIRS I hacked together 21:27:23 <andythenorth> I already have industry ID, cargos, dates etc 21:27:35 <andythenorth> as properties on objects 21:27:39 <andythenorth> with a templating system... 21:28:06 <Ammler> well, it would just be nice, if you could do something, that changes are possible without you. 21:28:53 <andythenorth> Yep, that is a point well made] 21:29:04 <DJ_Nekkid> i suspect templates for FIRS is worse then for trains :=) 21:29:12 <Ammler> including the whole zope framework to the project mgiht be an idea ;-) 21:29:23 <planetmaker> from make manual: 21:29:23 <andythenorth> burrrr don't do that :) 21:29:27 <planetmaker> The configure script and the Makefile rules for building and installation should not use any utilities directly except these: 21:29:29 <planetmaker> cat cmp cp diff echo egrep expr false grep install-info 21:29:30 <planetmaker> ln ls mkdir mv pwd rm rmdir sed sleep sort tar test touch true 21:29:45 <DJ_Nekkid> a question; 21:30:04 <DJ_Nekkid> if i were to make a "inject me" file, how? :) 21:30:09 <planetmaker> and ar bison cc flex install ld ldconfig lex 21:30:11 <planetmaker> make makeinfo ranlib texi2dvi yacc 21:30:11 <DJ_Nekkid> i mean, what is the format of it? 21:30:21 <Ammler> were is that list from? 21:30:24 <planetmaker> DJ_Nekkid: depends. But the same 21:30:43 <DJ_Nekkid> lets say i make a "mus.thisiswhereshitiskept" 21:30:44 <planetmaker> I do basically do what you did previously with copy /y > file 21:30:57 <planetmaker> in the correct order 21:31:23 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - cms_example.png @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/194/cms_example.png (by andythenorth) 21:31:39 <DJ_Nekkid> lets say i want COST_TEMP to be \b100 21:31:42 <andythenorth> right bedtime, here's a screenie of the tt-foundry cms to leave you with ;) 21:31:42 <andythenorth> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/194/cms_example.png 21:32:17 <planetmaker> DJ_Nekkid: look at the Makefile 21:32:40 <andythenorth> can 'someone' let me know where you end up with this description? I have to go! 21:32:41 <planetmaker> in the section $(NFO_FILENAME) : $(CPNFO_FILENAME) 21:32:47 <andythenorth> bye 21:32:53 <planetmaker> bye andythenorth :) 21:33:07 <planetmaker> ping me during day. At work I'll have logs 21:33:23 <DJ_Nekkid> this looks like NFO did to me a year and a half ago 21:33:30 <planetmaker> @sed -e "s/{{GRF_TITLE}}/$(GRF_TITLE)/" \ 21:33:32 <planetmaker> -e "s/{{GRF_ID}}/$(GRF_ID)/" \ 21:33:34 <planetmaker> $(CPNFO_FILENAME) > $(NFO_FILENAME) 21:33:47 <planetmaker> I use (currently) sed to replace a string 21:33:55 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 21:34:00 <Ammler> webster does log too 21:34:04 <planetmaker> I search for {{GRF_TITLE}} 21:34:20 <planetmaker> and replace it by the variable $(GRF_TITLE) 21:34:30 <planetmaker> the latter is defined previously in Makefile.local 21:34:40 <DJ_Nekkid> *sigh* 21:34:42 <DJ_Nekkid> hehe 21:35:13 <planetmaker> I do that with the file stored in $(CPNFO_FILENAME) and put the result in $(NFO_FILENAME) 21:35:21 <planetmaker> e.g 21:35:55 <planetmaker> sed -e "s/{{GRF_TITLE}}/Mein toller Titel/ mynew.cpnfo > mynew.nfo 21:35:59 <planetmaker> would do the trick 21:36:07 <planetmaker> But I put all that in variables 21:36:24 <DJ_Nekkid> im still confised 21:36:32 <planetmaker> sed -e "s/{{GRF_TITLE}}/Mein toller Titel/ inputfile > outputfile 21:36:34 <DJ_Nekkid> one step at the time please! 21:36:36 <DJ_Nekkid> hehe 21:36:37 <Ammler> http://hyru.ath.cx:60080/~kenji/ottdcoop/devzonelogs/ 21:36:38 <Webster> Title: Index of /~kenji/ottdcoop/devzonelogs (at hyru.ath.cx:60080) 21:36:46 <DJ_Nekkid> first: how do i define something? 21:36:59 <planetmaker> sed -e "s/text-to-be-replaced/replacement-text/" inputfile > outputfile 21:37:18 <planetmaker> Well... so far we don't use the pre-processor 21:37:39 <DJ_Nekkid> i.e: 21:37:48 <planetmaker> If we want to do that excessively... we need some nicer means than applied now 21:38:18 <DJ_Nekkid> sed -e "s/COST_TEMP/\b100" tempplate.pnfo tempplate.nfo ? 21:38:42 <DJ_Nekkid> but ... 21:38:54 <Ammler> @services op 21:38:54 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Webster 21:38:56 <DJ_Nekkid> what i see is something like this: 21:39:08 <Ammler> @topic add Logs: http://hyru.ath.cx:60080/~kenji/ottdcoop/devzonelogs/ 21:39:08 *** Webster changes topic to "Talk about things hosted and developed on http://dev.openttdcoop.org | Logs: http://hyru.ath.cx:60080/~kenji/ottdcoop/devzonelogs/" 21:39:13 <planetmaker> There's one problem, DJ_Nekkid 21:39:28 <planetmaker> \ is a "special" character and sed fails on it in this simple form 21:39:32 <DJ_Nekkid> http://paste.openttd.org/183427 21:39:47 <planetmaker> I tried today briefly but have so far no solution 21:40:08 <DJ_Nekkid> and then some kind of cool software replace all RCOST_TRAIN1 with \b100 21:40:22 <planetmaker> DJ_Nekkid: that's what I want to have, too. Yes 21:40:35 <planetmaker> It's feasable. In principle 21:40:46 <DJ_Nekkid> \bRCOST_TRAIN1 ? 21:40:48 <planetmaker> But requires still quite a bit of work on the build system 21:41:10 <planetmaker> that's ugly ;9 21:41:12 <planetmaker> ;) 21:41:20 <Ammler> planetmaker: \ 21:41:25 <DJ_Nekkid> better then not working :) 21:41:28 <planetmaker> Ammler: no 21:41:30 <planetmaker> :( 21:41:32 <Ammler> just escpace the escpace char :-) 21:41:40 <planetmaker> I tried it. Doesn't work 21:41:46 <Ammler> excape* 21:41:50 <Ammler> sjdfseajflaskjf 21:41:57 <DJ_Nekkid> we _can_ use hex tho.. 21:42:08 <Ammler> I fail in typing, should go to bed... 21:42:09 <planetmaker> DJ_Nekkid: that's not a solution either IMO :) 21:42:25 <Ammler> no hex please 21:42:27 <planetmaker> each input for numbers should be acepted. 21:42:29 <DJ_Nekkid> i must say i agree 21:43:14 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Revision 179: Added new liveries in 7F @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/worldairlineset/repository/revisions/179 (by Frank) 21:43:14 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Revision 180: Fix 237 Finished most of 737-100 nfo, Purch and Run Costs remain @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/worldairlineset/repository/revisions/180 (by Frank) 21:43:14 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Feature #237 (Closed): B737-100 NFO @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/237#change-527 (by Frank) 21:43:46 <Ammler> Frankr: you can't fix a feature ;-) 21:43:53 <Ammler> you fix bugs :P 21:44:36 <planetmaker> hr hr 21:49:16 <DJ_Nekkid> so... 21:52:37 <Ammler> hmm, does pikka have such a ugly tut? 21:53:09 <Ammler> benny is making same failure as djn, encoding a nfo, lol. 21:55:04 <Frankr> sorry ammker 21:55:05 <Frankr> lol 21:55:11 <Frankr> ammler* 21:55:35 <Ammler> just use Feature #XX :-) 21:55:43 <DJ_Nekkid> what failure did i make? :) 21:55:49 <DJ_Nekkid> i mean, witch one? 21:55:56 <Ammler> grfcodec -e *.nfo 21:56:11 <Ammler> I guess, was does still that ;-) 21:56:16 <Frankr> kk 21:58:50 <Ammler> DJ_Nekkid: now, I kow why you use that, pikka has that in his tut. 21:59:02 <DJ_Nekkid> what do i use? 21:59:04 <Ammler> kinda :-o 21:59:11 <Ammler> [23:56] <Ammler> grfcodec -e *.nfo 21:59:17 <DJ_Nekkid> never used that in my life! 21:59:22 <DJ_Nekkid> i swear! 21:59:34 <Ammler> hehe, we have history in the source, you know :P 21:59:43 <DJ_Nekkid> yes i do 21:59:48 <DJ_Nekkid> and i know, i've never done that! 22:00:09 <Ammler> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/2cctrainset/repository/revisions/0/entry/2cc offline.bat#L27 22:00:26 <Ammler> grfcodec.exe -c -e -p 2 2ccdj.nfo.new.nfo 22:00:36 <DJ_Nekkid> no *.nfo there! 22:00:45 <Ammler> ah 22:00:52 <Ammler> but soemthing.nfo 22:00:57 <Ammler> instead of something.grf 22:01:09 <DJ_Nekkid> blame foobar! 22:01:13 <Ammler> no 22:01:16 <DJ_Nekkid> yes! 22:01:22 <Ammler> pikka does the same ugly thing 22:01:28 <DJ_Nekkid> it is ecensially his bat-file 22:01:35 <Ammler> ok 22:01:45 <Ammler> well, the makefile doesn't that anymore. 22:02:35 <DJ_Nekkid> the attachment is gone tho... if not could i prove it! 22:02:42 <DJ_Nekkid> hey, maby i still can 22:02:48 <DJ_Nekkid> almostish 22:03:29 <Ammler> but very late fixed: http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/2cctrainset/repository/revisions/198/diff/Makefile 22:03:46 <DJ_Nekkid> what is wrong with that btw? 22:04:02 <Brot6> 2cctrainset: Backup push to ssh://hg@bitbucket.org/OpenTTD/2cctrainset/ initiated. 22:04:08 <Brot6> firs: Backup push to ssh://hg@bitbucket.org/firs/firs/ initiated. 22:04:13 <Brot6> heqs: Backup push to ssh://hg@bitbucket.org/firs/heqs/ initiated. 22:04:38 <Ammler> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=796927#p796927 22:04:40 <Webster> Title: Transport Tycoon Forums View topic - DJ Nekkids & Bennythen00b's NFO lessons (at www.tt-forums.net) 22:05:05 <Ammler> I guess, it forces you to use such ugly extensions like nfo.nfo 22:05:32 <Ammler> and it is against the usage of grfcodec 22:05:37 <Ammler> just run grfcodec --help 22:07:04 <DJ_Nekkid> hmm 22:07:20 <DJ_Nekkid> i still find it wierd ... 22:07:24 <DJ_Nekkid> i write stuff in nfo 22:07:33 <Ammler> yes it is, it was always 22:07:39 <DJ_Nekkid> when its "codeced" it turn out to .grf 22:07:51 <Ammler> I never understood your batch files 22:08:02 <DJ_Nekkid> 1. nforenum 22:08:08 <DJ_Nekkid> 2. grfcodec 22:08:14 <DJ_Nekkid> 3. copy to ottd-dir 22:08:15 <DJ_Nekkid> :) 22:08:24 <Ammler> but you encode a grf not a nfo 22:08:34 <Ammler> it is like if you make a zip 22:08:43 <Ammler> zip *.zip <path> 22:09:10 <Ammler> renum *.nfo 22:09:17 <Ammler> grfcodec *.grf 22:09:31 <DJ_Nekkid> but i dont have a grf yet 22:09:35 <DJ_Nekkid> hehe 22:09:35 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Revision 181: Changed all Airbus nfo's nvar Callback @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/worldairlineset/repository/revisions/181 (by Frank) 22:09:37 <Ammler> hehe 22:10:01 <Ammler> grfcodec does know that and create a empty "container" then 22:10:02 <DJ_Nekkid> then it should be ... grfcodec -<stuff> file.grf file.nfo (or vica verca) 22:10:12 <Ammler> called *.new, afaik 22:10:37 <DJ_Nekkid> .new is because there are already a .grf 22:10:42 <DJ_Nekkid> as i've understood it 22:11:30 <DJ_Nekkid> i guess it have become an "industry standard" ... 22:11:37 <DJ_Nekkid> like driveing 15kmh over the speedlimit is 22:11:54 <DJ_Nekkid> not really allowed, but everyone, including the cops does it 22:13:14 <Ammler> well, I don't 22:13:23 <Ammler> and everyone else using Makefile doesn't 22:13:26 <Ammler> MB doesn't 22:13:29 <DJ_Nekkid> "old man with hat" :p 22:13:45 <Ammler> DS doesn't :P 22:13:46 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Revision 182: Changed all ATR nfo's nvar Callback @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/worldairlineset/repository/revisions/182 (by Frank) 22:13:46 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Feature #245: Boeing 737-100 pcx files @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/245 (by Frank) 22:13:55 <Ammler> now 2cc doesn't :P 22:14:04 <DJ_Nekkid> good for us 22:14:07 <Ammler> opengfx doesn't :P 22:14:30 <Ammler> no, it is seriously wrong 22:14:31 <DJ_Nekkid> guess foobar have learned a thing or two since that batfile got into my hands 22:14:48 <Ammler> benny wouldn't have those issues, if he would use it right 22:15:49 <Ammler> -f isn't even documented 22:16:18 <Ammler> what does that? 22:16:27 <DJ_Nekkid> force something? 22:16:30 <DJ_Nekkid> i dunno tbh 22:16:35 <Ammler> GRFCODEC -e [<Options>] <GRF-File> [<Directory>] 22:16:56 <Ammler> directory is "your stuff" ;-) 22:17:37 <DJ_Nekkid> hmm 22:17:38 <DJ_Nekkid> i see 22:17:51 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Revision 183: Updated WAS MS DOS Batch File @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/worldairlineset/repository/revisions/183 (by Frank) 22:18:50 <DJ_Nekkid> anyway, nn :) 22:21:14 <Ammler> yeah, me should too 22:21:17 <Ammler> long time ago 22:21:22 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Revision 184: Fixed #245 - Added 7 737-100 pcx files @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/worldairlineset/repository/revisions/184 (by Beardie27) 22:21:22 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Feature #245 (Closed): Boeing 737-100 pcx files @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/245#change-529 (by Beardie27) 22:21:24 <Ammler> good night DJN 22:22:27 <Ammler> hmm :P 22:23:01 <Frankr> cya DJ 22:23:53 <Ammler> ah, this time, it was beardie ;-) 22:25:08 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Revision 185: Fixed 737-100 nfo pcx file directories @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/worldairlineset/repository/revisions/185 (by Beardie27) 22:27:41 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Revision 186: Corrected Typo in WAS Batch @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/worldairlineset/repository/revisions/186 (by Frank) 22:28:48 <Frankr> ammler 22:29:03 <Ammler> Frankr: ? 22:29:04 <Frankr> is it close thn for features? 22:29:19 <Frankr> hg commit -m "close 245" 22:29:31 <Ammler> or Feature 22:29:37 <Frankr> ok 22:29:40 <Ammler> or doesn't that close? 22:29:48 <Frankr> don't know 22:31:47 <Ammler> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/home/wiki/Writing_Commit_Messages 22:32:36 <Ammler> it should also possible something like Feature #xx: blabla (close) 22:44:49 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - preprocessor.diff @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/195/preprocessor.diff (by planetmaker) 23:31:52 <Frankr> i'm off cya ammler 23:33:37 *** Frankr has quit IRC 23:40:08 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Feature #246: Boeing 737-200 Nfo @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/246 (by Frank) 23:43:10 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Feature #247: Boeing 737-300 Nfo @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/247 (by Frank) 23:43:10 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Bug #248: Boeing 737-300F Nfo @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/248 (by Frank) 23:43:10 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Feature #249: Boeing 737-400 Nfo @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/249 (by Frank) 23:43:10 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Feature #250: Boeing 737-500 Nfo @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/250 (by Frank) 23:43:12 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Feature #251: Boeing 737-600 Nfo @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/251 (by Frank) 23:45:23 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Feature #252: Boeing 737-700 Nfo @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/252 (by Frank) 23:48:11 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Feature #253: Boeing 737-800 Nfo @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/253 (by Frank) 23:48:11 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: World Airliners Set - Feature #254: Boeing 737-900 Nfo @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/254 (by Frank)