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00:09:03 *** ODM has quit IRC 01:16:19 *** KenjiE20|LT has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 01:16:32 *** KenjiE20 has quit IRC 02:33:49 <Brot6> Backup done! (Usage: 103M) 02:33:49 <Brot6> You mean you don't want to watch WRESTLING from ATLANTA? 03:51:12 *** KenjiE20|LT has quit IRC 06:40:23 *** DJNekkid has quit IRC 07:50:48 *** ODM has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 07:55:26 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: 2cc train set - Revision 353: Change: Apply the engine template to class 1044 @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/2cctrainset/repository/revisions/353 (by planetmaker) 07:55:26 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: 2cc train set - Revision 352: Change: Finish the engine template to allow to configure all proper... @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/2cctrainset/repository/revisions/352 (by planetmaker) 08:10:45 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 343: Change: updated production ratio for Dairy @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/343 (by andythenorth) 08:10:45 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: 2cc train set - Revision 354: Cleanup: remove a few unnecessary lines and apply a bit coding style @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/2cctrainset/repository/revisions/354 (by planetmaker) 08:15:52 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: 2cc train set - Code Review #625 (New): use templates for real @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/625 (by planetmaker) 08:31:19 <ODM> hey planetmaker 08:32:20 *** Chris_Booth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 08:48:40 *** Chris_Booth is now known as Guest211 08:48:45 *** Chris_Booth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 08:53:06 *** Guest211 has quit IRC 08:59:06 *** Chris_Booth has quit IRC 09:23:12 <planetmaker> moin ODM :-) 09:23:47 <ODM> what are you upto this early?:) 09:24:06 <planetmaker> early? 09:24:43 <ODM> well it was early like an hour ago:P 09:25:45 <planetmaker> early is anything < 8h 09:25:51 <ODM> no way 09:26:01 <planetmaker> and too early anything <7h ;-) 09:26:51 <ODM> early is anything for 2 hours after you wake up 09:27:08 <planetmaker> well. I woke up at 7:15 or so 09:27:13 <ODM> cheat 09:27:15 <planetmaker> so it wasn't early by my definition 09:27:15 <ODM> why so early?:P 09:27:26 <planetmaker> that's usual for me 09:27:36 <planetmaker> without alarm clock even 09:29:54 <ODM> ugh 10:02:42 *** LordAzamath has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 11:04:03 <Brot6> 2cctrainset: Backup push to ssh://hg@bitbucket.org/OpenTTD/2cctrainset/ initiated. 11:43:06 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: OpenGFX - Feature #107: Sprites 4627:4674 (48) - Toyland: Buildings @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/107#change-1570 (by LordAzamath) 12:14:53 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #624 (Closed): easier way to change industry map colours @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/624 (by foobar) 12:14:53 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 348: Feature: colours for industry map now in seperate f... @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/348 (by foobar) 12:14:53 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #624 (Closed): easier way to change industry map colours @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/624#change-1571 (by foobar) 12:34:16 *** KenjiE20 has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 12:49:33 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: 2cc train set - Revision 355: Change: Use the engine template for nearly all engines (part of iss... @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/2cctrainset/repository/revisions/355 (by planetmaker) 12:57:30 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: 2cc train set - Code Review #625: use templates for real @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/625#change-1572 (by planetmaker) 14:28:46 *** Webster_ has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 14:31:28 *** Webster has quit IRC 14:31:28 *** Webster_ is now known as Webster 14:55:08 *** mark has quit IRC 15:04:03 <Brot6> 2cctrainset: Backup push to ssh://hg@bitbucket.org/OpenTTD/2cctrainset/ initiated. 15:04:28 <Brot6> firs: Backup push to ssh://hg@bitbucket.org/firs/firs/ initiated. 15:41:35 *** mark has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 15:55:39 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #626 (New): make colours of default industries configurable @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/626 (by foobar) 16:16:15 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #626 (Closed): make colours of default industries configu... @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/626 (by foobar) 16:16:15 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 349: Feature: make colours of default industries configu... @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/349 (by foobar) 16:16:15 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #626 (Closed): make colours of default industries configu... @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/626#change-1573 (by foobar) 16:35:21 *** b3lsatar has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 16:35:58 <b3lsatar> can i have a host here ? 16:37:51 <Ammler> hello b3lsatar :-) 16:37:57 <Ammler> what are you looking for? 16:39:29 <b3lsatar> i need a host to set a bnc 16:40:07 <Ammler> and why do you think, you get one here? 16:40:47 <b3lsatar> i find somthing on google 16:40:56 <b3lsatar> and direction me here 16:41:03 <Ammler> :-o 16:41:47 <Ammler> well, the services here are fro OpenTTD related things, do you know that? 16:42:31 <Ammler> could you show me the link? 16:43:06 <b3lsatar> not 16:45:09 <Ammler> so if you don't develop for openttd or create extensions like newgrfs, you won't get a bouncer account. 16:48:53 <Ammler> I am wondering, which page you found, so I could point that out there... 16:51:36 * LordAzamath chuckles 16:57:44 <Ammler> LALALA :-) 17:04:06 <Brot6> derailed, restarting apache 17:18:01 <Brot6> 2cctrainset: update from r351 to r355, starting nightly compile 17:18:40 <Brot6> 2cctrainset: compile done (0 errors) - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/2cctrainset/nightlies/ 17:18:40 <Brot6> bros: nightly compile not needed. (r10) 17:18:40 <Brot6> firs: update from r347 to r349, starting nightly compile 17:18:59 *** DJNekkid has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 17:19:02 <Brot6> firs: compile done (1 errors) - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/nightlies/ 17:19:02 <Brot6> fish: nightly compile not needed. (r159) 17:19:02 <Brot6> heqs: nightly compile not needed. (r169) 17:19:03 <Brot6> nmts: nightly compile not needed. (r15) 17:19:03 <Brot6> opengfx: nightly compile not needed. (r209) 17:19:03 <Brot6> opensfx: nightly compile not needed. (r43) 17:19:03 <DJNekkid> hi planetmaker :) 17:19:05 <Brot6> worldairlineset: nightly compile not needed. (r584) 17:19:22 <DJNekkid> i see you did "stuff" with the code :P 17:20:15 <DJNekkid> engines tho :) 17:51:13 *** LordAzamath has quit IRC 17:51:37 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: 2cc train set - Code Review #625: use templates for real @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/625#change-1574 (by DJNekkid) 18:08:30 <planetmaker> moin DJNekkid :-) 18:08:49 <DJNekkid> yo, sup my niggah? 18:09:33 <planetmaker> pfft 18:09:41 <planetmaker> go and fix the remaining ones. 18:09:48 <planetmaker> Those produce errors and those are your errors 18:10:09 <planetmaker> or they at least produce a different MD5, thus different behaviour when the template applies 18:10:26 <planetmaker> ;-) 18:12:52 <planetmaker> but honestly I don't know why converting those to the template changes something. 18:13:06 <planetmaker> The two mentioned in the ticket miss defines, probably in action0.pnfo 18:13:31 *** DJ_Nekkid has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 18:13:53 <planetmaker> <planetmaker> pfft 18:13:54 <planetmaker> <planetmaker> go and fix the remaining ones. 18:13:54 <planetmaker> <planetmaker> Those produce errors and those are your errors 18:13:54 <planetmaker> <planetmaker> or they at least produce a different MD5, thus different behaviour when the template applies 18:13:54 <planetmaker> <planetmaker> ;-) 18:13:55 <planetmaker> <planetmaker> but honestly I don't know why converting those to the template changes something. 18:13:58 <planetmaker> <planetmaker> The two mentioned in the ticket miss defines, probably in action0.pnfo 18:14:00 <planetmaker> in case you missed it ;-) 18:14:17 <DJ_Nekkid> property 21 18:14:17 <planetmaker> but what do you think in general of this kind of use of templates? 18:14:57 <DJ_Nekkid> i've not made up my mind yet... 18:14:58 <DJ_Nekkid> hehe 18:15:30 <DJ_Nekkid> im not actually sure if its easier to add a new engine this way 18:16:34 <planetmaker> not easier. But no code duplication 18:16:43 <DJ_Nekkid> i mean, each engine still needs its own file 18:16:44 <planetmaker> Thus an error fixed in the template is automatically fixed everywhere 18:16:53 *** DJNekkid has quit IRC 18:17:26 <planetmaker> copying the same thing over & over again is quite bad programming behaviour and makes things unnecessarily difficult to maintain. 18:18:18 <DJ_Nekkid> but then we need to introduce a vehicle-length-property-definition 18:18:37 <DJ_Nekkid> and it is the occational none-templateable one 18:18:39 <DJ_Nekkid> ones 18:18:40 <DJ_Nekkid> like the DM3 18:19:17 <DJ_Nekkid> animated steamers 18:19:28 <DJ_Nekkid> none-animated steamers 18:19:52 <DJ_Nekkid> none-symmetric MUs 18:23:57 <DJ_Nekkid> so yes, i like the system, but it also have its limitations... 18:27:28 <DJ_Nekkid> did my connection crash again? 18:27:32 <planetmaker> of course it has 18:27:39 <DJ_Nekkid> hehe 18:27:39 <planetmaker> so has the copy&paste 18:28:10 <planetmaker> I thought about breaking up the template into several sub-templates 18:28:21 <planetmaker> and especially moving the #undef section out of it. 18:28:38 <planetmaker> then it's easy to add additional things after the template and before the undef 18:29:44 <DJ_Nekkid> yea... 18:30:02 <DJ_Nekkid> im just not sure about what we should do about the mus... 18:30:11 <DJ_Nekkid> engines are usually quite streight forward 18:31:13 <planetmaker> MUs can probably be treated very similar 18:31:23 <DJ_Nekkid> the vanilla ones can 18:32:15 <planetmaker> splitting the action0 and the undefs in separate templates as well as the action 2/3 chain in yet another might solve that 18:32:25 <DJ_Nekkid> no 18:32:27 <planetmaker> maybe even the action2/3 chain can be templated even more 18:32:35 <DJ_Nekkid> no :) 18:33:03 <DJ_Nekkid> the action1+2+3 chain is now, as far as i can see, as simple as it can be 18:33:09 <DJ_Nekkid> simple and clean 18:33:55 <planetmaker> so... a nice template 18:34:22 <DJ_Nekkid> but what about where the gfx isnt within the/a template? 18:34:35 <planetmaker> then the gfx needs to be put into the template 18:34:39 <planetmaker> easy as that 18:34:50 <DJ_Nekkid> out of you mean? 18:34:54 <planetmaker> or the gfx are moved to their own template and not templated, if it doesn't apply 18:35:13 <DJ_Nekkid> #include action0.pnfo 18:35:16 <DJ_Nekkid> #include action1.pnfo 18:35:23 <DJ_Nekkid> #include action2.pnfo 18:35:25 <planetmaker> something like that 18:35:26 <DJ_Nekkid> #include action3.pnfo 18:35:29 <planetmaker> yeah 18:35:33 <DJ_Nekkid> optionally 18:36:01 <DJ_Nekkid> action0.pnfo tgv-a-action1.pnfo tvg-a-action2.pnfo action3.pnfo 18:36:09 <planetmaker> nah 18:36:25 <planetmaker> no file called <specific-engine-actionX>.pnfo 18:36:37 <planetmaker> that will remain in the engine's file, if it cannot be templated 18:37:12 <planetmaker> even now, the engines as they're now... IMO it could be put into one big file called engines.pnfo 18:37:22 <DJ_Nekkid> yea 18:37:26 <DJ_Nekkid> i agree on that 18:37:30 <planetmaker> I mean... Not much there in the individual ones ;-) 18:37:33 <planetmaker> :-) 18:37:55 <DJ_Nekkid> as is now, there is little or no reason to have it in its own file 18:38:06 <DJ_Nekkid> but then, we could move the #undef's in a undef.pnfo :P 18:39:10 <planetmaker> yes, but currently it's not needed - unless one of the 5 other ones needs it 18:39:18 <DJ_Nekkid> 5 other ? 18:39:24 <planetmaker> 5 remaining engines 18:39:36 <planetmaker> which don't work and which are your task ;-) 18:39:47 <planetmaker> ticket #625 18:40:52 <DJ_Nekkid> we still need to make a #define this_engine_length 18:40:59 <DJ_Nekkid> probably why the alco dont work 18:41:27 <DJ_Nekkid> and probably because a few others dont work 100% gfx whise 18:41:51 <DJ_Nekkid> did you read what i wrote on the same ticket? 18:42:06 <planetmaker> that is already done? did you look at the template? 18:42:15 <planetmaker> it's only an optional define afair 18:42:15 *** Chris_Booth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 18:42:27 <planetmaker> it gets a default value, if not defined. Default = 0. 18:43:18 <planetmaker> #ifndef THIS_ENG_SHORTERVEHICLE // Shorter vehicle 18:43:18 <planetmaker> 43 18:43:18 <planetmaker> #define THIS_ENG_SHORTERVEHICLE 00 18:43:18 <planetmaker> 44 18:43:19 <planetmaker> #endif 18:43:41 <planetmaker> (ignore the line numbers) 18:44:11 <planetmaker> I think I defined every property. 18:44:17 <planetmaker> But I made a number of them optional 18:45:11 <DJ_Nekkid> where is the template btw? 18:46:46 *** Chris_Booth has quit IRC 18:46:55 <planetmaker> templates/template-engines.pnfo? 18:47:11 <planetmaker> the path is defined in ids.pnfo :-P 18:47:14 <DJ_Nekkid> oh... i thoght it were in the sprites\nfo-somewhere 18:47:31 <planetmaker> you could just have searched for TEMPLATE_ENGINE 18:47:36 <planetmaker> found ids.pnfo 18:47:54 <planetmaker> and that would have told ../../../templates/template-engines.pnfo :-P 18:48:57 <planetmaker> I actually like my way to have optional arguments for the template :-) Just like the vehicle shortening ;-) 18:49:23 <DJ_Nekkid> its nice and all 18:49:40 <DJ_Nekkid> but the thing i dislike ... its more programming, and not much .nfo anymore... 18:49:41 <planetmaker> A default engine is just a few defines and that's it ;-) 18:49:51 <planetmaker> It's all about nfo 18:49:58 <DJ_Nekkid> hehe 18:50:04 <planetmaker> It's just that you don't have to write the 100% same NFO about 30 times 18:50:11 <DJ_Nekkid> btw ... 18:50:15 <DJ_Nekkid> probably my fault 18:50:21 <DJ_Nekkid> #ifndef THIS_ENG_MISC // 01 tilt + 02 2cc + 04 xMU 18:50:22 <DJ_Nekkid> #define THIS_ENG_MISC 06 18:50:22 <DJ_Nekkid> #endif 18:50:26 <DJ_Nekkid> should be 02, not 06 :) 18:50:32 <planetmaker> then change it ;-) 18:50:50 <planetmaker> It was wrong in ALL engines then! 18:51:02 <planetmaker> maybe that makes you see the power to only have one template? 18:51:05 <planetmaker> used everywhere? 18:51:14 <DJ_Nekkid> *blush* 18:51:21 <planetmaker> I checked for every engine whether the templification changed the MD5. 18:51:52 <planetmaker> e.g. compiled the grf for every engine I changed today 18:53:23 <DJ_Nekkid> but the Alco should not be a problem 18:53:30 <planetmaker> well. But it was. 18:53:57 <DJ_Nekkid> what errors did you get? :P 18:54:11 <planetmaker> I just got a different MD5sum 18:54:20 <DJ_Nekkid> that means? 18:54:43 <planetmaker> so it's either that the values in the file don't fit the defines as in action0.pnfo or there's some other value different than for the other engines 18:55:05 <planetmaker> result will be either: the engine properties change somewhere when we apply the template 18:55:07 <DJ_Nekkid> are the old template somewheree? 18:55:14 <planetmaker> Probably it will be correct, though 18:55:15 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: 2cc train set - Revision 356: Fix: Engines should have misc property 02, not 06 @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/2cctrainset/repository/revisions/356 (by DJNekkid) 18:55:23 <planetmaker> the old template is available, if you get an old version of the repo 18:55:30 <planetmaker> hg up -r<old> 18:55:37 <planetmaker> the power of a VCS. 18:55:54 <planetmaker> no need to keep old crap. But it's at your hand, if you checkout the old revision 18:56:19 <planetmaker> hg up without parameters updates to the latest revision 18:56:23 <planetmaker> (again) 18:56:33 <planetmaker> don't forget that afterwards ;-) 18:56:59 <planetmaker> I'm also thinking to throw out all the old unneeded files. 18:57:07 <planetmaker> It's only confusing and they're not needed. 18:57:17 <planetmaker> And checking out an old revision will give you back those still 18:57:30 <planetmaker> Keeping unused stuff around is bad style, too ;-) 18:57:44 <DJ_Nekkid> i think it might be available on the webpage... 18:57:45 <planetmaker> that's what we have versions for. 18:57:55 <planetmaker> yes, that works there, too 18:58:05 <planetmaker> but you have it on your PC, too. 18:58:17 <planetmaker> a hg repository has EVERY revision ever checked in. always 18:58:32 <planetmaker> e.g. hg up -r1 will give you the first version you put into this repo 18:58:50 <DJ_Nekkid> so, thats why it takes ages to dl WAS every 100th rev :p 18:59:11 <planetmaker> yes. Especially as you need to download each revision of each image and binary file 18:59:18 <planetmaker> That's why using excel is so bad, btw ;-) 18:59:28 <planetmaker> you have to download each excel file version ever put into this repo 18:59:48 <planetmaker> there's no such thing as only differences between two versions of binary files 19:00:16 <planetmaker> for plain text as nfo - that's another thing. There diffs are easy :-) 19:00:23 <DJ_Nekkid> how do i get back to "top" ? 19:00:25 <planetmaker> hg up 19:00:34 <DJ_Nekkid> oki 19:00:41 <planetmaker> hg up tip 19:00:48 <planetmaker> but without tip will update to tip ;-) 19:01:10 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 19:02:57 <planetmaker> but of course you're right in one thing: the code structure moves away quite a bit from plain NFO :-) 19:03:09 <planetmaker> I'm not sure it's a completely bad thing, though 19:03:28 <planetmaker> It makes things... different. 19:03:49 <planetmaker> And probably easier to understand in general. And better shows the structure 19:03:57 <andythenorth> evening 19:04:02 <Brot6> 2cctrainset: Backup push to ssh://hg@bitbucket.org/OpenTTD/2cctrainset/ initiated. 19:04:04 <planetmaker> hi andythenorth 19:04:07 <andythenorth> did I miss anything :) 19:04:20 <Brot6> firs: Backup push to ssh://hg@bitbucket.org/firs/firs/ initiated. 19:04:25 <planetmaker> not really. I just added today the real templification to 2cctrainset's engines 19:04:28 <planetmaker> at least most :-) 19:04:51 <planetmaker> Thanks for creating the FIRS industry template with me. That work basically gave the idea and made it possible 19:05:25 <planetmaker> btw, I think about adding those templates, 2cctrainset ones and firs ones to my newgrf example 19:05:47 <planetmaker> I mean... those templates are great examples and might help newbies get something done very quickly :-) 19:08:01 <planetmaker> maybe I'll even add an example engine and an example industry there, so that there's actually really a newgrf produced in order to have something to play around and experiment with. 19:13:57 <andythenorth> nice idea 19:20:10 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: 2cc train set - Code Review #625: use templates for real @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/625#change-1575 (by planetmaker) 19:23:01 <DJ_Nekkid> hehe planetmaker :) 19:23:09 <DJ_Nekkid> are there btw, a template-template? 19:23:10 <DJ_Nekkid> :P 19:26:15 <Ammler> btw, also consider using tnfo and template folder in sprites... 19:28:31 <planetmaker> Ammler, yes, that's on my agenda to change 19:28:40 <planetmaker> but step by step :-) 19:29:26 <planetmaker> DJ_Nekkid, well... I can imagine e.g. the current template-engines.pnfo to look like 19:30:08 <planetmaker> #include action0.tnfo #include action1-engines.tnfo #include action2-3-engines.tnfo 19:30:18 <andythenorth> question 19:30:20 <planetmaker> so a template calling other templates 19:30:40 <andythenorth> actually, maybe later! 19:30:41 <andythenorth> afk 19:30:53 <planetmaker> :-P 19:33:22 <DJ_Nekkid> *yawn* 19:33:36 <DJ_Nekkid> god damn, i HATE this change-the-clock-twice-a-year 19:40:10 <DJ_Nekkid> but what is our goal planetmaker ... make the BEST trainset out there, EVER? :) 19:40:17 <DJ_Nekkid> (current it is, but even better :P) 19:45:48 <planetmaker> well. I'd say "make a good one" :-) 19:46:13 <DJ_Nekkid> gotta aim higher then that! :) 19:46:20 <planetmaker> and if we make some work which makes life easy and makes it easy for others to contribute, that's good, too 19:46:31 <planetmaker> We want to make it such, that others can profit from it. 19:47:15 <planetmaker> Realistically it's not "the best". But one of the best IMO :-) 19:47:29 <planetmaker> "the best" depends too much on what you want and like 19:47:41 <Ammler> which is "the best"? 19:47:57 <planetmaker> exactly. Dunno 19:48:21 <planetmaker> This one (though the current release version has too many bugs for that IMO), japanese, NARS, DBXL 19:48:27 <Ammler> dbsetxl 0.9 :-P 19:48:34 <DJ_Nekkid> .9 isnt out yet 19:48:42 <planetmaker> Ammler, we don't include vapourware in comparisons ;-) 19:49:13 <DJ_Nekkid> indeed! 19:49:23 <planetmaker> DJ_Nekkid, note his ":-P" 19:49:27 <planetmaker> ;-) 19:49:36 <DJ_Nekkid> indeed 19:49:59 <planetmaker> probably once out, the canset will be nice, too 19:50:05 <DJ_Nekkid> well, for any PAX game, i think there are little or no competition :) 19:50:27 <planetmaker> don't say. NARS is a bit slow, but I very much like the Japanese one, too 19:51:07 <planetmaker> but the velocities are realistical for NARS. Both countries (UK and US) are not famous for their rolling stocks that is. At least not in modern times 19:51:40 <planetmaker> and the japanese set has much less bugs than the 2cctrainset currently has 19:52:03 <DJ_Nekkid> but no variable pax capacities 19:52:21 <planetmaker> well... Bug free is more important IMO than versatile. 19:52:33 <planetmaker> We should fix more bugs before we add even more ;-) 19:52:35 <DJ_Nekkid> why i wanted to make a 2.0 :) 19:52:54 <planetmaker> yes. It's a nice clean restart, agreed 19:52:54 <DJ_Nekkid> the 1.0 were in a too bad state 19:52:58 <planetmaker> indeed 19:53:26 <planetmaker> and the templates help us to get it better ;-) 19:53:48 <DJ_Nekkid> even I had problems reading its code after a good 6 months of dormant state 19:54:07 <DJ_Nekkid> atleast its oldest parts 19:54:12 <DJ_Nekkid> the newer parts were somewhat better 19:57:47 <DJ_Nekkid> im wondering on how much of this system i could adopt for the dutchset and bros 20:04:44 <andythenorth> there is no best train set :P 20:04:47 <andythenorth> nor RV set 20:04:53 <andythenorth> but there is a best ship set :D 20:05:10 <DJ_Nekkid> there is a "best" tramset :P 20:05:32 <andythenorth> there will be a best industry set :D 20:05:34 <andythenorth> maybe 20:05:39 <DJ_Nekkid> there will 20:05:44 <DJ_Nekkid> ECS is too confusing :) 20:05:48 <DJ_Nekkid> and bugged in open 20:05:50 <andythenorth> PBI is awesome 20:06:04 <andythenorth> Also Pikka is planning TAI 20:06:15 <DJ_Nekkid> well, PBI isnt entierly my cup of tea 20:06:19 <andythenorth> FIRS question 20:06:27 <andythenorth> I am *so* sick of starting with coal 20:06:38 <andythenorth> how about randomising payment rates at the start of a game? 20:06:45 <andythenorth> *that* would add variety no? 20:07:02 <DJ_Nekkid> sounds like an awsome plan... 20:07:10 <DJ_Nekkid> atleast to some degree 20:07:14 <DJ_Nekkid> _if_ its possible 20:07:21 <andythenorth> probably, I haven't checked 20:07:24 <andythenorth> let me see... 20:07:51 <planetmaker> clearly there's a best ship set, yes :-) 20:08:15 <andythenorth> New Ships! 20:08:21 <Ammler> PBI is buggy 20:08:30 <planetmaker> <andythenorth> how about randomising payment rates at the start of a game? <-- sounds great. But maybe make it a parameter? 20:08:32 <Ammler> imo, almost unplayable buggy 20:08:59 <andythenorth> PBI buggy? 20:09:09 <Ammler> you need to respawn the industries, even if they are services 20:09:21 <Ammler> yes, pikka is aware of it. 20:09:32 <Ammler> serviced* 20:09:39 <andythenorth> oh yeah, I have had bugs now I come to think of it 20:09:45 <andythenorth> grr. 20:09:46 <andythenorth> http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=Callbacks#Custom_profit_calculation_for_cargoes_39_ 20:09:50 <andythenorth> is not what I need 20:10:05 <andythenorth> what is that one actually used for in real life, sorry I mean the game 20:10:16 <planetmaker> guys, just let me tell you three: you're awesome. Without you three the devzone wouldn't exist :-) 20:10:25 <planetmaker> or would be dead 20:10:41 <planetmaker> and I like this grf-dev spirit here :-) 20:10:59 <planetmaker> like to see things growing :-) 20:11:09 <andythenorth> <planetmaker> is on happy juice :D 20:11:17 * planetmaker is, yes :-) 20:11:25 <Ammler> :-) 20:11:57 <DJ_Nekkid> well planetmaker, if it werent for your decition to fix bugs in 2cc, it wouldnt have exsisted ..? 20:12:04 <DJ_Nekkid> we started as #2cc :) 20:13:58 <planetmaker> :-) 20:14:03 <DJ_Nekkid> hehe :) 20:14:23 <andythenorth> DJ_Nekkid: [wiki] can you see any way to randomise cargo payment rates? 20:14:29 <andythenorth> I am thinking Action D.... 20:14:55 <DJ_Nekkid> i heavent studied it so far am i afraid... 20:16:38 <Ammler> he, just checked, the first devzone channel also still exists: #openttd.is 20:16:43 <DJ_Nekkid> can cargo payments be adjusted via callbacks _ 20:16:54 <DJ_Nekkid> ? 20:16:55 <andythenorth> not so far as I can see 20:17:03 *** LordAzamath has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 20:17:20 <DJ_Nekkid> then i dont think its possible 20:17:23 <andythenorth> only needs to be done once, cb would be very inefficient, unless it's just called once 20:17:36 <DJ_Nekkid> but, you can adjust it? 20:17:40 <DJ_Nekkid> via a callback? 20:17:44 <DJ_Nekkid> _can_ 20:17:53 <andythenorth> can't see a cb for it 20:17:56 <DJ_Nekkid> if so, its possible to add a random var2 20:18:02 <Ammler> planetmaker: any idea if that channel is still in use, else you should drop it, specially because of becoming outdated topic infos 20:18:03 <DJ_Nekkid> where different ones can be called 20:18:07 <andythenorth> Action D could do it, but would need some random bits to play with 20:18:29 <andythenorth> wonder if Action D can read the datetime or something? 20:19:25 <planetmaker> Ammler, you mean #2cc? 20:19:30 <planetmaker> It's not a registered channel 20:19:38 <Ammler> no, #openttd.is 20:19:43 <planetmaker> ah. 20:20:11 <planetmaker> there're still people there :-) 20:20:21 <planetmaker> I just cleaned my channel list 20:21:00 <Ammler> yes, but unregister it, so other people can take it over 20:22:01 <Ammler> or make Hirundo master 20:22:07 <planetmaker> sounds better 20:22:24 <Ammler> changed the topic and parted webster 20:23:05 <planetmaker> made Hirundo master 20:23:49 <Ammler> Hirundo, if you like activity annoucement from brot in that channel, tell me. 20:23:53 <planetmaker> andythenorth, can't CB39 be used? 20:25:24 <andythenorth> I think cb 39 could be used 20:25:32 <planetmaker> but sounds like A LOT of work 20:25:39 <andythenorth> I think it would be more work than just changing the values in Action 0 for each cargo 20:27:34 *** mark has quit IRC 20:27:59 <planetmaker> http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=Action0Cargos&highlight=cargo payment rates#Penalty_times_and_price_factor_10_11_12_ <-- that, andythenorth ? 20:28:29 <DJ_Nekkid> but there is no such thing as VarAction0 :P 20:28:41 <planetmaker> you could certainly randomize the values for properties set, couldn't you? 20:29:04 <DJ_Nekkid> not that im aware of 20:29:15 <planetmaker> hm... bad 20:29:18 <andythenorth> planetmaker: it is props 10 11 12 that need to change 20:29:20 <DJ_Nekkid> for trains, you could ... 20:29:23 <DJ_Nekkid> via CB36 20:29:26 <andythenorth> it would be done with Action 6 / D 20:29:32 <DJ_Nekkid> and "normal" randomization 20:29:35 <andythenorth> if action D could get some random bits, it would be fine 20:29:46 <andythenorth> I think 20:30:23 <andythenorth> frosch will know, or Rubidium 20:30:35 <Ammler> planetmaker: we need to move the whole devzone at once, as we used quite a lot symlinks from one domain to the other :-) 20:31:28 <planetmaker> hm... action 6 sounds like a nice plan for that, andythenorth :-) 20:31:47 <andythenorth> Action 6 + action D 20:32:32 *** mark has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 20:33:14 <planetmaker> hm.. but not random. True 20:33:43 <planetmaker> Ammler, yes, I think that will be true. We might want to install it such that we have straight away proper user accounts. 20:33:53 <planetmaker> and individual repo access. 20:33:57 <planetmaker> or? 20:36:28 <Ammler> hmm 20:36:40 <Ammler> I would say, we move everything and cleanup then 20:36:51 <Ammler> we can't keep the old server for long 20:37:03 <planetmaker> ok. Also a good point 20:37:07 <Ammler> 1 of those 2 are gone 20:37:18 <planetmaker> one of those two what? 20:37:31 <Ammler> 2 weeks, while we can run both servers 20:37:38 <planetmaker> oh. right. 20:37:41 <Ammler> :-D 20:37:54 <planetmaker> so... we have like 7 days left? 20:38:16 <Ammler> well, theoretically more 20:38:36 <Ammler> it depense, when I send the upgrade formulare 20:39:06 <DJ_Nekkid> Ammler: if you know how, i can set up a server at home when we move home... i have the hardware 20:39:22 <DJ_Nekkid> if this is something you actually pay for 20:39:37 <Ammler> around 30€/month 20:39:54 <DJ_Nekkid> i have a P4 1800mhz at home 20:40:23 <DJ_Nekkid> i only lack a raid card... and i can insert 2x 1TB discs in mirror raid 20:40:46 <DJ_Nekkid> i even have a static IP 20:40:55 <Ammler> sounds nice :-) 20:41:20 <DJ_Nekkid> P4 1800 ... not super-up-to-date, but it is most likely MORE then enough for our needs 20:41:25 <andythenorth> do you have a reliable connection? 20:41:42 <DJ_Nekkid> ADSL 2+ 15/1mbit 20:41:57 <Ammler> only 1mbit upload? 20:42:00 <DJ_Nekkid> yes... 20:42:25 <DJ_Nekkid> to little? 20:42:31 <Ammler> that is quite slow :-( 20:42:51 <DJ_Nekkid> 100kb/s :) 20:43:18 <planetmaker> DJ_Nekkid, the question is indeed the connectivity and reliability :-) 20:43:33 <DJ_Nekkid> ive never had any problems at home :) 20:43:43 <Ammler> well, you mostly download 20:43:48 <planetmaker> And the management interface is kinda nice to know, too :-) And the possibility to reboot it via web interface, you know :-) 20:44:00 <planetmaker> Ammler, well... but servers upload :-) 20:44:25 <planetmaker> we have like... 3GB traffic per month or so? 20:44:44 <Ammler> around 200 GB 20:44:59 <Ammler> but the server limit is 4 TB 20:45:06 <planetmaker> oh :-P 20:45:30 <Ammler> DJ_Nekkid: could make a radio stream ;-) 20:45:35 <planetmaker> @calc 200*10**9 / 24 / 3600 * 8 20:45:35 <Webster> planetmaker: 18518518.5185 20:45:41 <planetmaker> @calc 200*10**9 / 24 / 3600 * 8 / 10**6 20:45:41 <Webster> planetmaker: 18.5185185185 20:45:47 <planetmaker> we need 18 Mbit 20:45:49 <planetmaker> constantly 20:46:04 <DJ_Nekkid> cant be right 20:46:04 <planetmaker> oh. wrong. 0.5 :-) 20:46:09 <planetmaker> @calc 200*10**9 / 24 / 3600 * 8 / 10**6 / 30 20:46:09 <Webster> planetmaker: 0.617283950617 20:46:45 <planetmaker> but still. That's assuming constant traffic. Peak is much higher 20:46:48 <planetmaker> like now :-) 20:47:04 <planetmaker> We host the whole www.openttdcoop from that server 20:47:08 <DJ_Nekkid> oh... 20:47:13 <DJ_Nekkid> i thought it were just the devzone 20:47:18 <planetmaker> not (anymore) 20:47:25 <Ammler> it were, but that has changed.... 20:47:28 <DJ_Nekkid> my p4 wont be able to cope with the game serving 20:47:36 <planetmaker> no game running here :-) 20:47:39 <planetmaker> that's another one 20:47:40 <DJ_Nekkid> atleast not on much bigger maps then 512^2 20:47:51 <planetmaker> at least not now... well. Sometimes 20:47:53 <planetmaker> or? 20:48:01 <Ammler> #openttdcoop.dev server 20:48:05 <planetmaker> yeah 20:50:06 <Ammler> what are you doing with that server now? 20:50:11 <planetmaker> DJ_Nekkid, but... it might be a good idea to maybe use your computer as backup and secondary? 20:50:21 <planetmaker> That'd be a nice thing actually IMO 20:50:22 *** mark has quit IRC 20:50:38 <DJ_Nekkid> currently it got a bugged windows installation and have been turned off for the last ... i dunno ... half year 20:51:05 <planetmaker> it'd need a new linux install in order to work as a server. 20:51:11 <DJ_Nekkid> i used to have a personal fileserver on it 20:51:15 <planetmaker> and it'd need to run 24/7... 20:51:36 <DJ_Nekkid> but then i got a WD mybook world from my father 20:51:46 <DJ_Nekkid> and i just copied all stuff i had over to it, 20:51:55 <DJ_Nekkid> but that disk is insanely slow 20:52:04 <DJ_Nekkid> so i've thought about setting up a new one 20:52:07 <planetmaker> :-P 20:52:19 <DJ_Nekkid> and i did get two 1TB disks a while back, plus a raid-card 20:52:21 <Ammler> I use a 10year old desktop as fileserver here 20:52:26 <DJ_Nekkid> express PCI 20:52:40 <DJ_Nekkid> but that slot on that MB werent express PCI 20:52:43 <DJ_Nekkid> it were ... something else :p 20:53:44 <Ammler> I bouth a sata controller and usb 2.0 and since then, it works quite nice 20:54:28 <Ammler> usb disks for "rotating" backups :-) 20:54:40 <planetmaker> ok, do you still need me? Else I'm off for the rest of the night. Party time! :-) 20:54:49 <DJ_Nekkid> dont drive... 20:55:14 <planetmaker> nope. Just a few storeys below :-) (I'm still at my workplace) 20:55:15 <Ammler> I make the the newserver capable for redmine 20:55:19 <Ammler> then I am off too 20:55:30 <planetmaker> nice! :-) 20:55:42 <Ammler> gem install passenger is the last step, then only a bit rsync 21:11:27 *** LordAzamath has quit IRC 21:11:27 *** ODM has quit IRC 21:11:28 *** DJ_Nekkid has quit IRC 21:11:28 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 21:11:28 *** Brot6 has quit IRC 21:11:28 *** Ammler has quit IRC 21:11:28 *** Hirundo has quit IRC 21:11:28 *** FooBar has quit IRC 21:11:28 *** tneo has quit IRC 21:11:29 *** Rubidium has quit IRC 21:11:29 *** b3lsatar has quit IRC 21:11:29 *** KenjiE20 has quit IRC 21:11:29 *** XeryusTC has quit IRC 21:11:29 *** planetmaker has quit IRC 21:11:29 *** SmatZ has quit IRC 21:12:32 *** XeryusTC has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:12:33 *** SmatZ has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:12:33 *** planetmaker has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:12:33 *** Rubidium has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:12:33 *** tneo has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:12:33 *** FooBar has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:12:33 *** Hirundo has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:12:33 *** Ammler has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:12:33 *** Brot6 has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:12:33 *** ODM has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:12:33 *** KenjiE20 has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:12:33 *** b3lsatar has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:12:33 *** DJ_Nekkid has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:12:33 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:12:34 *** LordAzamath has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:20:55 *** dandan_ has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:21:14 <dandan_> hi 21:22:41 <dandan_> have a few questions about the devzone 21:22:53 <DJ_Nekkid> im here 21:23:01 <DJ_Nekkid> if im good enough :) 21:23:07 <DJ_Nekkid> tho, Ammler and planetmaker are the main bosses 21:23:12 <dandan_> hi dj 21:23:23 <DJ_Nekkid> :D:D 21:23:23 <dandan_> should be simple stuff 21:23:52 <dandan_> I just uploaded the Japan landscape stuff to the devzone 21:24:04 <dandan_> if I want to publish it on the forums, where should I link to? 21:24:05 *** KenjiE20 has quit IRC 21:25:00 *** KenjiE20 has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:25:04 <DJ_Nekkid> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/jptrains ? 21:25:33 <dandan_> how will people find the files there? 21:25:50 <dandan_> I was more thinking of a direct link to the grf or a directory listing 21:25:59 <DJ_Nekkid> did you "hg commit -m "text"" and "hg push" ? 21:26:05 <DJ_Nekkid> or upload via files? 21:26:32 <dandan_> the first 21:26:54 <dandan_> could link here 21:26:55 <dandan_> http://mz.openttdcoop.org/hg/jpland/ 21:27:20 <dandan_> but then if you take the zip you get everything, including source which most people dont want 21:27:53 <DJ_Nekkid> this is not my board am i afraid... :) 21:28:03 <dandan_> no problem 21:28:24 <dandan_> will wait for ammler or planetmaker then 21:28:41 <DJ_Nekkid> planetmaker went to bed or party a half an hour ago 21:29:12 <DJ_Nekkid> [21:54:35] <planetmaker> ok, do you still need me? Else I'm off for the rest of the night. Party time! :-) 21:29:13 <DJ_Nekkid> [21:54:44] <DJ_Nekkid> dont drive... 21:29:13 <DJ_Nekkid> [21:55:09] <planetmaker> nope. Just a few storeys below :-) (I'm still at my workplace) 21:29:13 <DJ_Nekkid> [21:55:10] <Ammler> I make the the newserver capable for redmine 21:29:13 <DJ_Nekkid> [21:55:14] <Ammler> then I am off too 21:29:26 <Ammler> I am still here 21:29:28 <DJ_Nekkid> [22:20:50] * dandan_ (~dandan@X40bd.x.pppool.de) has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:29:29 <Ammler> :-) 21:30:06 <dandan_> hi ammler 21:30:24 <Ammler> Hello dandan_ 21:31:07 <Ammler> well, the devzone is meant for hosting the source and probably the nightlies and such 21:31:11 <dandan_> dandan_: I just uploaded the Japan landscape stuff to the devzone 21:31:11 <dandan_> [22:24] dandan_: if I want to publish it on the forums, where should I link to? 21:31:30 <Ammler> you could also use the files sections, but I don't think, it is needed. 21:31:34 <dandan_> okay 21:31:57 <dandan_> so its not really intended as a repository for people to download from? 21:31:57 <Ammler> the release bundles you have on tt-forums or bananas 21:32:04 <dandan_> okay, thats fine 21:32:18 <dandan_> I have one other question 21:32:19 <Ammler> it is intended as a repository for people to constribute 21:32:27 <Ammler> -s 21:32:36 <dandan_> I want to add a subproject to the Japan Set project on the devzone page 21:32:39 <dandan_> how do I do that? 21:33:03 <Ammler> on top left you find projects 21:33:19 <Ammler> there you will find a create project in the right side 21:33:26 <dandan_> okay 21:33:56 <Ammler> currently you need an admin to move it as subproject 21:34:09 <dandan_> ah alright 21:34:19 <Ammler> no issue, just tell it here 21:34:26 <dandan_> will do 21:34:30 <Ammler> or create a ticket, if you don't have irc 21:37:27 <dandan_> Okay, I just created Japanese Landscape Set 21:37:37 <dandan_> Could you make it a subproject of the Japan Set? 21:42:13 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: Japanese Landscape Set - Revision 0: Version 1.1 @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/jpland/repository/revisions/0 (by dandan) 21:42:13 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: Japanese Landscape Set - Revision 1: Added readme @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/jpland/repository/revisions/1 (by dandan) 21:43:22 *** dandan__ has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:43:42 <Ammler> the newgrf projects here mostly support compiling the newgrf with make 21:43:53 <dandan__> oops I got disconnected 21:44:13 <Ammler> there is a Link on the topic to the logs 21:44:22 <Ammler> if you think, you missed something 21:45:26 <Ammler> hmm, but only in a hourly basis... 21:45:28 <Rubidium> Ammler: you mean those logs that can be delayed by 1 hour? 21:45:43 <Rubidium> although... next refresh in 10 minutes :) 21:46:11 <Ammler> KenjiE20: ^ :-) 21:46:43 <dandan__> more like eight hours or else I have the wrong page 21:46:54 <Rubidium> no, it's not in your timezone 21:47:13 <KenjiE20> just refreshed for you :) 21:47:15 <Rubidium> it looks like UTC-6 21:47:26 <KenjiE20> PDT (UTC-9) 21:47:38 <KenjiE20> 7* 21:47:40 <KenjiE20> >_> 21:47:54 <Ammler> webster is located in the US? 21:47:54 <Webster> Infrastructure Sharing. See http://wiki.openttd.org/Is for more details. 21:47:58 <KenjiE20> yup 21:48:28 <Rubidium> hmm... oh yeah, we're in +1, not +2 21:48:45 *** dandan_ has quit IRC 21:49:08 <dandan__> anyway, seems someone read my request to move my project to a subproject. Thanks guys 21:49:12 <KenjiE20> all of this for two lines of IRC :) 21:49:17 <Ammler> well, I would prefer realtime instead of long time logs, too :-) 21:50:23 <Ammler> but the delay is good for the public server :-) 21:50:44 <KenjiE20> I can tweak the devzone cron job if you like 21:51:02 <dandan__> i'll be off for now, thanks for the help 21:51:45 <Ammler> personally, I have the bouncer 21:51:58 *** dandan__ has quit IRC 21:52:46 <KenjiE20> I think an hour is probably sufficient, I doubt they get much traffic 21:53:13 <Ammler> can't you trigger it by call? 21:53:27 <KenjiE20> probably 21:53:33 <Ammler> with a cach something 21:55:08 <KenjiE20> I could probably write a php script to replace the .sh file sort and perl loger converter 21:55:57 * Rubidium wonders why the whole 'make up' is necessary 21:56:33 <KenjiE20> because the alternative, is staring at the raw file structure :P 21:57:45 <Rubidium> those colours and seemingly 'random' font sizes just annoy me 21:58:08 <Rubidium> then again, I rarely ever look at the logs because I don't need to 21:58:27 <KenjiE20> some of the colours are a bit off, I'll admit 21:58:50 <KenjiE20> but then I just shoved an 'off the shelf' with a shell script, to get the job done :P 21:58:55 <Ammler> I have enough to read from the client logs itslef 21:59:17 <Ammler> but sometimes I would like to point others to it, this time it failed ;-) 21:59:40 <Rubidium> http://irclogs.qmsk.net/channels/openttd <- that's adequate enough for me ;) 21:59:44 <KenjiE20> tbh Ammler you could've just pasted brots lines :P 22:00:25 <Ammler> well, I don't know, what to paste. 22:01:14 <KenjiE20> well all that was said between dandan_'s last lines, and dandan__ appearing was Brot 22:02:14 <Ammler> :-) 22:02:28 <Ammler> it is a general issue 22:04:28 *** b3lsatar has quit IRC 22:15:27 *** LordAzamath has quit IRC 22:52:56 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 23:02:08 <Brot6> ::DevZone:: OpenGFX - Feature #107: Sprites 4627:4674 (48) - Toyland: Buildings @ https://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/107#change-1579 (by athanasios) 23:20:10 *** Chris_Booth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 23:51:59 *** ODM has quit IRC