Log for #openttdcoop.devzone on 31st May 2010:
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13:43:32  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 873: Change: improved graphics for Fertiliser Plant (andythenorth) @
13:43:32  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 874: Feature: revamped Fertiliser Plant graphics & layout (andythenorth) @
13:59:14  <planetmaker> andythenorth, no quite constructive comment, but the bowl-shaped tanks on the fertilizer plant immediately reminded me of tea kettles...
14:00:55  <planetmaker> and their contrast with the ground tiles could IMHO be a bit increased
14:01:04  <planetmaker> what about: CC for them?
14:04:50  <andythenorth> planetmaker: I think they need a bit more work.  mph drew them, they are a hard shape.  Shadows underneath will help
14:05:11  <planetmaker> possibly, yes
14:05:27  <planetmaker> still I like the CC idea :-) Or 2nd CC
14:05:39  <planetmaker> though... that's not possible, I guess
14:05:44  <andythenorth> I can try CC
14:06:29  <planetmaker> it could also use a HEQS tractor or so with lorry full of fertilizer
14:06:49  <planetmaker> but that's a feature request for a more future version ;-)
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14:11:44  <andythenorth> planetmaker: CC works well enough
14:14:35  <andythenorth> planetmaker:
14:14:36  <Webster> Title: Transport Tycoon Forums • View topic - FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Development (at
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14:19:21  <planetmaker> MUCH better :-)
14:20:37  <planetmaker> btw, what about moving the danger symbol(?) from the front perspective to the diagonal (45° counter clockwise)
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15:02:43  <planetmaker> Hirundo: are the crucial questions for IS2 documented somewhere?
15:03:09  <Hirundo> forum and devzone issue list, mostly
15:03:28  <planetmaker> ok
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16:19:11  <Brot6> firs: update from r867 to r874 done (3 errors) -
16:19:18  <Brot6> Following repos didn't need a nightlies update: 2cctrainset (r544), 32bpp-extra (r36), airportsplus (r50), bros (r12), comic-houses (r70), fish (ERROR r374), heqs (r320), newgrf_makefile (ERROR r98), nml (r210), nmts (r16), nutracks (r65), ogfxplus (r23), opengfx (r459), openmsx (r57), opensfx (r94), snowlinemod (r12), test (ERROR r20), worldairlinersset (r643)
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17:10:14  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 875: Change: try CC for the spherical tanks (andythenorth) @
17:10:15  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 876: Change: additional layouts for Fertiliser Plant (andythenorth) @
17:50:12  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 877: Change: additional layouts for Fertiliser Plant (andythenorth) @
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18:44:08  <Irwe> long time since I've been here
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18:53:01  <PeterT> hi Irwe
18:55:18  <Irwe> that new rail feature, is that for roads aswell?
18:55:34  <PeterT> nope
18:56:06  <Irwe> to bad, coming in the near future?
19:00:19  <planetmaker> oh, hey Irwe :-)
19:00:27  <planetmaker> possibly it's coming. But who knows
19:00:36  <planetmaker> bug peter1138 about it ;-)
19:01:03  <Irwe> hehe maybe I will.. or I'll just wait with the roads for now
19:01:30  <planetmaker> well. I'm quite sure it'll come eventually for roads.
19:01:34  <planetmaker> It makes sense.
19:01:39  <planetmaker> The question is rather: when?
19:01:58  <Doorslammer> Is there a set date for all NuTracks to appear?  It's 1923 and only 50mph and 3rd Rail and Planning is there so far
19:02:28  <planetmaker> Doorslammer: there can't be.
19:02:35  <planetmaker> It's defined by the engine availability
19:02:44  * andythenorth ponders more layouts
19:02:51  <Doorslammer> Errr, that can't be good then
19:03:01  <planetmaker> there are some engines in the set which make them available from different dates on, depending upon track type
19:03:06  <Doorslammer> Got plenty engines running about
19:03:28  <Doorslammer> Is it dictated by the 2CC set?
19:03:33  <planetmaker> nope
19:03:50  <planetmaker> nutracks has engines which serve just that purpose: make tracks available
19:03:54  <planetmaker> useless engines that is
19:03:58  <planetmaker> 1HP, 1km/h
19:03:59  <Doorslammer> Oh, those
19:04:20  <Doorslammer> Wonder why on earth he's set different dates for them :/
19:04:36  <Doorslammer> I'm sure trains were doing much faster than 50mph in 1923
19:04:46  <andythenorth> how big is 'offensive' for an industry layout :P ?
19:05:01  <planetmaker> andythenorth: >5x5 on a square
19:05:08  <planetmaker> or longer than 8
19:05:17  <andythenorth> gah, I've got loads bigger than 5x5 :)
19:05:23  <planetmaker> really?
19:05:36  <planetmaker> well, your industries are fine I think
19:05:46  <planetmaker> but I wouldn't go for bigger
19:05:50  <andythenorth> I made sure that there are also lots approx 5x5 :)
19:06:03  <planetmaker> I wouldn't make things bigger than e.g. the sand dig
19:06:16  <planetmaker> that's as big as it should get IMHO. Or as the original wood
19:06:22  <planetmaker> or plantation
19:06:30  <andythenorth> I want to do just a few *very* large, probably 8x8
19:06:38  <andythenorth> but with gaps to route things through
19:06:41  <Doorslammer> Steel would be good very large
19:07:01  <andythenorth> also aluminium, oil refinery, fertiliser plant
19:07:55  <planetmaker> well, those deserve to be the biggest industries around, yes
19:23:19  <Irwe> does this new rail thing cover tunnels to? or do you have to make a tunnel for each ground?
19:25:08  <planetmaker> tunnels is the soft (aka missing) spot
19:25:21  <planetmaker> it's considered a bug / omission
19:25:43  <Irwe> so.. no?:P
19:25:46  <planetmaker> problem there is: tunnel entrances are hardly feasable in a ground-tile independent manner
19:25:59  <planetmaker> so: indeed no(t yet)
19:27:32  <Irwe> I see, making something for each ground isn't that hard, it's just time consuming
19:27:34  <Ammler> Heya Irwe, ikea fanatic :-)
19:28:04  <Irwe> hehe indeed, if you are Swedish you are a ikea fanatic
19:28:24  <Ammler> yeah, I learned from forums...
19:29:42  <Irwe> a new version of the houses will hopfully be out this weekend so people can play with ikeas
19:35:12  <planetmaker> Irwe: you CANNOT make something for each ground
19:35:25  <planetmaker> You can intrinsically and on purpose NOT know which baseset is in use
19:35:47  <planetmaker> that piece of information is and will not be exposed to newgrf.
19:38:33  <Irwe> so if I make tunnels for both original TTD and OpenGFX and you load the grf it can't tell which tunnels to use?
19:38:43  <planetmaker> exactly
19:38:56  <Irwe> can it be set with parameter?
19:39:01  <planetmaker> it can.
19:39:10  <planetmaker> But what does it help on a MP server?
19:39:49  <planetmaker> There'll be 1/3 folks with the "wrong" tunnel entrances, if you enable OpenGFX-compatible sprites or 2/3 "wrong" ones, if you enable TTD tunnel entrances
19:40:06  <planetmaker> But parameter is better than nothing, as it allows to chose for single player
19:40:18  <planetmaker> and it's the best which can be done, I think
19:40:24  <Ammler> couldn't you Action9 for the openttdw.grf or ogfxe-extra GRFID?
19:40:59  <Yexo> if that's possible it's a bug as that can cause desyncs
19:41:14  <planetmaker> problem is: you can't test for base set as it'd allow to do different things on different clients - thus desync for MP
19:41:24  <Ammler> well, skipping static actions shouldn't be a issue
19:41:29  <Yexo> one (or two) small static grfs could solve it
19:43:12  <Irwe> hopfully it's fixed when the set is complete, so people that use CStunnels for example with OpenGFX have TTD ground on tunnels?
19:46:15  <planetmaker> I guess they do, yes
19:46:50  <planetmaker> Yexo: hm... good idea actually. Providing the other ground tiles as static add-on for the folks with the other base set
19:47:17  <planetmaker> which then throws up the issue of: no one knows how to configure static newgrf except three dozen people
19:47:57  <Ammler> it isn't a matter of knowing.. it is simply too big hassle to do
19:48:08  <Ammler> I never set static grfs...
19:50:26  <PeterT> Ammler: for xShunter, would it be ok to make random passwords
19:50:40  <PeterT> instead of picking them from a dictionary file
19:50:46  <PeterT> as ap+ does
19:51:02  <planetmaker> Hm... static... It might need inclusion in the newgrf window. Somehow.
19:51:03  <Ammler> words are better to keep and type :-)
19:51:13  <planetmaker> possibly differently coloured in the applied newgrf list. Or so
19:51:31  <Yexo> indeed, a gui for them would be nice
19:51:38  <Yexo> but I can't be bothered to write it myself
19:52:19  <planetmaker> :-D
19:52:26  <Yexo> and for singleplayer it doesn't need to be static, it can be included in the normal list
19:52:31  <planetmaker> the usual 'excuse'. And quite a valid one
19:52:57  <Ammler> well, what "gui" is needed?
19:53:12  <PeterT> <xOR> it's 4 characters
19:53:12  <PeterT> <xOR> and not mixed with numbers or different letter case
19:53:12  <PeterT> <xOR> all lower case alphabetic characters
19:53:12  <PeterT> <xOR> you only need to keep it for some seconds to type it in openttd
19:53:12  <PeterT> <xOR> who cannot remember 4 characters?
19:53:13  <PeterT> <xOR> for 5 seconds
19:53:15  <PeterT> Ammler:
19:53:51  <Ammler> PeterT: such things are peanuts and not really important...
19:54:08  <PeterT> he's about to implement it
19:54:29  <Yexo> Ammler: same as newgrf gui, but for static newgrfs
19:54:43  <Ammler> Yexo: it already exists
19:55:35  <Ammler> :-)
19:56:16  <Irwe> time for bed before big exame tomorrow, bye!
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19:58:27  <Ammler> PeterT: I am not aware of any other server than #openttdcoop using this feature
19:58:43  <PeterT> Ammler: so?
19:58:51  <Ammler> also imo not really needed for a server where you can authentificate
19:59:06  <PeterT> no, password to join the server
19:59:10  <Ammler> at least that would be the reason for xShunter and then we would trash random password
20:00:02  <PeterT> how would you athenticate?
20:00:07  <Ammler> we use random password to control access and manage bans
20:00:24  <Ammler> PeterT: that you need to ask xor :-)
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21:01:08  <Webster> Announcement from my owner (KenjiE20): Webster will be having a (hopefully) brief downtime soon, while the OS gets an upgrade

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