Log for #openttdcoop.devzone on 11th October 2010:
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07:37:04  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles - Revision 4:c15c2f8e2d3c: Add: .hgignore was missing (planetmaker) @
07:40:06  <Terkhen> the first bulk truck is finished but I can't think of a good name... I'm thinking about keeping its current name (bulk truck MkI) and getting a better one later
07:51:07  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles - Revision 5:fee266e48156: Add: Cargo translation table. (Terkhen) @
07:51:52  <planetmaker> That's fine IMHO
07:52:09  <planetmaker> I'd not change things which are not required. Like names :-)
07:53:06  <planetmaker> I'm surprised that OpenGFX+trains is so much more downloaded than FIRS
07:54:49  <planetmaker> with the trains I just re-defined the first wagons which were of the suitable type
07:55:27  <planetmaker> that saves you the hassle to define everything and makes it more like the original :-)
07:58:01  <planetmaker> Terkhen: in order to explain the CTT as I used (and which you copied):
07:58:03  <Terkhen> I defined the new bulk truck after all standard road vehicles, so that the user does not lose any of them if he does not want to
07:58:22  <Terkhen> but I still wonder who would want to keep both road vehicles at the same time
07:58:44  <planetmaker> the first paragraph are those cargos which need explicit mentioning in the refit properties
07:59:01  <planetmaker> The others are those which are only mentioned in the varaction2
08:00:09  <planetmaker> The order of these two paragraphs is important as there can only 32 different cargos mentioned in specific refit properties
08:00:09  <planetmaker> you could so far probably move everything to the 2nd paragraph
08:00:43  <planetmaker> that is only the first 32 cargos can be used in explicit refit properties
08:01:10  <planetmaker> Concerning vehicleIDs: I wondered the same. But then decided the opposite :-)
08:01:26  <planetmaker> And after all I don't *remove* any, I just extend an existing vehicle
08:01:39  <planetmaker> Adding some more property to the vehicle.
08:01:54  <planetmaker> But well. Maybe with TTD base set you might be right.
08:01:56  <planetmaker> Hm
08:03:18  <Terkhen> also, I think I'll make the new trucks appear in the list just after the buses
08:03:42  <planetmaker> sounds reasonable
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08:06:35  <Terkhen> hmmm... there is no sort vehicle list property in NML
08:13:02  <planetmaker> nope.
08:13:09  <planetmaker> I'd call it 'not yet' ;-)
08:13:23  <planetmaker> And is only important when you add more vehicles
08:15:38  <Terkhen> I can't place new trucks before the old ones without it... it's not very important anyways; I think that most people will play with the old ones disabled
08:17:37  <Terkhen> hmm... where can I find a detailed credit list for opengfx? I know that Zephyris did the toyland (egrvts) road vehicles, but I don't know for sure about the rest
08:18:28  <Terkhen> ah, found it
08:18:31  <planetmaker> the csv file is as detailed as it gets
08:19:18  <planetmaker> did you know that you're officially programmer of OpenGFX+trains, too? ;-)
08:20:05  <planetmaker> I fear the credits file is not always as detailed as one wishes for.
08:22:08  <Terkhen> I did not... to be honest I was only planning to the point of coding the new trucks, disabling the rest and playing a game :P
08:22:22  <Terkhen> all of them seem to be made by Zephyris
08:23:26  <planetmaker> Likely
08:23:35  <planetmaker> Zephyris drew like 80% of OpenGFX
08:24:04  <Terkhen> :)
08:32:39  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles - Revision 6:bce89c8853ef: Add: First generation bulk truck with initial g... (Terkhen) @
08:34:32  <planetmaker> Terkhen: if you don't re-use existing vehicles, you can leave out the vehicleID :-)
08:34:44  <Terkhen> noted :)
08:34:59  <planetmaker> --> no trouble with double IDs :-)
08:38:22  <Yexo> it will overwwrite the default vehicles though
08:38:33  <Yexo> nml starts with id 0 when assigning ids automatically
08:39:22  <planetmaker> oh
08:39:35  <planetmaker> Then an ID is indeed needed
08:39:43  <Yexo> or a change to nml
08:39:53  <planetmaker> Hm... actually I'd like that ^
08:40:11  <planetmaker> Because it means that the behaviour is different for the 1st and the 15th ship
08:40:30  <Yexo> when you don't assign an id manually you should set all properties anyway
08:40:31  <planetmaker> and differs for each vehicle
08:40:37  <planetmaker> yes
08:40:38  <Yexo> and when you do set all properties the behavior is the same
08:40:49  <planetmaker> but when one does not... :-)
08:41:08  <Yexo> you have undefined behavior for ids > number of default vehicles
08:41:41  <Yexo> but I guess it's best to do that, because people will notice that earlier than when it happens to their 100th vehicle
08:42:23  <planetmaker> yeah. Like when they define manually vehicle 199 ;-)
08:42:37  <planetmaker> Maybe NML should complain about missing properties then
08:42:42  <planetmaker> in >0.1 ;-)
08:44:55  <planetmaker> shall I create an issue?
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08:45:09  <Yexo> for the missing properties check: yes
08:45:12  <Yexo> for the ids: no
08:47:25  <planetmaker> no for IDs? You mean... you want to keep the current behaviour of overwriting?
08:47:41  <Yexo> no, I've already commited that so no need to create an issue for it
08:47:57  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 836:e2b881637920: Change: start the assigned IDs just above the d... (yexo) @
08:48:33  <planetmaker> :-D
08:48:44  <planetmaker> you're fast :-)
08:49:02  <planetmaker> #1628
08:49:03  <Brot6> planetmaker: #1628 is "NewGRF Meta Language - Feature Request #1628: Warn on missing properties - #openttdcoop Development Zone"
08:49:08  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Feature Request #1628 (New): Warn on missing properties (planetmaker) @
08:50:19  <planetmaker> Terkhen: mind if I start to add the trams?
08:53:12  <Terkhen> not at all
08:55:45  <planetmaker> :-)
08:56:15  <planetmaker> You could ask in the forums for nice truck names :-)
09:01:03  <Terkhen> okay, but I think it's better to do so when there is an initial version of all new refittable trucks
09:03:54  <planetmaker> yep
09:12:14  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles - Revision 7:bdf7d7ee0121: Feature: Hereford 'Interurban' tram (planetmaker) @
09:18:21  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles - Revision 8:27e0690c027d: Feature: Foster 'Express' tram (planetmaker) @
09:25:45  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Bug #1629 (New): Review conversion for speed property (planetmaker) @
09:26:56  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles - Revision 9:3640f8568784: Feature: Foster 'Supertram' (planetmaker) @
09:28:22  <Rubidium> yeah, 3 km/h seems like a big difference when it has a precision of around 1 km/h
09:29:12  <Rubidium> although one would expect that the difference is 4 km/h at 80 km/h, but then... there are always some rounding issues
09:29:43  <Rubidium> so it could be e.g. "2.51" vs "3.49"
09:31:05  <planetmaker> I agree that there will remain rounding issues. But 3km/h seemed too much :-)
09:31:13  <planetmaker> I won't complain for 69 instead of 70 :-)
09:31:40  <planetmaker> I recall that from the last round of discussions concerning this topic ;-)
09:32:42  <Rubidium> actually, for RVs it should be possible to always get N km/h (I think) as they have 0.5 km-ish/h granularity
09:34:33  <Rubidium> though looking at the code I can't spot an obvious error, *except* when numbers are converted to m/s then rounded and then converted to the NFO value and rounded again
09:36:23  <planetmaker> yes, possibly. But then that chain needs improvement
09:36:36  <planetmaker> we're talking about 5% error here
09:38:02  <Rubidium> 60 km/h = 16.|6| m/s -> 16 m/s = 57.6 km/h
09:38:31  <Rubidium> though...
09:39:13  <Rubidium> 80 km/h = 22.|2| m/s -> 22 m/s = 79.2 km/h (so rounding doesn't seem to be the only thing that happens)
09:42:10  <Yexo> nml only rounds just before writing the value to the nfo file IIRC
09:42:12  <planetmaker> The conversion factors between units might not be accurate (enough)
09:42:13  <Yexo> will check that now
10:03:54  <Yexo> 60 km/h in nml -> 119 in nfo (=3.2*mph)
10:04:06  <Yexo> that is 119/3.2 = 37.1875 mph
10:04:12  <Yexo> but openttd displays that as 36mph
10:04:32  <Yexo> so the rounding error is in openttd, not nml
10:05:01  <Rubidium> does TTDPatch show 36 or 37 mph?
10:07:15  <Yexo> 37mph
10:07:56  <Yexo> and 59 km/h, not 57km/h
10:09:17  <Rubidium> yay :(
10:15:02  <Brot6> Unable to connect to execution expired
10:18:21  <planetmaker> :-O
10:21:02  <Brot6> Unable to connect to Failed with 502 Bad Gateway
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10:30:45  <planetmaker> sorry, for the IRC, _Terkhen_
10:31:34  <_Terkhen_> don't worry
10:31:55  <planetmaker> well, I do. Server going unresponsive in larger parts is not good
10:33:13  <_Terkhen_> oh, I meant about the bouncer
10:33:40  <_Terkhen_> I can access to without problems
10:34:25  <planetmaker> now :-)
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10:36:27  <planetmaker> I'm still searching for where to restart znc ;-)
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10:50:10  <planetmaker> ah
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10:59:43  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 57:d657533c5cd2: Fix (r56): Don't remove (yet) the vehicleIDs (planetmaker) @
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11:14:12  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 58:17d526ef186f: Change #1623: Use available default sprites for monor... (planetmaker) @
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11:31:44  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 59:bcdd246b06f0: Change #1621: Use available default sprites for monor... (planetmaker) @
11:49:44  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 60:6a5f6ee01354: Change #1622: Use available default sprites for monor... (planetmaker) @
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14:06:10  <planetmaker> <-- any idea why this tender doesn't show in the purchase list?
14:17:22  <planetmaker> hm. nvm
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14:35:07  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Feature #1630 (New): Allow using of proper units in callbacks / varaction2 (planetmaker) @
14:50:20  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Feature #1630: Allow using of proper units in callbacks / varaction2 (yexo) @
15:29:55  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Feature #1630: Allow using of proper units in callbacks / varaction2 (planetmaker) @
15:43:25  <Yexo> planetmaker: aren't wagons automatically disabled when they aren't able to refit to any cargo?
15:43:32  <Yexo> why do you have a special parameter for that?
15:50:00  <planetmaker> in opengfx+trains?
15:50:12  <planetmaker> The parameter I have is for those useless wagons
15:50:32  <planetmaker> I don't need a paper wagon when I have a piecegood wagon which refits to paper
15:51:13  <planetmaker> I don't disable any wagon based on availability of cargos
15:54:18  <planetmaker> It should be called 'disable default wagons'
15:59:03  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 61:d790fc8fceaa: Change: Clearify parameter (planetmaker) @
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16:10:29  <Brot6> nml: update from r831 to r836 done -
16:18:44  <Levi> I'm getting Error 502: bad gateway when trying to push changes into my project via TortoiseHG, are there any problems on the server?
16:19:33  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1631 (New): Railbus CFe3/3 (Voyager1) @
16:19:49  <Brot6> ogfx-trains: update from r53 to r61 done (1 errors) -
16:20:08  <Brot6> Following repos didn't need a nightlies update: 2cctrainset (r615), 32bpp-extra (r39), ai-admiralai (r68), airportsplus (r63), basecosts (r22), belarusiantowns (r7), comic-houses (r71), firs (r1473), fish (r394), frenchtowns (r4), grfcodec (r772), heqs (r380), indonesiantowns (r33), metrotrackset (r56), newgrf_makefile (r219), nforenum (r506), nml (r836), nutracks (r117), ogfx-trees (r41), opengfx (r550), openmsx (r97), opensfx (r97),
16:20:08  <Brot6> smts (r19), snowlinemod (r45), swedishrails (r182), swisstowns (r20), transrapidtrackset (r15), ttdviewer (r26), ttrs (r23), worldairlinersset (r664)
16:23:26  <Brot6> Following repos rebuilds successful without any difference to earlier nightlies builds: airportsplus (Diffsize: 6), belarusiantowns (3 errors) (Diffsize: 21), frenchtowns (4 errors) (Diffsize: 9), indonesiantowns (4 errors) (Diffsize: 12), swedishrails (Diffsize: 6), swisstowns (Diffsize: 4649)
16:23:59  <Levi> planetmaker?
16:24:03  <planetmaker> hm
16:24:24  <planetmaker> it worked for me one minute before you joined here
16:24:34  <Levi> so it's all my fault? :)
16:24:39  <planetmaker> no
16:24:54  <planetmaker> did you try again?
16:25:00  <Levi> multiple times
16:25:18  <planetmaker> hm
16:25:33  <planetmaker> I use ssh to push, not redmine credentials
16:25:54  <Levi> it worked yesterday
16:26:00  <planetmaker> no doubt
16:26:10  <planetmaker> it *should* also work now
16:26:19  <planetmaker> when did you try? Just now?
16:26:23  <planetmaker> Or earlier today?
16:26:27  <Levi> just now
16:27:43  <planetmaker> can you try again?
16:27:52  <Levi> 502
16:28:05  <planetmaker> hm, damn. then nginx is acting up
16:28:21  <planetmaker> I'll need Ammler for that ^
16:28:30  <Levi> restart server daemons?
16:28:49  <planetmaker> just did that
16:28:54  <Levi> hm
16:29:25  <planetmaker> though not nginx. Which probably is the cause
16:33:37  <Levi> so we need to wait for Ammler?
16:34:11  <planetmaker> Most probably :S
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17:33:14  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 837:f96d20675699: Doc: Callbacks for vehicles (planetmaker) @
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18:09:50  <Brot6> 32bpp-ez-patches: update from r20914 to r20915 done -
18:19:07  <Brot6> clientpatches: update from r20914 to r20915 done -
18:27:47  <Brot6> serverpatches: update from h962cc856 to h5ed234b4 done (2 errors) -
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18:50:27  <andythenorth_> hi hi
18:50:34  <andythenorth_> planetmaker: the min. version thing makes sense
18:50:44  <andythenorth_> that could be the reason for very low number of downloads for 0.4
18:50:54  <planetmaker> of course
18:51:03  <andythenorth_> far as I know it will be fine
18:51:14  <andythenorth_> I could compile stable and test, but I can't be bothered :P
18:51:29  <planetmaker> :-)
18:51:49  <andythenorth_> maybe we should mention it in the FIRS release thread?
18:52:18  <planetmaker> dunno. Wouldn't be a bad thing, though :-)
18:55:52  <andythenorth_> done
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19:40:17  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1236: 1 tile buffer should be ignored when player / scen... (foobar) @
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21:20:14  <Levi> Ammler?
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