Log for #openttdcoop.devzone on 23rd October 2010:
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06:30:12  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 428:7db61e98e930: Feature: enhanced / fixed cargo graphic... (andythenorth) @
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07:58:55  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 429:d2454092f189: Fix: mining trucks use grey load sprite... (andythenorth) @
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08:30:44  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1706: Alstom AGV (Voyager1) @
08:57:16  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 430:e5c7f40fe1f3: Change: template action 1/2/3 for Rockc... (andythenorth) @
08:57:16  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 431:23440745fad5: Change: template action 1/2/3 for Harne... (andythenorth) @
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09:49:43  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 432:991d29bfc42f: Change: template action 1/2/3 for Kilim... (andythenorth) @
10:08:04  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 433:57f8698ad72d: Change: template action 1/2/3 for Mt. R... (andythenorth) @
10:10:32  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 434:5a8ba24a0838: Change: template action 1/2/3 for Mt. M... (andythenorth) @
10:13:24  <frosch123> is there already some nml grf which puts the hg revision in the a14 version?
10:13:38  <frosch123> (which i could then copy :p )
10:14:06  <planetmaker> yes, +trains, swedish-rails, airports
10:14:20  * Alberth ponders to make that a NML feature
10:14:21  <planetmaker> rv also, I think
10:14:31  <planetmaker> Alberth: you can't set it automatically
10:14:36  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 435:54cd1de18344: Change: template action 1/2/3 for Wolfp... (andythenorth) @
10:14:38  <frosch123> really?.. i thought i already looked at serails
10:15:08  <planetmaker> frosch123: it just needs min_compatible_version: 1 within the grf block
10:15:19  <Terkhen> yeah, rv does that too IIRC
10:15:28  <planetmaker> (or whatever your minimal compatible version is)
10:15:33  <Terkhen> found it while adding min_compatible_version
10:15:52  <planetmaker> oh, wait, the version?
10:15:58  <planetmaker> yes, all those grf use that, too
10:16:06  <Alberth> planetmaker: you mean as a default? no I was thinking like "Version=HG_REVISION"  or so (no idea about the syntax used there)
10:16:19  <frosch123>         version : REPO_REVISION; // must be numeric
10:16:21  <planetmaker> you need to update scripts/Makefile_nml and the version by the given define
10:17:18  <planetmaker> sorry, Alberth mis-read intially :-) - might make sense
10:17:45  <Alberth> english text is just too ambiguous :)
10:17:56  <planetmaker> Though it'd require the repo to be a mercurial one. Which we should not require IMHO
10:18:15  <planetmaker> As such I'm not sure it should be set automatically or if so how a good approach would look like
10:18:19  <frosch123> planetmaker: looks like it works out of the box :)
10:18:33  <Alberth> why? "REPO_VERSION" seems nicely generic, although we will only support hg for the time being
10:19:03  <planetmaker> Alberth: well, ok, I don't mind to use that :-)
10:19:04  <frosch123> Alberth: the #coop makefiles seem to define that by default
10:19:14  <Alberth> planetmaker: what's the difference between having NML set it, or doing it with a script?
10:19:21  <planetmaker> Currently I use that as explicit define given to gcc via command line when processing the NML
10:19:41  <planetmaker> Alberth: not much. Except that I use the same variable in other places, too
10:19:42  <frosch123> Alberth: you also want to put it in the grf name/description
10:19:54  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 436:c4771c3b2b2d: Feature: clay cargo graphic support for... (andythenorth) @
10:19:55  <planetmaker> frosch123: no, please not mandatory
10:20:03  <planetmaker> It'd spoil release names
10:20:13  <frosch123> currently there is some {VERSION} custom tag, which resolves into "nightly-r3M"
10:20:22  <planetmaker> or to 0.3.0
10:20:35  <planetmaker> or whatever the tag name is, if != tip
10:20:42  <frosch123> planetmaker: but that also fails for the hg revision :)
10:21:15  <planetmaker> hm?
10:21:16  <frosch123> i.e. once you do branches
10:21:21  <planetmaker> it doesn't fail
10:21:26  <planetmaker> check it out ;-)
10:21:34  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1579: Finish support for Clay cargo (andythenorth) @
10:21:34  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1118 (Closed): Template Mining Trucks action 1-2-3 (andythenorth) @
10:21:43  <planetmaker> at least last time I checked, I tested it with branches
10:21:58  <frosch123> planetmaker: if you have branches the revision integer does not longer define older/newer/compatible
10:22:29  <planetmaker> hm, yes
10:22:41  <frosch123> you need something like ottd's grf version
10:22:43  <planetmaker> that's true
10:23:18  <planetmaker> no support for branches then for now for the sake of compatibility ;-)
10:23:29  <planetmaker> but... I should make a note on that
10:25:27  <Brot6> Example NewGRF Project - Bug #1708 (New): versions for action14 and branches (planetmaker) @
10:25:33  <planetmaker> that will require some quite different handling of versions. Both on the makefile as the newgrf author's side
10:27:52  <frosch123> maybe "version: 1 << 28 | 0 << 24 | REPO_REVISION;" already works
10:28:15  <frosch123> but in that case there should be some default macro to unify the encoding of versions into the number
10:29:23  <planetmaker> version is 32bit, right... so we could use 24 bit for version and 4 for major and 4 for minor
10:29:50  <planetmaker> hm or just 8 for the branch version
10:30:22  <planetmaker> still it requires trunk to have a higher one. Which somehow needs to be set
10:30:47  <planetmaker> which then puts release and branching work on authors. But... I guess not to be avoided
10:44:27  <frosch123> ottd sets trunk to the next to be expected branch
10:44:59  <frosch123> i.e. once a release is made older nighlties are older and newer nighltlies are newer than the branch
10:45:01  <planetmaker> yes. which is something which every newgrf author would need to be reminded of every time ;-)
10:45:12  <frosch123> except the makefile does it :)
10:45:33  <planetmaker> how could it do that?
10:45:51  <planetmaker> the user goes 'hg branch 0.3'
10:45:54  <frosch123> otoh, which grf authors does branches?
10:45:59  <planetmaker> andy ;-)
10:46:08  <frosch123> i thought he abondoned that?
10:46:10  <planetmaker> sometimes.
10:46:20  <planetmaker> yes, I recommended to skip that :-P
10:46:27  <planetmaker> more hassle than it's worth
10:46:40  <planetmaker> though it might make sense for FIRS in some circumstances
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10:47:29  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 437:44fe5223c4ba: Feature: clay cargo graphic support for... (andythenorth) @
10:48:53  <andythenorth_> branching FIRS was more trouble than worth
10:48:59  <andythenorth_> I screwed my repo :P
10:49:06  <andythenorth_> mostly my own mistakes though
10:49:21  <andythenorth_> would make sense if multiple versions are being supported
10:49:36  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 438:843a6f1eaa85: Feature: clay cargo graphic support for... (andythenorth) @
10:50:11  <planetmaker> :-)
10:53:14  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #1709 (New): Some industries appear to be incorrectly buildin... (andythenorth) @
11:07:11  <Brot6> Manual Industries - Revision 4:f72ec241d323: Add: Put the revision number into a14 version. (frosch) @
11:07:11  <Brot6> Manual Industries - Revision 5:d3fcffadb911: Fix: some spelling in strings. (frosch) @
11:13:03  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1579 (Closed): Finish support for Clay cargo (andythenorth) @
11:16:50  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #1709 (New): Some industries appear to be incorrectly buildin... (andythenorth) @
11:52:15  <planetmaker> andythenorth_: <-- you asked about a few days ago
11:52:25  <planetmaker> the topic could have told you :-P
11:52:29  <planetmaker> (as well as me)
11:53:47  <andythenorth_> thanks
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12:22:47  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #892 (Closed): Update belly dump trailer code to support F... (andythenorth) @
12:25:08  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1068: Extend FIRS cargo support (andythenorth) @
12:30:51  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1706: Alstom AGV (DJNekkid) @
12:33:40  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 439:ea07a0700b8e: Fix: very large crawler trailers were t... (andythenorth) @
12:48:34  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 440:de67120b4f53: Fix: buy menu positions for some mining... (andythenorth) @
12:49:44  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Bug #936 (Closed): Wrong sprites (andythenorth) @
12:51:49  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1661: Make sprites/pcx a flat structure (andythenorth) @
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13:17:57  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 441:5875a557c151: Change: moved pcx files directory to fl... (andythenorth) @
13:17:57  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1661 (Closed): Make sprites/pcx a flat structure (andythenorth) @
13:26:30  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 442:b410fdb1c655: Change: convert No.6 crawler text to de... (andythenorth) @
13:26:30  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 443:9f9482038560: Change: convert No.8 crawler text to de... (andythenorth) @
13:26:30  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 444:6d91045b07d8: Change: convert No.9 crawler text to de... (andythenorth) @
13:27:50  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 445:1ed1479656e1: Change: convert Red Peak crawler text t... (andythenorth) @
13:42:55  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 446:7ff352ca85ec: Change: convert tractor text to define IDs (andythenorth) @
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14:51:25  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1706: Alstom AGV (Voyager1) @
15:28:15  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1706: Alstom AGV (DJNekkid) @
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15:40:40  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1710 (New): OS T1000 (Voyager1) @
15:40:40  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 447:2c49cb75c748: Change: convert log truck text to defin... (andythenorth) @
15:46:44  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 448:a8307eae83f8: Change: convert mining truck text to de... (andythenorth) @
15:46:44  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1662 (Closed): Move info text IDs to defines for ease (andythenorth) @
15:53:44  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 449:bc8c7a21be0a: Fix: couple of minor issues with crawle... (andythenorth) @
16:03:01  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 450:9fb7582f76a4: Change: added some previously missed te... (andythenorth) @
16:07:30  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 451:cdde93843bc7: Change: trailer refit strings now use d... (andythenorth) @
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16:14:11  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1711 (New): Convert crawlers to CPP real sprites - as per... (andythenorth) @
16:14:11  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1712 (New): Convert crawler trailers to CPP real sprites ... (andythenorth) @
16:15:12  <Rubidium> Ammler: could you please fix pushes via https?
16:15:30  <Rubidium> as Lakie has very important stuff to push :)
16:15:50  <Lakie> Heh
16:16:05  <Lakie> Well, its not hugely important, just  a luxary
16:16:41  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1713 (New): Convert tractors to CPP real sprites - as per... (andythenorth) @
16:16:41  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1714 (New): Convert standard trailers to CPP real sprites... (andythenorth) @
16:16:41  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1715 (New): Convert articulated mining trucks to CPP real... (andythenorth) @
16:16:41  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1716 (New): Convert logging trucks to CPP real sprites - ... (andythenorth) @
16:17:22  <Hirundo> Andy is paid one cookie per commit/issue?
16:18:00  <planetmaker> I commit therefor I am
16:18:06  <planetmaker> Or something ;-)
16:18:19  <planetmaker> Hello Hirundo
16:18:37  <Hirundo> Co(m|g)ito ergo sum :P
16:18:43  <planetmaker> :-P
16:20:18  <Brot6> 2cctrainset: update from r634 to r635 done (7 errors) -
16:21:14  <Brot6> heqs: update from r427 to r451 done -
16:21:24  <andythenorth_> planetmaker: 'I commit therefore I am' is about right
16:21:33  <andythenorth_> it's like "I tweet therefore I am", but more useful
16:21:42  <planetmaker> :-) Much so
16:21:44  <Brot6> manindu: update from  to r5 done -
16:21:54  <planetmaker> it's about the difference between you and xiong
16:22:03  <Brot6> Following repos didn't need a nightlies update: 32bpp-extra (r39), ai-admiralai (r71), airportsplus (r64), basecosts (r22), belarusiantowns (r7), comic-houses (r71), firs (r1481), fish (r404), frenchtowns (r4), grfcodec (r778), indonesiantowns (r37), metrotrackset (r56), newgrf_makefile (r219), nml (r914), nutracks (r117), ogfx-trains (r85), ogfx-trees (r41), opengfx (r550), openmsx (r97), opensfx (r97), smts (r19), snowlinemod (r45),
16:22:03  <Brot6> swedishrails (r187), swisstowns (r20), transrapidtrackset (r15), ttdviewer (r26), ttrs (r23), worldairlinersset (r665)
16:22:04  <planetmaker> I hope you don't mind this qualifying "comparison"
16:22:08  <andythenorth_> that's the only difference? :P
16:22:18  <planetmaker> I hope not ;-)
16:22:28  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1711 (New): Convert No. 6, 8, 9 crawlers to CPP real spri... (andythenorth) @
16:22:35  <planetmaker> I guess there
16:22:37  <andythenorth_> I'm basically avoiding facing this ticket:
16:22:45  <Brot6> indonesiantowns: compile of r37 still failed (#1704) -
16:22:55  <planetmaker> is also some communication layer which works better, I guess :-)
16:23:11  <andythenorth_> opengfx+ RVs are all 'standard' 8/8 size?
16:23:29  <planetmaker> well. In principle
16:23:30  <Brot6> swisstowns: compile of r20 still failed (#1705) -
16:23:32  <andythenorth_> hmm
16:23:37  <planetmaker> But they're mostly "looks ok"
16:23:48  <planetmaker> And huge chunks are egrvts
16:23:59  <planetmaker> so... if that follows that guide opengfx does so, too
16:24:11  <andythenorth_> I think zeph made his own guide
16:24:14  <Lakie> I'm pretty sure I tried pikka's offsets and openttd's bounding boxes didn't match them...
16:24:20  <Lakie> (for trains)
16:24:28  <planetmaker> That I know
16:24:31  <planetmaker> Blame me
16:24:32  <andythenorth_> he has a couple of tweaks to make them close-coupled
16:24:36  <Terkhen> it only uses sprites from egrvts and opengfx... and all trucks I have coded already have the same size
16:24:36  <andythenorth_> IIRC
16:24:52  <Lakie> Ah, ok
16:24:59  <andythenorth_> I am going to have to figure out standard offsets for each length of RV :P
16:25:06  <planetmaker> Lakie: I basically defined my own. I tried Pikka's templates. But it seemed MUCH work without improving anything really
16:25:14  <planetmaker> at least among eachother
16:25:20  * Terkhen just copied the ones at OpenGFX
16:25:33  <Lakie> Hehe
16:25:47  <Lakie> Well, alignment does take quite some time, even with the grfhelper windows
16:26:29  <planetmaker> but then, I got the sprites already somewhat aligned. Even though I re-aligned every single rail vehicle in OpenGFX, it is still somewhat based on some original alignment. Roughly
16:26:42  <planetmaker> Yes, it took me weeks. Even with the helper window
16:27:08  <Lakie> Heh, but atleast it looks really nice now? :)
16:27:24  <planetmaker> I think it's ok
16:27:38  <planetmaker> A bit of a problem is no 32px in depots for base sets
16:28:08  <planetmaker> There might still be room for improvements in a few cases. Like very short steamers like the Kirby Paul
16:28:19  <planetmaker> It looks not optimal when you double-traction
16:28:23  <planetmaker> +do
16:28:29  <Lakie> Could be yea, because mnost of opengfx is drawn to 32px and not the original 28px?
16:28:44  <planetmaker> We have both. But yes
16:29:15  <planetmaker> 32px in 28px alignment in depots is just wrong ;-)
16:29:54  <planetmaker> Lakie: I think there's even an OpenGFX version for TTDPatch :-)
16:30:12  <Lakie> Nice
16:30:44  <planetmaker> you can build the TTDP bundle straight from the Makefile
16:30:56  <Lakie> As for the 32px depot and how the flag works, you can blame me, I came up with the idea and original ttdpatch implementation...
16:31:05  <planetmaker> just call make ttdp_bundle :-)
16:31:15  <Lakie> cool
16:31:31  <planetmaker> Lakie: 32px in depots works for newgrf fine. But base sets cannot use any of that
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16:34:00  * andythenorth_ thinks nice RV alignment will be really important....for rv-wagons :D
16:34:27  <andythenorth_> but until that pony arrives, it will be useful for when I start BANDIT
16:37:39  <Lakie> I know, because base sets can't set the bit for it, planetmaker. :)
16:39:16  <Lakie> 'cept since base sets don't exist like that in ttdp it can. ;)
16:39:34  <planetmaker> eh?
16:40:04  <planetmaker> you mean you can set that and it applies also to the normal vehicles?
16:40:14  <planetmaker> it's not a global var, is it?
16:40:20  <planetmaker> it's a grf-local one
16:40:35  <Lakie> Um, global
16:40:38  <Lakie> iirc
16:40:45  <Lakie> Might be different in openttd though
16:41:00  <planetmaker> hm, ok, then it differs. I guess due to no-engine-pool assuming one grf only
16:41:12  <planetmaker> In OpenTTD it's local to one grf
16:41:14  <Lakie> For TTDPatch it is global, so as I said you could happily set it in the patch version. :)
16:41:18  <planetmaker> but then to all vehicles within that
16:42:13  <Lakie> I can see why they'd do that, but troublesome from multiple grf point of view though
16:49:14  * Lakie goes to start converting his main diff into hg commits
16:49:57  <Lakie> Also Rubidium, did you manage to compile windows versions (which worked) ok with my diff?
16:50:25  <planetmaker> Lakie: I don't see where there'll be a problem in a multiple-grf environment
16:50:52  <planetmaker> it basically defines the looks of the sprites defined by each grf - and it should know it best
16:51:00  <Lakie> If addons don't think to set the bit being from the ttdpatch era?
16:51:46  <planetmaker> Hm, yes. But then they're not made for a multi-grf environment anyway.
16:51:53  <Lakie> Thats true
16:52:32  <planetmaker> Lakie: converting main diff into hg commits: learn the joy of mercurial queues :-)
16:52:36  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 452:d0a9eaeecacc: Add: file for storing standard offsets ... (andythenorth) @
16:53:10  <Lakie> Well, I don't want it all as one huge commit, thus I need to splice the diff into smaller commits, planetmaker
16:53:25  <planetmaker> yes :-) That's understood.
16:53:36  <planetmaker> That's why I proposed mercurial queues.
16:54:04  <Lakie> Ok, I'm not 100% sure what it is then, applying multiple patches at once?
16:54:24  <planetmaker> it's basically a convenient way to manage a patch sequence. or stack of patches
16:54:39  <planetmaker> and also to commit them then with a flick of your finger when you're satisfied
16:54:42  <planetmaker> without further work
16:55:02  <Lakie> Hmm.
16:55:08  <planetmaker>
16:55:09  <Webster> Title: MqExtension - Mercurial (at
16:55:35  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 453:f7700ffcdc38: Add: psd file for standard vehicle temp... (andythenorth) @
16:55:38  <planetmaker> it allows you to do the developement straight from the start in the "split" way
16:55:59  <planetmaker> of course it implies that you know already what sensible parts there are
16:56:23  <Lakie> I've got a little list and plan on how to split it down?
16:58:40  <planetmaker> naja... :-) In needs getting used to. But if you develop larger set of patches often, it's helpful.
16:58:45  <planetmaker> It makes their management easy
16:58:50  <Lakie> I'm not sure about the added files though, worried it might brek on trying to merge those.
16:58:57  <planetmaker> especially also the updating to a new base
17:01:02  <Lakie> Heh, lots to learn. :/
17:02:49  <planetmaker> well, it's nothing *needed*.
17:02:59  <planetmaker> You can do it the same way you always did. As with svn
17:03:18  <planetmaker> it's IMHO just a layer of convenience added
17:03:28  <Lakie> Heh, I tended to just commit lage patchs with xvn. :)
17:03:33  <Lakie> svn*
17:03:45  <planetmaker> :-P
17:03:53  <planetmaker> ok...
17:04:03  * planetmaker prefers the smaller patches, too :-)
17:04:15  <Lakie> Doesn't look like https is going to get fixed for a while... :/
17:04:16  <planetmaker> then I understand what the other person did
17:04:25  * planetmaker sighs
17:04:36  <planetmaker> he said he'd be around today :-(
17:05:09  <Lakie> Well, I suppose the day isn't over yet.
17:09:43  <Hirundo> planetmaker: just FYI, setting the 32 px bit in a base set is effectively a NOP in openttd
17:10:12  <planetmaker> I guess it'll be ignored, yes
17:17:59  <andythenorth_> I wonder if Pikka did weird template things, or if I modified them and forgot them :o
17:25:55  <Rubidium> otherwise you can give your whole hg checkout to me or planetmaker and then we can try to push it
17:26:32  <planetmaker> or you could create a key pair for ssh
17:27:24  <planetmaker>
17:29:02  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 454:198667538900: Change: setup psd with templates for 3/... (andythenorth) @
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17:37:25  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1654: Oslo Metro MX3000 (Voyager1) @
17:41:33  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1654: Oslo Metro MX3000 (Voyager1) @
17:43:04  <Ammler> hello planetmaker :-)
17:43:16  <Alberth> yep, my https is also blocked
17:43:17  <planetmaker> hallo Ammler :-)
17:43:24  <planetmaker> so is mine
17:43:29  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1710: OS T1000 (Voyager1) @
17:43:34  <Ammler> I see traffic with push
17:43:35  <Lakie> Everyone's is?
17:43:39  <planetmaker> yes
17:43:48  <planetmaker> Ammler: but only via ssh
17:44:07  <Ammler> no
17:44:33  <Ammler> how do you push to the http via ssh?
17:44:35  <Alberth> "remote: ssl required" is the errir
17:44:42  <planetmaker> ^
17:44:43  <Alberth> *error
17:44:45  <Ammler> https :-P
17:44:57  <Alberth> I try to :)
17:45:09  <Alberth> via ssh?
17:45:23  <Ammler> there is no push via http
17:45:27  <planetmaker> ssh only works, if we have your key installed
17:45:30  <planetmaker> Ammler: https...
17:45:35  <Ammler> do we need that?
17:45:38  <Alberth> pushing to https://Alberth:***
17:45:51  <Alberth> is what I try, and it worked until recently
17:46:00  <Ammler> until?
17:46:15  <Ammler> it works for me and I see other pushing that way just now
17:46:18  <planetmaker> few days ago
17:46:25  <planetmaker> It doesn't work for me either, Ammler
17:46:27  <Alberth> today, but Lakie and planetmaker failed earlier
17:46:34  <planetmaker> e.g. for test repo
17:46:38  <Lakie> Yeah, yesterday
17:46:41  <planetmaker> s/either/too
17:46:43  <Rubidium> Ammler: you saw my push? That was just testing something, but I had already everything pushed so nothing got actually psuhed
17:47:00  <planetmaker> or my try to the test repo. Which was rejected
17:47:13  <Alberth> Ammler: pulling worked yesterday
17:47:28  <Rubidium> my authorization on test fails by the way
17:47:30  <planetmaker> only push is affected. Alberth pull also doesn't use https
17:48:05  <Alberth> pulling from https://Alberth:***  <-- it doesn't?
17:48:05  <Lakie> The referencewiki page indicates differently?
17:48:16  <Ammler> I just pushed to test
17:49:22  <Rubidium> did you update/change the config of the HTTPS?
17:49:55  <Rubidium> as it might be something "stupid" like disallowing "old" ssl versions
17:50:33  <Rubidium> which means anyone with a not fully up-to-date version of hg/python might have trouble getting the https connection initialised
17:50:54  <Ammler> no, I did nothing, just arrived :-/
17:51:16  <Rubidium> I mean, when did it break and what happened before that
17:51:26  <Alberth> Hmm, I run hg 1.6.4
17:51:49  <Ammler> same here
17:51:50  <planetmaker> Ammler: I think it doesn't work since the restart. Also not yesterday
17:51:56  <planetmaker> 1.6.3 here
17:52:09  <Ammler> are you able to paste some error msg?
17:52:28  <Alberth> (07:44:39 PM) Alberth: "remote: ssl required" is the errir
17:52:44  <planetmaker>
17:53:12  <planetmaker>
17:53:27  <Ammler> are you able to browse your project with browser?
17:53:47  <planetmaker> yes
17:54:24  <Alberth> yep, I can log in and query pages through the web browser
17:55:02  <Ammler> ah, I see, planetmaker didn't follow my doc :-)
17:55:35  <Ammler> should work now for everyone
17:56:08  <Alberth> \o/
17:56:24  <Ammler> no, I made wrong docs :-P
17:56:31  <Ammler> hmm
17:57:35  <Lakie> Heh
17:57:45  <planetmaker> tsk :-)
17:58:14  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 455:916446c4d81f: Add: png files for standard templates (andythenorth) @
17:58:14  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1124: Setup RV offsets for Pikka templates (andythenorth) @
17:58:19  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 915:1bb177817eab: Fix: Variable name fix. (Alberth) @
18:02:51  <Brot6> 32bpp-ez-patches - Bug #1717 (New): DevZone compile failed (compiler) @
18:03:15  <Rubidium> Server returned an error: HTTP Error 504: Gateway Time-Out
18:03:35  <Rubidium> Ammler: I doubt the above is something GT can solve
18:03:54  <Lakie> I had that at some point last week when trying to browse the http projects pages
18:04:15  <Rubidium> lack of memory or something?
18:04:52  <Rubidium> interesting. Fedora has grfcodec 1.0.1
18:05:14  <Brot6> #openttdcoop Client Patch Pack - Bug #1718 (New): DevZone compile failed (compiler) @
18:05:42  * Rubidium guesses that's the same error
18:06:19  <Brot6> serverpatches: compile of r21016 still failed (#1658) -
18:06:27  <planetmaker> lack of memory might be
18:06:33  <planetmaker> might have been
18:07:18  *** fanioz has quit IRC
18:07:26  <andythenorth_> road vehicle ID FF is reserved?
18:07:31  <Rubidium> <- why is FIRS there?
18:09:03  <planetmaker> andythenorth_: that ID can never be used
18:09:12  <andythenorth_> so it would seem :)
18:09:20  <Lakie> Really?
18:09:24  <andythenorth_> certainly produced linter failure when I tried
18:09:26  <planetmaker> Lakie: extended byte
18:09:26  <Lakie> FF  FF 00 ?
18:09:39  <planetmaker> yes that way maybe :-)
18:09:50  <Lakie> ;)
18:10:02  * Lakie had thought about it with objects
18:10:30  <Lakie> Though in ttdpatch you can't go higher than FF with action3s
18:11:22  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 456:daf548206a50: Change: add Template Tester vehicle - p... (andythenorth) @
18:12:13  <Brot6> Backup test: abort: no suitable response from remote hg!
18:12:27  <Rubidium> goin' great :)
18:12:58  <Rubidium> although I shouldn't complain as OpenTTD's server isn't rock solid either
18:13:14  <Rubidium> stupid svnserve, lighttpd and apache that are still misbehaving
18:14:24  <planetmaker> hm
18:14:38  <Ammler> firs was last project, I didn't clean before, no serious thing, will change anyway...
18:14:43  <Ammler> it*
18:15:20  <Rubidium> although the amount of misbehavings has been significantly reduced :)
18:15:54  <Lakie> Heh
18:16:03  <Ammler> it results in bad idea to make compiling depnding on another compile service (obs)
18:16:38  <Ammler> but the advantage to have automatic chroot/vm creating is nice
18:17:18  <Ammler> I might simply check if obs is available, if not, just postpond the compile run
18:17:30  <Rubidium> just make a few chroots, tar them and untar them for each run
18:17:47  <Rubidium> might be tricky with updating grfcodec/nml though
18:17:50  <planetmaker> on the new one it might be an option
18:17:59  <planetmaker> on the new server
18:18:06  <Ammler> there is a "offline" mode
18:18:19  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1710: OS T1000 (DJNekkid) @
18:18:21  <Ammler> for newest osc version
18:18:33  <Ammler> it does use the rpms from cache only
18:21:35  <Ammler> btw. the error before was that "push_ssl=false" was missing in the config
18:22:19  <Ammler> push is proxied with the nginx which does ssl
18:26:40  <Alberth> and the config required not to use ssl?
18:31:27  <Ammler> my docs loaded the wrong config
18:40:48  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 457:270188fee4c8: Change: template further for real sprites (andythenorth) @
18:44:42  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Bug #1719 (New): Tram consists don't match refits (game warning on... (andythenorth) @
18:45:15  * andythenorth_ templates further than may be wise
18:45:29  <andythenorth_> defines / templates nested 3 levels deep is one level too much :P
18:45:35  <andythenorth_> but highly efficient in some ways
19:07:46  <Brot6> World Airliners Set - Revision 666:0160521c5c09: New A320 liverys added. Recoded B747-400D and ad... (FaddyPainter) @
19:16:48  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 458:5e853f6e38d7: Change: use further templates for real ... (andythenorth) @
19:21:17  *** andythenorth_ has left #openttdcoop.devzone
19:24:26  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1124: Setup RV offsets for Pikka templates (andythenorth) @
19:39:00  <Brot6> 32bpp-ez-patches - Bug #1717 (Rejected): DevZone compile failed (compiler) @
19:39:00  <Brot6> 32bpp-ez-patches - Bug #1717 (Rejected): DevZone compile failed (GeekToo) @
20:28:48  <Rubidium> planetmaker: what's the point of PCX_DIR in opengfx's Makefile.config?
20:29:33  <planetmaker> the dir of the pcx files / graphics files
20:29:55  <Rubidium> yeah, but it's not used at all
20:30:01  <planetmaker> you might want to make it different from the nfo dir
20:30:34  <planetmaker> he. True
20:30:58  <planetmaker> So it's pointless
20:31:13  <planetmaker> it was then once used in some very old dep checks, I guess
20:31:39  <Rubidium> likewise for WAV_DIR/PCX_DIR in newgrf_makefile
20:35:10  <planetmaker> indeed. Thanks
20:36:02  <Brot6> Example NewGRF Project - Revision 220:fc819edbe9d6: Cleanup: Remove unneeded, old variables (planetmaker) @
20:38:10  <planetmaker> Did you know that there's a separate paragraph "why I don't like Rubidium" on the luukland servers wiki?
20:38:40  <planetmaker> quite laughable
20:39:00  <Rubidium> yes, that whole piece of comedy wiki should be kept alive
20:40:20  <Terkhen> followed by an statement that all of them are over twenty-something years old... even they felt it was needed to clear that up after such paragraph
20:40:57  <Rubidium> <- that's a really fun read
20:41:00  <Webster> Title: Guidelines - Luukland's Servers OpenTTD Wiki (at
20:41:11  <Rubidium> never could get any of them to reply on my questions regarding that document though
20:41:35  <Terkhen> wow
20:43:06  <planetmaker> :-)
20:43:08  <Terkhen> You agree not to access the THE GOULP PRO DEV TEAM Technology by any means other than through the means that is provided by THE GOULP PRO DEV TEAM for use in accessing the THE GOULP PRO DEV TEAM Technology. <-- I'm just skimming over it, this sentence made me chuckle
20:43:33  <planetmaker> yeah, read that some time ago. Chuckle is a moderate description :-)
20:43:41  <Terkhen> :D
20:44:02  <Rubidium> "e) Using a different program then OpenTTD as interface between the player and his game is prohibited. Any other form of automatically generated information generated for a group of players advantage with malicious intentions is forbidden as well." <- that's really the best
20:44:27  <Rubidium> and, now I'm reading it again it has become even better
20:44:33  <planetmaker> :-D
20:44:55  <Rubidium> "a different program then [sic] OpenTTD" -> ottd_master, ottd_updater
20:45:20  <Rubidium> "interface between the player and his game" -> serverlist (ottd_master, website)
20:45:52  <Rubidium> "Any other form of automatically generated information" -> ottd_master, ottd_updater, website
20:46:15  <Rubidium> "group of players" -> the developers occasionally play
20:46:48  <Terkhen> :)
20:46:48  <Rubidium> "malicious intentions" -> dicatorship
20:47:52  <Terkhen> wow, they have shareholders too?
20:48:28  <Rubidium> Terkhen: the last paragraph is the real beauty of the document
20:48:31  <planetmaker> hehe :-)
20:49:02  <planetmaker> besides, I'm not bound to that contract.
20:49:15  <planetmaker> Putting the terms of usage on a website make them legally binding ;-)
20:49:36  <Rubidium> oh, I like their clause "d" as well
20:49:51  <planetmaker> bugs? yes, nice.
20:49:58  <Terkhen> :D:D
20:50:09  <Terkhen> that's one of the best indeed
20:51:17  * Terkhen stills smiles whenever he sees the logo
20:52:12  <planetmaker> what about it? It's a modified OTTD, but...?
20:54:25  <Terkhen> it is a summary of the whole page... grab something, change it a bit and stamp your name in big letters all over it
20:57:43  <frosch123> hmm, who deleted mb's reply to the luukland topic
20:58:24  <Rubidium> a "michael blunck"
20:58:53  <planetmaker> ^
20:59:05  <frosch123> boring
20:59:31  <frosch123> but yes, everything is logged ^^
21:00:03  <Rubidium> it's more deduction
21:00:33  <Rubidium> if it were a moderator it would be in the spam bin
21:00:40  <Rubidium> so it must be the person that wrote the post
21:15:26  *** Alberth has left #openttdcoop.devzone
21:15:45  <Rubidium> in any case I'm still (or again) pondering whether to reply to those pages
21:16:42  <Rubidium> especially as it could be seen as childish and points more people to him
21:17:19  <Rubidium> somewhat similarly to zodttd with his complaining and never rectifying that he was the one that was wrong
21:26:26  <frosch123> i guess it is better not to bother :)
21:26:50  <frosch123> argueing will become annoying for sure
21:30:50  <planetmaker> most likely, yes
21:31:06  <planetmaker> unfortunately
21:34:37  <Lakie> zodttd?
21:35:22  <Rubidium> person porting openttd to ip[ao]d while violating the (GPLv2) license on many points
21:35:43  <Lakie> Ah
21:35:53  <Rubidium> then me writing a long long list of things where he violates, send it to Apple. Apple pretends to forward it to the developer
21:36:07  <Rubidium> developer uploads new version, Apple says all issues are solved
21:36:25  <Lakie> But its not?
21:36:26  <Rubidium> I look again, still 90% of the issues remain unsolved, complain to Apple again. Apple pulls it
21:36:38  <Rubidium> zodttd goes almost mental
21:37:09  <Lakie> Well, if it voilates the lisense he can go mential all he wants, it doesn't change it being illegal
21:37:33  <Rubidium> he starts spreading FUD that we aren't open source because we let Apple pull it
21:37:51  <Rubidium> he finally comes a bit to his senses, makes a new version, shows that to us first
21:38:05  <Rubidium> we okay it, months later it shows up on the itunes store
21:38:12  <Rubidium> he still keeps spreading the FUD
21:38:35  <Rubidium> then apple pulls it again and it's dead silent, while all the FUD is still around on the web
21:39:10  <Lakie> Hm, and thus you are left trying to clean the fud and people's misguided opinions?
21:39:21  <Rubidium>
21:39:22  <Webster> Title: OpenTTD for Apple Devices Petition (at
21:39:27  <Rubidium>
21:40:02  <Rubidium> and people are still signing the stupid petition
21:40:30  <Lakie> Was it pulled by you or Apple itself?
21:40:38  <Rubidium> by Apple itself
21:40:49  * Lakie has heard Apple have been pretty odd about apps on their iOS over the last 12 months
21:40:54  <Rubidium>
21:40:56  <Webster> Title: An Analysis of the Impact of the FSF Apple Enforcement Action (at
21:41:21  <Rubidium> basically their terms of service violate GPLv2, so no GPLv2 apps are allowed on their store so all got scrubbed
21:41:42  <Lakie> Fair enough, not your faults, but the platform providers.
21:41:55  <Lakie> I think zodttd should refocus his complains. ;)
21:42:24  <Rubidium> but he's awfully silent since may 2010
21:42:49  <Lakie> Maybe he realized and is too ashamed to reappear for a while?
21:43:17  <Rubidium> <- that'll give him a good name as well
21:43:18  <Webster> Title: ZodTTD - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (at
21:44:19  <Lakie> Well, as I've pointed out to lecturers and such before, I find open source software kind of a mine field software development wise...
21:45:02  <Rubidium> software patents are an even bigger minefield
21:45:09  <Lakie> Though admittedly its more based on intented usage
21:45:14  <Lakie> The American ones??
21:45:25  <Lakie> Those are meant to be borderline stupidity..
21:45:31  <Rubidium> especially those, but I fear the European ones as well
21:45:36  <Lakie> :(
21:45:51  <Lakie> Eventually you won't even be able to write hello world apps
21:45:53  <Lakie> >_>
21:46:21  <Rubidium> *if* you did a search for whether your application violates a patent and you didn't find anything but there was something, then you're 100% liable for the infringement. If you didn't do the search, then it's a lesser offense
21:47:04  <Lakie> Eh?
21:47:21  <Lakie> But atleast you tried to avoid it in the first case rather than we don't care...
21:47:22  <Rubidium> yes, nasty... isn't it?
21:47:44  * Lakie thinks he might need to find a new industry to work in. ;_;
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21:48:32  <Rubidium> Lakie: well, other areas of expertise aren't not riddles with such minefields
21:48:42  <Lakie> Thats true
21:49:21  <Lakie> Though, it does seem to be all getting quite silly
21:49:42  <Lakie> Heh, that comment is so wrong...
21:49:53  <Lakie> You can't make a closed app from gpl'd material...
21:50:21  <Lakie> (I think lgpl and maybe zlibs you can but not gpl)
21:50:22  <andythenorth_> you can if you don't distribute
21:50:36  <Lakie> Then its pointless to do it? :)
21:50:48  <andythenorth_> depends what it is :)
21:50:58  <andythenorth_> I have missed whatever you are talking about, due to pub
21:51:48  <Rubidium> we'll stop. It's not after pub material
21:54:03  * Lakie shall now integrate his last two patches
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21:58:43  <planetmaker> good night
21:59:54  <Rubidium> night maker of planets
22:01:15  <Lakie> Night planetmaker#
22:01:53  *** thgergo has quit IRC
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22:11:20  <Brot6> Backup heqs: abort: no suitable response from remote hg!
22:17:35  *** andythenorth_ has joined #openttdcoop.devzone
22:18:04  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1720 (New): Fix offsets for mining trucks (andythenorth) @
22:53:43  <Brot6> GRFCodec - Revision 779:46f0a6f4855b: Fix: Prevent pcxfile::expirelines from reading more lines t... (Lakie) @
22:53:43  <Brot6> GRFCodec - Revision 780:c9e9dd665d49: Codechange: Moves the fseek from pcxfile into pcxread and p... (Lakie) @
22:53:43  <Brot6> GRFCodec - Revision 781:fb3eba13ce6a: Feature: Added -o argument for decoding, providing a mechan... (Lakie) @
22:53:47  <Brot6> GRFCodec - Revision 782:72e203eff1f1: Feature: Allows grfcodec (and renum) to accept and read PNG... (Lakie) @
22:53:51  <Brot6> GRFCodec - Revision 783:77145390debe: Feature: Allows grfcodec to generate PNG formatted spritesh... (Lakie) @
22:53:59  <Lakie> Mass highlight...
22:54:08  <Rubidium> yay! :)
22:54:52  <Lakie> grfcodec users everywherre rejoice, well many after an announcement, lols
22:55:50  <Lakie> huh, pull gives me 6 changesets. :/
22:56:08  <Brot6> GRFCodec - Revision 784:f921bf42a759: Add: libpng to the build dependencies of the rpm spec (Rubidium) @
22:56:13  <Lakie> Ah, ok
22:56:13  <Rubidium> yeah, I committed something as well :)
22:56:22  <Lakie> Cool. :)
22:56:33  * Lakie looks forward to a windows build, heh
22:58:16  <Rubidium> grfcodec's nightly runs at 01:00 UTC. It's done in like 5 minutes, so at ~01:10 UTC should be updated.
22:58:26  <Lakie> How convient
22:58:30  <Lakie> ;)
22:59:39  <Rubidium> actually, 01:00 UTC isn't 100% true. It's 03:00 CE[S]T (or Amsterdam time)
23:00:11  <Lakie> Awh, well I'll turn up eventually. :)
23:02:09  <Rubidium> now get the OpenGFX people "crazy" enough to use at least one png file for their 'Christmas' next release. That way most distros will have to update grfcodec and add libpng to the build dependencies :)
23:02:30  <Lakie> Hehe
23:03:17  <Lakie> Well, you can decompile it into five huge spritesheets, but I'm guessing they'll just convert all the pcx to pngs, once people realize
23:06:04  <Lakie> I'm tempted to take ogbx1_base decompile it into pcx, note the size, hack the code so the size and header are wrote first and then see how much difference there is when its all wrote in bands like pcx
23:16:35  <Lakie> Hmm... seems the pull didn't work as I don't have -o
23:16:41  * Lakie deletes and reclones
23:16:53  <Ammler> forgot update?
23:17:02  <Lakie> Its in the log on server
23:17:11  <Lakie> Just not on the repo I did hg pull on
23:17:24  <Lakie> Its in the newly cloned one too

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