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Log for #openttdcoop.devzone on 29th May 2011:
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06:56:22  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Airports - Revision 91:2e69e64ca0c5: Feature: Give the rotations of the small airport pr... (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/airportsplus/repository/revisions/2e69e64ca0c5
07:23:19  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Airports - Revision 92:611459c65bd3: Codechange: Rename the layouts for the concrete runway (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/airportsplus/repository/revisions/611459c65bd3
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08:09:31  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Industries - Bug #2674 (Closed): DevZone compile failed (compiler) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/2674
08:09:31  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Industries - Bug #2674 (Closed): DevZone compile failed (Terkhen) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/2674#change-6767
08:09:31  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Industries - Bug #2682 (New): Avoid having too much oil rigs under some conditions (Terkhen) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/2682
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09:45:36  <Yexo> <Ammler> Yexo: did you notice the nml setup error? <- what caused that?
09:45:48  <Yexo> friday night the nightly compiled fine
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11:11:36  <Ammler> Yexo: check my bug report
11:11:59  <Ammler> you had to fix the friday nightly
11:12:08  <Yexo> I read that, I was mostly surprised because it worked friday after my fix
11:12:22  <Ammler> so the rebuild with the builout addons was saturday the first time
11:12:40  <Yexo> <Brot6> nml: update from r1355 to r1359 done - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/nml/nightlies/r1359
11:12:46  <Yexo> ^^ is from friday
11:12:49  <Ammler> yep
11:12:52  <Ammler> nml is fine
11:13:00  <Ammler> but the setup wasn't
11:13:10  <Yexo> ah, ok ;)
11:13:13  <Ammler> so packages depending on nml can't build
11:14:30  <Ammler> http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/234/ <-- might fix it, but not tested
11:15:03  <Ammler> sincve I have no clue about python :-)
11:15:38  <Yexo> the pkg_resources module is part of setuptools
11:16:07  <Yexo> BuildRequires:  python-setuptools <- part of nml.spec
11:17:06  <Ammler> yep, but setup.py install doesn't add it to the package
11:17:20  <Yexo> it's not supposed to be part of the nml package
11:17:33  <Yexo> it is a different package that should already be installed on the system
11:17:38  <Ammler> the issue is similar to subfolders modules you made
11:17:44  <Yexo> no, it isn't
11:17:55  <Ammler> well, the error message looks like
11:18:32  <Ammler> it does rewrite the nmlc wrapper
11:18:45  <Yexo> yep
11:18:52  <Ammler> a workaround would be to make our own wrapper for rpms
11:19:06  <Yexo> http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/235/ bin/nmlc on my computer
11:19:30  <Ammler> also made with buildout?
11:19:42  <Yexo> according to http://rpm.pbone.net/index.php3/stat/4/idpl/11661797/dir/opensuse/com/python-setuptools-0.6c9-5.10.i586.rpm.html pkg_resources is part of python-setuptools
11:19:43  <Webster> Title: RPM Search OpenSuSE python-setuptools-0.6c9-5.10.i586.rpm (at rpm.pbone.net)
11:19:55  <Ammler> Yexo: yes it is
11:20:02  <Ammler> setup works
11:20:12  <Ammler> oh
11:20:19  <Ammler> I see what you mean
11:20:20  <Yexo> ImportError: No module named pkg_resources <- but apparently the module pkg_resources doesn't exist on the server
11:20:22  <Ammler> but that is sill
11:20:24  <Ammler> ysilly
11:20:43  <Ammler> well, so basically add setuptools as requires
11:20:55  <Yexo> that was my fix from friday night
11:21:01  <Yexo> before that the build failed, after that the build worked
11:21:05  <Yexo> but apparently not for other packages
11:21:09  <Yexo> oh, I see
11:21:13  <Yexo> as requires as well as build-requires
11:22:03  <Yexo> however on my computer it's not needed as at runtime
11:23:14  <Ammler> and why does your wrapper look that different to the one on suse?
11:23:33  <Ammler> you used setup.py too?
11:23:47  <Yexo> you should run bootstrap.py first
11:23:51  <Yexo> it'll create bin/nmlc
11:24:00  <Ammler> so why not do that in the spec? :-)
11:25:25  <Ammler> http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/236/
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11:27:36  <Ammler> shall I push a trigger a test?
11:27:45  <Yexo> hmm, the nmlc installed in /usr/local/bin looks like your version
11:28:02  <Yexo> so that is not the correct fix
11:28:30  <Alberth> Possible bug in OpenGFX+ Trains 0.2.5, smoke seems to be emitted in front of the engine:  http://devs.openttd.org/~alberth/smoke_early.png
11:29:34  <Ammler> mäh
11:29:35  <Alberth> SH'8P'
11:29:39  <Ammler> just pushed :-P
11:29:42  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 1360:781eb32bff55: Fix: run bootstrap.py before setup.py (Ammler) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/nml/repository/revisions/781eb32bff55
11:30:09  <Yexo> please revert, that's definitely incorrect
11:30:14  <Yexo> and not a fix for anything
11:31:44  <Ammler> I made a rollback as I am right on the server
11:32:08  <Ammler> so I don't think someone already pulled it
11:32:15  <Yexo> that just messes with the redmine interface
11:32:33  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Bug #2683 (New): 78 (compiler) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/2683
11:32:46  <Yexo> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/nml/repository/revisions/781eb32bff55 works, but after clicking on "view differences" you'll get an error message
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11:34:51  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Patch #2651: buildout for nml (Terkhen) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/2651#change-6757
11:35:04  <Ammler> that is because I did the rollback on devzone after the repo
11:35:05  <Terkhen> ?
11:35:07  <Ammler> check again
11:35:09  <Terkhen> oh, ok
11:36:49  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 1360:1c5e1fec45d9: Fix: add python-setuptools are runtime depende... (yexo) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/nml/repository/revisions/1c5e1fec45d9
11:37:24  <Yexo> Ammler: can you trigger some nml packages to see if they build now?
11:37:49  <Ammler> yep
11:38:39  <Brot6> nml: update from r1359 to r1360 done - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/nml/nightlies/r1360
11:39:26  <Ammler> igrnoe that ^
11:39:45  <Brot6> swisstowns: update from r22 to r22 done - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/swisstowns/nightlies/r22
11:40:11  <Ammler> hmm
11:44:18  <Ammler> it looks working
11:44:46  <Ammler> I thought, the 1360 is from my bootstrap fix
11:46:39  <Brot6> airportsplus: update from r90 to r92 done - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/airportsplus/nightlies/r92
11:46:56  <Brot6> Following repos didn't need a nightlies update: 2cctrainset (r750), 32bpp-extra (r40), ai-admiralai (r75), ai-aroai (r39), ailib-common (r21), ailib-direction (r17), ailib-list (r32), ailib-string (r29), ailib-tile (r16), basecosts (r25), belarusiantowns (r8), bros (r52), chips (r141), comic-houses (r71), firs (r1996), fish (r648), frenchtowns (r6), german-townnames (r34), grfcodec (r829), grfpack (r279), heqs (r605), indonesiantowns
11:46:56  <Brot6> (r41), manindu (r7), metrotrackset (r56), narvs (r37), newgrf_makefile (ERROR r293), nml (r1360), nutracks (r201), ogfx-industries (r107), ogfx-landscape (r68), ogfx-rv (r107), ogfx-rv.clone (r103), ogfx-trains (r241), ogfx-trees (r48), opengfx (r673), openmsx (r97), opensfx (r97), smts (r19), snowlinemod (r49), spanishtowns (r10), sub-landscape (ERROR r66), sub-opengfx (ERROR r666), swedishrails (r202), swisstowns (r22),
11:46:58  <Brot6> transrapidtrackset (r15), ttdviewer (r34), ttrs (r36), worldairlinersset (r672)
11:47:41  <Yexo> <Brot6> Following repos didn't need a nightlies update: <- so did those rebuild or not?
11:47:47  <Yexo> anyway, since airportsplus worked it seems fine
11:48:16  <Ammler> the rebuild is running and does delete the error bundles
11:48:45  <Brot6> newgrf_makefile: compile of r293 still failed (#2656) - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/newgrf_makefile/nightlies/ERROR/r293
11:48:46  <Ammler> (triggered a usual complete nightly build)
11:53:11  <Brot6> sub-landscape: compile of r66 still failed (#2616) - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/sub-landscape/nightlies/ERROR/r66
11:54:01  <Brot6> sub-opengfx: compile of r666 still failed (#2586) - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/sub-opengfx/nightlies/ERROR/r666
11:54:39  <Brot6> Following repos rebuilds successful without any difference to earlier nightlies builds: belarusiantowns (Diffsize: 30), frenchtowns, german-townnames, indonesiantowns (1 errors) (Diffsize: 1), manindu (Diffsize: 1), narvs, ogfx-industries, ogfx-landscape (Diffsize: 1096), ogfx-rv, ogfx-rv.clone (Diffsize: 1), ogfx-trains (Diffsize: 813), spanishtowns (Diffsize: 1), swedishrails (Diffsize: 259)
11:55:03  <Ammler> Yexo: all fine again :-P
11:55:09  <Yexo> great :)
11:55:13  <Yexo> thanks for the help
11:56:37  <Ammler> anyway, I am confused, why setuptools is needed for runtime
11:57:05  <Ammler> that looks unproper ;-)
11:57:49  <Yexo> nothing we can do about that
11:58:14  <Ammler> Terkhen: I saw that smoke issue also on the yacd server yesterday
11:58:29  <Terkhen> what smoke issue?
11:58:40  <Ammler> the one Alberth reported
11:58:51  <Terkhen> where?
11:58:54  <Alberth> which got lost in the brot spam :)
11:59:08  <Alberth> (13:29:12) Alberth: Possible bug in OpenGFX+ Trains 0.2.5, smoke seems to be emitted in front of the engine:  http://devs.openttd.org/~alberth/smoke_early.png
11:59:11  <Ammler> [13:28] <Alberth> Possible bug in OpenGFX+ Trains 0.2.5, smoke seems to be emitted in front of the engine:  http://devs.openttd.org/~alberth/smoke_early.png
11:59:17  <Ammler> mäh
11:59:20  <Terkhen> ah
11:59:31  <Alberth> you got my message earlier than me :)
11:59:32  <Ammler> Alberth: your or my clock in desync?
11:59:37  <Terkhen> that looks like a bug, yes
11:59:42  <Ammler> or big lag :-P
11:59:47  <Terkhen> but I don't know much about opengfx+ trains :)
11:59:52  * Alberth blames the Internets
11:59:54  <Ammler> ah indeed
11:59:59  <Ammler> this is pms grf
12:00:14  <Ammler> planetmaker: ^
12:05:15  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Bug #2681 (Closed): setup error (Ammler) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/2681
12:05:15  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Bug #2683 (Rejected): 78 (compiler) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/2683
12:05:15  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Bug #2683 (Rejected): 78 (yexo) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/2683#change-6768
12:05:15  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Bug #2681 (Closed): setup error (yexo) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/2681#change-6769
12:05:20  <Alberth> Terkhen: do you collect OpenGFX+ landscape 0.2.1 problems?  http://devs.openttd.org/~alberth/missing_fences.png  the radio tower seems to miss a few fences
12:05:52  <Ammler> Alberth: just make tickets :-P
12:05:54  <Terkhen> only for opengfx+ road vehicles and opengfx+ industries :)
12:06:03  <Terkhen> create a ticket, planetmaker will see it
12:06:06  <Yexo> Alberth: IIRC those fences are around the field, and the bug is in OpenTTD, not the grf
12:06:31  <planetmaker> radio towers indeed have no fences
12:06:31  <Alberth> that could be the case
12:07:07  <planetmaker> but opengfx+landscape could maybe try to add some ;-)
12:07:48  <planetmaker> but I'm not quite sure how well default objects are modify-able
12:08:15  <Ammler> [13:57] <Yexo> nothing we can do about that <-- well, we could use the old wrapper on linux
12:08:44  <Yexo> does it really matter?
12:08:47  <Yexo> it works now
12:09:07  <Alberth> if you drag a rail track through a field, you also get fences only at the north (west or east) side, so it is a general problem
12:10:02  <Ammler> no
12:14:11  <Yexo> see http://hg.openttd.org/openttd/trunk.hg/raw-file/tip/docs/landscape.html
12:14:29  <Yexo> class 0 (ground): there are only bits for fences on the SW and SE borders
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12:21:04  <Alberth> and object class has no fences
12:22:00  <Yexo> nope
12:22:08  <Yexo> same happens with an industry inside a farm field
12:25:01  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles - Bug #2684 (New): Lumber in bulk and in flatbed (Terkhen) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/2684
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13:29:29  <Yexo> Ammler: pulling from any repo fails: remote: *** failed to import extension hggit from ~/hg-git/hggit: No module named dulwich.errors
13:30:03  <Yexo> hmm, looks like the pull succeeds and that error is thrown afterwards
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14:53:54  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Industries - Code Review #2685 (New): english.lng remarks (Alberth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/2685
14:54:57  <Alberth> yeah yeah, I know Brot6
14:58:01  <Terkhen> :D
14:59:38  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Industries - Patch #2686 (New): dutch.lng addition (Alberth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/2686
15:01:22  <Terkhen> Alberth: thanks, we will check both of them later :)
15:01:42  <Alberth> yw :)
15:02:43  <Alberth> not that I will ever play with the dutch language enabled though :)
15:06:54  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Bug #2687 (New): SH'8P' emits smoke in front of the engine (Alberth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/2687
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15:57:59  <Ammler> he?
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16:54:29  <Rubidium> are there any other Norwegians in here on a regular basis besides DJNekkid?
16:54:39  <Rubidium> or should I say DJNekkid's bouncer?
17:17:28  <Brot6> Following repos didn't need a nightlies update: 2cctrainset (r750), 32bpp-extra (r40), ai-admiralai (r75), ai-aroai (r39), ailib-common (r21), ailib-direction (r17), ailib-list (r32), ailib-string (r29), ailib-tile (r16), airportsplus (r92), basecosts (r25), belarusiantowns (r8), bros (r52), chips (r141), comic-houses (r71), firs (r1996), fish (r648), frenchtowns (r6), german-townnames (r34), grfcodec (r829), grfpack (r279), heqs
17:17:28  <Brot6> (r605), indonesiantowns (r41), manindu (r7), metrotrackset (r56), narvs (r37), newgrf_makefile (ERROR r293), nml (r1360), nutracks (r201), ogfx-industries (r107), ogfx-landscape (r68), ogfx-rv (r107), ogfx-rv.clone (r103), ogfx-trains (r241), ogfx-trees (r48), opengfx (r673), openmsx (r97), opensfx (r97), smts (r19), snowlinemod (r49), spanishtowns (r10), sub-landscape (ERROR r66), sub-opengfx (ERROR r666), swedishrails (r202),
17:17:30  <Brot6> swisstowns (r22), transrapidtrackset (r15), ttdviewer (r34), ttrs (r36), worldairlinersset (r672)
17:18:40  <Brot6> newgrf_makefile: compile of r293 still failed (#2656) - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/newgrf_makefile/nightlies/ERROR/r293
17:19:20  <Brot6> sub-landscape: compile of r66 still failed (#2616) - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/sub-landscape/nightlies/ERROR/r66
17:20:09  <Brot6> sub-opengfx: compile of r666 still failed (#2586) - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/sub-opengfx/nightlies/ERROR/r666
18:04:53  * Alberth likes the differently coloured boxes at the opengfx flatbeds :)
18:08:35  <Terkhen> :)
18:08:47  <Terkhen> I should do random recolouring for the opengfx+ road vehicles boxes
18:14:43  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles - Bug #2676 (Closed): DevZone compile failed (compiler) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/2676
18:14:43  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles - Bug #2676 (Closed): DevZone compile failed (Terkhen) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/2676#change-6770
18:15:13  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles - Bug #2688 (New): Random recolouring (Terkhen) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/2688
18:42:51  <Terkhen> planetmaker: what do you think about #2682?
18:42:51  <Brot6> Terkhen: planetmaker: #2682 is http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/show/2682 "OpenGFX+ Industries - Bug #2682: Avoid having too much oil rigs under some conditions - #openttdcoop Development Zone"
18:43:56  <planetmaker> in one word? "nasty" :-P
18:44:28  <planetmaker> in principle it'd be a nice thing to solve. But how?
18:44:37  <planetmaker> Min. distance for game-generated industries?
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18:46:17  <Terkhen> only allow N industries of the same type in a X radius
18:46:27  <Terkhen> we would only do that for the oil rig
18:46:39  <Terkhen> it is more difficult to make other industries cluster like that
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18:52:40  <planetmaker> hm, yes, that's an idea, too. Clusters would be nice
18:53:30  <Terkhen> this would avoid huge clustering like the one in the picture, but it wouldn't avoid two or three oil rigs together
18:53:34  <Terkhen> I wonder if it is worth the effort
18:53:51  <planetmaker> :-)
18:53:57  <planetmaker> good question
18:55:40  <planetmaker> clustering in general would be a concept which could be nicely re-used, though
18:56:00  <planetmaker> it makes sense for farms and forests, too
18:56:20  <Terkhen> IMO clustering is nice for industries that produce small amounts of cargo... farms produce a lot, and forests already cluster a lot on arctic
18:56:31  <planetmaker> yes...
18:56:40  <planetmaker> true, default farms produce a lot
18:56:50  <planetmaker> they are capable of overloading small networks easily
18:57:04  <planetmaker> there are no small industries in vanilla openttd
18:59:36  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Industries - Bug #2666 (Closed): <invalid cargo> produced at tropical frams (Terkhen) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/2666#change-6771
18:59:36  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Industries - Revision 108:5fde5e50ec66: Fix #2666: Chain logic for the farm was incorrec... (Terkhen) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/ogfx-industries/repository/revisions/5fde5e50ec66
18:59:39  <Terkhen> I was wondering if it was worth to fix that bug
19:03:35  <Alberth> Terkhen: clustering of forests is the same issue as oilrigs, imho
19:03:52  <Terkhen> they could use the same template easily then
19:03:54  <Alberth> but less severe
19:04:07  <Alberth> perhaps the probability is less?
19:04:09  <Terkhen> I wonder if it is simple to code what I want to do, though
19:04:32  <Alberth> in C++ it is ;)
19:05:13  <Alberth> don't know whether you get a count of nearby industries
19:05:19  <Terkhen> oil rig has a ingame chance of 6, forests have 3 in temperate and 4 in arctic
19:07:10  <Terkhen> currently we have industry_count and industry_distance in NML... I'll check the newgrf specs
19:07:16  <planetmaker> 50% and 100% more ;-)
19:07:34  <Alberth> local search does seem to have a somewhat impact, instead of 2000 random locations, I now pick 10 locations, and search there 200 times in a 32x32 rectangle. In a test game I had 32 oilrigs, and now I have 21
19:08:04  <Alberth> with 10% water
19:08:38  <Terkhen> var 0x67 does not return "count within a given distance", just distance to closest industry and count of industries in the whole map, so it is not feasible use that fix
19:11:01  <planetmaker> in a certain sense industry_town_count is a 'region'
19:11:21  <Terkhen> there are many cases in which that will not work
19:11:25  <planetmaker> possibly one could scale that by map size and town number
19:32:44  <Alberth> eh, coal wagons also change in time, nice :)
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19:34:52  <Terkhen> planetmaker: where is random recolouring implemented in ogfx-trains?
19:35:27  <planetmaker> wagon_flatbed.pnml...
19:35:58  <Terkhen> thanks :)
19:36:05  <planetmaker> 135 and following
19:36:50  <planetmaker> but it's said to be not exactly correct, colours changing when trains turn after loading
19:36:51  <Terkhen> flatbed_wagon_random_colour_switch <--- are the constants defined in that switch the default company colours?
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19:36:54  <planetmaker> I didn't yet test
19:37:06  <planetmaker> yes, those are the recolour sprite numbers
19:37:10  <Terkhen> 0x307 and so on
19:37:12  <Terkhen> ok
19:37:27  <planetmaker> 0x307 is CC dark blue
19:37:36  <planetmaker> nml meanwhile has nicer constants
19:39:12  <planetmaker> http://hg.openttdcoop.org/nml/raw-file/tip/docs/refs.html#refs-palettes
19:40:06  <Terkhen> thank you :)
19:40:12  <Terkhen> those numbers look different from yours, though
19:40:26  <planetmaker> what you probably rather want is to (also) use base_sprite_2cc
19:40:33  <planetmaker> hex vs. decimal
19:40:44  <planetmaker> @base 16 10 307
19:40:44  <Webster> planetmaker: 775
19:40:46  <planetmaker> :-)
19:40:51  <Terkhen> oh, ok :)
19:41:19  <planetmaker> are the containers 2cc?
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19:41:55  <Terkhen> in ogfx-rv? yes
19:42:00  <Terkhen> right now they use 2cc
19:42:09  <Terkhen> but I think that random recolour is more appropiate for cointainers
19:42:48  <planetmaker> hm... I wonder whether you can get the CC. as you'll need base_sprite_2cc + cc*16 + random(16)
19:43:38  <planetmaker> the containers in ogfx+trains were written when 2cc base sprites were not quite known to me and not that nicely available in NML
19:45:22  <Terkhen> the code in ogfx-trains is easy to understand
19:45:29  <Terkhen> what does base_sprite_2cc do?
19:45:45  <Hirundo> It's the sprite number where the 2cc recolour sprites are loaded
19:46:30  <Terkhen> do I need special sprites for this?
19:47:29  <Hirundo> no, it's just that the 1cc recolour sprites are loaded in a constant location, while the 2cc recolour sprites are not
19:47:36  <planetmaker> no, they ... ^
19:47:49  <planetmaker> you want 2cc recolouring. not 1cc which I do with the containers basically
19:47:57  <planetmaker> it's a bit cheating what I do there ;-)
19:48:17  <Terkhen> I'll need to understand what is 2cc recolouring first then
19:48:30  <planetmaker> 1cc is clear? blue -> CC
19:48:39  <planetmaker> 2cc means blue -> CC and green -> 2CC
19:48:54  <planetmaker> thus you need to select the proper recolour sprite
19:49:14  <planetmaker> ogfx+trains only does 1cc random recolouring
19:49:32  <planetmaker> it doesn't show as the wagon then contains no cc ;-)
19:49:38  <Terkhen> hmm... I see
19:49:58  <Terkhen> it's not something short to do then
19:50:35  <Terkhen> I'll leave it for another day :)
19:50:41  <planetmaker> :)
19:50:52  <planetmaker> sorry for my cheating there :-)
19:50:58  <planetmaker> I didn't know better then
19:51:19  <frosch123> [21:39] <planetmaker> http://hg.openttdcoop.org/nml/raw-file/tip/docs/refs.html#refs-palettes <- nml could also make the s/STRUCT_GREY/NEWSPAPER/ change
19:51:35  <planetmaker> yep
19:51:51  <Alberth> planetmaker: would it be a good idea to make MPS Oil Tanker and CS-Inc. Oil Tanker graphically different?
19:52:23  <planetmaker> might be that it's not possible with a base set
19:54:49  <Terkhen> opengfx+ ships? :P
19:55:06  <Terkhen> it would only do that and updating the refits though, and everybody would keep using fish
19:55:40  <Alberth> opengfx+ vehicles :)
19:56:15  <planetmaker> Alberth: do you by chance have them on the screen?
19:56:21  <planetmaker> check the sprite numbers...
19:56:50  <planetmaker> I think they're the same. There's a frighter, an oil vessel, a smaller frighter and the hover craft
19:57:15  <planetmaker> http://mz.openttdcoop.org/opengfx/newgrf.php?1=3669:3700
19:57:46  <planetmaker> same actually for road vehicles... the new generation often uses same sprites
19:58:46  <planetmaker> but these things are one of the really annoying things when dealing with base sets. They simply are in some aspects ridiculously limited ;-)
19:59:21  <planetmaker> also, Alberth there once was an OpenGFX+ vehicles. Then we split it ;-)
20:00:23  <Alberth> in the autoreplace window they are the same indeed
20:00:45  <Alberth> so there is probably no room for a different look in the set
20:01:52  <planetmaker> nope :S
20:06:31  <Terkhen> :(
20:07:01  <planetmaker> but at some day, there'll be opengfx+ ships ;-)
20:07:08  <planetmaker> simply as it has to be
20:10:54  <Terkhen> refit and a new sprite for the tankers, anything else? :P
20:11:06  <Terkhen> adjustable costs I guess
20:17:38  <planetmaker> yes, that's mostly it
20:17:46  <planetmaker> as base line at least
20:18:10  <planetmaker> but then one can add such nice things as andy does with wakes when driving etc
20:21:10  <Terkhen> true
20:21:23  <Terkhen> but who will prefer default ships to newgrf sets? :P
20:21:38  <Terkhen> unless it has a switch for capacity too
20:29:11  <Alberth> how is a ship different from a train or a truck?
20:30:25  <Rubidium> Alberth: for (uint x = MapMaxX(); true; x--) {  <- the true can be left our
20:30:37  <Rubidium> e.g. for (;;) is perfectly valid as well
20:34:19  <planetmaker> Alberth: not in much. But default ships are very few and already offer refit capability
20:35:09  <Alberth> only 3 people talking to me at the same time :p
20:35:12  <Terkhen> default ships have too small capacity IMO
20:35:27  <Alberth> 4 :p
20:35:29  <planetmaker> well, for now the callings of my bed are too loud anyway :-)
20:35:30  <Terkhen> they are usable but FISH ships are better
20:35:33  <Terkhen> :)
20:35:46  <planetmaker> :-) yep, FISH makes OpenGFX+ ships not so tempting
20:35:51  <planetmaker> or urgent
20:36:14  <planetmaker> but so... good night :-)
20:36:38  <planetmaker> and Alberth: be happy. 0 people is worse if it lasts ;-)
20:37:29  <Alberth> Rubidium: yes, although I sort of like the 'true' there.
20:37:42  <Alberth> planetmaker: oh definitely. See you in a few days
20:38:07  <Terkhen> good night planetmaker
20:38:19  <Alberth> Terkhen: perhaps I should try FISH one time
20:39:19  <Terkhen> :)
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