Log for #openttdcoop.devzone on 26th December 2011:
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09:16:44  *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone
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11:33:47  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3402: Class 66 (Voyager1) @
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12:43:12  <planetmaker> hello andythenorth
12:43:21  <andythenorth> morning
12:43:22  <andythenorth> ish
12:43:35  <planetmaker> I'm currently pondering the merge of firs trunk to the 0.7 branch
12:43:49  <planetmaker> looking at all commits since the branch
12:44:02  <planetmaker> I stumbled (again) over the new cargo label for scrap metal
12:44:03  <andythenorth> I can't recall any reason not to
12:44:07  <andythenorth> yeah that
12:44:08  <andythenorth> :P
12:44:37  <andythenorth> please don't make me repeat the pain of discussing that specific label :(
12:44:41  <planetmaker> I wonder whether it should not get a new label - but keep the new classes. Though... there's no class 11 in the wiki yet either
12:44:59  <andythenorth> we have to change the label, it was told to me on irc by several people
12:45:02  <planetmaker> well... I know the reason to change classes. That's not what I want to discuss
12:45:24  <planetmaker> yes... but with the new carge refit properties?
12:45:53  <andythenorth> maybe that changes the situation
12:46:19  <planetmaker> that's what I wonder. I honestly am not sure
12:46:21  <andythenorth> I was told to change the label because I'd changed the classes, which can break sets that rely on the XOR masks
12:46:34  <planetmaker> yes, that's true, definitely
12:46:37  <andythenorth> despite that I was just making FIRS compliant with what the newgrf wiki told
12:46:42  <planetmaker> so far probably all sets rely on it
12:46:43  <andythenorth> (and what I thought the classes should be)
12:47:06  <andythenorth> it seems insane to me: I fix a 'bug' (making code comply with public docs in the wiki), but have to change the label
12:47:19  <andythenorth> however that's what resulted in new props :)
12:47:26  <planetmaker> :-)
12:47:33  <planetmaker> quite. And that's good imho
12:47:39  <planetmaker> very good
12:47:43  <planetmaker> makes classes useful again
12:47:49  <planetmaker> or better to handle
12:48:32  <planetmaker> the other thing I wondered, closely related: is the introduction of the neo-bulk class
12:49:16  <planetmaker> it defines a bit within the grf itself. But that's problematic, if it is not common standard. Should we just do that nevertheless...? Already?
12:49:57  <planetmaker> or change that according to Eddi's suggestion (where was it?)
12:55:50  <andythenorth> planetmaker: we should change everything to conform to Eddi's spec
12:56:07  <andythenorth> neo-bulk is unneeded, but introducing it forced some issues to get resolved ;)
12:57:59  <planetmaker> well... I could just edit the NewGRF wiki to add eddi's class expansion as "official" ;-)
12:58:06  <planetmaker> I'd dare to :-P
13:02:58  <andythenorth> you should
13:03:08  <andythenorth> it's been a long time now since discussion
13:05:37  <planetmaker> ok. I shall look into that then before I release anything :-)
13:06:30  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 877:4f77f1396792: Fix: wrong c&p caused building of releases to fail (Ammler) @
13:06:31  <andythenorth> YACS
13:06:38  <andythenorth> Yet Another Cargo Schema
13:06:56  <Brot6> BANDIT - Bug #3405 (Closed): Can't create articulated RV with more than 1 trailer (andythenorth) @
13:06:56  <Brot6> BANDIT - Bug #3405 (Closed): Can't create articulated RV with more than 1 trailer (andythenorth) @
13:07:00  <planetmaker> thanks, Ammler :-)
13:07:02  <andythenorth> I tried to persuade eddi to be the dictator of YACS, but he seems reluctant
13:07:38  <planetmaker> yes. I'm happy to take the heat of you-know-who :-P
13:07:43  <andythenorth> because the technical spec allows for flexibility, the actual spec of a cargo compatibility scheme needs looking after by someone
13:08:14  <andythenorth> I think MB is actually actually more realistic about it than we give him credit for
13:08:24  <Ammler> planetmaker: I let you do the merge, as I have no clue how you manage that
13:08:43  <planetmaker> ok
13:08:49  <andythenorth> I just think we should declare a named schema, that isn't ECS (as that has two problems), and then sets are either YACS compliant, or 'some other thing compliant'
13:08:57  <Rubidium> planetmaker: I guess is needed then, right? ;)
13:08:58  <planetmaker> you could simply commit it to both branches, though ;-)
13:09:08  <andythenorth> and then we can mark some classes as not YACS compliant (e.g. oversized, hazardous)
13:09:15  <Ammler> but it is kind of useless branch yet
13:09:32  <planetmaker> Rubidium: for OpenTTD 1.3.x, yes
13:10:08  <Ammler> you could also simply start the branch, when you start working on incompatible things
13:10:29  <planetmaker> hm... well. no, right. OpenTTD 1.2.0 will work with all OpenGFX. Sorry
13:10:52  <planetmaker> Rubidium: and what would older installers do?
13:10:59  <planetmaker> get an imcompatible OpenGFX?
13:11:15  <Rubidium> they get an older version
13:11:21  <Rubidium> e.g. 0.4.0 instead of 0.5.0
13:11:40  <planetmaker> how do they know?
13:12:08  <Rubidium> they're asking for opengfx- instead of opengfx-
13:12:26  <planetmaker> ah. that's how it works. Yes
13:12:36  <Rubidium> which are symlinks to versions that are supposed to support that version of OpenTTD
13:12:37  <planetmaker> Then I guess it can be committed now
13:19:53  <andythenorth> planetmaker: anything I can help with for FIRS release?
13:20:40  <planetmaker> changelog maybe?
13:20:51  <planetmaker> or checking the readme?
13:21:06  <planetmaker> I haven't yet done either, tbh
13:21:24  <planetmaker> but... I'll also be happy, if you just draw nice stuff for the next release ;-)
13:24:04  <andythenorth>
13:26:28  * Rubidium thinks andythenorth might be able to fix #3021 ;)
13:26:28  <Brot6> Rubidium: #3021 is "FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #3021: German translation - #openttdcoop Development Zone"
13:28:05  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 878:5a494d2e2d48: Backport: r877:4f77f1396792 (planetmaker) @
13:28:33  <planetmaker> lol @ Rubidium :-)
13:28:55  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #3396 (Closed): DevZone compile failed (compiler) @
13:28:55  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #3396 (Closed): DevZone compile failed (planetmaker) @
13:29:38  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #3406 (New): change grf version to v8 (planetmaker) @
13:30:10  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Feature #3407 (New): change palette to DOS (planetmaker) @
13:32:28  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Code Review #3408 (New): remove deprecated stuff (planetmaker) @
13:35:52  <andythenorth> planetmaker: do you want to merge the branches before I commit anything further?
13:41:21  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 879:860156bc677e: Change #3408: No minimum version check required for canal water (planetmaker) @
13:41:21  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 880:66fcba44f2d9: Change #3408: No minimum version check required for river wa... (planetmaker) @
13:41:21  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 881:39670c29de93: Codechange #3408: Rename a few identifiers as there's no new... (planetmaker) @
13:44:01  <Rubidium> planetmaker: you ought to change the initial version check ;)
13:44:24  <planetmaker> I should change much more, yes :-)
13:44:40  <Rubidium> yeah, but before you remove the other version checks
13:45:05  <planetmaker> quite true
13:46:25  <planetmaker> good point :-)
13:49:59  <Brot6> BANDIT - Revision 45:fd81504f2f10: Codechange: use built-ins for length, not ints (andythenorth) @
13:50:19  <planetmaker> there it goes :-)
13:50:29  <planetmaker> and silently ttdp compatibility gone, too ;-)
13:50:55  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 882:4a4caf8222b8: Change #3408: Update initial version check to require OpenTT... (planetmaker) @
13:53:24  <Ammler> planetmaker: then it might be good idea to remove the building and publishing of it
13:53:45  <planetmaker> yes
13:53:53  <planetmaker> one step at a time
13:54:01  <planetmaker> help is welcome, though :-)
13:55:52  <planetmaker> I hope / assume you agree that those bundles are meanwhile only work and no gain, right?
13:56:08  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 883:4e30674f11d0: Change #3408: Remove deprecated engine overrides (planetmaker) @
13:57:05  <Ammler> well, right now, removing is work :-P
13:57:27  <planetmaker> :-P
13:57:32  <planetmaker> but grf v8 is not supported there
13:57:46  <planetmaker> and nml 0.3 will produce that - something you approve of, right? :-)
13:58:04  <planetmaker> thus I'm in the process of giving you your Christmas present ;-)
14:00:29  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 884:2708054aaaa7: Change: stop building and publishing ttdp bundles (grf v8) (Ammler) @
14:04:41  <Ammler> planetmaker: what I last working version the 0.4 branch?
14:04:48  <Ammler> is*
14:05:07  <Ammler> I would like to make a "final" post on the ogfx patch thread
14:05:08  <planetmaker> for ttdp and old openttd? yes
14:05:16  <planetmaker> ogfx patch thread?
14:05:25  <Ammler> ogfx for ttdpatch thread
14:05:33  <planetmaker> yes. There'll be some future 0.4.x releases next year
14:05:48  <Ammler> those will still be v7, right?
14:05:50  <planetmaker> yes
14:06:01  <planetmaker> it will really be discontinued 2013 or so
14:06:18  <Ammler> yeah, well, 0.4 branch does still build those
14:08:31  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 885:e3fbf9be59f5: Change #3408: Don't build bundles which won't work anyway (planetmaker) @
14:08:50  <planetmaker> oh
14:16:44  <planetmaker> there. merge nicely hidden :-P
14:17:16  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 886:9ff852b89d61: Change #3408: Don't check for platform for newer action5 types (planetmaker) @
14:20:38  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Feature #2921: Connexxion 5001 graphics (foobar) @
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14:25:40  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 887:0c0dfbe12d33: Cleanup #3408: Snowy temperate trees are not supported by Op... (planetmaker) @
14:29:46  <planetmaker> Ammler: the 'requires' file in OpenGFX: can it also differ for nightly and releases?
14:30:02  <planetmaker> Can I just create such file in the nightlies and releases folder and have them differently?
14:32:39  <Ammler> do it like with files
14:33:02  <Ammler> keep one in .build an the other in nightlies
14:34:00  <Ammler> but why you need to differ?
14:34:37  <Ammler> 0.4 branch will not use those
14:36:28  <Leroot> Are autosaves created when running from an emergency save also considered emergency saves? I fixed a crash bug, but if it crashes for another reason down the line, I'd rather it not tell me "this is a crash save so i'm not going to generate a new one" =)
14:38:59  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 888:3477d97b2d22: Cleanup #3408: OpenTTD does not support action5, feature 0x0... (planetmaker) @
14:39:38  <planetmaker> Ammler: the difference is that OpenGFX nightly can now again require nml default branch (nightlies). While OpenGFX releases want to require nml 0.2 branch
14:40:15  <planetmaker> but... true actually. Why should I differ... I just remove the 'releases' in the default branch and will keep it in the 0.4 branch. stupid me :-)
14:40:21  <Ammler> but didn't you create 0.4 branch for that puropose?
14:40:27  <planetmaker> yup :-)
14:40:38  <Ammler> no
14:40:44  <planetmaker> hm?
14:40:48  <Ammler> keep releases, it might be required for 0.5
14:40:59  <planetmaker> what? the 0.2.x branch? No, won't
14:40:59  <Ammler> it does not hurt
14:41:08  <Ammler> hmm
14:41:15  <Ammler> we might talk about different things
14:41:28  <planetmaker> well: OpenGFX 0.4.x will need NML 0.2.x
14:41:37  <Ammler> yes, remove ;releases from default require file
14:41:45  <planetmaker> OpenGFX default branch will need nml nightly
14:42:10  <Ammler> yep
14:42:13  <planetmaker> ok
14:42:15  <planetmaker> thx
14:43:04  <Ammler> I thought, you want to remove the releases "build-branch" from default
14:43:52  <Ammler> but there are no custom things in it anyway
14:43:58  <Ammler> those are in nightlies
14:44:13  <planetmaker> no, I just wanted to do what I just comitted. And wondered if that's sane :-)
14:44:53  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 889:3041c5c7b362: Codechange #3406: Build OpenGFX nightlies with NML nightlies... (planetmaker) @
14:45:19  <Ammler> planetmaker: btw. we should also add arch targets to the binary bundles
14:45:23  <Ammler> like openttd
14:45:36  <Ammler> and then remove -source from source bundles
14:47:38  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 890:2f8da993a3d2: Codechange #3407: Switch to to DOS palette (planetmaker) @
14:48:15  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Feature #3407 (Closed): change palette to DOS (planetmaker) @
14:48:15  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Feature #3407 (Closed): change palette to DOS (planetmaker) @
14:48:46  <planetmaker> That might be a good idea, Ammler
14:49:02  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #3406 (Closed): change grf version to v8 (planetmaker) @
14:49:47  <planetmaker> <-- though if you look there, the naming of the download file also is ...-source.blub
14:50:00  <Ammler> remove "-source" can be done later, more important is the step to add arch targets to the bundles
14:50:20  <Ammler> planetmaker: yes, as said ^
14:50:54  <Ammler> I guee, that openttd will fix that issue won't happen ;-)
14:50:56  <planetmaker> well... I'm not entirely sure what you mean exactly.
14:51:27  <Ammler> <-- "-all"
14:52:08  <Ammler> <package>-<version>.ext is source bundle
14:52:52  <planetmaker> oh, of opengfx
14:53:29  <Ammler> well, or your framework
14:54:35  <Ammler> it is a general naming issue on our devzone
14:55:16  <planetmaker> I still think that I name the things the same way as openttd distributes its bundles
14:55:17  <Ammler> adding "-source" might not hurt, but using the common source name policy for binaries might be :-)
14:55:38  <Ammler> planetmaker: we don't
14:55:51  <Ammler> openttd adds "-all" or "-any" or whatever
14:56:22  <planetmaker>
14:56:34  <planetmaker> sounds pretty much like what we create, no?
14:56:35  <Ammler> that is halfish fine :_)
14:57:07  <Ammler>
14:57:18  <Ammler> this isn't a source bundle
14:57:23  <planetmaker> that's the binary, yes
14:57:32  <Ammler> yep, but with name policy for source bundles
14:57:47  <Ammler> openttd calls such file
14:57:55  <planetmaker> what would the naming policy for binaries be?
14:58:13  <planetmaker> hm, ah
14:58:18  <Ammler> in this case "-all"
14:58:28  <Ammler> It does not really matter what you add, I guess
14:58:31  <planetmaker> ok, I see what you mean
14:58:34  <Ammler> important is that you add something
14:58:48  <planetmaker> or -noarch
14:58:54  <Ammler> yep
14:59:12  <planetmaker> but let's keep it the same as openttd
14:59:48  <planetmaker> that should then be done for the framework itself
14:59:49  <Ammler> -noarch is just for arch, it does not tell the os behind
15:00:15  <Ammler> so "-all" does not sound that bad
15:01:48  <planetmaker> agreed
15:05:53  <Brot6> NewGRF build framework - Bug #1869 (Closed): naming of bundle files for releases fails (planetmaker) @
15:07:24  <Brot6> NewGRF build framework - Bug #1332: Separate names for binary and source distribution (planetmaker) @
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15:24:20  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 88:2155086ba4c7: Feature: Connexxion 5001 graphics by Bastiaan (closes ... (foobar) @
15:24:20  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 89:bde2bb27dd8a: Feature: sort the purchase list (closes #2920) (foobar) @
15:24:20  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 90:824369a9a7a7: Codechange: use spaces instead of tabs for templates.p... (foobar) @
15:24:22  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 91:9b4defccf472: Add: some more photoshop tools (foobar) @
15:24:25  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Feature #2921 (Closed): Connexxion 5001 graphics (foobar) @
15:24:28  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Feature #2920 (Closed): Sort vehicle list (foobar) @
15:27:00  <Brot6> dutchtramset: compile of r91 still failed (#3355) -
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15:45:10  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Feature #3409 (New): move to GRFv8 (foobar) @
15:45:26  <planetmaker> :-)
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15:49:05  <Brot6> repository /home/hg/gs-tutorial registered in Redmine with url /home/hg/gs-tutorial
15:49:05  <Brot6> repository /home/hg/gs-tutorial created
15:49:52  <planetmaker> \o/
16:00:19  <planetmaker> 15:36 Leroot: Are autosaves created when running from an emergency save also considered emergency saves? I fixed a crash bug, but if it crashes for another reason down the line, I'd rather it not tell me "this is a crash save so i'm not going to generate a new one" =) <-- did you try?
16:00:46  <planetmaker> normally a crash.sav should start paused, so one could create a save manually
16:17:47  <LordAro> "Error creating thumbnail: sh: /usr/bin/convert: not found" <-- on the wiki
16:18:40  <planetmaker> which wiki?
16:18:50  <LordAro> 'our' wiki ;)
16:18:54  <LordAro>
16:19:21  <planetmaker> in an openttdcoop channel that's not exactly unambigeous 'our' ;-)
16:19:34  <planetmaker> there's also
16:19:41  <planetmaker> and the devzone has wiki pages, too
16:19:58  <LordAro> oh, woops wrong channel :)
16:20:29  <LordAro> shall i repeat it in #openttd so TB sees?
16:20:36  <planetmaker> nor do I see that error message anywhere
16:20:55  <LordAro>
16:22:16  <planetmaker> yes, then tell that TB with that link ;-)
16:22:59  <planetmaker> btw, LordAro: something important is missing: the construction stages tracker
16:23:06  <planetmaker> it needs all sprites... not just finished state
16:23:24  <LordAro> i know, i know
16:23:34  <LordAro> i was just fixing something that was already broken
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16:31:07  <planetmaker> Yexo: I just mailed Zephyris, asking for all his blender files :-) He must have MANY ;-)
16:33:40  <LordAro> indeed
16:42:12  <Yexo> planetmaker: thanks, I hope to get around to do some work on that later this week
16:43:27  <Brot6> BANDIT - Revision 46:79bf3db03608: Change: clean up some more structure and add some test vehicles (andythenorth) @
16:46:22  <planetmaker> so do I :-)
16:46:51  <planetmaker> but I know already it won't be tomorrow or the day after
16:53:26  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 92:1b084c0623ff: Feature: version check, require OpenTTD 1.0.0 (foobar) @
16:53:26  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 93:9de7cf9f4272: Feature: new BRU livery for connexxion 5001 (foobar) @
16:53:26  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 94:b8c2f8ffe41a: Fix (r92): we should actually require to b... (foobar) @
16:55:30  <Brot6> dutchtramset: compile of r94 still failed (#3355) -
17:02:32  <andythenorth> planetmaker: wrt FIRS changelog - I wrote a changelog for 0.7 beta.  I guess it needs updating after we merge 0.7 branch with trunk
17:03:18  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Bug #3411 (New): tractive effort coefficient (foobar) @
17:03:48  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3412 (New): ACTS 6700 (Voyager1) @
17:05:10  <planetmaker> yes, I guess so, too, andythenorth ;-)
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17:29:52  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Bug #3413 (New): cargo capacity in purchase menu (foobar) @
17:42:24  <Brot6> opengfx: update from r875 to r890 done (1 warnings) -
17:43:30  <Brot6> bandit: update from r30 to r46 done -
17:53:17  <Brot6> cets: update from r441 to r445 done (217 warnings) -
17:59:39  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Airports - Revision 152:7733038cd355: Fix: Runway lights for runway 13 (dnicholls) @
18:02:30  <Brot6> nutracks: compile of r210 still failed (#3387) -
18:08:36  <Brot6> dutchtramset: compile of r94 still failed (#3355) -
18:16:29  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 95:fa0ad1866a9d: Codechange: move sprite templates file (foobar) @
18:16:29  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 96:764bbe6f6f9a: Codechange: use new style callbacks for 'other' vehicl... (foobar) @
18:16:30  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 97:c6bca571ac28: Fix (r96): also remove callback flags property (foobar) @
18:16:32  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 98:d792af9805ec: Codechange: use new style callbacks for GVB vehicles a... (foobar) @
18:16:35  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 99:003276542fe6: Codechange: use new style callbacks for RET vehicles a... (foobar) @
18:16:39  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 100:33b1262e0021: Codechange: use new style callbacks for HTM vehicles ... (foobar) @
18:24:22  <Brot6> airportsplus: update from r151 to r152 done -
18:24:25  <Brot6> Following repos rebuilds successful without any difference to earlier nightlies builds: ogfx-trains, ogfx-industries, firs (24 warnings), foobarstramtracks (Diffsize: 37132), manindu (Diffsize: 2), newgrf_makefile (Diffsize: 12), dutchtrains, rust (Diffsize: 188), ogfx-biggui (Diffsize: 30), swisstowns (Diffsize: 43), dutchroadfurniture (Diffsize: 8632), spanishtowns (Diffsize: 8), frenchtowns (Diffsize: 21), ogfx-rv, ogfx-landscape (2
18:24:25  <Brot6> warnings), swedishrails, german-townnames (Diffsize: 51), dach (Diffsize: 10855), belarusiantowns (Diffsize: 64), indonesiantowns (1 warnings) (Diffsize: 29)
18:25:14  <Brot6> dutchtramset: compile of r100 still failed (#3355) -
19:03:16  <Brot6> 32bpp-ez-patches: compile of r23674 still failed (#2446) -
19:11:30  <andythenorth> planetmaker: forwarded you a pm
19:12:02  <planetmaker> aye
19:13:12  <planetmaker> the only cargo I see use for is maybe building materials
19:13:20  <planetmaker> for the FIRS cargos
19:13:25  <planetmaker> but... that feels odd
19:13:28  <andythenorth> yup
19:13:48  <andythenorth> it's valid for building materials though
19:13:56  <andythenorth> where's eddi's list?
19:14:12  <planetmaker> well. For a small minority of building materials imho. But if it makes happy faces.
19:14:14  <planetmaker> Not sure though
19:14:45  <planetmaker> mostly I'd rather add it to grain, if at all
19:16:23  <andythenorth> powder is only supposed to be combined with bulk
19:16:32  <andythenorth> these extra classes are just a mess imho :P
19:16:48  <planetmaker> yes.
19:16:49  <andythenorth> they should be stripped back / ignored, as  per pikka suggestion ages ago.
19:17:11  <planetmaker> as said, I don't see any cargo in FIRS which would really fit into that category
19:17:12  <andythenorth> can we persuade eddi to commit his draft?
19:17:20  <andythenorth> so at least all are talking about same uses
19:20:23  <planetmaker> I'll just change that
19:24:22  <planetmaker> what about the 'not pourable'?
19:24:29  <planetmaker> i.e. your 'neo bulk'?
19:25:08  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 101:c3d2193bcea2: fix (r96,r98,r100): remove some more callback flag pr... (foobar) @
19:25:08  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Bug #3355 (Closed): DevZone compile failed (foobar) @
19:27:26  <andythenorth> planetmaker: eddi was quite determined to keep that
19:27:41  <planetmaker> then I keep it
19:27:46  <Brot6> dutchtramset: update from r87 to r101 done -
19:31:47  <planetmaker> well: just tell then, that you'll support them :-). You will :-P
19:31:56  <planetmaker> not using them is also support ;-)
19:32:15  <planetmaker> but we then should re-visit classes before the 0.7.0
19:32:40  <andythenorth> yup
19:33:52  <andythenorth> planetmaker 01/01/12 release?
19:34:01  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Feature #3409: move to GRFv8 (yexo) @
19:34:02  <andythenorth> or 31/12/11
19:34:04  <planetmaker> maybe
19:34:42  <planetmaker> I've a merge of default to 0.7. Maybe I should just commit that. Though I'd like to fix this issue first
19:36:28  <andythenorth> which issue?
19:36:53  <planetmaker> the cargo classes
19:37:04  <planetmaker> we should look which cargos get the new ones
19:37:08  <andythenorth> ok
19:37:09  <planetmaker> esp. neo-bulk might fit
19:37:11  <andythenorth> maybe later today?
19:37:17  <andythenorth> I am bathing the toddler right now
19:37:40  <planetmaker> :-) Maybe, I can't promise. I must pack a bit stuff, I'm away till late 28th
19:38:00  <planetmaker> but I'll be online in any case tonight
19:45:09  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Feature #3409 (Assigned): move to GRFv8 (foobar) @
19:53:44  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Airports - Revision 153:bab450a7f758: Fix: Compatibility with NewGRF v8 / NML 0.3.x: (a)... (dnicholls) @
19:57:24  <planetmaker> hm, that was possibly a broken commit
19:58:42  <Yexo> wouldn't it be better to just copy the groundsprite template from firs/opengfx+industries?
19:58:53  <Yexo> afaik the exact same code can be used, that makes maintenance easier
20:03:21  <planetmaker> yes
20:03:42  <planetmaker> but I think the change of the temp variable might be problematic. Not sure though
20:08:26  <andythenorth> planetmaker: bath done
20:08:28  <andythenorth> MB reply done
20:08:36  <andythenorth> it's either FIRS or BANDIT...
20:08:37  <andythenorth> :)
20:09:06  <planetmaker> :-)
20:14:39  <andythenorth> planetmaker: you want to review all classes?
20:15:06  <planetmaker> we might as well do that, yes
20:15:10  <andythenorth> hmm
20:15:18  <andythenorth> also Eddi's proposal changed Express to Air Freight
20:15:20  <planetmaker> but... might be too much pain, right now
20:15:25  <planetmaker> I didn't keep that name
20:15:25  <andythenorth> that's going to cause argument :o
20:15:40  <planetmaker> I kept 'express'
20:15:42  <planetmaker> or didn't I?
20:15:47  <andythenorth> you didn't :)
20:16:06  <planetmaker> :-O I thought I did
20:16:28  <andythenorth>
20:17:18  <planetmaker> yes, I did. Keep the name but also the (new) definition
20:17:52  <andythenorth> I'm looking at the wrong page
20:17:57  <andythenorth> sorry
20:18:13  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Airports - Revision 154:9b5ccc61afd1: Fix: Clipping through SW hangar due to undersize b... (dnicholls) @
20:26:49  <andythenorth> planetmaker: we should look at classes - but only if you have time
20:35:35  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 102:962e1cc67cdd: Codechange: use CB_RESULT_NO_MORE_ARTICULATED_PARTS i... (foobar) @
20:35:35  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 103:eede148c57a4: Codechange: require GRFv8 capable OpenTTD (closes #3409) (foobar) @
20:35:35  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 104:0ff7309b9a35: Docs: move building from source documentation to sepa... (foobar) @
20:35:37  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 105:830d2fe62317: Fix: cargo capacity display in purchase menu (closes ... (foobar) @
20:35:43  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Bug #3413 (Closed): cargo capacity in purchase menu (foobar) @
20:35:46  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Feature #3409 (Closed): move to GRFv8 (foobar) @
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21:04:06  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 106:ffae3c8b434d: Fix: TE coefficients were way too high (closes #3411) (foobar) @
21:04:06  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Bug #3411 (Closed): tractive effort coefficient (foobar) @
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21:05:52  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 107:2c22395ba2df: Codechange: set min compatible version to allow compa... (foobar) @
21:05:52  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Feature #2904 (Closed): Make compatible with RC (foobar) @
21:16:13  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 108:f76ac27dab3e: Update: translations (issue #2922) (foobar) @
21:43:20  <Brot6> DACH Trains - Bug #3414 (New): New Vehicles (Yoshi) @
21:43:59  <Brot6> DACH Trains - Feature #3414 (New): New Vehicles (Yoshi) @
22:04:31  <planetmaker> sounds good, andythenorth
22:04:34  <planetmaker> (the pm)
22:05:09  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 109:7f9ab265594a: Feature: ingame link to devzone (foobar) @
22:05:09  <Brot6> Dutch Tram Set - Revision 110:66f36d9058e7: Feature: Dutch version of readme (foobar) @
22:06:15  <LordAro> where's the sprite-tracker-thing on
22:07:11  <planetmaker>
22:07:16  <planetmaker> it's part of opengfx
22:08:10  <LordAro> ty
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22:14:48  <andythenorth> planetmaker: you away the next few days then?
22:16:06  <planetmaker> yes, let's ship it around new year
22:21:08  <andythenorth> k
22:21:11  <andythenorth> only three tickets
22:21:34  <andythenorth> although we should look at #3235 as well
22:21:34  <Brot6> andythenorth: #3235 is "FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #3235: Thoughts on classes - #openttdcoop Development Zone"
22:21:57  <andythenorth> I've added it to 0.7.0 milestone
22:22:30  <andythenorth> now 5 tickets :P
22:23:34  <planetmaker> is changing default cargos really a no-go?
22:27:57  <andythenorth> if we use their label, yes we must never do that
22:28:08  <andythenorth> no idea why, other than we must not :)
22:28:29  <planetmaker> it's again the refit thing for vehicles which don't use the new properties
22:28:42  <planetmaker> so yes, we should not
22:43:51  <andythenorth> planetmaker: was there a good reason to think of changing default classes?
22:45:07  <planetmaker> more appropriate according to how they "should be used"
22:45:31  <planetmaker> but other than that: not
22:46:49  <andythenorth> there are some anachronisms iirc
22:46:59  <andythenorth> but we have to live with them, or define our own labels
22:49:27  <planetmaker> yes, agreed
22:49:38  <planetmaker> we should not change them
22:50:08  <planetmaker> I just had to reflect on the issue again :-)
22:50:19  <planetmaker> good that we talked about it. It helped
22:52:17  <andythenorth> sugar cane remains puzzling
22:52:21  <andythenorth> it's uncountable
22:52:24  <andythenorth> but doesn't flow
22:53:15  <andythenorth> so should get bit 12 I guess
22:53:34  <andythenorth> but is also countable when bailed
22:53:43  <andythenorth> so piece, bulk, not pourable
22:55:04  <andythenorth> but setting piece is likely to lead to it travelling by box van
22:55:09  <andythenorth> which is dubious
22:56:16  <andythenorth> it could set also oversized, but that's a thoroughly stupid class
22:57:01  <planetmaker> well. it's classes. Not everything can fit 100% and you can always special-handle it
22:57:08  <planetmaker> adding bit12 to that one makes sense
22:57:22  <andythenorth> I think it's bulk + not pourable
22:57:32  <andythenorth> then set authors that don't want it in hoppers can handle it
22:57:39  <planetmaker> good
22:57:41  <andythenorth> it's arguably not going to work as piece goods
22:57:55  <planetmaker> then we use that. done :-)
22:57:59  <planetmaker> one cargo solved
22:58:24  <andythenorth> for some reason 'bulk + EXCLUDE not pourable' makes total sense for hoppers, but 'piece + EXCLUDE oversized' makes no sense for vans
22:58:34  <andythenorth> dunno why, the logic is identical for both
23:02:21  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Code Review #3218: sugar cane cargo classes (andythenorth) @
23:04:48  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature Request #3415 (New): Consider 'powder' class for BDMT (andythenorth) @
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