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00:18:40 <Brot6> DictatorAI - Revision 263:fcabe38cea31: - Fix trying to remove some tiles not own by us when removin... XkrinnX @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/ai-dictator/repository/revisions/fcabe38cea31 00:23:02 *** Zuu has quit IRC 07:27:22 *** Zuu has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 10:15:21 *** Yoshi has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 10:15:28 <Yoshi> Good morning :D 10:16:07 *** KenjiE20 has quit IRC 10:16:32 <Yoshi> Rubidium: though... how do you synchronise A and B? 10:16:48 <Yoshi> I don't use the animation function of objects... 10:17:17 <Yoshi> I use the general variable "animation_counter" for calculating the frames... 10:17:31 <Yoshi> sprite: gfxtest(animation_counter % 32) 10:19:43 <planetmaker> Yoshi, that was Rubi's point yesterday: even if you know the absolute coordinates, there's no way to sync animation of two objects 10:20:13 <planetmaker> thus the absolute coordinates alone wouldn't help you either 10:22:17 <planetmaker> and please let me ask you again and think about the answer: what's wrong with creating an object of size 1x5 tiles which is the whole thing? 10:23:14 <planetmaker> of course every mountain is different. But so is every tile 10:23:48 <planetmaker> and like my "company land", I also use it on every tile. But you can build the cable car on the ground as 1x5 tile object and retain the complete shape of the mountain 10:23:54 <planetmaker> thus it would fit the mountains just as well 10:25:27 <planetmaker> after all: for single-tile objects you need the ground awareness. So you can do that for the multi-tile version just as well 10:27:24 <planetmaker> you could offer cable lifts of different lengths then 10:28:18 <Yoshi> http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=167197 10:28:49 <Yoshi> When i use "animation_counter" it IS synchronised.... 10:29:36 <Yoshi> Because it doesn't use individual animations.... 10:31:18 <Yoshi> Maybe those preset tiles are a solution.... 10:32:02 <Yoshi> But the original idea was to make it as a "puzzle" so you can add special tiles with ski slopes or something like this.... 10:39:08 <planetmaker> though I think the sync here is using an implementation detail which is not guaranteed to remain... it works. Is there thus an issue remaining? 10:41:06 <Yoshi> With that solution i can't define which tile is in state A(start at frame 0) and which is in state B (start at frame 16) 10:41:12 <Yoshi> The rest works... 10:42:10 <planetmaker> eh? You always know the exact animation frame... Just display the proper animation frame for tiles. You don't need to know the state of others, if they all go in sync? 10:43:19 <planetmaker> think of the animation_counter as a global clock. Just look at that. from each tile 10:43:32 <planetmaker> that gives you the sync. As it gives you info at which state each tile should be at 10:43:42 <planetmaker> you just need to know the sequence of your tiles 10:44:57 <Yoshi> yes 10:45:06 <Yoshi> that syn thing works... 10:45:10 <Yoshi> sync* 10:45:19 <planetmaker> but...? 10:46:47 <planetmaker> if you have object A which shall loop 0...16 while object B shall loop 8...16 and then 0...7 (50% offset), that's easy to implement then, too. 10:47:08 <Yoshi> My hope was, that i can place the same object at position (100|28) and (100|29) and it automaticaly uses the proper state A or B 10:47:42 <planetmaker> ah... well. yes. 10:48:17 <Yoshi> And that's the reason why i'd like to use the coordinates... 10:48:37 <planetmaker> I understand 10:48:56 <planetmaker> Still I don't like the idea really. Generally it gives more problems than might be worth 10:49:21 <planetmaker> it increases overall complexit A LOT. For very little gain 10:49:41 <planetmaker> and I don't mean the newgrf code on your side 10:49:46 <Yoshi> Every tile which is on tile where (y_cooridinate % 2) = 0 has state A and tiles with (x_coordinate % 2) = 1 have state B 10:50:19 <Yoshi> But it is the way, that the users can built their cable car the most individual... 10:50:25 <planetmaker> yes. Next person wants %3 or %5 or the adjacent tile. Or whatever. And we add a special case for every such thing? 10:50:59 <planetmaker> The issue is that this thing disallows hard way to speed up anything on the map by parallelizing anything 10:51:38 <planetmaker> sorry. I still failed to see why you need a totally modular lift :-) 10:52:01 <Yoshi> Because there are different tiles: 10:52:03 <planetmaker> usually they're a few lifts chained anyway when it goes up a high mountain 10:52:12 <Yoshi> -normal cable car tile 10:52:16 <planetmaker> different tiles doesn't mean there can't be different larger objects 10:52:23 <planetmaker> which join the tiles in one object 10:52:40 <Yoshi> but then there are many objects.... 10:52:41 <Yoshi> :D 10:52:50 <Yoshi> -cable car tile with pylon in the middle 10:53:00 <planetmaker> yes. because you make every type of chair one object. every type of cable etc 10:53:00 <Yoshi> -cable car tile with pylon on the right side 10:53:16 <Yoshi> -cable car tile with pylon on the left side 10:53:25 <Yoshi> -cable car tile with ski slopes below 10:53:38 <planetmaker> yes. All that could be joined to ONE object with 1x5 tiles size 10:53:40 <Yoshi> -cable car tile with (fake) street below 10:53:41 <Yoshi> .... 10:53:53 <Yoshi> -cable car stations 10:54:02 <planetmaker> that could be included as well :-) 10:54:18 <planetmaker> though maybe not for size reasons 10:54:19 <Yoshi> but where is the street? at (0|0) or (0|1) ? 10:54:53 <planetmaker> piece of advise: don't try the jack of all trades object 10:55:34 <planetmaker> (eierlegende Wollmichsau-Objekt) 10:55:35 <Yoshi> It wasn't my idea :P It was swiss fan ;) 10:55:52 <planetmaker> not every idea is practicable 10:56:07 <Yoshi> yes ;) 10:56:14 <planetmaker> or rather: street below is very little gain for huge amount of work 10:56:31 <Yoshi> I'll try something out... 10:56:44 <planetmaker> and from my POV: I'm lazy. I want the one-click object to beautify my landscape 10:57:01 <Yoshi> :D 10:57:13 <planetmaker> piecing together every single thing where it looks broken when I choose the wrong objects... meh 10:57:17 <planetmaker> this isn't a puzzle 10:57:28 <Yoshi> In my case it would be :D 10:57:48 <Yoshi> Did you played SimCity with some mods? 10:57:54 <Yoshi> There it is like this :D 10:57:56 <planetmaker> thus: one lift = one object with everything in it. Valley and hill station, cables with chairs between. Animated. Done. Length 3 ... 7 tiles. Width: 1 tile 10:58:09 <planetmaker> 15 years ago. There were no mods for simcity 1 10:58:16 <Yoshi> :( 10:58:17 <Yoshi> ;) 10:58:51 <Yoshi> http://kurier.simcityplaza.de/details.php?file=719 10:58:52 <Webster> Title: SimCityKurier - ansehen SFBT Park-Set Sandwege von Khiyana (at kurier.simcityplaza.de) 10:59:16 <planetmaker> well. This isn't simcity. really 10:59:22 <Yoshi> yes 11:00:20 <planetmaker> I do understand what you want. But I also do believe that it's a shot slightly too far :-) 11:01:06 <planetmaker> keep it simple rules IMHO. It also keeps the object count low. Puzzling is what keeps it (very) high 11:01:25 <Yoshi> yes... 11:01:35 <planetmaker> If I play with ISR or CHIPS: I use the one-click beautiful stations. Only rarely I puzzle the extreme stations :-) 11:02:02 <Yoshi> at least i got a high execise in coding nml-newgrfs :D 11:02:13 <Yoshi> now i understand callbacks (jay) 11:02:26 <planetmaker> that is good :-) 11:16:35 <planetmaker> Yoshi, just to be sure that you understand my position on this: I understand and approve what you try to do. But I do believe that implementing that capability in OpenTTD would hurt in the long term, disallowing other more important improvements 11:17:09 <planetmaker> or rather making that unnecessarily difficult :-) 11:21:32 <Yoshi> i did'nt want you to implement something new.... :D (ok, only thing was the y_coordinates, x_coordinates for objects :D ) but maybe i take a animation frame number of 16 so i don't have to devide in state A and B :) 11:25:28 <Yoshi> and i think there are more immportant things to implement (like roadtypes :P) 11:28:21 <planetmaker> for instance. yes 11:28:37 <planetmaker> or newgrf bridges ;-) 11:30:53 <Yoshi> oh yes :) 11:31:11 <Yoshi> so you mean more bridges than the current number? 11:31:29 <planetmaker> and stations in NML. Yes I mean exactly that 11:31:37 <Yoshi> ok 11:32:56 <Yoshi> Yoshi wonders why roadtypes aren't implemented yet....and thinks of silly map array 11:38:16 <planetmaker> silly map array... mostly it needs conceptual decisions. As it e.g. impacts town growth and map generation (which railtypes both don't impact at all). What properties do they need? 11:38:29 <planetmaker> the map array might not be the biggest obstacle thus :-) 11:39:31 <Yoshi> are there some concepts already done? 11:40:35 <planetmaker> not really. It might all be *somewhere* in tt-forums and wiki. But I know nothing beyond that (or their actual links) 11:48:04 *** KenjiE20 has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 16:16:13 *** ODM has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 17:19:41 <Brot6> firs: update from r3308 to r3310 done - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/nightlies/r3310 19:20:16 *** Alberth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 19:29:11 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 19:38:47 *** frosch123 has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 19:49:46 <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Silcon Valley 7 years.png XandythenorthX @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/3449/Silcon%20Valley%207%20years.png 19:53:32 <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Silicon Valley 75 years.png XandythenorthX @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/3452/Silicon%20Valley%2075%20years.png 20:21:13 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 21:03:42 *** burtybob has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 21:31:22 *** burtybob has quit IRC 21:38:36 <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 3311:7a5c24ea1614: Fix (r3305): Portugese translation XfoobarX @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/7a5c24ea1614 21:39:59 <Brot6> firs: update from r3310 to r3311 done - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/push/r3311 21:42:13 *** Alberth has left #openttdcoop.devzone 21:46:17 *** ODM has quit IRC 21:46:19 <frosch123> ohoh, ogfx 0.4.6.1... that sounds like ottd 0.4.0.1 :p 21:55:12 <Ammler> same as 0.4.6, just with nml 0.2.4 22:01:37 *** burtybob has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 22:02:11 <burtybob> I've been reading the NML tutorial but I was wondering if there is any industry examples? 22:02:26 <burtybob> Fairly simple examples that I could use to read and learn from 22:06:05 <Brot6> DictatorAI - Revision 264:29705597d9d3: - Fix bug when failing to select a train engine and improper... XkrinnX @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/ai-dictator/repository/revisions/29705597d9d3 22:08:02 *** burtybob has quit IRC 22:10:22 *** Yoshi has quit IRC 23:40:01 <planetmaker> V453000, notice the commit? I guess you can't change power anymore during servicing 23:40:19 <planetmaker> you might want to adjust NUTS accordingly 23:40:48 <planetmaker> and quickly update the bananas version as otherwise other people use the version which will cause the desync as well 23:41:21 <michi_cc> planetmaker: You're wrong here. You can safely update it now without desyncs. 23:41:39 <planetmaker> oh :-) 23:42:03 <planetmaker> I like to be wrong here :D