Log for #openttdcoop.devzone on 20th April 2014:
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05:51:54  <Brot6> Revision 697:35005ebad849: Fix: buy menu and depot offsets XandythenorthX @
05:51:55  <Brot6> Revision 698:c7b2ee7cdd96: Cleanup: remove old template XandythenorthX @
05:51:55  <Brot6> Revision 699:105d3326c868: Added tag alpha-5 for changeset c7b2ee7cdd96 XandythenorthX @
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08:13:23  * planetmaker tries to create a wine-python3.4
08:17:40  <Alberth> hopefully snakes like alcoholic drinks :)
08:19:38  <planetmaker> :P
08:22:09  <planetmaker> wine: Bad EXE format for Z:\home\planetmaker\Downloads\python-3.4.0.msi.
08:22:09  <planetmaker>  :(
08:23:43  <planetmaker> ah...
08:24:11  <planetmaker> msiexec is the trick. Enjoy the live commentary :P
08:24:23  <DevZone> Project Iron Horse build #838-push: SUCCESS in 1 min 31 sec:
08:32:10  * Alberth is used to teddybear programming, andy does it all the time :)
08:34:00  <planetmaker> teddybear programming?
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08:37:14  <Alberth>
08:37:15  <Webster> Title: Rubber duck debugging - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (at
08:37:53  <planetmaker> haha :) NIce naming
08:38:00  <planetmaker> But definiely useful
08:38:51  <Alberth> andy has a better url :)
08:39:04  <andythenorth> talk to the bear
08:39:28  <andythenorth>
08:39:29  <Webster> Title: Compas Pascal: The teddy bear principle in programming (at
08:40:05  <planetmaker> :)
08:40:23  <andythenorth> oh this one is the one I saw before
08:40:25  <Webster> Title: Creating Passionate Users: Rubberducking and Creativity (at
08:40:38  <andythenorth> “the act of explaining something gets you thinking in ways you might never have reached if you hadn't tried to talk through it
08:40:50  <andythenorth> also
08:40:51  <andythenorth> “My sheep (R.I.P.) Albert used to be one hell of a coder, and was especially good at brainstorming.”
08:40:54  <andythenorth> he :D
08:41:10  <planetmaker> :D
08:41:41  <Rubidium> Alberth: given that wiki page, we should use frog debugging ;)
08:42:00  <planetmaker> :D
08:46:46  * Alberth misses the connection
08:46:58  <planetmaker> frosch = frog ;)
08:47:05  <planetmaker> you can have kermit to talk to
08:47:18  <Alberth> oh!  :D
08:58:03  <planetmaker> right... so I used easy_install to install pillow and ply on wine. That seems to have succeeded but cxfreeze still complains about missing modules when building nmlc.exe: (lines 342-356)
09:00:55  <planetmaker> ah... I should do all things which CF does... let's see
09:02:36  <planetmaker> hm... not sufficient to copy python34.dll there
09:05:00  <DevZone> Project Iron Horse build #839-push: SUCCESS in 1 min 19 sec:
09:06:28  <planetmaker> hm... I need to try with python3.3
09:06:32  <planetmaker>
09:06:33  <Webster> Title: python - cant find module cx_Freeze__init__ - Stack Overflow (at
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09:22:40  <planetmaker> hmpf...
09:22:47  <planetmaker> and there setuptools does not install
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09:30:24  <planetmaker> hmpf...
09:56:25  <Rubidium> so python calls a function that wine hasn't implemented (yet)
09:57:29  <Rubidium>
09:57:31  <Webster> Title: WineHQ Bugzilla Bug 34851 64-bit Autodesk Fusion 360 installer needs kernel32 GetFinalPathNameByHandleA/W (at
09:58:29  <planetmaker> Hm, thanks. Funnily it installs with python34 :)
09:58:41  <planetmaker> But that fails to work with cxfreeze :(
09:58:48  <Rubidium> maybe set the wine winversion to windows xp
10:00:43  <planetmaker> "Wine default Windows version is Windows XP"
10:00:54  <planetmaker> and I didn't change anything there
10:02:16  <planetmaker> but how do I check / change? Do you know?
10:03:57  <planetmaker> winecfg maybe...
10:04:45  <planetmaker> yup. And set to windows 7
10:05:58  <planetmaker> thank you, Rubidium !
10:43:37  <DevZone> Project World Airliner Set build #97-push: STILL FAILING in 21 sec:
10:45:03  <DevZone> Project World Airliner Set build #98-push: STILL FAILING in 17 sec:
10:53:53  <DevZone> Project World Airliner Set build #99-push: STILL FAILING in 17 sec:
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11:22:01  <Brot6> Revision 1283:7fc3411bd1c8: fix palette XRvP93X @
11:22:01  <Brot6> Revision 1284:1403a3e416a8: fix palette XRvP93X @
11:22:01  <Brot6> Revision 1285:fb6faf057922: fix palette XRvP93X @
11:23:41  <planetmaker> Alberth, there surely is a nicer construct to try importing a library but not care futher if it fails?
11:24:27  <Alberth> except ImportError:
11:24:52  <Alberth> try/except is the right approach, we also do that with PIL
11:24:52  <planetmaker> but I can't use an empty except, can I?
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11:25:04  <Taede> ImportError
11:25:06  <Alberth> except ImportError:  pass
11:25:11  <planetmaker> ah. thanks
11:26:05  <Alberth> often, they create the failed imported name, like   setup, Executable = None, None
11:26:23  <Alberth> so it becomes testable whether you have them imported
11:26:34  <planetmaker> yes, that makes sense.
11:26:51  <planetmaker> I'm still somewhat stabbing at murky waters on how to get an actually working windows executable
11:27:04  <planetmaker> and sure in normal operation cxfreeze is not needed, so I just want to ignore that
11:27:05  <Alberth> :(
11:28:48  <Alberth> quak
11:29:15  <planetmaker>
11:29:58  <planetmaker> but I fixed a *very* important bug on the way: :P
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11:31:38  <Alberth> please don't use "except:" ever
11:31:56  <planetmaker> oh? IOError: instead?
11:32:02  <Alberth> it hides literally all errors, including syntax errors, ^C interrupts etc
11:32:06  <planetmaker> or whatever is a file not found error
11:32:07  <frosch123> hola
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11:32:17  <planetmaker> hi
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11:34:04  <Alberth> planetmaker:  OSError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory
11:34:22  <Alberth> simplest way is to just try it on a known failing example :p
11:40:00  <planetmaker> :) right
11:40:52  <planetmaker>
11:41:42  <planetmaker> though we likely have some warning provisions. hm
11:42:24  <planetmaker> but then, we use print in that file already
11:42:49  <planetmaker> can we convert all indentation to tabs? :D
11:46:28  <frosch123> unless tabs are already the present coding style, i would always recommend to use spaces
11:46:41  <planetmaker> nml uses spaces
11:46:47  <frosch123> easier to check in commit hooks, easier to explain, and no restrictions on aligning
11:47:23  <frosch123> then just change the push hook to only accept tabs in files called "Makefile*"
11:47:25  <planetmaker> but I always have to correct that for edits I make there
11:47:43  <planetmaker> and openttd uses tabs for indentation. Thus I need to switch there always
11:48:07  <frosch123> sounds like your problem then :p
11:48:21  <frosch123> don't you have different settings for different projects resp. languages?
11:48:22  <planetmaker> and for indentation... I don't see how tab or spaces makes a real difference
11:48:39  <planetmaker> likely kate has such settings somewhere
11:48:41  <frosch123> tabs are only useful for indentation, not for alignment
11:48:51  <planetmaker> yes, I was talking about indentation
11:48:55  <planetmaker> not alignment
11:48:56  <frosch123> you run into issues when aligning stuff on multiple lines
11:49:16  <frosch123> ottd just drops the alignment and says second line of a if gets one tab more, but that is actually terrible
11:49:27  <planetmaker> eh?
11:49:34  <frosch123> other projects try to make complex rules, like indenting with tabs followed by some space alignment
11:49:41  <frosch123> but usually people don't get that
11:49:56  <frosch123> so, the easiest method by far is to always use spaces
11:50:20  <frosch123> planetmaker: usually you align similar stuff on multiple lines, which is impossible in totd
11:50:53  <frosch123> in fact it was practice in ottd in the past to mix tabs and spaces for alignment, but people didn't get it, so it was unified to a simpler but pointless way :p
11:51:23  <frosch123> also aligning comments is impossible in ottd, if the lines have diffent indentation levels
11:52:23  <frosch123> tabs are just inferior to spaces :)
11:52:31  <Alberth> just return '' ?
11:53:46  <Alberth> planetmaker: vim user?  if so, you can set tab/space settings per file type
11:54:01  <planetmaker> <-- kate user
11:54:02  <Alberth> other sane editors can also do that :)
11:54:27  <Alberth> sadly, there are a lot of non-sane editors :(
11:54:38  <frosch123> like vim :p
11:54:49  <Alberth> :D
11:55:20  <planetmaker> Alberth, why '' instead of version (which is set to '' previously)?
11:55:58  <Alberth> the error claims not be able to get a version, yet you return one, one line later :)
11:56:20  <planetmaker> It's set to '' initially for the exact reason to define the default return value once
11:56:33  <planetmaker> The last line of that function also returns version - while it still is ''
11:56:34  <Alberth> fair enough :)
11:58:09  <Alberth> patch seems fine
11:58:48  <planetmaker> I must pay attention to not push it unmodified to current trunk. It's py3 :P
11:59:00  <planetmaker> I work on your py3 version of nml ;)
11:59:31  <planetmaker> however, still nice weather here, so I'll be back in 2 hours or so
12:12:28  <Alberth> hg clone is your friend :)
12:53:23  <DevZone> Project World Airliner Set build #100-push: STILL FAILING in 19 sec:
13:24:00  <Brot6> Revision 700:cf45b1749b8c: Change: adjust vehicle name to Mail Car (Metro) XandythenorthX @
13:24:00  <Brot6> Revision 701:7c543ea81bf4: Feature: Chaplin tank randomised reversed sprites XandythenorthX @
13:56:33  <DevZone> Yippee, build fixed!
13:56:33  <DevZone> Project World Airliner Set build #101-push: FIXED in 1 min 5 sec:
13:59:01  <DevZone> Project World Airliner Set build #102-push: SUCCESS in 1 min 7 sec:
14:01:01  <DevZone> Project World Airliner Set build #103-push: SUCCESS in 1 min 8 sec:
14:04:50  <Brot6> Membership #6872 (New): Applying for project: French Train Set XJyratosX @
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14:35:54  <DevZone> Project World Airliner Set build #104-push: SUCCESS in 1 min 6 sec:
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15:27:53  <planetmaker> so... I've seen a sea hawk
15:34:58  <frosch123> high tide on your side?
15:35:10  <frosch123> flood?
15:36:39  <planetmaker> seems they also live inlands :)
15:41:28  <Brot6> Membership #6872 (Assigned): Applying for project: French Train Set XJyratosX @
15:41:28  <Brot6> Membership #6872 (Assigned): Applying for project: French Train Set XplanetmakerX @
15:46:32  <Rubidium> or it's just the German sea hawks confusing sea and See
15:48:08  <planetmaker> hehe, that could be :)
15:48:30  <planetmaker> even in German you can call it See. Both. Die See  vs. der See
15:49:48  <frosch123> words without plural/singular form are always messy
15:49:50  <planetmaker> actually Northern German dialect has it that See and Meer have reversed meanings than in standard German. Thus there are many (larger) lakes which actually are called like whatever-Meer
15:50:19  <planetmaker> der See. die Seen. die See
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15:50:35  <planetmaker> most famous example probably is the Steinhuder Meer
15:50:44  <planetmaker> which is a bigger lake near Hanovre
15:51:41  <planetmaker> so northern German dialect probably is like Dutch there :)
15:51:56  <Rubidium> yup
15:52:05  <planetmaker> which totally makes sense :)
15:53:13  <Rubidium> likewise the English sea coming from see, and the English lake probably coming from lac
15:53:39  <planetmaker> yup
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16:21:51  <DevZone> Project Japanese Buildings build #176-nightlies: SUCCESS in 16 sec:
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16:33:55  <DevZone> Project Finnish Rail Infrastructure - Rails build #290-nightlies: SUCCESS in 8 min 20 sec:
16:41:12  <DevZone> Project road-hog build #153-nightlies: SUCCESS in 37 sec:
16:47:59  <DevZone> Project Iron Horse build #840-nightlies: SUCCESS in 1 min 24 sec:
16:49:19  <DevZone> Project Dutch Trainset build #137-push: SUCCESS in 1 min 43 sec:
16:49:32  <DevZone> Project Iron Horse build #841-push: SUCCESS in 1 min 33 sec:
16:50:14  <DevZone> Project 2ccts build #87-push: SUCCESS in 55 sec:
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18:08:28  <DevZone> Project World Airliner Set build #106-push: FAILURE in 15 sec:
18:09:48  <DevZone> Project World Airliner Set build #107-push: STILL FAILING in 15 sec:
18:13:56  <DevZone> Project World Airliner Set build #108-push: STILL FAILING in 16 sec:
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18:17:47  <DevZone> Yippee, build fixed!
18:17:47  <DevZone> Project World Airliner Set build #109-push: FIXED in 1 min 7 sec:
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19:45:32  <DevZone> Project World Airliner Set build #110-push: SUCCESS in 1 min 9 sec:
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20:15:03  <DevZone> Project World Airliner Set build #111-push: SUCCESS in 1 min 8 sec:
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20:33:58  <DevZone> Project World Airliner Set build #112-push: SUCCESS in 1 min 9 sec:
20:40:40  <Brot6> feed NewGRFs had 13 updates, showing the latest 10
20:40:40  <Brot6> Revision 1289:81ba2c978d37: fix XRvP93X @
20:40:40  <Brot6> Revision 1290:79c33bc42531: Added A380-800 XRvP93X @
20:40:40  <Brot6> Revision 1291:257ef07db8bb: update docs XRvP93X @
20:40:41  <Brot6> Revision 1292:1f880775b80e: Added An124 XRvP93X @
20:40:46  <Brot6> Revision 1293:58d7c0084972: fix XRvP93X @
20:40:49  <Brot6> Revision 1294:f5884197ee22: fix XRvP93X @
20:40:52  <Brot6> Revision 1295:445e833f42cc: fix XRvP93X @
20:40:55  <Brot6> Revision 1296:1199d3bd711a: Fixed issue with An-124 landing with open nose XGeorgeX @
20:40:59  <Brot6> Revision 1297:65012f6dce23: fixed Coordinates An124, A345 XRvP93X @
20:41:02  <Brot6> Revision 1298:8ca9604f010f: fixed Coordinates A346 XRvP93X @
21:16:57  <Brot6> Revision 117:d827b5cc4fd5 (2ccts): Update: Translations XeintsX @
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22:33:47  <Brot6> Revision 801:f4cea61548bf: Update: Translations XeintsX @
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