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Log for #openttdcoop.stable on 26th June 2011:
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01:13:41  <Stablean> *** Sylf has left the game (leaving)
02:01:14  <Stablean> *** doonz joined the game
02:02:10  <Stablean> <doonz> morning
02:21:30  *** NCommander has quit IRC
02:23:37  *** NCommander has joined #openttdcoop.stable
02:57:45  <Stablean> <Anson> hallo, doonz
02:57:49  <Stablean> <doonz> hey :)
02:58:09  <Stablean> <doonz> just made my trains bigger
02:58:23  <Stablean> <Anson> was busy watching TV and fine twisting some trains/depots
02:58:45  <Stablean> <doonz> wow.
02:58:47  <Stablean> <Anson> there should be a new train this or next year, speed 300
02:58:49  <Stablean> <doonz> long trains make so much
02:58:52  <Stablean> <doonz> hehe yeah
02:58:55  <Stablean> <doonz> i got offered it :p
02:59:22  <Stablean> <doonz> i did some simple priority too :p
02:59:24  <Stablean> <doonz> see !here
02:59:30  <Stablean> <Anson> but too bad that the little blue "do you want to test the new engine" window has no important details, like whether that new loco can only pull pax cars ....
02:59:44  <Stablean> <doonz> hehe yeah, but might aswell say yes anyway
02:59:52  <Stablean> <doonz> not like it costs anything to test a vehicle !
03:00:26  <Stablean> <Anson> if you accept to test a new train and then do not use it, your reputation will drop ... at least that is what i read about the original TT/TTD
03:00:30  <Stablean> <doonz> oh
03:00:40  <Stablean> <doonz> reputation for what though?
03:01:22  <Stablean> <Anson> don't know/remember ... it was a long time ago, and this is openTTD anyway, but you should not just accept every new offer :-)
03:01:40  <Stablean> <Anson> maybe the reputation with ALL towns, since it was a publich offer ?
03:01:42  <Stablean> <doonz> well.. i dont accept offers for planes, busses and ships :d
03:01:56  <Stablean> <doonz> haha i hope not
03:01:56  <Stablean> <doonz> that would suck
03:02:38  <Stablean> <Anson> give me a moment please, i have 40 open windows for trains and orders :-) need to compare and chack them before i close them :-)
03:02:42  <Stablean> <doonz> kk
03:06:02  <Stablean> <doonz> could you check !here and !also here after you have done, wanna know if i am doing it correctly or if i could improve on it
03:17:27  <Stablean> <Anson> screen is still full, but I'm partially done now ... signs were !here and !also ?
03:21:51  <Stablean> <Anson>  !here looks ok ... and the best test is when a train comes : off line use pause to stop immediately, online use stop/unstop ... and then watch which signals change
03:22:57  <Stablean> <Anson> small detail : since no trains are supposed to USE those rails, i always do them in such a way (if possible)  that trainscan't accidentally enter them
03:23:27  <Stablean> <Anson> for logic rails to work, only the connections are important, not whether there really is a path
03:23:39  <Stablean> <doonz> how i can i make sure it doesn tenter though
03:24:51  <Stablean> <doonz> like that>?
03:26:22  <Stablean> <doonz> so like that?
03:26:36  <Stablean> <Anson> like you done now, trains from ML can't enter
03:26:59  <Stablean> <doonz> cool
03:27:01  <Stablean> <Anson> and no others ... since they would have to come from backside a signal
03:27:18  <Stablean> <Anson> you also can use the slowest and cheapest bridges :-)
03:27:34  <Stablean> <doonz> so at !also here
03:27:37  <Stablean> <doonz> better to do like that?
03:27:43  <Stablean> <doonz> with horizontal and vertical tracks
03:28:53  <Stablean> <Anson> what is your TL ? :-)
03:29:07  <Stablean> <doonz> 3
03:29:17  <Stablean> <doonz> TL 3
03:30:06  <Stablean> <Anson> count it yourself :-)
03:31:04  <Stablean> <doonz> so i could move the logic ?
03:31:24  <Stablean> <doonz> haha i still dont really understand how it works properly :)
03:31:30  <Stablean> <Anson> you need to make sure that no train fits between two connections of the logic
03:32:09  <Stablean> <doonz> that wouldnt work tho would it?
03:32:55  <Stablean> <Anson> too many connections don't hurt, except for their building costs and maintenance costs, and maybe they look more ugly, but no disadvantage on how they work
03:32:57  <Stablean> <doonz> hmm
03:33:31  <Stablean> <Anson> you ned to connect the logic to the entry signal ... but there is a simple trick : combination of simple prio and logic
03:34:10  <Stablean> <doonz> :D
03:34:13  <Stablean> <doonz> awesome!
03:34:53  <Stablean> <doonz> still trying to get my head around how it works :)
03:35:39  <Stablean> <Anson> just do it the simple way : start at the entry signal amd ask yourself "which signal needs to be red to make this one red" (or green to make it green)
03:35:57  <Stablean> <doonz> so i could improve the logic at !here too?
03:36:00  <Stablean> <Anson> thus you will follow the path of information propagation
03:36:02  <Stablean> <doonz> using two way combo
03:36:04  <Stablean> <doonz> instead of bridge
03:37:10  <Stablean> <Anson> like it is done now, it has one disadvantage : when a train from SL enters, the ML will have one additional signal red before the crossing ... but that is the price for an easy solution to the space problem, of how to connect the logic to the crossing
03:38:10  <Stablean> <doonz> ah i see what you mean
03:38:38  <Stablean> <doonz> thanks :)
03:40:32  <Stablean> <Anson> lol
03:40:50  <Stablean> <doonz> haha what are you doing
03:41:12  <Stablean> <Anson> to save all that space and possible errors, you pay by having one more red signal ... it is always a question what is more important or possible
03:41:35  <Stablean> <Anson> i just showed you how to connect when a bridge is not possible :-)
03:41:46  <Stablean> <Anson> very big and ugly
03:42:05  <Stablean> <doonz> indeed :(
03:43:39  <Stablean> <doonz> are having the deports on the sides like that ok?
03:45:13  <Stablean> <Anson> hehe, did you see how well it just wiorked at !also here ?
03:45:27  <Stablean> <doonz> no
03:45:29  <Stablean> <doonz> what happened
03:45:59  <Stablean> <Anson> too bad ... a train was leaving the station and another on ML barely hit the logic, stopping the SL
03:46:11  <Stablean> <doonz> haha oh lucky! :P
03:47:20  <Stablean> <doonz> hmm
03:47:34  <Stablean> <doonz> would it be worth moving the entry signal back a bit, to give the trains time to accelerate?
03:47:40  <Stablean> <Anson> with these short trains and good acceleration, the prio might be much shorter
03:48:51  <Stablean> <Anson> nice idea, but it would be very difficult to calculate ... different for every engine, weight, etc
03:49:03  <Stablean> <doonz> indeed
03:49:21  <Stablean> <doonz> well the oil cargo accelerates much slower than the rubber / ore
03:49:25  <Stablean> <Anson> and it would require the ML to be checked even further away ... making it more complicated again ...
03:49:55  <Stablean> <doonz> it probably wont matter when i upgrade the engines tho
03:50:33  <Stablean> <Anson> you build it early in the game, and if done properly, shouldn't need many changes when upgrading
03:50:50  <Stablean> *** Cosate joined the game
03:51:08  <Stablean> <doonz> cool :)
03:51:26  <Stablean> <doonz> afk for a bit, gotta have lunch :d
03:55:32  <Stablean> <Anson> look at the signs for CL !!!! ... your entry has several curves which are tighter than necessary
04:05:53  <Stablean> *** Sylf joined the game
04:07:30  <Stablean> <Anson> hehe, people are joining at the "strangest" times :-)
04:08:16  <Stablean> <Anson> where is the server ? UK ? or is the flag just an indicator for the language ?
04:24:30  <Stablean> *** Sylf has left the game (leaving)
04:39:48  <Stablean> *** Cosate has left the game (connection lost)
04:40:22  <Stablean> *** Cosate joined the game
04:50:17  <Stablean> *** Cosate has left the game (leaving)
05:16:35  <Stablean> *** Player has left the game (leaving)
05:57:55  <Stablean> <doonz> oh shit
05:58:01  <Stablean> <doonz> there is supposed to be space there haha
05:58:23  <Stablean> <doonz> i think i should have done two combos instead
05:59:55  <Stablean> <doonz> is that correct?
06:00:01  <Stablean> <doonz> i wanted a bit of waiting space
06:00:03  <Stablean> <doonz> for each one
06:01:16  <Stablean> <Anson> always with TL3 space between them
06:01:39  <Stablean> <doonz> hehe :)
06:02:03  <Stablean> <Anson> hehe, looked yt your trains too much which have TL3
06:02:10  <Stablean> <doonz> ^^
06:03:59  <Stablean> <doonz> oh
06:04:01  <Stablean> <doonz> yes
06:04:08  <Stablean> <doonz> i originally had trains tl7
06:04:12  <Stablean> <doonz> but changed them to tl3
06:04:18  <Stablean> <doonz> so still need to change this station
06:05:41  <Stablean> <doonz> i c
06:06:35  <Stablean> <doonz> whats wrong with CL 5?
06:08:07  <Stablean> <doonz> me too
06:12:13  <Stablean> <doonz> why is CL 5 bad?
06:13:56  <Stablean> <doonz> well i was hoping this station would get used more
06:14:05  <Stablean> <doonz> but there doesnt seem to be much oil on this island :p
06:16:00  <Stablean> <doonz> im there
06:17:07  <Stablean> <doonz> is there a max speed limit on CL5? so when trains get upgraded they wont be able to go full speed around them?>
06:18:33  <Stablean> <doonz> there is?
06:18:35  <Stablean> <Anson> gap 3 8
06:19:38  <Stablean> <doonz> @@5+%
06:19:46  <Stablean> <doonz> lol
06:20:13  <Stablean> <doonz> @@speed 5
06:20:15  <Stablean> <Anson> @@(speed 5 erail)
06:24:57  <Stablean> <doonz> sorry went afk
06:24:59  <Stablean> <doonz> back :P
06:25:33  <Stablean> <doonz> i see
06:25:33  <Stablean> <doonz> but
06:25:47  <Stablean> <doonz> why do the trains go full speed around CL5 then?
06:27:14  <Stablean> <doonz> why do the trains og full speed around CL5 then?
06:27:28  <Stablean> <doonz> because the trains are TL3?
06:27:42  <Stablean> <doonz> does it mean that if the train was TL4 the max speed it could go around that corner would be 166?
06:27:56  <Stablean> <doonz> i think thats what i means
06:28:06  <Stablean> <doonz> if the train is longer than the cl.. then it will slow down to 166
06:28:09  <Stablean> <Anson> but maybe related to another unclear fact from the wiki
06:28:23  <Stablean> <doonz> like it the train were TL4, then the train would slow down to 166 on CL5
06:28:45  <Stablean> <doonz> hmm
06:28:49  <Stablean> <doonz> isnt CL supposed to be curve length?
06:29:35  <Stablean> <doonz> TL?
06:29:37  <Stablean> <doonz> on
06:29:37  <Stablean> <doonz> oh
06:29:39  <Stablean> <doonz> on wiki?
06:29:39  <Stablean> <doonz> i dont know
06:29:42  <Stablean> <doonz> i havent been on wiki
06:30:02  <Stablean> <doonz> no
06:30:03  <Stablean> *** pewpew joined the game
06:30:06  <Stablean> <doonz> TL3 = CL5
06:30:21  <Stablean> <doonz> i think its in half tiles
06:30:51  <Stablean> <doonz> well
06:30:57  <Stablean> <doonz> it would depend on how big the wagons were
06:32:12  <Stablean> <doonz> yes but the wagons are all different
06:32:23  <Stablean> <doonz> like some of my wagons are 0.5 of a tile and some are 0.4 of a tile
06:32:58  <Stablean> *** pewpew has left the game (leaving)
06:33:10  <Stablean> <doonz> well a TL3 train should go around a CL5 at full speed right?
06:34:52  <Stablean> <doonz> see !test
06:35:17  <Stablean> <doonz> TL3 train going around CL5 bend at full speed
06:35:50  <Stablean> <doonz> if it is longer than the bend
06:35:54  <Stablean> <doonz> then it will have a speed reduction
06:35:56  <Stablean> <doonz> according to that formula
06:36:11  <Stablean> <doonz> see
06:36:13  <Stablean> <doonz> 168
06:36:23  <Stablean> <doonz> TL3.5 going around CL5 = 168 max speed
06:39:03  <Stablean> <doonz> no it doesnt
06:39:09  <Stablean> <doonz> it went around at full speed
06:39:40  <Stablean> <doonz> :P
06:40:45  <Stablean> <doonz> i tihnk its quite useful
06:41:02  <Stablean> <doonz> at CL2 = 221 max speed for maglev
06:41:23  <Stablean> <doonz> meaning you could have infinitely long trains with engines that only top 220 max speed, and they wouldnt slow down around the corner
06:42:44  <Stablean> <doonz> look
06:42:47  <Stablean> <doonz> max speed of that train is 104
06:42:53  <Stablean> <doonz> max speed around CL2 = 111
06:42:55  <Stablean> <doonz> doesnt slow down
06:46:10  <Stablean> <doonz> yes
06:46:22  <Stablean> <doonz> anything higher than 3.0 it will slow down on cl5
06:46:32  <Stablean> <doonz> even if you had 3.000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001 it would slow down around the corner
06:48:05  <Stablean> <doonz> its just the length of the track
06:48:09  <Stablean> <doonz> yes
06:48:13  <Stablean> <doonz> but the actual length = 3
06:48:15  <Stablean> <doonz> right
06:48:21  <Stablean> <doonz> the train isnt bigger than 3 length
06:48:24  <Stablean> <doonz> therefore it wont slow down
06:49:14  <Stablean> <doonz> If TL > length of curve (CL x 2) ; then there will be a speed reduction
06:49:30  <Stablean> <Anson> yes, that is what i thought ....
06:50:32  <Stablean> <Anson> but the opposite : TL = CL / 2 .... or TL * 2 = CL
06:50:54  <Stablean> <doonz> hehe depends what you view CL as
06:51:08  <Stablean> <Anson> and thus i had assumed that TL3 needs CL 6 (TL * 2)
06:51:50  <Stablean> <doonz> ah i se
06:55:13  <Stablean> <doonz> 151?
06:55:27  <Stablean> <doonz> 151
06:55:30  <Stablean> <doonz> http://wiki.openttd.org/Game_mechanics#Vehicle_speeds
06:55:42  <Stablean> <doonz> @ Curvature = 4 ; Speed = 151
06:57:01  <Stablean> <Anson> i know that wiki, and several other resources ... but they partially say different things, eg how to calculate the curvature, that the number of wagons is the curvature, or halftiles, average, or ......
06:57:17  <Stablean> <doonz> curvature = half tiles
06:58:21  <Stablean> <Anson> from just that wiki about game mechanics : ""Curvature" means the average number of wagons of the train between turns." !!!!!
06:58:33  <Stablean> <doonz> well thats wrong
06:59:23  <Stablean> <Anson> and if it would be halftiles, then the test curve has CL 5 and the train has TL3 --> slowdown ....
06:59:33  <Stablean> <doonz> no
06:59:43  <Stablean> <Anson> why not ?
06:59:45  <Stablean> <doonz> CL5 = Length 3
06:59:57  <Stablean> <doonz> see
06:59:57  <Stablean> <doonz> length 3
07:00:00  <Stablean> <Anson> the halftiles are rounded up ?
07:00:31  <Stablean> <doonz> they must be lol
07:00:41  <Stablean> <Anson> then there would be no CL3 curves either, but they would count as "no speed limit for TL2 ?
07:01:58  <Stablean> <doonz> CL3 = length 2
07:02:11  <Stablean> <Anson> TL 2 has no slowdown on CL 3
07:02:19  <Stablean> <doonz> right yo uare
07:02:23  <Stablean> <doonz> because CL 3 = TL 2
07:02:58  <Stablean> <Anson> then the rule is correct about the halftiles, limit of CL 3 is 133, etc ... but the CL for no slowdown at all is rounded to next full TL !?!?!?!
07:03:37  <Stablean> <doonz> well yeah
07:03:48  <Stablean> <doonz> if the train length doesnt go over the length of the curve, there will be no speed reduction
07:04:11  <Stablean> <doonz> but for an infinitely long train, the speed limit around CL3 = 132
07:04:13  <Stablean> <Anson> without that "rounding up", TL2 would be 4 halftiles, and thus be slowed down by CL3 ... as well as TL3 = 6 halftiles, which is not slowed down by CL 5
07:05:38  <Stablean> <doonz> ok
07:05:40  <Stablean> <doonz> you are right look
07:05:46  <Stablean> <doonz> that is a TL3 train
07:05:53  <Stablean> <doonz> but it doesnt fit on 3 distance curve
07:06:12  <Stablean> <doonz> TL3 train doesnt actually fit on a CL5
07:06:18  <Stablean> <Anson> then they implemented it as :    "no speedlimit if TL <=  roundup (CL / 2) .... eg 3 <= roundup(2.5)
07:06:53  <Stablean> <doonz> lo
07:06:55  <Stablean> <doonz> look at that train
07:07:36  <Stablean> <Anson> i calculated ... didn't watch the trains set up ?
07:07:42  <Stablean> <doonz> oh no
07:07:44  <Stablean> <doonz> im talking about this train
07:07:56  <Stablean> <doonz> this one
07:08:03  <Stablean> <doonz> thats a TL 3 train
07:08:13  <Stablean> <Anson> oh
07:08:23  <Stablean> <doonz> i think
07:08:41  <Stablean> <doonz> that the two end bits count for 0.25 of a tile
07:09:19  <Stablean> <Anson> then maybe they calculate diagonals with mathematical length ... 5 halftiles = 5 * sqrt/2) = 7 ... and thus TL3 = 6 halftiles is shorter
07:09:50  <Stablean> <doonz> oh i meant 0.5 of a tile
07:10:24  <Stablean> <doonz> ohhh
07:10:24  <Stablean> <doonz> no
07:10:27  <Stablean> <doonz> youre right
07:10:49  <Stablean> <doonz> half a tile diagonally is bigger than half a tile horizontally or vertically.
07:11:37  <Stablean> <doonz> a diagonal = 0.7071067811865476
07:12:08  <Stablean> <Anson> yes, that is sqrt(2)/2
07:12:11  <Stablean> <doonz> yea
07:13:20  <Stablean> <Anson> let's test ... one train with 4.1 or 4.2, anmd one with 4.3 ... then we will see whether curves with 3 slow them ...
07:13:29  <Stablean> <doonz> they will
07:13:47  <Stablean> <doonz> if you had a train with TL 3.0000000000000000000000000000001 it would slow down around CL5
07:13:47  <Stablean> <Anson> or rather half of those values ... the 4.24 are halftiles
07:15:42  <Stablean> <doonz> hehe. we dont need to know how it works though.. its just game mechanics
07:16:21  <Stablean> <Anson> this test train is shown as TL 2.1 ... 4.2 halftiles
07:16:54  <Stablean> <doonz> as expecte
07:16:56  <Stablean> <doonz> expected*
07:18:36  <Stablean> <Anson> slowed to 133 for CL 3 .... but is the shown 2.1 really 2.1 ? ... the exact value for the theory would be 2,1213203435596425732025330863145
07:18:51  <Stablean> <doonz> well yeah
07:18:53  <Stablean> <doonz> they would round it
07:19:43  <Stablean> <Anson> in theory (with the sqrt), slowdown should not happen below TL 2.121.....
07:20:15  <Stablean> <doonz> yea in theory
07:20:18  <Stablean> <doonz> but the game doesnt work like that
07:20:24  <Stablean> <Anson> but is my train <=2.12 or >=2.13 ?
07:21:53  <Stablean> <doonz> ok
07:21:55  <Stablean> <doonz> i made a 2.1 train
07:22:21  <Stablean> <doonz> this is TL 2.1
07:22:28  <Stablean> <doonz> oh lame its only 72.. lol
07:23:47  <Stablean> <doonz> you there?
07:24:23  <Stablean> <doonz> heyyyyyyyyy???1/?@!?51//2!?%!?@%/21%?!@%/?%!21
07:25:20  <Stablean> <doonz> when you get back look at my deop
07:25:22  <Stablean> <doonz> depo
07:25:28  <Stablean> <doonz> they obviously round it
07:25:45  <Stablean> <doonz> brb
07:26:13  <Stablean> <Anson> i see TL 2.0 on your train ...
07:26:20  <Stablean> <doonz> back
07:26:22  <Stablean> <doonz> yes
07:26:22  <Stablean> <doonz> but
07:26:24  <Stablean> <doonz> look
07:26:27  <Stablean> <doonz> the addon is 0.3
07:26:31  <Stablean> <doonz> yet if you add that to the train
07:26:33  <Stablean> <doonz> it goes to 2.0
07:26:35  <Stablean> <doonz> instead of 2.1
07:27:09  <Stablean> <Anson> until last version of openTTD, they only showed the interger, no decimal at all
07:27:33  <Stablean> <Anson> new in 1.1.1 : one decimal is shown (and of course, it is rounded up/down/whatever
07:29:18  <Stablean> <Anson> for curves with 7 halftiles, the trains needs to be < 9,8994949366116653416118210694679 ... in the sqrt theory :-) ... but current max TL is 6
07:31:18  <Stablean> <Anson> for curves with 5 halftiles, the number would be 7,0710678118654752440084436210485 ... too close to 7.0 with the rounded display in the buy window
07:32:27  <Stablean> <doonz> haha all you need to know is 5 diagonal half tiles = 6 horizontal / vertical half tiles
07:33:31  <Stablean> <Anson> and for 3 diagonals, the number would be TL 2,1213203435596425732025330863145 ... for testing, i would need >2.0 and <2.12 ... but that can't be seen in the game
07:33:56  <Stablean> <Anson> NO
07:34:12  <Stablean> <Anson> that only applies to the CL for no slowdowns
07:34:38  <Stablean> <Anson> otherwise, the CL is the number of diaginal halftiles, not doing any math with sqrt
07:36:30  *** TWerkhoven has joined #openttdcoop.stable
07:37:05  <Stablean> <Anson> if the CL3 hits, it hits with the ful might of CL 3 (133), even when 3 x sqrt(2) = 4.24 and thus trains would be slowed down to CL4 = 150 only !?!?!
07:37:45  <Stablean> <doonz> haha i dont know what you mean :p
07:38:02  <Stablean> <Anson> seems as if for the amount of slowdown, halftziles (no matter whether diagonal or vertical or horiz) are simply counted
07:38:08  <Stablean> <doonz> CL5 = TL3
07:38:29  <Stablean> <Anson> but for the decision whether the slowdown hits at all, CL * sqrt(2) is used instead
07:39:42  <Stablean> <Anson> what should CL 1 give ? .... slowdown to 88, and no slowdown for trains < TL ?
07:40:04  <Stablean> <doonz> yes
07:40:22  <Stablean> <Anson> no slowdown for TL < 1,4142135623730950488016887242097 ?
07:40:25  <Stablean> <doonz> as you can see the trains in my little 8 arent slowing down at all
07:41:00  <Stablean> <doonz> on CL1.. train will slow down if its any bigger than TL 0.5
07:41:25  <Stablean> <Anson> args, forgot the divide again ... CL1 has no slowdown for TL < 0.707.... ???
07:41:40  <Stablean> <Anson> how long is your testtrain ? <0.7 ?
07:41:43  <Stablean> <doonz> 0.5
07:42:13  <Stablean> <Anson> LOL ... CL1 and train with a halftile length was never the subject of controversy :-)
07:42:21  <Stablean> <doonz> hehe
07:42:48  <Stablean> <Anson> the question was for a diagonal CL1 and trains between 0.707 and 1.0
07:43:08  <Stablean> <Anson> maybe even for 0.6
07:43:10  <Stablean> <doonz> it will slow down
07:43:41  <Stablean> *** TWerkhoven joined the game
07:46:15  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> @clcalc erail 6
07:46:23  <TWerkhoven> !cl
07:46:26  <TWerkhoven> !clcalc
07:46:38  <Stablean> <Anson> 0.9 and no slowdown .... TL > 0.7 in a CL 1
07:46:40  <TWerkhoven> !irc_commands
07:47:01  <TWerkhoven> !curve
07:47:02  <Stablean> <Anson> hehe ... hallo TWerk :-)
07:47:06  <TWerkhoven> mornin
07:47:30  <Stablean> <doonz> wait so TL 0.9 around CL1 has no slow down?
07:47:48  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> theres a command for calculating max speed in a given cornerlength
07:47:52  <Stablean> <Anson> we are trying to find out which curves slow down which trains ... since the wiki and other sources give contradicting facts, and contradicting our tests too :-(
07:47:54  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> cant think of it atm
07:48:08  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> it only applies if tl => cl though
07:48:20  <Stablean> <Anson> the calc is only a utility, doesn't tell what is correct
07:48:42  <Stablean> <Anson> what would YOU think about a train of TL 3 ... would it be slowed down in CL 5 ?
07:48:54  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> shouldnt be
07:48:56  <Stablean> <doonz> no
07:49:05  <Stablean> <Anson> we tested : TL 3 is NOT slowed down in CL 5 !!!!
07:49:24  <Stablean> <Anson> but TL 3 = 6 halftiles
07:49:33  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> yes
07:49:39  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> that is correct
07:49:57  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> lenghth-popup when dragging new rail will tell you this as well
07:50:05  <Stablean> *** TWerkhoven has started a new company (#5)
07:50:30  <Stablean> <Anson> you just said yourself : shouldn't be slowed down if TL < CL ... eg 6 halftiles < 5 ?
07:50:30  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> those are both cl2
07:51:20  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> example?
07:51:32  <Stablean> <Anson> then it is simply rounded up ?
07:52:00  <Stablean> <Anson> a train with TL 6 = 12 halftiles would not be slowed down by a curve with 11 halftiles ?
07:52:26  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> think so
07:52:56  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> rule of thumb is, the whole shebang doesnt apply when the train itself is only ever bent once
07:53:10  <Stablean> <Anson> but a train with TL 13 would be slowed down by the same curve, using the length of 11 halftiles, and not the rounded value if 12
07:53:20  <Stablean> <Anson> .... od 12
07:53:23  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> soon as the last wagin is still pointing at 90degrees from the engine, max speed starts to apply
07:53:45  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> true but with cl12 you get some pretty high speeds anyway
07:54:27  <TWerkhoven> @clcalc
07:54:27  <Webster> TWerkhoven: (clcalc <railtype> [<tilt>] <cl|km/h>) -- For a number <30 this calculates the speed for <cl> on <railtype>. For any other numbers, this calculates the CL required for <railtype> travelling at <km/h>, assuming TL is small enough. [<tilt>] will apply tilt bonuses to the calculation.
07:54:52  <TWerkhoven> @clcalc erail 12
07:54:52  <Webster> TWerkhoven: A rail Curve Length of 12 (capped at 13 half tiles) gives a speed of 232km/h or 145mph
07:55:53  <TWerkhoven> @clcalc erail 6
07:55:53  <Webster> TWerkhoven: A rail Curve Length of 6 (11 half tiles) gives a speed of 228km/h or 142mph
07:56:09  <Stablean> <Anson> ok, lower values :-) ..... CL 5 slows down trains with length 3.0001 to 133, but TL3 not at all, although that are 6 halftiles ?
07:56:28  <TWerkhoven> !clcalc erail 5
07:56:37  <TWerkhoven> @clcalc erail 5
07:56:37  <Webster> TWerkhoven: A rail Curve Length of 5 (9 half tiles) gives a speed of 216km/h or 135mph
07:56:46  <Stablean> <Anson> @clcalc erail 3
07:57:08  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> @@clcalc
07:57:09  <Webster> Stablean: (clcalc <railtype> [<tilt>] <cl|km/h>) -- For a number <30 this calculates the speed for <cl> on <railtype>. For any other numbers, this calculates the CL required for <railtype> travelling at <km/h>, assuming TL is small enough. [<tilt>] will apply tilt bonuses to the calculation.
07:57:16  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> thats what i wanted
07:58:23  <Stablean> <Anson> @clcalc erail 3
07:58:33  <Stablean> <Anson> ?????
07:58:35  <Stablean> <doonz> @@clcalc erail 3
07:58:35  <Webster> Stablean: (clcalc <railtype> [<tilt>] <cl|km/h>) -- For a number <30 this calculates the speed for <cl> on <railtype>. For any other numbers, this calculates the CL required for <railtype> travelling at <km/h>, assuming TL is small enough. [<tilt>] will apply tilt bonuses to the calculation.
07:58:43  <Stablean> <Anson> @clcalc erail3
07:58:50  <Stablean> <doonz> need two "@"
07:58:52  <TWerkhoven> need to use @@ instead of @
07:59:17  <Stablean> <Anson> i just had looked at what you seemed to have typed above
07:59:29  <Stablean> <Anson> only one @ there
07:59:46  <Stablean> <Anson> @@clcalc erail 3
07:59:47  <Webster> Stablean: (clcalc <railtype> [<tilt>] <cl|km/h>) -- For a number <30 this calculates the speed for <cl> on <railtype>. For any other numbers, this calculates the CL required for <railtype> travelling at <km/h>, assuming TL is small enough. [<tilt>] will apply tilt bonuses to the calculation.
07:59:48  <TWerkhoven> yes, single @ only works when in irc though, use @@ when ingame
08:00:08  <TWerkhoven> hmm
08:00:22  <Stablean> <Anson> just tried ... it only gives the help text when using @@
08:00:23  * TWerkhoven slaps webster about a bit with a wet trout
08:00:43  <Stablean> <Anson> @clcalc erail 3
08:00:50  <Stablean> <Anson> @@clcalc erail 3
08:00:51  <Webster> Stablean: (clcalc <railtype> [<tilt>] <cl|km/h>) -- For a number <30 this calculates the speed for <cl> on <railtype>. For any other numbers, this calculates the CL required for <railtype> travelling at <km/h>, assuming TL is small enough. [<tilt>] will apply tilt bonuses to the calculation.
08:00:53  <TWerkhoven> @@clcalc erail 3
08:00:59  <TWerkhoven> @clcalc erail 3
08:00:59  <Webster> TWerkhoven: A rail Curve Length of 3 (5 half tiles) gives a speed of 168km/h or 105mph
08:01:35  <Stablean> <Anson> seems to listen only to @@ from ingame, and interprets @@ always the same (as help)
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08:04:05  <Stablean> <Anson> x
08:04:25  <Anson> @clcalc erail 3.5
08:04:25  <Webster> Anson: A rail Curve Length of 3 (5 half tiles) gives a speed of 168km/h or 105mph
08:04:53  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> @@gap 5 3
08:04:53  <Webster> Stablean: (gap <trainlength> [<split>]) -- Returns minimum and maximum signal gap sizes for 2,3 and 4 linesplits with <trainlength>. If <spilt> is given it will return the gap sizes for <split> (+/-) 1.
08:05:02  <TWerkhoven> @gap 5 3
08:05:02  <Webster> TWerkhoven: For Trainlength of 5: <= 11 needs 2, 12 - 18 needs 3, 19 - 25 needs 4.
08:05:37  <Stablean> *** TWerkhoven has joined spectators
08:09:18  <Anson> @clcalc erail 1
08:09:18  <Webster> Anson: A rail Curve Length of 1 (1 half tiles) gives a speed of 88km/h or 55mph
08:09:36  <Anson> @clcalc erail 2
08:09:36  <Webster> Anson: A rail Curve Length of 2 (3 half tiles) gives a speed of 132km/h or 82mph
08:09:56  <Stablean> <Anson> hehe, i want to know the value for 6 half tiles ...
08:10:21  <TWerkhoven> [08:55:51] <@Webster> TWerkhoven: A rail Curve Length of 6 (11 half tiles) gives a speed of 228km/h or 142mph
08:10:40  <Stablean> <Anson> too stupid or too tired ? :-)
08:10:46  <TWerkhoven> too early in the mornin
08:10:53  <Stablean> <Anson> i want 6 halftiles, not 6 tiles (11 halftiles)
08:10:54  <TWerkhoven> so yes, too tired
08:11:00  <TWerkhoven> and lack of caffeine
08:11:09  <Stablean> <Anson> i didn't mean you, but me :-)
08:11:14  <TWerkhoven> @clcalc erail 3
08:11:14  <Webster> TWerkhoven: A rail Curve Length of 3 (5 half tiles) gives a speed of 168km/h or 105mph
08:11:29  <Stablean> <Anson> that is for 5 ... and for 6 ?
08:11:36  <TWerkhoven> 6 halftiles is an s-bend, doesnt count
08:11:44  <TWerkhoven> http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/Max_Curve_Speed
08:11:56  <Stablean> <doonz> for length 3 it will be 8.48528137423857 half tiles
08:13:27  <Stablean> <Anson> i have to sort that out later :-) ... on horizontals and verticals, TL and CL are easy to compute, just double the value :-)
08:13:45  <Stablean> <doonz> well length 3 in diagonal would be 4.242640687119285
08:13:45  <Stablean> <Anson> TL 3 needs 3 tiles or 6 halftiles ... correct ?
08:14:03  <Stablean> <doonz> TL 3 needs 5 half tiles
08:15:22  <TWerkhoven> doonz is correct
08:15:52  <TWerkhoven> getting a train to turn through 90 degrees always requires an odd number of half-tiles (diagonals)
08:17:32  <Stablean> <Anson> or an even number of halftiles (horz of vert)
08:18:08  <TWerkhoven> no, thats getting confused now
08:19:00  <Stablean> <Anson> track arrives diagionally, then one tile vert or horz, and another turn to continue diagonally ... that is a 90 deg turn on one entire vert or horz tile = 2 halftiles
08:19:19  <Stablean> *** TWerkhoven has started a new company (#5)
08:21:53  <Stablean> <Anson> and the speed reduction is always calculated from CL ?
08:22:11  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> yes
08:22:25  <Stablean> <Anson> in the wiki, they list halftiles (curvature) ... thus CL 0..13
08:23:00  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> because those are the most common curves
08:24:06  <TWerkhoven> http://blog.openttdcoop.org/2009/05/13/about-curve-lengths/
08:24:12  <Stablean> <Anson> it is cinfusing with all those different versions to explain the same ... like curvature, halftiles, tiles/2, CL (like TWerk used it as sign), CL (as i read it somewhere = halftiles), etc
08:24:31  <Stablean> <doonz> i think of it like this.. an infinitely long train has a speed reduction around CL(x), if the TL is less than the CL then there is no speed reduction
08:25:35  <Stablean> <Anson> and the wiki on game mechanics even tells ""Curvature" means the average number of wagons of the train between turns." ... which further increases confusion (not all wagons are halftiles when using newGRFs :-)
08:26:33  <TWerkhoven> rule of thumb still applies, if train fits entirely in the curve, it wont be slowed down
08:26:38  <Stablean> <doonz> yup
08:27:41  <Stablean> <doonz> cl required = (train length * 2)-1
08:28:44  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> that is a tl4 train
08:28:58  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> it should not get slowed down in that curve
08:29:31  <Stablean> <Anson> what is your definition of CL ? ... halftiles ? or the curvatire ? or the rounded value (CL2 = 4 halftiles vert/horz, CL2 = 3 halftiles diag) ?
08:29:38  <Stablean> <doonz> cl = half tiles
08:30:43  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> 7 halftiles like that, ==cl8
08:30:49  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> cl4 i mean
08:31:07  <Stablean> <doonz> isnt that cl 7?
08:31:59  <Stablean> <doonz> oh i count each tile the track passes through
08:32:35  <TWerkhoven> go to advanced settings, interface, display options
08:32:52  <TWerkhoven> turn on ' show measuremeant tooltip when using build-tools'
08:33:00  <Stablean> <doonz> i have it turned on
08:33:03  <Stablean> <Anson> hehe, when 7 diagonal halftiles are CL4 and 4 vert/horz tiles are CL4 too, then how do you name the CL for calculating the speed ?
08:33:04  <TWerkhoven> the lenght that that gives == cl
08:33:11  <Stablean> <doonz> oh ok
08:34:12  <TWerkhoven> and that length should be same as tl for trains not to slow down
08:34:46  <TWerkhoven> @clcalc erail 3
08:34:46  <Webster> TWerkhoven: A rail Curve Length of 3 (5 half tiles) gives a speed of 168km/h or 105mph
08:36:09  <Stablean> <Anson> then there are no speed limits to 150 or 182 (for 4 and 6 halftiles = 2 or 3 straight tiles) ?
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08:36:37  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> did you turn on that measurement tooltip thing?
08:37:36  <Stablean> <Anson> yes, but it doesn't help when i ask for the speed reduction of a CL4 ... CL4 (as you use it) can be 7 as well as 8 halftiles, and thus be a different speed
08:38:03  <TWerkhoven> no, max speed will apply to 7 half-tiles only
08:38:17  <TWerkhoven> 8 halftiles == s-bend, and has no speed reduction
08:38:32  <Stablean> <Anson> and when i have 4 vert or horz tiles = 8 halftiles, it is which max speed ???
08:42:57  <TWerkhoven> that would be cl4
08:43:01  <TWerkhoven> @clcalc erail 4
08:43:01  <Webster> TWerkhoven: A rail Curve Length of 4 (7 half tiles) gives a speed of 196km/h or 122mph
08:44:26  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> so the outer has same speedlimit where it sais cl2
08:44:32  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> but slightly higher where it sais cl3
08:47:34  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> look on the other side of red's tracks
08:50:32  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> anson: !here
08:55:20  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> your outer circle still has 4 cl2 corners in it
08:55:34  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> so yes, same limit
08:55:45  <Stablean> <Anson> i see that train changig speed all the time ... thus CL2 (straight) is not the same as CL2 (diag)
08:55:53  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> though trains may accellerate a bit when on the cl3 bits
08:56:33  <Stablean> <TWerkhoven> thats because it can accellerate between corners as it were
08:56:43  <Stablean> <Anson> on your inner circle with 3 halftile diagonals and 4 halftile straights, it alternates between 133 and 150
08:58:31  <Stablean> <Anson> 132 would be the value given by the wiki for curvature 3, and 151 for curvature 4 (which you both name "CL2")
08:59:21  <Stablean> <Anson> thus the two speed limits ARE different ... the two curvatuires are only the same when it comes to comparing the TL and whether there should be a reduction at all
09:01:43  <Stablean> <Anson> i checked your three circles at "!here" ... the above three lines of comment apply to those circles : you name it CL2, but it is not all the same
09:03:54  <TWerkhoven> @clcalc erail 2
09:03:54  <Webster> TWerkhoven: A rail Curve Length of 2 (3 half tiles) gives a speed of 132km/h or 82mph
09:04:22  <TWerkhoven> clcalc must give the lower speed so you always have a minimum to work to
09:04:25  <Stablean> <doonz> Twerkhoven do you want some starter cash?
09:04:33  <TWerkhoven> no thanks doonz
09:04:36  <TWerkhoven> not playing
09:04:37  <Stablean> <doonz> kk
09:04:56  <Stablean> <Anson> doesn't matter what the calc says .. it was programmed as a utiklity ... what counts is that we can see the speed ingame at the train window
09:05:29  <TWerkhoven> true
09:05:41  <TWerkhoven> but how often do you use the 151 max speed corner?
09:06:13  <Stablean> <Anson> thus i would suggest not to name both curves CL2, but (like the wiki does) count them as curve or curvature from 0 to 13
09:06:44  <Stablean> <Anson> would be quite easy to use CL = number of halftiles
09:07:18  <Stablean> <Anson> and your rounding of both curvatures to the same CL would only apply to determining whether there is a reduction at all
09:09:55  <planetmaker> counting generally is rather done in tiles
09:10:02  <planetmaker> also look at the train length ;-)
09:10:28  <planetmaker> IMHO the better approach would be to adjust the curve length definition which should not use half - tiles.
09:10:47  <planetmaker> As half-tiles is a quite stupid and arbitrary unit while tiles is a somewhat "natural" unit
09:11:51  <planetmaker> especially as the ingame measurement tool also works with tiles ;-)
09:12:26  <Stablean> <Anson> with all standard locos and wagons being a multiple of halftiles, that unit looks natural to me too :-)
09:12:48  <planetmaker> but it's not. As newgrfs break that assumption
09:13:03  <planetmaker> !info
09:13:03  <Stablean> planetmaker: http://stable.openttdcoop.org
09:13:28  <planetmaker> and everything then learnt would not be true anymore. For example like in this game.
09:13:38  <Stablean> <Anson> true ... and what is missing then is not the definition of CL, but the explanation that there are two different CL used ingame
09:13:39  <planetmaker> The wagons and engines are NOT 0.5 tiles length
09:13:49  <planetmaker> Just "fix" the wiki
09:13:58  <planetmaker> any length measurement *should* be in tiles
09:14:08  <Stablean> <Anson> one CL (your roundes value, or the tiles, or the length from the tooltip) determines whether a train is slowed down
09:14:15  <planetmaker> and that's what this calculation formula gives you: tiles. and as extra help also in half-tiles
09:14:25  <Stablean> <Anson> and the other is the old CL which gives the amount of slowdown
09:14:50  <planetmaker> there's no difference...
09:15:11  <planetmaker> a train has one length. Which can for instance be 1.5 tiles
09:15:21  <planetmaker> or 1.3
09:15:24  <planetmaker> or exactly 2.0
09:15:42  <planetmaker> thus anything <= 1.5 is not slowed down in above case and anything longer 1.5 tiles is.
09:15:51  <planetmaker> But there's nothing new and old about it. It all remained the same
09:16:27  <Stablean> <Anson> a train in a diagonal curve of 3 halftiles is slowed down if it is longer than the length tells you (2 tiles), but the amount of reduction is not calculated from length 2, but from 3 halftiles (1.5 tiles) !!!!
09:17:00  <planetmaker> the measurement tool just rounds.
09:17:10  <planetmaker> drag it one half-tile longer and it will still tell you length 2
09:17:23  <planetmaker> and round(1.5) = 2
09:17:52  <planetmaker> so the length given there is also correct within the given accuracy (0 trailing digits)
09:18:18  <Stablean> <Anson> that is the problem ... earlier it was said to use the length as curvelength since halftiles are "bad"
09:18:37  <planetmaker> half tiles are pointless
09:19:02  <planetmaker> the only "problem" which there is that the length measurement tool rounds to full tiles
09:19:12  <planetmaker> Which obviously confuses you as you don't consider rounding
09:19:16  <planetmaker> as possible
09:19:30  <Stablean> <Anson> but the length is rounded, and for the sped reduction, two different rounded values are used : whether to reduce by full units, and reduce by how much by half tiles
09:19:42  <planetmaker> length is not rounded...
09:19:59  <planetmaker> just the display of it in the distance measurement tool...
09:21:08  <planetmaker> write a small patch to fix the display of length to one trailing digit and ... your confusion would be gone. Don't confuse display and actual values ;-)
09:21:57  <planetmaker> you see that the rounding is only a display issue exactly when you compare the length displayed when dragging over three or four tiles in the | or -- view
09:22:19  <planetmaker> it will be 2 in both cases. But it's not internal rounding, but just the accuracy shown
09:22:30  <Stablean> <Anson> no, the confusion is still there ... a train with TL 3.0 is not slowed down in a curve with length 2.5 ... that is the problem
09:23:35  <Stablean> <doonz> yes
09:24:11  <Stablean> <doonz> the train wont be making a 90 degree turn.. so why would it slow down
09:24:29  <Stablean> <doonz> go to !here
09:24:35  <planetmaker> I'm not ingame :-P
09:24:53  <planetmaker> I'm the voice from the off ;-)
09:24:57  <Stablean> <doonz> :D
09:24:59  <Stablean> <Anson> everywhere, i can read that trains are not slowed down when they are shorter (or as long as) the curve ... but that is true only after rounding : TL 2.5 and curve 3.0
09:25:18  <TWerkhoven> !screen
09:25:28  <TWerkhoven> worth a shot
09:25:36  <Stablean> <doonz> train wont slow down if TL <= CL
09:25:54  <planetmaker> that's how it should be
09:26:13  <Stablean> <doonz> yup
09:26:26  <Stablean> <Anson> and it is like this :   roundup to integer ( TL ) <= roundup to integer (CL)
09:26:36  <Stablean> <doonz> if the train hits two corners then it'll slow down to the maximum speed of the CL
09:26:56  <planetmaker> *two corners which bend in the same direction ;-)
09:27:02  <Stablean> <Anson> doonz : wrong half of the time
09:27:02  <Stablean> <doonz> yep! :P
09:27:09  <Stablean> <doonz> i forgot that part haha
09:28:33  <Stablean> <Anson> i don't always send a train to a curve and stop it there to see whether cars are shown in one direction or another :-) ... and with some GRFs, cars move diagionally anyway :-) LOL
09:28:58  <TWerkhoven> that was just because he used cars from one grf and locs from another
09:29:20  <Stablean> <doonz> anson look !here
09:30:14  <Stablean> <Anson> thus i take the numbers, and when i seetwo  curves with 5and 6  halftiles, and a train with 3 tiles, then it does NOT not matter which of the two curves i am traveling
09:30:45  <Stablean> <doonz> im so confused lol.
09:31:23  <Stablean> <doonz> yea
09:31:37  <Stablean> <doonz> exactly
09:32:13  <Stablean> <doonz> IF the train is longer than CL3
09:32:17  <Stablean> <doonz> then the max speed will be 166
09:32:39  <planetmaker> hm... you're saying a train of TL=3 tiles travels w/o speed penalty around a 90° corner of 2.5 tiles?
09:33:05  <Stablean> <Anson> nice graphics, doonz ... both curves are the same when it comes to determining WHETHER the trains slows down ... but the max speed is different for the two CL3 curves !!!!
09:33:39  <Stablean> <Anson> yes ... for determinbing whether it is slowed, it is rounded up
09:34:01  <Stablean> <Anson> but when it is slowed, it is only rounded to halftiles and not entire tiles
09:34:16  <Stablean> <Anson> for determining which the max speed is
09:34:21  <Stablean> <doonz> planet were you asking me that question?
09:35:01  <planetmaker> generally :-)
09:35:22  <planetmaker> I should grab my train ticket, go home and test :-P
09:35:24  <Stablean> <doonz> tehe yeah i did mena that
09:35:39  <Stablean> <Anson> we found the problem when i looked at the track layout which doonz had done, and i commented on tight curves for his TL3 trains ... CL3 (3 halftiles) really slowed down the trains, but CL5 (5 halftiles) did not slow them down at all
09:37:19  <Stablean> <doonz> an infinitely long train will have a max speed of 166 around that corner
09:37:43  <Stablean> <Anson> and during the discussion, TWerk was nice enough to explain and show test layouts, etc ... but he always names both curves the same, eg CL3 for a 5 halftile diagonal and a 6 halftile (3 tile) straight
09:39:03  <Stablean> <Anson> for determining whether the trains slows down, that naming is good, since both are the same for this decion (only) ... and they are different for the amount of reduction
09:40:01  <Stablean> <Anson> that's why i would vote to still count the curves in halftiles :no slowdown from entire tile length and  max is calculated from the halftiles
09:41:23  <Stablean> <Anson> btw : since the wikis never speak of the shown length or rounded up length or similar, i tried always to make curves longer than necessary, eg 8+ halftiles for TL4
09:45:42  <Stablean> <doonz> ;D
09:48:08  <Stablean> <doonz> eh
09:48:52  <Stablean> <Anson> graphic glitch on several trains with multiple locos ... example at "!looks ...."
09:50:04  <Stablean> <Anson> the last wagon is made to look as a reversed loco ... nice feature, but the additional locos of some of those types are messed up
09:50:36  <Stablean> <doonz> i think the same happens with the standard grfs too
09:51:02  <Stablean> <Anson> on one such train, the additional locos looked like wagons, while the wagons were recolored to match the original loco
09:51:44  <Stablean> <Anson> and it is not possible to put an engine elsewhere besides the train head ... nor to reverse it
09:53:11  <Stablean> <doonz> anyway im off for a bit
09:53:27  <Stablean> <Anson> hehe, logic is a bit difficult when it comes to an ICE with multiple engines, when in reality, only whole (half?) trains (and two ends :-) can be added to each other
09:53:37  <Stablean> *** doonz has joined spectators
09:53:42  <Stablean> <doonz> haha
09:53:44  <Stablean> <doonz> stoooppp
09:54:40  * planetmaker now grabbed the ticket, went home and can now look ;-)
09:54:50  <Stablean> <doonz> haha what on earth
09:54:58  <TWerkhoven> lol
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10:00:38  <Stablean> <Anson> and allowing one train to enter while another just leaves
10:00:57  <Stablean> *** doonz has joined spectators
10:06:15  <planetmaker> hm, well, I see. So a TL3 train also travels un-slowed through a 2.5 tile curve....
10:07:09  <Stablean> <Anson> yes ... i found that strange ... but also nice :-)
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10:07:57  <Stablean> <Anson> it would be annoying, when a train of TL3 needs a diagonal of 7 halftiles (3.5 tiles) when it looks longer on the diagonal anyway
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10:09:57  <Stablean> <Anson> thus i find rounding up nice ... it only should be better documented that there are two CL, for determining whether and by how much trains are slowed, and maybe even a hint that some people count both values as the same CL (when they mostly want to use "no slowdown") while other sources give different CL
10:15:35  <planetmaker> there are not two CLs... and... if you think it needs better documentation: it's a wiki!
10:16:00  <planetmaker> it lives from the contributions of *everyone*
10:17:26  <planetmaker> and you being confused (or me) obviously indicates need for better documentation ;-)
10:19:20  <Stablean> *** leg3nd joined the game
10:19:59  <Stablean> <Anson> i didn't play enough multiplayer games to know how people treat curves, how they speak about them (do they say curve radius,curve  length, CL, curvature, what else?) and what they mean by those units (halftiles, entire tiles,length as shown on the tooltip), etc ...
10:20:19  <Stablean> <Anson> i think for some people, it is almost religious to have it in a special way :-)
10:22:17  <Stablean> *** leg3nd has left the game (leaving)
10:24:07  <planetmaker> Anson: then just make clear on that page what *you* mean with the words *you* use ;-)
10:24:15  <planetmaker> That'd be better anyway when discussing that
10:27:08  <Stablean> <Anson> might do that, but probably will take a long time before i get to it ... need to take care of RL things quite often and suddenly, learn working as editor in wikis :-) and do more tests
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11:45:33  <Stablean> <DnZ-Ali> hi
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12:57:19  <Stablean> <Sylf> mornin'
12:57:27  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> moin
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17:19:55  <Stablean> Sylf: you must be channel op to use getsave
17:22:29  *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Sylf
17:33:57  <Sylf> !players
17:34:00  <Stablean> Sylf: Client 949 (Green) is Anson, in company 2 (Anson Transport)
17:36:42  <Sylf> !date
17:36:42  <Stablean> Sylf:  4 Apr 2093
17:36:58  <Sylf> !rcon ls
17:36:58  <Stablean> Sylf: 0) .. (Parent directory)
17:36:58  <Stablean> Sylf: 1) archive/ (Directory)
17:36:58  <Stablean> Sylf: 2) StableTempS01.sav
17:36:58  <Stablean> Sylf: 3) StableTropS01.sav
17:36:58  <Stablean> Sylf: 4) StableArcS01.sav
17:36:59  <Stablean> Sylf: you have 20 more messages
17:37:05  <Sylf> !rcon load 2
17:37:12  <Stablean> *** Game still paused (manual, number of players)
17:37:39  <Stablean> *** Sylf joined the game
17:37:47  <Sylf> !rcon reset_company 1
17:37:47  <Stablean> Sylf: Company deleted.
17:37:48  <Sylf> !auto
17:37:48  <Stablean> *** Sylf has enabled autopause mode.
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18:16:38  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> who used Nutracks 1.1.1?
18:16:48  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> with standard settings?
18:17:29  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> or who keeps making these maps?
18:31:49  <Stablean> *** BennyCZ joined the game
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18:42:03  <Stablean> <Phil> wtf
18:42:09  <Stablean> <Phil> no rvs?
18:43:31  <Sylf> it's too early for any RVs
18:43:43  <Sylf> they'll be available in 1935 or so
18:43:53  <Stablean> <Phil> aha ok :)
18:44:07  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> Oh so this is a sylf map
18:44:21  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> sylf use nutracks 1.0.0 next time
18:44:29  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> look less like grey poo on the screen
18:58:34  <Stablean> *** Timmaexx joined the game
18:58:39  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> Top Gear is back I am going afk
18:58:43  <Stablean> *** Chris Booth has joined spectators
18:58:45  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> Moin
18:59:05  <Stablean> <Phil> HEY TIM
18:59:07  <Stablean> <Phil> oops cap
18:59:11  <Stablean> <Phil> oo top gear
18:59:21  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> Hey
18:59:23  <Stablean> <Phil> i might watch it too
18:59:47  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> where's your TV located?
18:59:51  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> UK?#
19:00:01  <Stablean> <Phil> yeah im in england
19:00:15  <Stablean> <Phil> as is chris i believe
19:00:35  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> too much industries i think...
19:01:10  <Stablean> *** Timmaexx has started a new company (#3)
19:01:50  <Stablean> <Phil> there;s alot for sure
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20:01:28  <Stablean> *** Chris Booth joined the game
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20:01:44  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> film has ended?
20:01:52  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> film?
20:01:56  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> movie
20:01:58  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> not a film top gear
20:01:58  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> sorry
20:02:06  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> no?
20:02:39  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> Top Gear is possibly the best tv show ...........................................................................................................................................................    in the world
20:02:49  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> oh sorry
20:02:51  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> :D
20:03:03  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> lol
20:03:10  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> have you not heard of it?
20:03:20  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> I am from Germany :D
20:03:26  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> so
20:03:45  <Stablean> <leg3nd> Any wanna join me ?
20:03:53  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> Top Gear is an international car show
20:05:06  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> hmm... really never heard about it... well the only motor series I know are F1 and DTM and shows? There's one stock car challenge show but thats it
20:05:45  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> take it you don't take a huge interst in cars
20:06:06  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> maybe ;)
20:06:28  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> I am sure it is braodcast in germany
20:06:34  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> I know there was a german spin off
20:06:42  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> but not sure of the name
20:06:52  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> I will take a look on Wiki
20:10:26  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> still no good UKRS 2 locos
20:10:32  *** leg3nd has joined #openttdcoop.stable
20:10:48  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> I just use NARS...
20:11:50  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> leg3nd: you can join me if you wish
20:11:52  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> and coop with me
20:11:54  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> Top Gear had ten episodes on free tv in germany...
20:12:21  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> then it was send back to paytv
20:12:23  <leg3nd> Arr okay chris i would like that since starting new company is really tedius :<
20:12:31  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> #
20:12:35  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> it is
20:12:49  <Stablean> <leg3nd> What happend at you station :>
20:12:55  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> he you have a big comp, haven't you?
20:12:55  <Stablean> <leg3nd> farm disaper ?
20:13:10  <leg3nd> timmaexx me ?
20:13:13  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> which station?
20:13:21  <leg3nd> chuntfield woods
20:13:23  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> ye4a you
20:13:34  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> no its just opened
20:13:46  <leg3nd> (CPU 1) Intel Core i5 CPU 760 @ 2.80GHz (1024KB L2 Cache, LGA1156) @ 1176MHz (160MHz FSB), 7% load
20:13:48  <leg3nd> Not that big. but its okay.
20:14:15  <leg3nd> how come timmaexx ?
20:14:21  <Stablean> <Phil> my c is quite powerful
20:14:29  <Stablean> <Phil> was uber when i bought it
20:14:37  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> I meant company... not computer ;)
20:14:39  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> you don't need a power full shiny new PC for openttd
20:14:45  <Stablean> <Phil> ah ok doh
20:14:51  <Stablean> <Phil> yeah i know you don't
20:14:53  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> you need the best single core P4 or AMD XP you can find
20:14:59  <Stablean> <Phil> but this isn't the only game i play :)
20:15:00  <leg3nd> my company aint that big. just startede it. and have max loan :>
20:15:35  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> my nice i7 doesn't do me any better than my P4 3.2 when playing openttd
20:15:49  <Stablean> <Phil> yep same here
20:15:52  <leg3nd> i can feel its my gfx that suck :>
20:15:53  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> hö? 510.000 DM are available encore
20:15:59  <Stablean> <Phil> i have an i7 920 @ 4.2 gig
20:16:08  <Stablean> <Phil> and gtx 295
20:16:14  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> Phil: that is impossible
20:16:16  <leg3nd> just a bad hd5770
20:16:20  <Stablean> <Phil> err no it's not
20:16:28  <Stablean> <Phil> i have thermaltake expressar case
20:16:38  <Stablean> <Phil> it's easily doable
20:16:39  <leg3nd> corsair d700 :>
20:16:43  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> no way can you overclock a i7 920 to 4.2 ghz
20:16:47  <leg3nd> Now we are talking cases with space :>
20:16:49  <Stablean> <Phil> dude
20:16:52  <Stablean> <Phil> i already have
20:16:54  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> no in 1 million years
20:17:09  <Stablean> <Phil> gime your email address and i'll prove it with photo
20:17:18  <leg3nd> chris not completly untrue. i can take my i5 760 to 4ghz.
20:17:31  <Stablean> <Phil> my case has a phase change cooling system
20:17:31  <leg3nd> with prober cooling. but my ram is not stable enough.
20:17:33  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> chris_peter_booth@hotmail.co.uk
20:17:42  <Stablean> <Phil> ok i'll email you
20:17:48  <Stablean> <Phil> gimme a few
20:17:58  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> I high doubt it, I have the i7 930 and max I get out of this is 3.8
20:18:13  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> otherwise it overheats when I put it under stress
20:18:23  <Stablean> <Phil> yeah do you have a phase change cooling systen?
20:18:31  <Stablean> <Phil> phase change is better than water
20:18:44  <Stablean> <Phil> works like a fridge freezer
20:18:46  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> I have watercooling as it is quite
20:18:56  <Stablean> <Phil> google thermaltake expressar
20:19:10  <Stablean> <Phil> mine on full load sounds like chest freezer in tescos lol
20:19:35  <leg3nd> :>
20:20:23  <Stablean> <Phil> i have 2 bios profiles for clocking
20:20:39  <leg3nd> chris will join when im out of debt
20:20:41  <Stablean> <Phil> one is 3.8 gig and one is 4.2 i'll email pics of both
20:20:43  <Stablean> <Phil> brb
20:23:58  <Stablean> <Phil> chris any idea how to stop my clock speed dropping to 2.1gig when games are minmized?
20:24:09  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> turn of intel turbo
20:24:11  <Stablean> <Phil> ah
20:24:14  <Stablean> <Phil> nm i figured it out
20:25:34  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> with such bad trains I do want to run any more trains on my ML
20:25:47  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> but dont want to expand it as they suck on hills
20:25:56  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> and don't want to change to NARS locos
20:26:19  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> this is quite a quagmire I am in
20:26:21  <leg3nd> okay okay :>
20:26:32  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> NARS is cooler ;)
20:26:42  <Stablean> <Phil> umm chris is that turbo setting in bios?
20:26:44  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> no way UKRS FTW
20:27:08  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> not sure intel droped it in the i7 930
20:27:16  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> so I don't have to turn it off
20:27:24  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> just some stupid energy saving feature
20:27:34  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> just screen shot with game in back ground
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20:28:18  <Stablean> <Phil> i've tried css in windowed mode but still for somereason when i tab something above it it drops back down to 2.2 gig even though the picture is on screen
20:28:35  <Twerkhoven[L]> overheating?
20:28:50  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> or chip is running at 2.2
20:28:56  <Stablean> <Phil> neither
20:29:07  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> chip should drop from 4 - 2.2 that fast
20:29:17  <Stablean> <Phil> it's instant mate
20:29:20  <Stablean> <Phil> no lag
20:29:25  <leg3nd> Wee out of debt :>
20:29:32  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> then its not turbo
20:29:38  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> turbo takes time to react
20:29:44  <Stablean> <Phil> no i need to turn turbo on
20:29:44  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> industrys production increases if station rating is above 75% right?
20:29:58  <Stablean> <Phil> let me go into bios and find that turbo setting
20:30:05  <Stablean> <Phil> brb
20:30:10  <Twerkhoven[L]> 70-90% i think
20:30:14  <leg3nd> Chris privat the pass
20:30:21  <Stablean> *** Phil has left the game (connection lost)
20:30:26  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> thanks
20:30:44  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> leg3nd: you must make sure you build properly
20:31:11  <leg3nd> I will do my upmost best :>
20:31:37  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> legend, you have no more loan, what's the problem?
20:31:49  <leg3nd> hehe now when i think of it.
20:31:54  <leg3nd> nothing really.
20:32:08  <leg3nd> and i even have to go to bed soon, early morgning work :<
20:32:31  <leg3nd> Got it chris but thanks anyway. have to go to bed in 30 minz anyway.
20:32:44  <leg3nd> now you are also sure i dont fuck your network up :>
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20:34:39  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> yay mineral 0-8-0
20:35:28  <Stablean> *** Phil joined the game
20:35:32  <Stablean> <Phil> turbo mode was enabled
20:35:52  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> i told you
20:36:33  <Stablean> *** twerkhoven joined the game
20:43:30  <Stablean> <Phil> there mate i email u
20:43:56  <Stablean> <Phil> i thought u said to stop the clock dropping turbo mode needed to enabled
20:44:15  <Stablean> <Phil> and actually it's not 4.2 gig
20:44:17  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> no dissabled
20:44:27  <Stablean> <Phil> it's 4.09
20:44:31  <Stablean> <Phil> so 4.1
20:44:35  <Stablean> <Phil> oh my bad
20:44:40  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> you are pirty much double box clock still
20:44:52  <Stablean> <Phil> well i mamged to get it to work
20:44:56  <Stablean> <Phil> yeah
20:45:15  <Stablean> <Phil> i could probably push it further
20:45:22  <Stablean> <Phil> but i have 3.8 gig and 4.1
20:45:28  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> not something I would recomend
20:45:39  <Stablean> <Phil> i can't tell the differance between either in a gaming experiance
20:45:43  <Stablean> <Phil> nah i dodn't intend to
20:46:21  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> you will not the game will stop with your GPU or HDD befor you use 4.1 ghz
20:46:32  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> on a mutli core machine
20:46:36  <Stablean> <Phil> maybe gets an extra 1000 cpu on vanatge or something if i use 4.1 instead of 3.8
20:46:46  <Stablean> <Phil> yeah my gtx 295 is a bottle neck
20:47:00  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> why buy Nvidia?
20:47:19  <Stablean> <Phil> i wanted to sli them but there's no room in my case to fit two of them in with this cooling system so i couldn't  :(
20:47:38  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> ooh I would still buy ATI
20:47:43  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> even if you want to sli them
20:47:56  <Stablean> <Phil> i've always bougth nvida
20:48:02  <Stablean> <Phil> just a habit i guess
20:48:12  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> ati is cheaper faster and quiter
20:48:30  <Stablean> <Phil> yeah i know the new lot are
20:48:41  <Stablean> <Phil> but when i bought mine gtx 295 was king
20:48:51  <Stablean> <Phil> my machine is 2 years old almost
20:48:55  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> realy? no 5800 HD around then?
20:49:04  * Twerkhoven[L] looks at his 9600gt
20:49:21  <Stablean> <Phil> dunno what was arround but at the time 295 was the powerful by far
20:49:40  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> I am lucky with my 8500GT
20:49:54  <Twerkhoven[L]> this lappy has a geforce 420go
20:50:06  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> TWerkhoven my 9600 GSO in the P4 wis worse :D
20:50:32  <Stablean> <Phil> i've considered upgrading to 2 new nvida and sling them but even the best nvida now dual sli isn't much an improvment on the gtx 295 when u take into account how much it would cost
20:51:26  <Stablean> *** Phil has joined company #6
20:53:29  <Stablean> <Phil> hehe yeah on board cards are bad
20:53:40  <Stablean> <Phil> and i hate laptops in general for gaming
20:54:02  <Stablean> <Phil> they are probably ok for this game though
20:54:14  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> the new Apple, Macbook Pros and Alienwares are nice
20:54:15  <Twerkhoven[L]> it lets me surf
20:54:24  <Twerkhoven[L]> and play ottd as long as theres not too many trains
20:54:45  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> lol your CPU will stop you doing that on the laptop
20:54:56  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> but my 1.6 core2duo does a quite good job
20:54:58  <Stablean> <Phil> yeah aw are nice,  you pay £700 for lights and a name lol
20:55:07  <Stablean> <Phil> but you*
20:55:22  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> Phil: then you would hate my laptop
20:55:38  <Stablean> <Phil> haha no i like alieanware
20:55:43  <Stablean> <Phil> i'd just never buy one
20:55:53  <Stablean> <Phil> if that makes sense
20:55:55  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> no I have a Dell Adamo XPS
20:56:14  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> realy stlye of substance
20:56:23  <Stablean> <Phil> haha ok
20:56:33  <Stablean> <Phil> twek how many trains is too much?
20:56:38  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> its dells answer to the macbook air
20:56:46  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> 9
20:56:52  <Stablean> <Phil> lol
20:57:03  <Stablean> <Phil> i've head of the xps
20:57:06  <Twerkhoven[L]> with firewall on, 2-300, now, 8-900+ will make it noisy but not too bad lag-wise
20:57:10  <Stablean> <Phil> i've just never looked at them
20:57:20  <Twerkhoven[L]> its an amd athlon m 2400+ or so
20:57:26  <Twerkhoven[L]> 1.8GHz
20:57:36  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> I hate that about AMD
20:57:46  <Twerkhoven[L]> 2200+ even
20:57:50  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> if you sell a 2400 it should be 2400mhz
20:58:01  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> which would be ~ 2.3 gzh
20:58:03  <Twerkhoven[L]> i've always been an intel boy, but i bought this cheap secondhand some years ago
20:58:13  <Twerkhoven[L]> back when i lived in the netherlands, yet it has a uk keyboard
20:58:27  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> UK keyboard wow
20:58:36  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> with £ sign and everything?
20:58:39  <Twerkhoven[L]> yes
20:58:45  <Stablean> <Phil> :O
20:58:47  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> wow that is rare
20:58:49  <Twerkhoven[L]> i set it to us layout though, as im so used to that
20:58:53  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> I hate UK keyboards
20:59:06  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> I buy US keyboards
20:59:18  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> but nice for coding
20:59:27  <Twerkhoven[L]> so do i, but then in the netherlands they all tend to be us=international
20:59:38  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> just find the keys are better located on US keyboards
21:00:00  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> realy? though NL was like germany and had QWERTZ
21:00:16  <Twerkhoven[L]> im sure they are sold
21:00:21  <Twerkhoven[L]> majority is us-i though
21:00:35  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> oh you learn something new everyday
21:00:38  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> germany has qwertz
21:00:40  <Twerkhoven[L]> we don't have very many special characters like poundsign or ringel-s
21:01:02  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> do you have the € logo on E?
21:01:10  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> what about a with top hats?
21:01:30  <Twerkhoven[L]> they tend to get ignored much cb
21:01:33  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> I like the 'A' with a top hat
21:01:36  <Twerkhoven[L]> ctrl-alt+5
21:01:43  <Twerkhoven[L]> i think
21:01:45  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> reminds me of a little chinese man
21:01:48  <Twerkhoven[L]> dont use it much
21:02:38  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> I bought myself a new keyboard to try out, but I need to practice with is, its a DAVORAK
21:02:54  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> or something
21:03:04  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> supposed to be the fastest way to type
21:03:04  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> DAVORK???
21:03:10  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> but its still just sitting in the box
21:03:16  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> thats the ticket
21:03:19  <Twerkhoven[L]> vorak
21:03:21  <Twerkhoven[L]> dvorak
21:03:34  <Twerkhoven[L]> where dvorak replaces qwerty
21:03:50  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> that was cleas but that it exists not ;)
21:03:52  <Twerkhoven[L]> so not only are the special keys different, also all the letters
21:03:54  <Stablean> <Phil> i want an optimus maximus
21:03:58  <Stablean> * Chris Booth wonders if there is a mac wireless keyboard in that layout
21:04:05  <Stablean> <Phil> they keyboards rule
21:04:38  <Stablean> <Phil> each key is an led screen and you program to show any picture and all key are 100% remappable
21:04:43  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> that would stop my house mates using my mac pro
21:04:55  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> wow sick
21:05:01  <Stablean> <Phil> google it
21:05:05  <Stablean> <Phil> optimusmaximus
21:05:09  <Twerkhoven[L]> yup
21:05:11  <Stablean> <Phil> costs about £1200
21:05:52  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> I want dihedrals kick_player_script back... :(
21:06:20  <Twerkhoven[L]> ?
21:06:39  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> wasn't a script
21:06:41  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> was a patch
21:06:43  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> Dihedral had an auto-nightly server for years
21:06:49  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> AFAIk it was a script
21:06:51  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> server was pathed to kick players
21:06:57  <Twerkhoven[L]> lol
21:07:07  <Twerkhoven[L]> randomly or for a purpose?
21:07:07  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> may be an AP+ exension
21:07:15  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> on purpose
21:07:25  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> Because in this time there were hours with sixteen "Player"
21:07:27  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> autonightly was the server used to find bugs
21:07:35  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> and you got a cookie if you crashed it
21:07:37  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> or found a bug
21:07:44  <Twerkhoven[L]> ah
21:08:36  <Stablean> *** Player has left the game (leaving)
21:13:15  <Stablean> *** Chris Booth has joined spectators
21:13:17  <Stablean> *** Player has joined spectators
21:13:21  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> XD
21:13:39  <leg3nd> Hmm now its time for bed.
21:13:46  <Stablean> *** leg3nd has joined spectators
21:13:55  <Stablean> <Phil> gn leg
21:13:58  <leg3nd> GN
21:14:00  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> gn
21:14:15  <leg3nd> be my guest to take over the network if any want.
21:14:18  <Stablean> *** Player has left the game (leaving)
21:14:24  <Stablean> *** leg3nd has joined company #4
21:14:38  <Stablean> *** leg3nd has joined spectators
21:15:05  <Stablean> *** leg3nd has joined company #4
21:15:11  <Stablean> *** leg3nd has joined spectators
21:15:18  <leg3nd> There now anyone can take it :>
21:15:46  <Stablean> *** leg3nd has left the game (leaving)
21:19:25  *** leg3nd has quit IRC
21:28:44  <Stablean> <Phil> wtf @ pbs
21:28:55  <Stablean> <Phil> trains stop at them for no reason
21:29:11  <Stablean> <Phil> or am i doing something wrong?
21:29:34  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> where?
21:29:49  <Stablean> <Phil> check !here
21:30:27  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> whats exactly the problem?
21:30:49  <Stablean> <Phil> when a train arrives and the coast is clear it still stops
21:30:56  <Stablean> <Phil> one is arriving now just watch it
21:31:19  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> lol
21:31:30  <Stablean> <twerkhoven> odd
21:31:32  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> I would say bu
21:31:34  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> bug
21:31:52  <Stablean> <Phil> i hardly use them
21:32:07  <Stablean> <Phil> so thought maybe it working as intended llol
21:32:10  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> try to reproduce it in nightly
21:32:37  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> please report it in both possible cases
21:32:57  <Stablean> <Phil> where do i report such stuff?
21:33:48  <Stablean> <Phil> and is it important to nnote what trains and carriges im using etc?
21:34:13  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> i don't think so
21:34:44  <Stablean> <Phil> how about where to report?
21:34:58  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> bugs.openttd.org
21:35:12  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> you are native speaker?
21:35:51  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> If not, i can try to explain it tthere, I have an account
21:35:57  <Stablean> <Phil> catagory = core?
21:36:24  <Stablean> <Phil> is native kanguage german if yes, then no im not
21:36:34  <Stablean> <Phil> if english then yes i am
21:36:52  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> I'd say PBS
21:37:14  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> I meant, if you aren't english nativespeaker, I would try it
21:37:36  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> but as you are, you can explain it better
21:37:42  <Stablean> <Phil> ok
21:37:48  <Stablean> <Phil> first i need to register
21:38:15  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> I don't know if PBS or YAPF is the better category
21:39:44  <Twerkhoven[L]> pbs
21:39:59  <Twerkhoven[L]> yapf will only tell the train where to go, not where to stop i think
21:40:02  <Stablean> *** BennyCZ joined the game
21:40:08  <Twerkhoven[L]> pbs will only do stop or go, but not where
21:40:55  <Stablean> <Phil> can someone email me the save game?
21:41:09  <Stablean> <twerkhoven> just save it yourself?
21:41:15  <Stablean> <Phil> /doh
21:41:19  <Stablean> <Phil> lol
21:41:37  <Stablean> <Phil> so some reason i though it was server side only
21:41:56  <Stablean> <Phil> no idea why though because i;ve saved many a game from here
21:41:59  <Stablean> *** BennyCZ has left the game (leaving)
21:42:08  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> lol
21:42:14  <Stablean> <twerkhoven> lol
21:44:23  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> What would be the best loc for Drindingbury South to * Height?
21:47:09  <Stablean> <Phil> bug reported
21:47:13  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> :)
21:47:15  <Twerkhoven[L]> anything that can accelerate
21:47:28  <Twerkhoven[L]> look for accelleration rather than top speed
21:47:47  <Stablean> *** twerkhoven has joined company #4
21:48:14  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> you mean power?
21:48:42  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> or max. tractive effort?
21:49:43  <Twerkhoven[L]> i think power is flat-land accelleration, and te is for hills, i can never remember though
21:50:10  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> so i take te because of the bridge?
21:50:18  <Twerkhoven[L]> go for the ef1?
21:50:32  <Twerkhoven[L]> nah, is only one elevation
21:50:44  <Twerkhoven[L]> you want its top speed reached fast as its a short distance
21:51:06  <Twerkhoven[L]> rather than a high top speed it might not reach (granted its not that short)
21:52:50  <Twerkhoven[L]> i would go for the ef1 due to the low running cost
21:52:56  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> ef1?
21:53:01  <Twerkhoven[L]> its an electric loc
21:53:09  <Twerkhoven[L]> so you'll need to electrify that line with catenary
21:53:15  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> ah
21:53:21  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> :P
21:54:43  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> the next time it visits the depot it will be replaced
21:54:53  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> thanks for your councelling
21:55:01  <Stablean> *** twerkhoven has joined spectators
21:57:11  <Twerkhoven[L]> nps
22:00:21  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> good
22:00:24  <Stablean> <Timmaexx> night
22:00:46  <Stablean> *** Timmaexx has left the game (leaving)
22:00:52  <Stablean> <Phil> GOOD NIGHT
22:01:01  <Twerkhoven[L]> cya
22:01:25  * Twerkhoven[L] shall retire as wel
22:01:27  <Twerkhoven[L]> gnite
22:01:33  <Stablean> <Phil> cya :)
22:01:35  <Stablean> *** twerkhoven has left the game (leaving)
22:02:03  *** Twerkhoven[L] has quit IRC
22:19:24  <Stablean> *** Chris Booth has joined company #2
22:51:53  <Stablean> <Chris Booth> No fast erail
22:52:00  <Stablean> <Phil> no :(
22:52:21  <Stablean> <Phil> what year is medium available?
22:53:11  <Stablean> *** Chris Booth has left the game (leaving)
23:17:15  <Stablean> *** Phil has left the game (leaving)
23:17:15  <Stablean> *** Game paused (number of players)

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