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Log for #openttdcoop.stable on 22nd August 2015:
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00:07:39  <coopserver> <Anson> do you need some ? i think we have enough for the near future (2 fruit + 2 maize)
00:26:22  <coopserver> <Lisbon> funding new buildings still works
00:26:42  <coopserver> <Lisbon> it's not great if they don't have food/water but it's something
00:35:12  <coopserver> <Anson> we have food and water now, but it could be a little more water to balance those two
00:36:28  <coopserver> <Anson> since we have so little water, i checked the water supplies, and don't understand it ... one has only 38% transported, the second 67%, and the third 73%
00:37:18  <coopserver> <Anson> but they all have always one or even two trains waiting, and those trains have speed 200+ ... should give nice rating and thus good transport percentage !?!?
00:37:32  <coopserver> <Lisbon> yeah that seems weird
00:38:29  <coopserver> <Anson> sometimes the percentages go up by 1 or 2 points, and then back down to 38
00:39:28  <coopserver> <Anson> in the middle of the desert, with no other people around, thus nobody stealing ...
00:41:02  <coopserver> <Anson> the production of those water supplies also decreases over time ... down from 36 to 12 only, down from 60+ to 24, down from 100+ to 81
00:42:01  <coopserver> <Anson> with those low percentages, it's no wonder that production decreases over time ... but why, and do i have to fund more and more water supplies to get at least a bit of water ?
00:43:07  <coopserver> <Anson> maybe it is a bug related to the "smaller mines" grf ?
00:45:36  <coopserver> <Anson> strange again ... one of the water supplies just was up to 84% transported, but then doubed production from 6 to 12, then back to 6, and on each change transport% dropped: from 84 to 71 to 67 (the old "constant" value)
00:53:56  <Sylf> !date
00:53:57  <coopserver> Jan 06 2013
00:54:13  <Sylf> how is that exactly strange?
00:55:29  <Sylf> also the percentage number for stations is not how much you've transported
00:55:53  <Sylf> it's a performance rating of how "well" you're serving the station
00:56:19  <Sylf> including age of the vehicle, max speed of the vehicle etc
00:56:56  <coopserver> <Anson> yes, it's almost the same as station rating, which shows almost identical values
00:57:23  <Sylf> Then, based on the percentage score of the station, the industry provide that much of produced cargo to the station
00:57:46  <coopserver> <Anson> but it's strange when a relatively new train which has speed 200+ is always at the station, thus no cargo is waiting, and still the rating is below 40
00:58:37  <Sylf> "new" only uplies 0 or 1 year old vehicles
00:58:57  <Sylf> anything older gets no new vehicle bonus
00:59:58  <coopserver> <Anson> all my other stations have ratings around 89% ... but all water stations have ratings of only 34 to 75
01:00:52  <coopserver> <Anson> same station layouit, 2 platforms, always 1 or 2 trains waiting, identical engines, ... why are water stations so much worse than all the rest ?
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01:01:44  <coopserver> <Anson> kristnes water supply just went from 34 to 54, but usually is soon will drop back to 34
01:02:34  <coopserver> <Sylf> your smallest waterwell is shutting down
01:03:10  <coopserver> <Anson> and kirk even closes soon since production dropped from 70 to 6 (although rating is 75%) ... really bad luck on the random generator for only (and for all) of the water stations ?
01:03:16  <coopserver> <Sylf> industries like water supplies stockpile some cargo before delivering to the station
01:03:36  <coopserver> <Sylf> so the days between cargo pickup naturally is greater than some other cargo
01:03:47  <coopserver> <Sylf> you lose station rating points because of that
01:04:38  <coopserver> <Anson> OH ... invisible piles ... that would explain a lot, since big piles can give a LOT of -%
01:05:46  <coopserver> <Anson> maybe intended to simulate that water in a desert is no endless resource ? :-)
01:06:31  <coopserver> <Anson> but annoying when you need water to grow towns, and have to prospect water supplies a dozen times until you get one that requires only building across half the map
01:08:34  <Sylf> I was wrong
01:08:59  <Sylf> water supply has very small stockpile, just like coal mine or oil well etc
01:09:31  <Sylf> it's the two plantation that has relatively big stockpile - will not deliver any quantity smaller than 15
01:10:00  <Sylf> forest/cotton candy forest/battery farm has the biggest requirement - minimum 30 per delivery
01:10:53  <coopserver> <Anson> what can i do to improve the rating of Kristnes Valley ?
01:11:05  <coopserver> <Sylf> build statue
01:11:22  <coopserver> <Sylf> do large advertising campaign
01:11:31  <coopserver> <Anson> it was 34 for a few years, now at 55, or 53, maybe dropping back to 34 soon
01:11:44  <coopserver> <Anson> it already has a statue
01:12:02  <coopserver> <Anson> and it has trains with speed 200+ waiting all the time, no visible stockpiles
01:12:32  <coopserver> <Sylf> like I said, large advertising/marketing
01:13:13  <coopserver> <Anson> what is different at the water stations ? all my other stations have ratinghs around 89%
01:13:24  <coopserver> <Sylf> I don't know
01:14:00  <coopserver> <Sylf> spawn more water supplies instead of worrying about 1 station
01:14:11  <coopserver> <Sylf> it may be an openttd bug
01:14:19  <coopserver> <Lisbon> i'll do it for you
01:14:23  <coopserver> <Sylf> most likely not related to water supply
01:14:37  <coopserver> <Lisbon> there prospected nine times
01:14:42  <coopserver> <Lisbon> rip bank account
01:15:25  <coopserver> <Lisbon> oh jeez
01:15:30  <coopserver> <Lisbon> that was more than i had to begin with
01:16:39  <coopserver> <Sylf> anson had 3 times as much money as you did before you funded those water supplies...
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01:20:59  <Sylf> Fellini, did you see my train length sorter in the last PSG?
01:21:15  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> yes, i did
01:21:44  <Sylf> ok, good
01:22:00  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> thx for example
01:22:03  <Sylf> I dismantled it before archiving the game
01:22:13  <Sylf> so I didn't have one ready if you hadn't
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01:25:46  <coopserver> <Anson> near the old dead water supply, there was a new one and i redirected all trains from the old to the new water supply ... let's see how it works now
01:26:04  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> hi Anson
01:26:23  <coopserver> <Anson> started with 108 water production and rating rapidly climbed to 78 until now ...
01:26:27  <coopserver> <Anson> hallo
01:29:48  <Sylf> Fellini, here's another version: http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/
01:29:51  <coopserver> <Anson> Sylf, do you know details about growing towns in deserts ? ... looks like it is the same crappy system like firs: transfer to an auxiliary station, then transport any low amount of water and food (bus with 10 cargo :-) every 30 days ...
01:29:53  <Sylf> sorr, wrong site
01:29:57  <Sylf> http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/User:Mark/VarTL
01:31:14  <Sylf> just deliver both cargo within 1st and last day of each month
01:31:21  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> thx
01:31:45  <Sylf> not within 30 days since the last delivery or whatever that's the case for firs
01:32:20  <Sylf> if you want to stockpile then deliver in smaller quantity, that's up to you
01:32:50  <coopserver> <Anson> for firs, it is "during the last 3 months, including the current", thus 60-90 days ... and firs requires some minimum amount
01:33:21  <coopserver> <Anson> for growing towns in deserts, 15 is good enough ... couldn't find a smaller truck :-)
01:33:22  <Sylf> Or if you want to make the water train wait max of 30 days at the water supply station, that's another way to do it.
01:34:13  <Sylf> full load order isn't always the only way to go
01:34:21  <coopserver> <Anson> with travel times etc, it's more complicated for my brain ... thus i prefer the aux stations with timed delivery
01:51:19  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> can somebody fund food plant for me?
01:51:41  <coopserver> <Anson> where ?
01:52:01  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> somewhere !here
01:52:40  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> ^_^
01:52:48  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> thank you
01:53:36  <coopserver> <Anson> np ... guess who funded most of the water, fruit and farms ? .-)
01:53:52  <coopserver> <Anson> no idea, but prospected at least a total of 50 times
01:54:21  <coopserver> <Anson> average result was 50% success, but most of them across the entire map :-(
01:59:06  <coopserver> <Anson> do you want to build a refitting network ?
01:59:12  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> yep
01:59:46  <coopserver> <Anson> then trains easily can come in waves ... thus i build overflows at primaries
02:04:08  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> but my town need food
02:09:21  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> now accept
02:10:23  <coopserver> <Anson> a matter of taste ... either works ... i prefer truck stations on roads so that i don't have dead rails showing up in town
02:14:42  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> hm
02:14:47  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> timed orders
02:17:37  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> i understood
02:33:51  <coopserver> <Anson> don't forget to refit vehicles when you have bought them ... using the filter to show only trucks that transport water does NOT autorefit the truck from its default to water
02:33:53  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> ill go to bed
02:34:08  <coopserver> <Anson> your truck transports oil ....
02:34:24  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> oh
02:35:22  <coopserver> <Anson> why do you use two water trucks ?
02:35:39  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> idk
02:35:41  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> =D
02:35:54  <coopserver> <Anson> to keep the road clean and wet ? .-)
02:37:13  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> so, now i can go to sleep
02:37:15  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> =)
02:37:19  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> gl
02:37:32  <coopserver> <Anson> g'n8 ... cu
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02:37:46  <coopserver> <Anson> and tomorrow you can see how much water and food have piled up
02:38:13  <coopserver> <Anson> currently, there is already enough for a few years ....
02:57:21  <coopserver> <Anson> !name "Anson (afk)"
02:57:22  <coopserver> *** Anson has changed his/her name to Anson (afk)
02:57:32  <coopserver> <Anson (afk)> going afk ... g'N8
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04:02:22  <coopserver> <Dnz-Ali> hi
04:02:36  <coopserver> <Anson (afk)> hallo, ali
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04:03:53  <coopserver> <Anson (afk)> do you have an idea why the rating of my station is low (27% station rating, 29% rating of its primary) ?
04:04:36  <coopserver> <Anson (afk)> station name "<new w2> Seltjarnarnes Valley"
04:34:22  <maxtimbo> are any of you guys going to play on the public server for psg 301?
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10:39:45  <happpy> !players
10:39:45  <coopserver> happpy: There are currently 1 players and 1 spectators, making a total of 2 clients connected
10:42:29  <coopserver> *** happy train sport has joined
10:45:02  <coopserver> <Anson (afk)> !name Anson
10:45:02  <coopserver> *** Anson (afk) has changed his/her name to Anson
10:45:04  <coopserver> <Anson> hallo, happy
10:45:14  <coopserver> <happy train sport> hi   nice  food   net  woek
10:45:50  <coopserver> <Anson> 2k to 3k water and food waiting at all towns to be delivered with timetable (like firs)
10:46:02  <coopserver> <happy train sport> yep
10:46:28  <coopserver> <Anson> but the food plant and water supplies are a bit strange ... look at their ratings
10:47:00  <coopserver> <happy train sport> heem
10:47:15  <coopserver> <Anson> same fast trains as other stations ... all others have rating around 89%, but food plant and water supplies have only 30% to 60% most of the time
10:47:25  <coopserver> <happy train sport> yep4
10:47:46  <coopserver> <Anson> and with such a low rating, one water supply has died last evening and the other during the night
10:47:56  <coopserver> <happy train sport> i eee
10:48:30  <coopserver> <Anson> leaving only 2 of 4 water supplies ... and their production already has decreased from 100+ to 40 and 80 ... will die too (sooner or later)
10:49:14  <coopserver> <happy train sport> we    got  just  won   water   supply  now
10:49:30  <coopserver> <Anson> two
10:49:32  <coopserver> <happy train sport> ther  no  water  for  train    72
10:49:46  <coopserver> <happy train sport> ar yer   2
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10:52:19  <coopserver> <Anson> when i had connected the new w2 supply, it had 108 water at first and rating went straight up to the usual 80+
10:52:29  <coopserver> <happy train sport> heem
10:52:55  <coopserver> <Anson> but after a short while it already had decreased to 90 and rating 70, and currently is at 69% and 72 production
10:53:07  <coopserver> <happy train sport> be cours  the  cargo     taks  a  lone  time to   fall  up
10:53:19  <coopserver> <happy train sport> thats  i    up   grade to    slugs
10:53:49  <coopserver> <Anson> no idea why water and food are so bad ... maybe it has to do with transfer orders and several k of cargo waiting to be delivered ?
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10:54:58  <coopserver> <Anson> the rating should only go down (by up to -35% rating) when cargo is waiting at the station
10:55:26  <coopserver> <Anson> but since there are always 1 or 2 trains waiting and loading, there should be no penalty for waiting cargo
10:56:15  <coopserver> <Anson> https://wiki.openttd.org/Game_mechanics#Station_rating
10:57:35  <coopserver> <Anson> replace water trains with slugs ???
10:58:13  <coopserver> <Anson> animal express ?
10:58:28  <coopserver> <happy train sport> yer  thats the  ferst   sluge
10:58:44  <coopserver> <happy train sport> in till  thewr  uver  won  come  out  i  up  grade  to them
10:58:47  <coopserver> <Anson> started the auoreplace
11:02:48  <coopserver> <Anson> doing the autoreplace for all water+food (also grain, fruit, food, and the delivery trains)
11:02:57  <coopserver> <happy train sport> yep
11:06:25  <coopserver> <happy train sport> k   that  shord  speed  up  the  water  and  food
11:15:31  <coopserver> <happy train sport> we  got   lots  ov  water  and food  water    at the water  and  food  station  now
11:17:46  <coopserver> <Anson> yes, and the stations have the expected ratings again
11:17:54  <coopserver> <happy train sport> yep
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11:34:30  <coopserver> <Anson> happy, are you still there ?
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11:41:11  <coopserver> <happy train sport> yooo  Anson  how we  going
11:43:44  <coopserver> <Anson> also the other water supplies have dropped
11:44:22  <coopserver> <happy train sport> thats  be  cours   ther  goig to  the  depot  ferst   be  for  the  load  up   at the water and food   station
11:45:18  <coopserver> <Anson> after autoreplacing the trains, all ratings went up to the expected values of 80++, but now they are back, down to 63, 67, 58, 67, 63, and one even to 29
11:45:55  <coopserver> <Anson> no idea why the ratings of primaries and their stations are so low for water and foodplant, but at 89 for all other stations
11:47:10  <coopserver> <Anson> stations get bad ratings for trains going to a depot ???? why ????
11:48:24  <coopserver> <happy train sport> sume  won    tord  me   that   but did  not say y
11:49:41  <coopserver> <Anson> that would be a game breaking bug in ottd ... trains are expected to do some maintenance, and stations have no connection to depots (logically, not speaking of a rail connection :-)
11:51:04  <coopserver> <Anson> it also should apply to either all stations or none, but not work for fruit and maize as expected, and for food plant and water supply have bad ratings although stations and trains are almost identical
11:52:31  <coopserver> <Anson> the only difference is that food and water are not delivered directly, but are transfered and then delivered by a timetabled truck, creating piles of water and food at the delivery stations
11:53:31  <coopserver> <Anson> but do primary stations really remember each drop of water that they produced and give bad ratings while it is piled up at the delivery on the other side of the map ?
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12:27:35  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> рш
12:27:37  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> hi
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12:28:41  <coopserver> <happy train sport> yo __Fellini__
13:43:31  <coopserver> <Anson> if there is food waiting, the rating could be 85-35 = 50 and that would be ok too ... but not 39 with no piles
13:43:52  <coopserver> <happy train sport> yep
13:44:01  <coopserver> <happy train sport> i  am  trying  to  get  that
13:44:57  <coopserver> <happy train sport> can  u try  to  get  mro  water  and  farm  will   i try to get  the  food   mor the 39  %
13:49:37  <coopserver> <Anson> no, that is not the problem
13:50:23  <coopserver> <Anson> the factory rating (or the water supply rating) always corresponds to the station rating after some time
13:51:02  <coopserver> <Anson> it is only different when several stations try to get cargo from the same source and thus have lower ratings
13:51:11  <coopserver> <happy train sport> yep
13:57:59  <coopserver> <happy train sport> no    leve  it
13:59:45  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> gl all
13:59:48  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> & bb
13:59:50  <coopserver> <happy train sport> bb
14:00:01  <coopserver> <happy train sport> luch  time
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14:00:09  <coopserver> <happy train sport> yrp
14:00:15  <coopserver> <happy train sport> k
14:23:26  <coopserver> <happy train sport> Cornelius:   look  at  the  running  cost  on that  plan
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14:36:05  <coopserver> <Anson> hallo, I'm back from offline testing
14:36:12  <coopserver> <happy train sport> hi
14:36:48  <coopserver> <Anson> btw: i saw cornelius online for MANY hours ... too bad when he lost the company ....
14:36:57  <coopserver> <Anson> results of testing :
14:38:07  <coopserver> <Anson> with 4k water and 4k food waiting at each of 4 towns for later slow (timed) delivery, i saw water supply ratings -> set A
14:39:38  <coopserver> <Anson> then i had trains going back and forth to rather quickly decrease those waiting piles (mind you, the piles were not at the water supplies, but at the towns!), and when piles got to something below 1500 or around 1000, i saw these values -> set B
14:40:08  <coopserver> <Anson> set A : 86, 84, 83, 94, 63, 64, 74, 74, 78
14:40:35  <coopserver> <Anson> set B : 89, 79, 89, 90, 90, 91, 93, 92, 89
14:41:15  <coopserver> <Anson> expected values (according to fruit and maize stations with the same engines) : 89-90
14:41:42  <coopserver> <Anson> thus the smaller piles AT THE TOWNS caused the ratings to go up to normal values ?!?!?!
14:41:53  <coopserver> <happy train sport> K#
14:43:08  <coopserver> <Anson> problem still exists : "WHY ?"
14:44:20  <coopserver> <Anson> station ratings of pickup stations (and corresponding ratings of primaries and secondaries) shouldn't depend on what happens with the cargo a year later at a drop station, right ?
14:44:42  <coopserver> <happy train sport> YEP
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14:48:25  <coopserver> <Anson> for completeness : all the same (see above) also applied to the food processing plant ... first a rating of 39 only, later with reduced piles going up to 87+
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14:50:44  <coopserver> <happy train sport> hi  Sylf
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14:51:32  <coopserver> <Anson> hallo ... did you come to explain the reason for the strange behavior ? .-) :-)
14:51:40  <coopserver> <Sylf> no
14:51:45  <coopserver> <Sylf> just experimenting something
14:53:50  <coopserver> <Anson> quite a few years ago, i might have had an idea for a reason : when cargo was dropped on a station and there already was cargo of the same type, it changed the source of ALL that cargo to the new source, overwriting the old source
14:54:43  <coopserver> <Anson> thus you would get strange effects, like transporting a lot by a short distance, then dropping a single chest on the pile, and thus converting it to a long distance transport for all the pile
14:55:09  <coopserver> <happy train sport> how  things  Sylf
14:55:11  <coopserver> <Anson> which suddenly gave a very high income becauise of the seemingly big distance
14:56:07  <coopserver> <Anson> when i tried to exploit that, i had bad luck, and only succeeded in converting big piles of long distance cargo to short distance cargo which gave no profit and i went bancrupt
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15:48:46  <coopserver> <happy train sport> whont  a  food   plant  Sylf
15:48:52  <coopserver> <Sylf> no
15:48:55  <coopserver> <happy train sport> k
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16:40:17  <coopserver> <happy train sport> hi  Tonton
16:40:27  <coopserver> <Tonton> salut salut
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18:23:46  <coopserver> '__Fellini__' reported an error and is closing its connection (desync error)
18:23:47  <coopserver> *** __Fellini__ has left the game (desync error)
19:46:01  <coopserver> *** happy train sport has left the game (Leaving)
19:46:02  <coopserver> *** Game paused (number of players)
21:40:15  <coopserver> *** __Fellini__ has joined
21:41:15  <coopserver> *** __Fellini__ has joined company #5
21:41:16  <coopserver> *** Game unpaused (number of players)
21:47:38  <happpy> yoooo
21:48:07  <coopserver> *** happy train sport has joined
21:48:26  <coopserver> <happy train sport> how  things __Fellini__
21:48:42  <coopserver> *** happy train sport has joined company #1
21:50:36  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> hi
21:50:38  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> good
21:51:35  <coopserver> <happy train sport> nice
21:58:25  <coopserver> <__Fellini__> gn
21:58:28  <coopserver> <happy train sport> gn
21:58:35  <coopserver> *** __Fellini__ has left the game (Leaving)
23:07:51  *** happpy has quit IRC
23:10:36  *** happpy has joined #openttdcoop.stable
23:30:00  <coopserver> *** Lisbon has joined
23:30:04  <coopserver> <happy train sport> hi
23:30:09  <coopserver> <Lisbon> hello
23:30:15  <coopserver> <happy train sport> how  things
23:30:22  <coopserver> <Lisbon> pretty good
23:30:40  <coopserver> <happy train sport> nice
23:36:53  <coopserver> <Lisbon> the replace vehicles thing doesn't seem to work
23:37:14  <coopserver> <happy train sport> u  need  to  doo the  cargo
23:37:20  <coopserver> <happy train sport> as  will  the   trains
23:38:20  <coopserver> <happy train sport> whont   train  u  try to   get
23:38:46  <coopserver> <Lisbon> I was trying to change my trucks to some newer model that hauled mail. I did it manually though.
23:42:42  <coopserver> <happy train sport> ther  a  new  bus  the  name  is  witsharp  mkl 1    diuble  deck
23:42:53  <coopserver> <happy train sport> try  up  grade  to  that
23:43:15  <coopserver> <Lisbon> yeah, autoreplace is apparently not working
23:43:37  <coopserver> <happy train sport> u  need  a  biger  bus   stop
23:43:51  <coopserver> <happy train sport> sume  times
23:44:47  <coopserver> <happy train sport> can  i   help  u  to  up  grade  them
23:45:02  <coopserver> <Lisbon> i can do it. i'm just curious why autoreplace isn't working.
23:45:11  <coopserver> <happy train sport> k
23:47:48  <coopserver> <Lisbon> Oh, you have to send it to a depot afterwards.
23:47:55  <coopserver> <Lisbon> Okay, I got it working!
23:48:03  <coopserver> <happy train sport> yeo
23:48:13  <coopserver> <happy train sport> nice

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