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00:00:11 *** Neonox [~Neonox@p57B2A19D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: bin wech....] 00:00:38 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat2.arachne.cz] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:02:00 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB7790.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Osai] 00:04:20 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: bjarni * r8363 /trunk/ (6 files in 3 dirs): -Codechange: [autoreplace GUI] moved the autoreplace GUI to a file of it's own 00:07:32 <Bjarni> ok, that was the easy part 00:07:38 <Bjarni> now to dig into this mess.... 00:11:55 *** ArmEagle_ [~armeagle@cc8543-a.groni1.gr.home.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:24:36 <izhirahider> Bjarni, Is this still accurate? http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/Autoreplace 00:24:45 *** Digitalfox [~chatzilla@bl8-41-115.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #openttd 00:25:24 * ln- installing Solaris... 00:26:02 <caladan> solaris? wow... 00:26:58 <ln-> yeah, and Solaris/SPARC, not some x86 thing 00:29:19 <setrodox> ln-, which sparc? :o 00:29:53 <setrodox> i had access to a microsparc some time ^^ 00:30:22 <ln-> SparcStation 5 00:31:22 <setrodox> ah, the sparcstation is running a microsparc too, isn't it? 00:31:32 <setrodox> (microsparc as in the cpu) 00:31:59 <caladan> so, thats a big thing ;] 00:32:13 <caladan> a fried of mine installed solaris 10 on p4-2.4 :D 00:32:33 <setrodox> solaris doesn't really feel like it should on x86 ^^ 00:32:43 <setrodox> though i don't like solaris much at all :S 00:32:49 <ln-> hmm, i'm not sure about the cpu 00:32:58 <caladan> @ my university we got two HUGE servers with solaris 00:33:27 <setrodox> ln-, if you know the speed of it i'll probably be able to guess the cpu type from it ^^ 00:33:39 <caladan> and we had some exercises in programming and someonu wrote a program that did hang the system permanently :D 00:33:49 <setrodox> caladan, heh 00:34:16 <caladan> you see, we were training usage of sysV process comunication 00:34:26 <caladan> with messages 00:34:39 <caladan> id did not stand the test ;-) 00:34:52 <setrodox> hehe ^^ 00:34:58 <ln-> setrodox: it was something about 100 MHz 00:35:27 <setrodox> ln-, that's probably a better microsparc then, mark 2 or what it was called 00:35:55 <setrodox> only other cpu with 100mhz in the sparc series was the hypersparc i think, and afaik that wasn't used in the sparcstations 00:36:17 <setrodox> i nearly sound like i would know about what i'm talking :P 00:36:23 <caladan> hehe 00:36:41 <caladan> im not familiar with those uCs 00:36:51 <caladan> i prefer ARMs, MIPSs, AVRs and so on :D 00:37:08 <setrodox> microsparc was a fullfledged cpu ^^ 00:37:14 <setrodox> not a microcontroller 00:37:21 <ln-> i finally found a bigger hard disk yesterday, the original 1 GB was a little bit limiting for ... anything. 00:37:23 <caladan> yeah, i know :D 00:37:23 <setrodox> in the sense of embedded stuff 00:37:32 <setrodox> oki, only wanted to clarify ^^ 00:37:43 <setrodox> ln-, hehe, i can guess ^^ 00:37:44 <caladan> but see: the new ARM uP using ARM966 core runs at 96MHz :D 00:37:54 <Bjarni> <izhirahider> Bjarni, Is this still accurate? http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/Autoreplace <-- yeah 00:38:02 <Bjarni> I didn't change anything yet ;) 00:38:17 <ln-> is the solaris port of OpenTTD still working? 00:38:20 <setrodox> nice thing about the micro sparcs is that they need virtually no power :) 00:38:36 <caladan> like all CMOS devices if you know what I mean :P 00:38:36 <BFM> Oh! Good news! http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200701/s1831871.htm 00:38:37 <BFM> "Chaser star cleared over Bulldogs stunt" 00:38:53 <BFM> oops, wrong channel ^_^ 00:39:09 <setrodox> caladan, yeah ^^ 00:39:34 <setrodox> arm is overkill for hobby projects sadly though 00:39:39 * Bjarni once tried to compile on solaris 00:39:40 <caladan> why? 00:39:42 *** Belugas [belugas@openttd.org] has joined #openttd 00:39:46 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ 00:40:04 <setrodox> well, never did anything which an atmega8 couldn't handle ^^ 00:40:15 <setrodox> maybe i should've said "overkill for my stuff" 00:40:21 <caladan> hehe 00:40:36 <caladan> my engineer dipoma runs on Atmel ARM 00:40:42 <caladan> @48MHz 00:40:50 <setrodox> :o 00:40:52 <setrodox> what is it? 00:41:00 <caladan> midi2spi translator 00:41:07 <caladan> with debug with uart 00:41:24 <caladan> i need a lot of RAM 00:41:29 <setrodox> oh :o 00:41:31 <caladan> to buffer data 00:41:36 <setrodox> :) 00:41:39 <caladan> look, how much does cost atmega128? 00:41:56 <caladan> in poland like 00:41:59 <setrodox> no idea only bought 8's and 16's yet 00:42:01 <setrodox> oh 00:42:43 <caladan> and my arm, which has 64kB of flash, 16kB of RAM, ADC, USB, 3UARTS and can run @ 60MHz, and IS 32bit, *ALSO* 00:43:00 <setrodox> oh 00:43:08 <setrodox> but it probably needs more power, doesn't it? 00:43:25 <caladan> it isnt portable device 00:43:35 <setrodox> ah, ok 00:43:36 <caladan> LCD backlight uses more :D 00:43:40 <setrodox> hehe ^^ 00:43:58 <setrodox> midi is something i always wanted to try 00:44:09 <caladan> its an interface for Analog's DSP EvKit 00:44:20 <setrodox> i have gameboys and stuff lying around here, making a midi gameboy synth would be fun ^^ 00:44:30 <caladan> you see, that EvKit has only 4buttons and 8leds :/ 00:44:34 <setrodox> EvKit doesn't ring a bell 00:44:38 <setrodox> oh :o 00:44:41 <caladan> Hmm, evaluation board 00:44:46 <setrodox> ah, ok 00:45:07 <caladan> so im doing interface to connect BFC2000 :D 00:45:17 <caladan> wait... a sec... link :D 00:45:30 <setrodox> bcf maybe? 00:45:36 <caladan> http://www.synthtopia.com/news/2004_01-04/BehringerBFC2000OffersMot.html 00:45:58 <setrodox> oh 00:45:59 <caladan> BCF is a weapon in DOOM? :> 00:46:29 <setrodox> bcf is the same thing ^^ 00:46:37 <setrodox> http://www.zzounds.com/item--BEHBCF2000 00:46:38 <caladan> my tutor will have nice interface to tune his filters 00:46:50 <setrodox> one of the writings maybe is wrong :P 00:46:51 <caladan> shit, it says BFC on my console, true :D 00:47:01 <caladan> hmm, BCF... 00:47:08 <caladan> ok, nevermind :D 00:47:14 <caladan> so i have something to play with 00:47:25 <caladan> and I can tell you basics of midi :D 00:47:30 <caladan> its a simple UART 00:47:44 <caladan> no voltage, current 00:47:44 <setrodox> i know some basic protocol stuff of it already 00:47:53 <caladan> baud=31250 00:47:55 <setrodox> but i only flew over some specs ^^ 00:48:07 <caladan> Easy protocol 00:48:12 <caladan> But really nice :-) 00:48:15 <setrodox> 31250 only? that explains why sysex bank transferring is so slow ^^ 00:48:44 <setrodox> i'll be right back, getting some food 00:50:01 <caladan> and if we say about arms, a friend of mine built an MP3 player on AT91SAM7S256 :D 00:50:09 <caladan> worth like 12$ 00:51:41 <setrodox> :D 00:52:23 <caladan> and the cheapest ARM 00:52:24 <setrodox> i thought of using an atmega for a portable sid player with a real 6581 once, but it's one of the things i never did :( 00:52:39 <caladan> LPC2101 00:52:45 <caladan> costs like .5 00:53:02 <setrodox> :o 00:53:29 <setrodox> i'll have to look at the specs of that one ^^ 00:55:04 <caladan> look at this: http://salo.ath.cx/files/inzynierka/inzschemat.png 00:55:19 <caladan> i have many io pins to be used :D 00:55:45 <setrodox> heh, nice :D 00:55:46 <caladan> thou it's bit wrong, already made corrections 00:58:58 <caladan> i already tested many uPs so i have a bit of experience with useing them :D 00:59:20 <setrodox> heh, i only touched that stuff lightly so far ^^ 01:00:42 <caladan> ive already tried '51, avr, arm, hitachi, msp430 :D 01:01:18 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: bjarni * r8364 /trunk/src/build_vehicle_gui.cpp: -Codechange (r8362): added an assert to catch conditions where a request wants to draw more vehicles than the list contains 01:01:25 <setrodox> for me it was the atmega, and a 8051 ^^ 01:01:44 <caladan> :D 01:02:28 <setrodox> i just got out a box with some chips in it, for example a 8031AH 01:02:29 <setrodox> :P 01:02:48 <setrodox> wasn't the AH one the silly one which was programmable with basic? 01:03:26 <setrodox> intel '82 :) 01:03:36 <caladan> hmm? 01:03:43 <caladan> 8031 is like 8051, just no internal mem 01:04:04 <caladan> you can program everything with basic :D 01:04:07 <setrodox> yes, i know, but the 8031AH != 8031 01:04:11 <caladan> hmm, strange 01:04:15 <caladan> it executes BASIC? :D 01:04:33 <setrodox> i think i so... 01:04:39 <caladan> cant be... 01:04:48 <setrodox> i think i even got a ah basic book somewhere 01:05:38 <setrodox> ah, sorry, misunderstood you 01:05:55 <setrodox> it's probably a compiled dialect of basic 01:06:29 <caladan> hmmm 01:06:34 <caladan> that's strange too 01:06:42 <caladan> it has interpreter onchip? 01:06:49 <caladan> or just software interpreter? 01:08:38 <setrodox> if it would be compiled then there wouldn't be a need for that i think 01:08:58 <setrodox> but then i don't understand why there is a special version of the chip for that basic dialect :S 01:09:15 *** Smoovious [~smoovious@c-71-205-140-67.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:09:35 <caladan> maybe it has more ram or someting 01:09:48 <setrodox> heh, don't know where i have those from, just found some z80a stuff, cpu, pio, dart and some other ones :o 01:10:11 <caladan> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8031 01:10:35 <caladan> you can write programm in basic, but its still translated to plain machine code 01:10:45 <caladan> im that lazy, im using C almost all the time :D 01:10:55 <setrodox> hehe ^^ 01:10:58 <caladan> sdcc and arm-gcc 01:11:04 <caladan> and avrgcc 01:11:22 <setrodox> i used assembly for the arm cpu's in the nintendo ds once ^^ 01:11:39 <setrodox> was rather fun with all the peripheral stuff and dual processor mode :) 01:12:05 <setrodox> i first wanted to try to do sound miking on the slower one, but then i saw that the ds has 32 hardware sound channels :P 01:12:12 <caladan> i dont have to use thumb :D 01:12:51 <caladan> you see, i have almost all peripherials libs written and it uses like 1/6 of it's program memory :D 01:12:52 <setrodox> thumb is fun if you try to size optimize sometimes ^^ 01:13:00 <setrodox> heh 01:13:09 <caladan> it's damn small code :D 01:13:15 <setrodox> well, when i use assembly it's just for fun ;) 01:13:25 <caladan> you know about that conditional execution and shifts in every instruction :D 01:13:27 <setrodox> not because there would be any reason for it 01:13:34 <setrodox> yeah, that's pretty nice 01:13:54 <setrodox> that gave me a wow feeling after beeing tortured by x86 assembly ^^ 01:15:02 <caladan> yestarday i wrote strlen using MMX :>. 01:15:09 <caladan> shit, that's hard! :D 01:15:14 <setrodox> heh 01:15:21 <setrodox> never used extensions yet ^^ 01:15:24 <caladan> thou it tests 8BYTES at once... 01:15:36 <setrodox> that surely is fast :o 01:15:41 <caladan> tests 8 BYTES in like 6 instructions 01:15:56 <setrodox> nice 01:17:00 <caladan> and if I can recommend something 01:17:06 <caladan> try to use Nokia3310 LCD :D 01:17:25 *** roboboy [~Leo@c211-30-116-5.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 01:17:26 <setrodox> :o 01:17:32 <setrodox> is it easy to use? 01:17:33 <caladan> it has SPI interface 01:17:40 <setrodox> oh 01:17:56 <setrodox> i only used alpha numeric displays yet 01:18:30 <caladan> you just send bit after bit thru SPI 01:18:45 <caladan> in poland it costs like .5 01:19:47 <Triffid_Hunter> caladan: got a link? i have some of those 01:19:51 <setrodox> i'll remember about that when i'll have need for more advanced display stuff in some project :) 01:20:40 <caladan> http://www.amontec.com/lcd_nokia_3310.shtml 01:20:58 <Triffid_Hunter> fyi, 3210 screen is identical :) 01:23:24 <caladan> 3330 same i think 01:59:26 <caladan> ok, got to go to sleep finally 01:59:30 <caladan> bye 02:07:57 *** Bjarni [~Bjarni@0x50a46ac4.virnxx14.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:14:48 *** MUcht [~Mucht@p57A0DA8A.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 02:15:54 *** BFM [~chatzilla@CPE-138-130-140-81.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:21:28 *** Mucht_ [~Mucht@p57A0DE95.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:30:51 *** Eddi|zuHause2 [~johekr@p54B75E38.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 02:31:55 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: belugas * r8365 /trunk/docs/landscape.html: 02:31:55 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Cleanup: Remove unneeded and dead links, install Owner informations, add attribute m6. 02:31:55 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: More to come on that matter... 02:33:49 *** Smoovious [~smoovious@c-71-205-140-67.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 02:37:17 *** Eddi|zuHause3 [~johekr@p54B76045.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:37:35 *** Belugas is now known as Belugas_Gone 02:42:30 *** gass [~any@81.84.150.238] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:59:05 *** BFM [~chatzilla@CPE-138-130-140-81.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 03:03:16 *** blindwaves [~woogleman@cm173.sigma118.maxonline.com.sg] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:07:23 *** Sacro [Ben@87.102.80.3] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:18:25 *** blindwaves [~woogleman@cm173.sigma118.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #openttd 03:28:18 *** tokai [~tokai@p54B80BD6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:31:05 *** tokai [~tokai@p54B82D28.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 03:31:08 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 03:36:14 *** blindwaves [~woogleman@cm173.sigma118.maxonline.com.sg] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:38:29 *** BFM [~chatzilla@CPE-138-130-140-81.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Quit: Chatzilla 0.9.77 [Firefox 1.5.0.9/2006120612]] 03:44:37 *** Zahl [~SENFGURKE@p549F1F3F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: YOU! It was you wasn't it!?] 03:53:37 *** dp_ [~dp@p54B2DC45.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 04:00:37 *** dp [~dp@p54B2DBB7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:15:27 <Ailure> IS there any set 04:15:31 <Ailure> with good Maglev or monorail? 04:15:46 <Ailure> and note that I already have UKRS 04:47:39 *** helb [~helb@84.244.90.159] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:58:29 <Eddi|zuHause2> i think the point of UKRS is to not have a universal maglev system 05:16:35 *** orudge [~orudge@8afbfebe.resnet.st-andrews.ac.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:17:28 *** Sturm [Drang@201-26-141-175.dial-up.telesp.net.br] has joined #openttd 05:19:13 <Sturm> Hi everybody. Firstly, sorry about my poor English. I'm using teh OpenTTD RC3 and I cant get the money that my trains obtains... Are you having the same problem? 05:19:38 <DaleStan> Use RC4. 05:20:13 <DaleStan> If that doesn't solve the problem, post a savegame on the forums. 05:20:18 <Sturm> :) Ok, I'll get it. But the problem I reported was found? 05:20:37 <Sturm> by someone else? 05:20:46 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB64A5.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 05:27:58 *** Sturm [Drang@201-26-141-175.dial-up.telesp.net.br] has quit [Quit: Bye for now!] 05:28:55 *** Netsplit synthon.oftc.net <-> electron.oftc.net quits: Triffid_Hunter 05:31:20 *** bubersson [~bubersson@mnisek.casablanca.cz] has joined #openttd 05:35:22 *** Frostregen_ [~sucks@dslb-084-058-159-206.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 05:41:38 *** Frostregen [~sucks@dslb-084-058-161-173.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:42:02 *** Frostregen_ is now known as Frostregen 05:56:13 *** blindwaves [~woogleman@cm173.sigma118.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #openttd 05:58:15 *** Netsplit over, joins: Triffid_Hunter 06:04:35 *** blindwaves [~woogleman@cm173.sigma118.maxonline.com.sg] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:09:59 *** Digitalfox_ [~chatzilla@bl8-41-115.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #openttd 06:09:59 *** Digitalfox [~chatzilla@bl8-41-115.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:10:01 *** Digitalfox_ is now known as Digitalfox 06:16:43 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB64A5.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Osai] 06:39:19 *** silent [~pwr@86.121.146.200] has quit [Quit: Client exiting] 06:43:17 *** roboboy [~Leo@c211-30-116-5.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:44:27 *** imaginner|afk [~imaginner@acle226.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:49:41 *** Zavior [~Zavior@d195-237-7-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 06:49:41 *** Zaviori [~Zavior@d195-237-7-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:50:14 *** Zaviori [~Zavior@d195-237-7-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 06:53:48 *** roboboy [~Leo@c211-30-116-5.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 06:54:07 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has joined #openttd 07:23:18 *** roboboy [~Leo@c211-30-116-5.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:25:34 *** bubersson [~bubersson@mnisek.casablanca.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:25:34 *** Zaviori [~Zavior@d195-237-7-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:25:34 *** Zavior [~Zavior@d195-237-7-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:25:45 *** Zaviori [~Zavior@d195-237-7-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 07:25:58 *** Zavior [~Zavior@d195-237-7-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 07:41:30 *** TinoM| is now known as TinoM 07:44:32 <peter1138> bah 07:48:07 *** ThePizzaKing_ [~jeff@c211-28-160-224.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 07:55:14 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-160-224.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:02:30 *** ThePizzaKing_ is now known as ThePizzaKing 08:15:34 *** valhalla1w`gone [~valhallas@a62-251-30-68.adsl.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:15:35 *** valhallasw`gone [~valhallas@a62-251-30-68.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 08:17:01 *** TheMask96 [martijn@sirius-r5.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 08:19:18 *** mikl [~mikl@tbv.faderhuset.org] has joined #openttd 08:26:30 *** roboboy [~Leo@c211-30-116-5.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 08:29:22 *** ThePizzaKing_ [~jeff@c211-28-160-224.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 08:34:45 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-160-224.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Killed (NickServ (GHOST command used by ThePizzaKing_))] 08:34:50 *** ThePizzaKing_ is now known as ThePizzaKing 08:45:01 *** Tron__ [nJYG5iTU@nat-1.rz.uni-karlsruhe.de] has joined #openttd 08:50:55 *** blindwaves [~woogleman@cm173.sigma118.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #openttd 08:57:44 *** Maedhros [~jc@host86-144-6-60.range86-144.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 08:58:26 <Maedhros> morning 09:02:51 *** Purno [~Purno@5351CF18.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd 09:03:15 *** ThePizzaKing_ [~jeff@c211-28-160-20.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 09:08:17 *** setrodox [~setrodox@83-65-232-76.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:08:27 * peter1138 wonders if Bjarni's heard of svn copy 09:09:49 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-160-224.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:38:01 *** scia [~scia@AveloN.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 09:38:40 <Tron__> peter1138? 09:41:16 *** Neonox [~Neonox@p57B2C726.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 09:45:08 <peter1138> Tron__: autoreplace_gui.cpp 09:54:53 <Maedhros> will code like (int64 * int64) / int64 use int64 intermediates, or will the intermediate results get truncated? 09:55:45 <Tron__> int64 09:56:19 *** scia [~scia@AveloN.xs4all.nl] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 09:56:21 <Maedhros> good good. thanks 09:59:10 <Maedhros> hmm. how about (int32 * int64) / int64 ? 10:04:35 <Tron__> the result of a calculation is never shorter than its longest operand 10:05:44 <Maedhros> ah, that's good to know 10:05:46 <Maedhros> thanks :) 10:06:27 <Tron__> data types short than an int get promoted to int before a calculation takes place 10:06:41 <Tron__> char c 10:06:45 <Tron__> short s; 10:06:55 <Tron__> c + s; 10:06:58 <Tron__> is actually 10:07:04 <Tron__> (int)c + (int)s; 10:07:41 <peter1138> char c; char s; c + s? 10:08:20 <Tron__> types shorter than int /always/ get promoted to int before a calculation takes place 10:09:06 <Tron__> so you example still is equal to (int)c + (int)s 10:09:45 <peter1138> *nod* 10:12:57 <peter1138> bah, outlook is *still* deleting 10:12:59 *** Mucht_ [~Mucht@p57A0F35B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 10:13:06 <peter1138> how long can it take to remove 60,000 emails... 10:15:43 *** Tino|R152 [Tino@52N.UNI-MUENSTER.DE] has joined #openttd 10:17:00 *** Tino|R152 [Tino@52N.UNI-MUENSTER.DE] has quit [] 10:17:06 *** Tino|R152 [~Tino@52N.UNI-MUENSTER.DE] has joined #openttd 10:19:09 *** MUcht [~Mucht@p57A0DA8A.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:21:57 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: maedhros * r8366 /trunk/src/graph_gui.cpp: 10:21:57 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Codechange: [Graphs] Make the scaling code less cryptic, and fix two longstanding bugs. 10:21:57 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: 1) If the graph contained negative values, the y axis labels were half the size they should have been. 10:21:57 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: 2) If the maximum value was larger than the height of the graph in pixels << 32, all datapoints were scaled to 0. 10:32:57 <Brianetta> peter1138: Haven't you been deleting those emails for about a week? 10:42:36 <peter1138> nah, this is a separate lot 10:48:05 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat2.arachne.cz] has joined #openttd 10:53:54 *** Bjarni [~Bjarni@0x50a46ac4.virnxx14.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 10:53:55 *** mode/#openttd [+o Bjarni] by ChanServ 10:55:31 <Darkvater> ugh, morning 10:56:32 <Bjarni> railroads are nice 10:56:36 <Bjarni> ... when they work 10:57:22 <Bjarni> I just had to drive people around because the trains didn't 10:57:39 <Bjarni> they broke a switch (officially), but I presume something more is wrong 10:57:44 <Bjarni> anyway 10:57:47 <Bjarni> Darkvater: http://devs.openttd.org/~bjarni/vehicle_order_list_fix.diff 10:58:10 <Bjarni> the order list fix as it's possible to do now after I cleaned up the code it touch 11:00:02 <Bjarni> Darkvater: do you still think it's too big? 11:01:27 *** Neonox [~Neonox@p57B2C726.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: bin wech....] 11:06:17 <Darkvater> lemme see 11:07:44 <Darkvater> Bjarni: it looks better but I cannot comment on the functionality 11:08:01 *** Belugas_Gone is now known as Belugas 11:08:02 <Darkvater> eg does it solve the fundamental problem of the shared orders that is present at the moment? 11:09:42 <peter1138> Bjarni! 11:10:22 <peter1138> you lost change history for autoreplace 11:11:39 <Bjarni> I know, but I'm going to more or less rewrite the autoreplace GUI 11:11:56 <Darkvater> .. 11:12:05 <Bjarni> it's so garbaged by design that I think it's easier this way... it's a mess 11:12:26 <Darkvater> Bjarni: the correct answer would NOT be 'I know' but "I am terribly sorry, how can I fix it so this doesn't happen next time?" 11:12:49 <Bjarni> how should I move parts of a file into another file without clearing history of that part? 11:13:11 <Bjarni> besides it's still present in the old file, so it's not completely lost 11:13:47 <Darkvater> svn copy 11:15:24 <Brianetta> Is it possible to code a grf that imposes a minimum distance between an airport and a town? 11:16:06 <Bjarni> you mean copy the whole file and then delete the stuff I didn't want to move? 11:16:25 <Maedhros> yup. i did it when splitting signs_gui.cpp from graph_gui.cpp 11:16:28 <Bjarni> well, I can do that now. Reverting the change and then do it right 11:16:49 <Maedhros> Brianetta: i wouldn't like to say categorically "no", but i don't think so 11:17:37 <Brianetta> Maedhros: I just think that reserving huge rectangles of prime city-centre space from as early as 1920 is a tad bonkers. Huge airports should be out of town. 11:17:52 <Brianetta> I'd like to see only small and commuter in the city. 11:17:55 <peter1138> yeah, like heathrow 11:17:57 <peter1138> um 11:18:13 <Brianetta> Heathrow was out of town once upon a time (: 11:18:36 <Brianetta> It's at least 20 tiles from Trafalgar Square. 11:18:39 <Darkvater> Bjarni: yes like that 11:18:53 <peter1138> tiles, hehe 11:20:20 <Bjarni> bbl 11:20:27 <Bjarni> I will fix this when I get get back 11:21:06 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: maedhros * r8367 /trunk/src/graph_gui.cpp: -Fix: [Graphs] Don't try to use the same value to mean something is invalid for both an int64 and a uint. 11:21:53 <Darkvater> Maedhros: will there be any features when you're done? :) 11:22:23 <Maedhros> hopefully :) 11:22:44 <Maedhros> i'd like to make so graphs don't have to symmetrical about the x axis for a start 11:22:56 <Maedhros> *have to be 11:22:56 <Darkvater> nice, nice :) 11:27:04 <Brianetta> Hey 11:27:11 <Brianetta> I have a dedicated server feature request 11:27:15 <Brianetta> and it's kind of serious 11:27:26 <Brianetta> the ability to fine players 11:27:33 <Brianetta> and perhaps to give grants 11:28:24 <Brianetta> I wonder if a server-side only patch could do this... 11:28:35 <peter1138> no 11:28:57 <peter1138> all clients would need to know about it 11:29:39 <Brianetta> How are clients informed of money transfers? 11:29:44 <peter1138> by a command 11:29:52 <Brianetta> Couldn't such a command be sent by the server? 11:29:57 <peter1138> but that takes from one player and gives to another 11:30:05 <Brianetta> Well, I could do that 11:30:07 <peter1138> it would be a different, or a change to the, command 11:30:12 <Brianetta> redistribute the welth (: 11:30:25 <Brianetta> Brianetta the communist dictator 11:30:25 <peter1138> i wonder how many grants roboboy would need 11:30:42 <Brianetta> He could have all of shader's money 11:30:58 <peter1138> i don't know how he manages to go bankrupt so often 11:31:00 <Brianetta> Shader is a Portuguese player who gets rich then fails to respect the environment 11:31:05 <peter1138> :( 11:31:49 <Brianetta> If I could redistribute the money of players like that... 11:31:52 <Brianetta> that'd be mint 11:32:20 <Brianetta> I might look into it 11:32:28 <Brianetta> It would be neat for conflict resolution 11:32:47 <Brianetta> One player bullies another, then finds all his money went to them. 11:33:01 <Brianetta> I'd have to polish up my Muahahahaha! 11:33:33 <peter1138> heh 11:34:14 <Brianetta> I could fail to do bounds checking and bankrupt them, too 11:34:59 <Brianetta> Is it possible for spectators to give money? 11:35:08 <Brianetta> I might have to read the source or something 11:35:19 <peter1138> no 11:35:27 <Darkvater> thank god no 11:35:43 <peter1138> you can't not to bounds checking either 11:35:48 <Brianetta> This feature is, obviously, going to be such a blatant hack 11:36:08 <Ailure> hmmm 11:36:10 <Brianetta> but I promise not to implement it during RC testing (: 11:36:14 <Ailure> anyone who messed with trains 11:36:19 <Ailure> what's the internal maxspeed of them 11:36:21 <Ailure> :p 11:36:27 <peter1138> unless you change the clients, you're restricted to whatever a normal player can do 11:36:28 <Ailure> or rather 11:36:30 <Ailure> how fast would they go 11:36:39 <peter1138> so you can't take money from a loan 11:37:10 <Brianetta> right 11:37:17 <Brianetta> that's fair 11:37:23 *** ChrisM87 [~ChrisM@p54AC6D61.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 11:37:35 <Brianetta> players with a loan are hardly in a positoin to be fined for flattening mountains 11:37:50 <peter1138> if you want to fine someone, you'd have to give the money to someone else 11:37:53 <Brianetta> Yes 11:38:00 <Brianetta> Divvied up between the remainder 11:38:25 <Brianetta> with an option of compensation 11:38:32 <Brianetta> to pay for the flooded station, etc (: 11:38:35 <peter1138> you could implement your own commands and force all clients to disconnect, heh 11:38:44 <Ailure> hmm 11:38:48 <Ailure> heh 11:39:04 <Ailure> if the game couod automatically detect whoever started a flood and fine ;p 11:39:05 <Brianetta> well, it'd be console commands which send a sequence of regular commands 11:39:09 <Ailure> but that can be a small nightmare to program 11:39:18 <Brianetta> Ailure: It'd be down to the admin to determine 11:39:23 <Ailure> I actually had that happening 11:39:32 <Brianetta> I can usually tell by looking at the local authority ratings 11:39:33 <Ailure> not much of a problem tohugh 11:39:36 <Ailure> I was the admin after all 11:39:37 <Ailure> :) 11:39:49 <Ailure> told him to stop 11:39:51 <Ailure> that's about it 11:40:07 <Brianetta> I told a guy to stop yesterday, but he'd already flattened a mountain range 11:40:15 <Ailure> well 11:40:17 <Brianetta> another was flooding artificial islands 11:40:21 <Brianetta> but he got banned 11:40:23 <Ailure> a friend of mine got slightly bored at building railroads 11:40:27 <Ailure> so he flattened a part of the map 11:40:34 <Ailure> it actually winded up looking neat looking 11:40:44 <Ailure> and there wasn't any industries in that region I wanted to use anyway 11:40:48 <Brianetta> It pissed off the other 6 players, was my problem 11:40:50 <Ailure> and the ones that were there 11:40:52 <Ailure> were already connected 11:41:06 <Ailure> well 11:41:10 <Ailure> As a rule of thumb 11:41:15 <Ailure> if you made a artifical island 11:41:20 <Ailure> be sure to make "artifical" dams as well 11:41:22 <Ailure> that you own 11:41:23 <Ailure> I guess 11:41:48 <Brianetta> Sea level is dangerous - especially as players can build water anywhere 11:41:57 <Ailure> sometimes I use road for that 11:42:00 <Ailure> as it looks nice as well 11:42:04 <Ailure> with the edges 11:42:08 <Brianetta> yes 11:42:09 <Ailure> since it looks artificial 11:42:26 <Brianetta> Some players used canal 11:42:39 <Brianetta> until one player found out htat building a buoy on a canal tile turned it into floodwater 11:43:03 <Ailure> terraforming should be more expensive anyway 11:43:14 <Ailure> it's ridicolus 11:43:16 <Brianetta> yes 11:43:20 <Ailure> how it's cheaper to flat something 11:43:22 <Ailure> than building a tunnel 11:43:25 <Ailure> in a few situations 11:43:40 <Brianetta> although when I suggested that on #tycoon half an hour ago there were vocal opponents 11:43:55 <Ailure> meh 11:43:59 <Ailure> any controversional change 11:44:02 <Ailure> should be a patch setting 11:44:42 <Brianetta> Somebody should to a search/replace on all the openttd files 11:44:43 <Ailure> I used to be negative against electrical rails at first 11:44:45 <Brianetta> change patch to option 11:44:46 <Ailure> for example 11:44:52 <Ailure> but I winded up liking it after using it 11:44:54 <Ailure> for awhile 11:45:09 <Ailure> yeah I know 11:45:12 <Ailure> I said it before as well 11:45:21 <Brianetta> Perhaps on the 1.0 roadmap (: 11:45:23 <Ailure> the patch window is just a remain from TTDpatch 11:45:43 <Ailure> it makes sense in TTDpatch as TTDpatch is essentially the orginal game hacked 11:45:45 <Ailure> but not in openTTD 11:46:05 <Ailure> I think I suggested 11:46:07 <Ailure> "Advanced options" 11:46:27 <Ailure> thoose options can be confusing for a newbie after all 11:46:32 <Brianetta> All the options and difficulty settings should be combined, I think 11:46:40 <Brianetta> and a new set of difficulty presets defined 11:46:40 <Ailure> especially the vehicles part 11:46:46 <Ailure> yes 11:46:54 <Ailure> the orginal difficulties are kinda skewed in a way 11:47:01 <Noldo> Brianetta: map things could be in the generaton screen 11:47:03 <Ailure> I don't like how the landscape is related to the difficulty 11:47:05 *** bubersson [~bubersson@mnisek.casablanca.cz] has joined #openttd 11:47:17 <Ailure> like 11:47:20 <Ailure> if Iw ant a easy game 11:47:21 <Brianetta> Noldo: Could be, and are (: 11:47:23 <Ailure> but mountanious region 11:47:26 <Ailure> I have to go for custom 11:47:35 <Ailure> infact I never played any of the preset difficulties 11:47:39 <Ailure> and I doubt anyone really did 11:47:54 <Ailure> I tried to, but I wind up changing something halfway in the game 11:48:10 <Ailure> and some things makes sense in the orginal game 11:48:13 <Ailure> but not in openTTD 11:48:17 <Ailure> such as breakdown 11:48:25 <Ailure> normal works fine with the orginal limits 11:48:35 <Ailure> but when you have 400 trains on a network, it's almost impossible to have it on 11:48:52 <Ailure> if not just very annoying 11:49:20 * Brianetta nods 11:51:29 <Ailure> hmm 11:51:35 <Ailure> I wonder if I have it too dark in my apartment 11:51:41 <Ailure> I feel down alot lately 11:51:43 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1F1C6.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 11:51:44 <Ailure> but I have no reason why 11:51:55 <Ailure> I think I hae some kind of winter depression D: 11:52:18 <Ailure> It feels better when opened up the curtains so more light would come in 11:52:56 <Ailure> Not down in the emo way 11:52:59 <Ailure> just slight apathy stuff :p 11:54:11 <Ailure> ah heh 11:54:16 <Ailure> now I feel dumb Brianetta 11:54:26 <Ailure> for some reason I thought the C++ combatility was already done D: 11:54:40 *** ThePizzaKing_ [~jeff@c211-28-160-20.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 11:54:59 * Ailure stretches 11:55:09 *** bubersson [~bubersson@mnisek.casablanca.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:55:12 <Ailure> Guess I get around installing the compilers and stuff now when I have some free time 11:55:28 <Brianetta> Ailure: Either done or nearly done 11:55:32 <Ailure> ah 11:55:39 <Ailure> Still I need to play around with C++ a bit 11:55:39 <Brianetta> To be honest, I don't read *every* commit message 11:55:51 <Ailure> I only programmed in Java 11:55:57 <Ailure> but C++ is very similar from what I seen 11:56:03 <Ailure> and I understand the code pretty well when I see it 11:56:28 <Ailure> hmm 11:56:38 <Ailure> what's the preferable way of compiling openTTD under Windows? 11:56:46 <Ailure> Cygwin? 11:57:28 <Brianetta> Akalamanaia: to bad you cant..surrender your assets to other company 11:57:31 <Brianetta> Akalamanaia: like the AI does when it goes bankrupt 11:57:36 <Brianetta> (frommy server) 11:57:51 <Brianetta> Ailure: Darkvater uses regular Windows compilers, etc 11:57:56 <Brianetta> and he's the lead dev atm 11:58:10 <Ailure> such as visual C++? 11:58:22 <Ailure> I tend to prefer using open source alternatives, but whatever that works 11:58:35 *** Purno [~Purno@5351CF18.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Quit: Life is a game of pick-up-sticks, played by fucking lunatics.] 11:59:02 <Ailure> http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/Compiling_on_DevCPlusPlus 11:59:07 <Ailure> heh I followed this guide once 11:59:21 <Ailure> didn't get it to work due to the project file D: 11:59:21 <Darkvater> Ailure: use VS2005 Express 11:59:26 <Darkvater> it'll work just fine and is free 11:59:54 <Ailure> I give it a try then 12:02:37 *** ufoun-- [~ha@b07-305a.kn.vutbr.cz] has joined #openttd 12:03:37 <Ailure> xfgg 12:03:44 <Ailure> stupid sourceforg 12:04:47 <Ailure> it keeps making me download from a mirror that is down 12:04:55 <Ailure> until I enter the files page manually 12:05:02 <Ailure> and I know from earlier today that the belgium server is down 12:05:15 *** tosse [tosse@tosse.pp.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:05:17 <Ailure> why it goes for belgium when germany is closer is beyond me as well 12:06:04 <peter1138> hmm? 12:06:24 <Ailure> I 12:06:33 <Ailure> I was downloading tightVNC earlier from sourceforge 12:06:45 <Ailure> and it thought that the belgium server was a good mirror as well 12:06:48 <Ailure> when it was down D: 12:09:49 <Ailure> hmm 12:09:55 <Ailure> Visual is very similar to netbeans 12:09:57 <Ailure> which I use for Java 12:12:26 *** tosse [tosse@tosse.pp.se] has joined #openttd 12:15:25 <Ailure> hmm 12:15:32 <Ailure> apart from pointers I understand most of the code 12:17:04 <Darkvater> hmm anyone know how I can forward ports with SSH from X to Z when I connect from Y to Z? 12:17:34 <valhallasw`gone> Darkvater: just normal port forwarding; use google.com:80 instead of localhost:80 12:18:12 <Darkvater> local? 12:18:21 <Darkvater> -L 443:host:443 ? 12:18:31 <valhallasw`gone> yes 12:18:43 <Darkvater> good cause that doesn't work 12:18:49 <valhallasw`gone> right. 12:18:53 <valhallasw`gone> try using putty :P 12:19:08 <Darkvater> I mean I did -R 443, cause -L 443 is only root 12:19:14 <valhallasw`gone> erm. 12:19:25 <valhallasw`gone> -R is remote 12:19:39 <Darkvater> ssh darkvater.homeip.net -L 8080:svn.liacs.nl:443 12:19:42 <valhallasw`gone> which means port 443 on your server will route to host via you current computer 12:19:51 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: maedhros * r8368 /trunk/src/graph_gui.cpp: -Cleanup: [Graphs] Rename the variables relating to whether datasets should be drawn, and use HASBIT for testing against them. 12:19:52 <valhallasw`gone> that should work 12:19:58 <Darkvater> tfarago@arrakis:~> svn co http://127.0.0.1:8080/repos/unisource . 12:19:58 <Darkvater> svn: PROPFIND request failed on '/repos/unisource' 12:19:58 <Darkvater> svn: PROPFIND of '/repos/unisource': 501 Method PROPFIND is not defined in RFC 2068 and is not supported by the Servlet API (http://127.0.0.1:8080) 12:20:01 <Darkvater> :( 12:20:28 <valhallasw`gone> why are you routing that server via ssh? 12:20:48 <Darkvater> cause outside the uni domain it only works through VPN 12:20:56 <valhallasw`gone> ah 12:20:58 <Darkvater> and I can't set up that damn vpn for the love of god on linux 12:21:10 <valhallasw`gone> why ssh to your server instead of to tin? :P 12:21:25 <Darkvater> cause I want the repository locally :) 12:21:30 <valhallasw`gone> ... 12:21:39 <valhallasw`gone> ssh darkvater.homeip.net 12:22:10 *** valhallasw`gone is now known as valhallasw 12:24:41 <Ailure> The direct-x SDK is x-box hyuge 12:24:42 <Ailure> D: 12:25:00 <Ailure> then X-box is based on direct-x so heh lol 12:27:56 <Ailure> ... 12:28:07 <Ailure> the Direct-X SDK comes in the form of a Winzip self-extractor? 12:28:13 <Ailure> wow 12:29:16 <Ailure> well it's setup 12:29:17 <Ailure> but still 12:29:36 <Darkvater> Ailure: you only need a few files from there though :) 12:29:53 <Darkvater> I think I have a 1-2 MB zip with all the directX files openttd needs 12:30:08 <Brianetta> Akalamanaia is on the brink of bankruptcy on my server 12:30:10 <Brianetta> It's amazing 12:30:28 <Ailure> heh 12:30:32 *** DJGummik1h [~joey@clx-ac2-141-3.westend.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:30:42 <Ailure> Maybe I should abort the installation of Direct-X SDK and just obtain thoose files 12:30:55 <Ailure> As I have no intent on creating direct-x applications on my own 12:31:46 <Ailure> XNA 12:31:47 <Ailure> haha 12:31:50 <Ailure> sounds like a trolling group 12:32:00 <Ailure> I know what it is, but still 12:32:17 <Darkvater> lol 12:35:04 <Ailure> hmm 12:35:13 <Ailure> gonna take a walk and grab lunch :p 12:39:51 *** Zaviori [~Zavior@d195-237-7-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Quit: ( www.nnscript.de :: NoNameScript 4.02 :: www.XLhost.de )] 12:39:53 *** DJGummikuh [~joey@clx-ac2-141-3.westend.com] has joined #openttd 12:41:07 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: maedhros * r8369 /trunk/src/graph_gui.cpp: -Cleanup: [Graphs] Rename include_neg and adj_height to more descriptive names, and add some more comments. 12:41:36 <Maedhros> heh, mauve is a terrible player colour for graphs - it's practically invisible... 12:48:03 <Brianetta> Stealth colour 12:48:10 <Brianetta> It's like playing as blue in RTS games 12:48:17 *** ufoun-- [~ha@b07-305a.kn.vutbr.cz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:48:21 <Brianetta> so your boats can't be seen at sea on the map 12:49:06 *** ufoun-- [ha@b07-305a.kn.vutbr.cz] has joined #openttd 12:50:58 *** raimar3 [~hawk@p5489CE87.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 12:54:27 *** ufoun-- [ha@b07-305a.kn.vutbr.cz] has left #openttd [] 12:56:59 *** raimar2 [~hawk@p5489E123.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:08:34 *** green-devil [~rendmig@0x5358b8c4.arcnxe1.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 13:09:10 *** helb [~helb@84.244.90.159] has joined #openttd 13:10:55 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: bjarni * r8370 /trunk/ (6 files in 3 dirs): -Revert (r8363): the autoreplace GUI move cleared the file history 13:23:24 *** Zavior [~Zavior@d195-237-7-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Quit: ( www.nnscript.de :: NoNameScript 4.02 :: www.XLhost.de )] 13:23:44 <Brianetta> Gradual loading hurts profits on stations that make non-full-load stops at several cargo stations 13:23:53 <Brianetta> on trains, even 13:23:59 <Brianetta> because all wagons get some cargo 13:24:21 <Brianetta> and all wagons, if not filled, have their "from" location changed to a closer stationon the way 13:26:19 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: bjarni * r8371 /trunk/ (6 files in 3 dirs): 13:26:19 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Codechange: [autoreplace GUI] moved the autoreplace GUI to a file of it's own 13:26:19 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: Note: it's the same as r8363, only this time the svn history of autoreplace should be preserved 13:26:30 *** gass [~any@81.84.150.238] has joined #openttd 13:28:13 *** Zaviori [~Zavior@d195-237-7-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 13:34:34 <Ailure> 3>LINK : fatal error LNK1104: cannot open file 'dxguid.lib' 13:34:45 <Ailure> ...I must have done some error with configuring Direct-X now D: 13:34:50 <Ailure> kinda have a idea what as well even 13:34:58 * Ailure attempts to fix it 13:36:29 <Ailure> yep 13:36:54 <Ailure> didn't see the x86 and x64 subfolders in the libary folder of direct-x SDK 13:37:11 <Ailure> fixed it now 13:37:12 <hylje> :o 13:37:14 <Ailure> and it works D: 13:37:16 <hylje> omg, dx 13:37:20 <Ailure> well it compiles 13:37:24 <Ailure> I hadn't actually tested the program 13:37:27 <Ailure> *copies data files* 13:38:54 <Ailure> ok this is embrassing 13:39:02 <Ailure> I have no idea where the compiled game is 13:40:14 <Ailure> oh 13:40:23 *** ufoun-- [~ha@b07-305a.kn.vutbr.cz] has joined #openttd 13:40:32 <Ailure> solved it now kinda 13:40:38 <Ailure> still that was a wierd location 13:41:38 <Ailure> openTTD norev 13:41:38 <Ailure> nice 13:41:39 <Ailure> xD 13:46:28 <Ailure> studying code right now 13:47:28 <Ailure> hehe the map accessors 13:49:32 <hylje> omg 13:50:01 <Ailure> what? << 13:58:49 <Tefad> are there weird clipping things going on with the giantic airport? 14:00:08 <Ailure> yes 14:00:20 <Ailure> certain aircraft can get clipping issues 14:00:26 <Tefad> ok cool. 14:00:27 <Ailure> even on a big airport 14:00:38 <Ailure> usually newGRF aircraft from what I seen though 14:00:53 <Tefad> this is with the inbuilt concorde look-alike 14:01:16 <Tefad> but i am using UK renewal grf 14:01:22 <Ailure> shouldn't matter though 14:01:38 <Tefad> just graphical i assume 14:01:45 <Ailure> I think I do recall seeing clipping issues with the orginal concorde 14:01:52 <Ailure> but it's been awhile since I played with the orginal vehicles 14:01:59 <Tefad> ah : ) 14:02:14 <Tefad> this is the first time i've really played ottd in a while 14:02:19 <Tefad> newgrf stuff is interesting 14:02:37 *** imaginner [~imaginner@aclm228.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #openttd 14:02:48 <Tefad> i sort of like the different levels of train cars 14:03:00 <Ailure> heh 14:03:07 <Ailure> it was a pain before autoreplace for vans came around though 14:03:09 <Tefad> and speeds etc 14:03:10 <Ailure> but then I liked it 14:03:12 <Ailure> yeah 14:03:14 <Ailure> it's awesome 14:03:27 <Tefad> there's auto replace for the rail cars? 14:03:34 <Tefad> O_O ! 14:03:48 *** scia [~scia@AveloN.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 14:03:53 <Tefad> HOLY 14:04:02 <SpComb> moly 14:04:10 <Tefad> that could have saved me several.. minutes of time : ( 14:04:23 <Digitalfox> Auto replace for wagons how?? 14:04:34 <Tefad> where it says "Replacing: " 14:04:35 <Tefad> click. 14:05:09 <Digitalfox> and? 14:05:26 <Tefad> do you know how to get to the replace train dialog? 14:05:53 <Tefad> eh, i guess everything is a "window" except error messages or text input 14:06:06 <Digitalfox> yes and i use it, just didn't know wagons could also be replace 14:06:11 <Tefad> yup. 14:06:22 <Tefad> ah, the game says "cars" for me 14:06:39 <Tefad> ah ha. 14:06:50 <Tefad> wagons for original, cars for US 14:07:11 <Digitalfox> later i'll give it shot.. Thanks for the tip 14:07:24 <Digitalfox> *a shot 14:07:35 <Ailure> xD 14:07:45 <Ailure> the autoreplace GUI can be a little bit confusing for newbies I guess 14:07:59 <Tefad> newbs? 14:08:16 <Tefad> newbs to that UI perhaps : ) 14:08:40 <Tefad> i've been playing ottd for a few cvs/svn replacements now 14:08:56 <Tefad> and ttd since i had a pentium 60MHz 14:09:19 <Tefad> or was it just tto back then.. it had a demo 14:18:01 *** roboboy [~Leo@c211-30-116-5.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:29:54 <Darkvater> hmm 14:30:40 *** Wolfensteijn [~wolf@ip52-73-210-87.adsl2.versatel.nl] has joined #openttd 14:30:46 <Darkvater> what should we or will we do about the global list 'new vehicles' button? Allow building vehicles from there or not but only change the string? 14:31:31 <peter1138> hmm? 14:32:01 <Darkvater> you know "vehicle list" window, new vehicles 14:32:09 <peter1138> yeah 14:32:19 <Rubidium> make it available vehicles (instead of new)? 14:32:34 <Darkvater> or only change it to 14:32:36 <Darkvater> he 14:32:43 <Darkvater> what Rubidium said now and you suggested before peter1138 ? 14:32:52 <peter1138> uh huh 14:32:55 <Darkvater> although I don't think new players will understand the difference 14:34:43 <Darkvater> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=545117#545117 << don't you just love the standard answer? 14:34:54 <Darkvater> people are brainwashed by stupid games that need a reinstall to work 14:35:26 <peter1138> heh 14:35:36 <Ailure> [15:09] <Tefad> newbs to that UI perhaps : ) 14:35:45 <Ailure> We can't alienate everyone but veterans to the game 14:35:46 <Ailure> :p 14:36:27 <peter1138> why not? :) 14:36:47 <Ailure> becuse I keep getting new people intrested 14:36:59 <Ailure> think I have inspired at least more than ten players into getting t oplay openTTD D: 14:37:19 <Darkvater> :) 14:39:58 <Ailure> openTTD is quite steep for new players though 14:40:07 <Tefad> yup. 14:40:12 <Ailure> Sometimes I ask myself if I should do some tutorial videos and put them up somewhere 14:40:18 <Ailure> maybe on youtube or something 14:40:27 <Ailure> like the orginal tutorial videos on TTD 14:40:31 <Ailure> but expanded a bit 14:47:44 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r8372 /trunk/src/network/ (core/config.h core/udp.cpp network.cpp): -Fix (8361): NUM_LANDSCAPE comes (via some detour) from openttd.h, which does not exist in the masterserver/updater. 14:48:18 <caladan> Ailure: that videos would be nice, for i had to show how to play to many new players.... 14:49:08 *** DirtYiCE [~dirty_ice@84.236.50.38] has joined #openttd 14:50:14 *** Sacro [~Ben@87.102.80.3] has joined #openttd 14:51:22 <Ailure> and players confuse things 14:51:23 <Ailure> I mean 14:51:23 <Ailure> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?t=29744 14:51:26 <Ailure> just look at that 14:51:47 <Ailure> the concept of a depot might be simple for someoen who played the game for over a decade 14:51:55 <Ailure> but for newbies it might not be as clear 14:53:10 *** mikl [~mikl@tbv.faderhuset.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:53:45 <caladan> I guess that that button could be hmm, made invisible 14:54:01 <caladan> so it isn't even shown... 14:54:56 <Tefad> bug? buoy isn't listed in station ship roster 14:55:10 <Tefad> (in mini order list) 14:55:23 <Ailure> that's becuse 14:55:28 <Ailure> bouys are owned by nobody 14:55:44 <Tefad> ok, but an arrow is still drawn if that is present destination 14:55:46 <Ailure> I don't know the proper name for "neutral" stations 14:56:07 <Ailure> arrow? 14:56:09 <Tefad> the oilfield is listed as destination. 14:56:15 *** Digitalfox [~chatzilla@bl8-41-115.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: Bye Bye...] 14:56:20 <Tefad> arrow is drawn to signify current destination 14:56:44 <Tefad> when it is a buoy, it draws arrow with no words after 14:57:09 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB64A5.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 14:57:35 <Ailure> hmm 14:57:37 <Ailure> oh 14:57:52 <Ailure> I hadn't seen that 14:57:58 <Ailure> then I hadn't paid attention to my ships much 14:58:05 <Ailure> hmm 14:58:08 <Ailure> it dosen't do that on my game 14:58:14 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r8373 /trunk/src/stdafx.h: -Codechange: remove some obsolete MSVC6 compatability defines 14:58:29 <Tefad> it lists buoy in the mini order list? 14:58:32 <Ailure> yes 14:58:39 <Tefad> weird. 14:58:46 <Tefad> i'll keep an eye on it 14:58:48 <Ailure> I'm using openTTD 0.5.0 RC4 14:58:51 <Ailure> though 14:58:56 <Ailure> what version are you uisng? 14:58:57 *** DirtYiCE [~dirty_ice@84.236.50.38] has left #openttd [] 14:58:59 *** PandaMojo [~chatzilla@ip72-197-231-130.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Quit: Chatzilla 0.9.74 [Firefox 1.5.0.9/2006120612]] 14:59:01 <Tefad> r8296 14:59:05 <Ailure> ah 14:59:10 <Ailure> no diea what revision I have 14:59:14 <Ailure> but it's probably the latest 14:59:22 <Ailure> as I grabbed it from the SVN and compiled it just a hour ago or so 14:59:27 <Tefad> ah ha 14:59:33 <Tefad> mine is a day or two stale 14:59:49 <Tefad> it usually tells you revision number in title bar or main screen 14:59:51 <Rubidium> Ailure: you got 0.5.0-RC4 from the SVN? 14:59:57 <Tefad> heh 14:59:58 <Ailure> no 15:00:03 <Ailure> the uhm 15:00:04 <Ailure> trunk version 15:00:08 <Ailure> for some reason 15:00:10 <Tefad> also, about window. 15:00:12 <Ailure> it says norev after compiling it 15:00:22 <Ailure> in the openTTD title bar 15:00:38 <Rubidium> yup, there is no MSVC subversion integration 15:00:46 <Ailure> ah 15:00:49 <Ailure> I see 15:00:52 <Ailure> it dosen't really bother me though 15:01:10 <Ailure> I only used MSVC becuse it seemed to be the most simple approch for me 15:01:12 <Rubidium> getting the (correct) version in MSVC would require some hackery and people to install the command line version of subversion 15:01:19 <Ailure> and that doing it with DevC++ 15:01:23 <Ailure> is asking for a headache 15:01:34 <Ailure> I tried it 15:01:37 <Ailure> and it didn't work all the way 15:01:40 *** mikl [~mikl@tbv.faderhuset.org] has joined #openttd 15:01:42 <Tefad> meh 15:01:54 <Tefad> someone should hack sdl into SFU 15:02:07 <Ailure> hmm 15:02:14 <Ailure> for some reason terrain generation is really much slower 15:02:25 <Ailure> for the trunk version I compiled 15:02:28 <Tefad> larger map? 15:02:40 <Ailure> 256x256 shouldn't take so much time for generating 15:02:45 <Tefad> heh 15:02:47 <Ailure> especially with my computer specs 15:02:48 <Tefad> debug infos? 15:03:05 <Ailure> now if I knew how to do that xD 15:03:13 <Rubidium> possible issues: debug build, high water level, rough terrain, very hilly terrain, ... 15:03:18 <Darkvater> Ailure: debug version is reallllly slow 15:03:20 <Ailure> oh 15:03:22 <Ailure> debug build 15:03:23 <Ailure> yeah haha 15:03:26 <Ailure> it's the debug build I use 15:03:28 <Tefad> : ) 15:03:28 <Ailure> I know that 15:03:30 <Ailure> and suspected it even 15:03:41 <Tefad> i turn that crap off until i find a bug 15:03:43 <Ailure> but i'm not going to use this for serious play 15:03:48 <Ailure> only for me to screw around with the source 15:03:48 <Darkvater> that's not meant for playing :) 15:03:52 <Tefad> i remember once turning on debug fixed the bug and i was miffed. 15:03:56 <Ailure> yeah of course 15:03:57 <Ailure> heh 15:04:01 <Darkvater> to screw around the serouce I just make 64x64 maps 15:04:17 <Tefad> thems tiny maps 15:04:26 <Tefad> like.. two cities 15:04:27 <Ailure> hmm 15:04:29 <Ailure> the airport tool 15:04:33 <Ailure> lacks the landscape button now? 15:04:47 <Tefad> i think they all do now 15:04:49 <Ailure> dosen't make sense to have it removed for me 15:04:56 <Ailure> oh 15:04:58 <Ailure> I see 15:05:02 <Ailure> there was a landscape button added 15:05:04 <Ailure> didn't see that 15:05:12 <Ailure> oh 15:05:15 <Ailure> it's been there for awhile 15:05:17 <Ailure> I never used it 15:05:18 <Ailure> xD 15:05:19 <Tefad> i just have the auto thing turned on so i get landscape 15:05:20 <Darkvater> hmm 15:05:20 <Rubidium> Ailure: that landscape button has been there for as long as I can remember 15:05:29 <Darkvater> quickly; how do I check the CPU temp in lnux/ 15:05:41 <Ailure> yeah but for some reason that' ssomething I never noticed 15:05:45 <Tefad> cat /proc/acpi/THM.. depends on kernel. 15:05:52 <Tefad> use tab completion. 15:06:15 <Ailure> also 15:06:32 <Ailure> hmm 15:06:34 <Tefad> my bad.. 15:06:37 <Darkvater> hmm don't have THM 15:06:44 <Tefad> /proc/acpi/thermal.. 15:06:48 <Ailure> I probably do some "Hello world" thing in openTTD later 15:06:53 <Darkvater> thermal_zone 15:06:57 <Darkvater> but that's an empty dir 15:07:02 <Ailure> looking through the source gives me a good understanding of the inner workings of this game 15:07:12 <Tefad> then your kernel blows chunks. do not pass go do not collect 0 15:07:29 <Tefad> perhaps modprobe some things? 15:07:47 <Tefad> hmm 24C seems a little chilly 15:08:10 <Tefad> but again, my server is only running ssh, screen, irc, and an IM client. 15:11:20 *** bubersson [~bubersson@mnisek.casablanca.cz] has joined #openttd 15:12:16 <Ailure> heh 15:12:17 <Ailure> lovely 15:12:24 <Ailure> for no erason I let the AI play wild 15:12:35 <Ailure> cute how realistic acceleration causes problems for the computer 15:12:36 <Tefad> the AI makes things go boom here 15:12:40 <Ailure> while human prefers it on 15:12:48 <Ailure> well 15:12:52 <Ailure> the AI seems to be not bugged anymore 15:12:58 <Tefad> in the form of segfaults 15:12:59 <Ailure> or maybe it's bugged on bigger maps 15:13:01 <Ailure> oh 15:13:03 <Ailure> well 15:13:04 <Tefad> maybe that's it 15:13:13 <Ailure> for some reason 15:13:19 <Ailure> the AI gotten more stupid in openTTD 15:13:22 <Ailure> compared to the orginal TT 15:13:24 <Ailure> or rather 15:13:28 <Ailure> sometimes I see it building a line 15:13:31 <Ailure> then demolish it 15:13:36 <Ailure> and fail at demolishing it competly 15:13:40 <Tefad> haha 15:13:44 <Ailure> while it didn't have that problem in TTD 15:13:57 <Ailure> I could go through a whole game 15:13:59 <Ailure> with a AI surviving 15:14:05 <Ailure> in openTTD they go bankrupt rather quickly 15:14:12 <Ailure> the AI weren't smart 15:14:16 <Ailure> but they managed to survive at least 15:14:20 <Tefad> i think the AI is busted. completely 15:14:29 <Tefad> most people just sandbox in ottd anyway 15:14:47 <Ailure> I like seein gother companies around personally 15:14:57 <Ailure> and there's some annoying aspects 15:15:00 *** A1win [a1win@loota.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:15:02 <Ailure> such as reinventing the wheel AI 15:15:05 *** A1win [a1win@loota.fi] has joined #openttd 15:15:07 <Ailure> so you can see a huge mess of asphalt 15:15:16 <Ailure> if alot of AI players decide to use road on the same place 15:15:28 <raimar3> Ailure: I'm working on makeing the ai better 15:15:28 <Ailure> since the concept of reusing existing roads is beyond the AI 15:15:29 <Tefad> hehehe 15:15:37 <raimar3> and the improvements are quite visible 15:15:39 <Ailure> hehe I heard someone was 15:15:44 <Ailure> oh 15:15:47 <Tefad> once i put diagonal tracks all around something the AI wanted 15:15:47 <Ailure> such as? 15:15:58 <raimar3> they make money 15:16:01 <Tefad> i had way too much fun watching the AI fail miserably 15:16:04 <Ailure> one improvment they could be 15:16:06 <Eddi|zuHause2> ~> cat /proc/acpi/thermal_zone/THRM/temperature 15:16:07 <Ailure> is smoother curves 15:16:08 <Eddi|zuHause2> temperature: 49 C 15:16:11 <Eddi|zuHause2> says my kernel 15:16:17 <raimar3> and at 2000 they have put tracks everywhere on the map 15:16:23 <Tefad> that's slightly toasty 15:16:35 <Tefad> your CPU should be at high load 15:16:47 <Ailure> well heh 15:16:51 <Ailure> there's some things with the AI 15:16:57 <Ailure> that seems obvious to optimize with it 15:17:02 <Ailure> without messing with it too much 15:17:02 <Darkvater> my cpu is around 60 when idle 15:17:03 <Eddi|zuHause2> Durchschnittslast: 1,36, 1,24, 1,19 15:17:11 <raimar3> the tracks are also MUCH straighter then the existing AI 15:17:13 <Ailure> although longterm it's probably better to rewrite it from scratch 15:17:20 <Ailure> heh 15:17:24 <Tefad> Darkvater: that's not very nice for your CPU. 15:17:28 <Ailure> the track dosen't only need to be straigther 15:17:32 <Ailure> but whenever it creates curves 15:17:33 <Darkvater> my father's is around 70-80 15:17:37 <Ailure> the curves should be smooth 15:17:43 <Darkvater> but, pfft it's worked for years 15:17:47 <Eddi|zuHause2> my cpu is around 70% idle 15:18:00 <Tefad> some CPUs break down at 80-90C (or less) 15:18:01 <raimar3> this is more a matter of finetuning the penalties 15:18:10 <Ailure> depends on what i'm doing here for my CPU 15:18:16 <Tefad> usually 100C is the breaking point of many CPUs 15:18:24 <Ailure> openTTD 0.5.0 RC4 takes almost no CPU time 15:18:27 <Ailure> well in percentages :) 15:18:28 <raimar3> but so far I didn't motivation to look at this 15:18:35 <Ailure> windows show it as 0% 15:18:39 <Ailure> in the task manager 15:18:41 <Tefad> my laptop can hit 60C no problem, then 70C at high usage 15:18:54 <raimar3> under linux SDL eats up the most cycles 15:18:56 <Ailure> and that's in a early midgame session 15:19:04 <Ailure> where I slacked the last 20 years or so 15:19:09 <Ailure> so there isn't as many trains as there could be 15:19:21 <Ailure> played it together with a friend 15:19:40 <Tefad> i'm running 512x512 with minimal CPU impact 15:19:51 <Tefad> i turn off details and palette cycling 15:19:54 <Ailure> oh me too 15:19:59 <Eddi|zuHause2> hmm... kaffeine uses 18% CPU just while recording 15:20:04 <Ailure> then I could play at the biggest map size on my old computer 15:20:13 <Ailure> map generation and autosave got annoying 15:20:21 <Tefad> yeah . . 15:20:23 <Ailure> and there was too much on the mapo 15:20:36 <Ailure> I would enjoy really big maps more 15:20:36 <Ailure> if the map generator didn't place so many industries and towns 15:20:42 *** Zahl [~SENFGURKE@p549F163C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 15:20:45 <Ailure> I want very low amount of towns and industries D: 15:20:57 <Tefad> run scenario generator to make a map 15:20:59 <Eddi|zuHause2> i want industries placed in towns 15:21:01 <Tefad> place your own towns. 15:21:12 <Eddi|zuHause2> not in the middle of nowhere 15:21:16 <Darkvater> ha it works 15:21:18 <Darkvater> CPU Temp: +69.5°C (high = +95°C, hyst = +80°C) (beep) 15:21:29 <Ailure> Tefad: I have done that 15:21:34 <Ailure> but I rather see it done automatically 15:21:35 <Ailure> :p 15:21:37 <Darkvater> so only 70 15:21:49 <Tefad> that's quite high for a desktop 15:22:05 <Ailure> 70 celsius? 15:22:07 <Eddi|zuHause2> Darkvater: could use a fan on the case 15:22:08 <Ailure> Depends on what you're doing 15:22:10 <Maedhros> is there anyone around who can test whether openttd compiles with this patch for me? http://paste.openttd.org/13 15:22:11 <Darkvater> it's always been high. I have an AMD TB 1.3 15:22:16 <Maedhros> especially people who aren't running linux 15:22:19 <Tefad> oh, babahaha 15:22:20 <Darkvater> those are hotheads 15:22:35 <Ailure> I think you can go up to 100 C without problems 15:22:36 <Tefad> no idea why there's two b's there 15:22:41 <Ailure> and even past that 15:22:45 <Tefad> tbreds crazy. 15:22:53 <Ailure> my graphics card have a threshold at 110 C 15:23:04 <Tefad> cook on your CPUs. 15:23:14 <Ailure> It's 54 celsius 15:23:19 <Ailure> but it's not used much anyway for now 15:23:30 *** bubersson [~bubersson@mnisek.casablanca.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:23:30 <Ailure> most of my games tear on the CPU and memory more than GPU 15:23:31 <Eddi|zuHause2> my previous PC ran on 70°C when idle, and the mainboard blew up after a while 15:23:38 <Ailure> which is a bit of a shame, as it's a high end GPU xD 15:23:45 <Tefad> heh 15:23:50 <Tefad> i have a Ti4400 15:23:55 <Tefad> it doesn't do much of anything 15:24:03 <Tefad> every now and then i'll play ut2k4 15:24:38 <Ailure> 2 GB of memory, 2,61 GHZ 64 X2 dual 15:25:00 <Ailure> Geforce 7900 GTX 15:25:18 <Ailure> I forgot how much memory it have again 15:25:35 <Ailure> ah 15:25:37 <Ailure> 512 mb 15:25:48 <Ailure> quite a jump 15:25:54 <Ailure> considering my last graphic card were something like 15:25:58 <Ailure> 64 or 128 mb 15:25:58 <peter1138> has 15:26:03 <peter1138> are you bjarni or something? :p 15:26:04 <Ailure> forgot exact amount 15:26:11 <Ailure> me? 15:26:16 <peter1138> yeah 15:26:21 <Ailure> Isn't Bjarni scandinavian? 15:26:24 <Ailure> I live in South Sweden 15:26:29 <Ailure> and live rather close to denmark 15:26:31 <Brianetta> Bankruptcies galore! 15:26:36 <Brianetta> My server is good again 15:26:45 <peter1138> that'll probably be it 15:26:50 <Ailure> so I probably do some common scandinavian mistakes at English 15:26:51 <Ailure> :p 15:27:39 *** glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 15:27:43 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 15:37:35 *** Digitalfox [~chatzilla@bl7-182-183.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #openttd 15:40:42 <Bjarni> ohh I got highlighted 15:40:50 <hylje> Bjarni Bjarni Bjarni Bjarni 15:40:57 <Bjarni> and then nobody wanted to say anything to me :s 15:40:58 <hylje> You Just Got Highlighted! 15:41:16 <Bjarni> hylje highlight test 15:42:30 <Ailure> heh 15:42:40 <Ailure> hightligning is fun 15:47:30 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: maedhros * r8374 /trunk/src/ (graph_gui.cpp stdafx.h): 15:47:30 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Fix (r8367): LLONG_MAX isn't always defined, and INT64_MAX describes the 15:47:30 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: required value better anyway. However, INT64_MAX comes from stdint.h which 15:47:30 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: doesn't seem to exist on MSVC or MorphOS, so it's defined manually for them. 15:48:16 <Maedhros> aren't random incompatibilities fun? 15:48:39 <Darkvater> gaah, I bundled the wrong dbghelp.dll with the RC4 binaries o_O 15:48:46 <Darkvater> they don't run on win 95 15:52:26 <DJGummikuh> oh 15:52:39 <DJGummikuh> how many are really playing on win95 still? 15:52:55 <ln-> who's in charge here? 15:52:58 <Darkvater> a few 15:53:03 <ln-> $ ./configure 15:53:04 <ln-> ./configure: syntax error at line 520: `(' unexpected 15:53:27 <ln-> i suspect that is because configure begins with: #!/bin/sh 15:53:40 <ln-> now why the hell does it begin with that if it doesn't run with sh? 15:53:43 <Darkvater> Rubidium already fixed that 15:54:15 *** PandaMojo [~chatzilla@ip72-197-231-130.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #openttd 15:54:16 <ln-> when? 15:54:25 <ln-> i took a clean checkout just a minute ago. 15:54:56 <Darkvater> or well there was a recent change to it 15:55:39 <ln-> 5693 truelight #!/bin/sh 15:56:05 <Maedhros> if [ -n "$custom_lang_dir" ] && [ "$custom_lang_dir" != "$(OSXAPP)/Contents/Lang/" ]; then 15:56:14 <Maedhros> that should be ${OSXAPP} ... 15:57:38 <Maedhros> grr, this file would be easier to read if gvim didn't hilight everything bright red 15:57:49 <Maedhros> i wonder what it thinks is wrong with it? 15:58:14 <ln-> $ ./configure 15:58:14 <ln-> grep: illegal option -- E 15:58:14 <ln-> grep: illegal option -- q 15:58:14 <ln-> Usage: grep -hblcnsviw pattern file . . . 15:58:43 <Rubidium> ok, now comes the 'trick': it is a bash script, but in order to make it work under MinGW or cygwin (don't know which it exactly was), it needs to #!/bin/sh as it does not know bash, when sh is actually bash 15:59:00 <ln-> gah 15:59:26 <Tron__> Rubidium: nonsense 15:59:44 <Brianetta> All my bash scripts start #!/bin/sh anyway 15:59:55 <Brianetta> I tend not to use the bash extensions if I can help it 16:00:01 <ln-> Rubidium: if it doesn't run with plain sh, it should refer to it then. 16:02:34 <Rubidium> Tron__: http://rubidium.student.utwente.nl/openttd/mingw-bash.png <- see the nonsense 16:02:42 *** VanilleBert [~gilbert@p83.129.175.112.tisdip.tiscali.de] has joined #openttd 16:02:46 <Tron__> it is NO bash script 16:02:53 <Tron__> it does not use bashisms 16:03:57 <VanilleBert> hi, does anybody know the name of following grfs? http://www.openttd.org/screens.php?image=images/screens/Development/tart_valley 16:04:24 <Rubidium> what could cause the problems for ln- then? A non-sh compatible shell linked to /bin/sh ? 16:04:50 <Maedhros> Rubidium: no, $(OSXAPP) is invalid 16:04:53 <ln-> given that configure has 118 lines, it's odd that the syntax error is on line 520... 16:04:54 <Tron__> a non-Posix conform grep obviously 16:05:07 <Maedhros> ln-: it's all in config.lib 16:05:23 <ln-> Tron__: that, too, maybe, but initially the script wouldn't run even that far. 16:05:23 <DJGummikuh> VanilleBert: newstations perhaps? 16:06:37 <Tron__> this whole thing makes stuff unnecessarily complicated 16:06:57 <DJGummikuh> VanilleBert: http://www.openttd.org/screens.php?image=images/screens/Development/suntfingford 16:07:13 <VanilleBert> thx 16:07:38 <ln-> the configure script is only supposed to run with GNU tools? 16:07:58 <Maedhros> ln-: does it work if you apply this patch? http://rafb.net/p/g5FSyM93.html 16:08:39 <Tron__> the {} are redundant 16:09:24 <Maedhros> true... i'm just in the habit of using them for any variables inside a string 16:13:14 <Tefad> slight bug: if news hasn't been read before industry closes.. the industry's name is blank in the news item. 16:13:28 <ln-> hmm, ./configure 16:13:28 <ln-> configure: error: invalid option --endian=AUTO 16:13:56 <Ailure> I love how you can obliterate towns in openTTD 16:14:08 <Ailure> with some 'lobbying' :) 16:14:25 <Maedhros> meh 16:14:40 <Maedhros> ln-: which OS are you running? 16:16:08 <ln-> Maedhros: SunOS unknown 5.9 Generic_117171-07 sun4m sparc SUNW,SPARCstation-5 16:18:35 <VanilleBert> Ailure: just like in real life... villages in saxony get obliterated for brown coal... 16:19:21 <VanilleBert> Ailure: but in OTTD the protests and demonstrations against that, are not in the News... just like in real life ;) 16:19:22 <Maedhros> bah. that grep doesn't support -E, but you can't escape ( | and ) with it, making it completely incompatible with gnu grep 16:19:46 <Ailure> is there a way to remove a server pw from a running server 16:19:49 <Ailure> without restarting it? 16:21:20 *** MiHaMeK [~miham@xenon.bibl.u-szeged.hu] has joined #openttd 16:21:20 *** MiHaMiX [~miham@xenon.bibl.u-szeged.hu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:21:33 *** MiHaMeK [~miham@xenon.bibl.u-szeged.hu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:23:51 <Ailure> oh well 16:23:55 <Ailure> I just restarted my server :p 16:24:06 <Ailure> since the console didn't let me blank it 16:24:58 *** ChrisM87 [~ChrisM@p54AC6D61.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:26:18 *** MiHaMeK [~miham@xenon.bibl.u-szeged.hu] has joined #openttd 16:27:04 <Ailure> http://www.openttd.org/server_detail.php?id=13127 16:27:07 <Ailure> heh 16:27:10 <Ailure> reports one client 16:27:14 <Ailure> it dosen't count the server apparently 16:27:18 <Ailure> depsite me particying in the game 16:27:36 <peter1138> servers are not clients 16:27:48 <Rubidium> and, that page is not necessarily up-to-date 16:28:49 <Ailure> hmm well heh 16:29:15 <Ailure> but it says 1/10 clients 16:29:22 <Ailure> so it's possibel to run a game with 11 players in total? 16:29:26 <Ailure> with one being the server? 16:29:26 <Ailure> :p 16:29:50 <peter1138> probably 16:30:02 <Ailure> still 16:30:11 <Ailure> I never liked that client limit 16:30:15 <Rubidium> I think that the local player is counted as a client in case of non-dedicated servers 16:30:30 <Ailure> which would make sense 16:30:32 <Ailure> but it dosen't here 16:30:36 <Ailure> unles it's slow at updating now 16:30:48 <Rubidium> Ailure: it updates once in 15 minutes 16:30:53 <Ailure> ah yeah 16:30:55 <Ailure> heh 16:30:57 <Ailure> makes sense 16:31:03 <Ailure> probably was last updated when I started it 16:31:03 <peter1138> hehe, utf-8 doesn't support the oe ligature, apparently 16:31:06 <Ailure> as I restarted it recently 16:31:17 <Ailure> and I was the only player for a half minute 16:31:20 <Ailure> which is probably when it did a update 16:31:34 <Rubidium> when you register it updates immediatelly 16:32:03 <Ailure> I like that search for GRF's link 16:32:05 <Ailure> didn't see it before 16:32:08 <Ailure> but it will be useful 16:32:39 *** ChrisM87 [~ChrisM@p54AC6D61.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 16:32:39 <Ailure> heh 16:32:44 <Ailure> some of the GRF's listed is reduant 16:32:49 <Ailure> tropical set in temperate climate? 16:32:57 <Ailure> that set isn't used 16:33:09 <peter1138> don't use it then 16:33:31 <Ailure> can't bother restarting again now though 16:33:40 *** Tino|R152 [~Tino@52N.UNI-MUENSTER.DE] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 16:33:42 <peter1138> don't complain then ;p 16:33:42 <Ailure> it's the only GRF in that list 16:33:47 <Ailure> nah I wasn't complaining 16:33:52 <Ailure> just pointing out my own mistake :) 16:34:48 <Ailure> hmm 16:34:57 <Ailure> seems like some of my new stations is missing at grfcrawler 16:35:32 <Ailure> which is understandable as grcrawler can't have every GRF out there, especially without permission 16:35:54 <Ailure> I think thoose platforms are from the GRF pack for opeTTDcoop 16:36:36 <peter1138> grfcrawler doesn't host GRFs anyway 16:37:40 <Ailure> hmm 16:37:41 <Ailure> you're right 16:37:44 <Ailure> I never noticed that fact even 16:50:16 *** MiHaMeK_ [~miham@xenon.bibl.u-szeged.hu] has joined #openttd 16:50:16 *** MiHaMeK [~miham@xenon.bibl.u-szeged.hu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:50:34 *** MiHaMeK_ [~miham@xenon.bibl.u-szeged.hu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:50:47 <ln-> isn't it true that U = {(x,y,z) | z = 3x + 2y} is a subspace of R²? 16:53:30 <Progman> show me how u get a R³ element in a R² space *g* 16:54:31 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1F1C6.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:55:16 *** MiHaMeK [~miham@xenon.bibl.u-szeged.hu] has joined #openttd 16:55:29 *** Sillium [~x@e180072231.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd 16:55:46 *** Sillium is now known as Sillium^Away 17:00:10 *** DJGummikuh [~joey@clx-ac2-141-3.westend.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:03:11 *** nairan [~maui_key@p5498E9C8.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:03:42 *** DirtYiCE [~dirty_ice@84.236.50.38] has joined #openttd 17:07:46 *** Rens2Sea [~Rens2Sea@213.211.185.168] has joined #openttd 17:17:23 *** bubersson [~bubersson@mnisek.casablanca.cz] has joined #openttd 17:20:00 <Eddi|zuHause2> ln-: it is 2-dimensional, so you can map it isomorphically to R^2, but that does not make it R^2 17:20:48 *** Someone [~Someone@cc75806-b.ensch1.ov.home.nl] has joined #openttd 17:21:12 <ln-> Eddi|zuHause2: yeah, true... 17:21:34 *** PandaMojo_ [~panda@ip72-197-231-130.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #openttd 17:22:24 <Eddi|zuHause2> btw. i always assumed that germans use U at that place, because it means "Unterraum", why do non-german speakers use U there? 17:24:31 <ln-> i guess at the time when the finns came down from the trees and went to university, a lot of foreign math literature may have been in german.. and later the semantics of letters may have been forgotten but letters kept the same. 17:25:10 *** nairan [~maui_key@p5498E9C8.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 17:26:14 <Eddi|zuHause2> there are some funny things with those namings, because some things were german originally, later translated to english, and then back-translated to german 17:26:25 <Eddi|zuHause2> especially noticeable in graph-theory 17:28:08 <Someone> ;o 17:28:19 <Someone> *WP: Iron Maiden - 22 Acacia Avenue (The Number Of The Beast) [06:33m/128Kbps/44KHz] (1983) 17:34:37 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host86-235-dynamic.5-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 17:34:52 <stillunknown> Someone: spam alert ;-) 17:34:56 <Wolf01> hola 17:35:29 *** Digitalfox [~chatzilla@bl7-182-183.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: Bye Bye...] 17:40:19 *** Tron__ [nJYG5iTU@nat-1.rz.uni-karlsruhe.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:41:42 *** setrodox [~setrodox@83-65-232-76.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has joined #openttd 17:46:19 *** VanilleBert [~gilbert@p83.129.175.112.tisdip.tiscali.de] has left #openttd [] 17:46:35 *** PandaMojo_ [~panda@ip72-197-231-130.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Quit: PandaMojo_] 17:51:41 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB64A5.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Osai] 17:58:05 *** bubersson [~bubersson@mnisek.casablanca.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:01:34 *** green-devil [~rendmig@0x5358b8c4.arcnxe1.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk] has quit [] 18:11:59 <Eddi|zuHause2> we should burn spammers at the stake... like they did with witches 200 years ago ;) 18:12:16 *** BobingAbout [~BobingAbo@adsl-83-100-173-194.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 18:12:20 *** BobingAbout [~BobingAbo@adsl-83-100-173-194.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [] 18:13:30 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@dD5772982.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 18:22:31 *** mikl [~mikl@tbv.faderhuset.org] has quit [Quit: In the end, all that matters is your relation with God...] 18:22:53 <izhirahider> What can I do to prevent a town house or road from being built in a particular spot of the map? 18:24:16 <caladan> buy the land 18:28:29 <izhirahider> ah, well, that doesn't quite work in my map 18:28:36 <izhirahider> weird 18:29:06 <izhirahider> interesting...Is there any other way without putting a sign on the square? 18:29:18 <izhirahider> heh, if I buy it, it will block the boat passage 18:29:19 <caladan> build rail 18:29:32 <izhirahider> I'll show a screenshot, wait 18:33:07 <Eddi|zuHause2> i can't imagine how roads and ship-passages can possibly compete about the same tile... 18:33:16 <izhirahider> http://img478.imageshack.us/img478/2873/mollerussatransport26ma6ul.png 18:33:28 <izhirahider> and http://img259.imageshack.us/img259/1109/mollerussatransport7jun4fs.png 18:33:46 <izhirahider> the thing is: if I don't buy the land, houses will be built in those two positions, and will block the passage too 18:34:18 <Eddi|zuHause2> ah... diagonal shore tiles... 18:34:38 <caladan> do houses build like that? > 18:34:53 <izhirahider> yes, see next tile to the east 18:35:06 <izhirahider> I mean, to the west 18:35:16 <izhirahider> the road is on a slope 18:36:11 <Eddi|zuHause2> i'd propose making the water 1 tile wider, or use canals 18:37:04 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: miham * r8375 /trunk/src/lang/ (5 files): 18:37:04 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Update: WebTranslator2 update to 2007-01-23 19:34:40 18:37:04 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: brazilian_portuguese - 2 changed by fukumori (2) 18:37:04 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: esperanto - 14 changed by LaPingvino (14) 18:37:04 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: simplified_chinese - 6 fixed, 10 changed by Fishingsnow (16) 18:37:06 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: slovenian - 394 changed by Necrolyte (394) 18:37:08 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: ukrainian - 68 changed by mad (61), znikoz (7) 18:38:16 <caladan> izhirahider: build there horizontal track :D 18:38:37 <izhirahider> I can't put anything there because it would raise the whole tile 18:39:13 <izhirahider> Eddi|zuHause2, you say raise the whole canal and create an artificial lake? 18:39:13 <izhirahider> heh 18:39:19 <caladan> true... 18:39:32 <Eddi|zuHause2> izhirahider: yes 18:39:37 <caladan> hmm, just use canals 18:42:52 <izhirahider> I don't have money for that 18:42:58 <izhirahider> heh 18:45:51 *** Purno [~Purno@5351CF18.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd 18:54:44 *** bubersson [~bubersson@mnisek.casablanca.cz] has joined #openttd 19:02:42 <Eddi|zuHause2> izhirahider: tried placing a buoy? 19:03:57 *** ufoun-- [~ha@b07-305a.kn.vutbr.cz] has quit [Quit: ufoun--] 19:09:43 *** Zahl22 [~SENFGURKE@p549F163C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 19:09:47 *** Zahl [~SENFGURKE@p549F163C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Killed (NickServ (GHOST command used by Zahl22))] 19:09:47 *** Zahl22 is now known as Zahl 19:12:45 <izhirahider> can't 19:13:10 <izhirahider> Eddi|zuHause2, can't build anything on a slope like that, even my own trees 19:19:26 *** Purno [~Purno@5351CF18.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:19:41 *** ceji [~cerny@176.99.202.62.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #openttd 19:20:28 *** Zahl [~SENFGURKE@p549F163C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:21:28 *** ufoun-- [Miranda@b07-305a.kn.vutbr.cz] has joined #openttd 19:24:42 *** KritiK [Maxim@ppp31-150.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #openttd 19:25:33 <peter1138> who fucked up the rail vehicle lists? 19:27:10 <peter1138> bjarni 19:29:24 *** DirtYiCE [~dirty_ice@84.236.50.38] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:29:59 <peter1138> Bjarni: any chance you can unfuck the rail vehicle build window? 19:30:19 <Mucht_> unfuck is cool 19:30:21 <Ailure> Imagine how many people would like to be able to unfuck in real life 19:30:29 <Mucht_> yeah 19:34:02 *** Sillium^Away [~x@e180072231.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [] 19:34:45 <bubersson> I wish it woulf be possible to unfuck windows.. 19:35:27 <Wolf01> what is the problem? 19:35:46 <Eddi|zuHause2> windows is one big problem ;) 19:36:52 <bubersson> crashed, when reading nightly trunk log (cuz it was dodownloading updates or whatever) 19:37:03 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r8376 /trunk/src/strings.cpp: -Codechange: remove unused table 19:37:15 <Wolf01> oooook, as the latest about 50 revisions broke my daylength patch, i bugfixed it, now it works better than always :D 19:38:03 <izhirahider> Eddi|zuHause2, you think I should make a bug report, or just consider it a feature? 19:38:34 *** Sillium [~x@e180072231.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd 19:38:35 <Eddi|zuHause2> izhirahider: rather make a feature request ;) 19:38:43 *** Sillium is now known as Sillium^Away 19:40:35 <Wolf01> features? on windows? they call features the bugs "hey i found a bug which make me able to gain the control of a remote machine" is the "shared desktop feature" 19:43:02 *** Digitalfox [~chatzilla@bl8-41-115.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #openttd 19:44:10 <Eddi|zuHause2> Wolf01: don't mix different discussions ;) 19:45:19 <Wolf01> oh yeh, wasn't izhirahider who talked about windoz 19:45:30 <Digitalfox> Celestar said it would start some work in new branch economy this monday, haven't see him since saturday.. Anyone knows if he still thinks of starting economy branch this week? 19:47:19 <Wolf01> Bjarni, can you make the vehicle info windows resizable in width too? 19:47:56 <Wolf01> i can't read some strings 19:51:26 <Bjarni> one thing at a time please :P 19:51:35 <Bjarni> or rather, one window at a time 19:57:00 *** Wolfolo|AWAY [~wolf01@host86-235-dynamic.5-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 19:57:00 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host86-235-dynamic.5-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Killed (NickServ (GHOST command used by Wolfolo|AWAY))] 20:01:26 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: bjarni * r8377 /trunk/src/build_vehicle_gui.cpp: -Fix (r8331): [build vehicle window] train cargo capacity now only add "(refitable)" if the engine in question is refitable 20:01:40 <Bjarni> peter1138: here you go 20:01:55 <peter1138> what about the others? 20:02:32 <Bjarni> this particular bug was in a switch under case VEH_Train 20:02:46 <peter1138> you've shrunk the space at the bottom 20:03:21 <Bjarni> hmm 20:03:22 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host86-235-dynamic.5-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 20:03:42 <Bjarni> you mean it prints text outside of the widget? 20:03:46 <peter1138> yes 20:03:52 <Bjarni> with what set? 20:04:03 <peter1138> ukrs for a start 20:04:07 <Bjarni> ok 20:04:15 * Bjarni goes test this with ukrs 20:04:27 <peter1138> the space on the rail build window was increased but you've ripped that out 20:04:29 <hylje> :o 20:05:41 <peter1138> the railtype problem is tron's, though 20:05:58 <Tron> hm? 20:06:06 <peter1138> - e->railtype = (RailType)ei->railtype; 20:06:16 <peter1138> but e->railtype still exists and is still used in places 20:07:35 <peter1138> (and is still saved in the savegame, more wtfage) 20:08:09 <peter1138> want to fiddle, or shall i fix it? 20:08:53 <hylje> :o 20:09:11 <Tron> peter1138: at it 20:09:19 <Tron> something is fishy in src/autoreplace_gui.cpp:63 20:09:30 <Tron> RailVehInfo() is used twice 20:09:42 <peter1138> yeah 20:10:01 <peter1138> never mind that ENGINE_AVAILABLE macro, heh 20:10:09 <Tron> and use DeMorgan's law 20:10:34 *** Wolfolo|AWAY [~wolf01@host86-235-dynamic.5-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:11:26 <Tron> the variable "info" seems unused 20:12:00 <Bjarni> peter1138: well, I failed to make it print outside the window 20:12:16 <peter1138> Bjarni: trust me, it was bigger than it is now for a reason 20:12:38 <peter1138> enable realistic acceleration 20:12:38 <Bjarni> can you tell me what vehicle, that's too big? 20:12:45 <peter1138> and view the bombardier voyager 20:13:01 <peter1138> hmm 20:13:04 <peter1138> not that one :P 20:13:21 <peter1138> alstom pendoline 20:13:29 <peter1138> actually yes that one too 20:13:34 <Tron> something is very wrong with DrawVehiclePurchaseInfo() 20:14:08 <peter1138> which one? heh 20:14:15 <Tron> exactly that's the problem 20:14:21 <peter1138> indeed 20:14:42 <Tron> the one for rail wagons and the one for locomotives 20:14:59 <Tron> the last parameter for the latter is superflous 20:15:37 <Bjarni> ok, found the issue 20:17:17 <peter1138> that's a fairly nasty use of overloading... 20:18:25 * peter1138 goes back to flightsim 20:20:27 * Belugas goes into the delights of BDE API calls 20:23:37 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: bjarni * r8378 /trunk/src/build_vehicle_gui.cpp: -Fix (r8331): [build vehicle window] extended the widget with the details with one line since some newgrf trains needs it 20:23:45 <MiHaMeK> evening :) 20:24:11 <peter1138> welcome to regression testing 20:27:31 <Wolf01> yeah, now ships can travel diagonally under bridges :D 20:27:46 <hylje> :o 20:27:51 <Bjarni> should I rename the DrawVehiclePurchaseInfo() functions? 20:30:39 *** Reday [~yerich@CPE00095b329b39-CM000039faee61.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #openttd 20:30:52 *** Reday [~yerich@CPE00095b329b39-CM000039faee61.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has left #openttd [] 20:38:15 *** wolfy [~wolf@ip52-73-210-87.adsl2.versatel.nl] has joined #openttd 20:38:15 *** Wolfensteijn [~wolf@ip52-73-210-87.adsl2.versatel.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:40:27 *** ceji [~cerny@176.99.202.62.cust.bluewin.ch] has left #openttd [] 20:43:51 <Wolf01> mmmm what's better? drag&drop select ships | select all ships in one tile | allow one ship per tile 20:44:09 <Bjarni> better for what? 20:44:52 *** pecisk [~pecisk@purvc-44-54.maksinets.lv] has joined #openttd 20:46:45 <Wolf01> for a suggestion about the ship selection 20:47:08 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B764B6.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 20:49:46 *** Eddi|zuHause2 [~johekr@p54B75E38.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:51:56 *** Wolfolo|AWAY [~wolf01@82.60.174.136] has joined #openttd 20:51:56 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host86-235-dynamic.5-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Killed (NickServ (GHOST command used by Wolfolo|AWAY))] 20:52:56 *** Sillium^Away [~x@e180072231.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [] 20:53:04 *** Wolfolo|AWAY is now known as Wolf01 20:54:18 *** BFM [~chatzilla@CPE-138-130-140-81.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 20:55:15 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: bjarni * r8379 /trunk/src/build_vehicle_gui.cpp: -Cleanup: [build vehicle window] removed overloading with DrawVehiclePurchaseInfo() and renamed them into type specific names 20:55:15 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: miham * r8380 /trunk/src/lang/slovenian.txt: [Translations] -Fix: After held a developer mini-conference upon this wrong argidx issue, we decided to remove the {P ..} from STR_TONS 20:59:26 <Bjarni> at this rate, we will hit revision 10.000 in no time 21:00:05 *** scia [~scia@AveloN.xs4all.nl] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 21:00:42 <MiHaMeK> lol 21:01:41 <peter1138> all that for not that much progress :P 21:02:02 <MiHaMeK> :D 21:02:07 <Wolf01> Bjarni, you moved some "running cost" functions? 21:02:27 <Bjarni> I don't think so 21:02:31 <Bjarni> I moved the print of it 21:02:41 <Bjarni> I mean 21:02:42 <Wolf01> eh, i meant that 21:02:59 <peter1138> Bjarni: yeah, remember you're not supposed to... *change* things 21:03:00 <Bjarni> I moved the code to print it, not WHERE in the window it's printed 21:04:10 <Wolf01> peter1138, is only to know, so i can find easily where i have to fix my patches 21:04:56 *** ajmiles [~aj@212.241.231.3] has joined #openttd 21:05:32 <Bjarni> heh, now that I spend time coding again, I also spend time in this channel and now the TODO list grows more than ever even though I actually remove stuff from it 21:06:09 <ajmiles> would the reverse be true though? 21:09:18 <Bjarni> well, when I'm not in this channel and I don't code, it will not grow 21:09:31 <Bjarni> now that I do the stuff that's on the list, I thought it would shrink 21:09:42 <ajmiles> do other people do things on your TODO list though? 21:09:42 <Bjarni> instead people go "oh great. While you are at it, do this as well" 21:09:52 <Bjarni> I don't think so 21:09:59 <Bjarni> you see, it's on my HD and never made public 21:11:07 <hylje> thats, liek, good practice! 21:12:35 <Smoovious> speaking of which, Bjarni... would you mind doing ... .. . 21:12:37 <Smoovious> :) j/k 21:13:09 <ajmiles> does anyone have a ballpark figure for the # of lines in openttd's source? 21:13:36 <hylje> i can count em 21:13:39 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:13:52 <ajmiles> hylje, get back to me in 2008 sometime? 21:13:57 <hylje> :D 21:15:29 <hylje> hylje@fishtank ~/projects/ottd/trunk/src $ cat *.cpp *.h *.hpp | wc -l 21:15:29 <hylje> 116053 21:15:42 <peter1138> bzzt 21:15:44 <peter1138> sub directories 21:15:57 <hylje> o 21:16:37 <hylje> hylje@fishtank ~/projects/ottd/trunk/src $ cat *.cpp *.h *.hpp */*.cpp */*.h */*.hpp | wc -l 21:16:41 <hylje> 148500 21:16:49 <Tron> still not all 21:17:03 <hylje> :/ 21:17:16 <hylje> im not l33t enough to recursively go through it all 21:17:36 <ajmiles> just throw a -r in there somewhere, it'll work eventually 21:18:34 <hylje> a plain recursive thing counts .svn dirs too 21:18:52 *** green-devil [~rendmig@0x5358b8c4.arcnxe1.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 21:19:00 <hylje> but at least those dont have plain .cpp etc files 21:19:51 <Eddi|zuHause> hylje: svn export 21:21:19 <Bjarni> you could also open the files manually and count 21:22:32 <caladan> maybe using find? 21:24:31 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: bjarni * r8381 /trunk/src/build_vehicle_gui.cpp: -Fix (r8377): [build vehicle window] cleaned up the train refitable detection. It had two variables doing the same thing, but not always set to the same (oops) 21:31:27 *** Neonox [~Neonox@p57B29D85.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 21:32:00 <peter1138> 156830, heh 21:32:17 <ajmiles> thanks for that 21:33:52 <Rubidium> peter1138: have you counted the obj-C files? 21:35:07 <Eddi|zuHause> Postulate: there's always a pedant who notices a missing line 21:35:13 <peter1138> point 21:35:19 <Rubidium> and win64.asm 21:35:22 <Eddi|zuHause> 1st derivation: the project has infinitely many lines 21:39:20 <ajmiles> ok, so i'm about 10% of the way to rewriting openttd ;) 21:39:34 <Maedhros> heh, why? and in which language? 21:39:59 <caladan> show us what you got :-) 21:40:10 <ajmiles> why not? :) and because i needed a third year project and i thought it might be fun to try 21:40:14 <ajmiles> C# 21:40:26 <Bjarni> o_O 21:40:38 <ajmiles> quite aware i'm not an artist and in all certainly won't ever finish, but the project doesn't require that i finish, just that i have done something 21:40:43 <Bjarni> are you the guy from the forum, who talked about making a C# port? 21:40:47 <ajmiles> nope 21:41:24 <Bjarni> we got the code in C/C++. I see no reason to rewrite it in any other language 21:41:32 <Digitalfox> ajmiles: Will you make available to the community the code you port? 21:41:51 <Digitalfox> even if is not finished? 21:42:00 <Bjarni> Digitalfox: why would you want that? 21:42:13 <ajmiles> it depends on what i get done and how tidy the code it, but it won't be of any use to the openttd community 21:42:33 <ajmiles> it's really just a personal project to see what i'm capable of doing in a few months 21:42:59 <Digitalfox> Bjarni: Someone if interested may continue the work :) 21:43:12 <ajmiles> http://snipurl.com/1866r 21:43:19 <Bjarni> ajmiles: I once had a personal project that took a few months. It's called autoreplace 21:43:28 <ajmiles> Bjarni, hehe 21:43:34 <Bjarni> now a whole lot of people know it 21:43:45 <Digitalfox> Bjarni: This is if someone find it interesting or useful :) 21:43:49 <ajmiles> yeah, as i said, i'm *very* aware i won't ever get anywhere near finishing 21:43:50 <Sacro> his depots face the wrong way :\ 21:44:04 <Sacro> but i want his mine and power plant grf 21:44:04 <ajmiles> Sacro, yeah, that's because i've not though about how to change the openttd gui to reflect rotation 21:44:19 <Sacro> ajmiles: this is yours? 21:44:22 <ajmiles> yup 21:44:27 <Sacro> oooOOOooo 21:44:35 <ajmiles> don't stop with the criticism now :) 21:44:35 <Sacro> damn you stole my uni project idea 21:44:52 <ajmiles> it does have road vehicles and pathfinding, the video just doesn't demonstrate it 21:45:11 <ajmiles> http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=6460996610536814202 - that one does though (and is a lot older) 21:45:44 <ajmiles> and if you want my road vehicle models, you can't, they are waaaay too advanced 21:46:31 <Sacro> :o 21:46:34 <Sacro> that bus is sooo cool 21:46:35 <ajmiles> ignore the sharp 90 degree turns, i'll worry about that later, it's easy to fix 21:46:49 <Sacro> i like it 21:46:52 <Sacro> its got charecter 21:46:55 <Sacro> and a retro feel 21:47:37 <Sacro> wow, the pathfinder actually does work 21:47:44 <ajmiles> it is designed to be a 'clone' of openttd/ttd, but in 3D. i'm not even sure it'll be fun, but hey 21:47:53 <ajmiles> yeah, it's just A* pathfinding 21:48:08 <Sacro> im interested in your code now :p 21:48:10 <Digitalfox> ajmiles: But this videos are based in the code you ported from openttd?? I'm confused :| 21:48:11 <Sacro> is it in opengl? 21:48:24 <Sacro> Digitalfox: hope so, cos then he is bound to the gpl :D 21:48:27 <ajmiles> Digitalfox, it's not really a "port" 21:48:33 <ajmiles> it's all my own code 21:48:35 <peter1138> i'd imagine it's from scratch 21:48:46 <ajmiles> i don't know C++, but i do know how to program 21:48:50 <peter1138> and is not a bad achievement 21:48:58 <ajmiles> it's DirectX, not OpenGL 21:49:18 <Brianetta> <Sacro> ... hope so, cos then he is bound to the gpl 21:49:26 <ajmiles> which will make people cry, but again, it's my 3rd year project i'll probably never finish, porting to other platforms comes so far down the feature list it's not worth thinking about 21:49:32 <Brianetta> Sacro: Only as much as the GPL can legally be applied to OpenTTD 21:50:17 <Sacro> Brianetta: i have a sturdly built friend near warwick, im sure he can apply it quite nicely :) 21:50:25 <ajmiles> there's been a couple of things i've wanted to look up in the openttd source for reference but just can't read C++, so it was useless, every line is my own 21:50:43 <Sacro> ajmiles: i was mostly curious about your graphics code 21:50:55 <ajmiles> anything about it in particular? 21:51:28 <ajmiles> the vehicle view windows are probably my favourite part, but getting a terrain that scales up to 1024x1024 proved a little tricky 21:51:56 <Bjarni> ajmiles: it looks like you know how to code, so why do you waste your time with something that will never be finished instead of working on OpenTTD? 21:52:16 <peter1138> Bjarni: why don't you read what's been written? 21:52:21 <ajmiles> Bjarni, because i can't really use openttd for my 3rd year project, it needs to be my own thing 21:52:48 <peter1138> Bjarni: why don't you work on ttdpatch? 21:52:59 <ajmiles> and it would have required learning C++ in the middle of my final year, which wouldn't have been wise 21:53:49 <Bjarni> what are you studying? 21:53:52 <ajmiles> CS 21:53:59 <Bjarni> without knowing C++? 21:54:34 <Bjarni> <peter1138> Bjarni: why don't you work on ttdpatch? <-- because it fails to run natively on PowerPC 21:54:39 <caladan> Well, that's modern hmm, kind of way 21:54:47 <Sacro> Bjarni: not all CS courses teach C++ 21:54:47 <ajmiles> indeed, the university doesn't teach it's students a language but the theory of how to be a good programmer. sure we do do programming, but we've so far used Java, (a little C), and SML 21:55:00 <Sacro> i think we just do C# 21:55:09 <Sacro> ooh, and something else, could have been lisp 21:55:31 <imaginner> C++ is not the only language out there, you know 21:55:31 * Maedhros would like to learn lisp 21:55:50 <caladan> C++ is much faster than java :] 21:55:52 <Maedhros> i haven't found a good project to work on to teach it to myself yet though... 21:55:59 <ajmiles> i don't think any of my modules this term would require programming at all. computer graphics, neural networks, artificial intelligence and simulation... fairly theoertical CS 21:56:03 <caladan> and probably as java portable, if written in a good way 21:56:51 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB64A5.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 21:57:03 <imaginner> caladan: java is much faster to write in than C++ :) 21:57:22 <Bjarni> but java is slower to execute 21:57:37 <imaginner> depends 21:57:47 <caladan> java is like 5 times slower han c++ 21:57:54 <Bjarni> also java appears to give me more problems than C++ 21:57:55 <imaginner> caladan: nope 21:58:02 <caladan> nope? :> 21:58:09 <caladan> and it is eating so much memory 21:58:20 <caladan> JVM eats like 80MBs of RAM 21:58:46 <imaginner> caladan: it's surprising, but in some situations Java IS FASTER than C++ 21:59:04 *** nairan [~maui_key@p5498E9C8.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:59:06 <KUDr> imaginner: nope 21:59:16 <imaginner> due to it's JVM optimalisations and stuf 21:59:31 <caladan> oh come on, nothing can be faster than binary code 21:59:47 <KUDr> hehe, can optimize interpreted program better than compiled 21:59:48 <caladan> it's STILL run on virtual machine 21:59:57 <imaginner> ok, but what about some functions? 22:00:05 <caladan> which one? 22:00:08 <imaginner> Maths are about the same speed on java 22:00:15 <KUDr> functions, that are written in C 22:00:34 <imaginner> memory allocations in rare situations are faster 22:00:34 <caladan> it's partially true 22:00:37 <KUDr> as any jni functions 22:00:37 <caladan> lol 22:00:44 <imaginner> usually slightly slower 22:00:50 <caladan> dony even mention garbage-collector as a good feature 22:01:08 <imaginner> caladan: don't make me started :) 22:01:23 <Bjarni> the garbage collector is the saviour of the poor planning 22:01:27 * imaginner wishes he never started this topic 22:01:33 *** FauxFaux [~faux@compsoc.sunion.warwick.ac.uk] has joined #openttd 22:01:49 <caladan> you see, if a PONG written in java works slower than on atari, that's wrong ;] 22:02:11 <imaginner> okay, some things to sort out: 22:02:17 <Rubidium> Java can be compiled into native code by the JVM. It can also do high level optimizations, so it is possible that some functions are faster under Java than under C. 22:02:40 <imaginner> Java as a core language is almost as C++ 22:02:45 <caladan> compilet while being loaded to execute? 22:02:46 <imaginner> that was 1. 22:03:11 <imaginner> 2. Java GUI (Swing) IS SLOW. 22:03:17 <Tron> Rubidium: very much depends on your definition of "high level" 22:03:19 <Tron> imaginner: no 22:03:33 <imaginner> ah shoot 22:03:41 *** Tuzlo [~bill@blk-215-68-38.eastlink.ca] has quit [] 22:03:42 <imaginner> I meant almost as fast 22:03:48 <imaginner> not almost as C++ 22:04:21 <imaginner> Java core is almost as fast as C++, but the gui is slow 22:04:24 <caladan> i want to see a spice program or some advanced CAD written in java :D 22:04:44 <imaginner> what do you mean by a spice program? 22:04:57 <Sacro> ajmiles: i dont start my CS degree till september 22:05:00 <caladan> Elictronic Simulation 22:05:08 <ajmiles> Sacro, where you studying? 22:05:22 <imaginner> can it be a 3D game? 22:05:42 <caladan> 3d game in java? 22:05:48 <imaginner> http://xpandrally.com 22:06:05 <Tron> imaginner: if you stick to integers and floats 22:06:12 <Sacro> ajmiles: Hull Uni 22:06:18 <Tron> the moment you use objects, you usually have lost 22:06:19 <Sacro> imaginner: i was a beta tester for that 22:06:31 <Tron> (hint: java has no non-native value types) 22:06:54 <Sacro> well... gave up, they only had 1 mirror for the game files, it was a 200MB game, and they wouldnt allow bittorrent or anyone else to re-host 22:07:09 <Maedhros> night 22:07:27 <imaginner> Sacro: nice! 22:07:30 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@dD5772982.access.telenet.be] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:07:33 <Belugas> night Maedhros 22:07:37 *** Belugas is now known as Belugas_Gone 22:07:41 <ajmiles> Sacro, yeah, there's a lecturer at Hull called Rob Miles, he's into XNA / Game Programming in quite a big way 22:07:45 <Belugas_Gone> and good night to everyone else ! 22:07:52 *** Maedhros [~jc@host86-144-6-60.range86-144.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:07:52 *** bubersson [~bubersson@mnisek.casablanca.cz] has left #openttd [] 22:07:55 <imaginner> Sacro: I was near to joining the dev team for the sequel 22:07:55 <Sacro> ajmiles: rob miles is ace, known him for years 22:07:59 <caladan> you know why game is worse example than spice? 22:08:07 <Sacro> imaginner: coool 22:08:07 <imaginner> caladan: why? 22:08:09 <Rubidium> Tron: the high level optimizations in the league of: collecting statistics and optimizing based on the statistics. 22:08:10 <caladan> cause it uses probably directx 22:08:20 <imaginner> caladan: it does 22:08:24 <caladan> WELL 22:08:30 <caladan> so where's that damn portability!? 22:08:42 <Tron> Rubidium: that's rather very low level and only uses extremly local information 22:08:43 <imaginner> okay, different example 22:08:56 <caladan> you know, FrozenBubble is written in perl :D 22:09:11 <Tron> that's the usual approach of the Hotspot compiler 22:09:16 <imaginner> check out Eclipse 22:09:20 <imaginner> eclipse.org 22:09:20 <Tron> compile something which runs 22:09:29 <Sacro> eclipse ftw 22:09:31 <imaginner> ok, gotta go sleep 22:09:39 <Tron> add instrumentation code to collect some stats 22:09:45 <imaginner> see you tomorrow 22:09:48 <caladan> bye :-) 22:09:59 <Tron> if a piece of code gets executed very often 22:10:01 *** imaginner is now known as imaginner|away 22:10:52 <Tron> use the then available local (like currently used objects and their type) information there and produce a better code for this "hot spot" 22:11:34 <Tron> sometimes this can lead to faster code than what a static compiler can produce due to local information 22:12:13 <caladan> hmm, and what about the time it gets recompiled? 22:12:24 <Tron> but usually you only see this in synthetic examples 22:12:40 <caladan> it's called JIT, just-in-time, isnt it? 22:12:41 <Tron> like calling a virtual method in a loop 100 million times 22:13:13 <BFM> Reading about Vista... I think that, my last windows adventure for a while will be XP. I'm not gonna go down the vista path me thinks. 22:13:29 <Sacro> vista ftl 22:15:18 *** Sionide [sionide@217.147.86.20] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 22:15:43 *** Sionide [sionide@217.147.86.20] has joined #openttd 22:20:58 <BFM> Sacro, yah... With everything I've been reading, it doesn't really have one single advantage over XP for an end user such as myself. If anything, it's just another money pit. Start back at square 1. 22:21:34 <BFM> Direct X 10 doesn't justify it's purchase, not when majority of games will support DX9 for years to come. 22:22:03 *** TinoM| [~Tino@i5387C33B.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 22:22:05 *** guru3_ [~guru3@90-227-129-150-no21.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #openttd 22:22:13 *** blathijs_ [~matthijs@katherina.student.utwente.nl] has joined #openttd 22:22:27 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1F1C6.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 22:22:34 <Sacro> yup 22:22:34 *** Tefad_ [~tefad@c-75-75-0-121.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 22:22:36 *** Netsplit helium.oftc.net <-> xenon.oftc.net quits: guru3, Tefad, blathijs 22:22:42 <Sacro> :\ 22:22:51 <Sacro> how did they know... 22:23:45 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has joined #openttd 22:27:56 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B764B6.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:28:03 <ajmiles> DX10 does have fairly good benefits for developers over DX9, but the end user won't really see that 22:28:04 *** Tron [~tron@p54A3FAF7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:28:50 *** TinoM [~Tino@i5387C81F.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:28:54 *** Tron [~tron@p54A3E1EB.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 22:29:08 <BFM> As per the end user though,like, what are the pro's and con's of XP and Vista? 22:29:10 <BFM> I can't think of any pro's for vista :S 22:29:27 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B76CB4.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 22:29:45 <ajmiles> not running as an administrator by default should be a big plus for vista's security 22:29:59 <ajmiles> sure you can run as a limited user on xp, but you can bet 99% of people don't 22:30:36 <Sacro> ajmiles: doesnt really work though 22:30:47 <ajmiles> what, running as a limited user on vista? 22:33:02 <BFM> ajmiles, lol, but you can still do that with XP, just gotta set it up over about 5 minutes :D 22:33:03 <Sacro> vista in gerneral 22:33:09 <Sacro> UAC annoyed me so i disabled it 22:33:36 <BFM> And it's not like Linux, all user acounts still read of the one vulnerable reg 22:33:50 <ajmiles> BFM, oh indeed, but you have to be aware than 99% of users don't know how to do that and don't know what it achieves, so you have millions more infected machines attacking those that are better secured 22:34:03 <ajmiles> the same logic behind giving pirated versions of Windows security updates 22:34:25 <ajmiles> it's better to have everyone secure, whether they are legitimate or not, because it's better for those that are secured/legit 22:34:39 <BFM> yup 22:34:52 <ajmiles> UAC isn't as annoying as it once was for me 22:36:04 <ajmiles> the big problem in the betas with UAC was that it took ages for the screen to go black, display the dialog, and let you carry on again, in RTM with uptodate graphics drivers it's over in less than a second 22:49:43 *** green-devil [~rendmig@0x5358b8c4.arcnxe1.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk] has quit [] 23:00:42 *** Neonox [~Neonox@p57B29D85.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: bin wech....] 23:05:56 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-160-224.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 23:12:43 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1F1C6.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:14:30 *** pecisk [~pecisk@purvc-44-54.maksinets.lv] has quit [Quit: J?iet prom] 23:18:43 <Wolf01> 'night all 23:18:46 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@82.60.174.136] has quit [] 23:24:17 *** nairan [~maui_key@p5498FD2A.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 23:24:48 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat2.arachne.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:54:56 *** tosse [tosse@tosse.pp.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]