Config
Log for #openttd on 7th February 2007:
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00:45:41  <Digitalfox> Did the openttd dev meeting happen on monday??
00:45:58  <Digitalfox> Was it public or private?
00:51:33  <Sacro> its usually posted on the forum
00:51:35  <Sacro> or the wikie
00:58:27  <Belugas> it was monday and it did not really occured
00:58:51  <Belugas> and there was nothing to post on the forum nor wiki
00:59:10  <Belugas> you did not read that...
00:59:17  <Belugas> you never opened you compuer today
00:59:30  <Belugas> you were not home today!
00:59:35  <Sacro> :o
00:59:39  <Sacro> el Belugas!
00:59:46  <Belugas> hehe
00:59:52  <Belugas> hi Sacro :)
01:00:42  <Sacro> how are you?
01:03:27  <Belugas> still working :(  I've got a stupid bug @work
01:03:54  <Belugas> there is so many things to do in so little time, i've kinda lost it... again
01:03:57  <Belugas> and you?
01:05:27  <Sacro> just falling asleep
01:05:32  <Sacro> busy day at work
01:05:37  <Sacro> and back at college in the morning
01:05:43  <Sacro> then the student accomodation fair...
01:07:36  <Belugas> looks like you do not have time to waist :)
01:08:14  <Belugas> waste...
01:10:19  <Belugas> as for the meeting, there was 2-3 seniors who could not attempt.  Only left some juniors, so we discussed code...
01:10:21  <Belugas> as usual :)
01:12:20  <Digitalfox> Belugas: Thanks for the info :)
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01:14:37  <Belugas> pleasure...
01:18:38  <Sacro> hmmm
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05:37:00  <bob> can someone help me in installing debian?
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08:17:29  * Desolator says hello
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08:30:36  <waxman> Moin
08:30:56  <waxman> arr.. Hello
08:36:57  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: tron * r8617 /trunk/src/aircraft_cmd.cpp:
08:36:57  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Fix
08:36:57  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: Fix harmless typo: s/,/;/
08:40:09  <Nigel> *yawn*
08:40:35  <Nigel> OpenTTD releases at r10000? :P
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08:58:28  <MiHaMiX> Nigel: no, not that early :P
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09:03:01  <Eddi|zuHause3> who needs a release anyway?
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10:14:09  * Smoovious tips his black hat™ to Bjarni
10:23:15  * Bjarni wonders about the black hat
10:23:36  <Bjarni> villains always wear black hats. The heroes always wear white
10:28:26  <Smoovious> I just wear black mostly
10:29:13  <Smoovious> that, and I don't like stereotypes :D
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10:30:57  <Bjarni> that would make you a servant of evil
10:31:02  <Bjarni> :P
10:31:18  <nowhere> hi, i registered for the wiki, found a page that needed updating. Is toyland left out for a reason? http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/Industries
10:31:49  <Smoovious> no it wouldn't
10:32:35  <Bjarni> nowhere: yeah, nobody bothered to make a complete list for the wiki :P
10:32:37  <Smoovious> nowhere... for a reason? yeah... it is generally disliked and nobody yet has felt motivated to bother
10:32:57  * Smoovious grins.
10:33:10  <nowhere> Also, I doubt openttd contains any Tertiary Industries? I'm not a specialist at that point? Any idea's?
10:33:45  <Smoovious> was gonna try the Mars GRF replacement, but one of my players told me it still has the Toyland cargoes and sounds...
10:34:35  <Smoovious> I suppose a Factory could be considered tertiary along the ore/steel path...
10:35:03  <Smoovious> primary iron ore... secondary steel mill... tertiary factory...
10:35:38  <Smoovious> (unless I'm getting 'tertiary' wrong)
10:36:36  <Smoovious> anyways, ECS isn't in OTTD (yet?), so still gonna have the default cargoes for a while
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10:37:31  <nowhere> well maybe it can and should be put that way for the openttd wiki, or we need to find some other name. But primary stands for mining, secondary creates finished products, and tertiary offers services to both businesses and final consumers.
10:37:58  <nowhere> Again, i'm not a specialist, just reading it from wikipedia ;)
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10:38:38  <nowhere> I think in openttd the player is the tertiary industry.
10:39:55  <Smoovious> yeah, well... wikipedia isn't the perfect reference... it is good for what it is, but hard to consider the source of the info
10:40:04  <nowhere> But maybe they can be renamed to first chain, second chain, third chain?
10:40:15  <nowhere> Smoovious: sources are always listed.
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10:40:45  <Smoovious> usually... but the majority of the time, the sources mean nothing to me... just a name or reference I know nothing about...
10:40:56  <Smoovious> so, I try to look at several sources
10:41:06  <nowhere> That never hurts.
10:41:20  <Smoovious> plus I get different perspectives that way
10:41:22  <Smoovious> :D
10:42:04  <Smoovious> dunno if you wanna name them first/second/third chain... the ECS project does it well, naming their cargo paths according to the type of cargo...
10:42:08  <nowhere> It's also very useful to read the discussion on wikipedia articles: "Hi everyone. This is indeed a great article, isn't it? Hahaha~~XD"
10:42:32  <nowhere> I never heard of the ECS project. What is it?
10:43:41  <Smoovious> um... well, I read up on it briefly when I was looking for GRF's... it is basically a group of additional industries and cargoes... not supported by OTTD yet
10:44:10  <nowhere> Ah ok, well this is just a little table. Maybe I should just dump the toyland in :)
10:44:21  <Smoovious> knock yerself out
10:44:34  <Smoovious> (better you than me :P )
10:46:14  <Smoovious> perhaps I should have said 'incompatable with OTTD yet' instad of 'not supported'
10:49:28  <nowhere> there it goes -> http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/Industries
10:58:59  <Tron_> MiHaMiX?
11:08:51  * Maedhros considers making north-south and east-west tracks draggable
11:09:32  <nowhere> They already are?
11:09:53  <Maedhros> only with autorail
11:10:12  <Maedhros> either that or i'm mixing up my compass directions in the ttd world
11:10:58  <nowhere> No you are correct, it's just that I always use the autorail for it :)
11:11:17  <nowhere> With the original game it wasn't possible right? I saw some people placing them track by track.
11:11:27  <Maedhros> yeah, it was painful :)
11:12:21  <nowhere> Long time ago.
11:17:14  <Maedhros> heh, i have a feeling this is going to be painful
11:17:27  <Maedhros> what gets built depends on how the tiles were hilighted
11:18:17  <Maedhros> so if i change NS to hilight a rectangle, the land gets destroyed
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13:20:20  <Brianetta> autorail is a pig to use with an IBM nipple-mouse
13:20:32  <Brianetta> although scrolling is much easier
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13:46:32  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: tron * r8618 /trunk/src/aircraft_cmd.cpp:
13:46:32  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Fix
13:46:32  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: Remove redundant assignments. The function call just before already does it
13:54:53  <boekabart> ... and that way, slowly but surely, OpenTTD becomes perfect!
13:54:55  <boekabart> ;)
13:56:03  <nowhere> but it will never be, well... maybe for the devs ;)
14:05:28  <Bjarni> what would make it perfect?
14:05:51  <Bjarni> a final result with nothing else to work on would not indicate a great game, but lack of imagination
14:08:08  <Roel> there are enough things you can implement.. Complete 3d, in(train/bus/plane) cams
14:09:02  <Eddi|zuHause3> i'm sure there are still a lot of thigs before we have to revert to such drastic measures
14:17:07  <Sacro> BOOBS IN GAME :D
14:18:03  <ln-> there are boobs already.. just so small you can't see them.
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14:42:47  <boekabart> ok, i was referring to code cleanness actually.
14:44:01  <Belugas> hey... boekabart is back!
14:44:03  <Belugas> hello sir
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14:44:32  <boekabart> yes i am
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14:44:57  <boekabart> i was busy getting married and moving back to holland
14:45:08  <boekabart> now i'll have more time to work on openttd again
14:45:30  <boekabart> ... currently updating my patches to work on 050RC4
14:45:37  <Sacro> nooo
14:45:40  <Sacro> update to trunk
14:45:50  <boekabart> actually both!
14:46:25  <boekabart> i plan to release my patches for 0.5.0 stable (and hope to not make it unstable again :) )
14:48:36  <Belugas> you should take a look at the 32bpp branch, ifyou are still on that subjet :)
14:48:45  <Belugas> egladil did quite good on it
14:53:04  <boekabart> i know, i did and talked to him about it
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15:44:31  <Digitalfox> Hey guys i'm installing Microsoft Visual c++ 2005 Express and now that i'm at the menu of what to install i want to know if graphical IDE is the only thing to install or does MSDN 2005 and SQL is also required?
15:46:00  <Digitalfox> This is for compiling openttd
15:47:00  <Digitalfox> I'm followinf the wiki about compilitations for windows :)
15:47:04  <Digitalfox> following
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17:52:27  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r8619 /trunk/src/ (station_cmd.cpp station_map.h):
17:52:27  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Fix: store the ownership of a water tile in the buoy tile and set the ownership
17:52:27  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: of the water tile when the buoy is removed. This solves the issue of removing
17:52:27  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: ownership from canal tiles thus making is possible for other players to remove
17:52:27  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: the canal tile.
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17:55:14  <Wolf01> hello
17:58:36  <Wolf01> "Usually for patches to be included they need to be adopted by an "official" developer and re-coded."
17:58:37  <Wolf01> where is the nearest orphanage? i want to abandon some of my patches :P
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18:01:30  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r8620 /trunk/src/water_cmd.cpp: -Fix: buoys on canal tiles do not flood anymore (Maedhros).
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18:06:52  <Bjarni> <Wolf01>	where is the nearest orphanage? i want to abandon some of my patches :P <-- you need to pay a fee to be allowed to do that
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18:24:30  <Bjarni> guys I need a really old savegame
18:24:57  <Bjarni> to ensure that my patch didn't break compatibility
18:25:30  <Bjarni> so nothing fancy is needed, just a game with some vehicles (the vehicle count is not even important)
18:25:52  <KeeperOfTheSoul> could you check out an old version and use that to create one?
18:26:22  <Belugas> too long of a process :S
18:26:33  <Bjarni> that was my first idea, but that involves a certain problem
18:26:43  <Bjarni> old versions lack x86 OSX support :P
18:26:54  <KeeperOfTheSoul> i could make you one if you like
18:27:04  <Bjarni> that would be nice
18:27:18  <KeeperOfTheSoul> what revision/branch/tag would you like?
18:27:34  <Bjarni> 0.2.0 or something
18:27:54  <KeeperOfTheSoul> hmm, i'm not seeing them, was that before the svn crash?
18:28:13  <KeeperOfTheSoul> can go as far back as 0.3.4
18:29:14  <Bjarni> 0.3.4 is fine
18:30:17  *** Wolf01|AWAY is now known as Wolf01
18:31:16  <Bjarni> bbl dinner (hopefully you will still be here when I get back. Shouldn't take long)
18:31:29  <KeeperOfTheSoul> heh, that's what you think, seems i need sdl :)
18:32:11  <Wolf01> err.. i just deleted the OTTD 0.3.1 in the other computer
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18:44:09  <Bjarni> back
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18:45:33  <KeeperOfTheSoul> ah, just got it compiling after I worked out the different setup
18:45:54  <Bjarni> yeah, it's old :)
18:46:06  <Bjarni> we changed a lot and added a lot of improvements
18:46:41  <KeeperOfTheSoul> so i noticed, such as looking for libpng in the working folder
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18:49:22  <KeeperOfTheSoul> ok, what does it mean (apart from the obvious) when it says loader for 'zlib' is not available?
18:49:30  <KeeperOfTheSoul> and will the affect the save?
18:50:33  <Bjarni> it will since they will not be compressed as much as usual, but it doesn't matter in this case
18:51:22  <Bjarni> the issue will be if the uncompressed data is read correctly
18:58:02  <KeeperOfTheSoul> right, i've got your save now, at least one of each type of transport (road, ship, rail, air)
18:58:10  <KeeperOfTheSoul> dcc?
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19:00:10  <Bjarni> sure
19:00:30  *** goba [~goba@r2bi156.net.upc.cz] has joined #openttd
19:01:05  <goba> hello.. i have problem converting railtype... is there a problem or some tricky hack is required?
19:01:18  <goba> i have tried from source rc4 + latest night
19:01:38  <KeeperOfTheSoul> ah, dinner, hope that file works for you
19:01:49  <goba> i always get 'can't covert railtype...'
19:02:11  <Tron> you have selected the railtype you want to convert TO?
19:03:39  <goba> how?
19:03:45  <goba> never seen such choice
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19:04:04  <Sionide> oops
19:04:24  <Wolf01> if you want to convert rail to monorail, you have to open the monorail toolbar, select the convert tool and then drag
19:04:34  <goba> ahh will try :D
19:04:41  <goba> its not really obvious
19:04:50  <Tron> how could it be more obvious?
19:04:56  <Nigel> goba: the tracks have to be cleared btw
19:05:06  <Nigel> so depot all the trains on the track your upgrading
19:05:10  <goba> yes, thanks man!
19:05:31  <goba> yes, i killed all my trains, unable to upgrade them - which ended my last game
19:06:07  <Nigel> i should install openttd on the machines that i study on in town :P
19:06:23  <goba> my only big wish is to have openttd not depending on nonfree blobs :)
19:06:40  <goba> so i could sell it :)
19:07:08  <goba> hehe :) good jobs, just manuals are a bit unpolished :)
19:07:23  <Nigel> Thats why it's still in Beta
19:08:09  <goba> rail crossroads are really hard
19:08:38  <slafs> is there a simple way to get all newgrf files needed to play on Brianetta's Standard? To me it seems like a lot of work to get the right version of every file...
19:09:16  <Rubidium> slafs: open the URL in the server name in your webbrowser
19:09:19  <goba> i would like to have pack of newgrf files also... good ones
19:09:45  <slafs> Rubidium: i'm on http://ppcis.org/standard/
19:10:22  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: bjarni * r8621 /trunk/src/ (13 files):
19:10:22  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Codechange: assigned new numbers to the VEH_(type) enum so that VEH_Train is 0, VEH_Road is 1 and so on
19:10:22  <CIA-1> OpenTTD:  This means that "v->type" can be used as array indexes instead of VehTypeToIndex() (or "v->type - VEH_Train/0x10 as the code still used in some places)
19:10:22  <CIA-1> OpenTTD:  Surprisingly this can be done without changing the savegame format
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19:11:06  <Rubidium> slafs: read it carefully
19:12:43  <slafs> Rubidium: it explains what files I need, but it only tells me where to find some of the files, not all.
19:13:06  <Rubidium> carry on reading
19:13:25  <Rubidium> big table, bottom row, what does it say?
19:14:42  <goba> :)
19:14:49  <slafs> doh.. I read tables from top to bottom. Thanks!
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19:21:52  <Tron> hi, peter1138
19:24:57  * Brianetta sniggers at slafs
19:25:00  <Brianetta> heh heh (:
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19:31:13  <peter1138> hi
19:33:03  <|Jeroen|> ho
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20:04:24  <SpComb> Logs: http://zapotek.paivola.fi/~terom/logs/openttd
20:04:24  <Bjarni> !logs
20:06:58  *** Mucht_ [~Mucht@p57A0D3CA.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
20:07:27  <ln-> Logs: http://www.microscopy-uk.org.uk/mag/imgjul04/iw/logs.jpg
20:09:34  *** boekabart [~boekabart@81.58.27.138] has left #openttd [Back to work, back to work, everybody, work work work work!]
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20:11:53  <Bjarni> ln-: like I haven't seen logs like that before :P
20:11:54  <boekabart> hey I have a bug to report; i've got this saved game from last year, and when I open it, and unpause, ottd (rc4 at least) crashes. Not good , right, for a RC?
20:12:16  <boekabart> let me get the failed assertion...
20:12:22  <Bjarni> post a bug report on flyspray
20:12:22  <KeeperOfTheSoul> Bjarni: that's what they look like raw :)
20:12:41  <Bjarni> and add the savegame to it
20:14:03  <KeeperOfTheSoul> so, how'd that save game work out?
20:14:54  <Bjarni> <KeeperOfTheSoul>	Bjarni: that's what they look like raw :) <-- err I actually go to the woods once in a while to get those
20:15:08  <Bjarni> it keeps me warm during the winter :)
20:15:30  <KeeperOfTheSoul> i see, burning the logs, hiding the evidence
20:17:17  <Bjarni> you feel so stupid that you need to remove the logs?
20:18:14  <KeeperOfTheSoul> what logs? there were no logs, they were gone when I got here >.>
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20:24:05  <boekabart> done. http://bugs.openttd.org/task/602 (nice bugtracker btw)
20:25:02  <Maedhros> do you remember which version of openttd you used to create the savegame?
20:25:21  <boekabart> well, 99% sure trunk of 9/9/2005
20:25:48  <boekabart> i'll add that info to the task btw
20:26:46  <Maedhros> thanks :)
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21:09:59  <peter1138> rpar
21:10:02  <peter1138> roar, too
21:10:10  <peter1138> p2 300 laptop, with winxp, heh
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21:12:42  <Belugas> snails do road??
21:12:43  <Belugas> ^^
21:12:59  <peter1138> hmm?
21:13:11  <peter1138> it is "not fast"
21:13:20  <peter1138> i think the p1 233 with win98 was preferable
21:13:30  <Belugas> thus "snails" ;)
21:13:31  <peter1138> although this one's speakers do work
21:13:36  <Belugas> oups...
21:13:40  <Belugas> snails do roar??
21:13:44  <Belugas> ahhh better :)
21:13:51  <peter1138> and it's 1024x768 rather than 800x600
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21:34:39  <Ailure> heh
21:34:47  <Ailure> a classmember wondered why openTTD ran slow on his computer
21:35:01  <Ailure> ...turns out he was using the max map size
21:36:25  <Ailure> he was playing on the laptop we got from our college
21:36:30  <Ailure> rather limited with only 512 mb of ram
21:36:45  <Ailure> and a processor that likes t ogo close on overheating
21:39:28  <Wolf01> my laptop is not so different, but ottd runs well
21:40:04  <hylje> heheh
21:40:17  <hylje> my lappy is 512 mem, and goes up to 92C when full load
21:40:18  <Wolf01> i can play all games up to warcraft 3 requirements without loss of performance
21:40:49  <peter1138> "only 512 mb"
21:41:11  <hylje> world of warcraft is a bit hickupy with this box
21:41:17  <hylje> should get some extra mem
21:42:12  <Wolf01> i'm searching for a new desktop computer: 2GB ram, dual core cpu, a video card with at least 512MB and some terabytes of hard disk spac
21:42:14  <peter1138> i can't figure out where memory is in this laptop
21:42:21  <peter1138> else i'd put another 64MB in
21:42:45  <peter1138> hmm, maybe it's under the keyboard
21:43:07  <Wolf01> i have the ram under the keyboard, mine is an ASUS
21:44:39  <peter1138> ah ha
21:44:43  <peter1138> the keyboard's out
21:44:51  <peter1138> but there's a metal sheet behind it, heh
21:46:04  <peter1138> gotcha :D
21:46:12  * peter1138 shuts down...
21:46:17  <peter1138> don't fancy hotswap ram...
21:46:29  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: miham * r8622 /trunk/src/lang/ (5 files):
21:46:29  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Update: WebTranslator2 update to 2007-02-07 22:44:21
21:46:29  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: finnish - 8 fixed by kerba (8)
21:46:29  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: russian - 4 fixed, 2 changed by DarkFenX (6)
21:46:29  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: slovak - 2 changed by lengyel (2)
21:46:30  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: spanish - 7 fixed by eusebio (7)
21:46:30  <CIA-1> OpenTTD: traditional_chinese - 38 fixed, 27 changed by thomasau (65)
21:48:04  <Wolf01> i should take some days from work to open the laptop and clean it from the dust... last time i found a crocodile sized dust agglomerate under the keyboard... i don't know what i can find near the fans
21:53:59  <peter1138> better
21:54:05  <peter1138> boots much faster with 128MB...
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21:56:01  * peter1138 ponders installing ottd...
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21:57:01  <Wolf01> which ram do you mount? i seen an hp laptop with pc133 :D
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22:02:31  <peter1138> "i seen" ?
22:02:40  <peter1138> surely... "i've seen" or "i saw"
22:03:11  <peter1138> anyway, this is a P2 300, so it's probably PC66
22:04:04  <peter1138> cleartype is weird
22:04:12  <peter1138> it makes stuff blurry, not clear...
22:06:21  <Wolf01> sorry, i meant desktop sized ram dimm (168 pins), not the small laptop one :P
22:06:29  <peter1138> ahh
22:06:43  <peter1138> yes
22:07:19  <peter1138> oh
22:07:31  * boekabart is falling asleep
22:07:36  *** boekabart [~boekabart@c97171.upc-c.chello.nl] has left #openttd [Back to work, back to work, everybody, work work work work!]
22:07:38  <peter1138> and this laptop has a virtual desktop too
22:07:46  <peter1138> but this one goes up to 1600x1200 o_O
22:08:51  <peter1138> woo
22:09:06  <peter1138> and now i shall use it just as a fullscreen putty session...
22:09:20  <peter1138> hmm, it span the fan up for about half a second
22:10:35  <Wolf01> eheh the scrolling virtual desktop is one of the weirdest things i've seen, i really hate it like the automatic hide of the windows tray
22:15:50  <peter1138> hmm
22:16:01  <peter1138> stupid thing
22:16:04  <Sionide> "a" virtual desktop?
22:16:08  <Sionide> i've got 4... by default
22:17:57  <Roel> i've had four years before vista stole it.. :D
22:18:16  <peter1138> scrolling desktop, i'm talking about
22:18:21  <peter1138> and yes, X has had that since forever
22:18:39  <peter1138> but win98 isn't exactly new either
22:19:39  * peter1138 sleeps
22:19:43  <Sionide> does does a scrolling desktop work exactly?
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22:20:10  <Gonozal_VIII> i wouldn't want something like that :S
22:38:26  <Wolf01> sionide, you have a desktop which does not fit in your monitor, and you can scroll it by moving the mouse near the edges
22:38:44  <Sionide> ah i see
22:38:50  <Sionide> mm, annoying
22:40:26  <Gonozal_VIII> and when you want to click something on the edge, everything moves arround and you have to chase it^^
22:41:38  *** Neonox [~Neonox@offb-590eb104.pool.einsundeins.de] has joined #openttd
22:41:53  <Wolf01> one time i tried with virtual desktop and border wrap enabled... the pointer near the bottom edge to scroll for the windows appbar, the desktop scrolled, the mouse wrapped to the top border and the desktop beginned to scroll in the other direction... all with a big speed
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22:48:23  <Wolf01> 'night all
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22:48:26  <Gonozal_VIII> somewhere, i think it was in a flash game or something i saw a good solution for that window bigger than screen thing.. hard to discribe, somehow like if it's double the size then half of the movement you make with the mouse moves the pointer on the screen and other half moves the whole window in the opposite direction
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23:40:10  <Rector> hey guys, how can I build electric trains?
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23:41:23  <Frostregen> electrify your depot
23:41:52  <Frostregen> or build an electrified depot directly
23:45:17  <Rector> thanks
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