Times are UTC Toggle Colours
00:01:42 *** glx|away [~glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 00:01:42 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx|away] by ChanServ 00:02:02 *** glx is now known as Guest1010 00:02:02 *** glx|away is now known as glx 00:04:32 *** HMage [Queneex@hmage.dialup.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:05:19 <Tefad> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H3uEuUVk4lE haven't seen this one before (polka) 00:07:22 *** HMage` [HMage@hmage.dialup.corbina.ru] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:08:53 *** Guest1010 [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:09:03 <Eddi|zuHause> valhalla1w: i suspect infinite recursion 00:10:07 <valhalla1w> Eddi|zuHause: yes.. a footnote got stuck into an image caption 00:10:42 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A5DE1.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 00:11:06 <skidd13> Anyone knows where I can get those canals? -> http://ttd.tycoonez.com/img/art/vyvoj/csrailset/csrailset2.png 00:11:13 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-171-87-247.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:31:48 *** thgerg1 [~Administr@dsl51B65DAF.pool.t-online.hu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:33:32 <Bjarni> http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8437344189722462732 <--- wow... hackers really attack everything 00:33:51 <Bjarni> even places you didn't even think about 00:33:57 <Bjarni> http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8121360771605659258 <-- here too 00:34:21 <Bjarni> all Dutch but just the image without sounds gives a good impression of what goes on 00:36:14 <skidd13> Wooo 00:36:24 <skidd13> Chaos days are coming 00:36:45 <Bjarni> I think they will add security now 00:37:24 <Bjarni> otherwise the signs will end up saying 250 when some geek wants to drive really fast 00:37:32 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-160-2.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 00:38:15 <Bjarni> I think the most surprising one is the TV station 00:38:44 <skidd13> yeah 00:38:56 <Bjarni> not only do they have an open network to the stuff they read they also read what it says nomatter how odd it is 00:40:12 <Bjarni> we have two major TV stations here. I'm pretty sure one of them would stop reading the signs and say "something went wrong in the computer" and revert to improvising because the readers actually knows what they are supposed to say (this actually happened) 00:40:34 <Bjarni> the other station did really poor when the text printing computer crashed 00:40:52 <Bjarni> but at least they realised that the computer had a problem 00:43:58 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@xdsl-84-44-200-134.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: leaving] 00:44:03 <SmatZ> I really wonder why they show their faces in the video 00:44:18 <Bjarni> me too 00:44:23 <skidd13> SmatZ: It's a hacker not a cracker 00:44:25 <Bjarni> but then again he is the king 00:44:33 <Bjarni> people should now the king 00:44:42 <Bjarni> and we know that he is the king... the signs says so 00:44:53 <SmatZ> if the king won't be busted when police finds him 00:44:59 <skidd13> Hackers want things to be fixed. Crackers want to missuse things for their own purpose 00:45:01 <Bjarni> and it's an official sign placed by the government 00:45:12 <SmatZ> skidd13: aren't they doing something illegal anyway? 00:45:28 <skidd13> SmatZ: Sure but the motivation behind is different 00:45:46 <SmatZ> I am afraid the law doesn't see the difference 00:46:02 <Bjarni> that depends on the judge 00:46:09 <Bjarni> besides he wrote 5 instead of 50 00:46:15 <Bjarni> if it went the other way... 00:46:26 <Bjarni> that makes a difference to the law 00:46:37 <skidd13> SmatZ: The companys may want to know what is wrong whith their system and are able to ask him. 00:47:32 <SmatZ> sometimes are things just absolutelly unsafe - using weak passwords, no ecryption at all, etc... 00:48:00 <SmatZ> like the Slovakian National security agency used some really weak passwords like "nbusr123" or so... 00:49:36 <SmatZ> http://www.viruslist.com/en/news?id=185376772 00:49:45 <SmatZ> The attackers claim that network administrators employed the username ânbusrâ and password ânbusr123â 00:51:51 <SmatZ> or with Skype - the data are encrypted, but there are roughly tens or hundreds of keys (I just heard that, may be false) 00:56:10 *** BigBB [~BigBB@p5B0427FE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 00:58:15 *** Leviath [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 00:58:15 *** LeviathNL [~thomas@82.95.233.47] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:02:29 *** Dark_Link^ [~glidegame@xDSL-45-77.citynetnassjo.se] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:02:45 *** Dark_Link^ [~glidegame@xDSL-45-77.citynetnassjo.se] has joined #openttd 01:16:34 *** Mucht [~Martin@chello080109200215.3.sc-graz.chello.at] has joined #openttd 01:30:14 <Wolf01> 'night 01:30:17 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host30-223-dynamic.5-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 01:31:13 *** Eddi|zuHause2 [~johekr@p54B75F08.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 01:33:06 <Bjarni> talk about weak passwords. Somebody told that British Telecom once had "btc" or something like that as the password on their wifi 01:33:39 <Bjarni> so you could sit in a cafe on the other side of the street or something and browse their LAN and use their net connection 01:34:36 *** Tlustoch [~last_evol@r5bn73.net.upc.cz] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:37:32 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B747A6.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:40:25 *** Zahl [~Zahl@p549F052B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Windows shutdown) ((~_~]"] 01:50:23 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 01:58:58 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A5DE1.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #openttd [Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. - Eleanor Roosevelt] 02:02:56 *** Leviath [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:20:35 *** Bjarni [~Bjarni@0x50a46c2b.virnxx14.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:22:46 *** Greyscale [~Greyscale@host86-131-27-37.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:24:08 *** KritiK [~Maxim@78-106-142-154.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:24:48 *** glx|away [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 02:24:51 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx|away] by ChanServ 02:25:34 *** glx is now known as Guest1022 02:25:34 *** glx|away is now known as glx 02:32:33 *** Guest1022 [~glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:44:40 *** Wezz6400 [~Wezz6400@145-118-108-75.fttx.bbned.nl] has joined #openttd 02:56:12 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has quit [Quit: May the ducttape be with you] 02:59:42 <kyevan> Hmmm 03:00:06 <kyevan> Someone should set i tup so that you can rig the in-game music player controls to a real player, through dcop or something 03:01:14 <BigBB> maybe you stop the ingame player and load the mid files in the real player for full control? no, thats to easy... 03:02:13 <kyevan> BigBB: Yes, that's especialy too easy when you decide to run it in full screen. 03:02:14 <kyevan> >_> 03:02:45 <kyevan> I'm actually playing high-quality renders in vlc, but I want to play fullscreen, and if I have to be able to jump over, really can't do that. 03:03:36 <BigBB> and? you can run OTTP fullscrean and control your player (like vlc) seperatly 03:03:53 <kyevan> RIght, except, HOW DO YOU GET TO THOSE CONTROLS? 03:03:59 * kyevan rolls his eyes 03:04:48 <kyevan> Well, one way is to run on linux and run vlc with one of the crazy terminal interfaces on a terminal, and have ottd take over x, but anyway. 03:04:58 <BigBB> for me?, I use the Logitech extra media buttons, on Windows with logitech drivers and on linux with the distributation related drivers... 03:07:51 <BigBB> if you haven't media keys (and the driver for that) you can define a hot key for that ... 03:08:55 <BigBB> you must only undifine (if necessary) this combination in (e.g.) KDE. 03:09:16 <BigBB> How I say: Easy or? 03:32:08 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB6660.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Osai] 03:39:41 *** fjb [~frank@p5485F265.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:48:48 *** a1270 [~Cheese@24-117-163-29.cpe.cableone.net] has joined #openttd 03:50:13 *** Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-84-227-11-237.adslplus.ch] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:58:33 *** Hendikins [~wolfox@CPE-124-189-3-149.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 04:00:44 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB6CA6.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 04:00:49 *** Tino|Home [~Tino@i59F57349.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 04:07:28 *** TinoM| [~Tino@i59F55B80.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:23:01 *** glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: bye] 04:30:27 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB6CA6.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Osai] 04:32:12 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: belugas * r11683 /trunk/src/win32.cpp: -Fix(r11682): win32.cpp still requires gfx.h inclusion, at least for now. 05:12:58 *** Wezz6400 [~Wezz6400@145-118-108-75.fttx.bbned.nl] has quit [Quit: Zzz] 05:17:39 *** Burgundavia [~corey@dpc674745112.direcpc.com] has joined #openttd 05:17:52 <Burgundavia> just downloaded 6.0beta 2.0 deb 05:18:00 <Burgundavia> it seems the game is running a little fast 05:18:14 <Burgundavia> jets move at the speed of supersonic jets 05:31:10 <BigBB> what cluster do you use ... 05:31:30 <Burgundavia> cluster? 05:32:29 <BigBB> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer_cluster 05:33:15 <Burgundavia> I am running a Celeron M, if you are aksing about processor 05:33:24 <Burgundavia> I am using an old 0.5.3 save game from a windows version 05:33:31 <Burgundavia> same machine 05:34:24 <BigBB> not directly, I'm asking because you said: it seems the game is running a little fast jets move at the speed of supersonic jets 05:34:43 *** nfc [nfc@dsl-hkibrasgw2-ff6ec300-105.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:35:54 <BigBB> the version of the savegame is irrelevant, importand is the game version which you want to play... 05:37:34 <Burgundavia> basically, it looks like the internal clock is set a little fast 05:38:14 <BigBB> don't press the fast forward button?! 05:38:48 <Burgundavia> no, this is without the fast forward button 05:39:33 <Burgundavia> hmm, I am getting a day per 2 secs 05:39:48 <BigBB> Okay, have you read the forumk sticky "What to do when you find a bug - READ" ? 05:40:05 <Burgundavia> yes, I know how to file bugs 05:40:36 <Burgundavia> I am merely asking if it is a known issue or maybe by design 05:40:48 <BigBB> for me, no 05:42:16 <Burgundavia> another topic: is there a way to turn off all servicing if you have turned off breakdowns? 05:43:33 <BigBB> that is a patch option which you can turn on ... I like human which cannot read the options... 05:43:42 *** BigBB [~BigBB@p5B0427FE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: BigBB] 06:09:15 *** |Bastiaan| [~kvirc@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:33:39 *** Draakon [~chatzilla@88-196-98-113-dsl.trt.estpak.ee] has joined #openttd 06:33:46 <Draakon> hello 06:50:13 *** Draakon [~chatzilla@88-196-98-113-dsl.trt.estpak.ee] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:50:45 *** Draakon [~chatzilla@88-196-98-113-dsl.trt.estpak.ee] has joined #openttd 06:55:14 *** Draakon_ [~chatzilla@88-196-98-113-dsl.trt.estpak.ee] has joined #openttd 07:02:08 *** Draakon [~chatzilla@88-196-98-113-dsl.trt.estpak.ee] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:06:28 *** Draakon_ is now known as Draakon 07:14:36 *** Draakon [~chatzilla@88-196-98-113-dsl.trt.estpak.ee] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.79 [Firefox 2.0.0.11/2007112718]] 07:51:05 *** Frostregen_ [SADDAM@dslb-084-058-155-033.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 07:51:09 *** Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-84-226-40-158.adslplus.ch] has joined #openttd 07:56:46 *** Frostregen [SADDAM@dslb-084-058-145-007.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:57:15 *** Frostregen_ is now known as Frostregen 08:12:33 *** Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-84-226-40-158.adslplus.ch] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 08:16:27 *** Craterboy [Christmas@dc5147efc8.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:17:06 *** Craterboy [Christmas@dc5147efc8.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 08:24:57 *** Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-84-226-40-158.adslplus.ch] has joined #openttd 08:26:41 <Rubidium> Burgundavia: only the aircraft are running faster, right? 08:27:21 <Burgundavia> Rubidium: no, trains are as well 08:27:28 <Burgundavia> have aircraft speeds been increased? 08:28:31 *** Farden [~jk3farden@AMontsouris-156-1-26-104.w90-2.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 08:28:48 <Rubidium> yes; they are actually going as fast as trains now instead of 4 times slower 08:30:28 <Burgundavia> ah 08:32:05 *** Burgundavia [~corey@dpc674745112.direcpc.com] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 08:47:45 *** Wezz6400 [~Wezz6400@145-118-108-75.fttx.bbned.nl] has joined #openttd 08:49:57 *** Dark_Link^ [~glidegame@xDSL-45-77.citynetnassjo.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:03:54 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-171-87-247.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has joined #openttd 09:12:56 *** Dark_Link^ [~glidegame@xDSL-45-77.citynetnassjo.se] has joined #openttd 09:20:14 *** LordAzamath [~LordAzama@ip101.cab22.ltln.starman.ee] has joined #openttd 09:21:21 *** LordAzamath [~LordAzama@ip101.cab22.ltln.starman.ee] has left #openttd [] 10:10:59 *** Tino|Home is now known as TinoM 10:15:31 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host30-223-dynamic.5-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 10:15:41 <Wolf01> hello 10:17:54 *** nfc [~nfc@dsl-hkibrasgw2-ff6ec300-105.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd 10:19:07 *** Maedhros [~jc@i-195-137-43-74.freedom2surf.net] has joined #openttd 10:19:35 <Maedhros> morning 10:21:05 <Wolf01> hi 10:25:46 *** peterbrett [~peter@cpc2-oxfd6-0-0-cust544.oxfd.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd 10:31:54 *** Maedhros_ [~jc@i-195-137-43-74.freedom2surf.net] has joined #openttd 10:33:03 *** Mark [~Mark@5351EA48.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd 10:33:27 *** thgergo [~Administr@dsl51B60EF7.pool.t-online.hu] has joined #openttd 10:34:24 *** Maedhros is now known as Guest1051 10:34:24 *** Maedhros_ is now known as Maedhros 10:38:53 *** Guest1051 [~jc@i-195-137-43-74.freedom2surf.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:42:47 *** roboman [~Leo@c211-30-60-34.carlnfd4.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:51:39 *** Farden123 [~jk3farden@213.186.38.50] has joined #openttd 10:53:11 *** |Bastiaan| [~Bastiaan@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has joined #openttd 10:53:49 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has joined #openttd 10:54:02 <SmatZ> hello 10:56:27 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11684 /trunk/src/ (66 files in 9 dirs): -Codechange: split gfx.h in a type and functional header. 10:56:49 *** roboboy [~Leo@c211-30-60-34.carlnfd4.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 10:58:48 *** Farden [~jk3farden@AMontsouris-156-1-26-104.w90-2.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:58:48 *** Farden123 is now known as Farden 11:05:15 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1D69D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 11:06:20 *** Zahl [~Zahl@p549F4254.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 11:08:56 *** Eddi|zuHause3 [~johekr@p54B75F08.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 11:15:08 *** Eddi|zuHause2 [~johekr@p54B75F08.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:18:25 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has joined #openttd 11:20:55 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11685 /trunk/src/ (bmp.cpp gui.h textbuf_gui.h town_cmd.cpp): -Codechange: remove a few 'useless' includes. 11:36:46 <SmatZ> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=35201&p=650058&e=650058 does this work for you? 11:36:59 <SmatZ> it says "You are not authorised to read this forum." for me :( 11:37:33 <Maedhros> it's probably the sekrit mod forum 11:38:10 <SmatZ> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=35201 this works ... maybe the post was deleted 11:38:14 <Maedhros> and no, it doesn't work for me either ;) 11:38:19 <SmatZ> :-) 11:38:51 <SmatZ> it is a "Post a picture of a bus you like!" , I received the link as a reply notification 11:39:44 <Maedhros> ah, i think someone was basically trolling in that thread, but eventually got himself banned and his posts moved to the mod forum 11:41:03 *** Wezz6400 [~Wezz6400@145-118-108-75.fttx.bbned.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:43:38 *** mucht_work [~Martin@143.50.125.24] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 11:44:53 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-171-87-247.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:47:01 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-160-2.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Quit: ThePizzaKing] 11:56:55 *** Farden [~jk3farden@213.186.38.50] has quit [Quit: ( www.nnscript.de :: NoNameScript 4.02 :: www.XLhost.de )] 12:08:14 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-171-87-247.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has joined #openttd 12:12:23 <ln-> http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=215721&nseq=18 12:13:02 <hylje> CP rail 12:16:02 <Craterboy> Coca cola santa bus? 12:16:06 <Craterboy> *train 12:21:43 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@xdsl-84-44-196-204.netcologne.de] has joined #openttd 12:22:24 <Eddi|zuHause3> oh newgrf spec is great... 12:22:27 <Eddi|zuHause3> "<operator> is a C operator related to the function of the sequence's byte value, or something vaguely related to a C operator. Or something else." 12:22:49 <Maedhros> haha 12:22:52 <Maedhros> where does it say that? 12:23:06 <Eddi|zuHause3> http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=GRFActionsDetailed 12:23:23 <Eddi|zuHause3> a few lines above "strings" 12:24:06 *** divo [~asd@0x4dd443c6.adsl.cybercity.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:24:18 <Maedhros> aha, i thought it sounded like a DaleStan comment ;) 12:27:07 *** divo [~asd@0x4dd443c6.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #openttd 12:29:33 *** Mucht [~Martin@chello080109200215.3.sc-graz.chello.at] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 12:42:43 *** Stoffe [~mirc@89.233.243.248] has joined #openttd 12:45:31 *** pavel1269 [~pavel.g@48.140.broadband2.iol.cz] has joined #openttd 12:45:34 <pavel1269> hi 12:47:18 *** pavel1269 [~pavel.g@48.140.broadband2.iol.cz] has quit [] 12:50:40 *** KritiK [~Maxim@78-106-159-65.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 12:51:05 *** Greyscale [~Greyscale@host86-131-27-37.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 12:57:18 *** tokai [~tokai@p54B80085.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:58:44 *** tokai [~tokai@p54B83093.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 12:58:45 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 13:01:19 *** pavel1269 [~pavel.g@48.140.broadband2.iol.cz] has joined #openttd 13:01:56 <Eddi|zuHause3> we really need a higher programming language for grfs... 13:02:11 <Eddi|zuHause3> this assembler stuff makes you insane... 13:04:23 <Wolf01> maybe we can code an ide which compiles the grfs in assembly but we can use symple interfaces to input the values we need 13:04:40 <Maedhros> heh, like grfmaker? ;) 13:05:14 <Wolf01> i was thinking about something like gamemaker 13:06:21 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat1.spoje.net] has joined #openttd 13:06:35 <Wolf01> with a symple graphic editor where you can import the sprites like strips or tilesets 13:06:50 <Wolf01> cropping, offsets 13:07:22 <Wolf01> and i should try grfmaker, maybe it does this already 13:09:06 <Maedhros> i haven't actually used it before, but i think it does most of that 13:09:34 <Wolf01> yeah, seem so 13:12:54 <Eddi|zuHause3> i was not talking about GUI 13:13:02 <Eddi|zuHause3> i was talking about higher language 13:13:47 <Eddi|zuHause3> you know, with objects, variables, control flow etc. 13:14:06 <Eddi|zuHause3> and especially readable names 13:19:15 <Eddi|zuHause3> "Example: Something to go here" <- yeah, i love these statements 13:21:27 *** glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 13:21:30 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 13:31:47 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: glx * r11686 /trunk/src/win32.cpp: -Fix (r11684): win32 compilation was broken again :) 13:44:11 <Wolf01> Eddi|zuHause3, xml like locomotion would help? -> tar archives with xml file and sprites, we already support that (but xml), if we can add a sort of coding to the tar files we might have 32bpp grfs 13:44:36 <Eddi|zuHause3> xml is not a programming language 13:45:02 <Eddi|zuHause3> i am talking about a programming language that compiles into NFO 13:45:13 <Eddi|zuHause3> not some new grf format 13:45:39 <Wolf01> i know you want a scripting like language for grf, but the problem is to rewrite completely the grf support for bot the games 13:46:35 <Eddi|zuHause3> that is a complete non-issue, because it will be compiled into NFO, which will again be compiled into GRF, so for the game it is completely transparent 13:46:43 <Wolf01> we will end up with grf->dll files 13:47:59 <Wolf01> so where is the problem? an ide like gamemaker: sprite editor, objects, scripts and it compiles directly to assembly 13:48:09 <Wolf01> my first suggestion 13:48:18 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A6AA8.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 13:48:23 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat1.spoje.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:48:30 <Eddi|zuHause3> language != ide, i am telling you 13:48:50 *** fjb [~frank@p5485F42B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 13:48:54 <fjb> Moin 13:49:16 <Eddi|zuHause3> binary (grf) << assembler (nfo) << higher language (to be definded) << ide (what you call 'gamemaker') 13:49:37 *** shodan [user@xerxes.foocode.net] has quit [Quit: Client Exiting] 13:49:57 <Wolf01> code it in c++ and encode it in nfo 13:50:37 <Eddi|zuHause3> yeah, you write a full c++ -> nfo compiler, good luck... 13:50:52 <Wolf01> basic -> nfo 13:50:57 <Wolf01> delphi -> nfo 13:51:03 <Wolf01> jscript -> nfo 13:51:13 <Eddi|zuHause3> it should be a language specifically designed with nfo as backend in mind 13:51:16 <Wolf01> you will end up with nfo always 13:51:41 <Eddi|zuHause3> because you have to minimise the effort to write a compiler 13:52:20 <Sacro> whynot use lua? 13:52:35 <Wolf01> why not brainfuck? 13:52:43 <hylje> lua ~= brainfuck implied 13:52:53 <Eddi|zuHause3> because of the same reason why you don't use any other "established" language 13:52:58 *** fjb [~frank@p5485F42B.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:54:20 <Wolf01> i don't know the grf specs, but if they support scripting (written in assembly) surely there is a way to compile it... we need only the compiler 13:55:00 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat1.spoje.net] has joined #openttd 13:55:55 <Wolf01> so the only effort is to write the compiler... the language is always the same... variables, functions, constructs 13:58:33 <Eddi|zuHause3> no, established languages have a way too big number of features, that you can't always turn into NFO (complexity), and NFO has some special design features that you cannot easily describe in established languages (efficiency) 13:59:38 <Wolf01> what about this: http://www.falconpl.org/ the guy who invented it frequents my ircchan, i can always ask him if is doable with less efforts 14:00:45 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A6AA8.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #openttd [Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. - Eleanor Roosevelt] 14:00:58 <Eddi|zuHause3> you're coming from the wrong direction here 14:01:19 <glx> you need to understand what nfo can and cannot do first 14:01:36 <Eddi|zuHause3> the issue is not choosing a language and then writing the compiler, but instead learning nfo, design a compiler, and then design the language on top of it 14:02:01 <Eddi|zuHause3> the syntax of the language is the last thing to decide 14:04:31 <valhalla1w> how can you build a compiler without syntax? 14:04:37 *** valhalla1w is now known as valhallasw 14:06:16 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: skidd13 * r11687 /trunk/src/ (core/geometry_type.hpp core/random_func.hpp stdafx.h): -Codechange: move some defines to a better place 14:07:45 <Eddi|zuHause3> valhallasw: the syntax is only relevant for the parser step of the compiler 14:08:07 <Eddi|zuHause3> after that, you have a generic tree structure, which you do your analysis on 14:08:19 <Eddi|zuHause3> the parser step is completely exchangable 14:08:58 <valhallasw> yes, but the parse tree and syntax are not completely unlinked 14:09:29 <Eddi|zuHause3> yes, that's why you design the syntax after what your parse tree ends up like 14:09:39 <valhallasw> ok, sounds reasonable 14:11:19 <Eddi|zuHause3> syntax is mainly about stuff like wether you decide blocks upon indentation (python style), brackets (c style) or begin/end (pascal style) 14:12:22 <valhallasw> and what the names for your constructs are 14:12:33 <Eddi|zuHause3> or wether the assignment operator looks like "=" (c style) or ":=" (pascal style) 14:12:58 <blathijs> It might be feasible to use a C-style syntax for compiling to nfo, that just doesn't support all C features 14:13:03 <Eddi|zuHause3> the fact that you need an assignment operator will result from the fact that you have an assignment node in the parse tree 14:13:21 <valhallasw> yeah 14:13:29 <valhallasw> you could as well make it <- if you want ;) 14:13:38 <valhallasw> would not even be too bad... hmm 14:13:52 <Eddi|zuHause3> yeah, VHDL style 14:14:20 <Eddi|zuHause3> but again, this is completely irrelevant 14:14:38 <valhallasw> yeah, sorry for the interruption :P 14:51:15 *** Zahl [~Zahl@p549F4254.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Windows shutdown) ((~_~]"] 15:08:37 *** Nitehawk [~nitehawk@c-98-200-106-108.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:09:19 *** Nitehawk [~nitehawk@c-98-200-106-108.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 15:11:29 *** Gonoozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N826P006.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 15:13:04 *** Gonoozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N826P006.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has left #openttd [] 15:13:35 <Wolf01> yeah, i made the first steam maglev 15:15:24 <Eddi|zuHause3> and i can't figure out how to make an articulated vehicle from these specs... 15:15:58 <Eddi|zuHause3> this callback stuff somehow eludes me... 15:18:06 <Maedhros> yeah, it only started to make sense to me when i started coding nfo 15:18:18 <Maedhros> surprisingly, adding the support for it to openttd didn't help me that much 15:20:14 <Eddi|zuHause3> the documentation is really not that great 15:20:23 <Eddi|zuHause3> (and this is a serious understatement) 15:27:00 *** Aerandir [magic.powe@90-230-201-111-no37.tbcn.telia.com] has quit [Quit: - nbs-irc 2.36 - www.nbs-irc.net -] 15:44:19 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat1.spoje.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:44:32 <Wolf01> Eddi|zuHause3, talking with that friend of mine, he suggested to try bison 15:44:49 <Wolf01> but not the glue 15:45:04 <Eddi|zuHause3> again, that suggestion is as silly as any other language... 15:46:16 <Wolf01> so, what do you want? i can't understand 15:47:07 <Eddi|zuHause3> higher languages are all the same, you can list two dozen names here, it does not really make a difference 15:47:24 <Wolf01> bison is a compiler 15:47:27 <pavel1269> :) 15:47:33 <Eddi|zuHause3> the problems are a) understanding NFO to understand what features the higher language needs 15:48:20 <Eddi|zuHause3> and b) deciding how higher language features can easily be transformed into NFO statements 15:49:04 <Eddi|zuHause3> the actual compiler won't have too many lines of codes, but there are a lot of design decisions that you can make wrong 15:49:57 <Eddi|zuHause3> <Wolf01> bison is a compiler <- from where to where? 15:50:30 <Wolf01> ok, a parser 15:50:53 <Eddi|zuHause3> then my statement still holds... the parser is really irrelevant 15:51:28 <Eddi|zuHause3> we need to design the compiler backwards 15:52:35 <Eddi|zuHause3> start from NFO, make a strict tree representation of NFO, make abstractions on that tree representation, define syntax for the abstract tree representation 15:52:49 <Wolf01> that is why i suggested an ide (with compiler).. you can decide all the possible values, if i'm making a train engine, all the ship functions are grayed and so on, so i can't insert by hand the code to replace a ship with a train engine, the other values will be automatically converted to hex, like the ID, strings etc 15:54:14 *** Draakon [~chatzilla@88-196-98-113-dsl.trt.estpak.ee] has joined #openttd 15:54:19 <Draakon> hello guys 15:54:48 <Eddi|zuHause3> that still does not allow you imperative-style definition of reusable functions and callbacks 15:55:29 <Eddi|zuHause3> or inheritance relation 15:55:39 <Wolf01> why not? 15:57:25 <Eddi|zuHause3> we are not getting further in this discussion unless we find a common base, you are living in a completely different world than i am 15:58:12 <Draakon> what patches you guys suggest do add more challange to game? 15:58:46 <kyevan> Write a quick hack to turn off trains :P 15:58:56 <pavel1269> :)) 15:58:59 <Eddi|zuHause3> kyevan: that is a config setting 15:59:09 <pavel1269> max_trains: 0? 15:59:17 <kyevan> Eddi|zuHause3: Really? I only see one to turn it off for AIs 15:59:19 <Eddi|zuHause3> yeah, something like that 15:59:32 <Draakon> lol truck only game? nah i want trains 16:00:13 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB4CFE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 16:00:37 <Eddi|zuHause3> kyevan: in .cfg file, max_trains, max_roadveh, max_aircraft etc. 16:00:41 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat1.spoje.net] has joined #openttd 16:02:44 <pavel1269> Draakon: hilly terrain? dissalow for youselves terraform? 16:05:46 *** qball [~qball@ipd50a4125.speed.planet.nl] has joined #openttd 16:06:18 <qball> can I autoreplace wagons 16:06:32 <pavel1269> yes 16:07:04 <qball> how 16:07:08 <qball> running the beta 16:07:24 <Eddi|zuHause3> click on the button that says "engines", then you can select "wagons" 16:07:26 <Draakon> you know how do autoreplace ttrains? 16:07:31 <Draakon> trains* 16:07:41 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@xdsl-84-44-196-204.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: leaving] 16:07:44 <qball> yes 16:08:04 <qball> I see it 16:08:05 <Draakon> there should be a button: Repleacing: Trains 16:08:07 <Draakon> click that 16:08:13 <Draakon> and then you see wagons list 16:08:18 <qball> no directly clear 16:08:24 <qball> you can click it 16:08:26 <pavel1269> "Replacing: Engines" click "Replacing: Cars" 16:08:28 <qball> expected a dropdown 16:08:40 <qball> I assume it auto-refits? 16:08:50 <Draakon> yes 16:08:59 <qball> nice 16:09:02 <qball> I love the beta 16:09:04 <Osai> Hi all 16:09:07 <pavel1269> heh 16:09:08 <pavel1269> use NB 16:09:11 <Eddi|zuHause3> even better, it does not replace, if it cannot find a refit option 16:09:15 <qball> the cross diagonal lines 16:09:15 <Draakon> Hi Osai 16:09:25 <pavel1269> hi Osai 16:09:31 <qball> now to replace 1200 wagons 16:10:01 <Eddi|zuHause3> and make sure to turn "auto remove wagons" on, if the new wagons are longer than the old ones 16:10:12 <qball> same length 16:10:28 <qball> any new news on pbs? 16:10:33 <Eddi|zuHause3> nope 16:11:22 <Draakon> yes there is: it will be ready when it will be 16:11:23 <Draakon> :P 16:11:33 <qball> that was said 3 years ago :D 16:11:37 <qball> but I am patient 16:11:46 <qball> I loved the pbs patch 16:12:10 <Draakon> who created yapf anyway? 16:12:32 <qball> the yapf creater wrote yapf partially to add pbs 16:12:37 <qball> there was a patch before 16:13:26 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@xdsl-84-44-196-196.netcologne.de] has joined #openttd 16:15:38 <kyevan> Hmm, I have a crazy idea. 16:16:01 <kyevan> Mixing together TTD and SimCity. In multiplayer. 16:16:17 <kyevan> So you have some players mayoring, others trying to connect things. 16:16:53 <kyevan> And of course, no one wants smelly trains and ugly noisy trucks in THEIR town, thank you very much! 16:18:59 <qball> don't we all? 16:19:31 <Draakon> kyevan: impossibile 16:19:53 <kyevan> Draakon: How is that impossible? 16:20:04 <Draakon> legal issues 16:20:12 <kyevan> I mean, sure, it would have to be rewritten from scratch to work right, but. 16:20:16 <kyevan> Draakon: Um, wha? 16:20:36 <kyevan> What legal issues exist with creating a new game that mixes concepts from two older ones? 16:20:57 <qball> don't call it ttdsim 16:20:57 <Draakon> you cant mix ttd and simcity together because (il)legal issues 16:21:05 <kyevan> None whatsoever, otherwise the entire game industry would not exist anymore, save one or two big issues. 16:21:11 *** fjb [~frank@p5485F42B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 16:21:11 <kyevan> Draakon: What issues would those be? 16:21:15 <fjb> Moin 16:21:20 <kyevan> I can write whatever the hell code I want! 16:21:37 <Draakon> oeh you dont get it 16:21:49 <kyevan> Draakon: No, I don't. 16:21:56 <SpComb> Logs: http://spbot.marttila.de:8120/logs/oftc-ottd (old: http://zapotek.paivola.fi/~terom/logs/openttd ) 16:21:56 <fjb> !logs 16:21:59 <kyevan> Because you're not making any sense, at all. 16:22:01 <Draakon> well i dont have time too 16:23:03 <kyevan> Look, if creating a new game (Not enhancing an old one, where there might be issues, I admit) from two concepts is illegal... How come id and infocom haven't sued the hell out of Valve? 16:23:30 <kyevan> GASP! It's a mix of adventure games (like the old Infocom adventures) and shooters (like Wolf3d, Doom, and Quake)! ILLEGAL! 16:23:38 <kyevan> That's.... exactly what you said :P 16:23:58 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-209.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 16:28:12 <qball> hmmm wagons from coal trains aren't replaced... 16:28:59 <qball> but I have coal trains pulling that wagon 16:29:28 <Eddi|zuHause3> <kyevan> And of course, no one wants smelly trains and ugly noisy trucks in THEIR town, thank you very much! <- when they built the tram here (late 19th century), it was originally a horse tram, but when they wanted to put up catenary, they got huge resistance by the physics institute of the university, because it would interfere with their fine electric instruments 16:30:37 <Eddi|zuHause3> that resistance went on for over 10 years, then they decided to have the trams run with battery powers in that region, and put catenary up everywhere else 16:32:01 <Eddi|zuHause3> but the other tram company in the city was allowed to put up catenary much earlier, because it did not pass that region 16:33:54 <qball> everybody loves tinfoil cap 16:35:52 <Eddi|zuHause3> it is to mention that this was the first completely electric tram system in europe 16:37:14 <hylje> heres new trams to be bought 16:37:22 <hylje> for a new line 16:37:30 <hylje> and to replace the oldest series 16:38:41 <kyevan> Can anyone figure out what 'legal issues' Draakon was talking about? 16:39:12 <Eddi|zuHause3> Can anyone figure out what [...] Draakon was talking about? 16:39:12 <Draakon> kyevan: you cant use Sim word in your game 16:39:19 <kyevan> Oh, sure. 16:39:31 <Draakon> and use the same concept as SimCity has 16:39:34 <kyevan> That's a trademark thing, though. 16:39:42 <hylje> SimTTD 16:39:49 <kyevan> Draakon: Concepts can be neither copyright or trademarked. 16:40:08 <hylje> patents do not cover concepts either, rather implementations 16:40:28 <kyevan> Patented, maybe, but I refuse to recognize software patents as covering concepts. 16:40:44 *** joosa_ [~joosa@heh.fi] has joined #openttd 16:40:50 <kyevan> (Since that's not how patents work) 16:41:00 *** joosa [~joosa@heh.fi] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 16:41:25 <kyevan> So, OK. 16:41:37 <kyevan> I can't call it SimWhatever, because of trademark issues. 16:41:42 <Eddi|zuHause3> there are no software patents 16:41:43 <kyevan> I never said I was going to. 16:41:52 <kyevan> Eddi|zuHause3: In the US, there are. 16:42:05 <Eddi|zuHause3> and who here is in the US? 16:42:15 <kyevan> Me. 16:42:22 <Eddi|zuHause3> poor you ;) 16:42:29 <Eddi|zuHause3> anyway, you are a minority ;) 16:43:25 <kyevan> Right, but even in zanyland, Draakon's words made no sense. 16:43:46 <kyevan> So, I can't figure out what he meant, beyond the fairly obvious trademark issues 16:43:50 <qball> oeps, build a 13mil tunnel 16:45:42 <Draakon> lets stop talking about this? kyevan, if you one go ahead make that game 16:45:49 <Eddi|zuHause3> qball: afaik tunnel costs get capped at 800 Mrd. (not sure if £) 16:51:18 *** xintron [xintron@blinkenshell.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:54:36 <qball> I had enough cash 16:54:43 <qball> but a box "are you sure" for cost above 1 mil 16:54:46 <qball> would be an idea 16:54:54 <Eddi|zuHause3> why? 16:55:05 <Eddi|zuHause3> you can use shift to get the cost in advance 16:55:14 <qball> well I clicked wrong now 16:55:26 <qball> just one square 16:55:40 <qball> medication -> shaking hands 16:56:02 <Eddi|zuHause3> so that's what this is called now :p 16:56:11 <qball> ha ha ha, not funny 16:56:14 <qball> ass 16:56:15 *** xintron [xintron@blinkenshell.org] has joined #openttd 16:56:33 <Eddi|zuHause3> anyway... kolourpaint does not handle palettes correctly... 17:06:30 *** Draakon [~chatzilla@88-196-98-113-dsl.trt.estpak.ee] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.79 [Firefox 2.0.0.11/2007112718]] 17:10:18 *** peterbrett [~peter@cpc2-oxfd6-0-0-cust544.oxfd.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:10:46 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1D69D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:17:01 *** peterbrett [~peter@cpc2-oxfd6-0-0-cust544.oxfd.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd 17:22:49 *** TinoM [~Tino@i59F57349.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 17:29:04 *** TinoM [~Tino@i59F57349.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 17:29:05 <Wolf01> uh, we need steam powered road vehicles 17:29:10 <Wolf01> http://www.darkroastedblend.com/2007/12/steam-buses-trucks.html 17:29:34 <pavel1269> and eletric too right? :) 17:30:08 <Wolf01> :) 17:31:41 <Wolf01> i think is possible to have trolley buses, just make trams looking like buses :D 17:31:53 <Wolf01> but the smoke is slightly different 17:35:05 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB4CFE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Osai] 17:48:06 *** [1]Mark [~Mark@5351EA48.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd 17:50:27 *** Gonoozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N826P006.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 17:51:23 *** Gonoozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N826P006.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:51:28 *** nfc [~nfc@dsl-hkibrasgw2-ff6ec300-105.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:53:58 *** Mark [~Mark@5351EA48.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:53:58 *** [1]Mark is now known as Mark 18:07:44 *** |Bastiaan| [~Bastiaan@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 3.2.6 Anomalies http://www.kvirc.net/] 18:09:02 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: egladil * r11688 /trunk/src/ (8 files in 3 dirs): -Fix [FS#1581]: Compilation was broken on OS X again. 18:47:05 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:50:59 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has joined #openttd 18:51:30 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB4CFE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 19:06:16 *** Tlustoch [~last_evol@r5bn73.net.upc.cz] has joined #openttd 19:16:43 *** a1270 [~Cheese@24-117-163-29.cpe.cableone.net] has quit [Quit: The ending changes tone & is actually quite sad - but it involves a scene of necrophilia, so that's just another plus in my book.....] 19:22:21 *** dihedral [~dihedral@p54AFFD18.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 19:23:13 <dihedral> hello 19:25:07 <pavel1269> hi 19:33:32 *** Tlustoch [~last_evol@r5bn73.net.upc.cz] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:36:04 <dihedral> company password issue also with windows vista -> windows xp 19:37:10 <dihedral> vista is on core 2 duo, xp is on p4 19:37:17 <dihedral> Rubidium ^ 19:37:24 <dihedral> have a nice evening - i got to run :-) 19:46:03 *** dihedral [~dihedral@p54AFFD18.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:49:19 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has quit [Quit: May the ducttape be with you] 19:53:45 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has joined #openttd 19:53:57 *** toet [~cheese@3E339CE5.dslaccess.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:55:15 *** toet [~cheese@3E339CE5.dslaccess.aol.com] has joined #openttd 20:00:16 <hylje> regarding those trolleys 20:00:17 <hylje> http://www.1chan.net/rail/src/1198426865740.jpg 20:01:41 <kyevan> Hmm. 20:02:21 <kyevan> I wonder how much rethinking it would take to adapt TTD to an SC4 like landscape system (Not coding, I can already tell you that, a complete rewrite) 20:05:07 <hylje> do you mean arbitrary elevation? 20:05:21 <hylje> ive seen (and done) some plain silly stuff done with them elevation 20:05:26 <hylje> and absolutely silly tunnels 20:05:37 <valhallasw> is that... really *one* bus? 20:05:48 <hylje> yes 20:05:58 <valhallasw> interesting 20:06:14 <hylje> you see only the back one is powered 20:06:19 <valhallasw> yeah 20:06:31 <pavel1269> wow 20:06:53 <hylje> though it could be some soviet sillyness 20:09:16 <kyevan> Hylje: Arbetrary elevation, arbetrary slants, etc, yes. 20:09:46 <Eddi|zuHause3> i'm not a big fan of trolley busses 20:10:01 <Eddi|zuHause3> and i'm also not a big fan of the sc4 landscape handling 20:10:15 <Eddi|zuHause3> you don't have enough control over what you do 20:10:16 <hylje> them are planning trollbusses here 20:11:56 <Eddi|zuHause3> they planned trolleybusses here about 40 years ago 20:12:05 <Eddi|zuHause3> they even got delivered material and rolling stock 20:12:15 <Eddi|zuHause3> but then decided to extend the tram line instead 20:12:37 <kyevan> Eddi|zuHause3: Well, the editor's meh. 20:12:40 <kyevan> But the idea is sound. 20:13:50 *** thomas001 [~thomas@p54B77455.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 20:14:11 <Eddi|zuHause3> finer slopes would be nice, but when you go near arbitrary, you cannot handle that with a sprite based system 20:14:42 <hylje> hence a 3d map 20:15:34 <Eddi|zuHause3> trying to introduce a 3d graphics engine is not a sound idea 20:16:18 <thomas001> hi,i don't understand something about good waiting at stations. are goods waiting too long being dropped? is that why a coal mine has only ~50% transported coal when using long trains which are less frequent? 20:16:34 <SmatZ> thomas001: yes 20:16:49 <SmatZ> also depends at your cargo rating 20:17:12 <thomas001> so is it better to use shorter and more trains? or even to have always one train waiting at the station? 20:17:42 <Eddi|zuHause3> 50% transported means you have an average rating of 50% service at the station 20:18:09 <Eddi|zuHause3> if you have an average rating of 50%, the mine will produce around 50% of its maximum capacity 20:18:22 <Eddi|zuHause3> this has nothing to do with cargo being dropped 20:18:31 <Eddi|zuHause3> (although that can still happen) 20:18:52 <thomas001> so if i employ more trains,more will be produced? 20:18:57 <Eddi|zuHause3> rating rises when you have trains loading 20:19:06 <Eddi|zuHause3> and rating drops when you have no trains loading 20:19:12 <pavel1269> yeah, have all time there waiting vehicle 20:19:18 <pavel1269> *loading 20:19:25 <Eddi|zuHause3> through loading all the time, you can get around 75% 20:19:39 <pavel1269> 80 :) 20:19:50 <Eddi|zuHause3> a statue adds 10% permanently 20:20:12 <Eddi|zuHause3> the rest you have to do with advertising 20:20:16 <qball> hmm this game is getting boring, got 403 million pounds, and it's 1971.. 20:20:23 <thomas001> advertising a coal mine? 20:20:36 <Eddi|zuHause3> no, in the town 20:21:22 <thomas001> hmm,and when are goods dropped? 20:21:23 <Eddi|zuHause3> advertising temporarily increases all your station ratings in this town 20:21:42 <Eddi|zuHause3> that takes quite a while 20:23:31 <thomas001> is the rate based on loading calculated on a per month basis or is it a more difficult calculation? 20:24:36 <pavel1269> thomas001: http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/Game_Mechanics#Station-rating 20:24:48 <thomas001> thx 20:26:14 <Eddi|zuHause3> www.informatik.uni-halle.de/~krause/Fuerstenhaven%20Transport,%2010.%20Jan%201930.png <- i can't get this spacing right... what am i doing wrong? 20:26:49 *** Wolf01 is now known as Wolf01|AWAY 20:32:06 <kyevan> Eddi|zuHause3: Trying to introduce a 3d graphics engine would be crazy 20:32:28 <kyevan> Hence why I mentioned if you wanted to impliment it, you would probably have to rewrite it from scratch >_> 20:32:53 <thomas001> full 3d or mixed 2d/3d? 20:35:16 <kyevan> I dunno. It's just a random idea. 20:43:14 <Eddi|zuHause3> currently, slopes are always 8 pixels, i would like if they could be 4, 12 and possibly 16 pixels 20:46:18 <Eddi|zuHause3> 4px slopes should be quite easily handled by trains, 8 pixels will get most engines in trouble 20:46:33 <Eddi|zuHause3> tunnel entrances would need at least a 12px slope 20:47:03 <Eddi|zuHause3> catenary elevation is 11px i think 20:47:48 <Eddi|zuHause3> similarily, a bridge over a rail must be at least 12px higher 20:48:07 <kyevan> Don't mesure in px 20:48:11 <kyevan> It doesn't make sense. 20:49:03 <Eddi|zuHause3> in what should i measure, you suggest? 20:49:13 *** Zaviori [~zavior@d195-237-7-209.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 20:49:21 <Eddi|zuHause3> that word order sounds awful... 20:49:56 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-209.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:49:57 <kyevan> I dunno. Scaled units of some sort? 20:50:34 <kyevan> px mesures display things, so. 20:52:46 <kyevan> One of the current hight changes, let's define as 16 height units/ 20:53:00 <Eddi|zuHause3> but it's 8 height units 20:53:01 <kyevan> Build from that. 20:53:05 <kyevan> * then 20:53:11 <kyevan> er, 8, then 20:53:22 <Eddi|zuHause3> and 1 height unit = 1 pixel 20:53:31 <kyevan> I don't care, I was just assigning it a nice, power-of-two nimber 20:53:33 <kyevan> Eddi|zuHause3: No. 20:53:37 <kyevan> That CAN'T work 20:53:37 <Eddi|zuHause3> i really have no idea what your problem ist 20:53:53 <kyevan> Pixels are little dots on the screen 20:54:03 <kyevan> You can mesure in two directions with them. 20:54:17 <kyevan> Up in an isometric rendering, isn't one of the, 20:54:39 <Eddi|zuHause3> i define it, i can do it, see? 20:55:04 <kyevan> es 20:55:07 <kyevan> *Besides 20:55:12 <kyevan> Zoom levels :P 20:55:27 <Eddi|zuHause3> there are no zoom levels 20:55:53 * kyevan pops open ottd and scrolls his mouse wheel up and down 20:55:57 <kyevan> Yes, yes there are 20:56:09 <kyevan> And any new engine would need zooming too 20:56:23 <kyevan> Because, let's face it, you need to be able to get an overview at some points and detail at others 20:56:25 <Eddi|zuHause3> now go and find those zoom levels in the .grf files 20:56:53 <kyevan> It's done in the engine, I know 20:57:09 <kyevan> But still. 20:57:23 <kyevan> Anyway, family christmas party, cyall later :) 20:57:37 <Eddi|zuHause3> err... you're one day early 21:02:54 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: smatz * r11689 /trunk/ (4 files in 3 dirs): -Fix: compilation error and most of warnings for gcc 4.3 21:08:29 *** thgerg1 [~Administr@dsl51B60E55.pool.t-online.hu] has joined #openttd 21:12:38 <thomas001> hmm i want to transport passenger by ship to a airport and from the airport to another town,is that possible? 21:13:17 <Eddi|zuHause3> yes, partly 21:13:28 *** thgergo [~Administr@dsl51B60EF7.pool.t-online.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:13:40 <thomas001> which part is possible and how? 21:14:08 <Eddi|zuHause3> the airport must accept passengers and mail from the incoming planes, you cannot transfer passengers both ways 21:14:28 <Eddi|zuHause3> the ferry needs "transfer and leave empty" orders at the airport 21:15:06 <thomas001> so i can't tell the ferry only to take the passengers from the other town? 21:15:20 <Eddi|zuHause3> no, that is the part that does not work 21:15:41 <thomas001> hmm sounds like a nice feature to be implemented by someone? 21:16:10 * Eddi|zuHause3 puts thomas001 on top of the list of volunteers 21:16:49 <thomas001> yes i was sure about the top of that list ;) 21:17:07 <thomas001> but not before end of january 21:17:35 <thomas001> but you think it whould be a nice thing to work on? 21:28:39 <Eddi|zuHause3> well, it needs to be a quite complex work, because it'll need proper passenger destinations, and different settings for passenger and cargo destinations, to turn it off 21:29:25 <Eddi|zuHause3> also, you need a good algorithm to decide if a passenger takes train A, that is currently waiting, or train B that will be arriving shortly, but is much faster 21:29:50 <thomas001> does the game keep track where the passengers came from? 21:29:54 <Eddi|zuHause3> yes 21:30:08 <thomas001> so for the problem some kind of source routing whould perhaps work too? 21:30:09 <Eddi|zuHause3> that's in cargo packets 21:30:45 <Eddi|zuHause3> yes, if you can decide that a passenger will not go on a train that goes where he just came from 21:30:55 <Eddi|zuHause3> but then you also have to store all intermediate steps 21:31:12 *** wonko|twin [wonko@host-212-149-175-116.kpylaajakaista.net] has joined #openttd 21:31:54 <Eddi|zuHause3> like, if you have 3 airports in the middle of nowhere, passengers could get stuck in planes circling between the two he did not come from 21:32:12 <Eddi|zuHause3> instead of hopping on a transfer bus 21:32:17 <Eddi|zuHause3> into the city 21:32:32 <thomas001> you could configure the plains not to pick up certain passengers perhaps 21:32:38 <thomas001> *planes ;) 21:32:55 <thomas001> damn...aircraft :D 21:33:07 <Eddi|zuHause3> it should not involve too much player interaction 21:33:08 <thomas001> they should really teach english at university ^^ 21:33:46 <Eddi|zuHause3> reminds me of hot shots (2?) 21:34:08 *** Mark [~Mark@5351EA48.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:34:10 <thomas001> is "take passengers from A to airport B,but at B don't take passengers from A back" too much? 21:34:48 <Eddi|zuHause3> yes, because you also have to configure that planes between B and C don't take passengers from A 21:35:08 <Eddi|zuHause3> because they could go back and forth between B and C 21:35:47 <thomas001> but 3 airports in the middle of nowhere is a rather abstract example,isn't it? 21:35:59 <Eddi|zuHause3> and on the next level, you might want to allow passengers from A to travel from B to C, because there is no direct flight 21:36:11 <Eddi|zuHause3> in reality, all airports are in the middle of nowhere 21:36:51 <Eddi|zuHause3> airports in the middle of a city are really rare 21:37:57 <thomas001> hmm so you think you need to track the visited stations and disallow loops? 21:37:59 *** ln-_ [~lanurm@castor.utu.fi] has joined #openttd 21:38:19 *** ln- [lauri@ksenos.fi] has left #openttd [] 21:38:49 *** ln-_ is now known as ln- 21:50:50 *** dihedral [~dihedral@p54AFFD18.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 21:56:25 *** Mark [~Mark@5351EA48.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd 22:00:27 *** dihedral [~dihedral@p54AFFD18.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:03:12 *** Bjarni [~Bjarni@0x50a46c2b.virnxx14.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 22:03:12 *** mode/#openttd [+o Bjarni] by ChanServ 22:03:46 <ln-> 00:03 -!- Irssi: Uptime: 368d 2h 25m 53s 22:04:07 <Bjarni> ahh 22:04:11 <Bjarni> home sweet home 22:05:24 <Eddi|zuHause3> ln-: you missed it :p 22:06:45 * Bjarni fines ln- for excessive power usage for a geek purpose 22:07:22 *** Zaviori [~zavior@d195-237-7-209.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:07:28 <Bjarni> if you really have to do something that pollutes then you should really have to do so 22:07:43 <Bjarni> having an uptime doesn't count as "needed" 22:08:02 * Sacro is now playing: Britney Spears - Piece Of Me (.977 The Hitz Channel) 22:08:14 <SmatZ> having record uptime is really important for some people, I would celebrated 1 year uptime a lot too 22:08:31 <SmatZ> just got 500 hours a while ago :) 22:09:04 <SmatZ> http://88.146.45.107/uptime123456.png :) 22:09:54 <Bjarni> hehe 22:09:59 <Bjarni> photoshop :P 22:10:21 <SmatZ> no :) 22:10:29 <Bjarni> 1 year uptime would be great... if it's really needed like a server 22:10:48 <Bjarni> but I fail to see why ln- would have to have the computer turned on all the time 22:11:21 <valhallasw> Bjarni: generally my server has uptimes up to a year 22:11:30 <valhallasw> which is the point I decide to do a kernel upgrade etc 22:11:59 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1D69D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 22:12:21 * Bjarni gives Sacro an official warning 22:12:31 <valhallasw> 23:12:22 up 218 days, 8:33, 2 users, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00 22:12:42 <SmatZ> nice load :-P 22:12:46 <valhallasw> 23:12 Irssi uptime: 26d 2h 45m 32s <-- irssi crashes every now-and-then 22:12:46 * Sacro gives Bjarni an official hug 22:13:05 <Bjarni> Sacro: Britney Spears..... need I say more 22:13:10 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-209.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 22:13:20 <Bjarni> you need to actually listen to something worth listening to 22:13:29 <Bjarni> like engine noise 22:15:49 * valhallasw listens to Bjarni 22:17:16 <SpComb> 00:17 Irssi uptime: 239d 13h 15m 58s 22:17:31 <SpComb> you need to be careful not to crash it 22:21:15 <Rubidium> :O give me some tips ;) 22:22:34 <Eddi|zuHause3> my computer occasionally crashes, and i have no real idea why 22:23:06 <SpComb> Rubidium: never do anything other than chat with it 22:23:31 <SpComb> I've had it crash on me sontimes if I do weird things with split windows or such 22:28:20 * Sacro whistles 22:32:11 <Rubidium> for me it crashes when my internet connection drops, but randomly and unpredictably 22:33:48 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N925P023.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 22:34:58 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N925P023.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has left #openttd [] 22:35:00 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N925P023.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 22:35:29 *** nfc [~nfc@dsl-hkibrasgw2-ff6ec300-105.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd 22:38:33 *** Maedhros [~jc@i-195-137-43-74.freedom2surf.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:40:38 *** Aerandir [magic.powe@90-230-201-111-no37.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #openttd 22:42:53 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N925P023.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:45:54 *** pavel1269 [~pavel.g@48.140.broadband2.iol.cz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:47:50 *** Grey [~Greyscale@host86-131-27-37.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 22:48:42 *** Greyscale [~Greyscale@host86-131-27-37.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:57:17 *** Kenjuudo [~ef@116.80-203-20.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd 22:57:23 <Kenjuudo> hi :) 22:57:31 <Kenjuudo> <- another train freak :) 23:03:18 *** peterbrett [~peter@cpc2-oxfd6-0-0-cust544.oxfd.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:09:38 <qball> hmm not bad, almost 1.000.000 pounds/train average.. (total 105.000.000 a year.) 23:14:26 *** peterbrett [~peter@cpc2-oxfd6-0-0-cust544.oxfd.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd 23:17:00 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N925P023.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 23:22:14 <Bjarni> Kenjuudo: I have seen plenty of your kind today 23:22:39 <Kenjuudo> :) 23:22:41 <Gonozal_VIII> his kind? 23:22:46 <Kenjuudo> train freaks :) 23:22:50 <Gonozal_VIII> aah 23:23:09 <Bjarni> I was out in the real world today 23:23:10 <Bjarni> driving 23:23:11 <Kenjuudo> i just gotta say: thumbs up for openttd !! :) 23:23:18 <Kenjuudo> best thing that ever happened to open source ;) 23:24:38 <Bjarni> Kenjuudo: btw how would you define a train freak? :) 23:25:56 <Kenjuudo> a freak that likes trains ^^ 23:26:07 <Bjarni> hehe 23:26:10 <Kenjuudo> ;) 23:26:17 <Bjarni> that's not really what I meant XD 23:26:27 <Kenjuudo> what did you mean then :) 23:26:38 <Bjarni> I mean... what actions would classify a person to be a train freak? 23:27:31 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N925P023.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Quit: Trillian (http://www.ceruleanstudios.com] 23:27:42 <Kenjuudo> ok, here comes the explanation :) a train freak is one that plays openttd instead of world of warcraft and counterstrike ^^ 23:27:52 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N925P023.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 23:28:13 <Bjarni> lol 23:28:34 <Kenjuudo> bjarni do you know where i can find the grf packages? 23:28:35 <Bjarni> but that's a virtual train freak 23:28:50 <Kenjuudo> yeah, are you meaning the rl ones? :) 23:28:52 <Bjarni> http://grfcrawler.tt-forums.net 23:28:53 <Gonozal_VIII> grfcrawler 23:28:59 <Kenjuudo> thanks 23:29:15 <Bjarni> Gonozal_VIII: mine is clickable :P 23:29:33 <Bjarni> <Kenjuudo> yeah, are you meaning the rl ones? :) <--- yeah... how would you define a real life train freak? 23:30:25 <Kenjuudo> a guy taking his pants off in a fully occupied car and drooling on the poodle of a classy woman ;P 23:30:51 <Bjarni> ??? 23:31:01 <Bjarni> ok you really are a freak 23:31:19 <Kenjuudo> thanks... i guess i didn't know what you were looking for... :) 23:31:25 <Gonozal_VIII> don't get the pc wet 23:32:33 <Bjarni> a computer train freak uses his computer to play train games... but how would you define a real life train freak? 23:32:53 <Bjarni> this is a question for everybody :) 23:32:57 <Gonozal_VIII> uses a train to play computer games 23:33:09 <Bjarni> ok... 23:33:24 <Bjarni> reminds me of the play station gaming in a driving train 23:33:52 <Bjarni> but I guess that was a freak thing to do... only happened once 23:33:58 <Gonozal_VIII> i often play openttd on the train :-) 23:34:12 <Bjarni> you see... not only did it demand a playstation, it also needed a TV 23:34:53 <Gonozal_VIII> why not? 23:35:12 <Gonozal_VIII> small tv... 23:35:22 <Bjarni> they didn't use a small TV XD 23:35:28 <Gonozal_VIII> hehe 23:36:30 <Bjarni> hmm... google earth can sometimes show interesting stuff 23:37:01 <Gonozal_VIII> so you think the outside world is sometimes interesting? 23:37:13 *** peterbrett [~peter@cpc2-oxfd6-0-0-cust544.oxfd.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:37:14 <Bjarni> right now I found a parked locomotive in the no parking zone (actually the sign says that the driver should stop in a place to ensure the crossing is passable) 23:37:35 <Bjarni> <Gonozal_VIII> so you think the outside world is sometimes interesting? <-- I was in the outside world all day 23:37:38 <Bjarni> today 23:37:39 <Gonozal_VIII> how do you know it's parking? 23:38:13 <Bjarni> it's a track for parking locomotives 23:38:17 <Sacro> Gonozal_VIII: he's been watching it for 2 hours 23:38:23 <Bjarni> lol 23:38:56 <Bjarni> Sacro: that's likely one of your best replies ever :D 23:39:16 <Sacro> well it is christmas 23:39:41 <Gonozal_VIII> hmmm not for you yet 23:39:59 <Bjarni> let me put it this way: if it isn't parking then it would drive to a location where it blocks the other crossing 23:40:13 <Bjarni> either way it's not doing something really clever 23:40:40 <Gonozal_VIII> maybe it's driving the other way? 23:41:24 <Bjarni> then it would get out after parking in a crossing 23:41:37 <Bjarni> you see... this is a siding 23:42:09 <Bjarni> anyway 23:42:18 <Bjarni> did anything interesting happening to you today? 23:42:21 <Gonozal_VIII> well... the siding is of no use if there is no possible situation where a locomotive can be there 23:42:41 <Bjarni> ONE locomotive can be there 23:42:45 <Bjarni> but 3 can't :P 23:43:20 <Gonozal_VIII> ah now i understand 23:45:44 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N925P023.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Quit: Trillian (http://www.ceruleanstudios.com] 23:45:52 <Bjarni> bye... 23:46:01 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N925P023.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 23:46:14 <Bjarni> hello Gonozal_VIII 23:46:20 <Bjarni> haven't I seen you before? 23:46:31 <Kenjuudo> bjarni, are you one of the devs of openttd? 23:46:37 <Gonozal_VIII> :S did i have a different nick before? 23:46:58 <Bjarni> yeah 23:47:07 <Bjarni> you were named Gonozal_VIIII 23:47:19 <Sacro> Bjarni: IX 23:47:21 <Kenjuudo> bjarni: are you sure it's the same guy? 23:47:21 <Sacro> you fail at roman 23:47:26 <Kenjuudo> did you do a dns lookup? 23:47:48 <Gonozal_VIII> some clocks use IIII 23:47:55 <Bjarni> Sacro: that was on purpose 23:47:57 <Eddi|zuHause3> Sacro: it was actually very common to write IIII, the substraction rule was not widely used in rome 23:48:07 <Bjarni> now would have been a great time to reply in Latin 23:48:27 <Eddi|zuHause3> quod lumen, lumen 23:48:36 <Eddi|zuHause3> alter skatspruch 23:48:37 <Bjarni> I meant a real reply 23:48:46 <Eddi|zuHause3> "was licht, licht" 23:48:53 <Bjarni> telling Sacro that I know what I'm doing 23:49:06 <Bjarni> hmm 23:49:38 <Bjarni> no. Babelfish can't handle Latin :( 23:49:39 <Eddi|zuHause3> (you can't understand that joke if you aren't familiar with german dialects) 23:50:01 <Sacro> Danish eunt domus 23:50:19 <Bjarni> Eddi|zuHause3: first you speak garbage and then you blame it on the Germans :P 23:50:31 <Bjarni> Sacro: nice try :P 23:50:39 <Sacro> Bjarni: i got 2 of the words right 23:51:01 <Gonozal_VIII> "wos liegt des pickt" 23:53:27 <Eddi|zuHause3> well, the joke is that the skat rule says "was liegt, liegt" (when the card hits the table, you cannot take it back), latin "lumen" means "licht" (light, as in shining), but in some german dialects, "liegt" gets spoken like "licht" 23:53:51 <Gonozal_VIII> my line has the same meaning 23:54:02 <Gonozal_VIII> austrian dialect :-) 23:55:19 <Eddi|zuHause3> (a similar play on dialect we recently had with "griechen", "kriechen" and "kriegen") 23:55:43 <Gonozal_VIII> (not plural of war) 23:56:11 <Eddi|zuHause3> ("wenn Griechen ÃŒber Griechen kriechen, kriegen Griechen kleine Griechen")