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00:00:59 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: i also have installers for 0.4.0 and 0.4.0.1 00:01:19 <planetmaker> :-) 00:01:36 <OwenS> If I fish around I can probably find 0.3.5 bnaries... 00:01:44 <planetmaker> I recently found a 0.4.x on an old hard disc of mine... 00:01:57 <OwenS> planetmaker, yeah, but is that from #ottdc's oldskool game? :p 00:02:08 <planetmaker> no, not at all :-) 00:02:11 <Eddi|zuHause> and a "ttdpt20r1W.zip" 00:02:21 <planetmaker> those are on new hard discs ;-) 00:02:57 <Eddi|zuHause> this is my generic "installers from the last 10 years" collection directory 00:03:21 *** lugo [~lugo@mgdb-4db8d2f3.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:03:45 <Eddi|zuHause> unfortunately i can't find out anymore from when these files are, as they are all marked "26.06.2006" 00:04:07 <planetmaker> cp -p should be default ;-) 00:04:15 <Eddi|zuHause> which is a few days after my switch to linux 00:04:54 <OwenS> Hmm.. I think my switch date was ~august 2005 00:05:14 <Eddi|zuHause> interestingly, many files in there are newer than that :p 00:07:27 *** APTX [~APTX@chello089076052083.chello.pl] has joined #openttd 00:09:02 <amalloy1> it's pretty easy to make cp -p the default, though, on a given system 00:09:56 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-27-28-162.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:10:12 <Cadde> So basically, a lot of people here are running *nix 00:10:27 <amalloy1> well, you're playing a game which is an open-source project. surprise! :) 00:10:40 <Cadde> I wish i could too but there are too many things i still use for winblows 00:10:43 <amalloy1> i'm actually running windows, though. but i have cygwin installed 00:10:56 <amalloy1> good enough to get me most of what i want but still do windows gaming 00:11:01 *** JVassie [~James@nelocat2.gotadsl.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:12:09 <Cadde> If eve online would go back to supporting linux i would be close to the tipping point. I would probably run linux as my primary and winblows as my secondary. 00:12:46 * OwenS is actually running Solaris. But i'm odd 00:24:29 <Eddi|zuHause> please... who in this channel is _not_ odd? 00:31:09 *** ecke [~ecke@188.75.128.2] has quit [Quit: ecke] 00:31:37 <__ln__> _o/ 00:31:52 <ccfreak2k> __ln___o/ 00:32:50 *** JakeGrimshaw [~jake.grim@5e08f007.bb.sky.com] has quit [] 00:33:12 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: that is a lie :p 00:37:04 <__ln__> although... only odd people use irc. 00:38:58 <__ln__> Rubidium: By the way, why did you not speak up when Bjarni was granted access to svn? Why did you not object to it? 00:39:54 *** DX_Ipad [~Dreamxtre@host86-152-199-59.range86-152.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 00:40:05 *** Dreamxtreme [~Dreamxtre@host86-152-231-255.range86-152.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:41:07 <Yexo> __ln__: a guess from me: bjarni had already svn access before Rubidium joined 00:41:32 <Yexo> @commit 114 00:41:33 <DorpsGek> Yexo: Commit by bjarni :: r114 trunk/svnup.sh (2004-08-22 19:40:50 UTC) 00:41:34 <DorpsGek> Yexo: updated svnup.sh to display merged files (blathijs) 00:42:11 <Yexo> @commit 4788 00:42:15 <DorpsGek> Yexo: Commit by rubidium :: r4788 /trunk (15 files in 2 dirs) (2006-05-09 08:17:33 UTC) 00:42:16 <DorpsGek> Yexo: - Codechange: RAILTYPE_{NORMAL,ELECTRIC,...} and RAIL_TYPE_{NORMAL,SIGNAL,...} have nearly the same name, rename RAIL_TYPE_* to RAIL_TILE_* of extra clarity 00:42:23 <Yexo> first commits from both I could find 00:44:27 <__ln__> Fine, although the log is incomplete due to the svn crash. 00:45:11 <Yexo> yes, but if Rubidium would have had access to the old svn then I'd expect him to commit something in the first 4787 revisions of the new svn 00:45:56 <Yexo> the log is not randomly incomplete, the first 925 (or 975?) commits are missing 00:46:40 <Yexo> http://wiki.openttd.org/Developers <- another source of information 00:47:53 <__ln__> Rubidium: Alternatively, why did you not demand Bjarni's svn access to be revoked immediately even after you found out Bjarni is planting unpleasant "surprises" into the code? 00:48:51 <ccfreak2k> Oh, we're at 1.0 apparently. 00:50:51 <OwenS> __ln__, unpleasent surprises? 00:51:19 <amalloy1> does cargodist apply to non-passenger cargo? eg "some of this coal wants to go to power station A, some of it to power station B"? 00:51:25 <OwenS> amalloy1, yes 00:51:43 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: Rubidium "inherited" Bjarni 00:51:57 <amalloy1> neat. should make for an interesting change of approach 00:51:58 <__ln__> OwenS: no, unpleasant 00:52:10 <Eddi|zuHause> and by the time Rubidium got control, it likely was too late anyway 00:52:21 <OwenS> __ln__, what I'm wondering is, what you mean by this 00:52:39 <Yexo> OwenS: it's all in the irc logs from today 00:52:57 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: if my memory does not betray me, basically Rubidium is in charge since Darkvater left 00:53:06 <ccfreak2k> I'd like to know what's going on too. 00:53:10 <ccfreak2k> It sounds juicy. 00:53:22 <__ln__> OwenS: and i was referring to: 12:34 <@Rubidium> Darkvater: yeah, sadly enough we find surprises from Bjarni every few weeks :( 00:53:23 <OwenS> @logs 00:53:40 <OwenS> Aah 00:53:47 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: and by that time, Bjarni was already starting to go inactive 00:55:53 * OwenS is still curious w.r.t an example of such surprises 00:57:17 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 00:57:53 <Eddi|zuHause> [Donnerstag, 15. April 2010] [11:44:48] <Rubidium> Darkvater: yeah, such gems as CVE-2009-4007 01:00:06 <OwenS> Nasty 01:00:56 *** Lakie` [~Lakie@91.84.251.149] has joined #openttd 01:01:01 <Eddi|zuHause> you might not remember the maintenance pain that autoreplace was before frosch's rewrite 01:04:57 *** Lakie [~Lakie@91.84.251.149] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:07:11 *** elmz [~elmz@222.80-202-29.nextgentel.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:09:15 <OwenS> If his SVN access has been revoked... would it not also make sense to remove him from the developers group on the forum? 01:09:56 <Yexo> 1. I'm not sure his svn access has ever been revoked 01:10:03 <amalloy1> so...i have a general idea of how to build junctions, though not very efficient ones yet. but it seems like overkill to build a huge junction for every station i want trains to stop at, esp if trains have to be able to either turn around or go straight. is there a more lightweight way of doing this? 01:10:30 <Yexo> 2. he can't harm the code via the forum 01:10:45 <__ln__> OwenS: AFAIK his access has not been revoked. 01:10:51 <OwenS> Hmm 01:10:53 <OwenS> Yexo, true, but its somewhat misrepresentation of his ongoing status 01:11:02 <PeterT> Has his modifications to OpenTTD really been that bad? 01:11:26 <Cadde> amalloy1: RoRo 01:11:27 <Yexo> OwenS: true, but the same holds for more people 01:12:19 <Yexo> amalloy1: build a small junction (don't care about crossing tracks) and only improve it (and in the process likely enlarging it) if it's needed? 01:12:31 <OwenS> Yexo, I suppose its just that most projects I'm used to disable repository access for inactive devs for security reasons 01:13:12 <amalloy1> yexo: ah, good point. i'd been imagining that i needed to build perfectly the first time, but of course i don't 01:13:36 <amalloy1> cadde: yes, they are roro stations, but that doesn't avoid the use of bridges or crossovers in order to get trains to turn around after they go through 01:13:39 <Yexo> OwenS: and when is someone inactive exactly? when he hasn't commited for half a year? one year? two years? 01:14:04 <Yexo> amalloy1: personally I find upgrading live junctions one of the most fun parts of building 01:14:19 <OwenS> Yexo, the general policy I've seen seems to be 3 to 6 months. As said, its just disabled rather than revoked 01:14:22 <Cadde> amalloy1: If you'd like to you could host an online game and i can hop in a look at your designs and show you some. 01:14:56 <Yexo> OwenS: would you consider Belugas inactive? his last commit was 14 january 2010 01:15:00 <Cadde> And as yexo said, there is nothing more entertaining than upgrading live heavy traffic junctions 01:15:24 <OwenS> Yexo, more "no commits and missing from IRC" for 3 to 6 months 01:15:35 <Yexo> @seen bjarni 01:15:35 <DorpsGek> Yexo: bjarni was last seen in #openttd 7 weeks, 1 day, 1 hour, 50 minutes, and 15 seconds ago: <Bjarni> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-wVADKznOhY <-- wtf. Some rich guy built a trebuchet and uses burning pianos as ammo 01:15:37 *** Adambean [~AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has quit [Quit: Gone fishing] 01:15:40 <Yexo> 7 weeks is not even 2 months 01:16:34 <OwenS> I would say this, however, is a somewhat unusual case? 01:16:42 <Yexo> well, maybe 01:16:49 <Yexo> more old devs have shown up on irc lately 01:17:12 <Yexo> darkvater was here today for example (although i don't think he still has svn access) 01:17:27 <amalloy1> thanks cadde, but i think there will be nat/firewall issues with me hosting and don't want to try and work them out 01:17:39 <Cadde> ok, i could host 01:17:49 <Belugas> OwenS, your definition of inactivity is shocking me 01:17:50 <Cadde> If your FW is the only issue 01:18:34 <OwenS> Belugas, it would depend upon the project. But more than one project has found one day security exploits inserted into its code by the compromised account of an inactive developer 01:18:43 <amalloy1> it's the only issue i'm aware of; i've managed to join an online game or two. i might have some conflicting newgrfs, though? i don't know how to tell that 01:19:14 <Cadde> Well, i am more concerned over what build you have. openttd 1.0 ? 01:19:28 <Yexo> to host a game you need to open some ports in your router, to join a game you don't need to do that 01:19:30 <amalloy1> yeah, i think so. let me relaunch without cargodist 01:19:36 <OwenS> (And I know a few years back Debian were in the situation where a compromised developer's account caused bogus packages to be uploaded to their security repo) 01:20:07 <amalloy1> yeah, it's 1.0.0 01:20:13 <Cadde> 83.249.114.224 01:21:02 <amalloy1> okay, added you as a server; it says you're offline 01:21:08 <amalloy1> do you want one of my savegames, or start from scratch? 01:21:27 <Belugas> OwenS, these are bad people. 01:21:56 <Cadde> it up now 01:21:59 <Belugas> i doubt OpenTTD has ever counted thesesorts of jerks 01:22:00 <Cadde> It's 01:22:11 <amalloy1> i don't have ECS 01:22:12 <Belugas> well... there ws one once... 01:22:14 <OwenS> Belugas, maybe not. But they exist 01:22:23 <amalloy1> or, indeed, most of those newgrfs 01:22:23 <Cadde> Oh sorry, meant to start without grf 01:22:42 <Belugas> but hewanted toremove his stuff, only. no bad stuff other wise... 01:22:47 <Cadde> amalloy1: Now 01:22:54 <Belugas> anyway, me sleep 01:23:02 <Belugas> me waves bye bye 01:23:03 * Yexo is going to sleep too 01:23:05 <PeterT> good night Belugas 01:23:16 <PeterT> Me also, hehe 01:23:54 * OwenS too 01:24:41 <PeterT> Good night Belugas, Yexo, and OwenS 01:24:52 <Eddi|zuHause> OwenS: btw, did you think about the time based signalling? i think it's a really useful addition to progsigs 01:25:52 <OwenS> Eddi|zuHause, time based? (OK, I can stay awake a few more minutes :P) 01:26:32 <Eddi|zuHause> OwenS: i'm sure i mentoned that before, something like "stay red for X ticks and allow green for Y ticks"... or something date based 01:27:35 <OwenS> Eddi|zuHause, main thing is that then I need to add time-based callbacks, which have caveats (Changing to a different signal type while one still exists would have to be handled carefully, for example) 01:27:46 <OwenS> What for? 01:28:34 <Eddi|zuHause> OwenS: a) line priorities, b) keeping open windows for mixed fast/slow train lines, c) load balancing 01:29:45 <Eddi|zuHause> OwenS: things like the openttdcoop "tight packer" can be done with time based signalling 01:29:55 <OwenS> Line priorities: You can implement #ottdc style priorities without the signal track with progsigs 01:30:02 <OwenS> (Though its cumbersome) 01:30:15 <OwenS> Load balancing... I have a cunning plan </blackadder> 01:30:24 <OwenS> keeping open windows: Hmm? 01:30:33 <Eddi|zuHause> time window 01:30:56 <OwenS> I'm not quite following though ;-) 01:31:01 <Eddi|zuHause> OwenS: prevent slow freight trains from entering the main line when a fast passenger train is scheduled 01:31:13 <Eddi|zuHause> without having to add a timetable for every freight train 01:31:16 <OwenS> Aah, thats an interesting one 01:31:35 <OwenS> I have never touched the timetable interface except in logic constructions ;-) 01:32:31 <OwenS> Major things are that, firstly, programming the conditions could be as complex as the existing interface (-> complex to implement), and time based callback issues 01:36:04 <Eddi|zuHause> example: assume i have a mainline consisting out of 4 evenly spaced signal blocks [long]. and it takes a freight train 10 days to pass one signal block, and a passenger train is scheduled every 40 days. then i want to put a freight train in the first 10 day window, a freight train in the second 10 day window, keep the third 10 day window free, and start the passenger in the fourth 10 day window 01:36:58 <Eddi|zuHause> so i set the freight train signal to "green for 20 days, red for 20 days", and the passenger train signal to "red for 30 days, green for 10 days" 01:37:06 <Eddi|zuHause> and need a way to synchonize them 01:39:25 <OwenS> I suppose I could add an "<in the first 30 out of 40 days>" condition, and then make it so that the current position through a "phase" is the day count since the epoch modulo 40 01:43:47 *** Lakie` [~Lakie@91.84.251.149] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:44:33 <OwenS> Anyway, I bid you all goodnight 01:46:27 *** OwenS [~owenshep@cpc1-stkn14-2-0-cust562.11-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:50:21 <Cadde> amalloy1: http://wiki.openttd.org/Game_mechanics 01:50:42 *** Fuco [~dota.keys@fuco.sks3.muni.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:51:52 *** Biolunar_ [mahdi@blfd-5d821b9b.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 01:56:11 *** aber [~Adium@gb049.stw.stud.uni-saarland.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:59:08 *** Biolunar [mahdi@blfd-4db1b429.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:01:57 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 02:03:44 *** paul_ [~paul@e178033157.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [] 02:05:13 *** piro [~jeremy@pohl.ececs.uc.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:10:22 <Cadde> Eddi|zuHause: With progsigs i solve that by making a signal detect when a train is waiting for a train in front of it. Any train that is forcing a train behind it to wait is going to the slow lane. However, i haven't tested this with a situation where there is a complete lockup on the line. In that case every train would take the slow lane. 02:10:51 <Cadde> That is why i have suggested to Owen that we get more details about the train that has passed a progsig. 02:11:11 <Eddi|zuHause> that's not possible 02:11:17 <Cadde> Or a signal set as the monitor. 02:11:24 *** Dred_furst [~Dred_furs@cpc3-pool12-2-0-cust451.15-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 02:11:39 <Cadde> What isn't possible? 02:13:55 *** Dred_furst [~Dred_furs@cpc3-pool12-2-0-cust451.15-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [] 02:15:46 <Eddi|zuHause> a signal cannot have a reference to a train 02:16:01 <Eddi|zuHause> there can even be two trains on the signal at the same time 02:16:14 <Eddi|zuHause> or more, if you have newgrfs 02:16:29 <Cadde> Well, "Can't"... Isn't that a matter of changing code. 02:16:50 <Eddi|zuHause> it's more than just code 02:16:59 <Cadde> And i am talking about the last train to go past that signal. (Or possibly have a number of variables as a stack) 02:17:20 <Eddi|zuHause> it's also software design, algorithm complexity and memory usage 02:18:03 <Eddi|zuHause> and if you add that, people will also want information about the train that is waiting at the signal, and that is even mroe impossible 02:18:13 <Cadde> Well, each train has an ID right? I am not talking about passing the entire structure. I am talking about passing the ID so the progsig can query this information on demand. 02:19:13 <Cadde> So that is, once a train pass a progsig or a combo exit (set in the progsig) it will store the id and then there is a condition that can take trainID.maxspeed or likewise. 02:19:35 *** heffer [~felix@static-87-78-98-150.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: heffer] 02:19:36 <Cadde> However, i am not even remotely aware of how ottd works. 02:20:14 <Eddi|zuHause> but that means you need to store two train ids (2x16 bit) in the map array, even for non-progsig-signals 02:20:22 <Cadde> I am just trying to remain positive as i would love to have this functionality. And if i need it badly enough i might learn everything i need to learn to make it happen. 02:21:09 <Cadde> To me, impossible is nothing. It's just a matter of how much work it takes to make it happen whether it's worth the trouble. 02:22:10 <Cadde> And i am looking at this from my experience with Wiremod. In there you can program virtual CPU's and share data with anything placed in the game. 02:22:41 <Cadde> There is even Wire super mario bros... So i just like to think that nothing is impossible. 02:23:04 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, but they don't have a 100MB game state 02:23:13 <Eddi|zuHause> (i presume) 02:23:37 <Cadde> No, they have unlimited space (to the point where Source crashes) 02:23:55 <Cadde> Well, not in the memory leak sense though 02:24:25 <Cadde> More in the, your computer is about to explode but we prefer if the game crashes :D 02:29:06 <chaos95> I think what Eddi means is, the state in those games most likely takes up significantly less memory than in openttd 02:29:44 <Cadde> chaos95: You might be right, i thought of it the wrong way. 02:56:47 *** Cadde [Cadde@c83-249-114-224.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [] 03:25:38 *** water [45a581f3@webchat.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 03:26:32 *** water [45a581f3@webchat.mibbit.com] has quit [] 03:27:31 *** Cadde [Cadde@c83-249-114-224.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #openttd 03:34:42 *** SirSquid1ess [~sirsquidn@175.107.158.132] has joined #openttd 03:43:10 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:959d:928f:89:262d] has quit [Quit: bye] 03:46:41 *** Rhamphoryncus [~rhamph@d198-53-213-246.abhsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: Rhamphoryncus] 03:55:02 *** Pulec [~pulec@static-cl093181068250.unet.cz] has quit [Quit: ( www.nnscript.com :: NoNameScript 4.22 :: www.esnation.com )] 04:05:30 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:15:42 <Mazur> Morning. 04:23:43 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B778A4.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:24:42 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B744AE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 04:35:29 *** amalloy1 [~Alan@c-67-180-16-162.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has left #openttd [] 04:35:58 *** amalloy [~Alan@c-67-180-16-162.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 05:00:05 <Cadde> @vcs 19599 05:00:10 <Cadde> eh... 05:00:17 <Cadde> How does this work? 05:00:42 <Cadde> I need to see changes made since revision 19599 05:03:13 <Cadde> Never mind, found it 05:28:31 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 06:03:32 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:12:51 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 06:18:17 *** tokai [~tokai@port-92-195-196-6.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:20:31 *** tokai [~tokai@port-92-195-116-76.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 06:20:34 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 06:21:16 <Rubidium> zodttd: so now you blame me for going to bed at a reasonable time for my timezone because I have to be at school early? 06:24:10 <Forked> I blame you for the volcano activity on iceland 06:24:16 <zodttd> Rubidium: I'm not blaming you for anything. Though I would like your support, I expressed I would have to explain why such a popular application dissapeared from App Store. Apple pulled it shortly after you stopped speaking as I said they would. When I contacted Apple, they said both parties must come to the conclusion to bring back the app. 06:26:25 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 06:31:15 *** Priski [priski@ihq.in] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:36:50 <Ammler> zodttd: I don't know, if anyone already told you, but please do completely clone openttd trunk and keep the history, so it is easier for everyone to see the changes, all commits without (svn...) for example. 06:37:18 <Terkhen> good morning 06:37:20 <zodttd> Ammler: I am working off the release build within git. 06:37:30 *** lolman_ [~Holygoat@cust247-dsl93-89-128.idnet.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:37:49 <zodttd> Err rephrase. I am working in git, using the release of 1.0.0 which I was told is not in your git. 06:37:57 <Rubidium> Ammler: git doesn't support the way we release, so there's no 1.0.0 in our git repository 06:40:18 <Ammler> ah, I see, sorry then 06:40:53 <Ammler> http://git.openttd.org/openttd/branches/1.0.git/ <-- what's that? 06:41:05 <Rubidium> the 1.0 branch without 1.0.0 06:41:46 <Ammler> yeah, but the only missing part is the release changeset itself, so this should still be easiest? 06:42:49 <Ammler> well, and a parallel branch with trunk of course :-) 06:46:13 <peter1138> git supports branches and tags, but it probably wouldn't work from svn-git 06:47:16 <dihedral> is TrueBrain around? 06:48:19 <Ammler> in 4 hours :-) 06:48:41 <Rubidium> zodttd: I will email Apple as soon as I am confident you have resolved all violations 06:49:09 <zodttd> Rubidium: How can I make sure you're confident / how do I prove so? 06:50:17 <Rubidium> show me that the binary package and source repository doesn't miss anything that would violate, i.e. let me download and review the updated binary package and source repository 06:50:18 <dihedral> with time ;-) 06:50:31 <zodttd> As far as I'm aware, your requests are to add the license.txt & readme.txt in filesystem alongside the binary, and do the same with OpenSFX and OpenGFX. Then make sure they're in the splash as well. 06:50:49 <zodttd> Is this the case? 06:51:01 <dihedral> and the file he was missing required to compile it 06:51:13 <zodttd> The way I was told to go about OpenGFX and OpenSFX was to include them in their tar forms. 06:51:21 <zodttd> Which file? 06:51:43 <zodttd> I included literally the entire project. It requires XCode to compile. 06:51:47 <dihedral> i do not know which one, i only remember Rubidium was missing a file 06:51:49 <Ammler> or in subdirs without removing parts... 06:52:31 <zodttd> You can literally download XCode from Apple for free, run the xcodeproject and click Build & Go. 06:53:17 <Ammler> all base sets zips are distributed with subdirs, so you could also just use those. 06:53:38 <zodttd> Ok cool 07:00:16 <Rubidium> zodttd: at least src/network/core/config.h is missing from the repository, but to test what more is missing simply clone the git repository and test that 07:01:56 <zodttd> Checking where it is located. I know the project I have is complete unless git failed to upload it 07:02:28 <zodttd> Its here 07:02:34 <zodttd> Going to link to it 07:03:28 <zodttd> Ah! The gitignore file blocked it 07:04:01 <dihedral> lol - time make -j8 07:04:02 <dihedral> real 0m26.566s 07:04:02 <dihedral> user 2m42.966s 07:04:02 <dihedral> sys 0m11.697s 07:04:17 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 07:06:24 <zodttd> Making a final compile and updating the sources. Will have a new IPA in a few minutes 07:06:31 <Rubidium> http://rbijker.net/openttd/ipad.diff <- that's roughly the diff I get after removing the projects/openttd directory with sdl/freetype/png/xcode stuff and ignoring the files you moved around and ignoring the deleted makefiles 07:06:52 *** Grelouk [~Grelouk@93.21.14.194] has joined #openttd 07:08:45 <Rubidium> and it shows that network/core/config.h has been removed 07:08:52 <zodttd> Rubidium: Doing a push to the repo with the .gitignore cleaned up so it includes Makefiles and network/config.h 07:09:36 <zodttd> That was due to one of your previous .gitignore's making it's way into the project. Fun times with hidden files. 07:10:04 <chaos95> git doesn't support the way you release? 07:10:08 <zodttd> metwork/core/config.h and rev.cpp are up now 07:10:16 <Rubidium> I'm fairly certain that didn't ignore network/core/config.h 07:10:25 <zodttd> It does 07:10:30 <zodttd> you ignore config.* 07:10:44 <zodttd> config.* 07:10:44 <zodttd> objs/* 07:10:44 <zodttd> src/rev.cpp 07:10:55 <Rubidium> oh, lol 07:11:29 <zodttd> Might want to look into that :) 07:11:51 * Rubidium blames bruce89 07:15:20 <zodttd> Nearly ready for an IPA 07:20:19 *** sunkan [~Tarquin@90-224-108-233-no110.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #openttd 07:20:45 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 07:22:06 * Rubidium will be gone for a while now 07:23:55 <zodttd> Ok Rubidium. I will email you links to the IPA and the update source code. Let me know when you'll be back 07:26:29 <Rubidium> depends somewhat on how long the meeting takes; sometimes it's like 15 minutes, sometimes it's some hours 07:27:54 *** JVassie [~James@nelocat2.gotadsl.co.uk] has joined #openttd 07:28:58 <amalloy> where can i find a list of what changes cargodist makes? i've noticed very different behavior for station ratings, and i'd like to find out where it's documented 07:29:53 <planetmaker> amalloy: get a source checkout of cargodist and compare to the openttd version it is based upon 07:30:08 <planetmaker> and good morning folks 07:31:12 <amalloy> well, while that would certainly work eventually, it seems a bit overkill. it's really not documented anywhere? 07:31:26 <dihedral> hello pm 07:32:42 *** Fuco [~dota.keys@fuco.sks3.muni.cz] has joined #openttd 07:35:38 *** SirSquidness [~sirsquidn@lol.dongues.com] has quit [Quit: lol] 07:36:19 *** SirSquid1ess is now known as SirSquidness 07:39:38 *** NCommander [~mcasadeva@cpe-74-74-175-159.rochester.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 07:47:10 <Ammler> amalloy: I assume you know the wiki page, else you wouldn't ask here ;-) 07:57:48 *** einKarl [~einKarl@95-89-121-65-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #openttd 08:07:21 <zodttd> Rubidium: I sent you an email to rubidium@openttd.org with links to the new IPA and a link to the repo which has been updated. I also included a changelog for you. 08:11:59 <Ammler> if you would make your development public, others could help you to improve without the need to bother Rubi, tt-forums is a good start there :-) 08:12:35 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-188-100-217-067.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 08:12:40 <zodttd> How is it not public? 08:13:22 <Ammler> why you need to send a email to rubi? 08:13:51 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:14:07 *** ptr_ [~peter@c213-89-142-224.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #openttd 08:14:09 * Rubidium is back 08:14:34 <zodttd> Ammler: No worries. Just needed to resolve some issues with a port and licensing. 08:15:00 <zodttd> wb 08:15:02 <Rubidium> http://github.com/zodttd/OpenTTD/blob/de6dc74205e394876b9ab6ef0527df74f21f4c80/SDL8bit/src/video/uikit/MainWindow.xib <- somehow I can't quite read that easily :) 08:15:24 <zodttd> That just controls the splash screen 08:15:35 <zodttd> I can screenshot for you 08:15:57 <planetmaker> you're doing it wrong, Rubidium ! ;-) 08:16:02 <zodttd> It's three license files in scroll boxes labeled for each product, then a play on button. 08:16:35 <Rubidium> planetmaker: tell me how to do it right, i.e. tell me how to install Mac OS X in VirtualBox 08:16:44 <zodttd> Eep! Try VMWare 08:16:48 <zodttd> Should work better 08:16:59 <planetmaker> :-) @ Rubidium 08:17:23 <planetmaker> I know that you tried 08:17:33 <planetmaker> (or I think that I know. whatever) 08:18:11 <Rubidium> zodttd: vmware has always been a hell for me to get properly installed; virtualbox is just dead easy 08:18:42 <zodttd> True. I just know Mac OS X can run in VMWare some how some way. Not sure about VirtualBox. :/ 08:19:04 <Rubidium> new kernel: virtualbox says okay, lets compile a new module. vmware says: huh, hell no, I don't know that kernel... you first need to google for some third party patch to make my code compile with that kernel 08:19:05 <peter1138> Ammler, wow, i agree with you for once :p 08:19:32 <zodttd> ? 08:19:36 <Ammler> for once, I didn't make a request :-P 08:19:48 <Rubidium> ah, good... no zlib 1.2.4 in the ipa 08:20:11 <zodttd> zlib is a part of the iPhone OS and is dynamically linked 08:20:28 <peter1138> is it 1.2.4? hehe 08:20:37 <peter1138> (i doubt it, but you never know) 08:20:46 <zodttd> Oh, I will check in a bit if needed 08:21:24 <Rubidium> libpng is kinda old, but who am I to complain about that 08:21:43 <peter1138> zodttd, just there's a bug in 1.2.4 that breaks content download 08:21:58 <zodttd> Eww, well content download works. So probably not 1.2.4 :D 08:22:29 <Rubidium> does the downloaded content work, that's the real question :) 08:22:56 <zodttd> I will recheck, but it should 08:23:05 <chaos95> there's a bug in openttd that breaks content downloading for me, it's called BaNaNaS 08:23:35 <planetmaker> you're not helpful, chaos95 08:24:27 <chaos95> planetmaker: well the only way that it can be fixed is if BaNaNaS is essentially totally reimplemented to work via http :P 08:24:48 <planetmaker> that was more helpful ;-) 08:25:00 <peter1138> that's odd 08:25:03 <chaos95> until then I'll have to deal with not being able to download content in-game on my lunch breaks 08:25:12 <peter1138> cos my content mirror is http... 08:25:20 <planetmaker> or you could add an exception to your firewall :-P 08:26:40 <chaos95> planetmaker: I'll call IT and tell them to do that :P 08:27:01 <peter1138> gb.binaries.openttd.org - [16/Apr/2010:09:25:14 +0100] "GET /binaries/bananas/newgrf/Japanese_Buildings-2.0.tar.gz HTTP/1.0" 200 739362 "-" "OpenTTD/1.0.0" 08:27:07 <peter1138> yup, looks like http to me 08:27:27 <chaos95> peter1138: but getting the actual content list isn't 08:28:16 <Rubidium> isn't there some socks-over-http proxy stuff? 08:28:29 <Rubidium> I know there is a socks-over-dns thing 08:28:45 *** heffer [~felix@static-87-78-98-150.netcologne.de] has joined #openttd 08:29:06 <chaos95> Rubidium: there are ways around it; I have an ssh tunnel out to a shell, which I can piggyback other tunnels onto 08:29:13 <Noldo> socks-over-ping 08:29:41 <chaos95> but I just haven't got around to doing all the necessary tweaks to /etc/hosts and my ssh config 08:30:24 <chaos95> not to mention I'm not sure that bananas will use an http proxy when attempting to download from content mirrors 08:30:45 <Rubidium> I'm quite sure it won't 08:31:26 <Noldo> http-proxys are so 1995 08:31:36 <chaos95> so yeah that makes it tricky.. I can possibly try something with iptables 08:31:37 *** oskari89 [~oskari89@212-149-205-119.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 08:32:01 <Rubidium> zodttd: that ipa will still be advertised as version 1.0.0, right? 08:32:07 <zodttd> correct 08:32:17 <chaos95> after which I'll write a paper on per-application transparent http proxy configuration 08:33:20 <chaos95> but yeah, if bananas were able to grab the http_proxy environment variable and use said proxy when performing http stuff it would be awesome. 08:34:02 <Rubidium> chaos95: squid + transparent proxying works fine 08:34:23 *** Phazorx [~pavelkoll@77.239.236.193] has joined #openttd 08:34:38 <Noldo> chaos95: write a patch 08:35:52 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 08:40:21 <peter1138> is that environment variable available on all OSes? 08:42:52 <Noldo> propably not 08:43:56 <chaos95> peter1138: nah it's not, that's the problem 08:44:08 <chaos95> although I'd be happy with a setting within the application 08:44:21 <chaos95> Noldo: I may just do that 08:45:25 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1B601.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 08:49:56 *** Priski [priski@89.166.50.66] has joined #openttd 08:51:46 *** amalloy [~Alan@c-67-180-16-162.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has left #openttd [] 09:05:32 <Rubidium> zodttd: the copyright stuff is something that isn't encoded in the ipa, right? 09:05:48 <zodttd> Correct 09:06:05 <zodttd> Wait. Rephrase. 09:15:06 <Rubidium> should I rephrase or are you rephrasing your answer? 09:15:22 <zodttd> Please rephrase for me. Didn't understand completely. 09:16:19 <Rubidium> the "2005-2010 (c) OpenTTD Team" I saw in the snapshot/screenshot of the itunes page, is that coming from the .ipa or from somewhere else (e.g. some edit box on their submission website)? 09:16:42 <zodttd> Somewhere else (iTunesConnect backend) 09:17:07 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-188-100-217-067.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:23:30 <peter1138> OpenTTD © 2002-2010 The OpenTTD team 09:23:36 <peter1138> hmm, 2002? heh 09:23:49 <peter1138> That's what OpenTTD says, anyway 09:23:52 <zodttd> I got it from your website 09:23:59 <zodttd> heh 09:24:05 <peter1138> ah 09:24:08 <peter1138> that's the copyright for the website :p 09:24:21 <zodttd> Oh my! I will change accordingly 09:25:07 <zodttd> Assuming I can do so via the update function. 09:25:40 <peter1138> double check with Rubidium, he's more thorough than me 09:26:05 <zodttd> Ok :) 09:28:24 <Rubidium> peter1138: apparantly ludde started in 2002 09:29:02 <Rubidium> "fun" thing is that even if it's not correct, we're bound by the license to keep the copyright notice intact 09:34:17 <peter1138> heh 09:41:35 *** aber [~Adium@gb049.stw.stud.uni-saarland.de] has joined #openttd 09:42:37 *** aber [~Adium@gb049.stw.stud.uni-saarland.de] has quit [] 09:46:23 <zodttd> Thank you Rubidium. I truly appreciate it. 09:47:15 <zodttd> Thanks to the rest of the OpenTTD Team as well. I will be sticking around here. If you have any requests, concerns, or just anything to talk about, feel free to contact me anytime. 09:48:02 *** aber [~Adium@gb049.stw.stud.uni-saarland.de] has joined #openttd 09:51:26 <dihedral> zottd.... fix some os x bugs :-D 09:51:34 <planetmaker> :-) 09:51:35 <dihedral> and submit the patches :-P 09:51:42 <dihedral> hihi 09:52:04 <dihedral> i bet pm, yexo, or me are happy to skim over them for coding style - as good as we can of course :-P 09:52:13 <dihedral> or a bunch of others ^^ 09:52:21 <planetmaker> sure 09:52:28 <zodttd> Heh. Cool. I will look into them. I have to see how the Mac version was built in terms of libraries/frameworks used. 09:52:50 <zodttd> Cool. I don't mind code being refactored at all. :D 09:52:52 <planetmaker> you'll need cocoa framework. and zlib 09:52:58 <planetmaker> and libpng 09:52:58 <dihedral> well... it would be awesome if it used plain cocoa instead of quarz 09:53:12 <planetmaker> other than that it's not being built using xcode, rather the linux way 09:53:18 <planetmaker> using configure && make 09:53:27 <dihedral> ./confire may i please? ;-P 09:53:33 <dihedral> fuck 09:53:35 <planetmaker> no ;-) 09:53:38 <dihedral> typo just in the wrong moment 09:53:41 <planetmaker> not now, thanks ;-) 09:53:44 <dihedral> :-D 09:55:37 <dihedral> grrr - dns update is taking to damn long! 09:56:03 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:00:56 *** NoobCp [~kvirc@4.63.191.90.dyn.estpak.ee] has joined #openttd 10:01:41 *** heffer [~felix@static-87-78-98-150.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: heffer] 10:04:05 *** lugo [~lugo@mgdb-4db8cf2c.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 10:06:08 *** ptr_ [~peter@c213-89-142-224.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:07:47 <NoobCp> That junction posted yesterday might have been horrid but that scenario map looks rather awesome http://www.tt-ms.de/forum/showthread.php?tid=4464&pid=62091#pid62091 Europe in pretty good detail. 10:13:31 *** paul_ [~paul@e178033157.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd 10:18:06 *** mikk36|work [~mikk36@ntsrv.lakrito.ee] has joined #openttd 10:18:09 <mikk36|work> hey 10:18:28 <mikk36|work> how do i get a blank working openttd.cfg without graphical user interface? 10:19:04 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 10:21:00 <planetmaker> delete it and start openttd 10:21:13 <planetmaker> it will be written automatically upon exiting openttd 10:21:25 <planetmaker> openttd -D will start openttd in dedicated mode as server 10:21:53 <mikk36|work> hm, is it located somewhere else than its own folder? 10:22:14 <mikk36|work> aha, .openttd 10:23:06 *** Pikka [~PikkaBird@c122-108-245-233.kelvn3.qld.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 10:23:14 <dihedral> *cough* readme *cough* 10:23:17 <dihedral> :-P 10:23:38 <mikk36|work> sush... 10:27:07 *** snack2 [~nn@88.192.30.127] has joined #openttd 10:34:59 *** TheMask96 [martijn@sirius.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:37:05 *** nighthawk_c_m [~nighthawk@pD9504696.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 10:41:22 *** TheMask96 [martijn@lust.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 10:42:19 <Cadde> NoobCp: Not big enough, needs more tiles :D 10:43:24 <Cadde> One of these days we are going to see maps that takes a week to scroll across :D 10:47:04 <NoobCp> That's not fun ;/ 10:48:07 <Cadde> After an hour of scrolling you leave the planet :D 10:48:47 <NoobCp> There wouldn't be a whole lot of bulk goods leaving the planet tho 10:48:50 * mecool :) 10:48:50 <Cadde> And we have a new breed of transportation ofc, intergalactic space ships. That hauls space cows 10:48:55 <Forked> heh 10:49:01 <Forked> 10k players on a single map 10:49:05 <Forked> oh happy cloud computing 10:49:31 <NoobCp> Heh 10:58:34 <NoobCp> Ha, game 59 doesn't exist! http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/PublicServer:Archive_-_Games_51_-_60 11:03:50 <__ln__> http://www.ilmavoimat.fi/index.php?id=1149 11:07:14 <NoobCp> Ash in the jets? 11:07:29 <__ln__> correcto 11:09:06 *** KenjiE20 [~KenjiE20@92.0.11.24] has joined #openttd 11:15:01 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@188.109.241.181] has joined #openttd 11:25:16 * mecool brb 11:27:31 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@188.109.241.181] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:28:56 *** Chruker [~no@port113.ds1-vj.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #openttd 11:29:13 *** ptr_ [~peter@wpa-n5-64.kthopen.kth.se] has joined #openttd 11:43:48 *** mecool [mecool@94.128.19.117] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:45:19 *** Neon [~Neon@dslb-088-069-217-077.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 11:51:25 *** OwenS [~owenshep@cpc1-stkn14-2-0-cust562.11-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 11:59:39 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:38b1:b3df:3062:bc0e] has joined #openttd 11:59:42 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 12:01:15 *** fjb is now known as Guest186 12:01:17 *** fjb [~frank@p5485CD11.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 12:08:17 *** Guest186 [~frank@p5485D19D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:24:59 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dbabd1e.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 12:34:17 <NoobCp> For some reason I'm seeing a passengers accepted line on a coal mine tile... 12:35:44 <Rubidium> yeah, they would like some workers 12:35:52 <Rubidium> but not enough for there to be a demand for a station 12:36:11 <SpComb> ship ALL you passengers from the whole map there! 12:36:17 <NoobCp> Yes! 12:36:31 <Rubidium> if there is enough demand in the area (another coal mine and steel mill or so) the station will start accepting passengers 12:36:48 <NoobCp> I've been wondering if oil rigs or factories could be used for that actually, passenger sinks 12:37:12 *** ptr_ [~peter@wpa-n5-64.kthopen.kth.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:37:34 <Rubidium> yup 12:37:39 *** ptr_ [~peter@wpa-n5-64.kthopen.kth.se] has joined #openttd 12:38:11 <NoobCp> Two way transport (freeder shipline) complicates things with the oil rig a tiny bit tho 12:41:11 *** ptr_ [~peter@wpa-n5-64.kthopen.kth.se] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:41:14 *** Grelouk [~Grelouk@93.21.14.194] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:42:45 *** Biolunar_ is now known as Biolunar 12:46:21 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-188-100-211-102.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 12:51:22 <mikk36|work> could someone explain me the meaning of reserve_path ? 12:51:35 <Rubidium> where? 12:51:48 <mikk36|work> in the config 12:52:50 <Rubidium> michi_cc: ^^ :) 12:53:45 <mikk36|work> oh, it makes every signal type act as a pbs signal? 12:56:38 <Eddi|zuHause> more like it shows the path reservations 12:57:21 <Rubidium> isn't that "show_track_reservation"? 12:57:53 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... then i don't know 12:58:12 <Rubidium> why do you think I left it to michi_cc :) 12:58:31 <Eddi|zuHause> src/train_cmd.cpp: seg_state = _settings_game.pf.reserve_paths ? SIGSEG_PBS : UpdateSignalsOnSegment(v->tile, INVALID_DIAGDIR, v->owner); 12:58:49 <Eddi|zuHause> looks like "reserve paths even though no PBS signal is nearby" 12:59:01 <Ammler> http://wiki.openttd.org/Reserve_paths <-- wiki is also quite short about explanation :-) 12:59:10 <Eddi|zuHause> but that doesn't change the meaning of the signal 13:12:17 *** nighthawk_c_m [~nighthawk@pD9504696.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 13:18:02 *** einKarl [~einKarl@95-89-121-65-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:20:17 <Belugas> hello 13:28:32 *** Splex [~splex@n219078149145.netvigator.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:29:12 *** Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF8029.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 13:29:12 <ccfreak2k> The web site asked me what I was doing six years ago. 13:29:20 <ccfreak2k> I don't think it's any of its business! 13:29:48 <blathijs> "The web site?" 13:30:27 <welshdragon> blathijs: http://www.openttd.org/en/ < first line under 1.0.0 13:30:48 <blathijs> http://xkcd.com/565/ 13:31:03 <blathijs> Ah :-) 13:33:28 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:35:30 *** Rhamphoryncus [~rhamph@d198-53-213-246.abhsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 13:47:13 *** sunkan [~Tarquin@90-224-108-233-no110.tbcn.telia.com] has quit [Quit: - nbs-irc 2.36 - www.nbs-irc.net -] 13:49:14 *** Tennel [~Tennel@141.44.228.28] has joined #openttd 13:52:39 *** asilv [~as@h-62-142-160-55.joensuunelli.fi] has joined #openttd 13:53:04 *** Cadde [Cadde@c83-249-114-224.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:53:09 *** Cadde [~cadde@c83-249-114-224.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #openttd 13:54:31 *** ecke [~ecke@188.75.128.2] has joined #openttd 13:56:16 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@cpc7-newt30-2-0-cust443.newt.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 14:01:11 *** aber [~Adium@gb049.stw.stud.uni-saarland.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:05:29 *** Qcco [Kurimus@dsl-tkubrasgw1-fe23dc00-198.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd 14:06:10 *** kyoshiro [~kyo@92.17.233.101] has joined #openttd 14:06:47 *** kyoshiro is now known as Guest191 14:07:37 *** Tennel [~Tennel@141.44.228.28] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.1.1] 14:10:30 *** kyo313 [~kyo@92.17.233.101] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:12:03 *** Kurimus [Kurimus@dsl-tkubrasgw1-fe23dc00-198.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:12:14 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@cpc7-newt30-2-0-cust443.newt.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.3/20100401080539]] 14:17:13 <NoobCp> Are overtaking crossings like those actually effective? Seems to rely on a rather long train spacing, and blind to wether the next track is blocked or not... http://wiki.openttd.org/Double-Tracks 14:18:39 <Pikka> looks like presignals to me 14:18:49 *** nighthawk_c_m [~nighthawk@pD9504696.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 14:19:26 <Pikka> you don't need those big long crossovers if you're using PBS, just have an X between two parallel lines 14:19:42 <NoobCp> Oh yeah, I forgot about PBS 14:20:51 <Eddi|zuHause> that looks very useless indeed... 14:22:12 <Ammler> pbs "overtaking" lines does make sense for >2 lines 14:22:30 <Ammler> else you would need to make the lines bidirectional 14:25:15 <NoobCp> This might work http://wiki.openttd.org/Advanced_path_signal_layouts#Two-way_triple_track_layout 14:25:41 <NoobCp> Thanks for the idea Pikka 14:26:18 <Eddi|zuHause> www.informatik.uni-halle.de/~krause/Klein%20Elsmuenster%20Transport,%2023.%20Maer%201942.png <- a triple track line with bidirectional overtaking in the middle 14:27:56 *** elmz [~elmz@222.80-202-29.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd 14:28:36 <Eddi|zuHause> the trick is, the signal distance must be long enough for overtaking to actually succeed 14:28:53 <Eddi|zuHause> otherwise trains might get blocked by a train coming from the other side 14:29:47 <NoobCp> I think I'll use a four track line instead, don't feel like experimenting with that yet 14:30:40 <NoobCp> LLRR 14:32:32 *** George [~George@212.113.107.216] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:33:19 <Eddi|zuHause> i rarely have use for 4 track lines, and if so, they are separated freight/passenger lines and thus LRLR 14:35:00 <NoobCp> I'm concerned about poor acceleration with 12 tile trains 14:35:15 <Pikka> UUDD UDUD? :P 14:35:19 <nighthawk_c_m> Use 3 engines ^ 14:35:35 <nighthawk_c_m> then the acceleration won't get worse then with one, 14:36:07 <NoobCp> And not 4 or 5 engines? 14:36:14 *** George [~George@212.113.107.216] has joined #openttd 14:40:14 <nighthawk_c_m> well - experiment 14:40:55 <nighthawk_c_m> there is a calculation somwhere, but I dunno where actually 14:41:23 <nighthawk_c_m> But with 12 Tile trains always remember to make the curves at least 12 tiles long too - otherwise you have slowdowns there 14:42:09 <NoobCp> Perhaps not in 1950 but yeah, don't think the scenario I made has enough space for that 14:44:02 *** Polygon [~Poly@x0581b.wh7.tu-dresden.de] has joined #openttd 14:44:45 *** Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF8029.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:49:25 <NoobCp> That article shouldn't link to openttdcoop wiki tho, there's no equivalent load balancer shown 14:51:44 <nighthawk_c_m> well, many junwhich one do you mean? 14:51:55 <NoobCp> the station example in the bottom 14:52:29 <NoobCp> Perhaps I misanderstand the intention of the reference 14:53:10 <nighthawk_c_m> You mean the high capacity railway station? 14:53:15 <NoobCp> Yep 14:53:45 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B744AE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:53:54 <nighthawk_c_m> It should work fine, two incoming tracks that can access every station track - the PBS reserving the track onto a plattform 14:54:03 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B744AE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 14:54:27 <NoobCp> I'm thinking if the station is flowing near capacity both exits will be about equally filled anyway 14:55:24 <nighthawk_c_m> well, you don't need pbs at the end/exit, whoever developed that uses PBS way too much, regular signals do just fine there, and die to train length I think it should run pretty smooth 14:55:46 <NoobCp> die? 14:56:00 <nighthawk_c_m> Usdue to * 14:56:02 <nighthawk_c_m> sorry 14:56:32 <nighthawk_c_m> And regularly I plan 6 - 8 Plattforms for a high capacity line - liek a main Station that recieves a lot of goods or so 14:56:43 <NoobCp> Wasn't thinking of using that example tho 14:58:11 *** paul_ [~paul@e178033157.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [] 14:59:31 <nighthawk_c_m> Stations is a thing of taste + situation + landscape 15:00:08 <nighthawk_c_m> often I find that I have a very good design at hand but can't use it due to landscape limitations, I use nearly no terraforming so ... 15:02:58 <Eddi|zuHause> <Pikka> UUDD UDUD? :P <-- "up" and "down" don't make any sense in a decentralised network :p 15:03:13 <NoobCp> I'm strange, to get myself into the game I'm trying to play on flat land 15:06:35 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dbabd1e.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:07:09 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@94-224-31-113.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 15:26:26 *** Coco-Banana-Man [~Stephan.D@p5B2D9BDE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 15:27:14 *** woldemar [~woldemar@213.178.34.57] has joined #openttd 15:32:00 *** mecool [mecool@94.129.165.110] has joined #openttd 15:32:18 *** Qcco is now known as Kurimus 15:41:41 *** rhaeder1 [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-142-230.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 15:47:33 *** mecool [mecool@94.129.165.110] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:47:40 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-188-100-211-102.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:51:15 *** rhaeder1 [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-142-230.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:00:52 *** mecool [mecool@94.129.147.175] has joined #openttd 16:07:15 *** aber [~Adium@p5B325C30.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 16:10:26 *** Adambean [AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has joined #openttd 16:19:47 *** |NoobCp| [~kvirc@4.63.191.90.dyn.estpak.ee] has joined #openttd 16:19:54 *** Grelouk [~Grelouk@93.21.14.194] has joined #openttd 16:25:02 *** NoobCp [~kvirc@4.63.191.90.dyn.estpak.ee] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:38:09 *** Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF8029.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 16:39:03 *** Polygon [~Poly@x0581b.wh7.tu-dresden.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:41:40 *** Phazorx [~pavelkoll@77.239.236.193] has quit [Quit: Phazorx] 16:50:13 <nighthawk_c_m> can someone explainme how to change a newgrf parameter ? 16:51:21 <Yexo> http://wiki.openttd.org/NewGRF_Settings 16:55:15 *** DaleStan is now known as Guest209 16:55:16 *** DaleStan [~Dale@c-24-12-4-37.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 16:59:50 <Pikka> whoever created those images has good taste in grfs :P 17:02:00 *** Guest209 [~Dale@c-24-12-4-37.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:06:11 <nighthawk_c_m> what do you mean oikka? 17:06:18 <nighthawk_c_m> Pikka .. damn typo 17:11:01 *** Lakie [~Lakie@91.84.251.149] has joined #openttd 17:11:03 <Eddi|zuHause> nighthawk_c_m: most of these grfs are made by him :p 17:11:25 <nighthawk_c_m> :-P 17:11:42 <nighthawk_c_m> I am trying to figure out how to set ecs up so mines don't run dry and so on 17:11:52 <nighthawk_c_m> but I am unsure if I do the parameter thing correctly 17:12:06 <Eddi|zuHause> you need to set the "general behaviour" parameter for each grf 17:12:31 <nighthawk_c_m> oh, for each grf I understood it was only to be set for the basics grf 17:12:35 <planetmaker> hm, one can read parameters of other grfs, right? I wonder why george doesn't use that... 17:13:00 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't know if you can do that 17:13:24 <nighthawk_c_m> well the wikki described it somewhat like that - but maybe I am missunderstanding something here 17:13:30 <planetmaker> I think FIRS does something like that in order to check for compatibility 17:13:56 <planetmaker> being incompatible with some newgrfs only if they set (or don't set) certain parameters 17:14:07 <Eddi|zuHause> i only know that ECS parameters are a huge mess, because "general behaviour" isn't always the first parameter 17:14:15 <planetmaker> he 17:14:34 <planetmaker> sounds like IDs need a change and a re-work of that part 17:15:09 *** Grelouk [~Grelouk@93.21.14.194] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:15:10 <Eddi|zuHause> george said he might change that when he changes the GRF-ID... 17:15:51 <planetmaker> yeah, that's what will be required. 17:16:22 <planetmaker> I think it might really make sense to just set parameters to the base grf. 17:16:29 <Eddi|zuHause> but just changing the parameters is not enough to warrant such a change 17:16:30 <planetmaker> and read those 17:16:47 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: then teach him how to do that ;) 17:17:13 <nighthawk_c_m> but now comes the prize question - how do I know if I set the parameters right? 17:17:25 <Eddi|zuHause> i set them to 12 usually 17:17:51 <Yexo> <nighthawk_c_m> but now comes the prize question - how do I know if I set the parameters right? <- you play the game and see if it behaves as you expect 17:18:00 <Yexo> if it doesn't you post in the ecs topic so george can look at it 17:18:22 <nighthawk_c_m> Yeah, well, wasting time is not really what I am looking for ... 17:19:09 <planetmaker> nighthawk_c_m: then I propose you pickup work instead of playing and chatting :-P 17:20:37 <nighthawk_c_m> :-P 17:21:30 <nighthawk_c_m> I am more or less eeking someone who knows how to set up the ecs parameters - trial and error can take forever depending on how abindant the resources under a coal mine are 17:21:36 <nighthawk_c_m> abundand* 17:29:41 <planetmaker> nighthawk_c_m: the readme for the ecs vectors will tell you 17:30:55 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@94-224-31-113.access.telenet.be] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:33:15 *** str00tz [~a@cm-84.209.5.41.getinternet.no] has joined #openttd 17:45:16 <nighthawk_c_m> think i got it now 17:45:35 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: translators * r19640 /trunk/src/lang/ (dutch.txt portuguese.txt): 17:45:35 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 17:45:35 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: dutch - 2 changes by Yexo 17:45:35 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: portuguese - 12 changes by JayCity 17:46:46 *** murr4y [~murray@89.84-49-66.nextgentel.com] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.1.1] 17:48:54 <andythenorth> hi hi 17:51:27 <Terkhen> hi andythenorth 17:52:39 <andythenorth> @seen frosch123 17:52:39 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: frosch123 was last seen in #openttd 1 day, 20 hours, 54 minutes, and 29 seconds ago: <frosch123> though i have none of them in my world file. no idea what actually pulls them in :p 17:53:01 <andythenorth> I am drowning in "FIRS" bug reports for broken industry placement :| 17:55:21 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590f6d47.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 17:55:33 <andythenorth> ^ he must have sensed that :) 17:56:00 <andythenorth> frosch123: hi hi 17:57:40 *** str00tz [~a@cm-84.209.5.41.getinternet.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:58:14 *** murr4y [~murray@89.84-49-66.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd 17:58:15 * frosch123 assumed this is not the right place to mention that he touched an ipad today 17:58:38 <frosch123> though i was not allowed to burn it :( 17:59:15 <Forked> stomp on it? 17:59:22 <planetmaker> blend it 17:59:32 <Rubidium> planetmaker: :) 17:59:43 <Rubidium> with an apple! 17:59:48 <planetmaker> :-D 17:59:57 *** str00tz [~a@77.17.166.146.tmi.telenormobil.no] has joined #openttd 18:00:13 <planetmaker> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAl28d6tbko <-- similar to that? :-) 18:01:49 <Rubidium> pad smoke, don't breath this :) 18:02:04 <Rubidium> yeah, planetmaker like that :) 18:02:06 *** Coco-Banana-Man [~Stephan.D@p5B2D9BDE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:02:16 <Rubidium> ofcourse why use youtube when you can use the real site 18:02:20 <Rubidium> http://www.blendtec.com/willitblend/videos.aspx?type=unsafe&video=ipad 18:02:29 <planetmaker> well, yes :-) 18:02:35 <planetmaker> first link on google search :-P 18:02:55 <planetmaker> but it's what I remembered 18:03:26 <planetmaker> he, is the ipad version actually already appropriately modified? 18:03:48 *** oal [~olav@5.79-160-122.customer.lyse.net] has joined #openttd 18:03:54 <oal> Hi 18:03:57 <oal> Is the downlaod server down? 18:04:04 <Belugas> how was the experience, frosch123? 18:04:13 <planetmaker> doesn't look like 18:04:38 <oal> A friend of mine is not able to download openttd 18:04:40 <TrueBrain> one of our mirrors is currently down 18:04:43 <oal> Not me either if I try 18:04:45 <oal> Ok 18:04:45 <TrueBrain> let me put it offline ... 18:04:53 *** Alberth [~hat@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 18:04:54 <oal> TrueBrain: Can you change mirrors? 18:05:55 <TrueBrain> oal: try it now 18:06:13 <oal> It works, thanks! :) 18:07:11 <TrueBrain> yw 18:07:58 *** str00tz [~a@77.17.166.146.tmi.telenormobil.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:08:29 <frosch123> Belugas: well, i even hardly use cell phones, so such stuff hardly exaits me. i could watch a slide presentation for the coming industry fair on it, and when i noticed the gravity sensor rotating the screen i could only think about all those misgenerated pdf and ps (from scanners etc) which come in wrong orientation :p 18:08:35 <TrueBrain> (and then to imagine I never read this channel in general without highlight! I am all proud I catched this :p) 18:10:00 *** str00tz [~a@77.17.163.232.tmi.telenormobil.no] has joined #openttd 18:10:02 * Alberth buys TB a beer 18:10:11 <TrueBrain> hmm 18:10:17 <TrueBrain> that sounds like an amazing idea to do tonight 18:11:21 *** Pyr0 [~chatzilla@209.13.177.25] has joined #openttd 18:11:26 <Pyr0> Halo! 18:11:37 <planetmaker> olaH 18:11:53 <Pyr0> Hello 18:12:10 <Rubidium> ehlo :) 18:12:58 <Pyr0> I came here just to thank everyone involved in openttd dev for such a great game 18:13:01 <Pyr0> :) 18:13:32 <planetmaker> :-) 18:14:55 * Belugas nods at frosch123 18:16:28 <Rubidium> frosch123: sounds like my cellphone usage... as long as it can make a phone call without too much hassle it's fine with me 18:16:50 <Rubidium> don't need 8G or whatever is greatest and bestest right now 18:16:52 <__ln__> Pyr0: remember to thank Chris Sawyer for TTD too. 18:17:28 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: rubidium * r19641 /trunk/src/lang/unfinished/irish.txt: -Add: stub for an Irish translation 18:17:29 <Pyr0> I had always thanked him :) 18:18:01 <Terkhen> I tend to drop my cellphone a lot, I always pick the most sturdy looking from the cheap ones 18:18:10 <Terkhen> besides that... I don't care :P 18:18:34 <TrueBrain> Pyr0: how kind of you :) 18:19:52 <TrueBrain> Rubidium: FYI, master is now IPv6 mirror, nl is out of rotation. Please remind me to reset it when it is up again :p 18:20:09 <Rubidium> lennard: ^^ :) 18:21:08 <Eddi|zuHause> irish is a language? 18:21:20 <Eddi|zuHause> i thought they speak english there 18:21:22 <TrueBrain> it is if we say so, not? 18:21:44 <Eddi|zuHause> or is that some gaelic thing like welsh? 18:21:58 <Rubidium> Eddi|zuHause: apparantly it is an official language in the EU 18:22:18 <Noldo> what isn't official language in EU 18:22:26 <Eddi|zuHause> Noldo: luxembourgish 18:22:36 <TrueBrain> he shoot and he SCORES!!!! 18:22:44 <Noldo> *facepalm* 18:22:51 *** Lakie [~Lakie@91.84.251.149] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:23:11 <Rubidium> Noldo: Luxembourgish, Turkish, Romani, Welsh, Scottish Gaelic, Austrian German, Flemish, Belgian French, Frisian, Saami, Serbo-Croatian 18:23:14 <Eddi|zuHause> apparently, they consider it "just" a dialect of german :p 18:23:25 <Belugas> thanks frosch123 18:23:25 <Rubidium> Noldo: semi-official are Catalan, Galician and Basque. 18:23:30 <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause: irish gaelic 18:23:35 <Sacro> and scots is gaelic 18:23:50 <Sacro> basque eh 18:23:57 <Noldo> I wonder about saami 18:24:08 <Eddi|zuHause> Sacro: my teacher once flamed be because "scottish isn't a language" 18:24:20 <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause: it isn't 18:24:27 <Sacro> the language is 'scots' 18:24:34 <Sacro> as are the people 18:24:39 <Sacro> iirc 18:24:56 <Eddi|zuHause> but that's not the answer she gave me... 18:31:03 <Eddi|zuHause> fucking youtube... 18:31:29 <Eddi|zuHause> they screwed with direct downloading again. and they tell me to update flash player... 18:32:39 *** ajmiles [~aj@78-86-188-187.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 18:38:01 <__ln__> Noldo: english only, it's 'sami'. 18:38:07 *** Pyr0 [~chatzilla@209.13.177.25] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.3/20100401080539]] 18:38:40 <Noldo> :] 18:38:55 <__ln__> and what, there was a Mac version of the original Transport Tycoon? 18:39:34 <Eddi|zuHause> unlikely 18:39:40 <Sacro> iirc yes 18:40:09 <__ln__> Eddi|zuHause: likely: http://www.chrissawyergames.com/info.htm 18:42:01 <Eddi|zuHause> can't have been any success when they didn't even release world editor for it 18:46:26 <Rubidium> ln: Saami is English too; http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/saami 18:48:47 <__ln__> Rubidium: The Oxford English Dictionary doesn't recognize that form. 18:49:38 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: terkhen * r19642 /trunk/src/vehicle_gui.cpp: 18:49:38 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: -Add: Sort cargos alphabetically at the "Reffitable to" label in the 18:49:38 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: build vehicle window. 18:51:35 <Noldo> __ln__: so it's Oxford English only now? 18:52:25 <__ln__> Noldo: That's the way I would prefer, but the topic is a little vague. 18:55:11 *** peter1138 changed the topic of #openttd to: 1.0.0 | Website: *.openttd.org (translator: translator, server list: servers, wiki: wiki, patches & bug-reports: bugs, revision log: vcs, release info: finger) | UTF-8 please | No Unauthorised Bots | Full English Breakfast only 19:00:41 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-128-231.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 19:01:59 *** _NoobCp_ [~kvirc@4.63.191.90.dyn.estpak.ee] has joined #openttd 19:02:08 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-128-231.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:02:40 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-128-231.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 19:02:59 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-128-231.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:04:34 <Rubidium> then call them by their main term for general use by the Oxford dictionary: Lappi 19:07:47 * Ammler wonders, why it needs "English only" in the topic while __ln__ is in the channel... 19:08:18 *** |NoobCp| [~kvirc@4.63.191.90.dyn.estpak.ee] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:10:47 <theholyduck> Rubidium, i'm fairly sure the lapp as the scandinavian term for them is a bit derogatory. 19:10:54 <theholyduck> i'm not sure if it transfers to english 19:11:15 *** ajmiles2 [~aj@78-86-188-187.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 19:11:54 <Rubidium> theholyduck: oh yes, the dictionary says that they prefer Sami 19:12:11 <Rubidium> Ammler: because if it isn't there ln would be of no use in the channel 19:12:38 <dihedral> hehe :-P 19:16:59 *** ajmiles [~aj@78-86-188-187.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:17:36 <oal> Is there a way to auto replace all very old vehicles? 19:17:45 <oal> Or auto renew 19:18:11 <Rubidium> yup, just look it up on the wiki 19:18:17 <Rubidium> it's actually called autoreplace and autorenew 19:18:17 <oal> Ok 19:18:27 <Rubidium> it'll also tell what the difference between the two is 19:18:31 <oal> Thanks 19:18:50 <Rubidium> there are some cases where autorenew and autoreplace don't work, but that's usually when the vehicle you want can't be bought anymore 19:19:16 <Rubidium> or you're using NewGRFs that disallow connecting certain vehicles after a certain time 19:21:02 <andythenorth> frosch123: map generator industry placement issues 19:21:03 <andythenorth> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=871731#p871731 19:21:07 <andythenorth> :o 19:21:41 <andythenorth> been reported multiple times. Also a different one about 64x64 maps 19:22:05 <andythenorth> if it's non-trivial I'll FS it tomorrow, my brain is fried today. 19:22:16 <andythenorth> I've seen the issue, but not sure exactly which nightly I was using 19:22:27 *** Polygon [~Poly@p54B46FDD.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 19:24:42 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-26-54-41.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 19:26:12 *** ajmiles [~aj@78-86-188-187.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 19:27:09 *** Lakie [~Lakie@91.84.251.149] has joined #openttd 19:32:29 *** ajmiles2 [~aj@78-86-188-187.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:33:40 *** ecke [~ecke@188.75.128.2] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:37:13 *** Antigon [~Poly@p54B4726B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 19:37:42 *** teeone [oryan@sometimes.hoes.need.to.be.slapped.us] has quit [Quit: changing servers] 19:38:16 *** teeone [oryan@sometimes.hoes.need.to.be.slapped.us] has joined #openttd 19:42:52 *** Polygon [~Poly@p54B46FDD.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:43:12 *** ajmiles2 [~aj@78-86-188-187.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 19:49:30 *** ajmiles [~aj@78-86-188-187.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:51:02 *** ptr_ [~peter@c213-89-142-224.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #openttd 19:52:08 <frosch123> andythenorth: it is intentional that the number of generated industries is not influences by the number of available industry types. so if a normal map contains 10 industrytypes with ten industries each, that makes 100 industries. if only one industrytype is available that will result in 100 industies of that type 19:52:38 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@cpc7-newt30-2-0-cust443.newt.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 19:53:04 * andythenorth hmmms a bit 19:53:22 <andythenorth> so it's a feature not a bug? :P 19:53:56 <frosch123> it was changed just before 1.0. actually to some extent by your request :p 19:54:24 <frosch123> oh, and it also conforms to newgrf specs :) 19:55:13 <andythenorth> it's a bit weird that only 2048x2048 produces crazy results though 19:56:02 <andythenorth> I remember the changes -that's why I want the OTTD version numbers from the (multiple) forum posters who have reported this ;) 19:58:13 <frosch123> there was recently a fs task about hardly any industries being generated, but on asking for a demo savegame, the task author was not able to reproduce it 19:58:37 <andythenorth> frosch123: http://tt-foundry.com/misc/random_industries.png 19:58:48 <frosch123> so, just ask them to post a savegame. a savegame tells everything about used version, used grf version, settings, and generation seed 19:59:21 <andythenorth> yup ok 19:59:35 <frosch123> that looks like a fault of your grf. did you zero the appearence property? 20:00:07 <andythenorth> nope, that would be *really* dumb :) 20:00:26 <frosch123> i.e. ottd first generates at least one industry per type (unless the special industry flag is set, which says to not do so), and then generated the rest according to the probability property. 20:00:38 <andythenorth> except when it doesn't :) 20:00:55 <frosch123> though it only controls the number of "tries to generate an industry". if the map is too hilly there will be less industries of big industries nevertheless 20:01:01 <andythenorth> flat map 20:01:11 <andythenorth> as you said - a savegame would help :) 20:02:19 <andythenorth> http://tt-foundry.com/misc/random_industries_2.png 20:02:32 <TrueBrain> LOL! What happens if you connect 2 ports of your switch with one cable, and if that switch is VERY cheap? 20:02:41 <andythenorth> smoke? 20:02:42 <SpComb> TrueBrain: it fries and never works again 20:02:50 <TrueBrain> no, it is not that bad 20:02:57 <TrueBrain> a 'normal' switch would disable both ports btw 20:02:59 <SpComb> corrupted packets? 20:03:04 <TrueBrain> nope; endless packets 20:03:05 <Alberth> it talks to itself 20:03:07 <TrueBrain> they never expire 20:03:12 <SpComb> if your definition of 'normal' means a managed one... 20:03:14 <SpComb> TrueBrain: well, of course 20:03:15 <TrueBrain> so guess what happens then, when you put such switch in a big network of switches 20:03:23 <SpComb> the whole thing crashes 20:03:24 <SpComb> old hat 20:03:26 <Alberth> black hole! 20:03:26 <andythenorth> frosch123: the second screenie is same everything except 1024x1024 instead of 2048x2048 (and different random seed I guess) 20:03:27 <SpComb> it happens all the time 20:03:30 <TrueBrain> SpComb: even non-managed ones detect that the ports are connected to eachother 20:03:41 <SpComb> never ran into one of those 20:03:45 <TrueBrain> well, nothing crashes .... it just floods the whole darn network with endless (in this case arp) packets 20:03:47 <SpComb> and you can still hook up two switches to eachother 20:04:00 <SpComb> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broadcast_storm 20:04:10 <SpComb> -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Switching_loop 20:04:13 <TrueBrain> in result ... our whole network was completely flooded, not allowing any normal packet to go through ... takes a while to isolate :p 20:04:16 <TrueBrain> stupid roommates :p 20:04:26 <andythenorth> move out 20:04:36 <TrueBrain> it was amuzing 20:04:40 <TrueBrain> they are all on 100mbit switches 20:04:43 <TrueBrain> I have a 1gbit switch 20:04:46 <TrueBrain> but it even killed my switch 20:04:47 <frosch123> andythenorth: well, maybe i failed to estimate the maxima of some variables and it overflows somewhere 20:05:22 <TrueBrain> even in my off hours, I have to troubleshoot networks :( 20:08:05 <andythenorth> frosch123: the only weird thing is that FIRS fails at 2048x2048, but default industries doesn't. Neither does PBI. 20:09:03 <andythenorth> ECS however has the same issue 20:09:46 <George> andythenorth: Fails? What do you mean& 20:10:11 <andythenorth> strange numbers of industries. 20:10:19 <George> It takes 5 minutes to generate the map here, but I can't say it means FAIL 20:10:36 <George> what do you mean STRANGE? 20:11:31 <frosch123> ok, andy, reproduced :) 20:12:20 <andythenorth> George: http://tt-foundry.com/misc/random_industries_ecs.png 20:12:58 <Sacro> TrueBrain: we had a housemate connect a hub and a router that were already connecteed 20:13:11 <George> andythenorth: I see 20:13:19 <Sacro> instant 100% usage and i recived about 10 billion packets in a minute 20:13:44 <Alberth> that should be enough for a lifetime :) 20:14:17 *** Doorslammer [Doorslamme@119.11.30.218] has joined #openttd 20:16:16 <frosch123> haha, RandomRange only takes an uint16 20:16:33 <frosch123> so passing 200704 is troublesome :) 20:19:02 * Terkhen wonders if anyone besides andythenorth uses violet as the land colour for the smallmap 20:19:34 <planetmaker> Terkhen: it can be pretty nice 20:19:37 * andythenorth wonders why everyone doesn't :o 20:19:49 <planetmaker> and I'd assume it's even nicer for those with red/green issues 20:22:38 <Terkhen> dark green is enough to solve them for me... I find violet too dark 20:23:08 <Terkhen> the industries can be seen more clearly, but not the roads 20:23:35 <planetmaker> granted, I use the green contour version 20:29:44 <oal> I'm totally addicted to OpenTTD ... again! :/ 20:31:17 <planetmaker> hehe 20:52:37 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dbabd1e.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 21:11:08 *** oskari89 [~oskari89@212-149-205-119.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 21:21:45 <Rubidium> Q: what error message would you use to tell a cactus can't be built outside the desert and rain forest trees can't be built outside the rain forest? 21:22:10 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: frosch * r19643 /trunk/src/ (core/random_func.cpp core/random_func.hpp industry_cmd.cpp): -Fix (r19120): Industry generation failed for large maps and lots of industry types. 21:22:35 <aber> wrong biocoenosis 21:22:43 <Rubidium> "wrong climate for tree type" <- interferes with climates for the whole landscape, i.e. someone might assume that if the cactus can't be build in the tropic climate it should be build in temperate/arctic 21:22:59 *** Pikka [~PikkaBird@c122-108-245-233.kelvn3.qld.optusnet.com.au] has quit [] 21:23:04 <Terkhen> good night 21:23:14 <Yexo> Rubidium / TrueBrain: is the source for webtranslator public? if so, where I can download it? 21:23:19 <Rubidium> "wrong terrain for tree type" <- interferes with the terrain type setting from the world generation window (terrain type: ... flat) 21:23:23 <Alberth> wrong area for tree? 21:23:28 <Rubidium> Yexo: it isn't public (yet) 21:23:40 <Yexo> ok 21:24:11 <Rubidium> I can't make it public in any case though 21:24:34 <Yexo> oh, why not? 21:25:03 <planetmaker> root pw? 21:25:07 <Progman> "wrong ground (type) for tree type"? 21:25:08 <Rubidium> because I'm not the copyright owner? Because he had plans of making it a separate project 21:25:27 <Yexo> oh, in that way 21:25:34 *** Alberth [~hat@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has left #openttd [] 21:25:39 *** as3 [~Zach@69.80.175.125] has joined #openttd 21:25:42 <Yexo> you're saying I should ask TrueBrain instead of you :) 21:27:00 <Rubidium> yes, although you technically have access to its source code 21:27:22 <TrueBrain> the only reason I never made WT3.0 public, is that I do not want to support it on any other system, as that is kind of impossible :p 21:27:30 <TrueBrain> it is held together with .. well .. lot of glue :p 21:27:41 <planetmaker> :-D 21:27:50 <TrueBrain> WT3.1 is started, but Rubidium shut down the VPS :p 21:27:54 <TrueBrain> (mwhahahaha :p) 21:27:58 <planetmaker> it has a very deserted channel at #webtranslator :-( 21:28:02 <TrueBrain> and yes, you can view the source via your developers account 21:28:09 *** welshdragon is now known as Guest228 21:28:13 <Yexo> just viewing the source wasn't the point 21:28:15 <planetmaker> and http://www.noaddedsugar.net/ is down... 21:28:40 <Yexo> TrueBrain: for you information: I'm (together with Hirundo) creating a meta language for nfo 21:28:40 <TrueBrain> Yexo: then what is? 21:28:56 <Yexo> so far the language files look a lot like the openttd language files 21:29:05 *** Doorslammer [Doorslamme@119.11.30.218] has quit [] 21:29:08 *** Doorslammer [Doorslamme@119.11.30.218] has joined #openttd 21:29:18 <Yexo> so I hoped wt could be used for such projects too 21:29:22 <str00tz> if i made some kinda stupid mistake at the start of a game, can i reset myself ? 21:29:23 <TrueBrain> WT3.0 for sure not 21:29:26 <TrueBrain> it is a complete mess 21:29:31 <TrueBrain> WT3.1 should be able, but it is far from finished 21:29:35 <glx> you need language files for nfo meta language? 21:29:49 <Yexo> glx: yes, for all strings that are part of the nfo normally 21:30:26 <Rubidium> it's not to translate the nfo meta language, but to translate the projects using the language 21:30:41 <Rubidium> (or at least, that's what I understand of it) 21:30:52 <Yexo> ^^that's true, I should've made that clearer 21:31:05 <Eddi|zuHause> str00tz: you can start a game with the same random seed, to get the same map again 21:31:05 <glx> ha that's just grf translations then 21:31:24 <planetmaker> glx: well. 'just' ;-) 21:31:27 <Eddi|zuHause> str00tz: you can get the current random seed from the ingame console 21:31:28 <Yexo> str00tz: open the console (key left of 1 on your keyboard), then type "reset" 21:31:34 <Yexo> eh, sorry, "restart" 21:31:35 <str00tz> Eddi|zuHause, but not in multiplayer right ? 21:31:41 <glx> and meta language just ease the insertion of translations in the grf 21:31:42 <str00tz> Yexo, thankyou :) 21:32:01 <str00tz> Yexo, i get error tho 21:32:01 <frosch123> nfo translation and ottd translation is quite different wrt. control codes, isn't it? 21:32:01 <Yexo> but that's for singleplayer too, not for multiplayer 21:32:05 <str00tz> ahh 21:32:18 <frosch123> i.e. in nfo you have no genders and cases, and you cannot reorder parameters either 21:32:19 <str00tz> dso if i screw up in multi, i ..well, have to just leave 21:32:23 <planetmaker> frosch123: yes. But if you use a meta language you can translate 21:32:27 <frosch123> otoh you have other parameters 21:32:41 <Yexo> frosch123: I didn't like the nfo control codes, so I'm parsing codes that look like those inthe openttd language files 21:32:50 <Eddi|zuHause> nfo-languages really need genders 21:32:51 <frosch123> planetmaker: what do you want to do? 21:33:11 <Rubidium> Progman: good idea, but I doubt it's purely "ground", i.e. soil, that differentiates non-rainforest and rain forest 21:33:13 <frosch123> a metalanguage removes none of the restrictions i mentioned 21:33:22 *** Guest228 is now known as welshdragon 21:33:38 <Rubidium> but then, I've not studied the subject intensely 21:33:38 <planetmaker> frosch123: it doesn't. But it allows to use for those features which are common to use the same syntax 21:34:15 <Yexo> str00tz: move yourself to spectators, then start a new company 21:35:13 <planetmaker> frosch123: and: there might be some feature requests lurking ;-) 21:35:31 <Yexo> <frosch123> i.e. in nfo you have no genders and cases, and you cannot reorder parameters either <- yes, so the grf-translations are a lot simpeler 21:35:45 <str00tz> Yexo, thanks :) 21:37:11 <frosch123> planetmaker: just don't tell mb or similiar :) they might answer to distinguish languages inside action2 to rearrange parameters. (which is not possible in ottd due to desyncs) 21:37:17 <Yexo> but ok, if wt3 isn't useable I'll leave that idea for now 21:37:34 <planetmaker> haha @ frosch123 :-) 21:38:09 <Rubidium> why would mb care about order? As long as it's the German order it's correct. Anything but German isn't correct for a German train set 21:38:32 <frosch123> Rubidium: mb plays french version of ttd 21:38:46 <frosch123> and does turkish translations on ttdp wiki 21:38:56 <Yexo> with some tricky usage of byte "86 rotate down top 4 words on stack" it might actually be possible to rotate parameters in a newgrf string 21:39:10 <frosch123> so, either he is googling all day for train terms in foreign languages, or he knows some languages 21:42:23 <Rubidium> frosch123: definitely googling... after all, how can you know so many trains to play in that guess the train topic? 21:43:16 <frosch123> sounds like tt-forums off-topic :p 21:43:20 <Rubidium> yup 21:45:42 *** Antigon [~Poly@p54B4726B.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:46:24 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: rubidium * r19644 /trunk/src/ (lang/english.txt tree_cmd.cpp): 21:46:24 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: -Fix [FS#3728]: don't allow building cacti outside of the desert or rain forest 21:46:24 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: trees outside of the rain forest area. This to prevent people from thinking 21:46:24 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: planting rain forest trees makes the rain forest bigger and thus adds more place 21:46:24 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: to build a lumber mill. 21:49:40 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dbabd1e.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:49:48 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@cpc7-newt30-2-0-cust443.newt.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.3/20100401080539]] 21:54:43 *** asilv [~as@h-62-142-160-55.joensuunelli.fi] has quit [] 21:58:10 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: rubidium * r19645 /trunk/known-bugs.txt: -Doc: mention the zlib 1.2.3.5-1.2.4 gzeof issue in known-bugs 22:00:19 *** oal [~olav@5.79-160-122.customer.lyse.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:02:47 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: rubidium * r19646 /branches/1.0/ (12 files in 7 dirs): (log message trimmed) 22:02:47 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: [1.0] -Backport from trunk: 22:02:47 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: - Change: Log the _date and _date_fract in the desync log for saved games (r19638) 22:02:47 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: - Fix: Do not allow building cacti outside of the desert or rain forest trees 22:02:47 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: outside of the rain forest area. This to prevent people from thinking planting 22:02:49 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: rain forest trees makes the rain forest bigger and thus adds more place to build 22:02:51 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: a lumber mill [FS#3728] (r19644, r19635, r19634) 22:04:16 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1B601.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:08:12 *** ecke [~ecke@188.75.128.2] has joined #openttd 22:12:24 *** amalloy [~Alan@c-67-180-16-162.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 22:13:14 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-151-212.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 22:13:46 <amalloy> i'm trying to host a game, but i can't figure out how to make it work. i've set up port forwarding on my router, and a random stranger joined my game, but neither my friend nor i can join it evenn via my IP. any ideas? 22:14:05 <amalloy> well, that was fast. my friend was just being dumb. never mind :) 22:14:06 <Cadde> What IP/Port 22:14:14 <Cadde> Good good 22:18:00 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590f6d47.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:18:18 <Rubidium> amalloy: due to the "design" of most consumer internet modems/routers you cannot connect from the internal network to the port forwarded port on the external IP; it is actually quite unusual if it supports it 22:19:56 *** nighthawk_c_m [~nighthawk@pD9504696.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 22:21:27 *** _NoobCp_ [~kvirc@4.63.191.90.dyn.estpak.ee] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:28:20 *** JVassie [~James@nelocat2.gotadsl.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:30:41 *** Biolunar [mahdi@blfd-5d821b9b.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: gn8] 22:33:24 *** snack2 [~nn@88.192.30.127] has quit [Quit: ( www.nnscript.com :: NoNameScript 4.22 :: www.esnation.com )] 22:37:22 *** Chruker [~no@port113.ds1-vj.adsl.cybercity.dk] has quit [] 22:41:12 *** Neon [~Neon@dslb-088-069-217-077.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Something strange must have happened...] 22:45:26 <Eddi|zuHause> why do i have to laugh about the sentence "This is a known feature"? :p 22:53:57 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:54:01 <Rubidium> because you didn't know laughing is a feature of the human body? 22:54:39 <Rubidium> why doesn't var_dump work in C++? 22:56:52 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B744AE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [] 22:57:07 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B7623F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 23:00:52 *** Doorslammer [Doorslamme@119.11.30.218] has quit [] 23:00:55 *** Doorslammer [Doorslamme@119.11.30.218] has joined #openttd 23:01:05 *** ChoHag [~mking@77-44-113-86.xdsl.murphx.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:08:22 *** Adambean [AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has quit [Quit: Gone fishing] 23:28:55 *** ajmiles2 [~aj@78-86-188-187.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:32:25 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-151-212.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:38:47 *** zodttd [~me@user-0c90n1c.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 23:55:45 *** Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF8029.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]