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Log for #openttd on 11th June 2010:
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00:05:18  *** tartanterrorist [~Miranda@5ad4d707.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd
00:05:48  <tartanterrorist> guys, whats the criteria to open the monorail option? a certain amount of money or a certain amount of time?
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00:07:33  <tartanterrorist> anyone?
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00:11:05  <Eddi|zuHause> monorails appear after a certain date (if you don't use newgrfs, most disable monorail)
00:11:20  <Eddi|zuHause> then, you have to click and hold the rail icon, to get to the monorail menu
00:11:20  <tartanterrorist> ah cool
00:11:27  <tartanterrorist> you know what date?
00:11:37  <tartanterrorist> or year
00:11:54  <Eddi|zuHause> short after 2000, i believe
00:12:08  <Eddi|zuHause> maybe 2010
00:12:30  <SmatZ> monorail appears in ~1999
00:12:37  <SmatZ> maglev appears in ~2019
00:12:44  <SmatZ> in temperate climate
00:13:12  <tartanterrorist> bah, 9 years away, how do i cheat and make it available now?
00:13:30  <SmatZ> ctrl+alt+c
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00:14:21  <tartanterrorist> perfect
00:14:44  <tartanterrorist> one last question, is there a reason for oil refinerys having different colours?
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00:15:51  <Eddi|zuHause> factories do that as well
00:16:16  <Eddi|zuHause> it's pure eyecandy
00:16:31  <tartanterrorist> cool cool
00:16:33  <tartanterrorist> thanks
00:16:34  <tartanterrorist> all
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00:19:39  <elho> hmm. is tramway availability encoded in savegames and kept when using it as a scenario?
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00:20:56  <SmatZ> tramway availability is per-company
00:20:59  <SmatZ> (iirc)
00:20:59  <CIA-2> OpenTTD: smatz * r19957 /trunk/src/ (6 files): -Codechange: remove VLW_WAYPOINT_LIST
00:20:59  <CIA-2> OpenTTD: smatz * r19958 /trunk/src/ (station.cpp waypoint.cpp): -Codechange: move common code from Waypoint and Station destructors to BaseStation destructor
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00:22:03  <SmatZ> that holds at least for rails - when one company is offered experimental monorail, it can build monoral track
00:22:08  <SmatZ> while other companies can't
00:22:21  <elho> hmm
00:23:07  <elho> is there another way, to just play a completely new game (settings and tram wise ;)) on a map from an old savegame?
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00:24:08  <SmatZ> I think - rename game to .scn, open in SE, use "reset landscape"
00:24:15  <SmatZ> roads and trams could stay
00:24:19  <SmatZ> some, at least
00:24:58  <elho> reset was what i did not do before, let's try...
00:26:40  <elho> (as it was a 1st Jan 1950 savegame without anything cbuilt)
00:29:20  <elho> nope, still no trams
00:31:34  <Yexo> ddi you actually add a tram newgrf in the game? not just in the main menu?
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01:03:36  <elho> duh, when i did, i just closed the dialog sike all the other settings work instead of hitting apply changes :P
01:04:11  <elho> sweet. just hope the crash warning on doing so does not apply to the stock trams ;)
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01:18:42  <Belugas> applies to anythin you add mid-game
01:18:59  <Belugas> it might or might not crash
01:19:09  <Belugas> it's just a chance taken
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05:26:42  <SmatZ> morning
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06:29:51  <Terkhen> good morning
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07:15:57  <dihedral> morning
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12:05:31  <peter1138> oh hai
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12:10:06  <aditsu> hi, is it possible to change the maintenance interval for all the trains?
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12:12:07  <peter1138> as far as i know, no. only the default, and then individually, but not en-mass :(
12:12:23  <peter1138> (i could be wrong though)
12:12:41  <aditsu> even the default doesn't seem to apply to autoreplace
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12:19:17  <peter1138> well servicing is different to replacement
12:22:11  <aditsu> yes, but when autoreplacing, I would hope the new vehicle to use the default interval
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13:02:39  <Belugas> hello
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13:38:09  <Eddi|zuHause> these swiss people are weird... can't even build a straight line... www.informatik.uni-halle.de/~krause/screenshot6.png
13:40:48  <Alberth> they must have found a faster route
13:41:38  <glx> the loops are nice
13:42:17  <glx> was probably less expensive to build around the mountains instead through them
13:43:03  <Eddi|zuHause> the height differences are the biggest problem, i believe
13:43:37  <glx> that too yes
13:43:50  <theholyduck> Eddi|zuHause, you should see the stelvio pass
13:44:04  <glx> they built using locomotion style ;)
13:44:05  <theholyduck> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Stelvio.jpg
13:44:34  <glx> theholyduck: that's not a train line
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13:44:42  <theholyduck> well true :P
13:44:47  <theholyduck> but trains suck at steep gradients
13:44:49  <theholyduck> even more than cars
13:44:55  <theholyduck> so if you have to do that with cars
13:45:09  <theholyduck> imagine what you'd have to do with trains?
13:45:32  <glx> I just imagine buses and cars with trailer ;)
13:45:51  <Eddi|zuHause> two of them in opposite directions :)
13:46:31  <theholyduck> theres an even longer and bigger zigzag line in romania
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13:47:11  <Eddi|zuHause> there was a road in the andes, but i don't remember where...
13:47:46  <theholyduck> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transfăgărăşan
13:50:31  <Eddi|zuHause> air distance: 5km, height difference: 400m, maximum grade: 3,5%, resulting track distance: 12km
13:52:49  <Eddi|zuHause> (talking about the RhÀtische Bahn again)
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14:12:30  <aditsu> is there a way to change the maintenance interval of a train by more than 10 days at a time?
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14:23:12  <Alberth> you can set a better default value for new trains
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14:53:40  <aditsu> Alberth: yeah but what about all my existing trains?
14:54:54  <Alberth> I don't know of a better way for existing trains :(
14:55:26  <Alberth> I expected that double clicking the number would work, but it doesn't
14:55:58  <aditsu> I expected ctrl-click, but unlike the loan buttons, it does only half (5 days)
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14:59:23  <Alberth> I didn't even consider ctl+click :)
15:00:05  <aditsu> ctrl-click on "borrow" borrows max; ctrl-click on "repay" repays all you can
15:00:38  <Alberth> yeah, so the maintenance interval does just the other thing
15:00:50  <Alberth> doesn't sound very consistent :)
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15:06:27  * Alberth ponders better increment/decrement counts
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15:37:23  <CIA-2> OpenTTD: alberth * r19959 /trunk/src/order_gui.cpp: -Fix (r19889): Disable drag destination highlighting when aborting a drag.
15:49:34  <Eddi|zuHause> hm... ChooChoo could start to learn about tunnels...
15:53:50  <Eddi|zuHause> hm... "The cheapest engine to pull 'NiederbordwagenÄ at full speed (60) is 'BR 152 (E52) (Elektrisch)'" <-- how the hell does one get to that conclusion?
15:54:14  <Eddi|zuHause> s/Ä/'/
15:55:45  * Alberth guesses: looking at max speed of the wagon, then finding the cheapest locomotive with at least that speed?
15:56:12  <De_Ghosty> you also have to look at hp to see how fast it acceleerate
15:56:47  <Alberth> De_Ghosty: then your tracks are too short :p
15:58:17  <Alberth> since Eddi|zuHause didn't sound like that locomotive is a sane choice, I guess hp is not optimal :)
15:58:21  <OwenS> Alberth: Or too hilly :p
15:59:01  <Alberth> only when going up :p
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16:56:15  <Eddi|zuHause> the electrics are _extremely_ more expensive than the steam engines of that time...
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17:20:28  <Belugas> barf... all the cute girls were not really visib
17:20:30  <Belugas> le
17:20:35  <Belugas> fucking crowd :S
17:22:53  <SmatZ> where have you been, Belugas?
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17:28:47  <Belugas> around the F1 circus that's in town right now, SmatZ
17:29:51  <Belugas> so there are many stands with a lot of cars and (obviously) car girls, i was very interested to shhot some pictures, but it was way too crowdy for anythng valuable
17:31:51  <Belugas> i was on downtown as well on notre dame's island
17:31:57  <Belugas> same joke everywhere
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17:34:07  <frosch123> s/car girls/pithussies/
17:45:37  <CIA-2> OpenTTD: translators * r19960 /trunk/src/lang/ (french.txt serbian.txt unfinished/irish.txt):
17:45:37  <CIA-2> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
17:45:37  <CIA-2> OpenTTD: french - 45 changes by ElNounch
17:45:37  <CIA-2> OpenTTD: irish - 51 changes by tem
17:45:37  <CIA-2> OpenTTD: serbian - 2 changes by etran
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18:25:42  <Wolf01> hi
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18:44:48  <Wolf01> -40?
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18:49:17  <Alberth> is there a meaning attached to that number?
18:49:32  <Wolf01> 19960
18:49:39  <Alberth> oh
18:49:53  <Wolf01> if I'm not wrong
18:50:17  <Alberth> the log says you are not
18:51:05  <Wolf01> I should update the sloped roadsops to tip... but I don't have enough will :(
18:51:20  <SpComb> Unlocked r20k Achievement
18:51:33  <Wolf01> 150 points
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19:14:22  <Starn> Hello everyone.
19:18:55  <planetmaker> g'day
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19:31:53  <Belugas> THE DAY IS LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG
19:32:42  <planetmaker> the day's over ;-)
19:32:46  <planetmaker> hi Belugas
19:33:06  <Belugas> 'ts over when the sun's over :S
19:33:10  <Belugas> hey planetmaker :)
19:33:11  <planetmaker> but it was a looong day, working non-stop from 9 - 21h
19:33:46  <Belugas> yurk
19:34:12  <planetmaker> well, there was a short working lunch, but alas... VERY successful :-)
19:34:23  <SmatZ> :-)
19:36:28  * planetmaker gathered several thousand images today ;-)
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19:37:17  <planetmaker> ^ that's by concensus supposed to hook on Belugas :-P
19:37:51  <Alberth> s/images/photos/ :)
19:37:53  <Belugas> ho??
19:37:56  <Belugas> PHOTOS!!!
19:38:07  <Belugas> BIG LENSES!
19:38:08  <planetmaker> :-)
19:38:18  <planetmaker> hm... unique lenses :-)
19:38:21  <Belugas> sight... where are the girls ? :(
19:38:38  <Belugas> several THOUSANDS?
19:38:47  <Belugas> ho... true...  big card
19:39:02  <frosch123> Belugas: even 3d pictures :p
19:39:17  <planetmaker> :-)
19:39:29  <planetmaker> Belugas: only three with my camera ;-)
19:39:45  <planetmaker> The others with ... well ... my work place's camera
19:40:29  <Belugas> wait a sec you there... you now have 2?
19:41:00  <planetmaker> no :-)
19:41:23  <planetmaker> My workplace toy is not my personal one. And it's rather a video camera. Just a very fast one :-)
19:41:57  <planetmaker> And today I got to play - actually rather test for performance - a new 3D microscope :-)
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19:44:26  <Belugas> ho... wow!
19:46:07  <planetmaker> I'm quite impressed I have to admit :-)
19:46:14  <Terkhen> sounds fun :)
19:46:24  <planetmaker> A nice toy... and I was even offered to get one of those :-)
19:48:48  <planetmaker> we will see how it works out :-)
19:49:04  <frosch123> [21:46] <planetmaker> A nice toy... and I was even offered to get one of those :-) <- but you declined in favour of belugas?
19:52:53  <Belugas> well... i've got a nice macro lens, i doubt i could really use a micro lens as well :)
19:53:11  <Belugas> mmh... correction.. my wife has a macro lens... not me:S
19:53:31  <frosch123> :p
19:53:53  <planetmaker> :-P
19:54:26  <planetmaker> Belugas: the field of view is only mm^3- you might want to aim at more usually...
19:54:40  <planetmaker> (at least in cross-section ;-) )
20:04:24  <Belugas> like... VERY small!
20:04:34  <Belugas> good way to practice manul focus ^_^
20:04:54  <Alberth> girls tend to be slightly larger :)
20:06:34  <planetmaker> luckily!
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20:12:14  <SmatZ> 00000A3E  2401              and al,0x1
20:12:16  <SmatZ> 00000A40  84C0              test al,al
20:12:46  <SmatZ> what compiler could generate that :-/
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20:13:44  <SpComb> perhaps it's exploiting some cpu hardware bug side effects for performance optimization
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20:17:43  <Alberth> A intel compiler at a AMD processor? :p
20:17:55  <Wolf01> lol
20:18:43  <Alberth> Wolf01: I read not so long ago, that intel really tweaked the compiler to perform better at their processor
20:19:52  <Wolf01> Yeah, I read it too
20:20:32  <Wolf01> at SlashDot, maybe
20:21:09  <CIA-2> OpenTTD: terkhen * r19961 /trunk/src/ (7 files in 3 dirs): -Codechange: Unify "vehicle is destroyed" errors.
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20:22:41  <SpComb> 39!
20:26:56  <CIA-2> OpenTTD: terkhen * r19962 /trunk/src/lang/ (49 files in 2 dirs): -Cleanup: Remove unused "destroyed vehicle" strings.
20:30:33  <CIA-2> OpenTTD: terkhen * r19963 /trunk/src/vehicle.cpp: -Add: Stop a vehicle after it crashes or is destroyed.
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20:33:45  <CIA-2> OpenTTD: terkhen * r19964 /trunk/src/vehicle_cmd.cpp: -Add: Show an error message when trying to start a crashed or destroyed vehicle.
20:34:16  <frosch123> @calc 39!
20:34:16  <DorpsGek> frosch123: Error: unexpected EOF while parsing (<string>, line 1)
20:34:29  <frosch123> @calc factorial(39)
20:34:30  <DorpsGek> frosch123: Error: 'factorial' is not a defined function.
20:34:35  <frosch123> @calc fac(39)
20:34:35  <DorpsGek> frosch123: Error: 'fac' is not a defined function.
20:34:42  <frosch123> well, too many
20:34:49  <planetmaker> @calc 3!
20:34:50  <DorpsGek> planetmaker: Error: unexpected EOF while parsing (<string>, line 1)
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20:41:41  <Alberth> frosch123: Python thinks it is 20397882081197443358640281739902897356800000000
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20:42:52  <Terkhen> speedcrunch says 2.03978820811974433586e46
20:43:37  <Alberth> close enough :)
20:47:36  <frosch123> hmm, why are the 8 zeros at the end? i count only seven 5-factors in 39!
20:47:58  <frosch123> oh, no 25 has two
20:48:06  <planetmaker> frosch123:
20:48:36  <planetmaker> 5*2*10*20*30*35*32*22*25*12*15
20:49:08  <planetmaker> =10*10*10*10*10*10*10 *x
20:49:14  <frosch123> planetmaker: i did not doubt that there are enough 2-factors :)
20:49:20  <planetmaker> ;-)
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21:09:24  <Alberth> frosch123: it seems, it skips 5 zeroes when multiplying with 25: http://paste.openttd.org/225918
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21:10:07  <frosch123> Alberth: hint, 25 = 5*5
21:10:18  <frosch123> you only get a 0 with every pair of 5 and 2
21:10:31  <frosch123> as every second number has at least one factor 2, only the 5 are limiting
21:10:36  <frosch123> :p
21:10:44  <frosch123> sorry, mathematican :p
21:12:37  <frosch123> oh, he left :s
21:12:52  <frosch123> fail :/
21:13:39  <planetmaker> prime factor analysis? :-)
21:14:02  <planetmaker> then enjoy the prime factors of 39! ;-)
21:14:24  <Wolf01> and 69!
21:15:01  <planetmaker> :-P
21:15:15  <planetmaker> Wolf01: that's usually XX or XY :-P
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21:18:51  <Wolf01> I once amused my friends telling them that the last cypher of the multiplication of all the prime numbers is 0 and how to calculate it (2*5) :D
21:34:02  <andythenorth> "for certain definitions of amused" :P
21:34:33  <frosch123> the sum of two even primes always has an integer root
21:42:18  <SmatZ> "0
21:42:19  <SmatZ> :)
21:43:42  *** KouDy [~KouDy@rb5ck203.net.upc.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
21:56:29  <planetmaker> SmatZ: no ;-)
22:02:12  <SmatZ> planetmaker: now I am completely lost :)
22:02:29  *** bryjen [~bryjen@63.147.94.149] has quit [Quit: Quit]
22:02:34  <SmatZ> but I am happy you had successful day :)
22:02:34  <planetmaker> SmatZ: the only even prime is 2.
22:02:49  <planetmaker> 2+2 = 4; sqrt(2) = 2 = int number
22:02:55  <SmatZ> "two even primes" is just ... 2 and 2
22:02:57  <SmatZ> oh
22:03:00  <SmatZ> [23:42:21] <SmatZ> "0
22:03:02  <SmatZ> you mean this
22:03:08  <planetmaker> yup
22:03:19  <SmatZ> that's my fault, with czech layout, I type "0 instead of :)
22:03:25  <planetmaker> :-P
22:03:27  <SmatZ> :)
22:04:01  <planetmaker> two is the only true odd prime ;-)
22:04:23  <SmatZ> :-)
22:04:30  <planetmaker> but for now: good night :-)
22:04:41  <SmatZ> good night Ingo :)
22:05:36  <frosch123> also night
22:05:42  *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590fc3af.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:05:58  * andythenorth sticks it out and writes some code :P
22:09:02  <Terkhen> good night from me too
22:09:50  <SmatZ> good night, Terkhen
22:19:52  <Eddi|zuHause> how does an AI cause a train crash?
22:21:02  <SmatZ> the same way a human does that
22:21:36  <SmatZ> ignoring signals, removing signals, building track between two trains, flooding depot
22:21:42  <Eddi|zuHause> but why would an AI meddle with that?
22:21:51  <SmatZ> well
22:21:59  <SmatZ> it can build depot at sea level
22:22:07  <SmatZ> and someone else can flood it
22:22:12  <SmatZ> (even itself can)
22:22:22  <SmatZ> *the AI itself
22:23:34  <Eddi|zuHause> i see nothing wrong with the track layout...
22:23:54  <Eddi|zuHause> one train entering a terminus station, another train exiting
22:23:58  <Eddi|zuHause> both crossing paths
22:24:10  <Eddi|zuHause> BOOM!
22:26:15  <Zuu> SmatZ: In the 84-base number that CluelessPlus uses to create unique station names : is zero and ) is one. All numbers are printed as a two-symbol number with a leading zero.
22:26:42  <Zuu> IIRC 'D' is two
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22:27:32  <SmatZ> Zuu: hehehe :)
22:27:35  *** heffer [~felix@static-87-78-98-150.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
22:28:18  <Zuu> I think there are about ten or so symbols that make sense as a smiley before odd combinations are produced.
22:28:24  <SmatZ> :)
22:29:48  <Zuu> I could have used a smiley table that then would allow using other eye-symbols than the colon to give even more combinations but then I would have to have a separate solution for when the smielys run out and other characters are needed just to make it in practice fail proof.
22:30:57  <Zuu> Good night
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22:53:27  <Eddi|zuHause> hmmm... trAIns crashed with "could not build the locomotive"
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23:39:17  <Eddi|zuHause> hm... i have a feeling the level-crossing-prevention penalty doesn't work...
23:39:31  <Eddi|zuHause> there's a bridge directly next to the level crossing, and the vehicles don't use it
23:51:18  <Wolf01> 'night all
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