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00:17:02 *** JVassie [~James@92.27.149.231] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:22:51 *** goblin [~goblin@krlh-5f7262e8.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 00:39:44 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-4db0ecaa.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: All your IRC are belong to us!] 00:49:37 *** afk [~Dre@92.30.25.120] has quit [Quit: Don't follow me] 00:49:57 *** Dreamxtreme [~Dre@92.30.25.120] has joined #openttd 00:50:03 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 01:14:59 *** supermop [~daniel_er@cpe-67-243-25-39.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 01:15:13 <supermop> hello 01:18:35 *** dfox [~dfox@ip-94-113-89-201.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:20:08 <krinn> hi 01:20:51 <supermop> how is it going? 01:26:35 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-83-134-159-152.dsl.scarlet.be] has quit [] 01:30:14 *** KritiK [~Maxim@89-178-132-132.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:46:29 *** KenjiE20 [~KenjiE20@92.11.184.238] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.4] 02:15:35 *** pugi [~pugi@p4FCC5693.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: I reject your reality and substitute my own] 02:49:55 *** nicfer1 [~Administr@190.50.49.241] has joined #openttd 02:50:13 <nicfer1> hi 02:54:42 <nicfer1> did anyone ever think of a trainset with no 'arbitrary' max speed for trains? 02:55:38 *** DanMacK [~DanMacK@bas8-london14-1279480034.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #openttd 02:55:47 <supermop> you mean just use the horse power to calculate how fast it can go? 02:56:01 <nicfer1> horse power, tractive effort and weight basically 02:56:17 <supermop> there is also air drag 02:56:20 <nicfer1> and wagon's speed limits 02:56:55 <supermop> conceivably, if the wagons have a limited speed, so would te locomotive 02:57:23 <supermop> for example, the redline of the engine, or the point at which the wheels melt 02:57:54 <nicfer1> that would become the 'new' speedlimit for locomotives 02:58:13 <krinn> going fine thanks nicfer1 :P (what a late reply) 02:58:18 <supermop> yeah I think people has discussed it before 02:58:46 <krinn> hu, /nicfer1/supermop 02:58:48 <supermop> *have 02:58:49 *** DanMacK [~DanMacK@bas8-london14-1279480034.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [] 02:59:17 <supermop> in 2cc i belive the wagons have no hard limit on speed, 02:59:23 <supermop> just a design speed 02:59:41 <supermop> which they can operate above, but at increased running cost 03:01:45 <supermop> i guess you could imagine 'Rocket' being pushed by an HST at 125 mph 03:02:05 <nicfer1> that way, players will need more planning on how to build the trains so they're fast without making them too expensive to mantain 03:02:15 <supermop> which would cause pretty severe damage to rocket, but at least it would be going that fast 03:03:23 <supermop> the problem is, 03:03:49 <supermop> you often have no way to force a train to drive slower than its potential speed 03:04:19 <supermop> so if a train can easily do 120 mph, but is more expensive to run over 100, 03:04:35 <nicfer1> maglev wouldn't have those 'fixed' limit speeds, or maybe have a very high one 03:04:36 <supermop> there is no way to force it to run at exactly 100 03:05:23 <supermop> if the maglev went fast enough, either the magnetic coils in the track would burn out, or the front f the train would ablate off 03:06:18 <supermop> we could just use 'c' as a hard speed limit, with exponential running cost as one approaces c 03:09:07 <nicfer1> speaking of maglev, I find it somehow 'too much railway change' 03:09:40 <supermop> So have many national networks, 03:09:43 <krinn> or do like in life: increase speed = increase running costs because of decrease reliability 03:10:02 <supermop> currently one one maglev line earns any revenue 03:10:13 <supermop> *only 03:10:32 <nicfer1> I mean, in year 2000 you get monorail, you upgrade all your network only for finding that in 2020 you have to upgrade again to maglev 03:11:11 <supermop> well you could get monorail in 1960, if someone wanted to make an Alweg set 03:11:36 <supermop> but monorail was never intended to be a heavy rail replacement 03:12:30 <nicfer1> in that point I like more the NuTracks system 03:18:15 <nicfer1> and I think one railset changed maglev to be pax-based rather than all-cargos-lightning-transport 03:22:48 <supermop> any set could do that 03:23:06 *** Markavian [~Markavian@CPE-60-224-82-14.wxzr1.win.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:23:29 *** Markavian [~Markavian@CPE-60-224-82-14.wxzr1.win.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 03:26:31 *** rhaeder1 [~quix0r@dslb-094-220-136-037.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 03:30:26 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-220-139-251.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:36:13 *** Markavian [~Markavian@CPE-60-224-82-14.wxzr1.win.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:36:45 *** Markavian [~Markavian@CPE-60-224-82-14.wxzr1.win.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 03:57:40 *** Markavian` [~Markavian@CPE-60-224-82-14.wxzr1.win.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 03:57:40 *** ecke [~ecke@188.75.128.2] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:04:20 *** Markavian [~Markavian@CPE-60-224-82-14.wxzr1.win.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:06:48 *** afk [~Dre@92.30.25.120] has joined #openttd 04:13:38 *** Dreamxtreme [~Dre@92.30.25.120] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:15:20 *** rhaeder1 [~quix0r@dslb-094-220-136-037.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 04:16:37 <nicfer1> it was on ttdpatch where you could configure maglev trains to run on monorail, isn't it? 04:18:49 *** Wakou [~stephen@host86-181-185-82.range86-181.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:27:04 <supermop> it would be possible in ottd as well if someone were to make the appropriate newgrf 04:27:28 *** Kurimus [Kurimus@dsl-tkubrasgw1-fe86de00-46.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd 04:28:27 <glx> openttd can have maglev and monorail at the same time, but as ttdpatch can't most newgrf provide only one type 04:39:28 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:d8c8:b8f0:6c0d:7b5b] has quit [Quit: bye] 04:41:45 *** mkv` [~Markavian@CPE-60-224-82-14.wxzr1.win.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 04:41:45 *** Markavian` [~Markavian@CPE-60-224-82-14.wxzr1.win.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:05:43 *** mkv` [~Markavian@CPE-60-224-82-14.wxzr1.win.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:06:21 *** mkv` [~Markavian@CPE-60-224-82-14.wxzr1.win.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 05:06:52 *** Phoenix_the_II [~ralph@home.deboom.biz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:19:03 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@port-92-195-253-128.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 05:22:42 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-90-159.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 05:56:02 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B75079.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:56:18 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B76897.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 06:02:25 *** Krusen [~as.if@89.184.153.221] has joined #openttd 06:10:10 *** Mucht [~Martin@chello084115143107.3.graz.surfer.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:16:14 <Terkhen> good morning 06:16:53 <supermop> hello 06:17:16 <Mazur> Moar ning. 06:19:46 *** elmz [~elmz@184.213-167-126.customer.lyse.net] has joined #openttd 06:21:14 *** supermop [~daniel_er@cpe-67-243-25-39.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: supermop] 06:22:39 <planetmaker> moin 06:29:51 *** elmz [~elmz@184.213-167-126.customer.lyse.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:46:13 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 06:48:03 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:48:28 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 06:53:01 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:53:27 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 07:06:07 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 07:09:43 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has joined #openttd 07:12:12 *** amkoroew1 [~Heinz@p5B102996.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 07:12:38 *** Br33z4hSlut5 [~static.kp@92.68.154.34] has joined #openttd 07:15:01 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.A98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 07:16:57 *** amkoroew [~Heinz@p5B10348E.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:17:10 *** nicfer1 [~Administr@190.50.49.241] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:20:58 *** Krusen [~as.if@89.184.153.221] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:23:31 *** Pulec [~pulec@static-cl093181068250.unet.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:25:53 *** JOHN-SHEPARD [~JOHN-SHEP@ALyon-158-1-83-196.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:48:48 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.A98.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:00:11 *** perk11 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has joined #openttd 08:06:05 *** dnicholls [~chatzilla@host86-141-93-199.range86-141.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 08:06:33 <dnicholls> hello 08:07:05 <Terkhen> hi dnicholls 08:10:05 <dnicholls> do nightlies always have a minor version one higher than the latest stable? 08:13:42 <Terkhen> dnicholls: they have a version higher than the latest branch; since 1.1.0 is branched already now nightlies use 1.2.0 08:15:26 <Yexo> dnicholls: all work currently done in trunk is going to be part of 1.2, but not of 1.1 08:15:37 <Yexo> bugfixes are backported to the 1.1 branch 08:21:13 <dnicholls> so I perform a version check in Action 7 for \dx12000000, would that match all 1.2.x stables and all nightlies built after 1.1.0 and before 1.2.0 ? 08:21:19 <dnicholls> if* 08:21:48 *** Markavian` [~Markavian@CPE-60-224-82-14.wxzr1.win.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 08:21:48 *** mkv` [~Markavian@CPE-60-224-82-14.wxzr1.win.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:22:20 <Yexo> it'll match every nightly since r22083 and every 1.x.y stable with x >= 2 08:23:00 <Yexo> depending on the things you skip, you might need to use action9 instead of action7 though 08:35:42 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dbc1dba.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 08:36:25 *** Markavian` [~Markavian@CPE-60-224-82-14.wxzr1.win.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:36:47 *** Markavian` [~Markavian@CPE-60-224-82-14.wxzr1.win.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 08:38:03 <dnicholls> and if I want to check for r22084 or later, the Action 7 should check for versions higher than (\dx12000000 + \d22083) ? 08:38:44 <Eddi|zuHause> use \wx1200 and \w22083 08:39:01 <Eddi|zuHause> (well, the other way around) 08:40:52 <dnicholls> ah I see now 08:40:57 <dnicholls> thank you 08:42:20 <Eddi|zuHause> (this will work until r65535, then you'll have to do it more complicated) 08:43:47 <Eddi|zuHause> (by the current rate, that is somewhere around 20 years :)) 08:57:21 *** Markavian` [~Markavian@CPE-60-224-82-14.wxzr1.win.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:57:42 *** Markavian` [~Markavian@CPE-60-224-82-14.wxzr1.win.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 09:05:42 *** elmz [~elmz@184.213-167-126.customer.lyse.net] has joined #openttd 09:09:44 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@88.130.172.100] has joined #openttd 09:14:57 *** Fuco [~dota.keys@fuco.sks3.muni.cz] has joined #openttd 09:16:46 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@88.130.165.90] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:18:19 *** Fuco [~dota.keys@fuco.sks3.muni.cz] has quit [] 09:18:56 *** DDR [~DDR@d142-179-79-208.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:31:01 *** Capeguy [~dcff0181@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 09:31:09 <Capeguy> Hello, anyone here? 09:31:39 <Capeguy> I need some help on cyclotrons... 09:31:53 *** Fuco [~dota.keys@fuco.sks3.muni.cz] has joined #openttd 09:32:10 <Terkhen> @get -3 09:32:10 <DorpsGek> Terkhen: Don't ask to ask, just ask 09:32:34 <Capeguy> O_O 09:32:55 <Terkhen> although I have no clue of what that is (in this context) 09:33:18 <Capeguy> Can anyone help me by sending me a copypaste file of a cyclotron? 09:33:27 *** ar3kaw [~ident@ebt207.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #openttd 09:33:31 <Capeguy> I cant get mine working with the pf.yapf tihngy set to 1/true 09:34:24 <__ln__> wtf is a cyclotron? 09:34:35 <Capeguy> http://blog.openttdcoop.org/2010/01/13/fail-safe-joiners-priorities-and-the-cyclotron-example/ 09:34:39 <Capeguy> All the way down 09:34:57 <Capeguy> It holds a SL train at full speed until there's a ML space 09:36:13 <Capeguy> or http://wiki.openttd.org/Railway_Designs last 2 images. 09:36:22 <Capeguy> I had that savegame, but I cant find it T_T 09:38:57 *** ar3k [~ident@ebt207.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:39:02 <Terkhen> Capeguy: search at their wiki or at the forum for cyclotron 09:39:34 <Capeguy> Searched. Cant find one which is compatitble with my version 09:39:50 <Capeguy> Mine's a little older cause the new ones cant have the copypaste patch 09:40:27 <Eddi|zuHause> there's only one solution then: build one yourself. 09:40:39 <Terkhen> I don't think much people will be playing with old versions here either 09:41:37 <Capeguy> Eddi, I tried making one, with the logics and stuff like that. But it doesn't work cause of the repeative logic of the trains =X 09:42:07 <Capeguy> Terk, yea, unless I can find the copypaste patch for the latest version. 09:43:16 *** zydeco [~zydeco@163.165.16.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #openttd 09:43:43 <zydeco> greetings 09:45:29 <Eddi|zuHause> Capeguy: afaik someone is working on updating it. need to wait a bit. 09:45:53 *** Digit [~digit@88-110-137-235.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:46:06 <Eddi|zuHause> don't know if chills patch pack has it 09:46:18 <Capeguy> Yikes, I'll try and recreate a cyclotron myself 09:46:20 <Terkhen> but building that thing by yourself will probably be faster and you will not need to rely in a patch for playing 09:46:21 <Capeguy> what chills pack? 09:46:24 <Terkhen> hi zydeco 09:49:35 <Capeguy> Terk, what patch are you talking about? 09:51:19 <Terkhen> I did not mention any patch but using search you will find it in no time 09:54:00 *** ar3k [~ident@ebt207.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #openttd 09:57:42 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 10:01:01 *** ar3kaw [~ident@ebt207.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:06:50 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@78-80-200-5.tmcz.cz] has joined #openttd 10:27:14 *** ar3kaw [~ident@ebx191.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #openttd 10:28:09 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-83-134-159-152.dsl.scarlet.be] has joined #openttd 10:33:36 *** ar3k [~ident@ebt207.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:43:30 *** Capeguy [~dcff0181@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:58:08 *** ^ekipS^ [~Spike@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 10:58:13 *** ^Spike^ [~Spike@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:58:26 *** ^ekipS^ is now known as ^Spike^ 10:59:12 *** JVassie [~James@92.27.149.231] has joined #openttd 11:28:34 *** KenjiE20 [~KenjiE20@92.11.184.238] has joined #openttd 11:33:02 *** v3rb0 [~v3rb0@78.84.201.137] has joined #openttd 11:36:43 *** Fuco [~dota.keys@fuco.sks3.muni.cz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:37:02 *** Fuco [~dota.keys@fuco.sks3.muni.cz] has joined #openttd 11:41:00 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-4db1be7e.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 11:41:30 *** perk11 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 11:52:51 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 11:57:12 *** afk [~Dre@92.30.25.120] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:01:12 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-41-16.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:02:09 *** perk11 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has joined #openttd 12:02:32 *** perk11 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has quit [] 12:02:48 *** DanM [~DanMacK@206.191.69.149] has joined #openttd 12:02:55 *** perk11 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has joined #openttd 12:02:59 <DanM> Hey all 12:03:11 *** DanM is now known as DanMacK 12:04:07 *** Dreamxtreme [~Dre@92.30.25.120] has joined #openttd 12:08:16 *** elmz [~elmz@184.213-167-126.customer.lyse.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:08:18 *** elmz [~elmz@184.213-167-126.customer.lyse.net] has joined #openttd 12:09:21 *** vb [4f7225f8@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 12:09:27 <vb> help 12:11:22 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:12:37 <vb> anyone? 12:13:02 <JamesG> What do you need help with? 12:13:24 *** vb [4f7225f8@ircip1.mibbit.com] has quit [] 12:13:41 *** vb [4f7225f8@ircip3.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 12:14:18 <DanMacK> What do you need help with vb? 12:14:56 *** lstor [~lstor@sos1-1x-dhcp341.studby.uio.no] has quit [Quit: leaving] 12:15:00 <Terkhen> @get -3 12:15:00 <DorpsGek> Terkhen: Don't ask to ask, just ask 12:15:42 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd 12:17:12 <peter1138> -3? 12:21:55 <Terkhen> I find it simpler to count its place backwards :) 12:22:33 <vb> help 12:22:37 <vb> so 12:22:45 <vb> why i can't add any new grf while playing? 12:23:03 <vb> i have some grfs but it misses something 12:24:25 <Yexo> because it has never been supported, it can cause any kind of problems ranging from simple graphical glitches to crashes 12:24:29 <Eddi|zuHause> you're going to have to start a new game 12:24:39 <Terkhen> vb: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=51933&hilit=add+newgrf+ingame 12:24:41 <vb> oh my 12:25:00 <vb> but it worked before 12:25:05 <Yexo> no, it didn't 12:25:20 <Eddi|zuHause> it didn't "work" before, it just did not complain enough 12:25:32 <Yexo> there were some cases were it worked, but it caused a lot of trouble because _most_ people didn't know when they were able to use it safely 12:25:32 <vb> yes it did 12:25:45 <vb> :((((((((( 12:25:48 <Terkhen> everything is explained at that thread :) 12:26:02 <vb> i have the firs newgrf 12:26:06 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dbc1dba.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:26:10 <vb> but i don't have any ships to collect water stuff 12:26:33 <Terkhen> hmm... we should have a FAQ 12:26:40 <perk11> vb: enable newgrf developers tools 12:26:43 <Yexo> we have one, or several I think 12:26:46 <Yexo> perk11: wrong advise 12:26:51 <vb> how? 12:26:53 <Terkhen> correction, an updated FAQ 12:27:26 <perk11> newgrf_developer_tools = true 12:27:31 <perk11> in [gui] ection 12:27:35 <perk11> section 12:27:44 <perk11> of openttd.cfg 12:27:51 <vb> ok 12:27:55 <Terkhen> just don't get mad when you get glitches / crashes 12:27:55 <perk11> but use it at your own risk 12:28:03 <vb> ok 12:28:06 <vb> i made a backup save 12:28:32 <Terkhen> but yes, it's not really intended for this, it's called "newgrf developer tools" for a reason 12:28:40 <perk11> some problems may appear after some years 12:28:54 <Yexo> scenario_developer might be a better setting to advise 12:29:02 <Terkhen> yes 12:29:08 <Yexo> it doesn't enable the newgrf inspect button on all kinds of windows 12:29:41 <vb> now what ship mod i need for firs? 12:32:18 <DanMacK> FISH is your best bet 12:33:10 <vb> hmm 12:33:15 <vb> let's see 12:33:47 <vb> no errors after unpausing 12:33:56 <vb> that's good, i added 2 new grf, fish and bauxite wagon 12:34:35 <planetmaker> the errors only become apparent usually after people played for (game) years 12:35:31 <planetmaker> and bauxite wagon... the better guess is opengfx+trains. you can disable engines, if you only need wagons. 12:35:46 <vb> eh? 12:35:57 <vb> i'm using the american trains, even though i don't like american stuff 12:36:28 <Yexo> why are you not starting a new game? apparently you're using trains you don't like and you didn't have any ships 12:36:36 <vb> and nu tracks, which are a PAIN IN THE ass 12:36:41 <vb> i have ships now :D 12:36:51 *** dfox [~dfox@ip-94-113-89-201.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 12:36:54 <vb> by pain in the ass i mean expensive 12:37:28 <vb> also i played like 100 years or so 12:37:53 <vb> only 41 counted because i used the year cheat :)) 12:41:13 *** fjb is now known as Guest2212 12:41:14 *** fjb [~frank@p5DDFC495.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 12:45:13 <vb> ok, so removing nu tracks while playing is not ok 12:48:12 *** Guest2212 [~frank@p5DDFD72F.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:49:54 *** asilv [~as@h-62-142-160-55.joensuunelli.fi] has joined #openttd 12:50:01 <SmatZ> removing any newgrf while playing is not ok :p 12:50:08 <SmatZ> (or adding) 12:51:15 *** pugi [~pugi@p4FCC5839.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 12:52:44 <SmatZ> pugi pugi! 12:53:34 *** Scuddles [~notme@cm129.epsilon84.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #openttd 13:00:01 *** Pulec [~pulec@static-cl093181068250.unet.cz] has joined #openttd 13:03:02 <DanMacK> Smatz, agreed it isn't but if you do do it, be prepared for the consequences 13:04:19 <vb> yes, 2012 is coming 13:05:01 <Chaot_s> hi all has someone got a screnshot for a 3 track terminus i cant get the signaling right. i'm stil to damned stupid to find it out :D 13:05:08 *** DayDreamer [~pouzara@80.95.101.194] has joined #openttd 13:05:47 <Chaot_s> been googling and wikiÃng for hours now :D 13:05:55 <Yexo> a station with 3 tracks and 1 track in and 1 track out? 13:05:58 <Yexo> or something else? 13:06:37 <Chaot_s> 1 in, 1out, 3 trackstation. not ro-ro, terminus :D 13:06:44 <perk11> I'll make it 13:06:59 <Yexo> you can make a terminus station with 2-track station? 13:07:12 <Yexo> and are you using pbs signals or block signals? 13:07:56 <Chaot_s> i tried lots of things, they alway take the midle lane, and the second train que's right in front of it, blocking it's exit :D 13:08:35 <Yexo> put a pbs signal at the end of the entry and remove all signals in front of the station 13:09:35 <vb> yeah 13:09:38 <vb> i just discovered that 13:09:44 <vb> trains kept blocking in stations 13:10:13 <Chaot_s> Yexo : that sounds like a good idea, though. wont that give punishments (points) when a train is forced to turn around? 13:10:38 <Yexo> what kind of punishments are you thinking of? 13:10:38 <Chaot_s> just curious :D 13:11:07 <Yexo> the only penalty there is for turning around is that the train takes longer to reach is destination, which means a lower payment 13:11:17 <vb> i think i got flu 13:11:33 <perk11> Chaot_s: http://perk11.info/tmp/station.png 13:11:36 <Chaot_s> i'm not sure, editing openttd.cfg i saw ome thing that talked about penalty turning around. 13:11:56 <Yexo> that's a pathfinder penalty 13:12:07 <Chaot_s> okay :D just asking :D 13:12:12 <Yexo> just ignore it as long as you don't understand it 13:12:13 <vb> perk, i say remove those 3 signals 13:12:21 <vb> and make the right one as one of the red ones 13:12:30 <vb> but facing the train 13:12:38 <Yexo> perk11: the signals facing the station can be left out 13:12:44 <perk11> I know 13:12:48 <Chaot_s> hmm i cant get the image :S 13:13:53 <SmatZ> http://devs.openttd.org/~smatz/3roro.png 3 variants :) 13:14:19 <Yexo> SmatZ: bottom-left has one signal turned the wrong way 13:14:32 <SmatZ> oh right :) 13:14:46 <perk11> SmatZ: and why use pbs on normal tracks? 13:15:13 <SmatZ> fixed, thanks :) 13:15:21 <SmatZ> perk11: some people do that... 13:15:21 <perk11> and the variant with path-signals is the slowest one 13:15:22 <Yexo> why not? it's easier to use the same signal type everywhere, so always using pbs seems fine 13:15:44 <Yexo> -*=-sdfhjk 13:15:50 <perk11> *variant with presignals is 13:17:02 <Chaot_s> hmm, i had the uper one, wit a one way path on the exit :D 13:17:17 <perk11> it's the worst one 13:17:29 <Chaot_s> that one kept jaming everything in the midle lane :D 13:17:32 <perk11> unless you have a veeery large station 13:17:50 <Chaot_s> i'm just plaing for about 10 day's :D 13:17:51 <perk11> but than you should make more complex, anyway 13:18:11 <Chaot_s> ther is 530 trains for me :D 13:18:17 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:4476:a0e4:72d6:a977] has joined #openttd 13:18:20 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 13:18:30 <Chaot_s> and some rather large stations, (20+tracks) 13:18:34 <Yexo> Chaot_s: either of those 3 will work fine, if the trains jammed on your station you didn't make it exactly like one of those 13:18:35 <Chaot_s> fed with 5 mainlines :D 13:18:51 <perk11> Chaot_s: good for you, I played about a month, before I found out that there are different types of signals 13:19:58 <Chaot_s> i most of the time search for wiki's :D 13:20:12 <Chaot_s> that tends to be helpfull a lot of time's :D 13:21:02 <Chaot_s> perk11 : even though i couldn't load the picture, thanx for the help :D 13:21:13 <SmatZ> hmm why did I name it "3roro", when it is a terminus :x 13:21:18 <Chaot_s> dame goes for SmatZ :D 13:21:30 <Chaot_s> dame = same :D 13:21:34 <Chaot_s> thanx :D 13:22:04 <SmatZ> :) 13:22:36 <Chaot_s> hotkeys do speed up a lot too :D 13:23:00 <Chaot_s> instead of constantly needing to click everything perk11 13:23:19 <perk11> I know 13:26:20 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-220-136-037.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 13:31:23 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:33:44 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd 13:34:03 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:34:47 *** TheMask96 [martijn@gluttony.vhost.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:36:48 <vb> if i set trains to never expire 13:36:54 <vb> i will allways have them avaiable in depot to buy? 13:36:59 <vb> i don't really want that 13:37:00 <Yexo> yes 13:37:31 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd 13:38:02 *** Nite [5472b1fc@ircip3.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 13:38:24 <Nite> Snorre here for chance? 13:38:58 <Chaot_s> if i split a station by removing one midle track, will that still allow me to "transfer" from one part of the station to a other part? 13:39:06 <Yexo> yes 13:39:09 <Nite> yes 13:39:18 <Chaot_s> nice :) 13:39:37 <Yexo> you don't even have to build the middle track, just ctrl+click when building the second part of the station 13:39:40 <Chaot_s> got 22.000 tov coal... 13:39:53 <Chaot_s> that needs some moving :D 13:40:01 <Chaot_s> and no space :) 13:40:07 <Nite> what server? 13:40:16 <Chaot_s> personal desktop 13:40:39 <Chaot_s> kind of getting very huge now :D 13:41:41 *** TheMask96 [martijn@pride.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 13:41:51 <Chaot_s> this game would be unbareble to play via lan / internet :D 13:42:28 <Nite> stationlenght? 13:42:33 <vb> i played on a server where i had like 5 fps 13:42:38 <vb> trains and tracks everywhere 13:42:38 <Nite> @ chaot_s 13:42:42 <vb> everyone was using just 1 company 13:43:00 <Chaot_s> 2048x2048 map, with (leftovers from when it was a lan game) 524Trains of me, and 1500 in total 13:43:22 <vb> oh yeah, and hundreds of years passed in that game 13:43:25 <vb> so it was huge 13:43:26 <Chaot_s> meglev 16 blocks, (32 car's) main transport from hubs :D 13:43:28 <Nite> max stationsize chaot_s ?? 13:43:39 <Chaot_s> max station is 64 i think :D 13:43:40 <Yexo> Nite: doesn't really matter 13:43:47 <Yexo> total number of trains has way more impact 13:44:24 <Chaot_s> it doesn't impact on lan, wan / inet it's unplayeble :D 13:44:27 <Nite> Yexo: i just wanted to know how how long a 22 KT coaltrain has to be 13:44:34 <Chaot_s> eighter disconnect, or laaaaaaag 13:44:55 <Chaot_s> Nite : not a train, its stored on the station. 13:45:02 <Nite> IC 13:45:06 <Chaot_s> and needs to be moved :D 13:45:23 <Chaot_s> and 22Kt in trains... 22.000 / 37 :D 13:45:24 <Nite> ic ic 13:45:41 <Nite> hmmm 13:46:00 <Chaot_s> that would mean.... 595 cars :D 13:46:07 <Chaot_s> 594? 13:46:11 <Chaot_s> 595 :D 13:47:58 <Nite> depending on newgrf waggons u use 13:48:19 *** Skiddles [~notme@cm129.epsilon84.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #openttd 13:48:45 <Chaot_s> adding a lev4 in front and the end... and see :) you need a length of 597 cars and 299 blocks :S 13:48:55 <Chaot_s> normal trainset i think. 13:49:43 <Chaot_s> default coal for maglev takes 37 tons of coal 13:51:20 <Chaot_s> 90 normal trains feed the station, 13 lev's move it from the hub to a energy plant some 900 blocks away :D 13:51:39 <vb> industrial station renewal are nice 13:54:32 *** Scuddles [~notme@cm129.epsilon84.maxonline.com.sg] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:59:16 <Nite> did anything change about the "automatic order view" btw? 13:59:22 <Chaot_s> btw, how come i only transport ~80% of the produced amount. 13:59:43 <Nite> buy a statue chaot_s 14:00:00 <planetmaker> and newer and faster vehicles 14:00:31 <Nite> teh new vehicle = rating up thing sucks for years now 14:00:51 <Chaot_s> while there are l8 trains @a statue? 14:01:00 <Chaot_s> like ... okay :S 14:01:06 <Nite> especially for competition servers, which i happen to not play anymore (but for different reasons) 14:01:38 <Nite> a statue in town raises rating of all stations on its "land" - with its name 14:02:07 *** TheMask96 [martijn@pride.vhost.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:02:13 <Nite> so the "automatic order view" still there permanently? 14:02:42 <vb> fish is so cheap :( 14:03:46 <Chaot_s> i would expect building a statue of yourself would drop your popularity :D 14:04:25 <vb> not in a communist country 14:04:26 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-83-134-159-152.dsl.scarlet.be] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:04:26 <vb> :))) 14:07:35 <Chaot_s> okay, up to 95% :) 14:07:53 <Chaot_s> nearly 4000ton coal :D every month :D 14:08:34 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-83-134-159-135.dsl.scarlet.be] has joined #openttd 14:08:49 <Chaot_s> and it never moved away... its been there since 1950, and its now dec 1538 :D 14:08:57 *** perk11 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 14:09:22 *** TheMask96 [martijn@envy.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 14:12:49 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dbc1dba.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 14:19:53 *** vb [4f7225f8@ircip3.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 14:22:36 <Belugas> hello 14:22:43 <krinn> hi 14:24:05 <CIA-11> OpenTTD: terkhen * r22127 /trunk/src/smallmap_gui.cpp: -Fix: Canals would get drawn as land in the smallmap when using the owner window. 14:33:27 <DanMacK> Fish is a good starter cargo if transported fast... 14:34:57 <Nite> soo ... again ... is the "automatic order view" still there permanently? 14:35:40 <Chaot_s> how can i remove other players (their buildings and stuff) from a savegame played in lan? 14:36:00 <Nite> magic bulldozer? 14:36:18 <Nite> ctrl&C afaik 14:36:24 *** perk11 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has joined #openttd 14:36:32 <Chaot_s> Nite : what is that? i just want theri company's and all to be removed from this game / map :D 14:42:47 <Chaot_s> save and close game, start in server mode, load map, and reset the company id's from console :D (reset_company <ID>) 14:42:58 <Chaot_s> should do the trick :D 14:46:30 <Chaot_s> and it does :D 14:47:21 <Nite> well get into the companies and bancrupt them 14:47:51 *** Dreamxtreme [~Dre@92.30.25.120] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:48:05 <Chaot_s> that means cheating 14:48:16 <Chaot_s> and i don't want to load the cheats menu :D 14:48:24 <Chaot_s> though problem is fixed 14:48:50 <Chaot_s> load it up in a lan game and bankrupt them via console command :D 14:49:08 <Chaot_s> forum and wiki are great. 14:49:40 *** Dreamxtreme [~Dre@92.30.25.120] has joined #openttd 14:50:23 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@78-80-200-5.tmcz.cz] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:50:35 *** TheMask96 [martijn@envy.vhost.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:52:51 *** fjb [~frank@p5DDFC495.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:56:17 <Nite> you can get into the other companies without cheating 14:56:51 <planetmaker> what's the point of 'not cheating' but deleting it on a local server? 14:57:08 *** Dreamxtreme [~Dre@92.30.25.120] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:57:08 *** TheMask96 [martijn@envy.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 14:57:18 <Chaot_s> indeed planetmaker :D 14:57:30 <Chaot_s> lets now discus how stupid i am :D 14:57:49 <Chaot_s> i just don't know what happens when you open the cheats menu 14:58:11 <Chaot_s> wil that be logged, is it shown somewhere 14:59:11 <Chaot_s> i didn't want to be told that i cheated my way to a company with almost 50.000.000.000 14:59:45 <Chaot_s> beacause in the cheat menu you can higher youre money 14:59:59 <Chaot_s> or wont it show up that the cheats menu is used? 15:03:22 *** Dreamxtreme [~Dre@92.30.25.120] has joined #openttd 15:04:19 *** Dreamxtreme [~Dre@92.30.25.120] has quit [] 15:04:20 *** Lakie [~Lakie@91.84.251.149] has joined #openttd 15:05:53 *** ecke [~ecke@188.75.128.2] has joined #openttd 15:06:04 <Terkhen> it shows up what individual cheats were used 15:06:59 *** fjb [~frank@p5DDFC495.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 15:07:08 <Nite> ... woudl be kewl if u see bridges on the (owners)map 15:08:36 <krinn> i've saw one day (i think the wiki but can't refind it) a page showing picture with directions on map, anyone got the link to that? 15:09:04 <Terkhen> Nite: or in all maps 15:09:40 *** DayDreamer [~pouzara@80.95.101.194] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:10:37 <Nite> Terkhen true thats why the "()" 15:11:59 <planetmaker> Chaot_s, it will be logged in detail what cheat you used. But so will be the other actions 15:12:18 <planetmaker> at least mostly... 15:14:57 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-220-136-037.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:17:02 <Nite> no one can tell me about the auto order view :< 15:21:29 *** Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF8B83.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 15:24:56 <Nite> a little yes ort no woudl be enough; is the autoorder view still permanent? 15:25:35 <DanMacK> autoorder view? 15:28:38 <Nite> buhaaa :(( 15:29:15 <Nite> or where they called auto stops? 15:29:31 <Belugas> auto play! 15:29:48 <Belugas> lol... auto-undo!! 15:29:58 <Belugas> mmmh... too much coffee, i guess... 15:30:28 <Nite> auto undo would be awesome :D 15:31:04 <Nite> i mean these greyed out ordersorders with the 15:31:14 <Nite> i guess i have to try it to see 15:31:20 <Belugas> hem. right. 15:31:25 <Nite> i just cant remember their name 15:31:33 <Nite> or was i right? 15:33:01 <Nite> yes i was its called auto orders 15:33:20 <Nite> (or bug FS#4404) 15:38:34 *** Br33z4hSlut5 [~static.kp@92.68.154.34] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:38:35 <Yexo> FS#4404 has been fixed in r21807..r21809, as you can see on the bug report page 15:41:04 <Nite> ok thx 15:42:28 <Nite> still turning the veiw on or off in the interface options would be good 15:44:42 <Nite> i think autoorders are a nice idea BUT mostly they mess up the order list *shakes* 15:45:50 <Nite> also as the limit of orders is 255 will you reach that limit with autoorders faster ? or do only real orders count ? 15:46:29 <Yexo> how do they mess up your order list? 15:46:38 <Nite> (i cant find a forum thread about it) 15:46:44 <Yexo> if you want no autoorders, shouldn't you be using non-stop orders instead? 15:46:46 <DJNekkid> i've noticed on the 'nfo wiki' that CB36 also mentions property 07, 21 and 22... are theese now changeable with CB36 as well as their CB10-11-12 friends? 15:47:44 <Yexo> the way I read the wiki they're just listed there because it are also properties that can be changed, although not by cb36 15:47:59 <Nite> well first they pop up than they dissapear, and secondly they lenghthen the list unnecesarrily, thirdly orders change their number which is confusing. 15:48:24 <DJNekkid> Yexo: that is also how i undersood it tbh, but as they were on the list i were wondering :) 15:48:46 <perk11> Nite: but trains actually go to the stations listed in autoorders, stop there and even pick and unload cargo if available 15:48:55 <Nite> yexo no i do not want nonstop - i want trains to stop every statpoin between the end statoins 15:48:56 <perk11> so aren't they worth to be listed? 15:49:35 <Nite> they aRe worth to be listed! yust not in the process of making the order list 15:50:28 <Nite> they offer usefull info! but also can confuse 15:52:08 <Nite> well i guess it has coem across now, turning them on or off would be more tidy 15:52:09 *** ecke [~ecke@188.75.128.2] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:55:58 <Nite> cya! 15:56:00 *** Nite [5472b1fc@ircip3.mibbit.com] has left #openttd [] 15:56:16 *** Krusen [~as.if@89.184.153.221] has joined #openttd 15:57:05 <krinn> lol look http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/60/Openttd_transport_tycoon-terabass.jpg 15:57:11 <krinn> now that's serious play! 15:58:59 *** goblin [~goblin@krlh-5f720b25.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 16:03:07 <perk11> krinn: why do you need 2 monitors? 16:04:19 <krinn> i have 2 and really i need them :P 16:04:39 <krinn> but that's not mines, and i only have 2 16:05:49 *** Spoons [~faux@molotov.compsoc.warwick.ac.uk] has joined #openttd 16:06:47 <planetmaker> 2 monitors can be *pretty* convenient 16:07:25 <Yexo> indeed, I wouldn't want to work without it anymore 16:07:31 <krinn> i like dev (the text edtior) on left, and keep right for work/test/play 16:07:43 <Terkhen> but four... 16:07:49 * planetmaker neither 16:08:12 <planetmaker> krinn, I do it vice versa ;-) - My editor is on the right. The testing output on the left one 16:08:41 <Yexo> chat+console left, everything else (browser, editor) on the right 16:08:45 <krinn> lol i suppose it have to do with right/left handed part of the brain :p 16:09:37 <planetmaker> well. I've 8 desktops where I cycle through here. One is e-mail + internet. There the browser is left and e-mail right ;-) 16:10:03 <planetmaker> desktops as in virtual desktops on this machine 16:10:21 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d00825d.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 16:10:33 <krinn> i have the usual 4 16:10:56 <krinn> i don't really use them, if i compile... i drop the console there, or for vlc 16:10:59 <Yexo> also 4 for me, and actually that's alreayd too much 16:11:12 <planetmaker> 4 would be enough here, too. 16:11:27 <planetmaker> internet, text processing, data processing, other stuff ;-) 16:11:56 <krinn> dunno how you do, intenet for me should be in all workspace :p 16:12:24 <planetmaker> krinn, yes. But do you have a browser and e-mail window open on every one? 16:12:35 <planetmaker> and it's only distraction from work work 16:13:04 <Yexo> I use webmail, the new app tabs in firefox 4 are really nice 16:13:44 <krinn> no, i just use a mail ringer to told me i have new one 16:14:07 <krinn> and the browser is nether far (for documentation...) 16:14:10 <planetmaker> uh, I used that. That's ueber-annoying 16:14:28 <krinn> lol that's why i disable sound to kept only pic anim 16:14:49 <planetmaker> well, even that. No need. People usually can wait a few hours or till my next distraction ;-) 16:15:26 <krinn> at work i have only 1 monitor 16:15:44 <krinn> it's so shit to work on 1 only 16:16:04 <krinn> i shouldn't had try 2 monitors :( 16:16:10 <krinn> can't get back to 1 now 16:25:15 *** supermop [~daniel_er@rrcs-72-43-171-87.nyc.biz.rr.com] has joined #openttd 16:25:33 <supermop> hello 16:28:26 <planetmaker> hi supermop 16:28:32 <krinn> hi 16:30:08 <supermop> how is everyone 16:30:09 <supermop> ? 16:30:47 <Mazur> everyone :No such nick/channel 16:30:50 * Mazur is well. 16:31:59 <krinn> bored can't find what i'm looking for on the wiki 16:34:01 <supermop> thanks for pointing me to those values, planetmaker 16:34:11 <Mazur> 8 virtual desktops: 1: terminals, 2: free/OTTD Stable, 3: Twitter, 4: Browser, 5: Patience, 6: free/OTTD PS, 7: IRC, 8: EMail. 16:34:25 <supermop> so I cannot just make a switch that switches based on railtype? 16:37:28 <planetmaker> hu? 16:37:38 <planetmaker> Well. yes, you can. 16:37:53 <planetmaker> But the problem is: any depot-only thing doesn't work for the 4 default railtypes 16:38:10 <planetmaker> What you *might* do is the following: 16:38:26 <planetmaker> Do as you do now and additionally replace the default depots as well 16:38:26 *** TheMask96 [martijn@envy.vhost.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:38:55 <planetmaker> E.g. if you're asked to modify the MONO depot, replace that default monorail depot via replace_sprite also by your version 16:39:02 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@78-80-200-5.tmcz.cz] has joined #openttd 16:39:04 <planetmaker> that way it will also work for the default rail types 16:39:22 <planetmaker> except you cannot distinguish rail and erail. Which is not that tragic then, I think 16:39:54 <planetmaker> And it'll have the big advantage, that it is a true 'provides depots only' newgrf, something which I *think* quite a lot of people will like to see 16:40:33 <supermop> ah 16:40:37 <planetmaker> http://hg.openttdcoop.org/nml/raw-file/tip/docs/nml-language.html#block-replacement-replace <-- replace default sprites 16:41:27 <supermop> so can nml let me handle two different rail grfs (default and other) conditionally in the same grf afterall 16:41:28 <supermop> ? 16:41:47 <planetmaker> Please elaborate what you mean :-) 16:42:21 <planetmaker> you can replace depots for 16 railtypes and the 3 default depots. All in one grf. 16:43:24 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A0E7.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 16:43:59 <planetmaker> and you can of course couple any replacement to whatever condition you like 16:44:20 <Yexo> you can replace the depots for more than 16 railtypes, just not at the same time 16:44:31 <planetmaker> that's what I mean :-) 16:44:56 <planetmaker> And I think in current NML one can now provide the railtype label via parameter. 16:45:03 <planetmaker> so... things got a LOT easier to programme 16:45:15 *** TheMask96 [martijn@envy.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 16:45:17 <planetmaker> thanks for that, Yexo & Hirundo :-) 16:45:30 <supermop> ok 16:45:57 <supermop> i really would like to support all of the common rail grfs in just one depot grf 16:46:39 <Mazur> An universal depot. 16:46:54 <Terkhen> :) 16:47:05 <planetmaker> from what I see: not universal. Rather a large abundance of choice for depots 16:47:34 <planetmaker> supermop, the one thing which IMHO needs the biggest thought (from my POV) is: how do you want to let the user choose what depot is assigned to which railtype? 16:48:26 <Mazur> You're right, of course, planetmaker. 16:48:50 <Mazur> The wish was the father of the thought. 16:48:56 <planetmaker> :-) 16:49:08 <supermop> so far, I do not provide for that 16:49:11 <planetmaker> Mazur, there's a universal railtype newgrf. So... technically we have that universal depot already 16:49:22 <Mazur> Cool. 16:49:43 <Terkhen> does that solve the "convert to monorail/maglev problem"? 16:49:50 <Terkhen> or at least helps a bit with it 16:50:01 <supermop> other than allowing someone to modify my grf 16:50:02 <planetmaker> Terkhen, afaik yes. I never used it myself, though 16:50:10 <fonsinchen> damn viewport overlay keeps glitching 16:50:16 <supermop> but i envisioned that if one uses nutracks 16:50:51 <planetmaker> supermop, the only way I currently can imagine is on a per-depot basis: 16:50:57 <planetmaker> one parameter per depot which you have 16:51:02 <Mazur> DIfferent question: You know how I'm building a database of all trains, so is it possible to make a Sandbox with all train grfs, and when starting play remove all but one of them? 16:51:10 <planetmaker> And you assign to that depot a select-able railltype label 16:51:24 <Yexo> planetmaker: so you can't use one depot twice? 16:51:34 <Mazur> I already discovered that oe can no longer add one, even before starting the game. 16:51:35 <planetmaker> Yexo, hm, yes 16:52:04 <planetmaker> Or it'd have to be vice versa. But then you'll have a huge list of railtype labels. But maybe it's better 16:52:08 <Yexo> Mazur: I don't see the point, just start different games each with a single train newgrf 16:52:15 <planetmaker> ^ 16:52:33 <supermop> one has say, 4 different types of rail that are essentially compatible 16:53:11 <supermop> so one could use up to for different depots to taste for the same type of train 16:53:16 <planetmaker> supermop, I'd be quite happy to help you along with that... we'd only need to put that project on the devzone for my convenience ;-) 16:53:34 <Mazur> Yexo, sure, I just realise I can start a randomised game in 2100 with any particular train grf and pause that for the info. 16:53:34 <supermop> ok 16:53:37 <supermop> sure 16:53:42 <planetmaker> yeah. the railtpye --> associated depot way makes more sense probably 16:54:12 * Mazur was too fucused on the scenario way. 16:54:50 <supermop> so if i want a shiny new depot for my 80kmh line, 16:54:57 <supermop> i buy a HSR depot 16:55:03 <planetmaker> yeah 16:55:11 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-220-136-037.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 16:55:14 <supermop> the 80kmh trains can still service there 16:55:31 <Yexo> a parameter for every railtype has the disadvantage that you'll need a parameter even for railtypes not supported in the current game 16:55:37 <supermop> and one could use 80kmh MLSS stations that match it 16:56:33 <planetmaker> Yexo, yes, exactly 16:56:58 <planetmaker> and it has the disadvantage that it'd be not future proof so to say 16:57:07 <planetmaker> but... that is also the case the other way around 16:57:24 <planetmaker> hm... working without label, just with the railtype ID? 16:57:39 <planetmaker> insane? Or feasible? 16:57:50 <Yexo> impossible 16:57:58 <Yexo> railtype ID is grf-local 16:58:36 <planetmaker> hm, ok 16:58:54 <planetmaker> I thought it might not be when I don't define a RTT 16:59:27 <Yexo> I don't think you need a RTT at all for a railtype newgrf 16:59:48 *** zydeco [~zydeco@163.165.16.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:00:29 *** perk11 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 17:08:43 <frosch123> "[MAP REQUEST] Full Scandinavia Map, min. 2048x2048" <- i like the "min." :) 17:09:47 <Eddi|zuHause> scandinavia is tricky. the "common" heightmap sources have no data that far north, and the "usual" world-scaling is totally off in these regions 17:13:40 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: well, don't you play 32768^2 maps? :p 17:13:52 *** TheMask96 [martijn@envy.vhost.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:15:41 <frosch123> i wonder whether all games i ever played would add up to 2048x2048 17:17:19 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: if you only played TTO-sized maps, that would be 64 games 17:17:21 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause, http://www.ngdc.noaa.gov/mgg/global/global.html can give you height maps centred on any geographic location if I understand that correctly 17:17:27 <planetmaker> or rather complete DEMs 17:17:46 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: i know for sure that i played something bigger than 256x256 only once 17:17:58 <frosch123> 512x512 or 512x256 17:18:26 <frosch123> i guess the latter 17:18:35 <Eddi|zuHause> i managed to connect the two ends of a 2048x1024 map once 17:18:42 <frosch123> i might have started on a 512x512 map once, but quickly considered it to be way to big 17:18:48 <Eddi|zuHause> but not fill the full width 17:19:37 <Eddi|zuHause> it was on daylength 8, i believe, and i played from 1920 to the 1980's 17:21:07 <Terkhen> http://tmintt.eu/content/srtm-dem-conversion-gdal <-- lately I have been using steps 1 and 3 of this tutorial; gdal_translate can convert directly to PNG using -ot Byte -of PNG 17:21:23 *** TheMask96 [martijn@sloth.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 17:22:21 <supermop> can I just have an undefined dustbin category that gives any railtypes I haven't planned for a generic depot? 17:24:18 <planetmaker> supermop, you can have the player enter a parameter (numerically). Which then can be translated to a railtype label 17:24:35 <planetmaker> the UI would suck though - or do you know how RAIL looks as uint64? 17:25:06 <planetmaker> (similar way your grfID looks like ingame ;-) ) 17:25:33 *** ecke [~ecke@188.75.128.2] has joined #openttd 17:26:36 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-4db1be7e.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:28:44 <Eddi|zuHause> a HEX input would be easier than decimal 17:29:17 <planetmaker> easier would also be input as text ;-) 17:29:47 <Eddi|zuHause> not if someone makes a non-textual label ;) 17:30:24 <Eddi|zuHause> a label can be any random uint32 value 17:31:17 <planetmaker> I know. Such person has to be punished, though 17:32:01 <supermop> hm 17:32:16 <supermop> I should think about this more when I am not at work 17:33:58 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dbc1dba.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:34:37 <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: programmatically, the railtype label "RAIL" can be translated to an uint32 (in little-endian notation) by "ord('R')+256*(ord('A')+256*(ord('I')+256*ord('L')))" 17:35:39 <Eddi|zuHause> gives 1279869266 here 17:37:38 <Eddi|zuHause> "ord('R')" is a function to get the internal (usually ASCII) representation of the letter 'R', it's implemented in most programming languages 17:38:21 <supermop> that is a little over my head 17:38:43 <Eddi|zuHause> just start "python" from the console and enter the above string without the "" ;) 17:39:05 *** Bluelight [~chatzilla@151.80-203-100.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd 17:43:03 <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: actually, for you as grf author this is totally irrelevant. the grf doesn't care how the parameter is entered, you can use any 4-byte parameter value in an action 6 to replace the railtype label 17:49:35 *** Skiddles [~notme@cm129.epsilon84.maxonline.com.sg] has quit [Quit: o] 17:50:32 *** pugi [~pugi@p4FCC5839.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: I reject your reality and substitute my own] 17:53:12 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-78-102-233-148.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 17:53:13 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-4db1be7e.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 17:56:00 *** Bluelight [~chatzilla@151.80-203-100.nextgentel.com] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.13/20101203075014]] 18:03:14 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B25B.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 18:05:38 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 18:11:07 *** v3rb0 [~v3rb0@78.84.201.137] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:14:09 *** Bluelight [~chatzilla@151.80-203-100.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd 18:18:00 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has joined #openttd 18:21:58 *** ZirconiumX [561b9bc6@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 18:23:06 * ZirconiumX wonders why whenever I've been on in the past few weeks, LordAro has never been on 18:27:19 <ZirconiumX> lol 18:27:34 <ZirconiumX> A Class 172 Turbostar will have fewer seats than a Class 150 Sprinter it replaces[ 18:28:51 *** Bluelight [~chatzilla@151.80-203-100.nextgentel.com] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.13/20101203075014]] 18:42:17 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.A98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 18:48:21 *** Phoenix_the_II [~ralph@home.deboom.biz] has joined #openttd 18:51:35 *** Alberth [~hat@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 18:51:38 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 18:54:50 *** JOHN-SHEPARD [~JOHN-SHEP@ALyon-158-1-83-196.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 18:58:33 <TrueBrain> @op 18:58:36 *** mode/#openttd [+o TrueBrain] by DorpsGek 18:58:42 *** mode/#openttd [-b *!~shmore@dhcp-0-12-17-51-3b-2d.cpe.mountaincable.net] by TrueBrain 18:58:46 <TrueBrain> @deop 18:58:49 *** mode/#openttd [-o TrueBrain] by DorpsGek 18:59:25 *** dfox [~dfox@ip-94-113-89-201.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:00:21 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:00:43 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has joined #openttd 19:03:08 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 19:03:16 *** zydeco [~zydeco@163.165.16.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #openttd 19:04:11 *** ZirconiumX [561b9bc6@ircip1.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 19:06:41 <dihedral> hello 19:06:41 *** elmz [~elmz@184.213-167-126.customer.lyse.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:06:58 *** elmz [~elmz@184.213-167-126.customer.lyse.net] has joined #openttd 19:08:16 <zydeco> greetings 19:09:52 <dihedral> hello zydeco 19:19:59 *** orudge` [~orudge@owenrudge.net] has joined #openttd 19:20:02 *** mode/#openttd [+o orudge`] by ChanServ 19:20:38 *** orudge [~orudge@owenrudge.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:45:45 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B25B.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: oO] 19:46:42 *** ar3k [~ident@ebx191.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #openttd 19:48:02 *** dihedral [~dih@znc.noaddedsugar.net] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net] 19:48:17 *** dihedral [~dih@znc.noaddedsugar.net] has joined #openttd 19:48:43 <dihedral> @logs 19:48:43 <DorpsGek> dihedral: http://irclogs.qmsk.net/channels/openttd 19:52:27 <__ln__> dihedral: there's this thing called bookmarks 19:53:26 <dihedral> which i do not keep across multiple computers 19:53:47 *** ar3kaw [~ident@ebx191.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:54:05 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm sure there are functions for this available 19:54:09 *** orudge` is now known as orudge 19:54:13 <Eddi|zuHause> depending on browser 19:54:16 *** Kurimus [Kurimus@dsl-tkubrasgw1-fe86de00-46.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:56:01 <krinn> dihedral, understood? never redo @logs or you'll die ! 19:56:12 <Alberth> you can also bookmark the link at every computer :p 19:56:50 <Alberth> (I already did mine, so need to do that one) 19:57:02 <krinn> or just, well, maybe do @logs and lick on the link because you have a cool irc program :) 19:57:08 <dihedral> i refuse to use such tools 19:57:24 <dihedral> krinn, and who are you? 19:57:43 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-24-200-141.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 19:57:49 <Eddi|zuHause> a newbie who thinks he figured out how we talk to each other :p 19:58:15 <krinn> got the answer so 19:58:48 <__ln__> dihedral: consider purchasing a computer that comes with the OpenTTD logs bookmark preinstalled. 19:59:28 <dihedral> i know __ln__ is a bitch in a lot of cases, but a new guy? :-P 20:00:34 *** Kurimus [Kurimus@dsl-tkubrasgw1-fe86de00-46.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd 20:00:47 <__ln__> krinn: yes, who are you? 20:02:19 <krinn> strange question, how you'll answer to that one ln ? 20:03:41 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-83-134-159-135.dsl.scarlet.be] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:03:49 <__ln__> i answer: i have always been here 20:04:01 <glx> confirmed 20:04:16 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host220-174-dynamic.60-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 20:04:21 <Wolf01> hello 20:04:26 <krinn> hello 20:04:29 <SmatZ> hello 20:04:29 <__ln__> 'notte, Wolf01 20:04:39 <krinn> oh, my answer is so: i've not always been here 20:04:56 <Wolf01> not yet __ln__ :D 20:05:06 <krinn> and i'm sure glx could confirm 20:05:14 <__ln__> krinn: fine. so what's your shoe size? 20:05:53 *** Regiovogel [~Miranda@nrbg-4dbfd2cb.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 20:05:54 <krinn> 42 20:05:59 <Regiovogel> good evening 20:06:00 <dihedral> "Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep" 20:06:08 <dihedral> s/empty/__ln__/ 20:07:48 <Regiovogel> i've got a small question regarding the window system/nested widgets... 20:08:29 <Regiovogel> i have made some kind of acceleration graph, based on the other graph windows, it shows the speed of a train over time 20:08:59 <Regiovogel> and i'd like the caption to get the company color of the vehicle's owner. but... how? 20:09:09 <Eddi|zuHause> Alberth is the GUI-Guy 20:09:24 *** Wakou [~stephen@host86-181-185-82.range86-181.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 20:10:00 <Regiovogel> regarding other windows, i *thought* it should be enough to set "owner" of the window to the respective company, but the caption stays gray 20:10:32 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-220-136-037.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:11:01 *** Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF8B83.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:11:22 *** Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF8B83.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 20:11:34 <Regiovogel> Eddi|zuHause: i was aware of that, but thanks ;) 20:11:40 *** ^ekipS^ [~Spike@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 20:11:49 <Wakou> Hi folks. Is there any way I can get the stable or beta to run in 32bpp extra zoom or do I have to compile from source? 20:11:59 <Eddi|zuHause> Regiovogel: have you checked how it's done in the vehicle lists? 20:12:00 <Wakou> I am using openSuse Linux 20:12:24 <Eddi|zuHause> Wakou: there is no extra zoom in stable or beta 20:12:42 *** ^Spike^ [~Spike@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:12:42 *** ^ekipS^ is now known as ^Spike^ 20:12:43 <Wakou> Eddi|zuHause> TY, saves me trying.. 20:12:51 <Regiovogel> Eddi|zuHause: i compared it to the VehicleViewWindow and couldn't spot any obvious differences 20:13:05 <Wakou> its off to ./configure patch SVN etc etc for me then 20:14:55 <Regiovogel> well, the caption widget in the VehicleViewWindow is identified by VVW_WIDGET_CAPTION which wasn't the case for my graph window, but this didn't change anything 20:14:55 <Wakou> No plans to incorporate the extra zoom into the game as standard? For me it is 1/2 the game without it, I need it to see exactly what signals are up to etc 20:15:46 *** Chillosophy [~Chillosop@ip91350749.adsl-surfen.hetnet.nl] has joined #openttd 20:22:20 <Regiovogel> i think i might have found it... 20:23:53 <Terkhen> Regiovogel: do you have a screenshot of the graph? 20:24:27 <Regiovogel> yes, it's working now. the owner has to be set after InitNested is called... 20:24:56 <frosch123> yes, InitNested resets everything 20:25:06 <Regiovogel> Terkhen: just a moment, please ;) 20:25:10 <frosch123> btw. do you use svn, hg or git? 20:25:35 <Regiovogel> the code doesn't look very nice by now, but it works 20:25:43 <Regiovogel> i'm using svn 20:26:06 <peter1138> <3 git 20:26:16 <frosch123> your fix instructions read so complicated :) why don't you add a diff ? 20:26:19 <Eddi|zuHause> for local patch development, hg or git might be more appropriate 20:27:06 <JamesG> I'm setting up git to develop my patch, how do I get git to give me a patch file for all changes made since the repository was created? 20:28:07 <Regiovogel> frosch123: i thought for changing only some characters this would be easier, i'll add a patch next time ;) 20:28:16 <Eddi|zuHause> JamesG: "git show" with appropriate options maybe? 20:28:36 *** amkoroew1 [~Heinz@p5B102996.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:28:47 <CIA-11> OpenTTD: frosch * r22128 /trunk/src/rail_gui.cpp: -Fix [FS#4530]: Build-station-window showed wrong selection when reopening. (Regiovogel) 20:28:47 <frosch123> anyway, thanks for the report :) 20:29:47 <Regiovogel> you're welcome :) 20:30:10 <Rubidium> Wakou: palette animation fails with extra zoom, and there are some other conceptual issues I can't recall right now 20:30:15 <Regiovogel> i'll give git a try, but as i'm usually a bit short on time at the moment i'm using it rather for coding around a bit... 20:30:26 *** amkoroew [~Heinz@p5B102996.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 20:31:01 <Rubidium> Wakou: not to mention that "32bpp extra zoom" seems to be the reason to force changes in the game that shouldn't be changed 20:32:18 <Alberth> Eddi|zuHause: I can go home, it seems :) 20:32:25 <Wakou> Rubidium>Ty it just seeems a shame that it is not more widely avaiable 20:34:28 <JamesG> Eddi|zuHause: I'll look into that, was using git format-patch origin/master before 20:34:31 *** guru3_ [~guru3@81-235-164-123-no21.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #openttd 20:34:44 <Rubidium> also the extra zoom works with exactly one of the 6 blitters, which means it's far from complete, and completeness of a feature is one of the requirements for inclusion 20:34:46 *** guru3 [~guru3@2002:51eb:a47b::1] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:35:51 <supermop> what exactly is a blitter? 20:37:00 <Regiovogel> hah, finally got it working... 20:37:03 <Regiovogel> Terkhen: http://temp.sebastian-sperling.de/acceleration-graph.png 20:37:29 <Alberth> supermop: the piece of hardware/software that actually draws sprites onto the screen 20:37:48 <Alberth> (or rather, the video memory) 20:38:09 <supermop> i wonder what was the etymology behind that choice of name 20:38:23 <Rubidium> "blit" = BLock Image Transfer, so it's about copying bits of images around 20:39:17 <supermop> so it should be 'BlITer' 20:40:18 <Regiovogel> the graph shows the acceleration of a train when empty/fully loaded... i'm planning to add two labels to show the max. speed and needed time for this 20:43:17 <Regiovogel> at the moment i didn't actually clone a vehicle, actually it is a bunch of copy-paste of some code... 20:45:15 <Regiovogel> would it actually be possible to calculate something like this with a "real" cloned vehicle? it would be needed to change the speed (and for the empty/loaded calculation the weight and te) to get the right values... 20:46:36 *** ar3kaw [~ident@ebx191.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #openttd 20:50:57 <Terkhen> hmm... I expected more difference 20:51:57 <Terkhen> Regiovogel: I'm not sure, but it would be quite hacky 20:52:19 <Regiovogel> the example was from the turbo train from NARS, thus the small difference 20:54:13 *** ar3k [~ident@ebx191.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:54:53 <Regiovogel> currently i've extended the ground vehicle cache to hold the empty and loaded values, and yes, it looks quite hacky 20:55:05 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-220-136-037.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 20:55:31 <Terkhen> from my experience, *any* changes to the ground vehicle cache can cause big changes in performance (for better or worse) 20:56:04 <Regiovogel> well, i've not done a real game with that yet 20:58:03 <Regiovogel> it might be that caching these values isn't really needed and could be calculated when needed 20:59:19 <Terkhen> some people are still falling for that fake chris sawyer post 21:00:04 <Regiovogel> GetAcceleration calls some functions of the vehicles to get needed values (e. g. speed), would it have an impact on performance when changing this to parameters instead? 21:00:52 <Terkhen> I don't know 21:01:09 <Eddi|zuHause> the entire thread should have been locked... imho 21:02:23 <Regiovogel> i'll try that out when i've got some spare time... would surely save some code duplication 21:02:36 <Terkhen> I don't know enough about how class methods work at a lower level to be able to discern what option would be faster, but at first glance it seems to me that adding parameters would in the best case not affect performance 21:02:41 <Terkhen> what code is duplicated? 21:03:39 <Regiovogel> oh, well, err... i have copy-pasted GetAcceleration... ;) 21:03:55 <Terkhen> ah, in your patch, I see 21:04:17 <Eddi|zuHause> does the name "Sufkop" mean what i think it means? :=) 21:05:59 <Regiovogel> Eddi|zuHause: regarding what he wrote... maybe ;-D 21:08:23 <Regiovogel> if changing the functions to get their input values from parameters doesn't have an influence, my code might get quite readable... 21:11:32 * Regiovogel wonders if there might be a DBXL 0.9 on some day in the future... 21:12:11 <DanMacK> Some day 21:12:15 <Regiovogel> mb is so cruel ;) 21:12:51 <Regiovogel> a nice screenshot every now and then, something here, something there... 21:13:46 <Regiovogel> well, in the meantime, there's UKRS2 :) 21:14:13 <DanMacK> And NARS :P 21:15:05 <Regiovogel> don't know why, but i like the british vehicles more... 21:19:44 <Regiovogel> i think that most germans would rather say british trains are "ugly" (at least most people i know think so), but... i like them :) 21:21:32 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@s55978e11.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 21:22:13 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:22:16 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has joined #openttd 21:24:34 * DanMacK likes trains of all kinds, although German ones are cool 21:25:35 <supermop> can't argue with the beauty of an HST... 21:25:57 <supermop> with plenty of yellow up front 21:26:21 *** DDR [~DDR@d142-179-79-208.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 21:27:20 * Regiovogel would like to see, hear and smell a real HST... 21:27:41 <Regiovogel> watching youtube videos is good, but nothing can replace reality :-D 21:27:58 <Belugas> hem... 21:28:05 <Eddi|zuHause> i have never understood why british trains must be yellow at the front 21:28:52 <valhallasw> visibility= 21:28:55 <valhallasw> = 21:29:19 <valhallasw> dutch trains need to have a white front, although museum trains are not required to 21:30:08 <Eddi|zuHause> in germany, it's simply forbidden to step on the tracks. what does one need visibility for? 21:30:23 <__ln__> crossings 21:30:29 <Eddi|zuHause> if you need visibility, you switch on the lights. 21:30:59 <SmatZ> not all crossings have lights 21:31:06 <Eddi|zuHause> crossings have lights and bars on their own. and crossings without lights have to be announced by train whistle 21:31:13 <SmatZ> nor bars 21:31:13 <Regiovogel> we have crossings in germany, too... 21:31:22 <SmatZ> true 21:31:27 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@78-80-200-5.tmcz.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:31:33 <SmatZ> maybe that's because of deaf people 21:31:38 <SmatZ> who can't hear it coming 21:32:09 <supermop> also, why not? 21:32:15 <Eddi|zuHause> still, the train's headlights will be waaay more visible than any kind of coloured front 21:32:27 <supermop> the headlights might burn out 21:32:28 <valhallasw> of course, 30 years back there were deaf people, too, and the white front was not required in NL, then 21:32:31 <__ln__> Eddi|zuHause: you need to have pretty big lights if they are supposed to make the train more visible in broad daylight 21:32:37 <valhallasw> supermop: because it's ugly 21:32:42 *** Krusen [~as.if@89.184.153.221] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:33:01 <Regiovogel> german trains don't have too bright headlights... 21:33:20 <supermop> trains primary function is not to be decorative 21:33:29 <Regiovogel> they are more like... position lights 21:33:38 <__ln__> Eddi|zuHause: and the observer isn't (hopefully) observing the lights from directly ahead, but a less optimal angle. 21:34:06 <supermop> also, the train might be parked on a track, turned off 21:34:28 <Eddi|zuHause> in broad daylight, a red engine will probably be more visible (as in different from its surroundings) than a yellow engine 21:34:36 <supermop> in which case it needs to be visible to any other train travelling on those tracks 21:34:49 <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: no. that's what signals are for 21:34:53 <supermop> human eyes respond most strongly to yellows and greens 21:35:03 <__ln__> i remember hearing about a research that shows yellow+black is actually the most noticeable color combo for engines. 21:35:24 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: i haven't seen many tiger-trains around :p 21:35:26 <supermop> what if the signal breaks? 21:35:46 <supermop> why have yellow/black striped fronts here, but not mandatory 21:35:47 <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: a broken signal must be interpreted as showing "stop" 21:36:03 *** pugi [~pugi@p4FCC5839.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 21:36:15 <supermop> what if the wiring was bad and it falsely shows green, 21:36:39 <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: that must never ever happen. 21:37:02 <supermop> if one has to paint the front of a train anyway, you might as well paint it the most visible color you can 21:37:12 <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: at that point, the train's visibility will not help at all 21:37:21 <supermop> it will not hurt 21:37:42 <__ln__> http://c.photoshelter.com/img-get/I0000amYV5wK1IOs/s/750/750/Black-and-Yellow-Locmotive http://image.shutterstock.com/display_pic_with_logo/205741/205741,1220843850,1/stock-photo-old-yellow-and-blue-locomotive-engine-in-need-of-restoration-against-blue-sky-17094085.jpg http://static.bigstockphoto.com/thumbs/6/9/4/large/496897.jpg 21:38:39 <supermop> the above argument is like saying that there is no point wear a helmet on a motorcycle, because if you go over the handlebars at 60 mph, the helmet isn't going to help 21:40:01 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: to my statement "i have not seen many tiger trains" you reply with photos of trains i have never seen. what's the point? :) 21:40:21 <__ln__> Eddi|zuHause: now you can't say you haven't 21:40:37 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: i can still say it. 21:40:49 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: nobody said everything i say must be true :p 21:42:02 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@78-80-200-5.tmcz.cz] has joined #openttd 21:42:50 *** perk11 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has joined #openttd 21:43:16 <__ln__> i'm searching the logs to find a proof for the opposite 21:46:21 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:46:25 <__ln__> unsuccessfully 21:47:07 <peter1138> hmm 21:47:33 <peter1138> anyone know if it's possible for SDL to report whether the mouse movement event is from a mouse or tablet? 21:47:41 * peter1138 is suspecting it's not... 21:49:54 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dbc1dba.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 21:55:53 *** valhalla1w [~valhallas@s55978e11.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 21:59:57 <Eddi|zuHause> i'd suppose there are too many abstraction layers inbetween 22:01:27 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@s55978e11.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:05:18 <zydeco> an iPhone port of sdl reported multiple touches as multiple mice 22:06:19 <Zuu> Last time I looked, I found different APIs to access a tablet on Windows and on Linux. 22:06:54 <Zuu> Maybe you can find an abstraction layer if you look at eg Inkscape/Gimp source code. 22:08:50 <Regiovogel> well, time to go to bed... 22:08:53 <Regiovogel> good night, guys! 22:08:58 <SmatZ> good night Regiovogel 22:09:15 *** Regiovogel [~Miranda@nrbg-4dbfd2cb.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: good bye] 22:10:38 <Zuu> What might be possible for SDL is to tell if the mouse run in absolute or relative mode and if it is in absolute mode, it is quite probable a tablet. 22:12:04 <Zuu> But as said above it could be that even the idea of relative/absolute mouses devices have been abstracted away. 22:13:29 <Belugas> NIGHT ALL! 22:13:35 <Alberth> night Belugas 22:13:58 <SmatZ> good night Belugas 22:14:33 *** krinn [~krinn@98.227.101-84.rev.gaoland.net] has quit [Quit: Quitte] 22:17:37 *** DDR [~DDR@d142-179-79-208.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:17:45 <__ln__> what's 'to understand' in latin? 22:18:59 *** Alberth [~hat@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has left #openttd [] 22:20:03 <peter1138> basically i want an app to not use mouse warping if it can determine that a tablet is being used 22:20:09 <peter1138> because... well... 22:20:16 <peter1138> i can add it as a flag 22:20:24 <peter1138> but doing it automatically would be great 22:22:30 <CIA-11> OpenTTD: smatz * r22129 /trunk/src/saveload/afterload.cpp: -Codechange: use simpler check to test if there any towns in the game 22:28:40 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A0E7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:29:31 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-220-136-037.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:33:10 *** DanMacK [~DanMacK@206.191.69.149] has quit [Quit: Bye for now!] 22:35:05 *** shmore [~shmore@dhcp-0-12-17-51-3b-2d.cpe.mountaincable.net] has joined #openttd 22:36:15 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d00825d.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:44:43 *** Fast2 [~Fast2@p57AF8B83.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:45:51 <Wolf01> 'night 22:45:56 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host220-174-dynamic.60-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 22:47:39 *** asilv [~as@h-62-142-160-55.joensuunelli.fi] has quit [Quit: asilv] 22:54:54 <Terkhen> good night 22:58:31 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-83-134-159-135.dsl.scarlet.be] has joined #openttd 23:05:17 *** Chillosophy [~Chillosop@ip91350749.adsl-surfen.hetnet.nl] has quit [] 23:08:17 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-24-200-141.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:08:58 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@brln-4dbc1dba.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:09:18 *** Kurimus [Kurimus@dsl-tkubrasgw1-fe86de00-46.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:09:33 *** zydeco [~zydeco@163.165.16.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Quit: miscellaneous hardware exception error] 23:11:53 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@cpc7-newt30-2-0-cust37.newt.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 23:12:00 *** goblin [~goblin@krlh-5f720b25.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:19:44 *** perk11 [~perk11@81.17.157.195] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! 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