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00:02:29 *** Bilge [~bilge@92.28.197.104] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:05:37 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@cpc7-newt30-2-0-cust37.newt.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:10:36 *** fjb [~frank@p5DDFEFB3.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:15:13 *** fjb [~frank@p5DDFEFB3.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 00:18:00 *** Intexon [~Intexon@blk-222-147-135.eastlink.ca] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:23:59 *** Intexon [~Intexon@blk-222-147-135.eastlink.ca] has joined #openttd 00:24:38 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 00:38:11 *** sllide [~jari@ip565eb113.direct-adsl.nl] has joined #openttd 00:42:46 *** DoubleYou [~jkuckartz@ppp118-209-69-162.lns20.mel4.internode.on.net] has joined #openttd 00:59:53 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@78-80-200-5.tmcz.cz] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:14:18 *** fjb is now known as Guest4310 01:14:20 *** fjb [~frank@p5DDFEACB.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 01:21:51 *** Guest4310 [~frank@p5DDFEFB3.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:29:29 *** sllide [~jari@ip565eb113.direct-adsl.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:29:37 *** dfox [~dfox@ip-94-113-17-246.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 02:14:42 *** DDR [~DDR@66.183.113.68] has joined #openttd 02:23:57 *** Intexon [~Intexon@blk-222-147-135.eastlink.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:25:33 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-142-237.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 02:26:04 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:a5ab:7709:f10f:1675] has quit [Quit: bye] 02:31:28 *** Eddi|zuHause2 [~johekr@p54B74011.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 02:31:29 *** rhaeder1 [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-138-005.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:31:34 *** dfox [~dfox@ip-94-113-17-246.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:36:06 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B76B54.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:05:18 *** mikegrb [~michael@mikegrb.netop.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:05:29 *** mikegrb [~michael@mikegrb.netop.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 04:32:58 *** snorre [~snorre@c6529BF51.dhcp.bluecom.no] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:33:13 *** snorre [~snorre@c6529BF51.dhcp.bluecom.no] has joined #openttd 04:55:49 *** Eddi|zuHause3 [~johekr@p54B760DE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 04:56:30 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc18-aztw25-2-0-cust185.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 05:02:57 *** Eddi|zuHause2 [~johekr@p54B74011.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:10:30 *** KouDy [~KouDy@188.75.190.58] has joined #openttd 05:11:04 <Terkhen> good morning 05:30:45 <andythenorth> hi Terkhen 05:31:02 <supermop> hello 05:36:34 <planetmaker> moin 05:37:16 <supermop> hm have to drive to dc tomorrow, so, goodnight 05:37:33 <planetmaker> good night :-) 05:38:20 *** supermop [~daniel_er@cpe-67-243-25-39.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: supermop] 05:58:39 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@95.76.27.160] has joined #openttd 06:04:00 *** Amis_ [~Amis@5400EAD0.dsl.pool.telekom.hu] has joined #openttd 06:16:18 *** Amis_ [~Amis@5400EAD0.dsl.pool.telekom.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:18:05 *** Kurimus [Kurimus@dsl-tkubrasgw3-fe64de00-55.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd 06:50:32 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: rubidium * r22554 /extra/website/ (4 files in 3 dirs): [Website] -Update: logo, bananas 'constants', types of packages 06:56:46 *** Amis_ [~Amis@5400C2AD.dsl.pool.telekom.hu] has joined #openttd 06:58:39 *** Pulec [~pulec@static-cl093181068250.unet.cz] has joined #openttd 07:12:31 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has joined #openttd 07:14:26 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has quit [] 07:24:03 *** Neon [~Neon@dslb-094-219-004-126.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 07:30:51 *** perk11 [~perk11@broadband-77-37-203-211.nationalcablenetworks.ru] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 07:33:25 *** perk11 [~perk11@broadband-77-37-203-211.nationalcablenetworks.ru] has joined #openttd 07:39:32 *** Alberth [~hat@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 07:39:36 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 07:56:20 *** bryjen [~bryjen@76.92.85.169] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:00:02 *** DDR [~DDR@66.183.113.68] has quit [Quit: In democracy it's your vote that counts; In feudalism it's your count that votes. - Mogens Jallberg] 08:11:59 *** bodis [~bodis@cpc3-ando3-0-0-cust781.15-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 08:12:52 <bodis> morning 08:13:03 <planetmaker> moin 08:14:52 *** Eddi|zuHause3 is now known as Eddi|zuHause 08:14:56 <peter1138> heh minecraft's moding api: the full source code 08:15:31 <andythenorth> shouldn't 'minecraft' result in automatic kban? 08:15:36 *** perk11 [~perk11@broadband-77-37-203-211.nationalcablenetworks.ru] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 08:15:46 <andythenorth> 'minecrack' is acceptable :P 08:17:14 * andythenorth prefers this sort of mining: http://www.pitmanworld.com/ 08:21:31 <peter1138> well you're silly 08:22:03 <andythenorth> I don't mind shaft when I'm mineshafting 08:22:42 <V453000> lol 08:23:26 *** Cript [~0a0a6567@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 08:25:47 <andythenorth> "What I'm not is a friendly approachable person, so stay out me way and let me dig" 08:30:58 *** pugi [~pugi@p4FCC461E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 08:34:41 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 08:35:47 *** Cript [~0a0a6567@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 08:41:11 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5e0f84fe.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 08:44:01 *** TWerkhoven [~twerkhove@cpc14-linl7-2-0-cust28.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 08:53:46 <__ln__> there's quite a flaw in the big plot of The Event, imho... 09:00:59 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1B6C5.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 09:04:27 <Alberth> it does not happen? 09:05:17 <heffer> hey guys. most important patch for grfcodec EVER: http://fpaste.org/EDvU/raw/ 09:05:30 <heffer> (fixes the FSFs address in all license texts) :D 09:05:41 <heffer> + fixes the GPL 2.0 09:07:07 <heffer> aaaand it has some sed fail in it :D 09:07:11 <heffer> lemme fix that :D 09:08:39 <Alberth> heffer: http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfcodec 09:08:51 *** goblin [~goblin@dslb-088-066-117-191.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 09:14:07 <heffer> Alberth: http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/2729 09:14:48 <Alberth> ok :) I am not in that project, but I am sure the owners will appreciate your efforts 09:15:09 <heffer> i know they will ;) 09:26:22 *** Bilge [~bilge@92.28.197.104] has joined #openttd 09:26:52 <Alberth> heffer: do you have a source for this change? It might be useful to link to that as reference 09:27:52 <heffer> added it to the ticket :) 09:28:22 <heffer> our rpm checking tool somehow now also checks for the FSFs address :D 09:28:32 <Alberth> thank you 09:29:54 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host202-229-dynamic.5-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 09:30:37 <Wolf01> hello 09:30:51 <Alberth> hello Wolf01 09:37:31 *** DoubleYou [~jkuckartz@ppp118-209-69-162.lns20.mel4.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:46:59 *** goblin [~goblin@dslb-088-066-117-191.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 09:51:19 *** JVassie_ [~James@host-92-27-149-231.static.as13285.net] has joined #openttd 09:54:26 *** dfox [~dfox@ip-94-113-17-246.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 09:57:35 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B25B.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 10:01:53 <Rubidium> didn't those address like change last millenium? 10:03:57 <andythenorth> snow is interestink 10:04:06 <andythenorth> some default buildings have it on the roof only 10:04:12 <andythenorth> others on roof + ground 10:04:26 <andythenorth> somebody has cleaned snow from their office lawn :P 10:04:38 <planetmaker> yup :-P 10:04:44 <planetmaker> they do that. Install a lawn heating 10:04:54 <planetmaker> for outdoor golf on the green in winter. 10:05:02 <planetmaker> Too much money all those tycoons :-P 10:05:08 <Terkhen> yes, completely realistic :) 10:05:12 <planetmaker> :-D 10:05:47 <V453000> :d 10:07:18 *** KouDy [~KouDy@188.75.190.58] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:20:33 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 10:34:24 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d008554.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 10:37:29 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm fairly sure football stadiums do have lawn heatings 11:10:52 * andythenorth has a valid case for extended tile layout :) 11:10:58 <andythenorth> but is wondering about documentation :P 11:12:19 <Alberth> do I want to know what extended tile layout is about? 11:12:42 <andythenorth> of course you do ;) 11:13:13 <Alberth> interesting, this extended tile layout, can you tell more about it? 11:13:15 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F6D859.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 11:13:18 <andythenorth> @22518 11:13:25 <andythenorth> @DorpsGek 22518 11:13:27 <andythenorth> meh 11:13:31 <Terkhen> @commit 22518 11:13:31 <DorpsGek> Terkhen: Commit by frosch :: r22518 /trunk/src (13 files in 2 dirs) (2011-05-29 16:56:22 UTC) 11:13:32 <DorpsGek> Terkhen: -Feature: [NewGRF] Advanced sprite layouts with register modifiers. 11:15:01 <frosch123> andythenorth: it is called "Advanced Sprite Layout" now, "Extended Sprite Layout" was already used 11:15:29 <frosch123> and it also fits nicely with AdvVarAct2 which also deals with registers :) 11:18:43 *** zachanima [~zach@2506ds3-od.0.fullrate.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:18:55 *** zachanima [~zach@2506ds3-od.0.fullrate.dk] has joined #openttd 11:19:05 <andythenorth> frosch123: ttdp wiki needs specs updating? 11:19:34 <frosch123> yes, still :) 11:19:54 <andythenorth> can we copy-paste anything? 11:19:55 <frosch123> but as I already told you: the existing pages need restructuring first 11:19:59 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@88.130.179.190] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:20:03 <frosch123> they are too much of a mess to add something new 11:20:06 <andythenorth> oh yes 11:20:45 <frosch123> i'll do that when i am in the mood to do it 11:21:08 <andythenorth> ok 11:21:20 <andythenorth> in the meantime, I use the src as documentation? 11:22:21 <frosch123> no, http://wiki.openttd.org/Frosch/Advanced_Sprite_Layout 11:22:53 <andythenorth> okey cokey 11:22:55 <andythenorth> thanks 11:22:58 <frosch123> i also started on nforenum 11:23:22 <frosch123> first did action0 as i thought that would be the annoying part, finished that, and then discovered that the action2 part is more annoying :s 11:23:42 <andythenorth> will nforenum sulk if I try and use this? 11:26:50 <frosch123> it will not understand it :) 11:30:58 <andythenorth> that is an argument against writing that code today :P 11:33:54 *** Adambean [AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has joined #openttd 11:38:19 <Alberth> why, I can write code for days without testing whether a tool understands it :p 11:41:06 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@cpc7-newt30-2-0-cust37.newt.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 11:42:01 * andythenorth ....can't 11:42:08 <andythenorth> :P 11:42:53 <Terkhen> I need constant testing, otherwise I end up doing something stupid :P 11:47:38 <andythenorth> one day I will understand bounding boxes 11:47:45 <andythenorth> meanwhile I just cross my fingers + hope 11:50:09 *** rhaeder1 [~quix0r@dslb-188-100-216-203.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 11:55:02 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-142-237.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:56:46 <andythenorth> industry var 66 11:57:09 <andythenorth> I assumed that checking it was <100d would give me industries located within 10 tiles of town sign 11:57:18 <andythenorth> instead I get more like ~20 tiles 11:57:22 <andythenorth> which maths do I fail? 11:58:02 <Terkhen> maybe it uses manhattan distance instead of euclidean distance 11:58:07 <andythenorth> http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=VarAction2Industries#Get_square_of_Euclidean_distance_of_closest_town_66_ 11:58:17 <Terkhen> oh, it doesn't :P 11:58:31 <andythenorth> unless I need to nibble some of the result 11:59:10 <andythenorth> I'm checking it as a word 11:59:15 <andythenorth> no shift 11:59:28 <andythenorth> http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/270/ 11:59:34 <Terkhen> from checking the code it seems that you only need the last nibble, the first nibble is the town radius group 12:00:05 <andythenorth> ignore the comments on my paste, some are wrong 12:00:49 * andythenorth spots a mistake though 12:00:50 <frosch123> andythenorth: you should only check the lower 16 bits 12:01:00 <andythenorth> and my param will be all wrong :P 12:01:05 <andythenorth> copy and paste fail :P 12:01:55 <andythenorth> I was offsetting from N tile by whatever industry ID was 12:02:00 <andythenorth> interestink 12:02:44 <andythenorth> frosch123: lower 16 bits? 12:03:00 <andythenorth> 2 bytes? 12:03:02 <frosch123> yes, andmask of 0xFFFF 12:03:26 <andythenorth> this is my (fixed) code http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/271/ 12:03:32 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:03:33 <andythenorth> not sure it's entirely doing what it should yet 12:05:58 <frosch123> not sure what you define with THIS_DISTANCE_LIMIT_SQUARED 12:06:09 <frosch123> but you should put the \w not in the define 12:06:44 <andythenorth> that won't work, the CPP will stumble on it 12:06:47 <andythenorth> sadly :( 12:06:50 <andythenorth> it's a PITA 12:08:36 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:4de2:a145:25a8:eec3] has joined #openttd 12:08:40 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 12:10:04 *** Intexon [~Intexon@blk-222-147-135.eastlink.ca] has joined #openttd 12:12:02 <Alberth> the joys of using software in ways it is not meant to be used :) 12:12:17 <andythenorth> hmm 12:12:32 <andythenorth> it would be useful to be able to print some top level debug information from the game 12:12:48 <andythenorth> e.g. for each industry type, the enabled cbs etc 12:13:08 <andythenorth> I can manually inspect, but that's somewhat painful with ~ 40 types 12:13:27 <andythenorth> I guess I could write something locally to parse the pnfo 12:13:34 <andythenorth> but that only benefits FIRS 12:13:59 <andythenorth> FIRS development gets ever slower as there's so much to check isn't broken 12:14:05 <andythenorth> and no way of automatically testing :P 12:23:35 <andythenorth> hmm 12:23:59 <andythenorth> 'newgame FIRS build_only brewery' 12:24:05 <andythenorth> might be useful 12:24:09 <andythenorth> maybe not 12:24:14 <andythenorth> the probabilities would go nuts 12:29:51 <andythenorth> is there a method to allow industry to overbuild houses? 12:30:05 <andythenorth> besides special flags 8h, 10h, and 20h 12:30:19 <andythenorth> which do more than just allow overbuilding houses 12:30:23 <Alberth> banks and water towers do it, so I guess there is :) 12:30:38 <andythenorth> they use custom code in industry_cmd.cpp iirc 12:31:09 <Alberth> that could be the case 12:32:51 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-26-30-55.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 12:34:27 <Bilge> andythenorth I am playing using FIRS 12:35:11 <Bilge> I don't really understand these things like building supplies 12:35:33 <Bilge> They just disappear into thin air unless you have something to receive them constantly the second a delivery arrives 12:37:21 <Bilge> Also all quarries seem to be linked 12:37:34 <Bilge> They all produce 90/90 sand/stone maximum and the only time I saw it drop they all dropped in unison 12:37:36 <Bilge> Why? 12:37:50 <andythenorth> short month 12:38:11 <Bilge> I think it was because of recession 12:38:21 <Bilge> But the point is there seems to be very little variance between the industries 12:38:32 <andythenorth> FIRS ignores recessions 12:38:47 <Bilge> Unlike base TTD where there are good and bad performing industries in each sector 12:39:28 <andythenorth> Bilge: http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/855 12:40:06 <Bilge> Added by andythenorth about 1 year ago 12:40:08 <Bilge> real 12:40:44 <andythenorth> yarp 12:41:29 <andythenorth> there's been about 1100 FIRS commits since then 12:41:40 <andythenorth> but none of them fixed the production randomisation 12:42:23 <Bilge> And neither will the next 1100 12:43:02 <Bilge> They'll just be memos in the comments to order more beer 12:43:57 <Terkhen> sure 12:44:25 *** Adambean [AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:48:42 <Alberth> Bilge: comments like that are completely useless; accept how it behaves, stop using it, or help fixing it 12:50:20 *** Adambean [AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has joined #openttd 13:17:46 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-5d82004c.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 13:37:07 *** Markavian [~Markavian@187.35-50-210.static.dsl.mel.iprimus.net.au] has joined #openttd 13:45:04 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B25B.access.telenet.be] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:46:37 <Eddi|zuHause> # Wieso, wieso bin immer ich der Idiot 13:46:38 <Eddi|zuHause> # Und warum, warum haben andere, nich ich, die Millionen 14:01:25 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F6D859.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:04:15 *** ThaAmazonous [~ThaAmazon@D9799130.cm-3-2c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 14:04:30 *** ThaAmazonous [~ThaAmazon@D9799130.cm-3-2c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:05:41 *** ThaAmazonous [~ThaAmazon@D9799130.cm-3-2c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 14:11:51 *** Pixa [~Pixa@85.210.67.111] has joined #openttd 14:14:06 *** Brendan_ [~0a0a6567@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 14:17:09 *** Markavian [~Markavian@187.35-50-210.static.dsl.mel.iprimus.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:28:39 *** goblin [~goblin@dslb-088-066-117-191.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 14:35:23 *** perk11 [~perk11@broadband-77-37-203-211.nationalcablenetworks.ru] has joined #openttd 14:54:29 *** perk11 [~perk11@broadband-77-37-203-211.nationalcablenetworks.ru] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 15:10:10 *** haukinger [548054d0@ircip3.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 15:18:02 *** deepak [~0a0a6567@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 15:18:51 *** deepak [~0a0a6567@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has left #openttd [] 15:19:32 *** mib_0s42z5 [57d2725f@ircip4.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 15:20:07 <haukinger> hi all 15:20:41 <Terkhen> hi haukinger 15:21:25 <haukinger> question about the code: what are the preconditions for DoCommandP ? 15:22:36 <Eddi|zuHause> use DoCommandP from gui code/user interaction, and use DoCommand from within DoCommandP 15:23:05 <haukinger> I tried to invoke a command on a vehicle in LoadUnloadStation, and it doesn't work because of _current_company being set wrong 15:23:32 <frosch123> LoadUnloadStation is part of the gameloop, use DoCommand there 15:23:49 <frosch123> DoCommandP sends stuff to the server, i.e. there is no immediate execution 15:23:49 <haukinger> ok, I'm trying this 15:24:02 <haukinger> I copy-pasted the command code, but that gives desyncs 15:24:24 <Terkhen> every client and the server have the same code? 15:25:10 <haukinger> yes 15:25:40 <haukinger> and it works if I run two instances on one machine 15:26:53 *** mib_0s42z5 [57d2725f@ircip4.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 15:31:11 <Terkhen> haukinger: that code is being executed for stations of all companies, and you should not send commands as another company 15:36:45 *** Pixa [~Pixa@85.210.67.111] has quit [Quit: Bye] 15:37:20 *** Pixa [~Pixa@85.210.67.111] has joined #openttd 15:45:56 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-89-176-248-242.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 15:47:17 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-89-176-248-242.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [] 15:48:40 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-89-176-248-242.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 15:56:04 *** Brendan_ [~0a0a6567@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:13:23 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F6D859.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 16:24:29 *** LordPixaII [~Pixa@85.210.67.111] has joined #openttd 16:24:29 *** Pixa [~Pixa@85.210.67.111] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:27:23 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-088-076-107-186.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 16:31:11 *** rhaeder1 [~quix0r@dslb-188-100-216-203.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:31:17 *** ar3kaw [~ident@ebw81.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #openttd 16:37:46 *** ar3k [~ident@ecu246.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:44:45 <planetmaker> [13:20] frosch123 but as I already told you: the existing pages need restructuring first <-- is it a good idea to create a new server where we can transition the newgrf wiki to? It will be quite easy to setup one with whatever we like 16:45:11 <planetmaker> Then we can do the transition and switch it officially when the boring transition work is done 16:45:15 <planetmaker> good evening also :-) 16:45:22 <Alberth> evenink planetmaker 16:45:32 <planetmaker> I just thought this noon about creating a VM for that purpose 16:45:50 <planetmaker> question only is: what wiki do we want? 16:45:55 *** jonty-comp is now known as Gargamel 16:46:32 *** Gargamel is now known as jonty-comp 16:47:02 <Alberth> something with a proper vcs behind it, imho 16:47:41 <Alberth> i am not even sure you should want a wiki 16:47:50 <planetmaker> Ignorant of the different pros and cons of the different wikis as I am, I'd pick media wiki on grounds that both OpenTTD and #openttdcoop wiki use it 16:48:09 <planetmaker> wiki worked quite well for NewGRF specs 16:48:23 <planetmaker> as long as it's a separate wiki 16:49:06 <planetmaker> what would you suggest instead of a wiki, Alberth ? 16:49:14 <bodis> If I am transfering a save file from one pc to another, do I need to activate same NewGRF's or do they only need to be present in data directory? 16:49:37 <planetmaker> just copy the savegame. It knows which NewGRFs it wants 16:49:45 <bodis> k 16:49:46 <planetmaker> main menu newgrf selection has no impact on that 16:50:12 <bodis> ok ty 16:51:18 *** ctibor [~quassel@77.48.228.43] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:51:45 <Alberth> a vcs project with some plain text format, eg restructured text 16:51:47 <frosch123> planetmaker: i took a look at some wiki softwares some weeks ago 16:52:15 <frosch123> considering the requirements a unified wiki for ottd + specs would need, mediawiki is the only option 16:52:17 <Alberth> how many people edit the specs currently? 16:52:25 <Terkhen> Alberth: who would have access to that vcs? 16:52:33 <frosch123> there are a lot of wikis out there with some interesting features, but most are unmaintained 16:53:10 <frosch123> actually only mediawiki and tikiwiki looked maintained at all (considering those with a minimum feature set) 16:53:24 <Alberth> Terkhen: anybody that wants to change newgrf specs and knows what he is doing? 16:53:40 * andythenorth would prefer a better system, but thinks we'll end up with a wiki :P 16:53:50 <andythenorth> because it's most likely to be maintained 16:53:56 <Terkhen> and who determines "who knows what he is doing"? :P 16:54:18 <Alberth> devs of ttdpatch and openttd? 16:54:28 <Alberth> most things need program changes anyway 16:55:09 <Alberth> or are there other people that make useful contributions to a formal spec outside that group? 16:55:14 <frosch123> anyway, we cannot just transition to a new wiki... the worst would be two places with the specs. so if there is something new, the old one must be shut down 16:55:17 <orudge> The plan for TT-Wiki is to use MediaWiki 16:55:19 <Terkhen> but other people have also been correcting and extending stuff... IMO a wiki that enforces being registered would be enough 16:55:21 <frosch123> which i do not see quite happening 16:55:27 <orudge> and the original TTDPatch wiki was to be merged into that 16:55:45 <orudge> What is it you lot are plotting? 16:56:11 <Alberth> take over the world, of course 16:56:13 <orudge> quite 16:56:30 <andythenorth> I see well made things made with http://sphinx.pocoo.org/ 16:57:48 <Terkhen> orudge: that it would be nice to have a new place for hosting the specs 16:58:20 <andythenorth> sphinx appears well used by some major python projects 16:58:23 <andythenorth> it's probably maintained 16:58:33 <orudge> Terkhen: well, as I say, it seems to me that the best plan for that is for it to become part of this new integrated wiki. Plans for that have kind of stalled, though, but if what you're plotting is to involve the OpenTTD wiki too, then it sounds like you might be doing my work for you ;) 16:58:41 *** ctibor [~quassel@77.48.228.43] has joined #openttd 16:58:51 <orudge> in which case I'm happy to provide hosting and integration with the forum database, which of course was the other major thing that was desired for the wiki 16:59:09 <Terkhen> hmm... not really, IMO the openttd wiki should stay separated 16:59:33 <planetmaker> orudge: Only a subset of the current TTDP wiki would belong to the NewGRF wiki 16:59:35 <andythenorth> I'm not sure how much is gained from wide-open editing of newgrf specs 16:59:44 <orudge> planetmaker: well, true 16:59:47 <andythenorth> i.e. the number of people who can usefully contribute is limited 17:00:23 <planetmaker> and, indeed, orudge, separate sign-on for the NewGRF wiki is IMHO desirable. I.e. forum account should not automatically give edit rights there 17:01:23 <orudge> planetmaker: hmm, well, it would seem that having a unified user database would still be desirable, but possibly with a restricted group for editing certain pages (or even the whole thing) 17:01:26 <planetmaker> the reasons there actually is the inconvenience it means :-) 17:01:41 <orudge> is there actually much/any abuse of the existing TTDPatch wiki though? 17:01:42 <planetmaker> the newgrf wiki is the specs. Which not everyone should edit 17:01:43 <orudge> I hadn't really noticed any 17:02:02 <planetmaker> neither me. But I *think* the reason is that it is indeed a separate wiki 17:02:07 <orudge> hmm 17:02:08 <orudge> well 17:02:11 <planetmaker> Anyone can sign up. But it's a separate step :-) 17:02:24 <planetmaker> Maybe I'm mistaken or too cautious 17:02:32 <Terkhen> as long as edit is protected it does not matter who registers 17:02:44 <planetmaker> But I gathered that I'm not alone with the reservation to grant everyone (easy) edit rights there 17:02:52 <Terkhen> and right now the specs are not protected at all and I don't remember any issue with abuse 17:03:13 <orudge> it may be desirable to solicit feedback on this on the forums, at any rate, for the three people who exclusively work with TTDPatch or whatever :P 17:03:17 <Terkhen> I agree on that point, but IMO it should not be restricted to TTDPatch / OpenTTD devs 17:03:35 <Terkhen> yes, that's a good idea :) 17:03:42 <orudge> I would suggest that anonymous editing would definitely be disabled 17:03:43 <planetmaker> no, definitely not. Pikka, mb, andy, george, etc are valuable editors there 17:03:49 <planetmaker> yes 17:03:53 <Terkhen> indeed 17:04:01 <orudge> to me, it seems sensible to leave things unprotected, but if there's a problem, then things can be restricted further 17:04:04 <orudge> but maybe that's just me :) 17:04:30 <planetmaker> I don't mind unprotected :-) 17:04:34 <planetmaker> I'm for that 17:04:55 <planetmaker> (but logged in, of course) 17:04:59 <orudge> yes 17:05:39 <planetmaker> politically feasible is probably only that you host the NewGRF wiki 17:05:55 <orudge> well, I could definitely set up a tt-wiki.net/newgrf or somesuch 17:06:00 <planetmaker> if it'd run on Ammler's and my server, I guess a certain share of people would not accept that 17:06:10 <planetmaker> though I'd be happy to host it 17:06:12 <orudge> and import the existing newgrf pages from the ttdpatch wiki (which can then be edited or reorganised) 17:06:24 <planetmaker> we have capacity and means to easily do that 17:06:27 <orudge> or you can import them manually if desired 17:06:38 <andythenorth> I'm not worried about abuse :) That hasn't happened so far. 17:06:38 <orudge> mmh, I don't think there's a problem with hosting really :) 17:06:53 <andythenorth> I'm mostly concerned about having to use crappy software for documenation :P 17:07:05 <planetmaker> :-) 17:07:28 <Yexo> the scope of such a wiki would have to be clearly defined however 17:07:33 <planetmaker> Actually I'm worried about that the old wiki will not go offline 17:07:34 <Terkhen> IMO the newgrf specs should be a completely separate wiki... right now it is not clear what belongs to the specs and what not 17:07:44 <planetmaker> That's my biggest worry 17:08:05 <orudge> planetmaker: well, what I could do in conjuction is move the other TTDPatch wiki pages to the new forums wiki 17:08:13 <orudge> (and OpenTTD can keep its own wiki, which probably is best anyway) 17:08:18 <orudge> and then just officially close the old tikiwiki 17:08:23 <planetmaker> Terkhen: so two wikis: specs and newgrf programming wiki? 17:08:27 <Yexo> planetmaker: all spec pages on the old wiki could be cleaned and a redirect added, that shouldn't be a problem 17:08:31 <Terkhen> I think that tutorials and stuff like that do not belong with the specs, although it would also be nice to have them 17:08:36 <Terkhen> planetmaker: IMO yes 17:08:45 <planetmaker> probably a good idea 17:08:55 <Yexo> hard to draw the line between them sometimes 17:08:59 <Yexo> take the "CargoTypes" page 17:09:04 <planetmaker> yeah 17:09:05 <Terkhen> true 17:09:05 <Yexo> is that spec or just general consensus? 17:09:11 <Yexo> same for RailTypes page 17:09:36 <planetmaker> it _seems_ that cargotypes is specs and railtypes concensus at best. But... yes 17:09:39 <Terkhen> I'd say that the default cargos part is spec, the rest is consensus 17:09:49 <Rubidium> I'd make a spec wiki for nfo, a spec page (directly from hg) for nml and a general wiki with the stuff that transcends everything 17:10:09 <planetmaker> Terkhen: but then looking in two wikis for that basic thing you need for programming a vehicle is... inconvenient 17:10:15 <Rubidium> i.e. tutorials, general best use, used grfids, used cargo types, ... 17:10:20 <andythenorth> API spec is API spec 17:10:24 <andythenorth> tutorials are tutorials 17:10:34 <andythenorth> one can link the other, but they are not same 17:10:35 <Ammler> the newgrf spec could be added to grfcrawler 17:10:37 <Rubidium> where the spec and nml refer to the general wiki 17:10:40 <Ammler> grfcodec I meant 17:10:53 <Ammler> (no wiki) 17:10:57 * Terkhen agrees with Rubidium 17:11:09 <andythenorth> what currently irritates me is that code examples are generally banned from spec. This is not how other languages do it 17:11:45 <Ammler> ah, like Rubi suggested :-) 17:11:50 <Rubidium> examples are vital, but IMO the spec should have example snippets; not all encompassing examples 17:11:59 <andythenorth> yes 17:12:01 <andythenorth> exactly that 17:12:09 <andythenorth> it's what the 'pre' tag was invented for :P 17:12:11 <Rubidium> those belong more to the general wiki, although! the spec should refer to the general wiki 17:12:35 <planetmaker> sounds viable 17:12:44 <Rubidium> e.g. if there are 2 'big' examples using industry animation speed, it would be useful to refer to there 17:12:46 <planetmaker> even though drawing the line will not always be easy 17:15:05 <Rubidium> if it has multiple pseudo sprites and adding an action 8 + graphics would make it a somewhat working NewGRF you're too far (I'd say) 17:15:57 <planetmaker> for the specs wiki, yes 17:16:44 <Rubidium> yep, the general wiki should (mostly) contain (almost) working examples 17:17:32 <Rubidium> alternatively the NewGRF spec becomes a hg repository with htmls like the NML spec 17:17:55 <andythenorth> I would vastly prefer a documentation system to a wiki 17:18:15 <Rubidium> and we generously give those that we know have actual knowledge accounts 17:18:29 <Rubidium> andythenorth: docbook or so? 17:18:41 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:4de2:a145:25a8:eec3] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:18:55 <andythenorth> I'm a satisfied reader of http://sphinx.pocoo.org/ 17:18:55 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:4de2:a145:25a8:eec3] has joined #openttd 17:19:02 <andythenorth> although I haven't used it to add any content 17:19:47 <orudge> I would possibly argue that something more universally "standard", such as docbook, may be better 17:19:52 <orudge> that looks rather like it is geared towards Python 17:20:07 <andythenorth> possibly too much so 17:20:26 <frosch123> why do you consider access protection so important? 17:20:41 <frosch123> i don't see random people messing with the specs 17:20:52 <andythenorth> orudge: the chances of finding anything with code highlighting support for nfo is...well make your own bet :P 17:20:58 <Alberth> restructured text? more lightweight 17:21:20 <frosch123> otoh i see very restrictive rules on the current ttdp wiki, e.g. how hard it is to get something into the table of contents 17:21:41 <Yexo> the current ttpd wiki is imo too strict 17:21:54 <orudge> andythenorth: well, quite. :P But docbook, texinfo, etc, are generally easier for the majority of people to get and use, I imagine, rather than something they've never heard of before that requires them to faff with Python. But that's perhaps my own general dislike of things that require me to faff with Python coming through. I never get on well with them. :P 17:22:07 <Alberth> what about bundling current contents in a tarball? 17:22:19 <andythenorth> orudge: it parses reST as far as I can see 17:22:25 <andythenorth> it = sphinx 17:22:29 <frosch123> Alberth: noone wants an offline spec 17:22:39 <frosch123> 90% of the time it is linked from irc or the forums 17:22:43 <Yexo> I sometimes would like that :) 17:22:45 <Rubidium> sphinx seems to be focussd on files (modules) and method, and especially the latter doesn't exist in nfo 17:22:45 <Alberth> ok :) 17:22:58 <andythenorth> any others using reST? 17:23:00 <Yexo> it's quite useful to be able to do something while in a train without internet 17:23:03 <Rubidium> so I don't think sphinx is really useful, and neither are similar tools such as javadoc 17:23:10 <orudge> the TTDPatch manual at least used to be available in an assortment of offline formats, updated in a tarball nightly from the wiki (including, I presume, the newgrf specs) 17:23:13 <orudge> but I think that got broken some time ago 17:23:21 <frosch123> orudge: it still works 17:23:25 <orudge> oh, does it? 17:23:39 <Alberth> but html diffs are impossible :p 17:23:41 * andythenorth -> baby bath 17:23:42 <frosch123> but adding files to it, is as restriction heavy as adding to the toc :) 17:23:42 <andythenorth> bbl 17:24:06 <frosch123> so, i do not see any point in using something other than mediawiki :) 17:24:32 <Alberth> I can live with that option too 17:24:38 <Yexo> me too 17:24:55 <frosch123> just give access to everyone 17:25:59 <frosch123> random people only edit pages with titles like "suggestion", "roadmap" etc. but nothing with "property 13" :p 17:26:26 <Yexo> as long as there is a clear description of what the wiki is for, like "specs only, no big examples, no grf-specific documentation" 17:27:11 <planetmaker> [19:23] frosch123 Alberth: noone wants an offline spec <-- the ttdp wiki is available for offline use as tar download 17:27:25 <planetmaker> I have it, if I need it when I have no wifi 17:27:44 <frosch123> planetmaker: and? does it contain all files? 17:27:54 <planetmaker> yes, everything I needed was there 17:28:01 <planetmaker> up to the date I downloaded 17:28:09 <frosch123> afaik it contains only stuff linked from the table of contents 17:28:16 <planetmaker> it's quite some month ago I updated that, but yes 17:28:18 <frosch123> e.g. not the page about refitting 17:28:32 <planetmaker> I don't know, it's not like I extensively used it 17:29:05 <Terkhen> having an offline version is nice, but I couldn't live without an online version :P 17:34:16 *** goblin [~goblin@dslb-088-066-117-191.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 17:38:19 *** Chrill [~chrischri@h-5-149.A212.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 17:44:59 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: translators * r22555 /trunk/src/lang/ (dutch.txt korean.txt norwegian_nynorsk.txt): 17:44:59 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 17:44:59 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: dutch - 32 changes by Parody 17:44:59 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: korean - 2 changes by junho2813 17:44:59 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: norwegian_nynorsk - 27 changes by 2rB 17:51:14 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F6D859.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:53:05 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F6D859.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 17:53:09 *** rhaeder1 [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-133-046.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 17:58:23 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-088-076-107-186.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:59:55 <orudge> There's currently nothing on it, but: http://www.tt-wiki.net/newgrf/ 17:59:57 <orudge> Linked to the forum DB, only forum members can log in and edit. Nothing else done to it so far, but I could import the TTDPatch pages and we can see what might want doing. Plus any extensions that need installing can be installed. 18:03:48 <planetmaker> orudge: if you could do a (crude, if you want) import thereof, it'd be great 18:04:00 <planetmaker> I assume it could then become the specs wiki only? 18:04:05 <orudge> planetmaker: yep 18:04:12 <orudge> that's the intention 18:04:19 <Bilge> norwegs 18:04:26 <planetmaker> good. Thus all unneeded stuff can go to the trash bin. 18:04:55 <orudge> brb 18:25:52 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-5d82004c.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: All your IRC are belong to us!] 18:27:55 *** DDR [~DDR@66.183.113.68] has joined #openttd 18:42:19 *** DDR_ [~DDR@66.183.113.68] has joined #openttd 18:45:15 <orudge> Ugh, George's Russian pages are breaking this conversion script. (It seems that the easiest thing to do is to convert the whole wiki, and then just copy over the appropriate pages to the specs wiki) 18:46:40 *** DDR [~DDR@66.183.113.68] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:46:44 *** DDR_ is now known as DDR 18:56:59 <planetmaker> yes. The Russian pages are anyway not part of the NewGRF specs, but of the ECS readme 18:57:24 <orudge> Indeed. 18:58:17 <orudge> 559 pages comprising 2979 revisions 18:58:25 <planetmaker> many :-) 18:58:36 <planetmaker> So, you don't mind if I starte with a rigerous delete orgy? 18:58:40 <orudge> well 18:58:47 <orudge> what I've done while you weren't looking 18:58:52 <orudge> www.tt-wiki.net is different to newgrf.tt-wiki.net now 18:58:56 <orudge> so, these are all going to be imported into tt-wiki.net 18:59:07 <orudge> I'll then export the newgrf spec pages from that into newgrf.tt-wiki.net 18:59:09 <planetmaker> please elaborate 18:59:13 <planetmaker> ah 18:59:19 <planetmaker> so twice basically 18:59:21 <orudge> because it's easier than trying to do it using my converter 18:59:25 <orudge> from tikiwiki 18:59:31 <planetmaker> and the stuff which doesn't belong gets deleted respectively? 18:59:34 <orudge> yep 18:59:39 <orudge> tt-wiki.net will then be the new home of the TTDPatch wiki, and the tt-forums wiki 18:59:42 <planetmaker> yep, that's what I expected actually :-) 18:59:52 <orudge> and newgrf.tt-wiki.net (or grfspecs.tt-wiki.net, whatever you want to call it :P) can be the new specs wiki 19:00:29 <planetmaker> newgrfspecs.tt-wiki.net ? 19:00:43 <orudge> seems a bit of a mouthful 19:00:46 <orudge> but maybe that's just me 19:00:55 <planetmaker> hm, you're right with that 19:01:00 <orudge> I've internally called it "GRFSpecs", because that's the only thing I could come up with that looked nice 19:01:05 <orudge> NewGRFSpecs seems a bit long 19:01:09 <planetmaker> I just tried to find a descriptive but not mis-leading name 19:01:11 <orudge> mmh 19:01:19 <planetmaker> grfspec, why not? 19:01:41 <planetmaker> hm... though... 19:01:49 <Alberth> it's not like it is new any more :p 19:02:23 <Alberth> just keep the long name imho 19:02:27 <planetmaker> what was Rubidium's suggestion earlier? A specs wiki and then another one where examples and non-spec descriptions go. But those could be sub-pages of the tt-wiki itself 19:02:30 <orudge> NewGRFs have been around for more than half of the time TTD has been around for, now, I think :p 19:02:40 <orudge> planetmaker: yes, I think they could be part of the TT Wiki 19:02:49 <Terkhen> grfspecs is fine imo :) 19:02:50 <orudge> too many wikis might just get confusing 19:02:55 <planetmaker> yep 19:03:00 <Alberth> but leaving out 'new' would confuse everybody 19:03:01 <planetmaker> and they share much stuff anyway 19:03:14 <orudge> Alberth: it'd still be referred to as the "NewGRF Specs" on the site 19:03:16 <orudge> it's just the URL 19:03:40 <planetmaker> newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net 19:03:42 <planetmaker> hm... 19:03:45 <planetmaker> but would fit better 19:03:56 <Alberth> does anybody know the default template of hg log? 19:03:59 <planetmaker> and doesn't exactly hurt either 19:04:44 <orudge> that could work, I guess 19:12:36 <orudge> planetmaker: http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=NewGraphicsSpecs <-- are you wanting everything on that page, or just GRFActionsDetailed and AdditionalReference? 19:12:42 <orudge> (ie, ignore the GRFTutorial) 19:14:29 <planetmaker> the tutorial goes to the tt-wiki directly 19:14:33 <planetmaker> specs is specs 19:14:34 <orudge> right 19:14:35 <orudge> it's already there 19:14:38 <orudge> that's fine 19:15:19 <planetmaker> what could stay are the fundamental graphics things like palettes + coordinates 19:15:26 <planetmaker> they're part of the specs IMHO 19:15:35 <orudge> well 19:15:38 <planetmaker> but it'll need weeding through 19:15:41 <orudge> we can pull those over later if appropriate 19:15:42 <planetmaker> in detail 19:15:47 <planetmaker> yep. Or just copy 19:15:51 <planetmaker> manually 19:15:56 <planetmaker> it's not that much 19:16:24 *** sllide [~jari@ip565eb113.direct-adsl.nl] has joined #openttd 19:17:54 <frosch123> the tuturial contains a lot of explaination, parts of it could as well go to additonal reference 19:18:06 <frosch123> so, maybe copy them too, so they can be manually get split? 19:18:26 <orudge> well, everything's in tt-wiki now 19:18:30 <orudge> so they can be exported easily if need be 19:18:49 <planetmaker> ok. And the spec subset in newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net? 19:18:54 <planetmaker> Because that did time out yet 19:18:57 <orudge> it will be in a minute 19:19:00 <planetmaker> ok :-) 19:19:03 <orudge> well, newgrf.tt-wiki.net at the moment 19:19:06 <orudge> but it can be changed at a later date 19:19:09 <planetmaker> ok 19:19:24 <planetmaker> newgrf sounds too generic for my taste 19:19:32 <orudge> mmh, well, I can update that :) 19:19:40 <planetmaker> the user-side pages could get that as an alias 19:19:58 *** amkoroew [~Heinz@p5B1031CB.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 19:20:06 <planetmaker> i.e. a kind of newgrf - developer's landing page within tt-wiki.net 19:20:12 <orudge> yep 19:22:08 <Ammler> Alberth: ui.logtemplate 19:24:59 <orudge> OK, all done: http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/Special:AllPages 19:25:14 <orudge> note that most pages will require a good bit of reformatting, unfortunately, but that's pretty much unavoidable 19:25:21 <planetmaker> hm, my DNS doesn't know it yet 19:25:40 <andythenorth> he 19:25:50 <andythenorth> all the table formatting might be lost :D 19:25:52 <orudge> 178.19.113.112 / 2a02:1680:0:1:2:1:1:7001 19:25:54 <andythenorth> fun awaits 19:25:59 <orudge> andythenorth: not might, is :) 19:26:11 <orudge> well, it's recognisable I suppose in the edit mode 19:26:19 <orudge> but it renders horribly 19:26:30 <orudge> the existing ttdpatch wiki is still up, in read-only mode at the moment 19:26:38 <Alberth> Ammler: I don't have that file, and that name is also not in the python source. I want to add a '{svnrev}' to it. 19:26:39 <Terkhen> VarAction2Cities --> VarAction2Towns? :) 19:26:54 <andythenorth> :o 19:26:59 <Terkhen> nice :) 19:27:03 <andythenorth> media wiki supports real html 19:27:06 <andythenorth> I didn't know that :o 19:27:31 <orudge> It's quite likely that you may end up wanting some MediaWiki extensions 19:27:35 <Ammler> [21:27] <Alberth> Ammler: I don't have that file, and that name is also not in the python source. I want to add a '{svnrev}' to it. <-- needs hgsubversion 19:27:41 <orudge> I'll also look into sorting out sysops the like on the wiki 19:27:54 <Alberth> I have that, and a svn repo too :) 19:28:01 <Ammler> then what is the issue? 19:28:15 <Alberth> hg log does not show the svn revision 19:28:41 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@port-92-195-104-111.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 19:29:10 <Alberth> hg log --template "{rev}:{svnrev}\n" <- is what I do currently, but that does not show the full log message 19:30:00 <planetmaker> with that URL I get the tt-forums 19:30:06 <planetmaker> s/URL/IP/ 19:30:10 <orudge> planetmaker: I meant for you to add to your /etc/hosts :) 19:30:15 <orudge> or %windir%\system32\drivers\etc\hosts 19:30:16 <frosch123> orudge: there are lots of pages missing 19:30:24 <orudge> frosch123: if you make a list, I can copy those over 19:30:27 <orudge> they'll be at www.tt-wiki.net 19:30:30 <Alberth> Ammler: so I can make my own version of the default template, or use what already exists. I'd prefer the latter :) 19:30:37 <planetmaker> oh 19:30:41 <orudge> frosch123: I got everything from the TOC for the newgrf specs page, at least 19:30:41 <frosch123> e.g. the pages about action 0 default properties, or vehicle refitting 19:30:47 <frosch123> is there some special page about broken links? 19:30:51 <orudge> if they weren't on the TOC, they weren't copied 19:31:40 <frosch123> orudge: http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/Special:WantedPages 19:31:43 <frosch123> your list :) 19:31:48 <orudge> :) 19:31:57 <orudge> although, some of those are tutorials, etc 19:31:59 <orudge> which weren't to be copied 19:32:09 <orudge> indeed, it looks like most of them are 19:32:19 <Alberth> and some may be wanted originally :) 19:32:41 <frosch123> some places just reference those pages for a detailed explaination 19:32:57 <frosch123> of course they can be manually copied 19:32:57 <orudge> then they should link externally to the tt-wiki, probably 19:33:21 <Ammler> Alberth: well, the templates are editable, but it seems like it doesn't accept svnrev 19:33:42 <Alberth> which file is that? 19:33:57 <Ammler> e.g. mercurial/templates/map-cmdline.default 19:34:35 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-226-253.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:35:22 <Alberth> Ammler: thanks, this will do nicely, I just make a 'svnlog' alias with an adapted template. 19:37:10 <Ammler> Alberth: or as I said, add logtemplate="svnrevision: {svnrev}\nchangeset: {rev}:{node|short}\n{branches}{bookmarks}{tags}{parents}user: {author}\ndate: {date|date}\nsummary: {desc|firstline}\n\n" to .hgrc 19:37:31 <Ammler> or whatever :-) 19:38:14 <Alberth> oh, that's even better :) 19:38:42 <Ammler> I didn't have hgsubversion activated as I tested the first time 19:41:58 <Ammler> Alberth: it is a bit strange that hg convert does add svnrev, but you need hgsubversion to read it 19:44:42 <Alberth> Ammler: I only use hgsubversion 19:45:25 <Ammler> yep, but hg.openttd.org doesn't 19:46:24 <Alberth> I have a local mirror of opendune :p 19:46:46 *** Neon [~Neon@dslb-094-219-004-126.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:48:50 <Alberth> and hg.openttd.org has nicely added the svn revisions in the log text :) 19:49:22 <Ammler> hmm, can you push to svn.openttd.org with those repo? 19:50:40 <Alberth> I haven't tried that, and doing such a test on a public repo doesn't seem a very smart move :) 19:51:09 <planetmaker> orudge: is the TOC available as wikipage itself? 19:51:25 <orudge> planetmaker: not as such, it's autogenerated by a TikiWiki plug-in 19:51:38 <planetmaker> ok. I guess I'll start with that then 19:51:43 <orudge> sounds like a plan :) 19:52:02 <Alberth> Ammler: besides, I don't mind manually copying patches to a 'outgoing' repo, I often make small tweaks at that time. 19:53:03 <Ammler> so you commit with svn, still? 19:55:26 <Alberth> yes 19:56:20 <Alberth> and I like it better than hg, as you don't have that small moment between commit and push 19:58:36 <Ammler> well, the disadvantage is that you can't collect changesets :-) 19:59:07 <Alberth> indeed 19:59:42 *** asilv [~as@h-62-142-161-134.joensuunelli.fi] has joined #openttd 19:59:43 <Alberth> and a commit takes around a minute 20:00:04 <Alberth> mainly due to figuring out a log message :) 20:02:05 <Wolf01> 'night 20:02:08 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host202-229-dynamic.5-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 20:12:29 *** Kurimus [Kurimus@dsl-tkubrasgw3-fe64de00-55.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [] 20:16:39 *** DDR [~DDR@66.183.113.68] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:31:20 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: terkhen * r22556 /trunk/src/ (industry.h industry_cmd.cpp): -Codechange: Remove constness from the town pointer at industries. 20:31:59 *** goblin [~goblin@dslb-088-066-117-191.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 20:32:23 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: terkhen * r22557 /trunk/src/ (10 files): -Codechange: Remove constness from AnimationBase callbacks. 20:33:33 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: terkhen * r22558 /trunk/src/ (newgrf_spritegroup.h newgrf_station.cpp newgrf_station.h): -Codechange: Remove constness from BaseStation in ResolverObject. 20:34:07 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: terkhen * r22559 /trunk/src/ (3 files): -Codechange: Remove constness from Station in ResolverObject. 20:35:08 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: terkhen * r22560 /trunk/src/ (newgrf_house.cpp newgrf_house.h newgrf_spritegroup.h): -Codechange: Remove constness from House in ResolverObject. 20:36:03 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: terkhen * r22561 /trunk/src/ (newgrf_object.cpp newgrf_object.h newgrf_spritegroup.h): -Codechange: Remove constness from Object in ResolverObject. 20:36:56 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: terkhen * r22562 /trunk/src/ (5 files): -Codechange: Remove constness from TownGetVariable. 20:37:25 *** Juo [~Juo@82.132.248.200] has joined #openttd 20:37:28 <__ln__> what's wrong with constness? 20:37:37 <__ln__> tonight 20:37:56 <Terkhen> it gets in the way :) 20:38:16 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: terkhen * r22563 /trunk/src/ (6 files): -Codechange: Use a function for storing values inside the persistent storage. 20:39:56 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: terkhen * r22564 /trunk/src/ (7 files): -Codechange: Rename Get and Store persistent storage functions to GetValue and StoreValue. 20:40:47 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: terkhen * r22565 /trunk/src/ (newgrf_debug_gui.cpp table/newgrf_debug_data.h): -Codechange: Use helper functions for getting the persistent storage in the NewGRF debug GUI. 20:41:53 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: terkhen * r22566 /trunk/src/ (newgrf_commons.cpp newgrf_commons.h newgrf_house.cpp): -Codechange: Define and use OverrideManagerBase::GetGRFID function. 20:43:15 <andythenorth> hmm 20:43:27 * andythenorth seeks for better way to word this: "Light in TTD graphics comes from the bottom right of the screen." 20:44:56 *** Djohaal [~chatzilla@189.58.17.38.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has joined #openttd 20:45:00 <Djohaal> moo 20:45:59 <Alberth> hi 20:46:45 <Alberth> andythenorth: that would be nice 20:47:16 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: terkhen * r22567 /trunk/ (23 files in 5 dirs): -Codechange: Store persistent storages inside a pool. 20:48:37 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: terkhen * r22568 /trunk/src/ (saveload/town_sl.cpp town.h): -Change: Add a list of persistent storages to the Town class. 20:48:56 <andythenorth> not all light does come from bottom right 20:49:01 <andythenorth> which makes it more complicated :P 20:49:33 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: terkhen * r22569 /trunk/src/ (8 files in 2 dirs): -Feature: [NewGRF] Persistent storage for towns. 20:50:06 <andythenorth> Andersl has pointed out direction of plane shadow (1 o'clock) 20:50:10 *** r0w [~r0w@77-56-133-189.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:50:20 *** Juo [~Juo@82.132.248.200] has quit [Quit: Juo] 20:50:24 <andythenorth> it's primarily buildings which are lit from 4-5 o'clock 20:51:08 <Alberth> I just read that. It looks like we have several suns in the world :) 20:51:08 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: terkhen * r22570 /trunk/src/ (3 files in 2 dirs): -Codechange: Store the GrfID of the caller when opening a parent window in the NewGRF debug GUI. 20:52:22 <Djohaal> lol 20:52:30 <Djohaal> hmm, may I throw a thought out of the blue? 20:52:45 <Alberth> @get -3 20:52:45 <DorpsGek> Alberth: Don't ask to ask, just ask 20:52:46 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: terkhen * r22571 /trunk/src/ (3 files in 2 dirs): -Add: [NewGRF] Show town persistent storage in the NewGRF debug GUI. 20:53:08 <Terkhen> now... how should I document this? :P 20:53:09 <Alberth> although that one is primarily for questions :) 20:53:53 <Djohaal> well last IRC I popped in to mention it someone got a bit sour :\ 20:53:56 <Alberth> Terkhen: I heard we have a brand new wiki :) 20:54:34 <Terkhen> :) 20:54:47 <Terkhen> what can I do to help to set up the new wiki? 20:54:47 <planetmaker> :-) 20:54:50 <planetmaker> Main menu is done 20:54:55 <Terkhen> awesome :) 20:55:10 <planetmaker> http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/Main_Page 20:55:20 <planetmaker> sub pages all need re-formatting still, I guess 20:55:26 <planetmaker> but they're all there 20:55:32 <planetmaker> s/all/most/ ;-) 20:55:46 <planetmaker> But please go and add it there indeed... 20:55:50 <planetmaker> might make sense 20:55:52 <Terkhen> ok, I'll start with the formatting :) 20:55:56 <Alberth> Djohaal: it depends on how you bring it. demanding things usually don't go down very well 20:56:09 <Djohaal> well I'm not demanding, I'm looking for someone :p 20:56:16 <Alberth> @seen someone 20:56:16 <DorpsGek> Alberth: someone was last seen in #openttd 34 weeks, 1 day, 3 hours, 16 minutes, and 24 seconds ago: <Someone> indeed 20:56:21 <Terkhen> Djohaal: ask :P 20:56:25 <Ammler> why subdir wiki? 20:56:32 <Djohaal> a coder who can do either C++ or C# and would be interested at working on an open source simcity 4 clone :p 20:56:44 <planetmaker> hahaha :-) 20:57:06 * Terkhen already has enough with openttd :P 20:57:12 <planetmaker> same here 20:57:27 <Terkhen> planetmaker: do we have a template on how formatting should be done or something? 20:57:37 <planetmaker> nothing defined as of now, I think 20:57:54 <planetmaker> I found the existing style not that bad actually 20:58:03 <planetmaker> except that it misses features 20:58:24 <Alberth> Djohaal: you may want to post a request in the off-topic section of the forum 20:58:27 <Terkhen> if you have set formatting already in some page it would be helpful so I can use it as an example :) 20:58:35 <orudge> Ammler: because it's bad practice not to use some sort of subdir, in theory it can break certain things in MediaWiki :) 20:58:40 <Djohaal> Alberth: well I guess it can't hurt 20:58:56 <frosch123> orudge: shall i still create a list for you? 20:59:01 <planetmaker> well, what page should I give a shot, Terkhen ? 20:59:09 <orudge> frosch123: if there are pages missing that definitely need to be ported over, yes 20:59:10 <Terkhen> oh right, the index :P 20:59:23 <Terkhen> ok, I'll begin :) 20:59:44 <Alberth> Djohaal: I wouldn't really know how to find one. The best way may be to simply start yourself, and wait until one passes by. 21:00:27 <Djohaal> Alberth: well that's an issue, at the moment we have no coders at the simcity community, and I'm not exactly on the position to learn coding (4th year of medschool :\ ) 21:00:40 <frosch123> orudge: http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/272/ 21:00:54 <orudge> frosch123: OK, I'll look those out shortly 21:01:00 <Ammler> orudge: well, but it looks stupid 21:01:12 <frosch123> orudge: is there also some way to port the images? 21:01:18 *** DAnius95 [~0a0a6567@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 21:01:28 <orudge> frosch123: yes, but they'll have to be done individually. You can upload them yourself as required. 21:01:40 <orudge> If you require any mediawiki extensions for more flexibility with images, let me know 21:01:44 <Ammler> and afaik, you don't need hacks, it is supported per default 21:02:01 <orudge> Ammler: it looks just the same as Wikipedia and every wiki I've seen except the OpenTTD wiki ;) 21:02:16 <orudge> the /wiki/ bit is only for the nice URLs, physically everything is in /, by the way 21:02:21 <frosch123> planetmaker: did you left out some of the additional references intentional? 21:02:30 <planetmaker> nope 21:02:43 <planetmaker> which do you mean? 21:02:59 <DAnius95> hey what are you talking about 21:03:01 <frosch123> textids for example 21:03:38 <orudge> also, planetmaker, you're now a wiki admin 21:03:38 <planetmaker> that was something I needed to think about. I guess it goes to the TTD defaults section 21:03:40 <orudge> on the newgrf wiki 21:03:43 <frosch123> though only a subset of them is important 21:03:44 <planetmaker> orudge: thanks 21:04:58 *** DAnius95 [~0a0a6567@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [] 21:07:36 <Alberth> andythenorth: dairy in the snow is looking great! 21:07:44 <andythenorth> thanks :) 21:07:50 <andythenorth> some snow takes a long time 21:07:54 <andythenorth> others are quick 21:08:02 <andythenorth> the dairy was not quick :P 21:08:16 <Ammler> orudge: then it is even more silly, imo 21:09:39 <orudge> Ammler: perhaps, but there are, for instance, PHP scripts that may need to be accessed directly (not, admittedly, by most users) that would be inaccessible were the rewrite to take place on / instead of /wiki/, which is why MediaWiki recommends it be set up this way 21:10:40 <Ammler> that is if you mix different apps on same app, isn't? 21:10:51 <Ammler> same vhost* 21:12:08 *** Djohaal [~chatzilla@189.58.17.38.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86.1 [Firefox 3.6.17/20110420140830]] 21:13:57 *** Chrill [~chrischri@h-5-149.A212.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [] 21:15:09 <Terkhen> planetmaker: what style for tables? default ones have no borders :/ 21:15:32 <planetmaker> Just found out on that, too :S 21:15:37 <planetmaker> I'd prefer simple lines 21:15:50 <planetmaker> Without outside border 21:16:06 <andythenorth> 1px single line 21:16:09 <andythenorth> throughout 21:16:23 <andythenorth> if colour is an option, try #ddd 21:16:44 <planetmaker> colour is an option 21:16:50 <andythenorth> can you set th? 21:17:04 <planetmaker> in principle. But I need to familiarize with wiki code 21:17:06 <Terkhen> http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Tables <--- I like the "Simple one-pixel table border" in this tuto 21:17:35 <Terkhen> having to write that code everywhere will be extremely tedious though 21:17:46 <Terkhen> probably there is an option to make a given table style "global" 21:18:07 <frosch123> there are table templates or something like that 21:18:11 <orudge> frosch123: those pages are now importede 21:18:20 <frosch123> thanks 21:18:38 <bodis> hmm why flying from one side of 2048 map to the other would earn only 9k 21:18:43 <Terkhen> hmm... ok, I'll use default ones for now and look into templates later 21:18:47 <frosch123> btw. i would like to MediaWiki:Sidebar, but I am not allowed to :) 21:18:53 <frosch123> *edit 21:19:00 <Terkhen> I'm doing VarAction2Advanced btw, just in case we are doing the same thing :P 21:19:02 <andythenorth> there's no way to apply a class to the table? 21:19:39 <frosch123> andythenorth: afaik you can reference a template at the start of the table 21:19:57 * andythenorth is too old to learn media wiki :P 21:20:05 <andythenorth> maybe I will be younger tomorrow 21:20:12 <Alberth> bodis: you need a faster plane :p 21:20:20 *** Elvang [~Elvang@ip70-190-173-60.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined #openttd 21:20:30 <Elvang> Greetings 21:20:31 <bodis> yeah not many available in 1956 21:20:33 <bodis> :) 21:20:34 <Alberth> hi 21:20:35 <bodis> hi 21:20:45 <planetmaker> Terkhen: just set cellspacing=0, border="1" in the table header 21:20:46 <bodis> but 591 is a decent speed 21:20:53 <Elvang> Anything special I have to do in order to join stations in multiplayer? 21:20:55 <bodis> is there a cap on how much you can earn? 21:21:03 <planetmaker> Terkhen: I started with Action0General 21:21:12 <planetmaker> So... we're not doing the same. Puh! :-) 21:21:38 <Alberth> bodis: yeah, something with 18 or more zeroes 21:21:47 <Terkhen> :) 21:21:47 <bodis> lol 21:21:57 <bodis> this doesnt make sense 21:21:58 <Terkhen> it looks nice with cellspacing=0, border="1", but we should use something global 21:22:01 <bodis> nm 21:22:06 <Terkhen> as soon as we finish we look into it :P 21:22:24 <andythenorth> could probably adjust Common.css 21:22:30 <Alberth> Elvang: not that I am aware of, you cannot join with another company though 21:23:10 <Elvang> I'm holding control, but the station selection window never pops up. Other players appear to be able to join stations though... 21:23:11 <Alberth> bodis: try half that distance first 21:23:27 <bodis> why would that matter? 21:23:32 * andythenorth -> bed 21:23:34 <Alberth> even when you place it at 1 tile distance? 21:23:36 <bodis> nn 21:23:43 <Alberth> good night andythenorth 21:23:46 <andythenorth> night 21:23:48 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc18-aztw25-2-0-cust185.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has left #openttd [] 21:23:52 <Elvang> Yea 21:24:24 <Alberth> bodis: probably not, but it may give insight in what is happening 21:24:34 <bodis> ok 21:24:37 <bodis> :) 21:24:50 *** welterde [welterde@thinkbase.srv.welterde.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:25:16 <planetmaker> I guess I'll indeed define it in common.css 21:25:21 <Terkhen> I chose the biggest, ugliest table :P 21:25:32 <planetmaker> yep :-p 21:25:42 <planetmaker> that's why I did NOT start there ;-) 21:25:53 <Alberth> Elvang: the only thing I can think of is that you have the join stations settings switched off. I don't know whether it is a client or a server settings 21:26:25 <frosch123> planetmaker: what's "refit paths"? 21:26:30 <Elvang> "Allow building adjacent stations" right? 21:26:33 <planetmaker> your refit image 21:26:47 <Elvang> Its listed green, while the "not directly adjacent" option is red. 21:26:49 <planetmaker> please choose a better name :-) 21:26:52 <frosch123> ok, then i'll change that to the currently imported page, ok? 21:26:58 <planetmaker> yep, please. 21:27:15 <Terkhen> Elvang: no, allow to join directly adyacent 21:27:19 <Terkhen> adjacent* 21:27:25 <Elvang> Yea, its enabled 21:28:01 <Terkhen> but you said that "join not directly adjacent" was red 21:28:08 <Alberth> 'adjacent stations' sounds like they are placed right next to each other 21:28:13 <Elvang> Right 21:28:47 <Alberth> iirc, that is for building your stations directly next to the competitor 21:29:25 <Eddi|zuHause> [12.06.2011 21:00] <orudge> and newgrf.tt-wiki.net (or grfspecs.tt-wiki.net, whatever you want to call it :P) can be the new specs wiki <-- may i suggest nfospecs.tt-wiki.net? 21:29:32 <planetmaker> Terkhen: what name should the table style have? 21:29:36 <Elvang> I don't see any other options in Advanced Settings that are related to station joining 21:30:03 <Terkhen> Elvang: that setting should be green 21:30:10 <Terkhen> planetmaker: I don't know :) 21:30:13 <Eddi|zuHause> might neatly integrate with "nmlspecs" next to it as well 21:30:17 <Elvang> The directly adjacent one is, the non adjacent one is red 21:31:15 <Terkhen> non adjacent -> green 21:32:30 <Elvang> Can't change it, I'm assuming clients are stuck with whatever settings the server has set 21:32:59 <Alberth> that is very well possible 21:33:09 <Elvang> Other players on the server are able to join their stations though... 21:33:20 <Terkhen> Elvang: are you sure? or are they using station walk? 21:33:30 <Elvang> Station walk? 21:34:15 <Terkhen> build and demolish station tiles until you get a station as separated as you want 21:34:54 *** Intexon_ [~Intexon@blk-222-147-135.eastlink.ca] has joined #openttd 21:35:09 <Elvang> I don't think so, one player has several 2x14 rail stations set up in this game 21:35:31 <Elvang> Last map a player had bus stations joined to all his rail stations as well (same server) 21:35:51 *** xi23 [~xi23@ip-85-161-75-68.eurotel.cz] has joined #openttd 21:36:03 <Terkhen> strange 21:36:28 <Elvang> Eh 21:36:42 <Elvang> Just found some bus stations joined to an airport, about 8 tiles apart 21:36:58 <Terkhen> http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/VarAction2Advanced <--- something like this? 21:38:19 <Elvang> That link directed at me? 21:38:24 <frosch123> http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/index.php?title=Action0Cargos <- that page is completely broken 21:38:26 <Terkhen> Elvang: no 21:38:27 <frosch123> half is missing 21:38:31 <Elvang> Ah, k 21:38:50 <Terkhen> Elvang: the only thing I can think that might have happened is that the setting was enabled before and later it was desabled 21:38:52 <planetmaker> Terkhen: yes. But use the default wikitable class without other frills 21:38:58 <planetmaker> I'll try to change the default 21:39:01 <Terkhen> ok :) 21:39:07 <planetmaker> to something like that 21:39:33 <orudge> frosch123: http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=Action0Cargos <-- looks the same as the old page to me 21:39:42 <planetmaker> thus just class="wikitable" in the table header 21:39:44 <orudge> frosch123: obviously, formatting is messed up, but content seems to be the same 21:40:19 *** Intexon [~Intexon@blk-222-147-135.eastlink.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:40:31 <Elvang> Possible, wouldn't "Allow building adjacent stations" allow me to join touching stations though? 21:40:54 <frosch123> orudge: no, half of 10,11,12, complete 13 and 14 are missing 21:41:01 <Terkhen> Elvang: no, that settings allows you to build stations adjacent to other player's companies 21:41:19 <Elvang> I just tried that, got a red message box saying I'm building to close 21:41:30 <Terkhen> I won't be doing more formatting today, it is too late :) 21:41:53 <orudge> frosch123: strange. Well, you can copy them out of the original wiki; I guess the markup converter somehow ended up deleting them. :/ 21:42:27 <frosch123> planetmaker: Terkhen: then please be aware that the pages might miss content :) 21:42:28 *** welterde [welterde@thinkbase.srv.welterde.de] has joined #openttd 21:42:43 <orudge> I won't be deleting the original wiki any time soon, although it is now read-only 21:42:44 <planetmaker> hm, they do? 21:42:46 <Terkhen> ok, I have been checking each line against the original wiki 21:43:09 <frosch123> orudge: planetmaker: i would like to edit the sidebar, but only mods are allowed to :) 21:43:17 <planetmaker> what is missing? 21:43:36 <orudge> frosch123: I'll give you admin for now too, ideally will have to sort out admin/mods properly at some point in the future 21:43:39 <frosch123> planetmaker: action0 cargos misses sections on 10,11,12 (half), 13 and 14 21:43:59 <orudge> all of the revision history is there, so I really don't know why it's gone missing 21:44:03 <frosch123> planetmaker: i just wanted to link the cargo classes from the main page :s 21:44:08 <orudge> I guess when updating a page, just compare it against the original one and ensure it's all fine 21:44:34 <frosch123> planetmaker: btw. i added a section "NewGRF commons" to the main page, for stuff which is not exaclty spec, but agreed on 21:44:43 <planetmaker> ok 21:44:59 <Terkhen> planetmaker: once that the class for tables is set, we should paste a few example links at the transport tycoon wiki thread so anyone interested on formatting can get to it :) 21:45:01 <planetmaker> I guess I can't grant you elevated edit rights, frosch123 21:45:03 <orudge> frosch123: you're an admin now 21:45:12 <Terkhen> brb 21:45:29 <planetmaker> Terkhen: it then should suffice to just use class=wikitable and that's it 21:46:09 <planetmaker> shouldn't there be at least on other burocrat, too, orudge ? 21:46:39 <Terkhen> from the "other side" maybe :P 21:46:42 <orudge> planetmaker: eventually, yes. Ideally need to figure this out properly though rather than just appointing random people at the moment ;) 21:47:00 <planetmaker> yep :-) 21:47:21 <Elvang> Thought it might just be that server, but I looked for another that had joined stations going on; couldn't do it on that one either <_< 21:47:42 <Yexo> Elvang: do you know you need to press ctrl to build adjacent stations? 21:47:46 <Elvang> Yes 21:47:54 <Elvang> I do it regularly in sp 21:48:06 <Elvang> Just for the life of my can't get it to work in mp :( 21:48:10 <Elvang> me* 21:48:16 <Yexo> if it works for you in sp and not in mp the most likely reason is that the server has turned the setting of 21:48:33 <Yexo> got an example of a server where it doesn't work? 21:48:37 <Elvang> Others are doing it though in the same server I am in 21:48:41 <Elvang> Yea 21:48:44 <Yexo> hmm, that is strange 21:50:54 <Elvang> Heres the settings the server is using, along with an attempt to build a station next to a competitors: http://i51.tinypic.com/2nvypsg.jpg 21:50:57 *** Amis_ [~Amis@5400C2AD.dsl.pool.telekom.hu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:52:02 <Elvang> He built those (bus station joined to airport, couple rail stations) after I joined while I was trying to join some, so I don't think someone was flipping the settings on/off 21:52:18 <Yexo> which server is that? 21:52:31 <Yexo> I can't reproduce it, so I'd like to try and join that server to see if it works there for me 21:52:41 <Elvang> There a way to copy server info? 21:52:51 <Yexo> name of the server is enough 21:53:07 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-89-176-248-242.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:53:19 * Terkhen does another page :P 21:53:32 <Elvang> # www.n-ice.org #2 [Metropolis Goal, 1975-2040]# 21:53:33 <frosch123> planetmaker: updated the sidebar, comments? 21:53:33 *** asilv [~as@h-62-142-161-134.joensuunelli.fi] has quit [Quit: asilv] 21:53:56 <planetmaker> myself? Not yet 21:54:20 <frosch123> no, i just did :) do you want to comment on the sections i choosed :) 21:55:14 <planetmaker> main page, community portal, current events, recent changes, random page? 21:55:21 <frosch123> not sure whether there should be as prominent links to nml or the devzone 21:55:23 <planetmaker> I didn't quite look at it initially :-P 21:55:40 <planetmaker> Hm... might make sense actually 21:55:43 <frosch123> planetmaker: reload some page, so you get a new one :) 21:55:44 <Terkhen> the changes appear in any page except the first one for me 21:57:44 <planetmaker> Reload first didn't work. But yes. Now that you asked: I think DevZone and NML docs make sense to me 21:58:01 <planetmaker> bananas maybe? 21:58:31 <frosch123> quite some stuff is already explained under "Tools" 21:58:48 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 22:00:02 *** Alberth [~hat@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has left #openttd [] 22:00:08 <planetmaker> hm. yes 22:01:06 <planetmaker> Dunno... Maybe add a link to the DevZone. They get many free and extensive examples there :-) 22:01:29 <planetmaker> but then... that's also under 'tools'... 22:03:52 <frosch123> #openttdcoop is too long, i just put Development Zone :) 22:14:33 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-26-30-55.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:17:08 <frosch123> night 22:17:10 *** LordPixaII [~Pixa@85.210.67.111] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:17:23 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d008554.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:23:10 *** DDR [~DDR@66.183.113.68] has joined #openttd 22:25:01 <Hirundo> Terkhen: If I get r22569 correctly, you always need to explicitly set register 100 before reading/writing to town storage, right? (assuming no grf with id 0) 22:25:39 <Terkhen> Hirundo: yes, if the register is not set you can't access town storage at all 22:26:18 *** TWerkhoven [~twerkhove@cpc14-linl7-2-0-cust28.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: He who can look into the future, has a brighter future to look into] 22:27:05 <Terkhen> a newgrf only has write access to the storage of its own grfid, but can read any storage 22:27:27 <Terkhen> and items that are still not built cannot access town storage at all 22:27:33 <Terkhen> that's the idea :) 22:31:08 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@95.76.27.160] has quit [Quit: TTW - http://www.moddb.com/mods/the-third-tiberium-war] 22:33:28 *** zodttd [~me@user-0c90n0l.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Quit: zodttd] 22:35:05 *** haukinger [548054d0@ircip3.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 22:40:14 <Terkhen> planetmaker: is the table template supposed to work now? 22:42:26 <planetmaker> not yet, I'm afraid 22:43:57 *** Adambean [AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has quit [Quit: Gone fishing] 22:45:00 *** Pulec [~pulec@static-cl093181068250.unet.cz] has quit [] 22:49:35 <Ammler> maybe we can also move some generic guide things from the devzone to the new wiki 22:50:14 <Terkhen> good luck with the template, I'm going to bed :) 22:50:16 <Terkhen> good night 22:50:53 *** hgnmu128 [~hgnmu128@117.204.82.191] has joined #openttd 22:52:09 *** devilsadvocate [~quassel@109.200.19.188] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:55:33 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 22:57:09 *** pugi [~pugi@p4FCC461E.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: I reject your reality and substitute my own] 23:00:27 *** goblin [~goblin@dslb-088-066-117-191.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:13:26 *** hgnmu128_ [~hgnmu128@117.204.80.87] has joined #openttd 23:16:46 *** hgnmu128___ [~hgnmu128@117.204.85.32] has joined #openttd 23:16:51 *** hgnmu128 is now known as Guest4397 23:16:51 *** hgnmu128___ is now known as hgnmu128 23:17:15 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:18:29 *** Guest4397 [~hgnmu128@117.204.82.191] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:21:57 <Elvang> How big a penalty is there for pathing through the back of a Path Signal? 23:23:24 *** hgnmu128_ [~hgnmu128@117.204.80.87] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:26:11 *** amkoroew1 [~Heinz@p5B107E15.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 23:31:00 *** amkoroew [~Heinz@p5B1031CB.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:40:52 *** devilsadvocate [~quassel@109.200.19.188] has joined #openttd 23:42:17 <CIA-10> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r22572 /trunk/src/vehicle.cpp: -Fix: MSVC performance warning (assigning int to bool). 23:44:08 <Eddi|zuHause> Elvang: go to the ingame console and type "list_settings pf.yapf.rail" 23:44:19 <Eddi|zuHause> 1 tile = 100 23:46:35 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1B6C5.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:54:39 <Elvang> Ah, thanks Eddi|zuHause 23:55:02 *** DoubleYou [~jkuckartz@ppp118-209-69-162.lns20.mel4.internode.on.net] has joined #openttd 23:55:20 <michi_cc> orudge: The new wiki says my username ("Michi_cc") is invalid, likely because MediaWiki silently converts _ to spaces. I know TB had the same troubles when unifying the OpenTTD accounts, but I don't know what exactly he did to fix it. 23:56:34 <Elvang> Hmm. My trains refuse to use any depot with a path signal infront of it, even though they can path through it albeit with a penalty... 23:57:40 <Eddi|zuHause> there is a limit on the maximum penalty for automatically choosing a depot 23:58:51 <Elvang> It listed 1500(15 tiles), and theres a depot every ~20 or so but they ignore all of them until I remove the path signal 23:59:15 <Elvang> They'll path to them only if I tell them to head for depot :( 23:59:45 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, the path signal has a quite big penalty, so the distance is very small