Times are UTC Toggle Colours
00:03:11 *** Djohaal [~Djohaal@201.47.15.57.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has joined #openttd 00:08:31 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-89-240.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:29:58 *** mal2 [~mal2@port-92-206-81-172.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:48:00 *** Djohaal [~Djohaal@201.47.15.57.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:51:20 *** KritiK [~Maxim@93-80-207-65.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:10:04 *** kkb110_ [~kkb110@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:11:34 *** kkb110 [~kkb110@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-03.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has joined #openttd 01:21:41 *** Zeknurn [~Zeknurn@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:23:59 *** KouDy [~KouDy@175.137.102.249] has joined #openttd 01:29:17 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-78-45-92-151.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 01:37:21 *** kkb110 [~kkb110@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-03.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:55:02 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F6AE76.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 02:01:30 *** kkb110 [~kkb110@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-04.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has joined #openttd 02:01:50 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@i59F6D0FB.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:15:17 *** yorick_ [~yorick@ip51cd0513.speed.planet.nl] has joined #openttd 02:17:27 *** yorick [~yorick@ip51cd0513.speed.planet.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:24:52 *** brambles [brambles@79.133.200.49] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:25:31 *** brambles [brambles@79.133.200.49] has joined #openttd 02:56:37 *** kkb110 [~kkb110@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-04.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:56:49 *** kkb110 [~kkb110@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-04.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has joined #openttd 03:00:31 *** roadt_ 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*** supermop [~daniel_er@cpe-67-250-2-219.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: supermop] 05:14:46 <andythenorth> mm 05:14:48 <andythenorth> lighthouses 05:16:58 *** Rubidium [~Rubidium@noiv.net] has joined #openttd 05:19:39 <telanus> hi 05:27:10 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5e09ee84.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:37:44 *** Zeknurn [~Zeknurn@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 05:51:34 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 05:54:00 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.73.34] has joined #openttd 05:59:09 *** KingPixaIII [~pixa@79-68-96-3.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has joined #openttd 06:00:17 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@79-68-108-131.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:04:05 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.73.34] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:05:25 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@95.76.26.172] has joined #openttd 06:11:43 *** Eddi|zuHause2 [~johekr@p5DC679C3.dip.t-dialin.net] 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quit [Quit: for the love of god this is not safe for work] 08:11:36 *** KingPixaIII is now known as Pixa 08:13:01 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:14:59 *** roadt_ [~roadt@60.168.82.215] has joined #openttd 08:18:44 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@s55978e11.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 08:23:48 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host139-62-dynamic.252-95-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 08:24:27 <Wolf01> hello 08:25:03 *** zxbiohazardzx [~IceChat77@5ED05D6D.cm-7-1b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 08:27:56 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:32:45 *** A5fa3237b [~A5fa3237b@04ZAACOAT.tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:46:16 *** tegro [~undefined@78-105-226-68.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 08:47:49 *** GBerten2936 is now known as lugo 08:48:44 *** tegro_ [~undefined@78-105-226-68.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 09:04:04 *** mal2 [~mal2@port-92-206-96-103.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:13:23 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-78-45-92-151.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 09:13:30 *** kkb110 [~kkb110@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-04.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:21:40 *** FLHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 09:26:37 *** tijl [~tijl@vhe-540241.sshn.net] has joined #openttd 09:31:10 *** tijl [~tijl@vhe-540241.sshn.net] has quit [] 09:31:52 *** zooks [~zooks@vhe-540241.sshn.net] has joined #openttd 09:32:02 *** zooks [~zooks@vhe-540241.sshn.net] has quit [] 09:32:24 *** zooks [~zooks@vhe-540241.sshn.net] has joined #openttd 09:42:26 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F6AE76.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 09:53:38 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd 09:56:39 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@s55978e11.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:13:33 *** TGYoshi [~TGYoshi@86.81.146.146] has joined #openttd 10:15:52 *** Rhamphoryncus [~rhamph@d161-184-227-133.abhsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: Rhamphoryncus] 10:16:21 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@95.76.26.172] has quit [Quit: DANGER sla.ro is OFFLINE DANGER] 11:00:26 *** oskari89 [~oskari89@213-186-253-165.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 11:04:49 *** mal2 [~mal2@z529a.pia.fu-berlin.de] has joined #openttd 11:13:30 *** Firartix [~artixds@222.140.0.93.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:29:46 *** Amaury [~Admin@can59-h01-31-32-213-195.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr] has joined #openttd 11:29:53 <Amaury> Hi everbody 11:31:25 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-78-45-92-151.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:31:52 *** Amaury_ [~Admin@can59-h01-31-32-213-195.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr] has joined #openttd 11:32:10 <FLHerne> Hello 11:32:23 <FLHerne> This channel is a bit quiet :P 11:32:37 <Amaury_> =) 11:32:44 <Amaury_> is there a probleme with server to join ? 11:32:44 <Sacro> that's just how it seems 11:33:01 <Amaury_> i'm not able to update server list 11:33:23 <Amaury_> may be because of 1.2 ? 11:34:08 <Amaury_> anyone able to play ? 11:34:33 *** Amaury [~Admin@can59-h01-31-32-213-195.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr] has quit [] 11:44:11 <Amaury_> is there someone here ? 11:44:22 <Amaury_> Sacro, FLHerne ? 11:44:58 <Sacro> ? 11:45:08 <Sacro> Looks fine 11:45:32 <Amaury_> hum ... how can I diagnostik the probleme ? 11:46:04 <Amaury_> when I want to update TTD answer unable to connect server 11:46:55 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host139-62-dynamic.252-95-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:47:37 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host139-62-dynamic.252-95-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 11:51:18 * FLHerne doesn't use multiplayer enough to know :-( 11:56:39 <planetmaker> If you can't connect to a server, you the server's down or it has mal-configured ports somewhere. Usually 12:08:54 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 12:09:16 <planetmaker> ^ Amaury_ 12:11:17 <NGC3982> marknadsundersökningsprogrammering. 12:11:20 <NGC3982> swedish. <3 12:13:01 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:58a9:286d:ee6a:7077] has joined #openttd 12:13:04 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 12:16:25 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@95.76.26.172] has joined #openttd 12:18:19 *** Pikka [~chatzilla@d58-111-69-99.rdl800.qld.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 12:24:16 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-43-55.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 12:29:41 *** krinn [~krinn@114.54.71.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #openttd 12:30:02 <krinn> hi 12:44:24 <andythenorth> Pikka le bird 12:51:20 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-83-134-166-70.dsl.scarlet.be] has joined #openttd 12:51:59 <Pikka> oui 12:53:31 <Eddi|zuHause> lö börd? 12:54:49 <andythenorth> le Eddi|zuHause 12:54:51 <andythenorth> or das Eddi|zuHause 12:55:06 <andythenorth> have you mastered pixa yet? 12:55:16 <Eddi|zuHause> as long as it's not "die Eddi|zuHause" :p 12:55:16 <andythenorth> I should have called it pikka :P 12:55:43 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i have not continued yet from the state of yesterday 12:55:50 <andythenorth> looked pretty good 12:56:18 <andythenorth> I'm going to make an example teaching how to generate 'hello world' text using pixels :P 12:56:19 <andythenorth> in increasingly complex ways 12:56:23 <andythenorth> but not today 12:56:30 <andythenorth> today I am trying to sell something to Australia 12:57:41 <Eddi|zuHause> i hope it's not didgeridoos :) 12:58:50 <andythenorth> they have them I think 12:58:55 <andythenorth> probably got enough 13:11:12 <Pikka> wobbleboards 13:11:19 <andythenorth> need some? 13:11:32 <Pikka> probably not 13:11:45 * andythenorth has been poking at FIRS some more 13:11:58 <andythenorth> Pikka: when is your industry set ready? :P 13:12:08 <andythenorth> you should include a minecraft mine :P 13:12:23 <FLHerne> For mining minecraft? 13:12:31 <andythenorth> yup 13:12:44 <andythenorth> ideally, if you click on it, we provide a new cb for 'game over' 13:13:01 <FLHerne> What does mined minecraft from a minecraft mine look like when you mine it? :P 13:13:02 <Pikka> I had contemplated a minecraft grf 13:13:19 <Wolf01> me too 13:13:20 <andythenorth> discuss? 13:13:22 <Pikka> it's one of those things that seems like a cool idea 13:13:27 <Pikka> but on more thought 13:13:30 <Pikka> even I wouldn't use it 13:13:30 <andythenorth> implementing minecraft in ttd :P 13:13:40 <andythenorth> implementing TTD in minecraft seems more plausible 13:13:59 <Pikka> yes 13:14:01 <andythenorth> someone I know patched a full js interpreter into minecraft iirc 13:14:11 <andythenorth> so build a C++ emulator in javascript :P 13:14:17 <Pikka> D; 13:14:44 <andythenorth> :) 13:14:48 *** TheMask96 [martijn@polaris.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:14:50 <Pikka> minecraft is silly, really 13:15:07 <Pikka> although I have been playing a bit of old yobgox recently 13:15:15 <andythenorth> I've stayed out of minecrack 13:15:18 <andythenorth> I know what would happen :P 13:15:19 <Pikka> I'd play newer yobgox but it's very unstable 13:15:27 <andythenorth> I've nothing against MC, but I only get one life 13:15:47 *** zxbiohazardzx [~IceChat77@5ED05D6D.cm-7-1b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:15:50 <Pikka> there are worse things to do with your life than minecraft 13:16:06 <FLHerne> Is OTTD one of them? :P 13:16:13 <Pikka> not necessarily 13:16:56 <andythenorth> I've run out of discretionary time, for the next 18 years or so 13:17:11 <andythenorth> I do work, children, ottd and sleep in that order 13:19:03 *** TheMask96 [martijn@polaris.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 13:23:30 <Eddi|zuHause> surely, playing minecraft will only need dropping one of those :p 13:24:04 <Pikka> minecraft is actually pretty boring 13:24:11 <Pikka> one tends to play it in spurts 13:26:04 <andythenorth> as far as I can see, it's project based 13:26:08 <andythenorth> seems like online lego 13:26:15 <andythenorth> 'can I build a cannon in minecraft?' 13:26:20 <andythenorth> 'can I build a roller coaster' 13:26:36 <andythenorth> 'can I build an automated mine cart dispatching system?' 13:26:43 <andythenorth> 'how far can I throw stuff?' 13:26:45 <Pikka> eh 13:26:49 <andythenorth> no? 13:26:49 <Pikka> depends 13:27:13 <Pikka> well, online is even more griefer-prone than openttd 13:27:25 <andythenorth> all the players I know just hack on it 13:27:28 <andythenorth> rather than playing 13:27:45 <CornishPasty> I wonder if you can create OpenTTD systems in minecraft... :P 13:30:08 <oskari89> Pikka? 13:30:14 <Pikka> andy: and because it's so griefer-prone, all the servers use whitelists and only let people in who they know. and getting to know minecraft players is not much fun. 13:30:21 <andythenorth> he :) 13:30:46 <Pikka> I think sss on the forums would be at the "thoughtful, intelligent and mature" end of the minecraft community spectrum. 13:30:51 *** roboboy [~robotboy@CPE-58-173-43-55.nxzp1.ken.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:31:52 <Pikka> even with mods it's a fairly shallow game, in either single or multi player imo 13:32:03 <andythenorth> millions of downloads! 13:32:08 <andythenorth> â¬8 per download! 13:32:12 <Pikka> yes 13:32:14 <Pikka> there is that 13:32:20 <andythenorth> notch! 13:32:21 <andythenorth> etc 13:32:43 <Pikka> it would be nice if the openttd devs had three million dollars that they decided they didn't really need so could give away to their friends. 13:33:20 <andythenorth> we should help them get it 13:33:20 <zooks> minecraft alse is loaded with really bad bugs 13:33:22 <andythenorth> bananas! 13:33:25 <zooks> like memleaks and stuff 13:33:29 <Pikka> yes zooks 13:34:10 <zooks> as there is only 5 people working on the game and they are only interested in adding features to attract more sales 13:34:24 <Pikka> no zooks 13:34:31 <zooks> well maybe more heh 13:37:35 <Pikka> andythenorth: I'm not sure how monetisable GPL-licenced content is, though. 13:38:14 *** Fori [5ce44709@ircip2.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 13:38:26 <Fori> Hi! 13:39:10 <Pikka> from my point of view, as far as possibly making money from OTTD goes, I can only see grfs as an audience-building tool, rather than saleable products in themselves. 13:39:19 <dihedral> oi 13:39:21 <dihedral> :) 13:39:48 <Pikka> hello dihedral 13:39:59 <dihedral> uh - hi :-) a Pikka :-) 13:42:05 <andythenorth> Pikka: we just charge for the pipe, i.e. Bananas 13:42:12 <andythenorth> conwenience 13:42:36 <andythenorth> same reason I pay apple, instead of doing illegal limewire-ish type things 13:42:38 <andythenorth> but yeah 13:42:39 <andythenorth> and no 13:42:50 <Fori> Is there any possibility for trains being replaced by the same train but a newer model? 13:43:05 <andythenorth> yes and no 13:43:19 <andythenorth> pikka does it 13:43:34 <andythenorth> but not in a way you can use with auto-replace :P 13:43:41 <Pikka> yes 13:43:43 <andythenorth> I invented a spec for it the other day 13:43:43 <Pikka> it is a bad idea 13:43:55 <andythenorth> give vehicles an incremental version number 13:43:58 <andythenorth> it would be neat 13:44:05 <Pikka> there's no shortage of IDs any more 13:44:05 <Fori> But for now there is none? ^^ 13:44:14 <andythenorth> but probably it's just as easy to use more IDs 13:44:21 <Pikka> stat upgrades are to be avoided 13:44:30 <andythenorth> I use them in HEQS 13:44:33 <andythenorth> avoid buy menu spam 13:44:41 <planetmaker> Fori, there's autorenew 13:44:42 <andythenorth> as model life is a total crap shoot and broken imho 13:44:44 <Pikka> if they're minor upgrades, perhaps 13:44:53 <planetmaker> whic hreplaces with the same 13:45:00 <Pikka> but things like the early steam locomotives in NARS, the difference is too great 13:45:01 <planetmaker> and autoreplace, which replaces with another engine 13:45:18 *** mal2 [~mal2@z529a.pia.fu-berlin.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 13:45:28 <Fori> I'm using NARS in fact. 13:46:51 <Fori> So I'll have to wait for a new engine? 13:47:01 <andythenorth> ach 13:47:16 <andythenorth> 'buy menu availability' cb is probably a trivial patch for vehicles 13:47:17 <andythenorth> let's patch it 13:47:21 <andythenorth> stations have it 13:47:26 <Pikka> after you 13:47:30 <Pikka> I've always wanted that 13:47:31 <andythenorth> not today, but remind me 13:47:33 <andythenorth> seriously 13:47:37 <Pikka> to have different vehicles for different players ;) 13:47:41 <Pikka> AI only vehicles, etc 13:47:46 <andythenorth> in my idea....hmm 13:47:47 <andythenorth> bad 13:48:02 <andythenorth> I want to be able to make availability of vehicle x depend on availability of vehicle y 13:48:11 <andythenorth> I'm *sure* that won't be circular :P 13:48:17 <Pikka> nah 13:49:15 <andythenorth> _probably_ it's called in a deterministic order, perhaps by ID 13:49:20 <andythenorth> and so loops would be impossible :P 13:49:24 <andythenorth> _probably 13:52:58 <andythenorth> iirc the hardest part about adding cbs looks like patching nforenum :P 13:53:03 <andythenorth> I may regret that comment 13:53:39 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: is 'buy menu availability' cb of interest to CETS? 13:54:08 <Eddi|zuHause> in what sense? 13:54:45 <andythenorth> in the sense of making vehicles appear in buy menu by returning 0x00 or 0x01 etc 13:54:50 <andythenorth> and I might patch it 13:54:55 <andythenorth> but it will need a reviewer :P 13:55:01 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: it would be useful to tie availability of one vehicle to the availability of another vehicle 13:55:09 <andythenorth> so it might need new vars 13:55:28 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: but that may interfere with the prototype phase 13:55:39 <andythenorth> ok, so things to think about 13:55:48 <andythenorth> but a useful cb? 13:56:00 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: for example, i introduce "ICE1", i may want to introduce it as a "10 Wagon", "12 Wagon" and "14 Wagon" version 13:56:21 <Eddi|zuHause> as separate buy menu items 13:56:45 <andythenorth> you want all to appear at same time? 13:56:50 <Eddi|zuHause> then only one of these versions should be offered as prototype 13:56:58 <Eddi|zuHause> and all others should get available at the same time 13:57:06 <Eddi|zuHause> but only to the person accepting the prototype 13:57:14 <Eddi|zuHause> and then he should only need to buy one of them 13:57:27 <Eddi|zuHause> to fulfill the "bought prototype" condition 13:57:41 <andythenorth> interesting 13:57:49 <andythenorth> doesn't sound batshit crazy 13:58:06 <andythenorth> I'd have to read src to see how that could be done though :P 13:58:18 * andythenorth back to work 13:58:22 <Eddi|zuHause> it may be possible to do this by other means though 13:58:31 <Eddi|zuHause> i.e. don't code these as different vehicle IDs 13:58:41 <Eddi|zuHause> but code a "multiple variants" callback 13:58:55 <Eddi|zuHause> that is registering multiple buy-menu entries 13:59:31 <Eddi|zuHause> and which one was selected is passed to the purchase callbacks as extra callback info 13:59:42 <Eddi|zuHause> so the articulation callback may return different stuff 14:00:27 *** cypher [~Miranda@wifi-cl-248.feld.cvut.cz] has joined #openttd 14:00:44 <andythenorth> I had the multiple variants idea too 14:00:54 <andythenorth> points to vehicle-local-storage imo 14:01:06 <andythenorth> but in this case, on the type, not the instance 14:01:59 <Eddi|zuHause> this has nothing to do with storage 14:03:21 *** cypher [~Miranda@wifi-cl-248.feld.cvut.cz] has quit [] 14:03:52 <andythenorth> I think authors would want to customise what they're doing with this 14:04:16 <andythenorth> storage / extend arbitrary properties /s 14:05:21 * andythenorth doubts it's wise 14:05:25 <andythenorth> or possible 14:05:49 <Eddi|zuHause> https://github.com/jmechner/Prince-of-Persia-Apple-II 14:07:37 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: this could just be a separation of "cargo subtypes" from cargos. and one could allow dropdown boxes in the buy menu listing the cargos and the subtypes 14:07:46 <CornishPasty> Eddi|zuHause: winner 14:08:32 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: same comment could apply to other things 14:08:34 <andythenorth> but yes 14:08:39 <andythenorth> +lots 14:09:12 <andythenorth> - articulated vehicle lengths 14:09:14 <andythenorth> - liveries 14:09:22 <Eddi|zuHause> but making subtypes changeable after building would conflict with the idea of having the articulation callback depend on it 14:09:38 <andythenorth> yes 14:09:43 <andythenorth> - stat variations (power, weight etc) 14:09:56 <andythenorth> hmm 14:12:10 <Eddi|zuHause> CornishPasty: what? 14:12:35 <CornishPasty> Eddi|zuHause: the Prince of Persia source 14:12:47 <Belugas> hello 14:13:18 <Eddi|zuHause> CornishPasty: the whole sentence 14:13:44 <CornishPasty> Never mind. You'll be forever wondering 14:23:22 *** KouDy [~KouDy@175.137.102.249] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:25:36 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: one big problem for separating subtypes from cargos is handling backwards compatibility for existing GRFs 14:27:04 <andythenorth> always that :P 14:27:09 <andythenorth> just don't break it? 14:27:11 *** FLHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has left #openttd [] 14:27:18 <andythenorth> respect all current vars and cbs, it just keeps working 14:28:10 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: but that duplicates memory and stuff 14:28:20 <andythenorth> [shrug] 14:28:24 <Eddi|zuHause> if done "the wrong way" 14:28:31 <andythenorth> worse is better :P 14:28:49 <andythenorth> but also...better is better 14:29:09 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i didn't even understand what that meant 14:29:29 <andythenorth> you're familiar with worse is better though? :) 14:29:40 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: it seemed to argue a "grand design" vs. a "step by step" approach 14:29:49 *** Vadtec [~Vadtec@2001:470:1f06:13e0::1337] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:29:50 <andythenorth> approximately yes 14:29:58 *** FLHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 14:30:05 <andythenorth> primarily it advocates simplicity of implementation *above* other factors 14:30:12 <andythenorth> it doesn't say ignore other factors 14:30:13 <Eddi|zuHause> and then cited some artificial reasons why one should be superior 14:30:24 <andythenorth> nor does it say make things deliberately worse 14:30:40 <andythenorth> it's basically a pretty simple argument that shipping something beats shipping nothing 14:32:13 <Eddi|zuHause> the tower of babel was a "grand design". and that's the reason why it failed. 14:34:01 <andythenorth> it doesn't necessarily recommend burning all future possibilities to ship today :P 14:34:11 <andythenorth> nor breaking everything that was already built to ship today :P 14:34:59 *** FLHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has left #openttd [] 14:35:06 *** Vadtec [~Vadtec@2001:470:1f06:13e0::1337] has joined #openttd 14:35:27 *** FLHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 14:36:05 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: that's why i didn't understand the whole argument 14:36:26 <andythenorth> it originates in the question 'why did C and Unix together beat Lisp' 14:36:41 <andythenorth> it's a bit like 'why did PHP comprehensively beat Python and Perl' 14:39:35 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: because the properties that someone defines as "best" do not automatically create the biggest "market share" 14:39:51 <andythenorth> exactly 14:40:04 <Eddi|zuHause> why did VHS win over Betamax? 14:40:13 <andythenorth> because porn was available on VHS 14:40:22 <andythenorth> dunno why that was, but it's the usual reason given :P 14:40:26 <Eddi|zuHause> why did Bluray win over HD-DVD? 14:40:30 <andythenorth> politics :P 14:40:49 <Eddi|zuHause> why did "free market" win over "communism"? 14:41:40 <andythenorth> it did? 14:41:43 * andythenorth missed that :) 14:41:44 <Eddi|zuHause> even in china 14:42:03 <andythenorth> seems to me like 'markets captured by elites' won 14:42:16 <Eddi|zuHause> why did mammals win over dinosaurs? 14:43:27 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: sometimes the label doesn't accurately describe the content :p 15:03:09 *** mal2 [~mal2@z529a.pia.fu-berlin.de] has joined #openttd 15:12:08 *** mal2 [~mal2@z529a.pia.fu-berlin.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:15:30 <Fori> Is this "Town growth can be accelerated by loading and unloading at least one item of cargo at up to five stations within town influence within a two month period. It does not matter which cargos are loaded/unloaded. " still accurate with 1.2? 15:15:56 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 15:16:06 <Eddi|zuHause> unless you load a GoalScript 15:16:19 <Eddi|zuHause> that can override this behaviour 15:19:13 *** Fori_DC [4e32f05a@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 15:19:18 <Fori_DC> Uhm, had a DC. 15:19:22 <Fori_DC> Did someone answer me? 15:19:25 *** Fori [5ce44709@ircip2.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 15:19:32 *** Fori_DC is now known as Fori 15:19:48 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, unless you load a GoalScript 15:19:50 <Eddi|zuHause> that can override this behaviour 15:20:56 <Fori> Thx Eddi|zuHause 15:21:15 <Fori> One should use timetables for that, huh? 15:22:52 *** SpComb^ [terom@zerg.fixme.fi] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:22:58 *** SpComb^ [terom@zerg.fixme.fi] has joined #openttd 15:24:15 <Eddi|zuHause> if your vehicle arrives less than every two months, you probably do something wrong 15:25:35 <Fori> I seem to be doing something wrong. It continuesly says "This town doesnt grow." 15:25:51 <Fori> Even though water / food are green and I got some mail trains stopping by from while to while. 15:27:07 *** Lakie [~Lakie@host81-141-98-96.wlms-broadband.com] has joined #openttd 15:30:01 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5e09ee84.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 15:30:20 <Eddi|zuHause> can't help you with that 15:30:39 <Fori> kk 15:34:18 <planetmaker> maybe you use a game script? 15:40:25 *** supermop [~daniel_er@rrcs-72-43-171-87.nyc.biz.rr.com] has joined #openttd 15:49:07 <Fori> I don't. 15:50:01 <FLHerne> Are you using some strange townset? 15:50:33 <FLHerne> I believe TaI Houses does something to town growth... 15:51:41 *** telanus1 [~Barney_Er@196.215.173.27] has joined #openttd 15:51:43 <Fori> I just tested on temperate and made a bus line in town. 15:51:44 <Fori> All good. 15:52:02 <Fori> Seems like my deliveries are not fast enough. Strange. 15:52:26 <Fori> It should be enough when a train catches some mail bags all 2 months. Isnt that right? 15:53:52 <Fori> Now I've seen that there was loading / unloading in these two months but it didnt grow. Strange that is. 15:56:16 *** telanus [~Barney_Er@196.215.173.27] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:56:37 *** Neckel [96a21c55@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 16:01:42 <Sacro> @seen bjarni 16:01:42 <DorpsGek> Sacro: bjarni was last seen in #openttd 27 weeks, 4 days, 15 hours, 47 minutes, and 11 seconds ago: <Bjarni> heh 16:03:03 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590f6c73.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 16:07:44 <Fori> @seen Fori 16:07:44 <DorpsGek> Fori: Fori was last seen in #openttd 13 minutes and 52 seconds ago: <Fori> Now I've seen that there was loading / unloading in these two months but it didnt grow. Strange that is. 16:08:05 <Fori> @seen drac_boy 16:08:05 <DorpsGek> Fori: drac_boy was last seen in #openttd 17 hours, 26 minutes, and 40 seconds ago: <drac_boy> manual>gameplay>multiplayer 16:33:43 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1BD19.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 16:35:31 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@5070A0D5.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has joined #openttd 16:40:24 <supermop> when did this canadian station drama happen? and why? 16:41:35 *** telanus1 is now known as telanus 16:51:41 <Fori> Eddi|zuHause: Ich found the problem! 16:52:38 <Fori> lol, Ich = I, sorry. 16:56:37 *** supermop [~daniel_er@rrcs-72-43-171-87.nyc.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: supermop] 16:58:25 *** peteris [~peteris@78.84.100.24] has joined #openttd 17:01:25 *** Fori [4e32f05a@ircip1.mibbit.com] has quit [autokilled: Spam. Contact support@oftc.net for further information and assistance. (2012-04-17 17:06:01)] 17:01:25 *** Neckel [96a21c55@ircip1.mibbit.com] has quit [autokilled: Spam. Contact support@oftc.net for further information and assistance. (2012-04-17 17:06:01)] 17:05:50 <Terkhen> hello 17:06:23 <Wolf01> hello Terkhen 17:13:38 <andythenorth> lo Terkhen 17:13:47 <andythenorth> did you solve Metal Fabrication Plant? ;) 17:15:59 *** Alberth [~hat3@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 17:16:02 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 17:16:21 <Alberth> good evenink 17:17:03 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 17:17:16 <Terkhen> andythenorth: yes :P 17:17:52 <andythenorth> it makes metal...stuff 17:18:43 <Terkhen> something that takes metal and produces "metal" :P 17:18:51 <Eddi|zuHause> there's not enough doctor who in this spring... 17:23:03 *** Rhamphoryncus [~rhamph@d161-184-227-133.abhsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 17:25:37 <Alberth> it should make question marks! 17:28:12 *** TheMask96 [martijn@polaris.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:33:04 *** TheMask96 [martijn@polaris.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 17:34:38 <andythenorth> ! 17:38:42 <Alberth> a question mark stretching itself :p 17:40:55 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: translators * r24123 /trunk/src/lang/ (afrikaans.txt french.txt slovak.txt): 17:40:55 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 17:40:55 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: afrikaans - 8 changes by telanus 17:40:55 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: french - 22 changes by OliTTD 17:40:55 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: slovak - 6 changes by teso 17:54:44 *** krinn [~krinn@114.54.71.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Quit: Quitte] 17:55:52 *** flaa [~flaa@089-101-093077.ntlworld.ie] has joined #openttd 18:10:46 *** Firartix [~artixds@222.140.0.93.rev.sfr.net] has joined #openttd 18:11:02 *** mal2 [~mal2@port-92-206-96-103.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 18:12:14 <michi_cc> Last chance to dig out your old, rusty and forgotten patch! ;) 18:13:03 <NGC3982> what! 18:13:04 <NGC3982> oh 18:13:15 <NGC3982> i should exclude rusty off my hilight list. 18:13:24 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@5070A0D5.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:22:21 *** Zeknurn [~Zeknurn@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:24:01 *** Zeknurn [~Zeknurn@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 18:29:02 *** supermop [~daniel_er@rrcs-72-43-171-87.nyc.biz.rr.com] has joined #openttd 18:34:26 *** Fori [4e32f05a@ircip2.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 18:34:53 <Fori> Can I influence how often a town grows? E.g. 100 or 200 days? 18:35:06 <Fori> Cause I got 2 cities and one grows every 100 and the other every 199 days. 18:39:28 *** zxbiohazardzx [~IceChat77@5ED05D6D.cm-7-1b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 18:41:15 <Alberth> http://wiki.openttd.org/Town_growth 18:41:26 <zxbiohazardzx> quicky question: is there a limit to the ammount of bridges one can have in OTTD? 18:41:54 <zxbiohazardzx> as in different bridge-types, newgrf wise 18:41:55 <Alberth> less than inifinite? 18:41:57 <frosch123> not yet 18:42:18 <Fori> Alberth: Does that article cover the new changes of 1.2? 18:42:25 <Alberth> oh bridge types, that something else 18:42:47 <supermop> 12 i though? 18:42:50 <supermop> thought 18:43:11 <Alberth> Fori: no idea 18:43:15 <zxbiohazardzx> yeah TTDP its 11, but is this hardcoded and can this ammount be raised? 18:43:26 <Fori> I don't think so. That's why I asked here ^^ 18:44:09 <Alberth> Fori: I don't even know exactly what has changed, except that you've got much more control now with a game script 18:44:12 <zxbiohazardzx> in TTDP the number is 11 - if I'm not mistaken. What I've never understood though is why bridges must be identical in both views. Having a different view in the 2nd direction would give us 22 different bridges - assuming we're talking TTDP here. Could the similar number for OTTD be 13/26? 18:44:18 <zxbiohazardzx> thats the question actually 18:44:23 <supermop> would need to be patched 18:45:19 <Alberth> static const uint MAX_BRIDGES = 13; ///< Maximal number of available bridge specs. 18:45:32 <zxbiohazardzx> hardcoded to 13 because? 18:45:41 <zxbiohazardzx> uint can hold > 13 right? 18:45:41 <zxbiohazardzx> XD 18:45:58 <Alberth> newgrf specs???? 18:46:25 <Alberth> historic reasons???? 18:46:28 <Alberth> who knows 18:46:41 <zxbiohazardzx> Alberth stupid specs again? why is it limited to 13 and can this not be altered via a setting or via the newGRFs ??? 18:46:52 <zxbiohazardzx> what cpp is that in btw? 18:47:15 <Alberth> zxbiohazardzx: OpenTTD follows specs, not the other way around :) 18:47:32 <Alberth> bridge.h file 18:48:42 <zxbiohazardzx> Alberth makes me wonder about those "specs" more and more 18:48:59 <zxbiohazardzx> where are the specs defined, who defined them, and why are they so holy-bile-styled 18:49:23 <supermop> bridge specs need a lot of work 18:49:44 <Alberth> http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/Main_Page 18:50:08 <Alberth> historically, a lot of them came from the original program and from TTDPatch 18:50:40 <Alberth> people do make extensions though, eg the 32bpp support 18:51:16 <supermop> more types, custom sprite layout, callbacks to be aware of neighboring bridges, and ability for new grf to determine different sets of bridge type for each way type 18:53:18 *** Elukka [Elukka@78-27-90-14.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 18:53:28 <zxbiohazardzx> supermop yeah custom bridgeheads etc 18:53:34 <zxbiohazardzx> but i was more wondering why it was set to 13 18:53:48 <zxbiohazardzx> and if that limit could be increased to allow more newgrf bridges :P 18:54:09 <supermop> well custom bridgeheads would be have little to do with new grf specs 18:54:21 *** zooks [~zooks@vhe-540241.sshn.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 18:54:46 <supermop> unless you want to set the property to allow them for each tipe 18:54:48 <supermop> type 18:59:46 <zxbiohazardzx> hmmz fair nough 18:59:57 <zxbiohazardzx> lemmy see if spec says anything about those 13 hardcoded number 19:00:21 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-4d0838df.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 19:00:49 <zxbiohazardzx> we already added 2 in OTTD? 19:01:05 <supermop> the tube bridges 19:01:09 <zxbiohazardzx> according to the spec, ID (dec) ID(Hex) has 2 extra ones for OTTD that arent in TTDP 19:01:10 <zxbiohazardzx> yeah 19:01:18 *** zooks [~zooks@vhe-540241.sshn.net] has joined #openttd 19:01:27 <zxbiohazardzx> so why would it be impossible to add more / make it more variable? 19:01:57 *** Avenger [~rafinha21@189.58.189.180] has joined #openttd 19:02:24 <supermop> no one has done it yet 19:02:36 *** Avenger [~rafinha21@189.58.189.180] has quit [] 19:02:43 <supermop> nml doesnt support bridges, but i really want it to 19:02:57 <zxbiohazardzx> well there are bridge renewal sets 19:03:05 <zxbiohazardzx> but im wondering if i want to combine or add more:P 19:03:07 <supermop> but i doubt it will until there is some better agreed upon spec 19:03:24 <zxbiohazardzx> eg grey brick, red brick etc variations 19:03:34 <supermop> those only allow up to 13 too, anc can only use one of the default sprite layouts 19:05:53 <zxbiohazardzx> yes i know they only use 13 19:06:02 <zxbiohazardzx> as the spec lists 13 slots/ids that you can then modify 19:06:07 <zxbiohazardzx> but the main question again is why 19:06:25 <zxbiohazardzx> as the hex gives you at least 15/16 options 19:06:35 <zxbiohazardzx> 00 -> 0F 19:06:40 <zxbiohazardzx> and we use 00-> 0C 19:07:29 <andythenorth> maybe the higher parts of the byte are used for something else 19:07:29 <planetmaker> well, the current approach won't be extended to further IDs. The next extension would need to be real NewGRF bridges with action0 etc 19:07:41 <planetmaker> just adding new IDs which need hard-coding is not a good thing 19:07:49 <zxbiohazardzx> @Planetmaker thats the question 19:07:52 <andythenorth> or maybe there were only 13 original bridges 19:07:59 <zxbiohazardzx> if i have sprites for lets say 26 or more bridges 19:08:05 <zxbiohazardzx> how would that work ingame? 19:08:12 <planetmaker> andythenorth: there were 11. And 2 added 19:08:14 <zxbiohazardzx> do i get 13 and the rest gets cut out? 19:08:22 <zxbiohazardzx> 11 original, 2 got added indeed 19:08:47 <planetmaker> zxbiohazardzx: with a newgrf support, you would get more. Whatever then is the allowed amount of bridges ;-) 19:09:05 <zxbiohazardzx> planetmaker i recon that support is not in? 19:09:22 <Alberth> zxbiohazardzx: somewhere along the path from source to loaded in openttd, you'd lose 13 currently 19:09:29 <planetmaker> oh, it's a very nice thing. But it does not yet exist nor even a patch (that I know of) 19:09:30 <zxbiohazardzx> bridge-types not ammount of total bridges ingame 19:09:44 <zxbiohazardzx> so yeah Planetmaker hardcoded is the limit atm 19:09:50 <planetmaker> yes 19:09:56 <Alberth> zxbiohazardzx: if it exists, it would be in the newgrf spec 19:09:59 <zxbiohazardzx> would it not be an idea to add 3 empty/dummy slots that newgrfs can overwrite as they do now? 19:10:12 <zxbiohazardzx> newGRF spec lists 00-> 0C ids 19:10:22 <planetmaker> it's actually not even a limit. It's an exact amount of bridge types. Though you can change availability date to reduce bridge types available 19:10:32 <zxbiohazardzx> so afaik you can add 0D,0E,0F to at least fill it up Hex 19:10:54 <zxbiohazardzx> planetmaker, total bridge renewal etc do change the ammount? 19:10:59 <planetmaker> zxbiohazardzx: no, that's not an idea 19:11:08 <planetmaker> as the sprites need hard-coding, too 19:11:09 <Alberth> zxbiohazardzx: as said by planetmaker, it is a wrong direction. 19:11:19 <planetmaker> as does the sprite layout 19:11:22 <planetmaker> not good 19:11:51 <planetmaker> and hard-coding invisible sprites so that they *might* be replaced... urgs 19:12:08 <planetmaker> then someone just changes availability.. and voila :-) 19:12:10 <Alberth> finally an invisible bridge :p 19:12:11 <planetmaker> invisible bridges 19:13:28 <Alberth> zxbiohazardzx: in other words, we need a new newgrf spec for bridges :p 19:14:09 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-89-176-205-158.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 19:16:06 <zxbiohazardzx> haha so the un-change able spec needs a change 19:16:36 <Alberth> an extension :p 19:17:04 <zxbiohazardzx> reasonable 19:17:05 <planetmaker> no change. As usual an extension. In a similar manner as vehicles, houses, industries 19:18:03 <zxbiohazardzx> and then in theory the ammount of bridges and the design/lenght/spriteuseperlenght will all move to the GRF? 19:18:11 <zxbiohazardzx> as all those are linked 19:19:32 <andythenorth> spec can be extended 19:19:40 <andythenorth> existing stuff can't be changed :( 19:19:43 <supermop> brb 19:19:44 *** supermop [~daniel_er@rrcs-72-43-171-87.nyc.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: supermop] 19:19:45 <planetmaker> there'll be a maximum amount of allowed bridge types. Not sure how high that can be, that dependso n the free bits in the map array 19:20:04 <planetmaker> but the actually available bridges will be then newgrf-determined as the other stuff 19:20:26 <planetmaker> the 13 default bridges still would be there, unless made unavailable or also changed by the newgrf. So yes 19:20:57 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-89-176-205-158.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 19:22:12 *** A629e6b1b [~A629e6b1b@cho94-8-88-178-12-119.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 19:22:21 <Eddi|zuHause> bridge availability depending on railtype would be nice 19:22:36 <Eddi|zuHause> don't offer 400km/h bridges for an 80km/h railtype 19:22:36 <zxbiohazardzx> ^^ 19:22:49 <zxbiohazardzx> alot of good features relate to it :P 19:24:33 *** zooks [~zooks@vhe-540241.sshn.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:24:51 <zxbiohazardzx> now the next question 19:25:06 <zxbiohazardzx> in relation to patches etc, how hard is it to modify the spec to accept above idea's ?:P 19:25:36 <andythenorth> about as hard as patching in some cases 19:25:46 *** zooks [~zooks@vhe-540241.sshn.net] has joined #openttd 19:25:51 <andythenorth> in other cases, modiying the spec is much harder than patching 19:26:18 <zxbiohazardzx> i cant even patch :P but i was just wondering in general :P 19:26:36 <zxbiohazardzx> my coding skills end after the interwebs & a bit of java 19:28:37 <Alberth> getting some agreement on the new spec is a challenge enough for now, I think ;) 19:29:37 <zxbiohazardzx> Alberth well as i mentioned, there is more then just changing the number of bridges 19:29:39 <andythenorth> good luck :P 19:30:02 <zxbiohazardzx> as Eddi suggested, availability depending on railtype etc would also be part of that i guess? 19:30:21 <zxbiohazardzx> and i know 0.0 of what that new spec would have to contain 19:30:32 <zxbiohazardzx> i just suggested something in the IRC or asked about it :P 19:30:33 <Alberth> zxbiohazardzx: yes, so making a spec is non-trivial, and getting agreement on them is more complicated 19:31:42 <Rhamphoryncus> .. oi, I just realized 1.2.0 has been released :P 19:32:00 <Alberth> someone woke up :D 19:32:19 <michi_cc> Rhamphoryncus: It's going to be outdated in a minute :p 19:32:26 <Rhamphoryncus> heh 19:32:39 <zxbiohazardzx> lolled] 19:32:43 *** drac_boy [~drac_boy@bas1-ottawa08-1177643171.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #openttd 19:32:48 <drac_boy> hi 19:32:52 <Alberth> hi 19:33:17 <drac_boy> how're you Alberth? 19:33:36 <zxbiohazardzx> i gotta go :( 19:33:41 <zxbiohazardzx> ill keep this in mind though :P 19:33:50 <zxbiohazardzx> thx alberth&planet for answering :) 19:33:57 <Alberth> bye zxbiohazardzx :) 19:34:23 <Alberth> drac_boy: happy, /me has 0x28 in the RCD data file :p 19:36:28 <drac_boy> rcd? 19:37:55 <Alberth> Roller Coaster Data file, in my freerct project :) 19:38:29 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24124 /trunk/src/ (engine_type.h vehicle.cpp): -Add [FS#4658]: [NewGRF] Misc engine flag to disable breakdown smoke. (Hirundo) 19:38:34 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24125 /trunk/src/group_gui.cpp: -Add [FS#3705]: Drag destination highlighting to the group GUI. (sbr) 19:38:36 <Alberth> the bad news is now that I have to load that value again in my program, and I don't have code for it yet 19:38:38 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24126 /trunk/src/newgrf_gui.cpp: -Feature [FS#3854]: Drag and drop support for the NewGRF list window. (Based on patch by sbr) 19:38:43 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24127 /trunk/src/ (16 files in 6 dirs): -Feature [FS#1497]: Allow closing airports for incoming aircraft. (Based on patch by cirdan) 19:38:48 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24128 /trunk/src/vehicle.cpp: -Change: Don't let vehicles break down directly after servicing. 19:38:57 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24129 /trunk/src/ (6 files in 3 dirs): -Feature [FS#3660]: Option to minimise signal distance when dragging over obstacles. (adf88) 19:38:59 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24130 /trunk/src/rail_gui.cpp: -Feature(ette): [FS#2314]: Deselect 'remove' button when changing signal types in the GUI. (Alberth) 19:39:04 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24131 /trunk/src/ (company_gui.cpp lang/english.txt): -Add [FS#1952]: Ctrl-Clicking to change colour of all colour schemes at once. (Roest) 19:39:07 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24132 /trunk/src/ (genworld.cpp landscape.cpp misc.cpp saveload/afterload.cpp): -Change [FS#4713]: Improve randomness of tile order in the tile loop. (monoid) 19:39:12 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24133 /trunk/src/ (currency.cpp currency.h lang/english.txt): -Add [FS#4984]: Lithuanian currency. (devastator) 19:39:17 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24134 /trunk/src/ (8 files in 4 dirs): -Add: Configurable limits for tree planting. 19:39:22 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24135 /trunk/src/tree_gui.cpp: -Remove [FS#4757]: Tree drag size limit. 19:39:28 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24136 /trunk/src/ (14 files in 4 dirs): -Feature [FS#4465]: Autoreplace vehicles only when they get old. (Vikthor) 19:39:33 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24137 /trunk/src/build_vehicle_gui.cpp: -Feature(ette): Draw indicator icon in the replace vehicle window for vehicles which have a replacement set. 19:39:36 <drac_boy> hmm alberth whats freerct supposed to do? 19:39:39 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24138 /trunk/src/ (group_cmd.cpp group_gui.cpp): -Feature(ette): Ctrl+drag to add all vehicles with a shared order list to a group. (Juanjo) 19:39:42 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24139 /trunk/src/ (5 files in 2 dirs): -Add: Creating a new vehicle group by drag and drop. (Based on patch by Juanjo) 19:40:02 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24140 /trunk/src/ (52 files in 3 dirs): -Add [FS#1117]: Group name in the replace vehicle window caption. (Juanjo) 19:40:07 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24141 /trunk/ (8 files in 4 dirs): -Feature: Display rating in the town directory window. (Inspired by patch from MagicBuzz) 19:40:12 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24142 /trunk/src/vehicle.cpp: -Feature [FS#3576]: Randomise count of passengers killed in a crash. (riffraffselbow) 19:40:12 <Alberth> drac_boy: open source variant of a well know rollercaster tycoon program :) 19:40:21 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24143 /trunk/src/rail_cmd.cpp: -Change [FS#5145]: Improve fence placement for rail. (Eddi) 19:40:21 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24144 /trunk/src/rail_gui.cpp: -Change [FS#4605]: Reset 'convert signal' button when signal GUI is closed. (yorick) 19:40:24 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24145 /trunk/src/settings.cpp: -Cleanup: Switch coding style. 19:40:26 <andythenorth> ho ho 19:40:29 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24146 /trunk/src/settings.cpp: -Fix [FS#5153]: Use default value when reading an invalid setting value. (Eddi) 19:40:37 <drac_boy> alberth hmm what kind of system requirement? 19:40:41 <michi_cc> Rhamphoryncus: See, outdated :p 19:40:48 <Alberth> there is no stopping michi_cc, andythenorth :) 19:41:05 <andythenorth> it's a spree 19:41:31 <michi_cc> Now I have to close all those tickets :( :p 19:41:43 <andythenorth> close airports 19:41:59 <Alberth> drac_boy: currently it only builds from source, at a linux system, if you have python 2.7 19:42:22 <Alberth> michi_cc: ask TB for an automagic close-on-commit :p 19:43:07 <Alberth> drac_boy: but there is nothing moving yet :) 19:43:09 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@host81-129-125-202.range81-129.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 19:43:19 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1BD19.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:43:26 <drac_boy> Alberth hmm so probably just as low resource more or less like the original one? 19:43:53 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@85.210.69.193] has joined #openttd 19:44:05 <Alberth> hopefully, but I don't really design on that 19:44:29 <Alberth> first it needs to move, and get playable 19:46:26 <drac_boy> Alberth well if it'll work smoothy with a full&busy park on a P3 I don't see any problem in it hopefully catching on big time 19:46:42 <andythenorth> there's only one Alberth :) 19:46:51 <andythenorth> he needs a network effect ;) 19:47:28 <drac_boy> mind you I know I've changed computers by then but the only reason I never ever got to rct2 was because when I tried the demo I found that it always ran rather sputterly even for small parks 19:48:12 <drac_boy> andythenorth heh 19:48:58 *** Djohaal [~Djohaal@201.47.16.210.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has joined #openttd 19:49:00 <Alberth> andythenorth: indeed, any good in Python hacking? :p 19:49:02 *** Pixa [~pixa@79-68-96-3.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:49:18 <andythenorth> Alberth: ask pixa 19:49:29 <Alberth> bummer, he just left :( 19:49:56 <andythenorth> oops 19:50:16 <Alberth> :) 19:51:48 <drac_boy> heh 19:57:36 *** roadt_ [~roadt@60.168.82.215] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:57:56 <Alberth> good night all 19:58:01 <andythenorth> bye 19:58:39 *** Alberth [~hat3@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has left #openttd [] 19:59:12 <oskari89> michi_cc: Did those features go to 1.2.1? 19:59:17 <michi_cc> No. 19:59:41 <oskari89> Ok. 19:59:54 <oskari89> They are going in 1.3x or so? 20:00:04 <michi_cc> Yes, trunk is 1.3 now. 20:00:29 <oskari89> Even more new features than that? :) 20:04:31 <Terkhen> trunk = new stuff 20:05:19 <Zuu> Warning: I just posted a very silly GS interface idea :-) 20:05:27 <Zuu> (in the NoGo thread) 20:05:32 <drac_boy> zuu where? :) 20:05:42 <Zuu> its in the development forum 20:06:17 <Zuu> It maybe should be moved to the AI/NoGo subforum now, but that is up to the moderators to decide. 20:06:30 *** flaa [~flaa@089-101-093077.ntlworld.ie] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:08:28 *** kkb110_ [~kkb110@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-02.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has joined #openttd 20:13:31 <Zuu> r24124 just killed the need for CluelessPlus to build service airports (for sending aircrafts there when upgrading airports). At least if that change included an AI api function. 20:13:38 <Zuu> :-) 20:15:03 *** Djohaal [~Djohaal@201.47.16.210.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:15:35 <michi_cc> If you meant 24127, you're lucky. 20:16:16 <Zuu> Yep, I ment 24127, I was too happy to see the commit sphere to type the correct number. :-) 20:16:34 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24147 /trunk/bin/ai/regression/regression.txt: -Fix (r24132): AI regression output. 20:27:00 *** DDR [~chatzilla@d99-199-14-2.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 20:29:28 *** zxbiohazardzx [~IceChat77@5ED05D6D.cm-7-1b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has left #openttd [] 20:44:28 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@host81-129-125-202.range81-129.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88.2 [Firefox 12.0/20120411064248]] 20:46:10 *** Fori [4e32f05a@ircip2.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 20:48:06 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-019-067.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 20:50:05 *** thphwh [5c0939db@ircip4.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 20:50:45 *** thphwh [5c0939db@ircip4.mibbit.com] has left #openttd [] 20:52:13 <frosch123> Zuu: wrt. fs#5151. the crash is related to in-game switching of blitters 20:52:29 <frosch123> so, it only happens if you do not enforce a particular blitter with the -b or blitter options 20:53:13 *** zooks [~zooks@vhe-540241.sshn.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:53:13 <Rubidium> and only on windows 20:53:15 <Zuu> hmm, so I should actually not set the blitter in openttd.cfg to the one that the crash reporter used in order to reproduce it. 20:53:34 *** zooks [~zooks@vhe-540241.sshn.net] has joined #openttd 20:55:02 <Zuu> assuming that 8bbp is still the default one. 20:58:50 *** supermop [~daniel_er@rrcs-72-43-171-87.nyc.biz.rr.com] has joined #openttd 20:59:53 <FLHerne> Is that bug Windows-specific? 21:00:20 <Eddi|zuHause> win64 specific, iirc 21:00:24 <Zuu> 64bit windows specific as far as we know now. 21:00:46 <Terkhen> yes 21:00:56 <Terkhen> I only managed to reproduce it with win x64 21:01:38 <FLHerne> Thought I hadn't encountered it :P 21:03:17 <FLHerne> I did get this one though: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=59513#p1008826 21:05:42 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@95.76.26.172] has quit [Quit: DANGER sla.ro is OFFLINE DANGER] 21:10:59 *** oskari89 [~oskari89@213-186-253-165.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 21:11:37 <drac_boy> btw is 'willing to entertain on price' right or was there a different wording I should be thinking of? its for an ad post 21:12:43 <FLHerne> That doesn't make a lot of sense to me :P 21:12:50 <supermop> hey Eddi|zuHause, does your post mean that the fence thing is in trunk? 21:13:04 <drac_boy> FLHerne heh any idea how to say that you're flexible on the price rather than the one you listed? 21:13:23 <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: there's an easy way to find that out... 21:13:26 <TWerkhoven[l]> reasonable offers accepted? 21:13:33 <drac_boy> hm thanks TWerkhoven[l] 21:14:04 <FLHerne> Now [i]that[/i] makes sense to me :D 21:14:07 <drac_boy> ok posted :) 21:14:50 * FLHerne waits for someone to invent IRC with markup that works :P 21:15:04 <FLHerne> Oh, and more smilies :-) 21:15:19 <drac_boy> FLHerne nope, thats not text so not going to happen 21:16:09 <TWerkhoven[l]> it could, but parsign would have to happen clientside 21:16:28 <TWerkhoven[l]> im sure theres clients out there (java mostly) that will change smileys into graphics 21:17:37 <Rubidium> which is incredibly annoucing when you're talking about code 21:17:53 <drac_boy> Rubidium yeah theres that :p 21:18:13 <TWerkhoven[l]> agreed 21:18:16 <Rubidium> (or for someone that uses parenthesis) 21:18:56 <Rubidium> any 'respectible' text-to-smiley code would introduce at least two smileys there 21:20:06 <TWerkhoven[l]> no, thats just the crap version, to be called respectible it would have to filter out common parenthesis usage 21:20:35 <FLHerne> My IRC client already parses smilies :P 21:20:48 <FLHerne> Just not enough variations... 21:21:46 <FLHerne> Standardised client-side parsing of markup would actually be possible, wouldn't it? 21:22:07 <FLHerne> 'Standardised' being the issue, I guess 21:22:47 <TWerkhoven[l]> yup 21:23:48 <Rubidium> pff... standards. 21:23:56 <Rubidium> the standard is pretty clear about the markup 21:24:12 <Rubidium> only everyone decides to make custom additions to that standard 21:24:15 <FLHerne> http://xkcd.com/927/ 21:24:58 <drac_boy> four ads posted so far 21:25:10 <drac_boy> wouldn't be surprised if I could clear all four out this week too :) 21:25:29 <Terkhen> good night 21:25:33 <drac_boy> bye Terkhen 21:25:37 <FLHerne> 'night Terkhen 21:25:50 <FLHerne> drac_boy: four of what? 21:26:49 <Eddi|zuHause> in KDE you can configure the smilies 21:27:30 * Rubidium claims the Zzzz smiley 21:27:30 <FLHerne> I'm using KDE :P 21:28:26 <FLHerne> It's all shiny, and widgety, and ooh, I can make that section both semi-transparent [i]and[/i] animated! :D 21:28:28 <drac_boy> FLHerne you need to read the whole line silly :p 21:28:40 <FLHerne> I did 21:28:57 <TWerkhoven[l]> dont forget the blink tag 21:28:58 <drac_boy> well you probably didn't to be asking such question :P 21:29:00 <FLHerne> Then I went off on a random tangent for no reason... 21:29:46 <FLHerne> clear all four ads out? 21:30:06 * FLHerne gets baffled again 21:34:42 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r24148 /trunk/src/ (currency.cpp currency.h lang/english.txt): -Add [FS#4907]: South Korean and South African currencies. (PaulC) 21:36:28 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590f6c73.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:37:26 <NGC3982> hmz 21:37:29 <NGC3982> i wonder 21:37:47 <NGC3982> how can a train like the CC 40100 achieve speeds like 240km/h? 21:37:51 <NGC3982> http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fichier:Locomotive_CC-40110.jpg 21:37:58 <NGC3982> doesnt look that aerodynamic? :E 21:39:07 <drac_boy> actually it is...its more or less flat except on the front .. and from the sizing of the middle its probably got a lot of hp 21:39:42 <TWerkhoven[l]> aerodynamics isnt everything, though it sure helps 21:40:18 <Eddi|zuHause> it says 160km/h on wikipedia 21:42:22 <Wolf01> 'night 21:42:25 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host139-62-dynamic.252-95-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 21:43:53 <TWerkhoven[l]> french one sais 160/240kmh, but also 2 different kw outputs 21:45:19 <NGC3982> sure, aerodynamics isnt everything. though, i thought speeds like that required a more ..not that flat faced form. 21:45:29 <TWerkhoven[l]> maybe it depends on the line voltage, as it can draw 4 different voltages 21:46:46 <TWerkhoven[l]> anyway, bedtime for me 21:47:19 <NGC3982> night :) 21:48:06 <Eddi|zuHause> voltage is really only relevant for DC 21:49:38 *** TGYoshi [~TGYoshi@86.81.146.146] has quit [Quit: Popidopidopido] 21:52:36 <drac_boy> eddi actually not quite true. theres low voltage ac as well 21:52:54 <drac_boy> they're in small number tho of course 21:53:58 <drac_boy> probably ever smaller for old dual-pantograph systems too (although the london system still uses the 3rd+4th rail version of this I recall) 21:54:56 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: i meant: you can draw the same amount of power in low and high voltage AC 21:55:31 <Eddi|zuHause> lower voltage may mean slightly more losses over distance 21:55:31 *** TWerkhoven[l] [~twerkhove@cpc3-linl7-2-0-cust522.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:55:42 <Eddi|zuHause> but you need smaller security distance 21:56:42 <Eddi|zuHause> but in DC, you can't make the current arbitrarily high, so you only have pretty much linear dependency between voltage and power 21:57:05 *** kkb110_ [~kkb110@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-02.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 21:57:13 <Eddi|zuHause> P = U*I 21:57:37 <FLHerne> <(although the london system still uses the 3rd+4th rail version of this I recall)> London is DC. Maybe I misunderstood you again though... 22:01:16 *** peteris [~peteris@78.84.100.24] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 22:02:21 <drac_boy> FLHerne some of the double panto systems were dc too mind you 22:02:56 *** zooks [~zooks@vhe-540241.sshn.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:05:25 *** kkb110_ [~kkb110@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 22:07:04 <NGC3982> my word 22:07:37 <NGC3982> when i get my own garden, forget the garden gnomes 22:07:45 <NGC3982> ill get a uac turbo train. 22:08:19 <drac_boy> NGC3982 heh why? you'll need a large yard for something approaching express-like speeds :) 22:09:31 <NGC3982> i dont want it running 22:09:40 <drac_boy> oh outdoor display model? 22:09:42 <NGC3982> i just want it to sit there, in its yellow glory. 22:09:47 <NGC3982> indeed 22:10:01 <drac_boy> hmm so the question then would be...what kind of set makeup and in which livery then? :) 22:10:21 <NGC3982> and i feel quite serious. even though i dont know that much about trains (yet), i feel compelled to create my own museum. 22:10:31 <NGC3982> drac_boy: i have no idea. 22:11:50 <drac_boy> NGC3982 well I asked because it varied between 3-car (only one intermidate coach yeah) up to a bit over ten cars 22:12:01 *** Firartix [~artixds@222.140.0.93.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:12:19 <NGC3982> oh, i have no clue 22:12:29 <NGC3982> i just want the end. 22:12:36 <NGC3982> or at least the engine 22:12:43 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has left #openttd [] 22:12:55 <drac_boy> thats not much of a train then :p 22:13:06 <drac_boy> especially with half of its truck missing :) 22:13:35 <NGC3982> :) 22:14:51 <drac_boy> if you really need a single-unit something, model that one modified rail speed record setting budd rdc with the two red/gray jet engines on its roof :) 22:15:00 <drac_boy> heh 22:15:47 *** supermop [~daniel_er@rrcs-72-43-171-87.nyc.biz.rr.com] has left #openttd [] 22:17:13 *** mal2 [~mal2@port-92-206-96-103.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:17:36 *** Amaury_ [~Admin@can59-h01-31-32-213-195.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr] has quit [Quit: Quitte] 22:17:57 <NGC3982> oh 22:18:29 <NGC3982> http://images26.fotki.com/v940/photos/4/43743/1298651/jetpoweredBuddRDC2-vi.jpg 22:18:30 <NGC3982> harr. 22:18:30 <NGC3982> :D 22:19:51 *** Pikka [~chatzilla@d58-111-69-99.rdl800.qld.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88.2 [Firefox 11.0/20120312181643]] 22:22:53 *** A629e6b1b [~A629e6b1b@cho94-8-88-178-12-119.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:25:42 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-89-176-205-158.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 22:28:11 *** Devroush [~dennis@ip-83-134-166-70.dsl.scarlet.be] has quit [] 22:29:51 <drac_boy> NGC3982 btw also try look up the Xplorer from C&O .. it was supposed to be 'the' next generation passenger train .. lighter and lower gravity (it was pretty much the usa version of talgo concept yeah) 22:30:15 <drac_boy> did not have a good life tho. one of the major ops was not ordering the rear locomotive unit so the tail always rode a bit harsh :-s 22:30:58 <NGC3982> oh 22:31:01 <drac_boy> a different New haven version with more conservative nose did actually have a loco at both ends..but again short life mainly from one thing - it caught fire on the press run, not so much fun :-/ 22:31:51 <drac_boy> these two were the only known lightweight trainset in usa afaik 22:36:28 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-27-29-217.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 22:38:51 *** APTX_ [APTX@89-78-217-144.dynamic.chello.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:38:53 <drac_boy> NGC3982 you probably could still do a tgv locomotive .. they were seperated end units (from the articulated consist) anyhow 22:39:13 <drac_boy> although whether you want to do the well known electric one or the one-off gas turbine one is up to you :) 22:39:16 <drac_boy> same livery for both tho 22:45:14 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-4d0838df.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: All your IRC are belong to us] 22:53:48 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-89-240.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:00:12 *** FLHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has left #openttd [] 23:08:09 <V453000> hm, how do I remove an AI company? :D 23:08:24 <V453000> ERROR: Company is owned by an AI. on reset_company :D 23:10:08 <Mazur> rcon stop_ai <company_slot> 23:12:51 *** Djohaal [~Djohaal@201.47.16.210.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has joined #openttd 23:13:18 <Zuu> Don't forget to also reduce the company count in difficulty settings, if you don't want a new AI to start soon. 23:14:00 <Mazur> Or unset ai_in multiplayer 23:14:10 <Mazur> Which had already been done. 23:17:15 <Zuu> requires that you have a MP game, but I guess you do :-) 23:17:47 <Mazur> Stable. 23:25:18 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:30:22 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@port-92-195-234-108.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 23:30:25 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai|noir] by ChanServ 23:36:09 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-24-200.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:39:29 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.69.193] has joined #openttd 23:39:30 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@85.210.69.193] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]