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00:02:40 *** yorick [~yorick@ip51cd0513.speed.planet.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:23:22 *** montalvo [~montalvo@c-76-103-107-219.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzzâŠ] 00:26:22 *** kero [~keikoz@pha75-1-81-57-54-15.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 00:26:34 *** Flygon [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has joined #openttd 00:27:33 *** MJP [~mjp@hq.z77.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:32:11 *** Flygon_ [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 00:39:55 *** Hazzard [~quassel@c-67-174-253-44.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 00:50:02 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:50:38 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 00:57:22 *** Midnightmyth [~quassel@93-167-84-102-static.dk.customer.tdc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:58:37 <Eddi|zuHause> what ever happened to the "nightshift"? 00:59:02 <Eddi|zuHause> everyone seems to go to bed at like 10... 01:10:11 *** luaduck is now known as luaduck_zzz 01:10:14 <efess> the americans are lurking :) 01:23:32 *** glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Bye] 01:30:26 *** DDR [~kvirc@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 01:39:33 <Eddi|zuHause> there are not a lot of americans here either 01:41:22 <efess> I know at least one 01:43:12 *** theholyduck [~theholydu@172.245.30.36] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:43:57 *** bdavenport [~davenport@aeolus.mindlesstux.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:47:24 *** theholyduck [~theholydu@172.245.30.36] has joined #openttd 01:58:19 <Eddi|zuHause> that's still only 1% 01:59:20 <Eddi|zuHause> based on population (and technology bias), there should be roughly equal amounts of americans and europeans in here 01:59:26 <efess> >= 1% at least 01:59:52 <Eddi|zuHause> 1 of 119 is not >= 1% 02:00:12 <efess> true, didn't want to do the math :) 02:00:32 <Eddi|zuHause> not a lot of maths in there :p 02:01:34 <Eddi|zuHause> (why is there an 's' at the end of 'mathematics', anyway? there isn't one in greek, and there's also not one in german) 02:03:09 <Eddi|zuHause> (and it's not a plural s either. it's "mathematics is hard", not "mathematics are hard") 02:04:41 <efess> Could you have more than one mathematics? 02:05:15 <Eddi|zuHause> depends on how philosophical you want this discussion to get 02:06:47 <Eddi|zuHause> maths is born out of itself. and the only ways to change maths must come out of itself. so from a maths perspective, there is no point in discussion what's "outside" of maths, or if what there is "outside" of maths is another maths 02:08:55 <Eddi|zuHause> in some matter, it's like discussion whether there is another universe 02:23:29 * mikegrb american 02:25:38 <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, one who has spoken like 5 lines in the last 5 years :p 02:27:44 <Eddi|zuHause> 2007: 19, 2008: 34, 2009: 11, 2010: 2, 2011: 0, 2012: 2, 2013: 6, 2014: 1 02:29:17 <Eddi|zuHause> (ok that's 10 lines) 02:48:10 <kero> In French, mathematics' "s", is a real plural. I would bet it comes from there. 02:48:29 <kero> (yes, some other there around not sleeping :p) 02:50:37 *** theholyduck [~theholydu@172.245.30.36] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:11:20 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 03:11:50 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 03:44:00 *** kero [~keikoz@pha75-1-81-57-54-15.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: kero] 03:55:52 *** montalvo [~montalvo@c-76-103-107-219.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 03:58:52 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:59:18 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 04:04:47 <Jinassi> in Slovenian, it's a female gender 04:04:56 <Jinassi> Now ain't that a bitch. 04:05:27 <Jinassi> and singular -.- 04:20:42 *** DDR [~kvirc@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: DDR is not Dance Dance Revolution.] 04:39:50 *** DDR [~kvirc@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 04:53:03 <Eddi|zuHause> it's also female in german 04:56:01 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p5DC66E0F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [] 04:56:16 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p57BD4ED3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 05:03:22 *** pthagnar [~pthagnar@cpc7-pres17-2-0-cust28.18-3.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:05:52 *** montalvo [~montalvo@c-76-103-107-219.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzzâŠ] 05:23:17 *** LSky` [~LSky@5ED4B2EA.cm-7-5c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 05:23:17 *** DDR [~kvirc@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:57:01 *** pipeep [~pipeep@2605:6400:10:a15d:ca7:ea75:b12d:dead] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 05:57:24 *** pipeep [~pipeep@2605:6400:10:a15d:ca7:ea75:b12d:dead] has joined #openttd 06:07:26 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 06:07:34 <andythenorth> oops :o 06:08:00 * andythenorth forgot that a feature item canât have two action 3s 06:14:55 <andythenorth> hmm 06:30:19 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@89.137.74.191] has joined #openttd 06:30:39 *** Pikkaphone [~yaaic@131.181.158.141] has joined #openttd 06:31:07 <Pikkaphone> wutwut 06:34:37 *** tstts [~id@37.140.121.161] has joined #openttd 06:40:14 <andythenorth> ho ho 06:41:09 <Pikkaphone> merry christmas 06:43:22 <Pikkaphone> what's going on in here? 06:44:33 <LSky`> not much 06:45:34 <Pikkaphone> oh 06:46:02 <andythenorth> Pikkaphone: too many action 3s 06:46:29 <andythenorth> also potty training child #2 06:46:32 <andythenorth> we just had a poo 06:47:15 <Pikkaphone> how many is too many? Aren't you all nml these days anyway? 06:47:29 <andythenorth> turns out nml is slow 06:47:42 <andythenorth> more than 1 is too many 06:48:28 <Pikkaphone> what if they're livery uberride? 06:50:08 <andythenorth> hmm 06:50:11 <andythenorth> never used that 06:50:26 * andythenorth considers liveries for industries 06:50:41 <V453000> :d 06:50:43 <Pikkaphone> what, never? 06:51:03 <Pikkaphone> mu carriages? 06:51:47 <V453000> switch on graphics is better than livery override isnt it 06:52:08 * andythenorth wonders what the game does when there are two action 3s for an industry 06:52:48 <planetmaker> it would ignore one or the other I recon 06:53:10 <planetmaker> Anyhow, a good morning (that's an action0 :P ) 06:53:32 <Pikkaphone> v: depends 06:54:22 <planetmaker> conceptually there should be no livery override in grf specs 06:55:14 <planetmaker> it's a bad feature from ye ol' times when there was no proper support for the switch way 06:56:00 <V453000> idk, I use switches everywhere and livery override only in case when I wanted powered wagons 06:56:12 <Pikkaphone> hooray for hysterical raisins 06:56:27 <planetmaker> yeah. We have whole cans of them 06:56:33 <planetmaker> they're cheap :P 06:56:57 <Pikkaphone> although as a bsd feature it's definitely eclipsed by powered wagons. ;) 06:57:08 <Pikkaphone> a bad feature too 06:58:30 <V453000> I dont think powered wagons are that bad 06:58:38 <V453000> they can be useful if used right 06:59:30 <planetmaker> of course. Just the specs how they are to be created are aweful :) But that's how they are 07:00:15 <Pikkaphone> we should make a thread to discuss all these bad features 07:00:42 <V453000> :D 07:00:42 <andythenorth> forums are a bad feature 07:00:48 <peter1138> openttd is a bad feature 07:01:09 <Pikkaphone> peeter is a bad feature 07:02:26 *** Hazzard [~quassel@c-67-174-253-44.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:03:05 <peter1138> rm * 07:03:07 <peter1138> svn commit 07:03:10 <Pikkaphone> I should bring my laptop to uni do I can at least make bad newgrf spreadsheets 07:04:53 <andythenorth> spreadsheets are a bad feature 07:04:53 <andythenorth> if you canât make a set design in a notes app on a phone 07:04:53 <andythenorth> then itâs too much 07:05:12 <Pikkaphone> D: 07:05:46 * andythenorth soapbox 07:06:24 <Pikkaphone> but I need semi-random cost calculations 07:07:17 <peter1138> Just return random values to all the callbacks 07:07:29 <Pikkaphone> yes 07:07:31 *** Yotson [~Yotson@2001:980:6ac8:1:cb7:673f:2ccd:780e] has joined #openttd 07:07:54 <Pikkaphone> rerandomise on loading, too 07:07:54 <peter1138> the complain that callbacks are broken 07:07:59 <peter1138> *then 07:08:08 <andythenorth> oops 07:08:13 <andythenorth> pickling error 07:10:42 *** Pikkaphone2 [~yaaic@131.181.158.141] has joined #openttd 07:10:42 *** Pikkaphone [~yaaic@131.181.158.141] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:11:01 <Pikkaphone2> whoops 07:15:35 <peter1138> http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-07-28/orban-says-he-seeks-to-end-liberal-democracy-in-hungary.html 07:15:38 <peter1138> fun 07:16:05 <Pikkaphone2> andy:so are you moving everything back to nfo? or are you making your own andy4nfo? 07:16:19 <andythenorth> nml -> nfo 07:16:31 <andythenorth> as in, compile nml to nfo 07:16:47 <andythenorth> then grfcodec 07:16:56 <andythenorth> itâs done for Iron Horse and is faster 07:17:04 <andythenorth> trying to make it work for FIRS is super super hard 07:17:49 <andythenorth> definitely not worth the time Iâm putting into it 07:17:53 <andythenorth> but then what is? o_O 07:17:55 <peter1138> is it faster when playing? 07:18:25 <andythenorth> âsnappier" 07:18:36 <Pikkaphone2> industry code runs on magic and tears 07:18:37 <andythenorth> OS X joke :P 07:19:06 <andythenorth> trains are so simple 07:19:14 <andythenorth> irony being that I did a train set last 07:19:15 <Pikkaphone2> yep 07:19:25 <andythenorth> ships are even simplser 07:20:55 <V453000> YETI cannot even compile without compiling nml->nfo first 07:20:57 <peter1138> MMOOpenTTD 07:21:00 <V453000> nml runs out of memory :) 07:21:24 <Pikkaphone2> nfo is the future! 07:21:27 <V453000> :d 07:21:59 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 07:23:09 <andythenorth> meh 07:23:17 <andythenorth> with nfo I could just write out the strings I need in an action 4 07:23:26 <andythenorth> instead of having to trick nmlc into doing it 07:26:22 <andythenorth> also bye 07:26:27 * andythenorth lets the train take the strain 07:26:32 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 07:32:46 *** Pereba [~UserNick@179.179.31.124] has joined #openttd 07:41:46 *** Pikkaphone2 [~yaaic@131.181.158.141] has left #openttd [] 07:42:37 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 07:42:40 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai|noir] by ChanServ 07:47:50 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-101-224.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:26:37 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~flex@i59F6A350.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 08:39:25 *** MJP [~mjp@hq.z77.fr] has joined #openttd 09:02:20 *** UukGoblin [~jaa@yatima.uukgoblin.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:12:12 *** UukGoblin [~jaa@yatima.uukgoblin.net] has joined #openttd 09:19:09 *** Midnightmyth [~quassel@93-167-84-102-static.dk.customer.tdc.net] has joined #openttd 09:44:43 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:45:27 *** kero [~keikoz@pha75-1-81-57-54-15.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 09:45:59 <kero> hello 10:12:05 *** jensowal [~a-zelfani@197.6.79.157] has joined #openttd 10:12:11 *** Brumi [~quassel@78-131-41-191.pool.digikabel.hu] has joined #openttd 10:17:41 <planetmaker> @ports 10:17:41 <DorpsGek> planetmaker: OpenTTD uses TCP and UDP port 3979 for server <-> client communication, UDP port 3978 for masterserver (advertise) communication (outbound), and TCP port 3978 for content service, a.k.a. BaNaNaS (outbound) 10:18:41 *** jensowal [~a-zelfani@197.6.79.157] has left #openttd [] 10:25:51 *** Pereba [~UserNick@179.179.31.124] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:26:51 *** Pereba [~UserNick@179.179.31.124] has joined #openttd 10:32:56 *** theholyduck [~theholydu@172.245.30.36] has joined #openttd 11:31:30 *** Supercheese is now known as Guest4176 11:31:32 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@76.178.136.186] has joined #openttd 11:36:30 *** Guest4176 [~Superchee@76.178.136.186] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:07:09 *** luaduck_zzz is now known as luaduck 12:21:39 *** shirish_ [~quassel@117.195.102.61] has joined #openttd 12:25:32 *** yorick [~yorick@ip51cd0513.speed.planet.nl] has joined #openttd 12:25:44 *** shirish [~quassel@0001358e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 12:36:06 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 13:07:29 *** Pikka [~Octomom@d110-32-40-180.rdl801.qld.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 13:33:25 *** pthagnar [~pthagnar@cpc7-pres17-2-0-cust28.18-3.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 14:13:24 *** Pikka [~Octomom@d110-32-40-180.rdl801.qld.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:23:14 *** DDR [~kvirc@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 14:31:04 *** shirish_ [~quassel@117.195.102.61] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:03:50 *** Hazzard [~quassel@c-67-174-253-44.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 15:12:13 *** TheMask96 [martijn@envy.vhost.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:16:21 *** TheMask96 [martijn@sloth.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 15:30:30 *** bdavenport [~davenport@aeolus.mindlesstux.com] has joined #openttd 15:42:02 *** Alberth [~hat@2001:981:c6c5:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has joined #openttd 15:42:05 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 15:53:22 *** Progman [~progman@p57A182E2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 15:55:02 *** Sylf [~sylf@c-71-199-78-95.hsd1.ks.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 16:06:26 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-5f740e9e.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 16:19:00 *** shirish [~quassel@117.195.102.61] has joined #openttd 16:21:33 *** tstts [~id@37.140.121.161] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:43:28 *** pthagnar [~pthagnar@cpc7-pres17-2-0-cust28.18-3.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:00:05 *** andythenorth [~Andy@5ec1b55e.skybroadband.com] has joined #openttd 17:00:39 <andythenorth> grr 17:00:42 * andythenorth might yet win 17:01:02 <andythenorth> going to have to do a horrible split on a specific line of nfo 17:01:19 * andythenorth hopes nml writes out specific lines deterministically 17:10:00 *** shirish [~quassel@0001358e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.] 17:11:23 *** shirish [~quassel@117.195.102.61] has joined #openttd 17:13:41 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest4199 17:13:41 *** andythenorth [~Andy@5ec2c730.skybroadband.com] has joined #openttd 17:14:18 *** Guest4199 [~Andy@5ec1b55e.skybroadband.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:26:50 <planetmaker> good evening 17:27:43 <planetmaker> andythenorth, we cannot give you a guarantee that any order in the output will be maintained other than the ordering strictly required by grf specs 17:27:55 <andythenorth> figures 17:28:02 <andythenorth> splits are highly unsafe :P 17:28:08 *** tyteen4a03 [tyteen4a03@Daedalusx.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 17:31:48 <andythenorth> I couldnât find another way to do what I need 17:32:02 <andythenorth> I thought I had a cunning solution last night, but it wasnât so 17:35:57 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 17:36:19 <Wolf01> hi hi 17:36:44 <planetmaker> o/ 17:36:50 <planetmaker> andythenorth, well, it's tricky :) 17:37:14 <planetmaker> I still invite you to solve your issues at the NML level rather than adding another layer of indirection behind it 17:37:26 <planetmaker> or two layers for what it's worth 17:38:29 <andythenorth> given that the solution requires rewriting nml in c or c++, I think itâs beyond me :) 17:39:28 <planetmaker> the partial compile thing which you're working on does not necessarily require that 17:39:54 <planetmaker> yet that might still be the easier or more profitable route 17:40:00 <planetmaker> I don't know really either :( 17:40:47 <andythenorth> this grfcodec route is now a battle to the death for me 17:40:51 <andythenorth> even if it ends up getting binned 17:41:05 <andythenorth> like the time I wrote a horrible cpp macro system to generate bandit, even though it was stupid 17:41:09 <andythenorth> I had to win 17:42:03 <andythenorth> anyway, train time :) 17:42:03 <andythenorth> bbl 17:42:46 <planetmaker> :) 17:44:21 <Wolf01> mmh, there's something which has been rumbling for months around my house and I can't find the origin, I'm beginning to have weird ideas like somebody digging a tunnel, a sinkhole, a geyser 17:45:06 <planetmaker> a marten? 17:45:17 *** montalvo [~montalvo@c-76-103-107-219.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 17:45:41 <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r26707 /trunk/src/lang (lithuanian.txt ukrainian.txt) (2014-07-29 17:45:32 UTC) 17:45:42 <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 17:45:43 <DorpsGek> lithuanian - 1 changes by RunisLabs 17:45:44 <DorpsGek> norwegian_bokmal - 1 changes by 17:45:45 <DorpsGek> ukrainian - 37 changes by Strategy 17:46:13 *** tyteen4a03 [~tyteen4a0@Daedalusx.net] has joined #openttd 17:46:38 <Wolf01> an entire train of martens maybe 17:47:26 <Wolf01> it's so deep and rithmic 17:48:22 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:50:07 *** andythenorth [~Andy@5ec2c730.skybroadband.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:59:20 <Eddi|zuHause> i have a feeling andy is on that totally wrong track for solving his "problem" 18:00:05 <planetmaker> well. I do, too 18:00:17 <planetmaker> but whatever floats his boat :) 18:01:06 <Eddi|zuHause> i mean like he forgot one essential step, and now he tries to fix the outcome of this at the totally wrong level 18:10:38 <Eddi|zuHause> who invented this minecraft coordinate system? why is y the height, and not z? 18:11:54 <peter1138> Notch is strange like that. 18:13:02 <Rubidium> someone who starts drawing a box with x on the horizontal and y on the vertical axis. Then he wanted 3D and added a dimension "to the back", which obviously would need to be z 18:13:36 <Rubidium> what's funky is that 2D x = 3D y, 2D y = 3D z 18:14:34 <Rubidium> the real question is... who invented that coordinate system? 18:17:23 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: i think that is actually the normal way to do it 18:17:33 <frosch123> e.g. also povray does y=up 18:18:13 *** shirish [~quassel@0001358e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.] 18:18:16 <planetmaker> blender doesn't 18:18:39 <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: if x is to the right and y is up, then z must be to the front. otherwise it's not a right hand system 18:18:44 <planetmaker> normal is a right-handed instead of left-handed 18:19:34 *** shirish [~quassel@117.195.102.61] has joined #openttd 18:19:54 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: still you can arrange a right hand system many ways 18:20:46 <planetmaker> obviously. But as you pointed out, what you described was left-handed 18:21:39 <frosch123> maybe he has issues with left and right? 18:33:13 *** tyteen4a03 [~tyteen4a0@Daedalusx.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 18:33:38 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 18:34:15 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: no information i have given points to it being left handed 18:34:38 <frosch123> "if x is to the right and y is up, then z must be to the front. otherwise it's not a right hand system" 18:35:04 <Eddi|zuHause> that was a reply to Rubidium 18:37:15 <Eddi|zuHause> i complained about z not being the height, not about being not-right-handed 18:42:49 *** tyteen4a03 [tyteen4a03@Daedalusx.net] has joined #openttd 18:43:08 *** andythenorth [~Andy@213.205.229.76] has joined #openttd 18:45:45 *** glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 18:45:48 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 18:59:44 <Eddi|zuHause> but i did get my dogs fixed anyway 19:02:17 *** jjavaholic_ [~jjavaholi@grahamg63.plus.com] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 19:09:36 *** Hazzard [~quassel@c-67-174-253-44.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:12:56 <peter1138> There are people saying that getting your dogs neutered/spayed causes cancer. 19:13:09 <peter1138> And then there are others saying that if you don't, it causes cancer... 19:13:17 <peter1138> And nothing to do with the Daily Mail. 19:15:56 <frosch123> chemistry divides substances into two classes: those who cause cancer, and those who are suspected to do so 19:16:19 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 19:24:50 <Belugas> what if the newspapers you trained your dog to bring you also cause cancer? 19:27:49 *** Vex [Vex@b.clients.kiwiirc.com] has joined #openttd 19:28:41 <Jinassi> evening, I'd like to continue from my yesterdays inquiry, there's a page on desura about openttd. Someone made it, but it is not being updated anymore. I'd like to get permission and additional info to update it. Later on, with permission from developers I'd like to create such pages on other websites that offer free games. Since most of the nowadays players use those sites as go-to to check 19:28:41 <Jinassi> on games it would be beneficial to the whole community in expanding playerbase. 19:33:06 <peter1138> These days everybody uses Steam and nothing else. 19:33:48 <Jinassi> Peter, your thoughts on making something like this there' 19:33:52 <Jinassi> ? 19:33:59 <frosch123> Jinassi: ask Terkhen about desura 19:34:11 <Jinassi> roger 19:34:27 <frosch123> he is here some evenings, but his nick being here does not mean him being here 19:34:38 <peter1138> Frankly I don't give a shit, OpenTTD just exists, it doesn't need advertising or market share. But that's just my opinion :p 19:34:58 *** andythenorth [~Andy@213.205.229.76] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:36:55 <planetmaker> Jinassi, I would not mind it seeing there or on steam. The main problem I see: *someone* needs to maintain it. Thus make sure it's fed with the newest stable release in a timely manner 19:37:49 <planetmaker> (or greenlight, where it would have to go through probably in order to get onto steam) 19:38:05 <frosch123> isn't greenlight dicontinued? 19:38:13 <planetmaker> But I don't know whether they impose any restrictions like iOS app-store 19:38:17 <planetmaker> frosch123, no idea 19:38:40 <Jinassi> They have a fee to get on greenlight 19:41:19 <planetmaker> ah, hum 19:41:52 <planetmaker> Jinassi, would you want to maintain one or the other? And care to make stable releases available through their service? 19:42:20 *** andythenorth [~Andy@31.118.29.202] has joined #openttd 19:42:28 <Jinassi> I would, i'll get in touch with Terkhen 19:43:34 <planetmaker> *I* do think that would be nice. And dislike the fact that we can't simply automatically publish there, too like we can on our binary server(s) 19:44:17 <frosch123> yeah, an automatic updater is the only purpose of it :p 19:44:37 <frosch123> if it is not up-to-date it is silly, and all the comments are about that :p 19:50:02 <Jinassi> shouldn't be an issue to link binaries, only issue is, how would updater handle that 19:50:27 *** andythenorth [~Andy@31.118.29.202] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:50:35 <frosch123> as said, the updater is the only point of those platforms 19:51:05 <frosch123> (as in "one updater to rule them all") 19:54:01 <planetmaker> having openttd on steam certainly would also be nice. It's an awefully convenient one-stop-get-them-all programme 19:54:56 <Rubidium> pfff... apt is so much better ;) 19:54:57 *** andythenorth [~Andy@31.104.191.221] has joined #openttd 19:54:59 <frosch123> i don't think the "get it" is any argument for ottd, it's only about the updating for people who already have it 19:55:43 <planetmaker> Rubidium, yes, it is... except for those stuff not in apt ;) 19:56:08 <planetmaker> frosch123, dunno, it's easy to browse a list of games just using the steam client 19:56:27 <frosch123> planetmaker: would you find it, if not searching for it? 19:57:05 <planetmaker> frosch123, maybe. One can really just scroll through and look for interesting stuff... 19:57:13 <frosch123> (as in "searching by explicit name") 19:57:30 <planetmaker> you can search for keywords 19:58:04 <planetmaker> like "transport simulation" gives a good list 20:01:39 <planetmaker> http://devs.openttd.org/~planetmaker/patches/steam.png 20:01:48 <frosch123> he, that mostly gives simutrans images :p 20:02:42 <Jinassi> plus simulator games are all the rage these days, there's even a water simulator ffs 20:02:44 *** andythenorth [~Andy@31.104.191.221] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:03:12 <frosch123> well, at least ottd is no "walking simulator" :) 20:03:52 <Ailure> gosh the simulator parodies trend on greenlight is one of the dumber trends i saw on steam 20:04:19 <planetmaker> getting into greelight is like 100$US or so. *iff* there is one or two people to keep that updated continuously that's imho worth doing 20:05:00 <planetmaker> it would probably strengthen the multiplayer aspect 20:05:12 <frosch123> doesn't it take like 3 years to get on there? 20:05:37 <planetmaker> I don't know 20:05:38 *** luaduck is now known as luaduck_zzz 20:05:49 <Jinassi> to where? 20:05:52 <planetmaker> I hoped Jinassi would know :) 20:05:56 *** luaduck_zzz is now known as luaduck 20:06:26 <Ailure> Is there any open soruce apps on steam at all? :P 20:06:48 <Ailure> not counting games that were open source after a commercial release, so no doom dosen't count lol 20:07:08 <frosch123> Ailure: there are a hell lot of old games which come with dosbox 20:07:30 <Ailure> Like xcom ;) 20:07:33 <Ailure> not free though 20:07:55 <frosch123> as in, someone takes the old game, removes the cd/copy protection, bundles it with dosbox, and effectively writes an installer 20:08:16 <frosch123> i use a lot of "as in" today, do i? 20:09:10 <frosch123> i believe people who get those games end up with dozen of dosbox installations :p 20:09:24 <Ailure> yeah 20:09:29 <Ailure> gog.com does the same thing though to be fair 20:09:33 <Ailure> (which I find annoying though) 20:09:37 <frosch123> just like people who play/read visual novels end up with dozen of renpy installations 20:09:46 <Eddi|zuHause> <frosch123> well, at least ottd is no "walking simulator" :) <-- you mean like qwop? 20:10:16 <Ailure> It was funny playing xcom after all those years though, one of those DOS era games I didn't play until something like 2011 20:10:24 <Ailure> as I knew about it for years through transport tycoon ;) 20:10:59 <Ailure> It was funny seeing those anti war discussions regarding transport tycoon even from the author when it features some of the implied xcom fights 20:11:04 <Ailure> as disasters 20:11:24 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: no idea what that is. i only heard about steam adding a feature to aggregate common tags used by users... then being suprised by people calling bad games bad games... and then banning a lot of tags, amongst them stuff like "console port" or "walking simulator" 20:11:53 <Jinassi> http://steamcommunity.com/app/221410/discussions/0/828934724038646872/ 20:11:59 <Ailure> which is good cause those tags aren't meant to cover opinions 20:12:01 <Ailure> i hated those tags 20:12:22 <Ailure> but then again i hate most steam reviews cause people think they're being clever by littering them with injokes that you only get if you played the game 20:12:37 <Ailure> which defeats the point of a review 20:14:54 <Jinassi> open source game on steam:http://store.steampowered.com/app/264380 20:15:09 <Ailure> yeah just found that 20:15:14 <Ailure> so i guess it's not impossible 20:15:41 <Jinassi> keep searching...i have a feeling there has to be something about the game that is payable 20:15:56 <Jinassi> so Valve actually gets something from it 20:15:58 <Ailure> soundtrack 20:15:58 <Ailure> :P 20:16:08 <Ailure> it's on the page as DLC 20:16:17 <Jinassi> mhm 20:24:30 <Jinassi> its not just gettngme on there,,,it's gettingthis in heam too:https://github.com/ValveSoftware/steamworks-vr-api howver,i resume thisisoptional 20:24:42 <Jinassi> *i presume th is otional 20:24:47 <Jinassi> ffs 20:24:54 <Ailure> are you having a stroke? :O 20:25:07 <Jinassi> is optional 20:25:32 <Jinassi> meh keyboad, nedt fix it 20:25:37 <Ailure> that is for oculus rift stuff lol 20:25:42 *** Brumi [~quassel@78-131-41-191.pool.digikabel.hu] has quit [] 20:25:44 <Ailure> says vr as in virtual reality 20:25:47 <Jinassi> ffs, 20:26:16 <Jinassi> https://partner.steamgames.com/documentation/api 20:26:17 <Jinassi> this 20:26:40 <Jinassi> optional 20:27:13 <Ailure> lol at the disclaimer at the bottom 20:27:20 <Ailure> must be a oversight that is visible on a public page 20:27:21 <peter1138> Valve Confidential 20:27:21 <peter1138> This restricted access site and content provided by it (code, documentation, etc.) is Valve confidential information. You must have a non-disclosure and/or license agreement covering confidential information with Valve to use or access this site 20:27:46 <peter1138> :D 20:27:54 <Ailure> it does say further up on the page that "More details are available once you've signed up for Steamworks and have logged into this site." 20:28:01 <Ailure> so i assume it's meant to be a teaser for non-steam devs 20:28:10 <Ailure> and that disclaimer is a mistake 20:28:10 <Ailure> lol 20:29:08 <Jinassi> click there to attempt to log in for more info 20:29:33 <peter1138> Anyway, I'm sure last time someone looked at all that bullshit it was incompatible with opensource software. 20:29:48 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@89.137.74.191] has quit [] 20:30:50 <Jinassi> this is far beyond me, desura will be fine LOL 20:31:05 <Ailure> yeah the API stuff cannot be used in open source software (as that breaks steams licising rules), but it dosen't prevent open source software being put on steam apparently. :P Just no Steam specfi features 20:31:05 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:31:32 <Ailure> I think it would be more trouble than it's worth, until it's made a bit more open source friendly anyway imo 20:31:53 <peter1138> Nobody knows what Desura is. 20:32:01 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 20:32:21 <peter1138> So it really doesn't matter. 20:32:35 <Jinassi> true, but there's gog too 20:33:22 <peter1138> People only go to GoG for the offerse. 20:33:23 <peter1138> -e 20:34:08 <planetmaker> or if they mind steams DRM print on stuff 20:35:34 <Ailure> usualyl though those games don't have DRM on steam either though lol 20:36:56 *** KritiK [~Maxim@0001264a.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 20:37:08 <peter1138> Meh, it's usually old crap packaged with its own copy of dosbox... 20:37:14 <Ailure> Generally if it's a old DOS game it dosen't have DRM attached anywhere, if it's a indie game it's usually best to get a DRM free copy directly from the dev 20:37:21 <Ailure> anyway 20:37:25 <Ailure> rather than gog or steam 20:37:27 <peter1138> DOS games had DRM... 20:37:33 <Ailure> oh i know :) 20:37:36 <Ailure> but i meant steam DRM 20:37:55 <peter1138> We just called it copy protection back then. 20:38:17 <Jinassi> which was bollocks 20:38:53 <Ailure> i think they are funny in retroaspect 20:39:04 <Ailure> since most of them depend on you using a manual to look up a word or number or something 20:39:31 <peter1138> Yeah, or some other physical item. 20:40:19 <planetmaker> well, red on green background manuals were actual copy protection :) 20:40:32 <peter1138> Yellow on white code lists were fun. 20:40:40 <planetmaker> also that :) 20:40:43 <peter1138> I had one that used a spinny wheel system. 20:40:54 <peter1138> Had to line up bits to get the code. 20:41:38 <Ailure> good thing that game companies realized that doing annoying copy protections is bad copy protections 20:41:47 <frosch123> the most weird thing was the "oxyd book", which were 300 pages of random numbers 20:42:11 <peter1138> Earliest one I know of is a game that included a Novella. 20:42:11 <Ailure> then again it's all relative, i used to not mind needing a CD to run a game, but digital distribution have spoiled me now 20:42:25 <planetmaker> times change :) 20:42:36 <peter1138> You have to look up works from the story, and that was on a BBC Micro, so in the 80s. 20:42:38 <Ailure> and I found myself buying a game again just so i don't need to use a CD haha 20:43:37 *** Progman [~progman@p57A182E2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:44:06 <Jinassi> same here Ailure, still have boxed copies of Galciv I&II and Homeworld I&II 20:44:13 <Jinassi> and digital ones 20:44:33 <Ailure> and partly so i don't have to hunt down all CD's again (I was really happy that The sims 2 is free right now lol) 20:45:05 <planetmaker> oh, I still have quite a few, too. Civ 1,3 and 4, Dune 2, Diablo I + II,... 20:45:06 <Jinassi> really? what about the dlc's? 20:45:18 <Ailure> It got everything 20:45:18 <Ailure> lol 20:45:56 <Ailure> http://help.ea.com/en/article/how-to-get-the-sims-2-ultimate-collection/ 20:46:07 <Jinassi> planetmaker, those boxes, well, all of the copies before were a work of art, with all different easter eggs included 20:46:20 *** Yotson [~Yotson@2001:980:6ac8:1:cb7:673f:2ccd:780e] has quit [Quit: .] 20:46:54 <planetmaker> kinda, yeah. Though I got most of those already cheap when they were re-packed 20:47:32 <planetmaker> except civ1. That was full box, four 3.5" disks :) 20:47:40 <planetmaker> nice manual and stuff 20:48:13 <Ailure> Civilization series... another game series i'm a huge fan of 20:48:21 <Ailure> yep, i am looking towards beyond earth 20:49:27 <Ailure> then again, i got a wide gaming taste 20:49:54 <Ailure> only game genre i dislike are sports 20:51:46 *** user__ [~user@pool-108-34-155-226.prvdri.fios.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 20:55:25 *** user__ [~user@pool-108-34-155-226.prvdri.fios.verizon.net] has quit [] 20:55:44 <peter1138> Ailure, except they didn't bother patching it to make it work properly. 800x600 sucks. 20:56:22 <Ailure> running it at 1280x1024 fine, you have to manually change a config file for higer resolutions 20:56:33 <Jinassi> everything can be solved, I'm playing Pharaoh on 1680x1050 20:57:49 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 20:59:55 <andythenorth> so now my plan is to put a dummy version of every industry in the header, declaring all properties and cbs that handle strings 21:00:11 <andythenorth> wrapped in a parameter check that will always be false, to avoid unwanted side effects 21:00:29 <andythenorth> and then include that header in the compile for each industry 21:00:32 <andythenorth> so far so good 21:01:03 <andythenorth> then I have to split the header back off the industry during the final linking step, which is ugly 21:01:05 <andythenorth> but meh 21:01:50 <andythenorth> maybe nmlc could be given args for files to parse, but not output? o_O 21:04:11 <andythenorth> also bedtime 21:04:13 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 21:18:19 *** pthagnar [~pthagnar@cpc7-pres17-2-0-cust28.18-3.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 21:19:38 *** montalvo [~montalvo@c-76-103-107-219.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzzâŠ] 21:24:28 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:25:56 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 21:28:50 <frosch123> night 21:28:53 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-5f740e9e.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: be yourself, except: if you have the opportunity to be a unicorn, then be a unicorn] 21:32:52 <Wolf01> 'night 21:32:56 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 21:39:36 *** Jinassi1 [~Jinassi@internet-188-198-38-188.narocnik.mobitel.si] has joined #openttd 21:40:20 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:41:05 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 21:43:03 *** Jinassi [~Jinassi@0001ec72.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:48:55 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Quit: There's a real world out here!] 21:52:43 *** Pereba [~UserNick@179.179.31.124] has quit [Quit: AdiIRC - The only client that takes care of your wife while sancho not come. (www.adiirc.com)] 21:53:45 *** solar7 [~polaris@0001f2e7.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 22:01:06 *** solar7 [~polaris@0001f2e7.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3] 22:03:50 *** Vex [Vex@b.clients.kiwiirc.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client] 22:08:36 *** Tvel [~Thunderbi@84.40.120.230] has joined #openttd 22:14:42 *** luaduck is now known as luaduck_zzz 22:18:05 *** Alberth [~hat@2001:981:c6c5:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has left #openttd [] 22:24:38 *** luaduck_zzz is now known as luaduck 22:28:26 *** LSky` [~LSky@5ED4B2EA.cm-7-5c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [] 22:36:18 *** KritiK [~Maxim@0001264a.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:50:33 <Eddi|zuHause> <peter1138> I had one that used a spinny wheel system. <- monkey island did that 22:51:26 <glx> day of the tantacle used a nice one too 22:51:55 <Eddi|zuHause> <Ailure> then again it's all relative, i used to not mind needing a CD to run a game, but digital distribution have spoiled me now <-- strange, that was always the most annoying of all for me... 23:03:47 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~flex@i59F6A350.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:25:46 *** Rarn [~Rarn@static-74-43-117-212.fnd.frontiernet.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3] 23:31:04 *** Tvel [~Thunderbi@84.40.120.230] has quit [Quit: Tvel] 23:54:42 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving]